EPTjust as an aside, I like Sif Muna for the channeling, and was wondering if putting anything into invocations was a good idea for a full caster type.
Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup - Page 52
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Blazinghand
United States25550 Posts
just as an aside, I like Sif Muna for the channeling, and was wondering if putting anything into invocations was a good idea for a full caster type. | ||
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crate
United States2474 Posts
Sif is the best god if you want to kill everything with summons. Getting some invocations levels at some point is certainly good and convenient but don't go overboard, get your spells first. | ||
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Blazinghand
United States25550 Posts
Here is the reason scorpions is so good: there are very few enemies in the game who can kill more than one thing in 10 aut. So your scorpion creation will almost always outpace the rate of scorpion deaths, even when you account for hostile scorpions. (This is also why spammals is very good once you get to max power, and why summon horrible things is the best summon spell in the game.) This is not true of other summons. Sif is the best god if you want to kill everything with summons. Getting some invocations levels at some point is certainly good and convenient but don't go overboard, get your spells first. Yeah I was more thinking that at some point, battles would start with me dumping all my magic into scorps, a few mammals and some imps, then hanging out while the battle goes on, channelling for 0, 1, or sometimes 2 magic, then using it to summon more stuff. This process gets started basically as soon as you're able to summon like more than 4 imps. VpSu in particular likes to hang out and channel since he doesn't care about spell or invoke hunger-- after all, once you do some basic positioning and shouting orders, you're mostly doing nothing. The thing is, the channelling is so ineffecient it seems like 3 or 4 invocations might be good. Early on of course you're not putting stuff into anything but summoning and spellcasting. | ||
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Salivanth
Australia1071 Posts
What weapon school should I pick? I assume I'm going for 1h weapons. When do I turn my primary weapon off for a while? Should I focus on it exclusively early? When do I train Shields? How useful is the skill? (At least I know about the 5/15/25 rule with shields) Should I put Armour on if I have splint mail? What about chain mail? Does Armour increase the AC of enchanted gear more then un-enchanted gear? When does my max HP get strong enough to train Fighting cost-effectively? Rather than answering all these questions individually (Except for the last armour question, that one I want to know), could someone give me a decent build? To put it in StarCraft terms, right now people are saying "1 gate FE into 3 gate robo, double forge, get upgrades, get 2 gas at some point, take third when Terran does, go Colossus." That's just not a comprehensive enough gameplan, and leaves out vital information. (Like Twilight tech.) Team Liquid values more specific "build orders" so hopefully you guys can help me. Alternatively, if MiFi's aren't really that good and I should be going with a KoBe or something, the same thing applied to that would be equally awesome. | ||
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Blazinghand
United States25550 Posts
In terms of weapon skill for going for min delay, one handed weapons tend to require a low level of skill (below 10), hand-and-a-half weapons require a skill level in the mid-teens, and two handers require 18 or more. When do I turn my primary weapon off for a while? Should I focus on it exclusively early? I focus my main weapon exclusively until I hit like 8-10 with it. It's really important just to be able to kill things fast. As a MiFi most what you are doing should be hitting o, then either tabbing the enemy to death, or if there's any doubt, just wandering off and killing other stuff. Don't put exp into anything until your primary weapon skill is decent. Should I put Armour on if I have splint mail? What about chain mail? Does Armour increase the AC of enchanted gear more then un-enchanted gear? Armor skill does 2 things: 1) increase AC from armor 2) decrease EV penalty from armor Armor skill does NOT impact the AC given from the enchantments on armor, It DOES increase the base AC granted by armor by about 2.5% per point learned. chain mail might be something you wear as you train up for plate mail-- split mail is a bit better, but if you can wear splint mail you might as well be wearing plate mail tbh EDIT: Alternatively, if MiFi's aren't really that good and I should be going with a KoBe or something, the same thing applied to that would be equally awesome. MiFi is great. you won't be getting much casting or anything, but you should train up enough to use a couple low-level spells, such a deflect missiles, swiftness, and blink if you find it. The main thing is that MiFi is like this: oooooooooooo Can I beat him? Yes -> Tabtabtatabtabtabtab No -> run away Maybe -> run away | ||
