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All book discussion in this thread is now allowed. |
On May 01 2012 04:08 scudst0rm wrote:Show nested quote +On May 01 2012 03:40 Incognoto wrote:+ Show Spoiler +Disclaimer: These aren't spoilers. I haven't read the books. I don't know what's going to happen. This is pure speculation on my part. I'm posting as of when I've seen the 5th episode of the second season. !!!!!!
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So I was watching the last episode a second time (I find I always need to watch twice to get a good grasp at what's going on) and I did a small recap of the situation. So we have Renly dead and all the Baratheons who are under Stannis's flag. I'm pretty sure the Stark/Baratheon alliance is going to go to hell, especially since there are rumors of Cat being the assassin (or at least having taken part in it).
So every house is basically for itself now. Greyjoys vs Stark, Stark vs Lannister, Baratheon vs Lannister, etc. There are pretty much no alliances. And every house wants the throne, EXCEPT for Robb Stark. He just wants Joffrey's head. So basically the 7 kingdoms is one hell of a war.
On top of that, we have Daenerys Targaryen, who also wants the throne. I think the really interesting part of this episode was when Jorah told her that her allies weren't at Qarth (I hope she leaves Qarth soon btw because that city gives me the creeps) but in Westorros. Except that Daeny is the only Targaryen alive... who the hell is going to support her? Who are her allies? Yeah she's got the dragons but they're still little and shit. The other interesting point is that Daenerys would make a good queen. When she was a Khaleesi, she was loved by the people and she was a good khaleesi. A kind one. She's probably the best monarch the Iron Throne could get, better than Stannis, Joffrey or whoever else wants it. She'd be good to her people, she isn't the Mad King. She's also honorable, which seems to be a rare quality.
In that regard, it almost seems that Daenerys and Robb Stark are natural allies. Robb doesn't want the Throne, Daeny does. Robb needs support because he's alone against 3 different houses, Daeny needs an ally in Westorros. The Starks are the ones who are going to "suffer" the most when Winter comes, what with White Walkers and their wights. What kills the latter? Fire. What breathes fire? Dragons, that's what. Both are honorable, both are loved by their people. Both are leaders. An alliance almost seems perfect between them, even if Stark and Targaryen have been at each other in the past. Not only that, the Starks are the only faction who doesn't want to rule on the Iron Throne (besides perhaps Greyjoy), hence the only reasonable ally to be had for Daeny.
I don't have much to say about Snow. His story line is really interesting but I can't think of horse shit of stuff that'll happen. I'm pretty sure that the wildlings and the WW aren't allies. I'm pretty sure that the WW are the ones making the wildlings march south. But that's all.
I really love Arya's situation, it's really interesting. Especially with Gendry mixed up there (by the way people, don't forget that Gendry has a claim to the throne). What I find harder to believe is that someone as smart as Tywin (the opposition of epicness between Tywin and Arya is really excellent btw) didn't put two and two together about Arya.
So Stark's last girl completely disappears, no one can find her, no one knows where she is. The Lannisters are looking for her though. Tywin is aware that Arya hasn't been captured. All of a sudden, a northern girl is found in a convoy which left FROM King's Landing (ie where Arya was last known to be). Fancy THAT. Doesn't he realize he's got Arya? That said, he probably isn't even thinking about her at all, considering he's waging a war and not doing politics. The other thing I'm surprised that Tywin didn't figure out was who Gendry was. Oh, right, blacksmith's apprentices are SO common, are they? They go looking for one, they find the convey where he was, they think he's dead. But apparently another blacksmith was also traveling with them.
My analysis is that the Lannisters at King's Landing aren't telling Tywin all the details of their failings. ;/
But yeah enough for now, I've got myself my own Wall [of text] here. I don't know how likely an alliance between Robb and Dany would be. the Starks got just as bad of a rap as the Baratheons from Viserys. Although Dany knows Viserys was full of shit most of the time I think she still holds that animosity. Then there's Ser Jorah, who usually dispels most of Viserys' BS, but in this case he also has a grudge against the Starks because Ned was the one who exiled him.
The other thing to keep in mind is that Dany wants to rule over the entirety of the 7 kingdoms. It could be that she wouldn't be down with Robb having a 'King of the North' title.
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On May 01 2012 04:22 sjh wrote:Show nested quote +On May 01 2012 04:08 scudst0rm wrote:On May 01 2012 03:40 Incognoto wrote:+ Show Spoiler +Disclaimer: These aren't spoilers. I haven't read the books. I don't know what's going to happen. This is pure speculation on my part. I'm posting as of when I've seen the 5th episode of the second season. !!!!!!
-------------------------------------------------------------
So I was watching the last episode a second time (I find I always need to watch twice to get a good grasp at what's going on) and I did a small recap of the situation. So we have Renly dead and all the Baratheons who are under Stannis's flag. I'm pretty sure the Stark/Baratheon alliance is going to go to hell, especially since there are rumors of Cat being the assassin (or at least having taken part in it).
So every house is basically for itself now. Greyjoys vs Stark, Stark vs Lannister, Baratheon vs Lannister, etc. There are pretty much no alliances. And every house wants the throne, EXCEPT for Robb Stark. He just wants Joffrey's head. So basically the 7 kingdoms is one hell of a war.
