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If you come in here looking for "anime recommendations" then please refer to this chart before posting: Anime Recommendations (as of may 2014). We also have an IRC channel called #tladt where we all hang out. The channel is on Rizon, not QuakeNet! Feel free to check it out. TLADT discord is Discord.ggFor currently airing anime, please see Anichart.net |
On January 05 2013 11:53 Southlight wrote:
Steins;Gate anime was alright, but it missed some big nuances. You can probably search one of my rants about it with Milkis, where it was accepted that the S;G anime missed a significant aspect of Okabe's character, which may or may not damage the anime for you.
I thought the F/SN anime was horrible, but most people in this thread are biased because they dislike the canon Heaven's Feel route from the VN. To clarify, the VN has three "routes," but the third is universally considered canon while the first two are considered "what if" type stories. The anime really only details the first, most straight-forward and bland route, while the third (HF) is more a continuation of Fate/Zero. Fate/Zero on the other hand is from a book, so there is no VN, and is also written by a different author (Urobuchi Gen, who generally belonged to Nitro+, which in an amusing little connection for this discussion is one of the two companies behind Chaos;Head and Steins;Gate).
I loved Clannad, but I'm apparently a sucker for slice of life and tearjerkers.
VN adaptations tend to struggle because VNs individually usually have more textual content than novels and come with a lot of "tricks" that cannot be performed as well via a book medium. After all, we're looking at an industry that catastrophically fails whenever presented with source material with more depth than a 200-page Middle School level book. The vast majority of VN adaptations then end up being adaptations of standard School RomCom Harem stuff. The ones that are actual quality source material that ARE picked up tend to also be picked up by said companies that are willing to grab the school RomCom stuff, because the stigma of being a porn game tends/tended to shy people away. That trend is obviously slowly being changed, but at the same time some of the better VN works have either already been taken or are basically impossible to animate. Hence the dilemma of Little Busters, where so many people pined for an anime, but it was always waved off by KyoAni due to its impossible nature. So then it gets picked up... by a much reviled studio. The end result you can imagine.
Tsukihime anime was horrible, again for similar reasons as the F/SN anime, except that the Tsukihime VN was less of a start-to-finish affair and thus is even rougher to storyboard/animate. As a result you get an entire season of a single, bland route, which is fantastic for lore/background purposes but is useless in the context of a VN adaptation. There were if I remember correctly six routes, each of which diverged significantly from each other, and as a sum gave insight into the Tohno household and the world. Combined with ineffective storyboarding and horrible production quality you get something that many would rather carry on as if it never existed.
A surprisingly good anime adaptation was OreTsuba (Oretachi ni Tsubasa ha Nai), despite it having some of the more nasty storyboarding obstacles in VNs. I would still highly recommending reading it instead if the possibility exists (I'm not very knowledgeable about translations), but if it is not possible, and you're not willing to wait however many years it may take, or don't intend to read anyways, then watching it is perfectly fine.
Wow really informative. Thanks for the explanation! So I take it that studios have more difficulty adapting visual novels to anime specifically due to its format? So in general they do a better job for mangas, novels (or whatever Bakemonogatari is), etc.? From what I've personally seen and read of other's opinions, I take it that the original source is almost always better than the anime adaptation is the general consensus.
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On January 05 2013 12:17 Aerisky wrote:Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 12:14 Artifice wrote:
Is there supposed to be any relation between s;g, c;h, and r;n? I just caught up on r;n and now I'm watching c;h, I keep hearing that 'Kagome, Kagome' beeping at random points. Also the world divergence number meter thingy from s;g was shown at the beginning of r;n. I don't read things about things, sorry if this is a dumb question. I believe it's the same world but the "universes" differ (events are distinct and unconnected), not sure though.
I thought it was something along the lines of this. Isn't R;N based like 10 years after the events of S;G? You have Nae in both of them after all and
+ Show Spoiler +I spoilered myself to the ending of R;N, but it seems like Kaito uses a virus created by Daru to stop Kimijima's plan. If so, it just blows my mind that they can exist in the same universe/general timeline even if they are in different divergence number. How do all these secret organizations not notice each other? I'm just skeptical that SERN and the committee of 300 can act independently of each other without noticing each other.
