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On December 09 2012 17:06 Forikorder wrote:Show nested quote +On December 09 2012 17:03 Sentenal wrote:On December 09 2012 16:54 Forikorder wrote:On December 09 2012 16:52 Sentenal wrote:On December 09 2012 16:47 Forikorder wrote:On December 09 2012 16:43 Sentenal wrote:On December 09 2012 16:32 Forikorder wrote:On December 09 2012 16:28 Sentenal wrote:On December 09 2012 16:14 Forikorder wrote:On December 09 2012 16:09 Sentenal wrote:
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There are 3 types of Haki. One is Armament Haki, which was described as "coating your body in an invisible armor", that also allows you to solidify Devil Fruit powers. The other is Observation, then there is Conquerors. None of those are even remotely similar to air jumping. And it is reliant on physical strength. Nami after the timeskip is strong enough to parry blows from Fishmen, who are on average 10x stronger than your average human being. Please stop posting this stuff. You are just embarrassing yourself. You clearly don't even know what Haki is (likely becaue you can't read), so you should stop making theories saying that other things (that you understand even less about) are Haki. if someone eats the air air fruit if you use Haki you can punch them in the face so why cant you punch normal air in the face? Haki lets you hit thing you normally cant hit so you hit the air and use it as a surface to jump from also i think your confusing parrying with blocking with parrying you use small amounts of force to change the direction fo your opponents attack so you can either dodge it or itll miss completely parrying doesnt require super human strength which Nami has never shown (in fact Sanji constantly complains about how weak Namis body is during his joyride) Haki armament Haki has the ability to SOLIDIFY DEVIL FRUITS. That's and being an invisible shield is all Armament Haki is stated to do. What is so hard to understand about that? It isn't stated to "let you hit things you normally can't", that is BS fan theory on your part. Stop making up things just because you know you are wrong, and need straws to grasp. Also, you have no idea what parrying is, and Sanji complains because Nami's body is weaker than his, because it is. its never stated that it only has the ability to jsut soldify devil fruits and yes Namis body is much weaker then Sanjis thats the whole point and your the one who doesnt know what parrying is http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/parry?s=t Here are the ONLY THINGS Armament Haki has ever been stated to do: 1.) Invisible armor, useful for hitting things because hard things hurt 2.) Solidify Devil Fruits + Show Spoiler [Proof] +Everything else you say it can do is fan theory bullshit. Because it has never been stated to be a steroid or "lets you hit anything you couldn't hit before" or any other such nonsense. And you don't know what parrying is because you think that you don't require any strength in order to do it. Maybe you should go find some athlete, give them a bat, and tell them to swing it full force at you. And then you just need to use a small force to parry it away, don't worry you will be fine, you don't have to be strong to do that. you linked the image youself, its force there bodies into solidity not negate there DF he never said it only works on logias and no you dont ahve to be strong but you have to be able to actually tell the bats coming, have good enough reflexs to react in time and be skilled enough to parry the bat all of which Nami has shown He said it works on Devil Fruits. He didn't say it works on anything else. You saying it could is fan fiction. Unless you have proof of Releigh, or another similar character, saying it works on other things, you have no proof and are making fan theory bullshit. You are also incredibly ignorant about parrying and the strength required. Clearly you have never played any sport before. Like I said, go try it. Go find the strongest person you know, and tell them to do it. it was never said it doesnt of Rokoshiki isnt Haki then how do they jump in the air without some sort of supernatural assistance? See, you have no arguement. Unless you have proof of Releigh, or another similar character, saying it works on other things, you have no proof and are making fan theory bullshit. They jump in the air by kicking really hard to generate lift. Birds do it by flapping their wings. Its the same principle, only magnified by a ton. Rokushiki users use their feet because they have super human strength, thus allowing them do get a similar affect. then how come Namis body could use the technique? are you saying shes a super human too?
1.) Nami is stronger
2.) Nami/Sanji was underwater when he did it. Have you ever been in water before?
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On December 09 2012 17:09 -JoKeR- wrote:
Nami is super human that was why Sanji was able to preform geppou with her body. She has been getting stronger over the entire course of the manga it would be incredibly terrible if she was not super human at this point in the story,
shes a superhuman not with strength but with her knowledge that elts her use the sky rod thing that makes weather
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On December 09 2012 17:12 Forikorder wrote:Show nested quote +On December 09 2012 17:09 -JoKeR- wrote:
Nami is super human that was why Sanji was able to preform geppou with her body. She has been getting stronger over the entire course of the manga it would be incredibly terrible if she was not super human at this point in the story, shes a superhuman not with strength but with her knowledge that elts her use the sky rod thing that makes weather
LOLLOLOLOL. SO nami has superhuman knowledge now? What the hell. Are you just making anything up just to make something up? How does her "sky rod thing that makes weather" relate to the whole haki argument that you have been waging.