On top of that, we have Daenerys Targaryen, who also wants the throne. I think the really interesting part of this episode was when Jorah told her that her allies weren't at Qarth (I hope she leaves Qarth soon btw because that city gives me the creeps) but in Westorros. Except that Daeny is the only Targaryen alive... who the hell is going to support her? Who are her allies? Yeah she's got the dragons but they're still little and shit. The other interesting point is that Daenerys would make a good queen. When she was a Khaleesi, she was loved by the people and she was a good khaleesi. A kind one. She's probably the best monarch the Iron Throne could get, better than Stannis, Joffrey or whoever else wants it. She'd be good to her people, she isn't the Mad King. She's also honorable, which seems to be a rare quality.
In that regard, it almost seems that Daenerys and Robb Stark are natural allies. Robb doesn't want the Throne, Daeny does. Robb needs support because he's alone against 3 different houses, Daeny needs an ally in Westorros. The Starks are the ones who are going to "suffer" the most when Winter comes, what with White Walkers and their wights. What kills the latter? Fire. What breathes fire? Dragons, that's what. Both are honorable, both are loved by their people. Both are leaders. An alliance almost seems perfect between them, even if Stark and Targaryen have been at each other in the past. Not only that, the Starks are the only faction who doesn't want to rule on the Iron Throne (besides perhaps Greyjoy), hence the only reasonable ally to be had for Daeny.
I don't have much to say about Snow. His story line is really interesting but I can't think of horse shit of stuff that'll happen. I'm pretty sure that the wildlings and the WW aren't allies. I'm pretty sure that the WW are the ones making the wildlings march south. But that's all.
I really love Arya's situation, it's really interesting. Especially with Gendry mixed up there (by the way people, don't forget that Gendry has a claim to the throne). What I find harder to believe is that someone as smart as Tywin (the opposition of epicness between Tywin and Arya is really excellent btw) didn't put two and two together about Arya.
So Stark's last girl completely disappears, no one can find her, no one knows where she is. The Lannisters are looking for her though. Tywin is aware that Arya hasn't been captured. All of a sudden, a northern girl is found in a convoy which left FROM King's Landing (ie where Arya was last known to be). Fancy THAT. Doesn't he realize he's got Arya? That said, he probably isn't even thinking about her at all, considering he's waging a war and not doing politics. The other thing I'm surprised that Tywin didn't figure out was who Gendry was. Oh, right, blacksmith's apprentices are SO common, are they? They go looking for one, they find the convey where he was, they think he's dead. But apparently another blacksmith was also traveling with them.
My analysis is that the Lannisters at King's Landing aren't telling Tywin all the details of their failings. ;/
But yeah enough for now, I've got myself my own Wall [of text] here. I don't know how likely an alliance between Robb and Dany would be. the Starks got just as bad of a rap as the Baratheons from Viserys. Although Dany knows Viserys was full of shit most of the time I think she still holds that animosity. Then there's Ser Jorah, who usually dispels most of Viserys' BS, but in this case he also has a grudge against the Starks because Ned was the one who exiled him. The other thing to keep in mind is that Dany wants to rule over the entirety of the 7 kingdoms. It could be that she wouldn't be down with Robb having a 'King of the North' title.
True, but the whole pretense for the Greatjon's king in the north speech was "It was the dragons we bowed to, and now all the dragons are dead." I don't think Robb really wants to be King, he was pressured in to it by his bannermen. He couldn't back down on it for the sake of a Baratheon alliance or else he would lose his bannermen's respect, but I feel like bowing down to the dragons (again) would be more understandable.
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On May 01 2012 04:22 sjh wrote:Show nested quote +On May 01 2012 04:08 scudst0rm wrote:On May 01 2012 03:40 Incognoto wrote:+ Show Spoiler +Disclaimer: These aren't spoilers. I haven't read the books. I don't know what's going to happen. This is pure speculation on my part. I'm posting as of when I've seen the 5th episode of the second season. !!!!!!
-------------------------------------------------------------
So I was watching the last episode a second time (I find I always need to watch twice to get a good grasp at what's going on) and I did a small recap of the situation. So we have Renly dead and all the Baratheons who are under Stannis's flag. I'm pretty sure the Stark/Baratheon alliance is going to go to hell, especially since there are rumors of Cat being the assassin (or at least having taken part in it).
So every house is basically for itself now. Greyjoys vs Stark, Stark vs Lannister, Baratheon vs Lannister, etc. There are pretty much no alliances. And every house wants the throne, EXCEPT for Robb Stark. He just wants Joffrey's head. So basically the 7 kingdoms is one hell of a war.
On top of that, we have Daenerys Targaryen, who also wants the throne. I think the really interesting part of this episode was when Jorah told her that her allies weren't at Qarth (I hope she leaves Qarth soon btw because that city gives me the creeps) but in Westorros. Except that Daeny is the only Targaryen alive... who the hell is going to support her? Who are her allies? Yeah she's got the dragons but they're still little and shit. The other interesting point is that Daenerys would make a good queen. When she was a Khaleesi, she was loved by the people and she was a good khaleesi. A kind one. She's probably the best monarch the Iron Throne could get, better than Stannis, Joffrey or whoever else wants it. She'd be good to her people, she isn't the Mad King. She's also honorable, which seems to be a rare quality.
