EPTDiablo III General Discussion - Page 682
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matiK23
United States963 Posts
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Doraemon
Australia14949 Posts
On August 11 2012 01:28 TheMango wrote: I don't really agree with all the nerf's to making inferno content easier. They are already buffing drop rates on normal mobs, buffing items, and buffing skills so its l like a double nerf. For people with decent gear, the game is already easy as it is. cmon. i've seen your gear and it's damn op. there would be less than 1% of the players base with gear anywhere near your level. all my friends have stopped playing because we just hit a wall, this patch will at least provide some incentive for us to play again. give us - the poorer and lesser geared players - a break | ||
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heishe
Germany2284 Posts
On August 11 2012 20:36 Doraemon wrote: cmon. i've seen your gear and it's damn op. there would be less than 1% of the players base with gear anywhere near your level. all my friends have stopped playing because we just hit a wall, this patch will at least provide some incentive for us to play again. give us - the poorer and lesser geared players - a break Then spend more time and get better gear. Oh come on. You don't want to spend more time to farm better gear in a game like D3? Really? That's what the game is all about, man. No reason to ask for nerfs and make the game worse for people who actually want some progression in the game. Improving gear is the only end-game there is at the moment, and nerfs just remove parts of that endgame. Also, by wall I hope you don't mean that you haven't cleared Inferno yet, because that wall is reaaaaallly low, and thin. How anyone can hit a wall in Inferno at this stage is beyond me, it's really ridiculously easy (even though getting to really farm Act 3 effectively can take a while). | ||
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sansalvador
Austria308 Posts
On August 11 2012 21:16 heishe wrote: Then spend more time and get better gear. Oh come on. You don't want to spend more time to farm better gear in a game like D3? Really? That's what the game is all about, man. No reason to ask for nerfs and make the game worse for people who actually want some progression in the game. Improving gear is the only end-game there is at the moment, and nerfs just remove parts of that endgame. Also, by wall I hope you don't mean that you haven't cleared Inferno yet, because that wall is reaaaaallly low, and thin. How anyone can hit a wall in Inferno at this stage is beyond me, it's really ridiculously easy (even though getting to really farm Act 3 effectively can take a while). This is a pretty good example of internet masturbation. | ||
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Doraemon
Australia14949 Posts
On August 11 2012 21:16 heishe wrote: Then spend more time and get better gear. Oh come on. You don't want to spend more time to farm better gear in a game like D3? Really? That's what the game is all about, man. No reason to ask for nerfs and make the game worse for people who actually want some progression in the game. Improving gear is the only end-game there is at the moment, and nerfs just remove parts of that endgame. Also, by wall I hope you don't mean that you haven't cleared Inferno yet, because that wall is reaaaaallly low, and thin. How anyone can hit a wall in Inferno at this stage is beyond me, it's really ridiculously easy (even though getting to really farm Act 3 effectively can take a while). sorry i don't have the time to play as much as you guys, i have a full time job, i have 3 hours at night that i play diablo. i have already spent more than 200 hours and i'm not embarassed to say i haven't cleared inferno. i'm happy for you that you find the ceiling so low for you, but for the group of us who have limited time DO in fact struggle. it's not uncommon to see people make demeaning comments regarding players who can't clear inferno and the generic comment is usually "we suck, we don't play enough, it's so easy how can you not do it" and to me that is pointless. you know what i enjoyed about diablo 2? i started with nothing, sold stuff for gems, then sold gems for items, then i can run keys or do uber tristram - there was variety of end game options. but currently? what can i do with the 3 hours available on hand? farm act 2 over and over and that is simply it. i try joining pub games to help me through and they unfortunately had even worse items. tldr: i'm happy you find inferno easy to clear but please understand there is a significant player base who have time constraints who can not clear inferno. i don't understand how you can bemoan changes that will assist majority of the players out there just because it will make it a little bit easier for you. to me a large problem is that heavily geared players believe they represent the majority and i understand how you would get that impression because the players who post here, d2jsp, bnet and so on are in fact highly geared players...keep in mind that the player base was/is in the millions and i have all the confidence in saying the majority are in the same position as my friends and i | ||