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On December 09 2012 17:15 iSometric wrote:Show nested quote +On December 09 2012 17:12 Forikorder wrote:On December 09 2012 17:09 -JoKeR- wrote:
Nami is super human that was why Sanji was able to preform geppou with her body. She has been getting stronger over the entire course of the manga it would be incredibly terrible if she was not super human at this point in the story, shes a superhuman not with strength but with her knowledge that elts her use the sky rod thing that makes weather LOLLOLOLOL. SO nami has superhuman knowledge now? What the hell. Are you just making anything up just to make something up? How does her "sky rod thing that makes weather" relate to the whole haki argument that you have been waging.
its science
nami has been shown pretty mcuh since she was introduced that shes the best navigator shown
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Forikorder, are you religious?
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On December 09 2012 16:42 Forikorder wrote:Show nested quote +On December 09 2012 16:40 Zooper31 wrote:On December 09 2012 16:36 Forikorder wrote:On December 09 2012 16:34 Zooper31 wrote:On December 09 2012 16:27 Forikorder wrote:On December 09 2012 16:23 Zooper31 wrote:On December 09 2012 15:58 Forikorder wrote:On December 09 2012 15:50 b3n3tt3 wrote:On December 09 2012 14:39 Forikorder wrote:if rokoshiki is all about super strength and not Haki then how come Sanji could still use the flying ability while in namis physical weak body? http://www.mangareader.net/one-piece/672/13 We don't know yet the full mechanics of rokushiki's air jumping. Unlike other rokushiki moves I think it takes more from technique than raw strength. Like how everyone is capable of using simple haki but not everyone has the time and tenacity to know the feel on how to perform it. it probably works on the same principle that lets haki users hit Logia users instead of hitting a logia there hitting the air and using it as a platform to jump at any rate since Namis body can use it the technique is definently not reliant on physical strength and definently Haki It is not haki, end of story. Theres been more than enough evidence to suggest it is something different than haki. Why are you so gun ho on it being something it's not? You're Sanji & Nami example still doesn't work. If you put a black belt karate master in a little kids body, he's still gonna know all the moves, he's just not gonna have the body that is capable and durable enough to perform everything to perfection. Yes he can do some stuff but thats not to say that his little child body is going to not be worn to shreds and exhaused afterwards because it's not used to it. Sanji is even saying like you said she has a weak body, meaning he doesn't want to hurt her body doing the same kind of moves his normal body is durable enough to do. If I remember correctly when he does do some moves in her body, hes super exhausted and when they switch back Nami complains about feeling weak and sore. exactly Namis body is physical incapable of performing the sort of super human strength that jumping on air with pure leg strength needs, shes as strong as a normal person who does alot of physical acitivty she cant punch through concrete her kicks dont send people flying since tis impossible for her to have used the rokoshiki tech with pure leg strength then the only answer is that the technique is pretty much purely technical and pretty mcuh anyone could use it for short bursts at least assuming they know haki I agree with everything you said except the part about it being haki. It's a different type of tehcnique that is not haki, why do you insist it is when there is 0 evidence saying so, it even goes by a different name and is explained differently. Until it's explained that it is a haki, it is not and anything saying otherwise is just specualation and fan fiction. so its not Haki it jsut works exactly like Haki It is not exactly like haki but it is similiar, is that so hard to understand? Seriously. Is it not possible for 2 techniques to be similiar but not the same? Haki is a very general principle and can take many different forms, Rokoshiki is one of those forms Show nested quote +Rayleigh stated that haki let's you nullify the logia and thus enables the user to "touch" the real body of the fruit user. It doesn't let you hit the air/light/electricity but instead, transform back the person to the normal flesh and blood state no Rayleigh explained that Haki can force there bodies into solidity http://www.mangareader.net/103-56928-14/one-piece/chapter-597.htmlso the rokoshiki technique is jsut forcing air into solodity long enough to jump off it
You are so talking out of your ass I truly believe you are just saying it for the sake of the arguement. I'm done argueing about this, you are gonna believe w/e theory you have no matter what lack of evidence you have or how much everyone disagrees with you.