In that regard, it almost seems that Daenerys and Robb Stark are natural allies. Robb doesn't want the Throne, Daeny does. Robb needs support because he's alone against 3 different houses, Daeny needs an ally in Westorros. The Starks are the ones who are going to "suffer" the most when Winter comes, what with White Walkers and their wights. What kills the latter? Fire. What breathes fire? Dragons, that's what. Both are honorable, both are loved by their people. Both are leaders. An alliance almost seems perfect between them, even if Stark and Targaryen have been at each other in the past. Not only that, the Starks are the only faction who doesn't want to rule on the Iron Throne (besides perhaps Greyjoy), hence the only reasonable ally to be had for Daeny.
I don't have much to say about Snow. His story line is really interesting but I can't think of horse shit of stuff that'll happen. I'm pretty sure that the wildlings and the WW aren't allies. I'm pretty sure that the WW are the ones making the wildlings march south. But that's all.
I really love Arya's situation, it's really interesting. Especially with Gendry mixed up there (by the way people, don't forget that Gendry has a claim to the throne). What I find harder to believe is that someone as smart as Tywin (the opposition of epicness between Tywin and Arya is really excellent btw) didn't put two and two together about Arya.
So Stark's last girl completely disappears, no one can find her, no one knows where she is. The Lannisters are looking for her though. Tywin is aware that Arya hasn't been captured. All of a sudden, a northern girl is found in a convoy which left FROM King's Landing (ie where Arya was last known to be). Fancy THAT. Doesn't he realize he's got Arya? That said, he probably isn't even thinking about her at all, considering he's waging a war and not doing politics. The other thing I'm surprised that Tywin didn't figure out was who Gendry was. Oh, right, blacksmith's apprentices are SO common, are they? They go looking for one, they find the convey where he was, they think he's dead. But apparently another blacksmith was also traveling with them.
My analysis is that the Lannisters at King's Landing aren't telling Tywin all the details of their failings. ;/
But yeah enough for now, I've got myself my own Wall [of text] here. I don't know how likely an alliance between Robb and Dany would be. the Starks got just as bad of a rap as the Baratheons from Viserys. Although Dany knows Viserys was full of shit most of the time I think she still holds that animosity. Then there's Ser Jorah, who usually dispels most of Viserys' BS, but in this case he also has a grudge against the Starks because Ned was the one who exiled him. The other thing to keep in mind is that Dany wants to rule over the entirety of the 7 kingdoms. It could be that she wouldn't be down with Robb having a 'King of the North' title.
Pretty dumb question, but what are the 7 kingdoms?
1. the north (the entire northern region)
2. casterly rock
3. stormlands
4. the reach (or w/e land the Tyrell's control)
5. the vale
6. dorne? (Who even holds the Dorne and I guess they remain nuetral within all this conflict?)
7. riverlands?
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On May 01 2012 04:31 sung_moon wrote:Show nested quote +On May 01 2012 04:22 sjh wrote:On May 01 2012 04:08 scudst0rm wrote:On May 01 2012 03:40 Incognoto wrote:+ Show Spoiler +Disclaimer: These aren't spoilers. I haven't read the books. I don't know what's going to happen. This is pure speculation on my part. I'm posting as of when I've seen the 5th episode of the second season. !!!!!!
-------------------------------------------------------------
So I was watching the last episode a second time (I find I always need to watch twice to get a good grasp at what's going on) and I did a small recap of the situation. So we have Renly dead and all the Baratheons who are under Stannis's flag. I'm pretty sure the Stark/Baratheon alliance is going to go to hell, especially since there are rumors of Cat being the assassin (or at least having taken part in it).
So every house is basically for itself now. Greyjoys vs Stark, Stark vs Lannister, Baratheon vs Lannister, etc. There are pretty much no alliances. And every house wants the throne, EXCEPT for Robb Stark. He just wants Joffrey's head. So basically the 7 kingdoms is one hell of a war.
On top of that, we have Daenerys Targaryen, who also wants the throne. I think the really interesting part of this episode was when Jorah told her that her allies weren't at Qarth (I hope she leaves Qarth soon btw because that city gives me the creeps) but in Westorros. Except that Daeny is the only Targaryen alive... who the hell is going to support her? Who are her allies? Yeah she's got the dragons but they're still little and shit. The other interesting point is that Daenerys would make a good queen. When she was a Khaleesi, she was loved by the people and she was a good khaleesi. A kind one. She's probably the best monarch the Iron Throne could get, better than Stannis, Joffrey or whoever else wants it. She'd be good to her people, she isn't the Mad King. She's also honorable, which seems to be a rare quality.
In that regard, it almost seems that Daenerys and Robb Stark are natural allies. Robb doesn't want the Throne, Daeny does. Robb needs support because he's alone against 3 different houses, Daeny needs an ally in Westorros. The Starks are the ones who are going to "suffer" the most when Winter comes, what with White Walkers and their wights. What kills the latter? Fire. What breathes fire? Dragons, that's what. Both are honorable, both are loved by their people. Both are leaders. An alliance almost seems perfect between them, even if Stark and Targaryen have been at each other in the past. Not only that, the Starks are the only faction who doesn't want to rule on the Iron Throne (besides perhaps Greyjoy), hence the only reasonable ally to be had for Daeny.
I don't have much to say about Snow. His story line is really interesting but I can't think of horse shit of stuff that'll happen. I'm pretty sure that the wildlings and the WW aren't allies. I'm pretty sure that the WW are the ones making the wildlings march south. But that's all.
