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If you come in here looking for "anime recommendations" then please refer to this chart before posting: Anime Recommendations (as of may 2014). We also have an IRC channel called #tladt where we all hang out. The channel is on Rizon, not QuakeNet! Feel free to check it out. TLADT discord is Discord.gg For currently airing anime, please see Anichart.net | ||
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felisconcolori
United States6169 Posts
On August 02 2016 09:25 XenOmega wrote: Today is the day I drop Taboo Tatoo What a fucking mess, garbage show. This is this season's Big Order. Also, fuck Subaru Does it even have Big Order's incest or a pregnant but now you're not? Indeed, fuck Subaru. | ||
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Sentenal
United States12398 Posts
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Deleted User 173346
16169 Posts
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Deleted User 173346
16169 Posts
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IceHism
United States1903 Posts
On August 02 2016 11:34 plasmidghost wrote: I won't sugarcoat it, Under the Dog was pretty awful. Nothing explained at all. If I was a backer, I'd be regretting wasting my money Feeling a 1/10, maybe a 2/10 at best. At least the English was pretty good (/s) I didn't follow any of the development, is there supposed to be more? If so, I'd watch it just to see what any of this means It's a series so yea there is more. What's funny is why does it look so bad with 800k dollars in backing. Where did the money go? | ||
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Deleted User 173346
16169 Posts
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Sentenal
United States12398 Posts
On August 02 2016 12:04 IceHism wrote: It's a series so yea there is more. What's funny is why does it look so bad with 800k dollars in backing. Where did the money go? Normally I would say Backer Rewards but... WTF that Kickstarter didn't offer anything good. Maybe Muv-Luv Kickstarter just spoiled me as to what a good kickstarter is, but now I really feel bad for those Backers. | ||
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IceHism
United States1903 Posts
On August 02 2016 13:30 plasmidghost wrote: I actually have no idea how much money it takes to make a single episode like this, is 800k average, high, or low? Most anime single episodes range from 100k-200k. Ufotable has the highest average per episode i believe with just a bit higher than 200k. maybe 230-260. This was just a pilot episode to show business people that this type of anime could succeed (and i think it'll get a series soon since the team did get offers from people) so I believe that they spent most of the money on this. I'm not sure how much they are using the money for paychecks but the majority of the money should have been used on this single episode. | ||
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Numy
South Africa35471 Posts
Artist always cry about having the freedom to do what they want but the reality is you can't trust them to get things done if you give them that freedom. It's funny that they did a worse job than Triggers random youngins did for LWA which I'm pretty sure didn't have anywhere near this budget. edit: Actually looking up kickstarter for LWA2 it was almost 200k cheaper while being longer and better done. That's just ridiculous. This is after their initial demand was merely for 150 for a normal episode that got so overfunded they turned into a longer feature. How can anyone praise Under the Dog wtf. | ||
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Miragee
8716 Posts
On August 02 2016 09:06 Nezgar wrote: I ended up rating it 6/10. There was no story to speak of, no proper characters that had any remarkable attributes or memorable dialogue. World building was reduced to throwing a few words around and.. that was pretty much it. The redeeming thing was certainly the action, which had a good pace to it. What you said pretty much sums up my thoughts about it. It was like a good teaser for a proper movie or TV series that would need to flesh out all the things that didn't get any attention due to the length of the OVA. Yeah, 6/10 was what I was giving it as well. Could have been a 5/10 as well. Guess I was generous here because all of the negativity or so... On August 02 2016 10:30 Sentenal wrote: I feel sorry for Under the Dog's backers, but this result should be expected. Why though. Kickstarter has brought us lot of good games. Dunno why an anime shouldn't be possible. On August 02 2016 12:04 IceHism wrote: What's funny is why does it look so bad with 800k dollars in backing. Where did the money go? See, this is what I don't get. Sure the show has some moments where it looks like absolute garbage. Some first person scenes, some scenes from above etc. You can clearly see that they ran out of budget there. However, it also has some good animation for long parts. It's not on the same level of TV shows in that regard. I doubt it's 800 k worth, either, and we know that some of the money got lost due to the management. But actual animation instead of trickery like in TV shows in disgustingly expensive. For comparison: Ghibli dropped 20-50 mio on feature-length movies in the past. On August 02 2016 09:29 IceHism wrote: Weird, i didn't know people were watching taboo tatoo un-ironically. I've only been doing it for lulz. Ikr? Same for me here. On August 02 2016 15:48 Numy wrote: From what I could gather a lot of the money got lost just by terrible management of resources. That's what happens when you give money to people without having any kind of business contracts in place to get them to actually do the work properly. As said, it can work. I for one am pretty satisfied giving money to PC game studios like Obsidian, Larian and inXile. I personally didn't follow the backing process of Under the Dog so I don't know whether it seemed trust-worthy or not. Usually there is lots of shit on kickstarter and in between some projects that are really worth backing. | ||
