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All book discussion in this thread is now allowed. |
On May 18 2011 21:11 WhiteDog wrote:Show nested quote +On May 18 2011 21:01 tertos wrote:On May 18 2011 20:40 AndyJay wrote:
Full suit of plate armor and a solid wood 10 foot lance? Yeah... no. Not gonna happen without some muscles. actualy a full set of plate armor made of steal weights as much as 25kilos / 50 pounds. a 10 feet solid oakwood lance is no more than 3kilos/7 pounds. I only weight 100 pounds and if you strap that weight into my backpack i could still run at least 2 miles before losing breath. not to mention that you are biased by what you see in movies, knights needing help to mount or put on armor. In fact I saw it with my own eyes to a festival where one man wearing full plate armor ran and catched up with a clother from the audience. That and as you saw in the movie all that Ser Loras did since the age of 10 was train in beeing a better fighter. All ins and outs when you strap someone on the back of a galloping horse his weight and muscle suddenly does not matter that much. Anticipation of both your position and opponent, a sure eye and a steady hand is the top requirements. And he did used a trick, a mare in heat to make his oponnent`s stallion restless. I had a hard time understanding how the hell did you saw a guy running with a brest plate, then I read you were from Romania. 
Yeah, kinda understandable since you live in France everybody uses foils and rapiers to kill each other, they don`t wear armor, they wear blue capes with musketeer logos, large flamboyant hats with feathers and long pointy mustaches.
En garde, monsieur. Vive la France!
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On May 18 2011 21:15 -Archangel- wrote:
Come on people. Loras said he practices each day with a sword. I practiced with a stick in my martial arts class 3 times per week and after a few months I could feel the difference and my arms looked way more buff then Loras although still not big. They fucked up with this and no false logic will save it.
If you really care that much about it then I don't think you should continue to watch series. It's for enjoyment sake. Nitpicking that hardcore will just make everything not enjoyable no matter the content.
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On May 18 2011 21:32 tertos wrote:Show nested quote +On May 18 2011 21:11 WhiteDog wrote:On May 18 2011 21:01 tertos wrote:On May 18 2011 20:40 AndyJay wrote:
Full suit of plate armor and a solid wood 10 foot lance? Yeah... no. Not gonna happen without some muscles. actualy a full set of plate armor made of steal weights as much as 25kilos / 50 pounds. a 10 feet solid oakwood lance is no more than 3kilos/7 pounds. I only weight 100 pounds and if you strap that weight into my backpack i could still run at least 2 miles before losing breath. not to mention that you are biased by what you see in movies, knights needing help to mount or put on armor. In fact I saw it with my own eyes to a festival where one man wearing full plate armor ran and catched up with a clother from the audience. That and as you saw in the movie all that Ser Loras did since the age of 10 was train in beeing a better fighter. All ins and outs when you strap someone on the back of a galloping horse his weight and muscle suddenly does not matter that much. Anticipation of both your position and opponent, a sure eye and a steady hand is the top requirements. And he did used a trick, a mare in heat to make his oponnent`s stallion restless. I had a hard time understanding how the hell did you saw a guy running with a brest plate, then I read you were from Romania. Yeah, kinda understandable since you live in France everybody uses foils and rapiers to kill each other, they don`t wear armor, they wear blue capes with musketeer logos, large flamboyant hats with feathers and long pointy mustaches. En garde, monsieur. Vive la France!
.........WTF? during the middle ages France also had full plate armour and one of the best armored cavalries in the world. Riders wore full plate, FUCKING HORSES wore full plate.