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zomgE
498 Posts
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Doraemon
Australia14949 Posts
On August 11 2012 21:51 zomgE wrote: why is it bad that it takes a long time to clear the game? i just don't understand it. i wish i still had more content to clear in the game.... to me there are two distinct scenarios: 1. game takes long to clear because the gameplay itself is difficult, requires concentration, accuracy and/or pure gaming skill 2. in the case of diablo 3, it takes long simply because you don't have the gear...and that is it. we're not stuck because we can't press 1 fast enough, we're not stuck because we can't get the angle right, we're stuck because the 100's of hours we played didn't drop us the gear required to progress. it's not surprising that 1 is more enjoyable than 2. let me caveat that option 2 would still be heaps of fun if i can play with friends, but the punishment for group play is just unbelievable and subsequently led me to comment why 1.04 appears to be an incentive to get back into it. | ||
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TyrantPotato
Australia1541 Posts
On August 11 2012 22:10 Doraemon wrote: to me there are two distinct scenarios: 1. game takes long to clear because the gameplay itself is difficult, requires concentration, accuracy and/or pure gaming skill 2. in the case of diablo 3, it takes long simply because you don't have the gear...and that is it. we're not stuck because we can't press 1 fast enough, we're not stuck because we can't get the angle right, we're stuck because the 100's of hours we played didn't drop us the gear required to progress. it's not surprising that 1 is more enjoyable than 2. let me caveat that option 2 would still be heaps of fun if i can play with friends, but the punishment for group play is just unbelievable and subsequently led me to comment why 1.04 appears to be an incentive to get back into it. there is one game that has elements of both 1 and 2. monster hunter. honestly i spent 600+ hours playing MH2 and another 800+ on MHFU it just was perfect in terms of grind/difficulty WOW typing this just made me cream myself thinking how epic a pc MH with giga graphics and better everything would be! | ||
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BurningSera
Ireland19621 Posts
On August 11 2012 22:10 Doraemon wrote: to me there are two distinct scenarios: 1. game takes long to clear because the gameplay itself is difficult, requires concentration, accuracy and/or pure gaming skill 2. in the case of diablo 3, it takes long simply because you don't have the gear...and that is it. we're not stuck because we can't press 1 fast enough, we're not stuck because we can't get the angle right, we're stuck because the 100's of hours we played didn't drop us the gear required to progress. it's not surprising that 1 is more enjoyable than 2. let me caveat that option 2 would still be heaps of fun if i can play with friends, but the punishment for group play is just unbelievable and subsequently led me to comment why 1.04 appears to be an incentive to get back into it. the two scenarios are not the reasons that you still have not cleared inferno - the real reason is you missed the exploits. I dare to say most people bought the game at launch and if they didn't abuse the exploits then they would be exactly in your same boat (and most of them probably never turn on the game after the first month). And fyi flipping in AH is about 1000times quicker to get good gears in D3 but that golden period of time has passed as well. Legit players are the ones who get 'punished' most in D3. There is a reason D3 is called D3: The lord of Auction House. | ||
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Grovbolle
Denmark3804 Posts
On August 11 2012 22:43 BurningSera wrote: Legit players are the ones who get 'punished' most in D3. There is a reason D3 is called D3: The lord of Auction House. This is how I feel all the time | ||
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oneofthem
Cayman Islands24199 Posts
they need to introduce more end game content and generally raise the income level of the average player so that they can hope to make more money than inflation level. otherwise the economy will keep shrinking. | ||
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heishe
Germany2284 Posts
