EPTOn July 19 2007 10:19 Hot_Bid wrote:
i thought stork was the one that lost his nexus (in addition to being storm dropped)
bisu saved his nexus during that simultaneous drop
Show nested quote +
On July 18 2007 21:28 Organ wrote:
Agreed about Stork's superior micro, and investing into double-forge updgrade. I just wrote about
#2 letting all of his probes be stormed at his natural. it's hard to fix this mistake since the only reason it happened was that stork was microing his 2 shuttle drop at that exact time, so bisu basically got lucky that stork wasnt there to retreat his probes.
that is not a great mistake when you're razing opponent's nexus and make a bigger damage to him.
I enjoy facing strong opponents and I like PvP very much. I would accept your offer about playing a series of games if only I hadn't decided to have a rest of starcraft about 2 weeks ago.. Maybe later you'll prove me your superior PvP knowledge
.
On July 18 2007 13:23 NonY[rC] wrote:
i don't say that bisu's storm drop hurt stork more than stork's 2 shuttle drop hurt bisu. if you notice, i am tackling the belief that failing to research goon range was a major setback. when stork said in an interview that he was upset because he made mistakes in every game that caused him to lose the series, i don't think he was talking about goon range.
i did watch the game. stork got back into the game because he skimped on forge upgrades, he invested less into arbiters, and he had much better micro in the major fights. it was the third thing that helped stork the most, as he caught bisu horribly out of position and proceeded to kill bisu's units very efficiently with storms.
his horrible use of his dark archon is not so much a mistake as a missed opportunity. the dark archon had great potential but, as you saw in the game, it is no guarantee. still, i fail to see the revelance to goon range.
anyway, as great as this forum is, language barriers, impatience, egos, etc, tend to get in the way of good discussion. seeing as how this is a matter of PvP knowledge, i'd be happy to accept a series of games as a way of demonstrating whose knowledge is superior. and then we won't have to concern ourselves with all these words...
On July 17 2007 22:04 Organ wrote:
While bisu was storm-dropping stork, stork was killing of bisu's nexus. And Stork succeed more here! Losing nexus hurts your economics much more than losing your probes cause you have a good amount of probes in pvp usually and can easily divide probes from to bases into three. But when you lose your nexus it's pure mining time. Remember that bisu lost his shuttle + 2HT for those probes, Stork's units otherwise killed nexus and traded themself for some cannons and bisu's troops. You say bisu gained economic advantage after this economic trade. Did you watch the game? Stork had much more troops after this and gained his advantage HERE, but Bisu barely survived and it could be close but the really deciding factor was in those probes at the bottom expansion which couldn't find their way to mine during all late game. And because of that arbiter decided the game. And NOT USING DARK ARHON AS WELL. Imagine if he only feedbacked those arbs.. Does anyone know where the hell he had disappeared?
On July 17 2007 16:54 NonY[rC] wrote:
i would just like to say that goon range would not have made a game-changing difference by itself. the biggest mistakes that stork made were the ones that hit his economy hard: #1 letting his nexus die to a 4 DT drop when he could have been prepared for the DT drop and saved the nexus. #2 letting all of his probes be stormed at his natural. it's hard to fix this mistake since the only reason it happened was that stork was microing his 2 shuttle drop at that exact time, so bisu basically got lucky that stork wasnt there to retreat his probes. but in any case, these 2 major economic set-backs were what allowed bisu to get arbiters much faster and get the game-winning statis fields. in the major battles, most of stork's goons found an enemy zealot charging close enough so that range didnt matter. the number of units and the positioning of units (for flanks and storms) are wayyyy bigger deciding factors than whether a few goons got a few extra hits.
i would just like to say that goon range would not have made a game-changing difference by itself. the biggest mistakes that stork made were the ones that hit his economy hard: #1 letting his nexus die to a 4 DT drop when he could have been prepared for the DT drop and saved the nexus. #2 letting all of his probes be stormed at his natural. it's hard to fix this mistake since the only reason it happened was that stork was microing his 2 shuttle drop at that exact time, so bisu basically got lucky that stork wasnt there to retreat his probes. but in any case, these 2 major economic set-backs were what allowed bisu to get arbiters much faster and get the game-winning statis fields. in the major battles, most of stork's goons found an enemy zealot charging close enough so that range didnt matter. the number of units and the positioning of units (for flanks and storms) are wayyyy bigger deciding factors than whether a few goons got a few extra hits.
While bisu was storm-dropping stork, stork was killing of bisu's nexus. And Stork succeed more here! Losing nexus hurts your economics much more than losing your probes cause you have a good amount of probes in pvp usually and can easily divide probes from to bases into three. But when you lose your nexus it's pure mining time. Remember that bisu lost his shuttle + 2HT for those probes, Stork's units otherwise killed nexus and traded themself for some cannons and bisu's troops. You say bisu gained economic advantage after this economic trade. Did you watch the game? Stork had much more troops after this and gained his advantage HERE, but Bisu barely survived and it could be close but the really deciding factor was in those probes at the bottom expansion which couldn't find their way to mine during all late game. And because of that arbiter decided the game. And NOT USING DARK ARHON AS WELL. Imagine if he only feedbacked those arbs.. Does anyone know where the hell he had disappeared?
i don't say that bisu's storm drop hurt stork more than stork's 2 shuttle drop hurt bisu. if you notice, i am tackling the belief that failing to research goon range was a major setback. when stork said in an interview that he was upset because he made mistakes in every game that caused him to lose the series, i don't think he was talking about goon range.
i did watch the game. stork got back into the game because he skimped on forge upgrades, he invested less into arbiters, and he had much better micro in the major fights. it was the third thing that helped stork the most, as he caught bisu horribly out of position and proceeded to kill bisu's units very efficiently with storms.
his horrible use of his dark archon is not so much a mistake as a missed opportunity. the dark archon had great potential but, as you saw in the game, it is no guarantee. still, i fail to see the revelance to goon range.
anyway, as great as this forum is, language barriers, impatience, egos, etc, tend to get in the way of good discussion. seeing as how this is a matter of PvP knowledge, i'd be happy to accept a series of games as a way of demonstrating whose knowledge is superior. and then we won't have to concern ourselves with all these words...
Agreed about Stork's superior micro, and investing into double-forge updgrade. I just wrote about
#2 letting all of his probes be stormed at his natural. it's hard to fix this mistake since the only reason it happened was that stork was microing his 2 shuttle drop at that exact time, so bisu basically got lucky that stork wasnt there to retreat his probes.
that is not a great mistake when you're razing opponent's nexus and make a bigger damage to him.
I enjoy facing strong opponents and I like PvP very much. I would accept your offer about playing a series of games if only I hadn't decided to have a rest of starcraft about 2 weeks ago.. Maybe later you'll prove me your superior PvP knowledge
.i thought stork was the one that lost his nexus (in addition to being storm dropped)
bisu saved his nexus during that simultaneous drop
He was talking about the drops that happened a bit after the initial drops. When Bisu storm dropped Stork's front natural and Stork razed Bisu's back natural.