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On May 18 2011 21:32 tertos wrote:Show nested quote +On May 18 2011 21:11 WhiteDog wrote:On May 18 2011 21:01 tertos wrote:On May 18 2011 20:40 AndyJay wrote:
Full suit of plate armor and a solid wood 10 foot lance? Yeah... no. Not gonna happen without some muscles. actualy a full set of plate armor made of steal weights as much as 25kilos / 50 pounds. a 10 feet solid oakwood lance is no more than 3kilos/7 pounds. I only weight 100 pounds and if you strap that weight into my backpack i could still run at least 2 miles before losing breath. not to mention that you are biased by what you see in movies, knights needing help to mount or put on armor. In fact I saw it with my own eyes to a festival where one man wearing full plate armor ran and catched up with a clother from the audience. That and as you saw in the movie all that Ser Loras did since the age of 10 was train in beeing a better fighter. All ins and outs when you strap someone on the back of a galloping horse his weight and muscle suddenly does not matter that much. Anticipation of both your position and opponent, a sure eye and a steady hand is the top requirements. And he did used a trick, a mare in heat to make his oponnent`s stallion restless. I had a hard time understanding how the hell did you saw a guy running with a brest plate, then I read you were from Romania. Yeah, kinda understandable since you live in France everybody uses foils and rapiers to kill each other, they don`t wear armor, they wear blue capes with musketeer logos, large flamboyant hats with feathers and long pointy mustaches. En garde, monsieur. Vive la France!
I was not flaming your country huh, just joking.
And in my country we are all pussies, we don't fight anymore and dress like girls 
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On May 18 2011 20:52 WhiteDog wrote:Show nested quote +On May 18 2011 16:38 SpectralFremen wrote:
Jaime Lanister is widely considered one if not the best swordsmen ever to live. The fact Ned was going toe to toe with him at all is a credit to his fighting ability. Well, we did not read the same book. I thought Jaime was a great fighter but never considered as a legend because he had never been in a situation where he would face a difficult opponent. Always choosing his opponent wisely, as a true Lannister.
Yea Jaime is one of the best living Knights, but not the best ever.
Now I am wondering, who WAS the best ever? I'm spoilering some suggestions
+ Show Spoiler + Barristan the Bold, Arthur Dayne, King Robert? Yea he's fat and everything now, but he won the Iron Throne as a warrior and killed Rhaegar in single combat
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On May 18 2011 21:47 InFiNitY[pG] wrote:Show nested quote +On May 18 2011 20:52 WhiteDog wrote:On May 18 2011 16:38 SpectralFremen wrote:
Jaime Lanister is widely considered one if not the best swordsmen ever to live. The fact Ned was going toe to toe with him at all is a credit to his fighting ability. Well, we did not read the same book. I thought Jaime was a great fighter but never considered as a legend because he had never been in a situation where he would face a difficult opponent. Always choosing his opponent wisely, as a true Lannister. Yea Jaime is one of the best living Knights, but not the best ever. Now I am wondering, who WAS the best ever? I'm spoilering some suggestions + Show Spoiler + Barristan the Bold, Arthur Dayne, King Robert? Yea he's fat and everything now, but he won the Iron Throne as a warrior and killed Rhaegar in single combat
No, if I remember correctly, I think the the best ever was the Dragon Knight Aemon Targaryen, who was almost matched by Cregan Stark.
i did not put any spoiler since this is irrelevant to the actual story line. Tell me if I should still put.
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On May 18 2011 21:47 InFiNitY[pG] wrote:Show nested quote +On May 18 2011 20:52 WhiteDog wrote:On May 18 2011 16:38 SpectralFremen wrote:
Jaime Lanister is widely considered one if not the best swordsmen ever to live. The fact Ned was going toe to toe with him at all is a credit to his fighting ability. Well, we did not read the same book. I thought Jaime was a great fighter but never considered as a legend because he had never been in a situation where he would face a difficult opponent. Always choosing his opponent wisely, as a true Lannister. Yea Jaime is one of the best living Knights, but not the best ever. Now I am wondering, who WAS the best ever? I'm spoilering some suggestions + Show Spoiler + Barristan the Bold, Arthur Dayne, King Robert? Yea he's fat and everything now, but he won the Iron Throne as a warrior and killed Rhaegar in single combat
Minor spoiler
+ Show Spoiler +Dayne was considered the best in his lifetime. If you ask for the best ever, that could just as well have been somebody living 3000 years prior that we don't know about. Several of the dragonknights were pretty good too probably. Rhaegar was beaten by Robert, though.