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Salivanth
Australia1071 Posts
 I'm assuming the skills you told me to get earlier should all go to 8-10 before I get my Weapon to MAD. A few more questions though:Once I hit MAD, what should I do? Should I continue cycling Fighting, Shields and Armor until they hit 27?(25 for Shields) I don't need detailed skill advice after that, I'm not going to get that far for some time. What should my primary weapon school be? If it's a toss-up, what are the pros and cons of my legitimate options? When should I branch out into the following, if I should? 1) Traps and Doors 2) A ranged skill like Throwing 3) Dodging 4) Spellcasting skills | ||
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Blazinghand
United States25550 Posts
1) I don't usually level this in the early game. You won't see any serious traps until you start running into Zot traps, I guess in lair or later. Try to get it to 10 at some point in the midgame 2) You don't need this, but usually a bow is fine with some training. Depending on your god this may be your only real way to deal damage at range. 3) if you're going for a high-AC MiFi build you won't be having much EV anyways. 4) minimal training. Just enough for a couple low level spells like swiftness, deflect missiles, etc. Anything above level 3 or 4 isn't gonna be castable in heavy armor. You'll want a decent amount of summonings to make your Abjuration spell strong. | ||
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Resistentialism
Canada688 Posts
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myopia
United States2928 Posts
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Salivanth
Australia1071 Posts
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Resistentialism
Canada688 Posts
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myopia
United States2928 Posts
Upping the amount of AC gained from skill won't help because you don't start the game with any skill. Plus, heavy armour is common enough that you can pick something up within the first 3 floors. Though, with the current state of armour, anything between leather and plate is more or less a noob trap. | ||
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Blazinghand
United States25550 Posts
The real fun way to play is to be a VpSu though and disregard spell hunger, acquire quokkas ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/fAE2r.png) Of course, it'll take you like 9 years to clear out every level. Edit: So here I am in the ecumenical temple, and there's no Sif Muna Altar to be found. Instead, my VpSu finds himself kneeling before Ashenzari, in what becomes my most awesome VpSu run yet. I find you need to curse items onto yourself to gain piety, so my amulet, rings, and armor all become cursed. Then I realize that as a Vp, it doesn't matter what I have in hand, I don't need a cutting tool to eat (and I don't need to eat at that). Regardless, I find a +2/+6 halberd and start running train, prodding enemies from the other side of my scorps. I'm chilling and wandering down a hallway and see a Kobold and I'm like "oh easy i'll just halberd him to death" but then its' like "Ashenzari warns you that this Kobold is wielding a Whip of Holy Wrath" and it's like "damn Ahenzari you a G" and then he's like "watch out this other kobold has curare venom darts" and it's yet another crisis averted. It's not his strongest ability but it's like, super awesome. | ||
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ZaplinG
United States3818 Posts
anyone have any new tips for the arcane marksmen now that the class has been out a while? I just can't seem to get a HeAm past d:4-5 without running out of arrows and having to try to sword fight something (like an ogre or a centaur) to death. I even tried to temporarily pretend I was a melee stabber until I had the supplies to convert to pure bow/magic, and it sort of worked until lvl 6, then I ran into a unique and couldn't escape... | ||
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crate
United States2474 Posts
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Blazinghand
United States25550 Posts
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crate
United States2474 Posts
But DEAM is much easier than HEAM, the extra starting int and slightly better apts end up making a sizable difference. | ||
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ZaplinG
United States3818 Posts
is there any real class that is good for He ? i remember one time i asked about HeWi and you also suggested i try De instead then too | ||
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beef42
Denmark1037 Posts
Also rocks are everywhere, but it's a bit of a pain to play constantly changing your ammo. | ||
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crate
United States2474 Posts
Probably HE is extra unappealing to me because at least the other difficult races (Op, Te, Mu) have something that makes them feel sufficiently different from other options. I don't like DE very much either but DEAM is better than HEAM. | ||
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