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All book discussion in this thread is now allowed. |
United States43971 Posts
On May 23 2016 23:10 Laurens wrote:Show nested quote +On May 23 2016 22:59 KwarK wrote:On May 23 2016 18:19 zatic wrote:On May 23 2016 13:09 KwarK wrote:On May 23 2016 11:25 [UoN]Sentinel wrote:On May 23 2016 11:22 shin_toss wrote:
Okay good episode, New info has been revealed. I just think that close up dick pic was not necessary -.-
The Hodor reveal means is Bran a time traveler? Kinda hyped for the Iron Island story now, at first I thought the old guy drowned and murdered Euron lol
also
> not using Sean Bean Ned was the kid, not the dad Ned was neither. Huh? The kid is young Ned. Ned wasn't sent to The Reach to be fostered, his elder brother was. Ned married Catelyn not because they spent a childhood together as friends but because there was already a marriage contract between his elder brother, who was murdered by the Mad King, and her. It all worked out but the Stark fostered at The Reach wasn't Ned. That part of the plot echoed the marriage of Arthur Tudor and Catherine of Aragon, big brother dies and so next brother (Henry VIII) steps up. Remember it wasn't Ned that almost killed Littlefinger at The Reach, it was Brandon Stark who got Catelyn all moist with his fine swordplay. Ned was sent to the Vale under Jon Arryn. Is it mentioned that the kid is being sent to the Reach instead of the Vale? In that case it is indeed not Ned, nice catch. I just assumed it was Ned and didn't pay attention to Reach/Vale.
Yeah, I'm wrong. Brandon would have been at the seat of house Tully which was mixed up with the Vale in my head. I knew it was Brandon, not Ned, who grew up with Lysa and Catelyn Tully (and Littlefinger) and I must have assumed for no reason that Lysa was always in The Vale. It was Ned, don't mind me.
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I didn't quite get the transition from...
"You need to GTFO the white walkers are coming. Leave now."
to...
"Lets go hang out with your dad-as-a-kid so you can mess with Hodor"
The "time travel" stuff doesn't bother me, it's not like Bran changed the past from what we knew the past to be. So we aren't going to have alternate timelines or anything and there are no paradoxes.
But it just seems weird for them to decide to just chill and hang out in the past when they know the white walkers are going to come for them very soon.
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I thought it was pretty clear he couldn’t figure out how to leave. That he was trying to, but couldn’t pull himself back to the real world.
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Zurich15365 Posts
The kid was also introduced as young Ned in last time traveling flashback ...
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i think others have already mentioned here? that or I've just been spending too much time this morning rehashing the episode.
the old man needed to bring Bran there to make hodor into 'hodor' so complete the whole loop to get Bran to where he is.
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United States43971 Posts
On May 23 2016 23:46 Logo wrote:
I didn't quite get the transition from...
"You need to GTFO the white walkers are coming. Leave now."
to...
"Lets go hang out with your dad-as-a-kid so you can mess with Hodor"
The "time travel" stuff doesn't bother me, it's not like Bran changed the past from what we knew the past to be. So we aren't going to have alternate timelines or anything.
But it just seems weird for them to decide to just chill and hang out in the past when they know the white walkers are going to come for them very soon.
I assumed that the Three Eyed Raven knew that they had to be there to create Hodor. Events could not have been otherwise.
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On May 23 2016 23:49 Plansix wrote:
I thought it was pretty clear he couldn’t figure out how to leave. That he was trying to, but couldn’t pull himself back to the real world.
No but like they were told to leave immediately, then the Three Eyed Raven pulled Bran back into his visions.
It's a bit of mixed messages to say "Leave now" then "Wait check this vision out".
The part of Bran being stuck in the vision seems fine to me.
It makes sense to complete the loop, but it'd be nice if there was more motivation behind it than that.
Like even with the Three Eye Raven being well motivated, Bran has no idea what's going on and he's just gotten really conflicted information. At the very least he should be freaking out not just chilling in the vision like normal.
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United States43971 Posts
On May 23 2016 23:50 zatic wrote:
The kid was also introduced as young Ned in last time traveling flashback ...