I really love Arya's situation, it's really interesting. Especially with Gendry mixed up there (by the way people, don't forget that Gendry has a claim to the throne). What I find harder to believe is that someone as smart as Tywin (the opposition of epicness between Tywin and Arya is really excellent btw) didn't put two and two together about Arya.
So Stark's last girl completely disappears, no one can find her, no one knows where she is. The Lannisters are looking for her though. Tywin is aware that Arya hasn't been captured. All of a sudden, a northern girl is found in a convoy which left FROM King's Landing (ie where Arya was last known to be). Fancy THAT. Doesn't he realize he's got Arya? That said, he probably isn't even thinking about her at all, considering he's waging a war and not doing politics. The other thing I'm surprised that Tywin didn't figure out was who Gendry was. Oh, right, blacksmith's apprentices are SO common, are they? They go looking for one, they find the convey where he was, they think he's dead. But apparently another blacksmith was also traveling with them.
My analysis is that the Lannisters at King's Landing aren't telling Tywin all the details of their failings. ;/
But yeah enough for now, I've got myself my own Wall [of text] here. I don't know how likely an alliance between Robb and Dany would be. the Starks got just as bad of a rap as the Baratheons from Viserys. Although Dany knows Viserys was full of shit most of the time I think she still holds that animosity. Then there's Ser Jorah, who usually dispels most of Viserys' BS, but in this case he also has a grudge against the Starks because Ned was the one who exiled him. The other thing to keep in mind is that Dany wants to rule over the entirety of the 7 kingdoms. It could be that she wouldn't be down with Robb having a 'King of the North' title. Pretty dumb question, but what are the 7 kingdoms? 1. the north (the entire northern region) 2. casterly rock 3. stormlands 4. the reach (or w/e land the Tyrell's control) 5. the vale 6. dorne? (Who even holds the Dorne and I guess they remain nuetral within all this conflict?) 7. riverlands?
They said that the Martells rule in Dorne, and Tyrion is sending Myrcella there in hope to secure an alliance with them.
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On May 01 2012 04:29 scudst0rm wrote:Show nested quote +On May 01 2012 04:22 sjh wrote:On May 01 2012 04:08 scudst0rm wrote:On May 01 2012 03:40 Incognoto wrote:+ Show Spoiler +Disclaimer: These aren't spoilers. I haven't read the books. I don't know what's going to happen. This is pure speculation on my part. I'm posting as of when I've seen the 5th episode of the second season. !!!!!!
-------------------------------------------------------------
So I was watching the last episode a second time (I find I always need to watch twice to get a good grasp at what's going on) and I did a small recap of the situation. So we have Renly dead and all the Baratheons who are under Stannis's flag. I'm pretty sure the Stark/Baratheon alliance is going to go to hell, especially since there are rumors of Cat being the assassin (or at least having taken part in it).
So every house is basically for itself now. Greyjoys vs Stark, Stark vs Lannister, Baratheon vs Lannister, etc. There are pretty much no alliances. And every house wants the throne, EXCEPT for Robb Stark. He just wants Joffrey's head. So basically the 7 kingdoms is one hell of a war.
On top of that, we have Daenerys Targaryen, who also wants the throne. I think the really interesting part of this episode was when Jorah told her that her allies weren't at Qarth (I hope she leaves Qarth soon btw because that city gives me the creeps) but in Westorros. Except that Daeny is the only Targaryen alive... who the hell is going to support her? Who are her allies? Yeah she's got the dragons but they're still little and shit. The other interesting point is that Daenerys would make a good queen. When she was a Khaleesi, she was loved by the people and she was a good khaleesi. A kind one. She's probably the best monarch the Iron Throne could get, better than Stannis, Joffrey or whoever else wants it. She'd be good to her people, she isn't the Mad King. She's also honorable, which seems to be a rare quality.
In that regard, it almost seems that Daenerys and Robb Stark are natural allies. Robb doesn't want the Throne, Daeny does. Robb needs support because he's alone against 3 different houses, Daeny needs an ally in Westorros. The Starks are the ones who are going to "suffer" the most when Winter comes, what with White Walkers and their wights. What kills the latter? Fire. What breathes fire? Dragons, that's what. Both are honorable, both are loved by their people. Both are leaders. An alliance almost seems perfect between them, even if Stark and Targaryen have been at each other in the past. Not only that, the Starks are the only faction who doesn't want to rule on the Iron Throne (besides perhaps Greyjoy), hence the only reasonable ally to be had for Daeny.
I don't have much to say about Snow. His story line is really interesting but I can't think of horse shit of stuff that'll happen. I'm pretty sure that the wildlings and the WW aren't allies. I'm pretty sure that the WW are the ones making the wildlings march south. But that's all.
I really love Arya's situation, it's really interesting. Especially with Gendry mixed up there (by the way people, don't forget that Gendry has a claim to the throne). What I find harder to believe is that someone as smart as Tywin (the opposition of epicness between Tywin and Arya is really excellent btw) didn't put two and two together about Arya.
So Stark's last girl completely disappears, no one can find her, no one knows where she is. The Lannisters are looking for her though. Tywin is aware that Arya hasn't been captured. All of a sudden, a northern girl is found in a convoy which left FROM King's Landing (ie where Arya was last known to be). Fancy THAT. Doesn't he realize he's got Arya? That said, he probably isn't even thinking about her at all, considering he's waging a war and not doing politics. The other thing I'm surprised that Tywin didn't figure out was who Gendry was. Oh, right, blacksmith's apprentices are SO common, are they? They go looking for one, they find the convey where he was, they think he's dead. But apparently another blacksmith was also traveling with them.