On August 11 2012 22:43 BurningSera wrote: the two scenarios are not the reasons that you still have not cleared inferno - the real reason is you missed the exploits. I dare to say most people bought the game at launch and if they didn't abuse the exploits then they would be exactly in your same boat (and most of them probably never turn on the game after the first month). And fyi flipping in AH is about 1000times quicker to get good gears in D3 but that golden period of time has passed as well. Legit players are the ones who get 'punished' most in D3. There is a reason D3 is called D3: The lord of Auction House. That's not true. Inferno is easily clearable without any exploits, and most players who cleared Inferno have certainly done it without exploits. It's even clearable without the auction house, but it's gonna take a (much) longer time. On August 11 2012 22:10 Doraemon wrote: to me there are two distinct scenarios: 1. game takes long to clear because the gameplay itself is difficult, requires concentration, accuracy and/or pure gaming skill 2. in the case of diablo 3, it takes long simply because you don't have the gear...and that is it. we're not stuck because we can't press 1 fast enough, we're not stuck because we can't get the angle right, we're stuck because the 100's of hours we played didn't drop us the gear required to progress. it's not surprising that 1 is more enjoyable than 2. The time argument is invalid. First of all... "100s of hours".. what? The game has only been out for less than three months. I thought you had a full-time job! And I had Inferno cleared with ..80 hours played time or so. When I still played Diablo 3, I played less than one hour a day (on average, since very often during the week I couldn't or didn't want to play at all and then would play a couple of hours on the weekends). It took me quite some time, and I didn't clear inferno before the nerf (simply didn't have time), but I did it, and it wasn't hard. The second scenario may be less enjoyable for you, but that IS Diablo. You didn't answer zomgE's question. What does it help you to have the time reduced that you need to clear the game? And all of you: Stop implying that players who use the AH are illegitimate players. That's ridiculous. | ||
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Doraemon
Australia14949 Posts
On August 11 2012 22:59 heishe wrote: That's not true. Inferno is easily clearable without any exploits, and most players who cleared Inferno have certainly done it without exploits. It's even clearable without the auction house, but it's gonna take a (much) longer time. The time argument is invalid. First of all... "100s of hours".. what? The game has only been out for less than three months. I thought you had a full-time job! And I had Inferno cleared with ..80 hours played time or so. When I still played Diablo 3, I played less than one hour a day (on average, since very often during the week I couldn't or didn't want to play at all and then would play a couple of hours on the weekends). It took me quite some time, and I didn't clear inferno before the nerf (simply didn't have time), but I did it, and it wasn't hard. The second scenario may be less enjoyable for you, but that IS Diablo. You didn't answer zomgE's question. What does it help you to have the time reduced that you need to clear the game? And all of you: Stop implying that players who use the AH are illegitimate players. That's ridiculous. 3 months = 90 days, 3 hours a day is 270 hours. you proved my point by saying u cleared it in 80 hours and we didn't despite longer playing time, and dare i say with no difference in skills. you managed because you have better gear and we don't. i did answer zomge's question, it will be more enjoyable because i can finally play with friends without getting crushed. although it's not direct related to reduced game length, it's about enjoyment | ||
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oneofthem
Cayman Islands24199 Posts
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heishe
Germany2284 Posts
On August 11 2012 23:12 Doraemon wrote: 3 months = 90 days, 3 hours a day is 270 hours. you proved my point by saying u cleared it in 80 hours and we didn't despite longer playing time, and dare i say with no difference in skills. you managed because you have better gear and we don't. i did answer zomge's question, it will be more enjoyable because i can finally play with friends without getting crushed. Oh.. so your point was that it's too hard for you to use trading or the auction house to find and sell gear, or that you didn't want to use it. I understand. Well, then there's nothing I can say. | ||
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alQahira
United States511 Posts
Anyway, I feel like I'm at a pretty reasonable place in terms of game progression and hours played. I feel like the two changes that will make a big difference are weapon quality buffs to ilvl 61 and 62, and obviously the multiplayer health nerf. I think these are both needed, as friends that had played less would really drag me down when playing together. Also, weapon DPS is the single most important stat in the game, and getting your first decent weapon is such a huge help, but unless you get a lucky drop it will take hours to get up to the 5 million + that you will need for it. With increased drops, weapon prices should come down quite a bit, and help out people like Doraemon. Edit: meant to say 180 hours played on my main. Obviously more hours on other character, but I only really farm with my main wizard at the moment. | ||
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BurningSera
Ireland19621 Posts
