Anime Discussion Thread - Page 2309

On September 05 2012 05:54 Zergneedsfood wrote:


Well if a character is boring, why should I care? If you say you should just care about the story, then why is the story being told from the angle of a detestable/retarded/boring person?

On September 05 2012 06:06 ragz_gt wrote:

It's like reading true crime books, they are usually told from the angle of a detestable person who surprisingly often are retarded / boring. Doesn't really make the book less fascinating. Also, don't care about character development is not the same as don't care about characters. I like kick arse characters as much as next person, I just prefer them come that way rather than "level up" during the story.

Don't know if you watched ESPN's 30 for 30. Most of them have little or no character development (and a few that focuses on it), they just have awesome characters doing awesome stuff. Or focus on a singular event.

Character development does play a bigger role in anime, due to series cover greater length of time. But I always gravitate to characters that never changes, even when end up crashing and burning, anyway.

On September 05 2012 06:06 ragz_gt wrote:


It's like reading true crime books, they are usually told from the angle of a detestable person who surprisingly often are retarded / boring. Doesn't really make the book less fascinating. Also, don't care about character development is not the same as don't care about characters. I like kick arse characters as much as next person, I just prefer them come that way rather than "level up" during the story.

Don't know if you watched ESPN's 30 for 30. Most of them have little or no character development (and a few that focuses on it), they just have awesome characters doing awesome stuff. Or focus on a singular event.

Character development does play a bigger role in anime, due to series cover greater length of time. But I always gravitate to characters that never changes, even when end up crashing and burning, anyway.

On September 05 2012 06:06 ragz_gt wrote:


It's like reading true crime books, they are usually told from the angle of a detestable person who surprisingly often are retarded / boring. Doesn't really make the book less fascinating. Also, don't care about character development is not the same as don't care about characters. I like kick arse characters as much as next person, I just prefer them come that way rather than "level up" during the story.

Don't know if you watched ESPN's 30 for 30. Most of them have little or no character development (and a few that focuses on it), they just have awesome characters doing awesome stuff. Or focus on a singular event.

Character development does play a bigger role in anime, due to series cover greater length of time. But I always gravitate to characters that never changes, even when end up crashing and burning, anyway.

On September 05 2012 06:06 ragz_gt wrote:


It's like reading true crime books, they are usually told from the angle of a detestable person who surprisingly often are retarded / boring. Doesn't really make the book less fascinating.

Don't know if you watched ESPN's 30 for 30. Most of them have little or no character development (and a few that focuses on it), they just have awesome characters doing awesome stuff. Or focus on a singular event.

Character development does play a bigger role in anime, due to series cover greater length of time. But I always gravitate to characters that never changes, even when end up crashing and burning, anyway.

On September 05 2012 06:43 Maxie wrote:
Just finished watching Dantalian no Shoka. It was... decent. I'm not a fan of when it's basically one story per episode, which there was a bit too much of in this anime. The episodes that actually were connected to each other decently (Flamberge ep + last 2) were fairly good, though. But needs more Flamberge and the wannabe Nanoha dude (that stance + weapon + "cartridge load", if that's not an obvious Nanoha reference i don't know what is...). Also a very unfinished ending, I wouldn't mind a second season as long as they actually connect the episodes to each other more.

I have to admit that I started watching it because it's Inaban/Kanbaru/Celty's VA voicing a loli tsundere which in my mind was an impossibility. I wasn't disappointed there at least. My guilty pleasure these days are loli tsunderes that aren't voiced by Rie, lmfao.

On September 05 2012 06:21 Zergneedsfood wrote:


I don't doubt this happens, but it's not like a TON of anime have a bunch of stunning plots that don't need good characters.

Also, I don't know about other people, but you characterizing development as just "level up" in your post seems to tell me that you watch more shounen shows than a lot of other anime genres.

On September 05 2012 06:25 biology]major wrote:



character development is a kinda everything if you want any form of critical acclaim in story telling whether it be anime, movies or books. Characters that don't change are uninteresting, and unrealistic (can't empathize with them). It is kind of a baseline, characters develop each other and are also developed by the environment. You can give me the coolest most likable character at the start, but if he/she does not change, and they are randomly killed half way within the story I am not going to care in the slightest.

Of course a genre like comedy can break these normal rules because they are not trying to be serious and can parody the idea of character development itself. Maybe it's just how I see it but that is the most critical factor for me to give critical recognition to a work. Of course you can still enjoy a show like SAO for example, literally has no development in any of the characters except for some romance which is just some cheap attention whoring) but it won't ever be "good"(unless it radically changes in the upcoming episodes)

On September 05 2012 07:02 ragz_gt wrote:


Actually I don't watch alot shounen shows at all, mainly because it's how MC gets more powerful overtime.