My analysis is that the Lannisters at King's Landing aren't telling Tywin all the details of their failings. ;/
But yeah enough for now, I've got myself my own Wall [of text] here. I don't know how likely an alliance between Robb and Dany would be. the Starks got just as bad of a rap as the Baratheons from Viserys. Although Dany knows Viserys was full of shit most of the time I think she still holds that animosity. Then there's Ser Jorah, who usually dispels most of Viserys' BS, but in this case he also has a grudge against the Starks because Ned was the one who exiled him. The other thing to keep in mind is that Dany wants to rule over the entirety of the 7 kingdoms. It could be that she wouldn't be down with Robb having a 'King of the North' title. True, but the whole pretense for the Greatjon's king in the north speech was "It was the dragons we bowed to, and now all the dragons are dead." I don't think Robb really wants to be King, he was pressured in to it by his bannermen. He couldn't back down on it for the sake of a Baratheon alliance or else he would lose his bannermen's respect, but I feel like bowing down to the dragons (again) would be more understandable.
I think swearing fealty to Renly would have been entirely plausible, considering the long history between the Starks and the Baratheons. All Robb wanted was revenge for his father, Sansa and Arya back, and the Lannisters gone. And Renly seemed very keen on a peaceful solution with Robb. Of course, now we'll never know.
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Re: 7 Kingdoms - That is correct.
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On May 01 2012 04:31 sung_moon wrote:Show nested quote +On May 01 2012 04:22 sjh wrote:On May 01 2012 04:08 scudst0rm wrote:On May 01 2012 03:40 Incognoto wrote:+ Show Spoiler +Disclaimer: These aren't spoilers. I haven't read the books. I don't know what's going to happen. This is pure speculation on my part. I'm posting as of when I've seen the 5th episode of the second season. !!!!!!
-------------------------------------------------------------
So I was watching the last episode a second time (I find I always need to watch twice to get a good grasp at what's going on) and I did a small recap of the situation. So we have Renly dead and all the Baratheons who are under Stannis's flag. I'm pretty sure the Stark/Baratheon alliance is going to go to hell, especially since there are rumors of Cat being the assassin (or at least having taken part in it).
So every house is basically for itself now. Greyjoys vs Stark, Stark vs Lannister, Baratheon vs Lannister, etc. There are pretty much no alliances. And every house wants the throne, EXCEPT for Robb Stark. He just wants Joffrey's head. So basically the 7 kingdoms is one hell of a war.
On top of that, we have Daenerys Targaryen, who also wants the throne. I think the really interesting part of this episode was when Jorah told her that her allies weren't at Qarth (I hope she leaves Qarth soon btw because that city gives me the creeps) but in Westorros. Except that Daeny is the only Targaryen alive... who the hell is going to support her? Who are her allies? Yeah she's got the dragons but they're still little and shit. The other interesting point is that Daenerys would make a good queen. When she was a Khaleesi, she was loved by the people and she was a good khaleesi. A kind one. She's probably the best monarch the Iron Throne could get, better than Stannis, Joffrey or whoever else wants it. She'd be good to her people, she isn't the Mad King. She's also honorable, which seems to be a rare quality.
In that regard, it almost seems that Daenerys and Robb Stark are natural allies. Robb doesn't want the Throne, Daeny does. Robb needs support because he's alone against 3 different houses, Daeny needs an ally in Westorros. The Starks are the ones who are going to "suffer" the most when Winter comes, what with White Walkers and their wights. What kills the latter? Fire. What breathes fire? Dragons, that's what. Both are honorable, both are loved by their people. Both are leaders. An alliance almost seems perfect between them, even if Stark and Targaryen have been at each other in the past. Not only that, the Starks are the only faction who doesn't want to rule on the Iron Throne (besides perhaps Greyjoy), hence the only reasonable ally to be had for Daeny.
I don't have much to say about Snow. His story line is really interesting but I can't think of horse shit of stuff that'll happen. I'm pretty sure that the wildlings and the WW aren't allies. I'm pretty sure that the WW are the ones making the wildlings march south. But that's all.
I really love Arya's situation, it's really interesting. Especially with Gendry mixed up there (by the way people, don't forget that Gendry has a claim to the throne). What I find harder to believe is that someone as smart as Tywin (the opposition of epicness between Tywin and Arya is really excellent btw) didn't put two and two together about Arya.
So Stark's last girl completely disappears, no one can find her, no one knows where she is. The Lannisters are looking for her though. Tywin is aware that Arya hasn't been captured. All of a sudden, a northern girl is found in a convoy which left FROM King's Landing (ie where Arya was last known to be). Fancy THAT. Doesn't he realize he's got Arya? That said, he probably isn't even thinking about her at all, considering he's waging a war and not doing politics. The other thing I'm surprised that Tywin didn't figure out was who Gendry was. Oh, right, blacksmith's apprentices are SO common, are they? They go looking for one, they find the convey where he was, they think he's dead. But apparently another blacksmith was also traveling with them.
