I just started playing this game on PC again. Didn't realize just how bad the lag could get. One guy whiffed an ultra right in front of me and I mashed ultra to try and punish but all my character did was just stand there, no normals came out, not even any directional movement. Not all my matches were that bad but now I know what everyone is talking about with the PC lag. Is the networking beta still going on? I haven't been keeping up with that.
@DannyJ Good to know there are still people new to the game and having fun playing. Keep it up, it's a tough but rewarding game to play.
@Marlie One piece of advice I can give is to look for your opponent's tendencies and find a way to punish them for it. For example, the sakura player really likes to jump. Punish that by standing at her perfect jump distance and do nothing but wait for her to jump, then anti-air it. Keep doing that until you convince him that jumping is bad for his health. Another example would be the dhalsim player who likes to teleport on his wakeup. You're not going to get command grabs or frame traps until that dhalsim is convinced he should stop teleporting. I'm not sure what THawk has that can punish it...maybe EX spire or jump and condor dive? You can figure out what setups work in training mode and then use them if you notice sims teleporting a lot on wakeup. These setups will help you later since people like to backdash/teleport against grapplers. Hope this helps.
On September 05 2014 09:09 MarlieChurphy wrote: Sim teleport seems unpunishable, Thawk needs a buff or something?
If you mean Sims teleporting behind you, you can just throw out a fast normal (or a slow one if you know it's coming). Spam jab on reaction should work with most characters.
PS- Can someone explain to me why I am always getting regular thrown out of LP Typhoon?
From what I read its a 2 frame grab and throws are 3 frames. Like I empty jump in buffering it (and I'm like 90%+ on execution) and get tossed a lot. Maybe it's just online lag or something, I do often see moves just not coming out sometimes. I'll try and pay attention to inputs and pause on a video if I see it happen.
TBH, I think these are the hardest matchups for THAWK (probably in this order), DH, BL, VE, JU, GO, GU, MB, PO, and honorable mentions for HO, DJ,
In SF4, when you jump, you have 4 landing frames. There are two different things that can happen based on whether you pressed a button. Empty jumps (meaning you press no buttons in the air) allow you to act immediately upon landing aside from jumping/dashing/crouching, and you can also block and tech throws immediately upon landing. If you did press a button in the air, your first two landing frames are completely vulnerable and you can't even block. However, you can still tech throws. Your second two landing frames allow you to block and tech throws but not do anything else.
If you are actually empty jumping, then your 2f command grab will come out before their 3f normal throw. That assumes that a) your input is frame perfect, meaning your input happened on the same frame you touched the ground, and b) you didn't accidentally press a button early which would cause your first 2 frames to be vulnerable. It can be really difficult to tell if you're messing this up because jumping moves have startup too, and by pressing a button 1-2f before you hit the ground, you won't be able to notice that a move even started coming out before you land.
If you pressed a button during your jump, then your 2f command grab will come out after their 3f normal throw because at Frame 0 you both perform your inputs, at Frame 3 his throw connects, and at Frame 4 your command executes, connecting by Frame 6. That's why the best thing to do if you land from a jump without connecting a move is just tech a throw.
Who is GU? Guile? Guy? I would imagine the former. I had to look at the character select menu to figure out who some of these were. I've never seen them like that it looked weird.
Okay here are the notes on the games I watched.
Vs Adon. When someone is spamming focus attack on your either do an armor breaker, do a 2 hit move, or jump clear. Practice your 720 punishes, you would've done much better in these games if they were on point. Calm down a bit, doing nothing on wake up (block of course) is a good idea and an excellent habit to form.
Vs Seth. Learn to walk forward and block. As a grappler it should be almost always be better for you to be in your enemies face's instead of far away. Just start to go left right left right and nudge your way forward until you learn to do this. This pressures your opponent greatly. When your opponent goes into the air you will want to stand block.
Vs. Dudely. You can punish ALL machine gun blows (!!!). If he starts to spam s.hp or f.hp try low profiling him to either whiff punish or stuff (i.e. c.mk should work). Try not to full screen condor spires (the one you do after you jump?) or you will start to get punished by people who know the match up.
Vs. Hakan. Block low especially if he spams his slide. Learn to punish properly and watch to see if he has two meters (for fadc slide).