I don't know... Shawshank Redemption, Forest Gump, don't get much more acclaimed than that, and they are both about stories where MC live through turbulence while changing little themselves, like eyes of the storm kind of way. Or books like Hunt for Red October, or most of the Stephen King novels. The events and characters involved are fascinating, but not alot of growth there.

On September 05 2012 06:52 Shauni wrote:
Inspiring? Succeeding? Rising after a challenge? Why should entertainment only cover that side of the coin? Your whole definition of enjoyment is skewed. Pathetic things can't bring enjoyment to you? Tragedy? What about someone failing to meet up to the expectations? Why would it be wrong to depict that? Why does the media have to cater to your typical "feelgood" scenarios in order to become meaningful?
I kind of agree with Requizen in this aspect, I don't see why media has to portray life in one simplistic way, there is so much variance in life and most of it doesn't even attempt to portray it accurately, instead just relying on simple storytelling mechanisms which was often made in regard to children's perception of reality.

For example, I watched a movie yesterday. It was about a woman laying on her deathbed in cancer, with her two sisters being unable to comfort her or be by her side, not wanting to touch a woman with disease, coping with the situation by sending in their servant in their stead. And the two sisters kept fighting, being unable to understand one another, even after the third sister died.
There were no "likable" characters, no fulfillment or conclusion reached. It was enervating and painful to listen to the regrets of her life and hate toward her deceiving sisters from the cancer ridden woman. It's very absurd to think that the woman should have died gracefully with some sweet last words just to make it more pleasurable for the viewers. It was painful, not enjoyable at all. I enjoyed the movie.

Ultimately, I feel that it's a misconception of the definition of enjoyment (in most of the entertainment industry, not just with anime).
The two main definitions are to me very different:

1. the act or condition of receiving pleasure from something
2. the use or possession of something that is satisfying or beneficial

Enjoyment in media does not have any relation to whether or not you like a character unless you define by (1). Enjoyment can be felt in any spectrum of emotions, even numbness or other lack of emotion. When you typically talk about the definition of enjoyment in media and art, it's vastly different from the (1) definition. The enjoyment lies in the intent of conveying, not simply the "end" emotion by the viewer. The idea of what you view bringing something new and stimulating to your mind, benefiting from the added experience and perception.

Also... in classic storytelling it's important to have characters that you comprehend, empathize with and sometimes even relate to. I understand that. But it's a giant leap from that to your "like" and "hate". Anime is a bit different from most media in this regard, because the viewers typically prefer to relate to the characters in a simple and pleasurable way. It's quite shallow since, as you say, the likable characters are rarely even remotely realistic portrayals of human beings. It's like taking merely a few (from millions) pleasurable traits, reactions, actions, emotions of a person and stuffing it into an anime character, creating something disgusting like Azunyan...

On September 05 2012 07:43 Tabbris wrote:
Hmm I was baiting Sent to tell my why he didnt like eva cause I honestly had no idea and was curious. Didnt mean for a backlash like that it was just a talking point. Ill just end it with this. Sent did you like the Rebuild series? It seems like the major problems you had with eva is addressed in the movies

On September 05 2012 07:32 Sentenal wrote:

So why is it wrong to define 'enjoyment' with the first definition, rather than the 2nd? Why can't it be a mix of both definitions?

On September 05 2012 07:47 Sentenal wrote:

Rebuild is better, IMO. With Rebuild, I'm pretty sure most people who liked the series, thinks Rebuild is worse, and visa versa. Like, I liked Mari, but I can see how someone who liked the Evangelion tv series would see her inclusion as an abomination.

On September 05 2012 07:51 Souma wrote:


Why define enjoyment at all? This argument is almost as bad as elitists bashing other people's preferences. YEAH I'M TALKING TO YOU, TLADT.

Leave my Azu-nyan alone, damn it.

On September 05 2012 07:55 Tabbris wrote:

What? People didnt like Mari? I never heard of this....Are people upset that she doesnt act like she has mommy issues or somthing? I guess someone who really liked the series could argue Shinji turned into a generic shonen character but thats it. Tho he still portrayed more realism then most anime.

On September 05 2012 07:51 Souma wrote:


Why define enjoyment at all? This argument is almost as bad as elitists bashing other people's preferences. YEAH I'M TALKING TO YOU, TLADT.

Leave my Azu-nyan alone, damn it.

On September 05 2012 07:55 Tabbris wrote:

What? People didnt like Mari? I never heard of this....Are people upset that she doesnt act like she has mommy issues or somthing? I guess someone who really liked the series could argue Shinji turned into a generic shonen character but thats it. Tho he still portrayed more realism then most anime.

On September 05 2012 07:58 Souma wrote:


I never understood the argument that Shinji is portrayed as realistic. If you took a kid from my hood and put him in a mecha he'd probably GTA the world.