My analysis is that the Lannisters at King's Landing aren't telling Tywin all the details of their failings. ;/
But yeah enough for now, I've got myself my own Wall [of text] here. I don't know how likely an alliance between Robb and Dany would be. the Starks got just as bad of a rap as the Baratheons from Viserys. Although Dany knows Viserys was full of shit most of the time I think she still holds that animosity. Then there's Ser Jorah, who usually dispels most of Viserys' BS, but in this case he also has a grudge against the Starks because Ned was the one who exiled him. The other thing to keep in mind is that Dany wants to rule over the entirety of the 7 kingdoms. It could be that she wouldn't be down with Robb having a 'King of the North' title. Pretty dumb question, but what are the 7 kingdoms? 1. the north (the entire northern region) 2. casterly rock 3. stormlands 4. the reach (or w/e land the Tyrell's control) 5. the vale 6. dorne? (Who even holds the Dorne and I guess they remain nuetral within all this conflict?) 7. riverlands?
Yes except:
2. westerlands (casterly rock is just a castle)
7. riverlands + iron islands. Back when the 7 kingdoms were actually kingdoms the Ironborn had conquered the riverlands and ruled it from Harrenhal.
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On May 01 2012 04:31 sung_moon wrote:Show nested quote +On May 01 2012 04:22 sjh wrote:On May 01 2012 04:08 scudst0rm wrote:On May 01 2012 03:40 Incognoto wrote:+ Show Spoiler +Disclaimer: These aren't spoilers. I haven't read the books. I don't know what's going to happen. This is pure speculation on my part. I'm posting as of when I've seen the 5th episode of the second season. !!!!!!
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So I was watching the last episode a second time (I find I always need to watch twice to get a good grasp at what's going on) and I did a small recap of the situation. So we have Renly dead and all the Baratheons who are under Stannis's flag. I'm pretty sure the Stark/Baratheon alliance is going to go to hell, especially since there are rumors of Cat being the assassin (or at least having taken part in it).
So every house is basically for itself now. Greyjoys vs Stark, Stark vs Lannister, Baratheon vs Lannister, etc. There are pretty much no alliances. And every house wants the throne, EXCEPT for Robb Stark. He just wants Joffrey's head. So basically the 7 kingdoms is one hell of a war.
On top of that, we have Daenerys Targaryen, who also wants the throne. I think the really interesting part of this episode was when Jorah told her that her allies weren't at Qarth (I hope she leaves Qarth soon btw because that city gives me the creeps) but in Westorros. Except that Daeny is the only Targaryen alive... who the hell is going to support her? Who are her allies? Yeah she's got the dragons but they're still little and shit. The other interesting point is that Daenerys would make a good queen. When she was a Khaleesi, she was loved by the people and she was a good khaleesi. A kind one. She's probably the best monarch the Iron Throne could get, better than Stannis, Joffrey or whoever else wants it. She'd be good to her people, she isn't the Mad King. She's also honorable, which seems to be a rare quality.
In that regard, it almost seems that Daenerys and Robb Stark are natural allies. Robb doesn't want the Throne, Daeny does. Robb needs support because he's alone against 3 different houses, Daeny needs an ally in Westorros. The Starks are the ones who are going to "suffer" the most when Winter comes, what with White Walkers and their wights. What kills the latter? Fire. What breathes fire? Dragons, that's what. Both are honorable, both are loved by their people. Both are leaders. An alliance almost seems perfect between them, even if Stark and Targaryen have been at each other in the past. Not only that, the Starks are the only faction who doesn't want to rule on the Iron Throne (besides perhaps Greyjoy), hence the only reasonable ally to be had for Daeny.
I don't have much to say about Snow. His story line is really interesting but I can't think of horse shit of stuff that'll happen. I'm pretty sure that the wildlings and the WW aren't allies. I'm pretty sure that the WW are the ones making the wildlings march south. But that's all.
I really love Arya's situation, it's really interesting. Especially with Gendry mixed up there (by the way people, don't forget that Gendry has a claim to the throne). What I find harder to believe is that someone as smart as Tywin (the opposition of epicness between Tywin and Arya is really excellent btw) didn't put two and two together about Arya.
So Stark's last girl completely disappears, no one can find her, no one knows where she is. The Lannisters are looking for her though. Tywin is aware that Arya hasn't been captured. All of a sudden, a northern girl is found in a convoy which left FROM King's Landing (ie where Arya was last known to be). Fancy THAT. Doesn't he realize he's got Arya? That said, he probably isn't even thinking about her at all, considering he's waging a war and not doing politics. The other thing I'm surprised that Tywin didn't figure out was who Gendry was. Oh, right, blacksmith's apprentices are SO common, are they? They go looking for one, they find the convey where he was, they think he's dead. But apparently another blacksmith was also traveling with them.
My analysis is that the Lannisters at King's Landing aren't telling Tywin all the details of their failings. ;/
But yeah enough for now, I've got myself my own Wall [of text] here. I don't know how likely an alliance between Robb and Dany would be. the Starks got just as bad of a rap as the Baratheons from Viserys. Although Dany knows Viserys was full of shit most of the time I think she still holds that animosity. Then there's Ser Jorah, who usually dispels most of Viserys' BS, but in this case he also has a grudge against the Starks because Ned was the one who exiled him. The other thing to keep in mind is that Dany wants to rule over the entirety of the 7 kingdoms. It could be that she wouldn't be down with Robb having a 'King of the North' title. Pretty dumb question, but what are the 7 kingdoms? 1. the north (the entire northern region) 2. casterly rock 3. stormlands 4. the reach (or w/e land the Tyrell's control) 5. the vale 6. dorne? (Who even holds the Dorne and I guess they remain nuetral within all this conflict?) 7. riverlands?