On August 11 2012 22:59 heishe wrote: That's not true. Inferno is easily clearable without any exploits, and most players who cleared Inferno have certainly done it without exploits. It's even clearable without the auction house, but it's gonna take a (much) longer time. First off, it is a very complicated situation in saying 'clearing inferno' because it is highly related to different classes, i was simply doing a generalization there. Wiz was the easiest to clear diablo at the first few days because of the huge exploit and then DH is the easiest class for a long time since he can farm act3 so efficiently with glass cannon build (dh doesnt even need dps when all the dh in the world were rushing the replenish chest in underbridge). And there was this chapter skipping exploit where everyone plays the game knew and used it (since launch and lasted for a long long time). Those are facts and they are caused by the exploits. The first exploit that ruined the economy is probably the replenish chest in act2. Now if you tell me you can clear inferno without using wiz/dh (and monk to some extend in the first few days after launch) in 80hours, you either have some extremely good luck (on AH or drop), or you used someone's help to clear diablo (in this case there is nothing to discuss of). And that only applies to players played since launch. After all the nerf/changes etc, i dare to say new players are impossible to clear D3 in under 200hours. 3 of my friends who started since last month (in which i told them not to buy the game) now stuck in act1 (obviously) with the richest one has 500k in bank. I just lol'ed at them and tell them i couldn't really help them either. | ||
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heishe
Germany2284 Posts
On August 11 2012 23:39 BurningSera wrote: First off, it is a very complicated situation in saying 'clearing inferno' because it is highly related to different classes, i was simply doing a generalization there. Wiz was the easiest to clear diablo at the first few days because of the huge exploit and then DH is the easiest class for a long time since he can farm act3 so efficiently with glass cannon build (dh doesnt even need dps when all the dh in the world were rushing the replenish chest in underbridge). And there was this chapter skipping exploit where everyone plays the game knew and used it (since launch and lasted for a long long time). Those are facts and they are caused by the exploits. The first exploit that ruined the economy is probably the replenish chest in act2. Now if you tell me you can clear inferno without using wiz/dh (and monk to some extend in the first few days after launch) in 80hours, you either have some extremely good luck (on AH or drop), or you used someone's help to clear diablo (in this case there is nothing to discuss of). And that only applies to players played since launch. After all the nerf/changes etc, i dare to say new players are impossible to clear D3 in under 200hours. 3 of my friends who started since last month (in which i told them not to buy the game) now stuck in act1 (obviously) with the richest one has 500k in bank. I just lol'ed at them and tell them i couldn't really help them either. I don't think we can reasonably discuss this, since all we're doing is throwing anecdotal evidence towards each-other. I will say that I also played a WD (in hardcore), and that just sucked ass, but that's just one class and the other 4 seem fine. All I can say is that from my personal experience, when I look at the broad population of players in D3, I can't help but feel that people simply do things wrong a lot, which lets them take a lot more time for everything (have you ever looked at peoples gear in the general chat? they have no clue how to properly equip their character). You have a point with the new players though. Gets me thinking... It's probably incredibly hard to make money in Hell/A1/A2 right now, because the players who can farm A3 and thus get good enough items to actually make money, got their A3 farming equip largely in a time when mediocre items could still be sold on the AH. Then Blizzard nerfed everything and changed up the droprates, and suddenly there's this huge disparity between people that have been playing since launch and can farm everything like crazy because mobs were nerfed, and new starting players, since now mediocre items won't get you even 5k gold on the auction house, plus the player base shrunk a lot, AND to top it off gold has inflated a lot since launch and decent items now cost millions where they would earlier have been at maybe a couple hundred thousand. | ||
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BurningSera
Ireland19621 Posts
 and you probably know why by now. Don't get me wrong imo WD is the best class (most fun to play with) from normal to hell but inferno is where the fun ends.Not trying to take away anything from you, may be you are a very good d3 player but even so d3 is not that skilled based compare to d2, inferno's bosses/elites are all gear check based and you know that. And i really pity those newer players. Since there is no ladder reset etc, D3 is basically now a miniature real world, the rich gets riches lol thanks to those botters. | ||
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kafkaesque
Germany2006 Posts
Blizzard is mocking me.... | ||
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