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Numy
South Africa35471 Posts
Honestly part of the problem is way kickstarters are structured. Going over the budget is actually a huge issue. Obsidian themselves talk about how much pressure the excessive amount of money they got put on them. If I budget a game for 1 mill but then get 2 mill that now puts a burden on my company to change the product to be worth the new budget. That change isn't always positive or even possible. Then there's the issue with setting proper deadlines and project goals. Artists in general aren't particularly deadline orientated or good at setting up proper project budgets so you need individuals that can do this leading the project. However these studios don't always have the people in place that can actually manage that. They are often more a collection of "passionate people" then properly set up companies and even if they are properly setup it still can be a huge issue. It really amounts to kickstarters being an uphill battle before they even start. Early access is possible worse in my opinion. How I loathe it.... edit: As for Under the Dog. There were enough hints and drama surrounding it to suggest it wouldn't deliver well ahead of time. | ||
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Miragee
8716 Posts
On August 02 2016 18:39 Numy wrote: Kickstarter really hasn't brought a lot of good games compared to how much stuff gets kickstarted. There are a few exceptions to the rule but on average it's just not worth it. Honestly part of the problem is way kickstarters are structured. Going over the budget is actually a huge issue. Obsidian themselves talk about how much pressure the excessive amount of money they got put on them. If I budget a game for 1 mill but then get 2 mill that now puts a burden on my company to change the product to be worth the new budget. That change isn't always positive or even possible. Then there's the issue with setting proper deadlines and project goals. Artists in general aren't particularly deadline orientated or good at setting up proper project budgets so you need individuals that can do this leading the project. However these studios don't always have the people in place that can actually manage that. They are often more a collection of "passionate people" then properly set up companies and even if they are properly setup it still can be a huge issue. It really amounts to kickstarters being an uphill battle before they even start. Early access is possible worse in my opinion. How I loathe it.... edit: As for Under the Dog. There were enough hints and drama surrounding it to suggest it wouldn't deliver well ahead of time. I agree. The thing is, when I look at kickstarter pages, it's pretty apparent which projects are most likely going to be a success and which don't. To this date I have never backed a project and later regretted it. There are still a few on going projects I backed (Torment: Tides of Numenera, Divinity: OS II, Bard's Tale IV, Camelot Unchained and Kingdomcome Deliverance), so that might change in the future. I think the pressure, as you mentioned, is a problem. I don't understand people though. What do they expect? Only because it's kickstarter it will be the godlike game of the century and everything they desire for. I don't know, I go differently about that. I know the games will have things I don't like. Everything has. I know they will make some decisions I don't agree with - hell, that's the process of democracy when lots of people vote on certain topics. People should know what to expect when going into kickstarter and stop whining when they don't get 100 % of what they dreamed of. But I guess that's impossible because humans are stupid. You can start the shit storm when they actually delivered something bad, something completely different or nothing at all. And yeah, I loathe Early Access as well. It's the cancer of the pc game market. What's even more confusing: kickstarter projects that go early access. What the hell? You have thousands of loyal backers that are willing to play your alpha/beta to test it and write reports to ensure you can release the best game possible. Instead you try to get beta testers that don't write reports, are disappointed because it's not a full game and shit on it all over the internet, causing bad publicity. It makes no sense at all. | ||
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Toadesstern
Germany16350 Posts