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On May 18 2011 21:37 Numy wrote:Show nested quote +On May 18 2011 21:15 -Archangel- wrote:
Come on people. Loras said he practices each day with a sword. I practiced with a stick in my martial arts class 3 times per week and after a few months I could feel the difference and my arms looked way more buff then Loras although still not big. They fucked up with this and no false logic will save it. If you really care that much about it then I don't think you should continue to watch series. It's for enjoyment sake. Nitpicking that hardcore will just make everything not enjoyable no matter the content.
No, I do not care but I do care when people try to apply false logic to push their point or story forward.
This part with Loras was an obvious mistake (and there are more in the series) but considering + Show Spoiler [minor spoiler from Book 1] +Loras will probably not appear in this season again it was too much to ask the actor to spend some weeks/months in a gym so he can better look the part to only show up for 3 minutes in the whole season.
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On May 18 2011 21:53 Maginor wrote:Show nested quote +On May 18 2011 21:47 InFiNitY[pG] wrote:On May 18 2011 20:52 WhiteDog wrote:On May 18 2011 16:38 SpectralFremen wrote:
Jaime Lanister is widely considered one if not the best swordsmen ever to live. The fact Ned was going toe to toe with him at all is a credit to his fighting ability. Well, we did not read the same book. I thought Jaime was a great fighter but never considered as a legend because he had never been in a situation where he would face a difficult opponent. Always choosing his opponent wisely, as a true Lannister. Yea Jaime is one of the best living Knights, but not the best ever. Now I am wondering, who WAS the best ever? I'm spoilering some suggestions + Show Spoiler + Barristan the Bold, Arthur Dayne, King Robert? Yea he's fat and everything now, but he won the Iron Throne as a warrior and killed Rhaegar in single combat Minor spoiler + Show Spoiler +Dayne was considered the best in his lifetime. If you ask for the best ever, that could just as well have been somebody living 3000 years prior that we don't know about. Several of the dragonknights were pretty good too probably. Rhaegar was beaten by Robert, though.
Yes, in the books they do mention the Age of Heroes and the wonderous feats those people performed so probably someone from then was the best fighter.
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On May 18 2011 22:06 -Archangel- wrote:Show nested quote +On May 18 2011 21:37 Numy wrote:On May 18 2011 21:15 -Archangel- wrote:
Come on people. Loras said he practices each day with a sword. I practiced with a stick in my martial arts class 3 times per week and after a few months I could feel the difference and my arms looked way more buff then Loras although still not big. They fucked up with this and no false logic will save it. If you really care that much about it then I don't think you should continue to watch series. It's for enjoyment sake. Nitpicking that hardcore will just make everything not enjoyable no matter the content. No, I do not care but I do care when people try to apply false logic to push their point or story forward. This part with Loras was an obvious mistake (and there are more in the series) but considering + Show Spoiler [minor spoiler from Book 1] +Loras will probably not appear in this season again it was too much to ask the actor to spend some weeks/months in a gym so he can better look the part to only show up for 3 minutes in the whole season.
....go look at Bruce Lee... size of your arms =/= strength. I've seen smaller and thinner people to the guy who plays Loras be about 10x more powerful then massive Gregor like guys. So please don't try and call everything false logic.
I've seen a 5 foot, super thin Thai guy kick a 6'3 ultra ripped Englishman in pads (the ones you hold for kicking practice) and make him stumble back 2 feet, when he wasnt even putting much force in his kick! seen it with my own eyes!
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Its mentioned a few times in the books that stories from back in the Age of heroes then are quite unreliable
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On May 18 2011 21:53 Maginor wrote:Show nested quote +On May 18 2011 21:47 InFiNitY[pG] wrote:On May 18 2011 20:52 WhiteDog wrote:On May 18 2011 16:38 SpectralFremen wrote:
Jaime Lanister is widely considered one if not the best swordsmen ever to live. The fact Ned was going toe to toe with him at all is a credit to his fighting ability. Well, we did not read the same book. I thought Jaime was a great fighter but never considered as a legend because he had never been in a situation where he would face a difficult opponent. Always choosing his opponent wisely, as a true Lannister. Yea Jaime is one of the best living Knights, but not the best ever. Now I am wondering, who WAS the best ever? I'm spoilering some suggestions + Show Spoiler + Barristan the Bold, Arthur Dayne, King Robert? Yea he's fat and everything now, but he won the Iron Throne as a warrior and killed Rhaegar in single combat Minor spoiler + Show Spoiler +Dayne was considered the best in his lifetime. If you ask for the best ever, that could just as well have been somebody living 3000 years prior that we don't know about. Several of the dragonknights were pretty good too probably. Rhaegar was beaten by Robert, though.