You would think that since the events of both leads to a possible post-apocalyptic future, there would be more overlap. Like considering the revelation in R;N that the sun is blowing up soon, wouldn't SERN be more concerned? And I think the committee of 300 would definitely be very interested in time travel...
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On January 05 2013 12:18 generalyao wrote:
Wow really informative. Thanks for the explanation! So I take it that studios have more difficulty adapting visual novels to anime specifically due to its format? So in general they do a better job for mangas, novels (or whatever Bakemonogatari is), etc.? From what I've personally seen and read of other's opinions, I take it that the original source is almost always better than the anime adaptation is the general consensus.
Honestly it's just up to the studio, the staff, and then dumb luck. And of course the quality of the source material (which in most cases is not really 100/100 material, if you get what I mean). For example, I think most people would agree that Jormungand S2 was better than S1 in anime format, and I've noted in this thread that I actually liked the way the anime ended it more than the manga. While you can still tell that the studio sucks ass at gunfight scenes, you didn't feel it as much in the second season because the source material more-or-less moved away from that and actually to character development. So that's a case of the source material tying the hands of a studio that was "alright" but did a decent job.
I'd say in general anything novelized is going to be harder to animate, just as it's harder to make a theatrical adaptation of a book. This has nothing to do with Japanese culture or animation or whatever, it's just (IMO) a universal truth in all languages. Manga->Anime usually has an easier time, but I'd also (cynically) remark that manga writing is usually nothing remotely like well-written novels, either, so that's that  That's a different topic though, and more about how good illustrators are usually not good writers!
Good writers use a lot of tricks and know their medium. Nishio Ishin for instance is simultaneously notorious and reputed for his wordplay and his fascinating dialogue. Well, Shaft's done a decent job of transferring that into anime format, but you're still missing out on the bulk of the dialogue, and thus the bulk of what's made the books popular. Does that mean the anime is bad? Not necessarily, as there's enough "action" and such within all this dialogue to make it an adaptable work. It also helps that the studio was willing to (or forced to, given that they've more-or-less done what they did with SZS in terms of style) take a different approach to animating the series, and it was a hit with fans. I wouldn't be fair if I didn't also mention Gundam Unicorn, which is a set of novels (seven, IIRC), which were animated by a studio I generally disdain (Sunrise) and has turned out to be pretty good, although if you nitpick the plot and events you can tell where stuff has been truncated, stuff doesn't make as much sense, etc. It just is how it is.
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R;N, C;H and S;G all in the same world, iirc the Science series or something, forgot proper name. The connection between C;H and the rest is a bit more tentative because iirc they linked it solely w/ the 300 man committee thing and some reused explanation pictures from C;H in S;G (Kurisu's thesis used very similar, if not identical visual explanations to the thing in C;H). R;N just has S;G characters having cameos or being referred to I believe.
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Wait... ain't HF route is pretty well regarded here? And I don't know anyone who think F/SN anime is good.
On January 05 2013 12:36 Southlight wrote:Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 12:18 generalyao wrote:
Wow really informative. Thanks for the explanation! So I take it that studios have more difficulty adapting visual novels to anime specifically due to its format? So in general they do a better job for mangas, novels (or whatever Bakemonogatari is), etc.? From what I've personally seen and read of other's opinions, I take it that the original source is almost always better than the anime adaptation is the general consensus.
Honestly it's just up to the studio, the staff, and then dumb luck. And of course the quality of the source material (which in most cases is not really 100/100 material, if you get what I mean). For example, I think most people would agree that Jormungand S2 was better than S1 in anime format, and I've noted in this thread that I actually liked the way the anime ended it more than the manga. While you can still tell that the studio sucks ass at gunfight scenes, you didn't feel it as much in the second season because the source material more-or-less moved away from that and actually to character development. So that's a case of the source material tying the hands of a studio that was "alright" but did a decent job. I'd say in general anything novelized is going to be harder to animate, just as it's harder to make a theatrical adaptation of a book. This has nothing to do with Japanese culture or animation or whatever, it's just (IMO) a universal truth in all languages. Manga->Anime usually has an easier time, but I'd also (cynically) remark that manga writing is usually nothing remotely like well-written novels, either, so that's that That's a different topic though, and more about how good illustrators are usually not good writers! Good writers use a lot of tricks and know their medium. Nishio Ishin for instance is simultaneously notorious and reputed for his wordplay and his fascinating dialogue. Well, Shaft's done a decent job of transferring that into anime format, but you're still missing out on the bulk of the dialogue, and thus the bulk of what's made the books popular. Does that mean the anime is bad? Not necessarily, as there's enough "action" and such within all this dialogue to make it an adaptable work. It also helps that the studio was willing to (or forced to, given that they've more-or-less done what they did with SZS in terms of style) take a different approach to animating the series, and it was a hit with fans. I wouldn't be fair if I didn't also mention Gundam Unicorn, which is a set of novels (seven, IIRC), which were animated by a studio I generally disdain (Sunrise) and has turned out to be pretty good, although if you nitpick the plot and events you can tell where stuff has been truncated, stuff doesn't make as much sense, etc. It just is how it is.