On September 05 2014 15:35 Excalibur_Z wrote: In SF4, when you jump, you have 4 landing frames. There are two different things that can happen based on whether you pressed a button. Empty jumps (meaning you press no buttons in the air) allow you to act immediately upon landing aside from jumping/dashing/crouching, and you can also block and tech throws immediately upon landing. If you did press a button in the air, your first two landing frames are completely vulnerable and you can't even block. However, you can still tech throws. Your second two landing frames allow you to block and tech throws but not do anything else.
If you are actually empty jumping, then your 2f command grab will come out before their 3f normal throw. That assumes that a) your input is frame perfect, meaning your input happened on the same frame you touched the ground, and b) you didn't accidentally press a button early which would cause your first 2 frames to be vulnerable. It can be really difficult to tell if you're messing this up because jumping moves have startup too, and by pressing a button 1-2f before you hit the ground, you won't be able to notice that a move even started coming out before you land.
If you pressed a button during your jump, then your 2f command grab will come out after their 3f normal throw because at Frame 0 you both perform your inputs, at Frame 3 his throw connects, and at Frame 4 your command executes, connecting by Frame 6. That's why the best thing to do if you land from a jump without connecting a move is just tech a throw.
So I should get used to OSing a LP+LK+360 ? That would work right?
Most of the time I'm talking about an empty jump here, didn't hit any buttons.
On September 05 2014 15:54 SwatRaven wrote: Who is GU? Guile? Guy? I would imagine the former. I had to look at the character select menu to figure out who some of these were. I've never seen them like that it looked weird.
Okay here are the notes on the games I watched.
Vs Adon. When someone is spamming focus attack on your either do an armor breaker, do a 2 hit move, or jump clear. Practice your 720 punishes, you would've done much better in these games if they were on point. Calm down a bit, doing nothing on wake up (block of course) is a good idea and an excellent habit to form.
Vs Seth. Learn to walk forward and block. As a grappler it should be almost always be better for you to be in your enemies face's instead of far away. Just start to go left right left right and nudge your way forward until you learn to do this. This pressures your opponent greatly. When your opponent goes into the air you will want to stand block.
Vs. Dudely. You can punish ALL machine gun blows (!!!). If he starts to spam s.hp or f.hp try low profiling him to either whiff punish or stuff (i.e. c.mk should work). Try not to full screen condor spires (the one you do after you jump?) or you will start to get punished by people who know the match up.
Vs. Hakan. Block low especially if he spams his slide. Learn to punish properly and watch to see if he has two meters (for fadc slide).
GU, GY.
AD player is good, he is my friend on steam, we've played a lot. need to get more consistent 720s yea.
Playing footsies with the lag by walking forward/backward is just random on steam. Until they fix it, I'm not really going to play that way. Inhibits my play for sure though.
I'm not sure what you mean by punish MGB? (what point did I miss it?) it's called condor dive. I know CD is risky and can be punished, but I will use it until I notice the guy doing so a lot, because it does a lot of things besides hit.
That guy was like the first HA I ever played so I was pretty clueless. I didn't even know he had an air throw lol.
On September 05 2014 15:35 Excalibur_Z wrote: In SF4, when you jump, you have 4 landing frames. There are two different things that can happen based on whether you pressed a button. Empty jumps (meaning you press no buttons in the air) allow you to act immediately upon landing aside from jumping/dashing/crouching, and you can also block and tech throws immediately upon landing. If you did press a button in the air, your first two landing frames are completely vulnerable and you can't even block. However, you can still tech throws. Your second two landing frames allow you to block and tech throws but not do anything else.
If you are actually empty jumping, then your 2f command grab will come out before their 3f normal throw. That assumes that a) your input is frame perfect, meaning your input happened on the same frame you touched the ground, and b) you didn't accidentally press a button early which would cause your first 2 frames to be vulnerable. It can be really difficult to tell if you're messing this up because jumping moves have startup too, and by pressing a button 1-2f before you hit the ground, you won't be able to notice that a move even started coming out before you land.
If you pressed a button during your jump, then your 2f command grab will come out after their 3f normal throw because at Frame 0 you both perform your inputs, at Frame 3 his throw connects, and at Frame 4 your command executes, connecting by Frame 6. That's why the best thing to do if you land from a jump without connecting a move is just tech a throw.