+ Show Spoiler [A Storm of Swords] +Strong Belwas would wreck all your Westerosi knights!
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On May 18 2011 21:52 WhiteDog wrote:Show nested quote +On May 18 2011 21:47 InFiNitY[pG] wrote:On May 18 2011 20:52 WhiteDog wrote:On May 18 2011 16:38 SpectralFremen wrote:
Jaime Lanister is widely considered one if not the best swordsmen ever to live. The fact Ned was going toe to toe with him at all is a credit to his fighting ability. Well, we did not read the same book. I thought Jaime was a great fighter but never considered as a legend because he had never been in a situation where he would face a difficult opponent. Always choosing his opponent wisely, as a true Lannister. Yea Jaime is one of the best living Knights, but not the best ever. Now I am wondering, who WAS the best ever? I'm spoilering some suggestions + Show Spoiler + Barristan the Bold, Arthur Dayne, King Robert? Yea he's fat and everything now, but he won the Iron Throne as a warrior and killed Rhaegar in single combat No, if I remember correctly, I think the the best ever was the Dragon Knight Aemon Targaryen, who was almost matched by Cregan Stark. i did not put any spoiler since this is irrelevant to the actual story line. Tell me if I should still put.
I agree with you post here, Aemon is lauded as one of the greatest, if not the greatest of all time, and he said he hadn't faced a finer swordsman than Cregan. In later history, Arthur Dayne is probably the hottest pick.
That said, these "powerrankings" are for the book though, the TV series seem to have given Ned Stark a powerup at least (who knows if they have done the same with others).
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just watched ep5, things are kicking up a notch! fucking insane shit going down there.
and i also received my delivery for the books! all four of them in full boxed glory. cant wait to start :D
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On May 18 2011 22:34 wbirdy wrote:
fucking insane shit going down there. :D
+ Show Spoiler +
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On May 18 2011 22:13 PlaGuE_R wrote:Show nested quote +On May 18 2011 22:06 -Archangel- wrote:On May 18 2011 21:37 Numy wrote:On May 18 2011 21:15 -Archangel- wrote:
Come on people. Loras said he practices each day with a sword. I practiced with a stick in my martial arts class 3 times per week and after a few months I could feel the difference and my arms looked way more buff then Loras although still not big. They fucked up with this and no false logic will save it. If you really care that much about it then I don't think you should continue to watch series. It's for enjoyment sake. Nitpicking that hardcore will just make everything not enjoyable no matter the content. No, I do not care but I do care when people try to apply false logic to push their point or story forward. This part with Loras was an obvious mistake (and there are more in the series) but considering + Show Spoiler [minor spoiler from Book 1] +Loras will probably not appear in this season again it was too much to ask the actor to spend some weeks/months in a gym so he can better look the part to only show up for 3 minutes in the whole season. ....go look at Bruce Lee... size of your arms =/= strength. I've seen smaller and thinner people to the guy who plays Loras be about 10x more powerful then massive Gregor like guys. So please don't try and call everything false logic. I've seen a 5 foot, super thin Thai guy kick a 6'3 ultra ripped Englishman in pads (the ones you hold for kicking practice) and make him stumble back 2 feet, when he wasnt even putting much force in his kick! seen it with my own eyes!
Lol you pick Bruce Lee of all the people. He has a really strong sinewy body. Loras not even close to that.
And you second example where you compare a martial artist focusing all his forward momentum into a kick and pushing someone away (who is at that point just a bag of force) to people fighting with swords and the effect of constant daily practice with piece of metal and the effect of that on your body, is a big FAIL.