How can you hate on Sunrise after the stretch they had in late 90s (Gundam 08th MS > Escaflowne > Outlaw Star > Cowboy Bebop > Turn A Gundam), and still cranking out 2-3 quality work every year now.
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When can we ever get an anime/manga section so we can all post in our own little threads about certain mangas. Having a clusterfuck thread for mangas is such a hard place to have a good conversation for them.
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Most people seem to hate HF route because of Sakura *shrugs*
I don't like JC Staff and they produced Honey and Clover and Nodame Cantabile. Shit's too far back. And even then, Sunrise stuff has generally been one-pattern action stuff, which is fine if that's what you look for but unfortunately it's not, for me. And I make no pretense of not being biased or having fair tastes :p
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i have been watching hell girl as of late, it's an excellent anime. story plot similar to death note except more schoolgirl-ish. excellent stuff.
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On January 05 2013 13:15 zJayy962 wrote:
When can we ever get an anime/manga section so we can all post in our own little threads about certain mangas. Having a clusterfuck thread for mangas is such a hard place to have a good conversation for them.
Well... that's what ANN and animesuki is for :p
It's not an anime site after all.
On January 05 2013 13:24 Southlight wrote:
Most people seem to hate HF route because of Sakura *shrugs*
I don't like JC Staff and they produced Honey and Clover and Nodame Cantabile. Shit's too far back. And even then, Sunrise stuff has generally been one-pattern action stuff, which is fine if that's what you look for but unfortunately it's not, for me. And I make no pretense of not being biased or having fair tastes :p
H&C is one of my fav as well, though not as high on Nodame Cantabile. JC also had Excel Saga and KareKano, IMO most of JC's problem is with action fantasy LN ( (ZnT, SnS, Index, Aria). They just can't help but ruin them AND can't help keep picking them up...
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On January 05 2013 13:15 zJayy962 wrote:
When can we ever get an anime/manga section so we can all post in our own little threads about certain mangas. Having a clusterfuck thread for mangas is such a hard place to have a good conversation for them.
If they made an anime/manga section, it would absolutely murder anime discussion here and transfer 90% of it to IRC. Individual shows don't have enough to talk about to sustain a thread, unless its something like One Piece. Even the Evangelion thread died, despite my attempts at keeping it going.
On January 05 2013 12:53 ragz_gt wrote:Wait... ain't HF route is pretty well regarded here? And I don't know anyone who think F/SN anime is good. Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 12:36 Southlight wrote:On January 05 2013 12:18 generalyao wrote:
Wow really informative. Thanks for the explanation! So I take it that studios have more difficulty adapting visual novels to anime specifically due to its format? So in general they do a better job for mangas, novels (or whatever Bakemonogatari is), etc.? From what I've personally seen and read of other's opinions, I take it that the original source is almost always better than the anime adaptation is the general consensus.