The Riverlands was ruled by the king of the Iron Islands so that is the seventh kingdom on your list 
As for Dorne it is ruled by Prince Doran Martell. Myrcella has recently been shipped of to Dorne to marry one of Doran's youngest son so they should be supporting the Lannisters atm.
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On April 30 2012 22:41 alypse wrote:Show nested quote +On April 30 2012 21:42 iMYoonA wrote:On April 30 2012 21:41 alypse wrote:Please no more bullshit like this anymore  . Conjuring a shadow demon and send it to kill the enemy's leader... ezpz. While they're at it, why don't they have it kill off Joffrey-Cercei-Tyrion-Tywin... or ANY one who dares rise against them, and then take the throne with little to no effort? I swear I'll stop watching if this kind of magic bullshit happens again. because there is obviously a tradeoff, just because you can't see it doesn't mean it doesn't exist you nitwit. no one cares if you watch it or not, get out then. Normally I don't reply to bad-mannered brats like you, but since this is a topic I'm following with great interest, I'll do this time. Just because I didn't say it doesn't mean I didn't think of the possibility of trade-offs or "limited use" of that demon. The point is, it looks like the easy way out that the writer took. Having magic intervened and then decided the outcome of the battle(s) is the worst think that the writer should do, since it makes the whole thing looks like children's fantasy books. Having dragons and the so-called White Walkers is already enough, that way the "fantasy" element of the series doesn't become ridiculous and doesn't make army soldiers look like redundant fools. Even if that demon can only be used once, it's still a ridiculously good trade for Baratheon - all he did was having sex with a woman and then come collecting Renly's 100000 troops. Also, apparently I don't care if anyone cares about I watch the show or not; I just wanted to post since this is a topic in the general section of TL. Think before you speak and mind you words. Show nested quote +On April 30 2012 22:12 ZasZ. wrote:
Did it look like little to no effort? Use your brain before you spout off nonsense like this. There is a reason magic is so rare in this story...it is exceedingly powerful. You don't see opposing sides lobbing fireballs at each other, so what exactly is the problem?
Like I said above, yes, it looked exactly like that. What kind of effort did Baratheon make? Do tell me. And yes, I did use my brain and if you had used yours, you would see that fireballs is nowhere as bad as this kind of magic assassination - killed off the opposing leader and then simply took over almost all his troops. Edit: By "writer" I mean the TV series writers. I did not read a single page of the books.
An strictly honorable brother killing his own kin through the use of magic is simple? I can't begin to describe how much changed in a matter of seconds, but you ought to just calm the fuck down, there are reasons Stannis doesn't want to use more magic (for example the he doesn't want it to be the Red God's victory as well as others). You're like a child watching a movie with your parents and when the main character gets stuck in a hole at the beginning and you burst into tears "What?! This can't happen, that's unfair" - just wait and see.
As for Stannis not knowing, I think him telling Davos to talk to the hand means he probably does know or at the very least can guess that Melisandre killed Renly and may or may not know about the "son" she and he had did the job.
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Does this remind anyone of risk? Renly had Asia, and thus, well, you can never have Asia xD
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On May 01 2012 03:34 ShmeeZZy wrote:Show nested quote +On May 01 2012 02:03 TheSamuraj wrote:
What hasn't been mentioned is that maybe Stannis himself doens't even know how Renly got killed, atleast I haven't seen him finding that out (might have missed it >.>). Because when they had sex, Melisandre and Stannis, Melisandre promised him a son. That's why I don't think that Stannis had this planned but then the scene where the hand of Stannis, can't remember his name, took Melisandre to that cave doesn't make alot of sense. Or Melisandre asked to be escorted by the hand of Stannis because he didn't trust Melisandre.
For me this is a big scheme from Melisandre where Stannis has nothing to do with it and took it as it came. I don't agree. You forget the convo at the end between Cat and Brienne. They said the shadow looked like Stannis. Chances are that it was a part of his soul unleashed upon Renly. There is your extreme cost and why it can't be used whenever.
Pretty sure it was only Brienne that said the shadow looked like Stannis. And considering how much of a rage she was in, she could've just saw what she wanted to see in that instance.
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The original 7 kingdoms were the Kingdom of the North (Winterfell/White Harbor), the Kingdom of Vale and Sky (The Vale/Eyrie), the Kingdom of the Isles and Rivers (Iron Islands), Kingdom of the Rock (Casterly Rock/Lannisport), Kingdom of the Reach (High Garden/Oldtown/Tyrells), Kingdom of the Stormlands (Storm's End/Baratheons) and Dorne (Sunspear/Martell's).
The Riverlands are not part of the count. This area is ruled by House Tully. Catelyn (Tully) Stark's family. They were once ruled by a certain someone (fearful of spoilers) that was conquered by the Tully's who then appointed the current Greyjoy family rule over the Iron Islands presently.