If want to go by these stupid descriptions that mean nothing, I seen with my own eyes a guy with a huge belly do a flying kick. But you know what, this guy was training martial arts for like 20 years and had 3x the muscle of Loras actor although he was not buff.
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Reading all the spoilers makes me wanna get the book. I've always seen Martin's books in the fantasy section but never bothered to buy them.
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On May 18 2011 21:47 InFiNitY[pG] wrote:Show nested quote +On May 18 2011 20:52 WhiteDog wrote:On May 18 2011 16:38 SpectralFremen wrote:
Jaime Lanister is widely considered one if not the best swordsmen ever to live. The fact Ned was going toe to toe with him at all is a credit to his fighting ability. Well, we did not read the same book. I thought Jaime was a great fighter but never considered as a legend because he had never been in a situation where he would face a difficult opponent. Always choosing his opponent wisely, as a true Lannister. Yea Jaime is one of the best living Knights, but not the best ever. Now I am wondering, who WAS the best ever? I'm spoilering some suggestions + Show Spoiler + Barristan the Bold, Arthur Dayne, King Robert? Yea he's fat and everything now, but he won the Iron Throne as a warrior and killed Rhaegar in single combat
+ Show Spoiler +Rhaegar is described as a man who basically excelled at everything but really had no desire to be a warrior. He was a fighting bard more then anything. While he was good I think most of his reputation comes from the fact that he was good at everything and very charismatic. Robert was good as well but I dont think even close to the best.
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On May 18 2011 23:33 -Archangel- wrote:Show nested quote +On May 18 2011 22:13 PlaGuE_R wrote:On May 18 2011 22:06 -Archangel- wrote:On May 18 2011 21:37 Numy wrote:On May 18 2011 21:15 -Archangel- wrote:
Come on people. Loras said he practices each day with a sword. I practiced with a stick in my martial arts class 3 times per week and after a few months I could feel the difference and my arms looked way more buff then Loras although still not big. They fucked up with this and no false logic will save it. If you really care that much about it then I don't think you should continue to watch series. It's for enjoyment sake. Nitpicking that hardcore will just make everything not enjoyable no matter the content. No, I do not care but I do care when people try to apply false logic to push their point or story forward. This part with Loras was an obvious mistake (and there are more in the series) but considering + Show Spoiler [minor spoiler from Book 1] +Loras will probably not appear in this season again it was too much to ask the actor to spend some weeks/months in a gym so he can better look the part to only show up for 3 minutes in the whole season. ....go look at Bruce Lee... size of your arms =/= strength. I've seen smaller and thinner people to the guy who plays Loras be about 10x more powerful then massive Gregor like guys. So please don't try and call everything false logic. I've seen a 5 foot, super thin Thai guy kick a 6'3 ultra ripped Englishman in pads (the ones you hold for kicking practice) and make him stumble back 2 feet, when he wasnt even putting much force in his kick! seen it with my own eyes! Lol you pick Bruce Lee of all the people. He has a really strong sinewy body. Loras not even close to that. And you second example where you compare a martial artist focusing all his forward momentum into a kick and pushing someone away (who is at that point just a bag of force) to people fighting with swords and the effect of constant daily practice with piece of metal and the effect of that on your body, is a big FAIL. If want to go by these stupid descriptions that mean nothing, I seen with my own eyes a guy with a huge belly do a flying kick. But you know what, this guy was training martial arts for like 20 years and had 3x the muscle of Loras actor although he was not buff.
no dude, i'm saying size doesnt mean shit all. go look at Samurai and see if u find massive body builder types there. and the martial artist wasnt focusing much energy to push back another martial artist that was double his size. It's not about how big you are, it's how you use those muscles.
There's a martial arts theory that people have red and white muscles with red being big bodybuilder types that deliver burst power and white being less strength but more endurance and then pink type which is as powerful as red but as endurant as white and not bulky.
anyways, size doesn't matter, especially if the entire force used is provided by a horse and not by you ie jousting. go watch Ong Bak and Tom Yum Goong and see how smaller = stronger in some cases
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EPT