So I should get used to OSing a LP+LK+360 ? That would work right?
Most of the time I'm talking about an empty jump here, didn't hit any buttons.
On September 05 2014 15:54 SwatRaven wrote: Who is GU? Guile? Guy? I would imagine the former. I had to look at the character select menu to figure out who some of these were. I've never seen them like that it looked weird.
Okay here are the notes on the games I watched.
Vs Adon. When someone is spamming focus attack on your either do an armor breaker, do a 2 hit move, or jump clear. Practice your 720 punishes, you would've done much better in these games if they were on point. Calm down a bit, doing nothing on wake up (block of course) is a good idea and an excellent habit to form.
Vs Seth. Learn to walk forward and block. As a grappler it should be almost always be better for you to be in your enemies face's instead of far away. Just start to go left right left right and nudge your way forward until you learn to do this. This pressures your opponent greatly. When your opponent goes into the air you will want to stand block.
Vs. Dudely. You can punish ALL machine gun blows (!!!). If he starts to spam s.hp or f.hp try low profiling him to either whiff punish or stuff (i.e. c.mk should work). Try not to full screen condor spires (the one you do after you jump?) or you will start to get punished by people who know the match up.
Vs. Hakan. Block low especially if he spams his slide. Learn to punish properly and watch to see if he has two meters (for fadc slide).
GU, GY.
AD player is good, he is my friend on steam, we've played a lot. need to get more consistent 720s yea.
Playing footsies with the lag by walking forward/backward is just random on steam. Until they fix it, I'm not really going to play that way. Inhibits my play for sure though.
I'm not sure what you mean by punish MGB? (what point did I miss it?) it's called condor dive. I know CD is risky and can be punished, but I will use it until I notice the guy doing so a lot, because it does a lot of things besides hit.
That guy was like the first HA I ever played so I was pretty clueless. I didn't even know he had an air throw lol.
you can punish all machine gun blows on block with your command grab & 720 ultra (maybe super too). I noticed you didn't punish it lol. I can't seem to view the video right now sorry but I know you didn't punish. It is a hard one for the l.mgb anyway.
Yea footsies online are... meh right now.
edit: I added you on steam btw
The MGB punish was just at the start. Something small but I notice it because I play against a Dudely all the time.
There's no way to turn it off, you have to turn it off in your brain. And delayed wakeup is only for hard knockdowns (sweeps, throws, supers, ultras) and has the same input as quickrise for soft knockdowns except for the down direction thing, which is whatever. The down input causing quickrise screws me up a lot more than the button presses which are more deliberate.
On September 08 2014 10:09 Excalibur_Z wrote: There's no way to turn it off, you have to turn it off in your brain. And delayed wakeup is only for hard knockdowns (sweeps, throws, supers, ultras) and has the same input as quickrise for soft knockdowns except for the down direction thing, which is whatever. The down input causing quickrise screws me up a lot more than the button presses which are more deliberate.
In this game it's more sensitive or something, I recall it being hard to get the hang of in third strike
Seems pretty strange that both knockdowns have 2 options, the only difference is now that a hard knockdown takes longer. I can see why this sounds pretty silly when you look at it from a beginner's point of view. We might as well call it short and long knockdown now. I'd actually prefer it if either the short or long version for both would require button input, not the opposite one. And if they could change the falling animation in some way so you could see which one it is, that would be even greater. This could be way clearer for starting players (for which fighting games are too difficult as it is).
On September 08 2014 19:21 aseq wrote: Seems pretty strange that both knockdowns have 2 options, the only difference is now that a hard knockdown takes longer. I can see why this sounds pretty silly when you look at it from a beginner's point of view. We might as well call it short and long knockdown now. I'd actually prefer it if either the short or long version for both would require button input, not the opposite one. And if they could change the falling animation in some way so you could see which one it is, that would be even greater. This could be way clearer for starting players (for which fighting games are too difficult as it is).
It's inconsistent mostly because delayed wake up on hard knockdown was added as a patch aid to stop people from abusing unblockable setups.
EPT
![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/sJJyA7R.jpg)