On August 02 2016 13:46 Sentenal wrote: Normally I would say Backer Rewards but... WTF that Kickstarter didn't offer anything good. Maybe Muv-Luv Kickstarter just spoiled me as to what a good kickstarter is, but now I really feel bad for those Backers. as far as I know since I'm one of the guys that spend some money on it and ended up disappointed (haven't seen it yet!) was something like this. Keep in mind it's internet hearsay: 1) So the idea was to make an independent anime where all the money is there to begin with so that you don't end with situations where you're like "yeah I really would like to do this, but it won't sell..." etc 2) It didn't take off for a long time and looked like it wouldn't make it for the longest time so supposedly the people other than those that wanted to make it kickstarter got pissed and didn't feel like doing anything. I've heard the reason there weren't any updates early on was because people like writer for original source didn't feel like it's worth his time when the kickstarter is obviously failing anyways 3) So in the last week or so when they suddenly got money they got more updates, people became happier etc but the people that did the kickstarter essentially got kicked out from the project and they basicly went back to producing it like any other series/anime/ova when the innitial selling point was that they'd not do that... 4) Supposedly the source author is really hard to deal with and kind of infamous? They apparently had a discussions about what to do with the extra money, how to spend that etc. Like, prepare for next OVA, make it longer, make it better or whatever and he supposedly was all like "nah, I think we just use the 300k for OVA1 and everything beyond that goes in the creators pockets. We've earned this". Idk, if even just a bit of all the stuff I heard about that source author is correct that seems like a person I wouldn't want to work with Don't really remember what the estimate for costs were... I have the number 300k and 500k in my head so one of them was what ended up the goal for this and they specifically said it's more on the high-end of a budget because they want to make action look good and all. | ||
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SK.Testie
Canada11084 Posts
Zestiria looks fucking great imo. | ||
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Miragee
8716 Posts
On August 02 2016 22:03 SK.Testie wrote: Wonder if by ufotable using games and getting to use the soundtracks of those games they save money on music because they can just use the ingame tracks. So they can focus their budget on other things like art & animation. I haven't found the CG to be a complete eyesore either. Zestiria looks fucking great imo. Zestiria is a great example of inconsistency. One time they have cgi with lots of textures that actually don't look to bad. Then in the next moment they throw in cgi scenes that look like they are done by an intern, no textures, right out of a freaking simulator. It's really irritating. In UBW they at least did a good job at hiding all the cgi. I mean, I don't know what costs how much but I assume actual animation takes a lot of money. And that's actually the department where ufotable doesn't excel above other studios. | ||
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Sentenal
United States12398 Posts
On August 02 2016 17:11 Miragee wrote: Why though. Kickstarter has brought us lot of good games. Dunno why an anime shouldn't be possible. LWA2 showed anime is possible. Under the Dog shows how not to do it. Given Under the Dog is original, there is more risk since no one actually knows what they are getting, and the staff listed was subpar (other than based Orange, but good CGI won't save shitty anime Comet Lucifer). Lots of people were just blindly backing it just to show that an anime can be done via Kickstarter, not because there was any indication that the end result would actually be good. Just looking at the anime's concept was enough for me to stay away. And then following the Kickstarter, the actual production of it and the drama surrounding it was pretty thick, so this disastrous outcome isn't actually surprising. | ||
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
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Slaughter
United States20255 Posts
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Miragee
8716 Posts
Ahahahahahaha. That girl kissed him, then that other girl kissed her and the only thing the third girl was thinking is "indirect kiss"? loooooooooool It's not like she should be bothered more because of the direct kiss, no it's the indirect one. Japan pls. xD And what the hell was the ping pong scene? Could have been an intro for an SM hentai also, lol. This anime. On August 03 2016 05:32 Requizen wrote: Are we talking about Netflix Death Note here? Because Willem Dafoe is going to be Ryuk and I don't know whether to laugh histerically, feel uncomfortable, or both. What? On August 03 2016 05:39 Slaughter wrote: They are making a US live action tv show of SAO.....lol Yeah, looking forward to the scene where Asuna gets raped by that elven dude. Must be awkward as fuck to do that for american TV with real people, lol. | ||
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IceHism
United States1903 Posts
all of them are getting white washed :/ Qualidea code 4 + Show Spoiler + Wow. first they made the climatic scene a still shot. Next they hit Canaria with a big rock at the end of the episode which was just fucking hilarious. lolololol | ||
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