Honestly it's just up to the studio, the staff, and then dumb luck. And of course the quality of the source material (which in most cases is not really 100/100 material, if you get what I mean). For example, I think most people would agree that Jormungand S2 was better than S1 in anime format, and I've noted in this thread that I actually liked the way the anime ended it more than the manga. While you can still tell that the studio sucks ass at gunfight scenes, you didn't feel it as much in the second season because the source material more-or-less moved away from that and actually to character development. So that's a case of the source material tying the hands of a studio that was "alright" but did a decent job. I'd say in general anything novelized is going to be harder to animate, just as it's harder to make a theatrical adaptation of a book. This has nothing to do with Japanese culture or animation or whatever, it's just (IMO) a universal truth in all languages. Manga->Anime usually has an easier time, but I'd also (cynically) remark that manga writing is usually nothing remotely like well-written novels, either, so that's that That's a different topic though, and more about how good illustrators are usually not good writers! Good writers use a lot of tricks and know their medium. Nishio Ishin for instance is simultaneously notorious and reputed for his wordplay and his fascinating dialogue. Well, Shaft's done a decent job of transferring that into anime format, but you're still missing out on the bulk of the dialogue, and thus the bulk of what's made the books popular. Does that mean the anime is bad? Not necessarily, as there's enough "action" and such within all this dialogue to make it an adaptable work. It also helps that the studio was willing to (or forced to, given that they've more-or-less done what they did with SZS in terms of style) take a different approach to animating the series, and it was a hit with fans. I wouldn't be fair if I didn't also mention Gundam Unicorn, which is a set of novels (seven, IIRC), which were animated by a studio I generally disdain (Sunrise) and has turned out to be pretty good, although if you nitpick the plot and events you can tell where stuff has been truncated, stuff doesn't make as much sense, etc. It just is how it is. How can you hate on Sunrise after the stretch they had in late 90s (Gundam 08th MS > Escaflowne > Outlaw Star > Cowboy Bebop > Turn A Gundam), and still cranking out 2-3 quality work every year now.
90s, 80s, 00s, Sunrise is hands down the studio that produces the largest amount good shows. Its easy to excuse a fuck-up every now and again.+ Show Spoiler +(BTW ELEM I WAS SAYING AN OPINION IN CASE YOU THOUGHT I WAS STATING FACT)
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On January 05 2013 13:30 excusemeimretarded wrote:
i have been watching hell girl as of late, it's an excellent anime. story plot similar to death note except more schoolgirl-ish. excellent stuff. Jigoku Shoujo is pretty good, even if I only watched first 2 seasons. Second one was the best but apparently it dips after that. Like a less moe version of Shigofumi. It's pretty good as far as episodic anime go, but there is better imo even if most of them don't go with same grimmer theme.
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honey and clover is so good t.t
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One of the only shows that I've dropped. lel
Thing was so boring and I didn't care about any characters. Doesn't help that the main girl was ugly, looked childish, and didn't interest me in the slightest. I prefer Sakurasou heavily.
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On January 05 2013 14:00 tonight wrote:
honey and clover is so good t.t
Ive had this on my "to watch" list since forever now. Ill make more of an effort to watch this before my semester begins x_O
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On January 05 2013 14:26 Emnjay808 wrote:Ive had this on my "to watch" list since forever now. Ill make more of an effort to watch this before my semester begins x_O
Yeah, it's something I've really been wanting to watch, and I dropped it after the first two episodes when I started it a while back. I know it has rave reviews and I typically really like the genre. The first couple episodes just seemed kind of boring, and I didn't really like the art. I can't really place exactly what, but maybe it has something to do with the fact that it's shoujo. I'm guessing it gets way better after and that I should watch the whole thing?
Also, is there anywhere I can find a really detailed explanation of HF in FSN? Or somehow download the VN? Is it worth playing through it? I'm very interested in what I've read/spoilered myself in regards to HF, and personally I've always preferred Sakura over the other heroines (I might be alone in that opinion though). My only knowledge if what i've seen in the FSN and Fate Zero animes, and some stuff I found that talks about a little bit about what happens in the VN.
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It's definitely worth playing through. All the routes.
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F/SN is the most popular VN ever made. It's definitely worth playing, and very easy to find a download with Google.
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I wouldn't call H+C shoujo, as it ran in a unisex young adult magazine. Her style is what it is, and if you can't stand it no one will fault you for it ;p
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After not really watching much anime for most of the past year (or two?) ish, I marathoned a couple shows while forced to be with relatives over the holidays and didn't have much else to do. The break seemed to have done wonders, as I've quite enjoyed the shows I did watch. Cheers to the thread, and back to lurking for shows to watch.
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On January 05 2013 15:52 atombombforpeace wrote:
After not really watching much anime for most of the past year (or two?) ish, I marathoned a couple shows while forced to be with relatives over the holidays and didn't have much else to do. The break seemed to have done wonders, as I've quite enjoyed the shows I did watch. Cheers to the thread, and back to lurking for shows to watch.
What did you watch? What type of genres interest you the most?
Just out of curiosity.
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EPT