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On April 30 2012 22:41 alypse wrote:Show nested quote +On April 30 2012 21:42 iMYoonA wrote:On April 30 2012 21:41 alypse wrote:Please no more bullshit like this anymore . Conjuring a shadow demon and send it to kill the enemy's leader... ezpz. While they're at it, why don't they have it kill off Joffrey-Cercei-Tyrion-Tywin... or ANY one who dares rise against them, and then take the throne with little to no effort? I swear I'll stop watching if this kind of magic bullshit happens again. because there is obviously a tradeoff, just because you can't see it doesn't mean it doesn't exist you nitwit. no one cares if you watch it or not, get out then. Normally I don't reply to bad-mannered brats like you, but since this is a topic I'm following with great interest, I'll do this time. Just because I didn't say it doesn't mean I didn't think of the possibility of trade-offs or "limited use" of that demon. The point is, it looks like the easy way out that the writer took. Having magic intervened and then decided the outcome of the battle(s) is the worst think that the writer should do, since it makes the whole thing looks like children's fantasy books. Having dragons and the so-called White Walkers is already enough, that way the "fantasy" element of the series doesn't become ridiculous and doesn't make army soldiers look like redundant fools. Even if that demon can only be used once, it's still a ridiculously good trade for Baratheon - all he did was having sex with a woman and then come collecting Renly's 100000 troops. Also, apparently I don't care if anyone cares about I watch the show or not; I just wanted to post since this is a topic in the general section of TL. Think before you speak and mind you words. Show nested quote +On April 30 2012 22:12 ZasZ. wrote:
Did it look like little to no effort? Use your brain before you spout off nonsense like this. There is a reason magic is so rare in this story...it is exceedingly powerful. You don't see opposing sides lobbing fireballs at each other, so what exactly is the problem?
Like I said above, yes, it looked exactly like that. What kind of effort did Baratheon make? Do tell me. And yes, I did use my brain and if you had used yours, you would see that fireballs is nowhere as bad as this kind of magic assassination - killed off the opposing leader and then simply took over almost all his troops. Edit: By "writer" I mean the TV series writers. I did not read a single page of the books.
There was nothing simple about it, but I guess you'll think what you want about Stannis' approach. Keep in mind that A) Melisandre had to carry that child for an undetermined amount of time, and B) Davos had to smuggle her close enough to unleash it. If they had been discovered they would have been killed.
Now Stannis has to cope not only with the fact that he killed his own brother but that he did it in such a dishonorable fashion. But tell me, if your end goal was getting as many of these troops to fight for you as possible, don't you think assassinating their leader while simultaneously making it look like it wasn't you would be the best way to go about this?
And if you don't want people to respond to your post negatively, don't sound like one of the "bad-mannered brats" you never reply to. Saying things like "I swear I'll stop watching if this kind of magic bullshit happens again" sounds whiny and petulant. I guarantee you that HBO and GRRM are taking your threats very seriously.
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On May 01 2012 04:52 ballasdontcry wrote:Show nested quote +On May 01 2012 03:34 ShmeeZZy wrote:On May 01 2012 02:03 TheSamuraj wrote:
What hasn't been mentioned is that maybe Stannis himself doens't even know how Renly got killed, atleast I haven't seen him finding that out (might have missed it >.>). Because when they had sex, Melisandre and Stannis, Melisandre promised him a son. That's why I don't think that Stannis had this planned but then the scene where the hand of Stannis, can't remember his name, took Melisandre to that cave doesn't make alot of sense. Or Melisandre asked to be escorted by the hand of Stannis because he didn't trust Melisandre.
For me this is a big scheme from Melisandre where Stannis has nothing to do with it and took it as it came. I don't agree. You forget the convo at the end between Cat and Brienne. They said the shadow looked like Stannis. Chances are that it was a part of his soul unleashed upon Renly. There is your extreme cost and why it can't be used whenever. Pretty sure it was only Brienne that said the shadow looked like Stannis. And considering how much of a rage she was in, she could've just saw what she wanted to see in that instance.
You should rewatch the episode and get a better look at the shadow then.
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The Riverlands are indeed part of the count. The Iron Islands themselves are not.
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The night was dark and full of terrans.
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On May 01 2012 04:46 TokO wrote:
Does this remind anyone of risk? Renly had Asia, and thus, well, you can never have Asia xD
Quoted for being spot fucking on! <3
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On May 01 2012 05:08 Ace wrote:
The Riverlands are indeed part of the count. The Iron Islands themselves are not.
This is wrong. The Riverlands have never been an independent kingdom. They were once part of the kingdom of the Iron Islands.
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On May 01 2012 05:08 Ace wrote:
The Riverlands are indeed part of the count. The Iron Islands themselves are not.
"Westeros in the books is depicted much as in the TV series, though it is possible that the book version of the continent is slightly larger, as in the TV series it only takes a large party a month to get from Winterfell to King's Landing. In the book version, this would only be possible for a fast, single rider with frequent changes of mount.
In the novels the term 'Seven Kingdoms' is a much looser and more informal term. However, in the TV series it seems to be more codified and important, with emphasis given on the fact that the Riverlands are not considered part of the count."
The Iron Islands are 100% part of the count.
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Can't say I'm thrilled at the increasingly prominent role the fantasy elements of the story are taking.
"Renly's troops massively outnumber our own, there's no way to beat him in battle, we have no hope of winning... unless... we send the magic smoke monster to kill him in his tent and get all of his army to follow me instead!"
I loved the scene between Renly and Stannis in the previous episode and thought it set the conflict between them up quite nicely. To see that whole storyline resolved within 5 minutes of the following episode (by a magic smoke monster) was more than a little disappointing.
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EPT