It is not Haki stop saying it is.
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On December 09 2012 17:17 Forikorder wrote:Show nested quote +On December 09 2012 17:15 iSometric wrote:On December 09 2012 17:12 Forikorder wrote:On December 09 2012 17:09 -JoKeR- wrote:
Nami is super human that was why Sanji was able to preform geppou with her body. She has been getting stronger over the entire course of the manga it would be incredibly terrible if she was not super human at this point in the story, shes a superhuman not with strength but with her knowledge that elts her use the sky rod thing that makes weather LOLLOLOLOL. SO nami has superhuman knowledge now? What the hell. Are you just making anything up just to make something up? How does her "sky rod thing that makes weather" relate to the whole haki argument that you have been waging. its science nami has been shown pretty mcuh since she was introduced that shes the best navigator shown
Is being the navigator a type of haki? How does your response respond to anything reasonable. What are you smoking.
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On December 09 2012 17:30 iSometric wrote:Show nested quote +On December 09 2012 17:17 Forikorder wrote:On December 09 2012 17:15 iSometric wrote:On December 09 2012 17:12 Forikorder wrote:On December 09 2012 17:09 -JoKeR- wrote:
Nami is super human that was why Sanji was able to preform geppou with her body. She has been getting stronger over the entire course of the manga it would be incredibly terrible if she was not super human at this point in the story, shes a superhuman not with strength but with her knowledge that elts her use the sky rod thing that makes weather LOLLOLOLOL. SO nami has superhuman knowledge now? What the hell. Are you just making anything up just to make something up? How does her "sky rod thing that makes weather" relate to the whole haki argument that you have been waging. its science nami has been shown pretty mcuh since she was introduced that shes the best navigator shown Is being the navigator a type of haki? How does your response respond to anything reasonable. What are you smoking.
no he was talking about namis weather abilities which was science created in weatheria that Nami can use because of her vast knowledge about weather
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Well in all honesty some of the points Forik makes seem a quite reasonable explanation. The reason why I dont think its haki is simply because it wouldve been named as such. And more importantly : Oda probably just wanted characters with the ability of being superstrong, but might not have thought out the entire haki thing yet, or atleast didnt want to give these characters haki abilities. You have to see the manga in its timeframe aswell : as far as I remember Haki back then wasent such a big deal yet, and it seems totally reasonable that there are strong characters with wacky abilities out there that are not based on haki. It makes One Piece all the more fun : it just means more possibilities.
But yeah, forik : while your statements COULD fit into the story, there is no real way to prove / disprove it. However, I cant disprove god either. That doesnt mean there is some guy with a beard or what have you floating in the air.
A theory needs to be falsifiable or in other words we need to be able to disprove it. What you are giving us is material that cant really be disproven, but that is exactly what makes it weak and not worth discussing. Unless Oda makes a statement about this, no real progress can be made, and we shouldnt assume what you say is correct.
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nami is pretty much stronger than any normal human being, sure not as strong as sanji, zorro, etc.
but nonetheless she isn't a normal human anymore so if she knew how she could definitely perform rokishiki
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On December 09 2012 18:37 []Phase[] wrote:
But yeah, forik : while your statements COULD fit into the story, there is no real way to prove / disprove it. However, I cant disprove god either. That doesnt mean there is some guy with a beard or what have you floating in the air.
A theory needs to be falsifiable or in other words we need to be able to disprove it. What you are giving us is material that cant really be disproven, but that is exactly what makes it weak and not worth discussing. Unless Oda makes a statement about this, no real progress can be made, and we shouldnt assume what you say is correct.
But that also applies to the other side. While you can argue that the airsteps are not due to the use of Haki, there is no proof to it. And saying that there isnt any proof for it being due to Haki usage, does not proof that it is not. It just means we dont know.
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Fork, bodies are naturally solid.
Air, despite what you may believe, is not naturally solid.
Haki simply reverts devil fruit users to their normal solid body state. It cannot make something that is not supposed to be solid, such as air, solid.
On December 09 2012 19:13 seve wrote:Show nested quote +On December 09 2012 18:37 []Phase[] wrote:
But yeah, forik : while your statements COULD fit into the story, there is no real way to prove / disprove it. However, I cant disprove god either. That doesnt mean there is some guy with a beard or what have you floating in the air.
A theory needs to be falsifiable or in other words we need to be able to disprove it. What you are giving us is material that cant really be disproven, but that is exactly what makes it weak and not worth discussing. Unless Oda makes a statement about this, no real progress can be made, and we shouldnt assume what you say is correct. But that also applies to the other side. While you can argue that the airsteps are not due to the use of Haki, there is no proof to it. And saying that there isnt any proof for it being due to Haki usage, does not proof that it is not. It just means we dont know.
Haki was explained. You really have no reason to say "you can't prove us wrong", when it was already explained and it's explanation proves you wrong. We have no reason at all to believe haki has any more usages than what we were told, and we weren't told it can do what you claim it can.
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EDIT : nvm, just sticking to talking about how cool OP and its characters are from now on.
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Guys, seriously, just ignore any post about Forikorder. His main objective on TL is troll on manga topics, just check his posts on every manga thread.
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I honestly can't tell if he's being serious or if he's just really, really good at acting like he's 12
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On December 09 2012 18:37 []Phase[] wrote:
Well in all honesty some of the points Forik makes seem a quite reasonable explanation. The reason why I dont think its haki is simply because it wouldve been named as such. And more importantly : Oda probably just wanted characters with the ability of being superstrong, but might not have thought out the entire haki thing yet, or atleast didnt want to give these characters haki abilities. You have to see the manga in its timeframe aswell : as far as I remember Haki back then wasent such a big deal yet, and it seems totally reasonable that there are strong characters with wacky abilities out there that are not based on haki. It makes One Piece all the more fun : it just means more possibilities.
I think you´re implying Oda didn´t plan Haki in advance, i.e. he may retcon things to fit.
Gotta disagree, because he actually foreshadows plot way before it happens.
"Mantra" a.k.a. observation haki was introduced in skypiea. Water7 and the introduction of CP9 and rokushiki was after that.
Even Conqueror's haki was introduced after the CP9 fight, with Shanks + Show Spoiler +http://www.mangareader.net/103-2541-5/one-piece/chapter-434.html
tl;dr
I trust in Oda completely. Instead if disappoint with retconning, he amazed me with good planning ahead.
On December 09 2012 22:20 ZERG_RUSSIAN wrote:
I honestly can't tell if he's being serious or if he's just really, really good at acting like he's 12
I wish he was a troll. He is either incredibly dedicated to his act, which would be kinda impressive, or he isn´t pretending at all.
And everyone, please, please, please stop making the thread unbearable by replying to this insanity.
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I'm really curious about two things at this point in the story:
1) How are they going to escape this poison
2) is the cute little dragon/kid going to be permanently stuck... ;( <-- the whole artifial devil fruit thing is very interesting....
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Why are you still arguing with this guy lol. Just ignore him, he's just a bad troll.
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On December 09 2012 23:24 Mataza wrote:Show nested quote +On December 09 2012 18:37 []Phase[] wrote:
Well in all honesty some of the points Forik makes seem a quite reasonable explanation. The reason why I dont think its haki is simply because it wouldve been named as such. And more importantly : Oda probably just wanted characters with the ability of being superstrong, but might not have thought out the entire haki thing yet, or atleast didnt want to give these characters haki abilities. You have to see the manga in its timeframe aswell : as far as I remember Haki back then wasent such a big deal yet, and it seems totally reasonable that there are strong characters with wacky abilities out there that are not based on haki. It makes One Piece all the more fun : it just means more possibilities.
I think you´re implying Oda didn´t plan Haki in advance, i.e. he may retcon things to fit. Gotta disagree, because he actually foreshadows plot way before it happens. "Mantra" a.k.a. observation haki was introduced in skypiea. Water7 and the introduction of CP9 and rokushiki was after that. Even Conqueror's haki was introduced after the CP9 fight, with Shanks + Show Spoiler +http://www.mangareader.net/103-2541-5/one-piece/chapter-434.html tl;dr I trust in Oda completely. Instead if disappoint with retconning, he amazed me with good planning ahead. Show nested quote +On December 09 2012 22:20 ZERG_RUSSIAN wrote:
I honestly can't tell if he's being serious or if he's just really, really good at acting like he's 12 I wish he was a troll. He is either incredibly dedicated to his act, which would be kinda impressive, or he isn´t pretending at all. And everyone, please, please, please stop making the thread unbearable by replying to this insanity.
Conqurerer's Haki was introduced in the very first chapter when shanks stopped a sea king with it.
http://www.mangareader.net/103-2039-44/one-piece/chapter-1.html
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EPT![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/F9wCp.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/XOqyx.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/qtpGQ.jpg)