Welp.
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On May 23 2016 23:51 Logo wrote:Show nested quote +On May 23 2016 23:49 Plansix wrote:
I thought it was pretty clear he couldn’t figure out how to leave. That he was trying to, but couldn’t pull himself back to the real world. No but like they were told to leave immediately, then the Three Eyed Raven pulled Bran back into his visions. It's a bit of mixed messages to say "Leave now" then "Wait check this vision out". The part of Bran being stuck in the vision seems fine to me. It makes sense to complete the loop, but it'd be nice if there was more motivation behind it than that.
I think that is motivation enough. That by altering the past you lock yourself into whatever loop it creates, which already happened. It teaches Bran the limits of his abilities and that he can do real damage in the past. And that he has no idea what is going on in the present while he is travel. I think it was a reminder that Bran is still powerless in a lot of ways.
It is not expressly put out there, but a lot of it is implied.
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He talked about "becoming him" so he might have forced his knowledge into bran brain with that forced vision?
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On May 23 2016 23:55 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On May 23 2016 23:51 Logo wrote:On May 23 2016 23:49 Plansix wrote:
I thought it was pretty clear he couldn’t figure out how to leave. That he was trying to, but couldn’t pull himself back to the real world. No but like they were told to leave immediately, then the Three Eyed Raven pulled Bran back into his visions. It's a bit of mixed messages to say "Leave now" then "Wait check this vision out". The part of Bran being stuck in the vision seems fine to me. It makes sense to complete the loop, but it'd be nice if there was more motivation behind it than that. I think that is motivation enough. That by altering the past you lock yourself into whatever loop it creates, which already happened. It teaches Bran the limits of his abilities and that he can do real damage in the past. It is not expressly put out there, but a lot of it is implied.
yeah I suppose, but (as per my late edit) Bran's motivation is still really messed up there. He doesn't know why he's back at that vision but he does know he's about to be attacked by White Walkers. Yet he's in the vision perfectly calm and doesn't even seem to bother asking why he's there again.
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On May 23 2016 23:56 Logo wrote:Show nested quote +On May 23 2016 23:55 Plansix wrote:On May 23 2016 23:51 Logo wrote:On May 23 2016 23:49 Plansix wrote:
I thought it was pretty clear he couldn’t figure out how to leave. That he was trying to, but couldn’t pull himself back to the real world. No but like they were told to leave immediately, then the Three Eyed Raven pulled Bran back into his visions. It's a bit of mixed messages to say "Leave now" then "Wait check this vision out". The part of Bran being stuck in the vision seems fine to me. It makes sense to complete the loop, but it'd be nice if there was more motivation behind it than that. I think that is motivation enough. That by altering the past you lock yourself into whatever loop it creates, which already happened. It teaches Bran the limits of his abilities and that he can do real damage in the past. It is not expressly put out there, but a lot of it is implied. yeah I suppose, but (as per my late edit). Bran's motivation is still really messed up there. He doesn't know why he's back at that vision but he does know he's about to be attacked by White Walkers. Yet he's in the vision perfectly calm and doesn't even seem to bother asking why he's there again.
Bran is told to “listen to your friends” when they ask for Hodor. Once he tries that, he sees the damage he does to Hodor in the past and realizes that it’s his fault. For the rest of the scene he just watches in horror as Hodor yells hold the door and Bran realizes that he ruined Hodor’s entire life and he never had a choice.
Just think about that, Bran destroyed Hodor’s life, but was locked into that decision. That using his powers already make him powerless in how he uses them. He can’t change anything, because he has already done it.
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Yeah that part of the scene was great. I just found it pretty jarring to hop from this life-or-death situation to the calmness of that vision without much of a transition other than a cryptic message from the raven.
The thing I'm curious about, something that I like that the show sort of leaves ambiguous. Is did Hodor live his entire life knowing how he'd die?
Was the thing that broke Hodor the voices/shouting of "hold the door" being fed back through his head while Bran was in there or was it also a full vision of that scene (with the shouting obviously having a profound impact).
It seems like at the end it's implying that Hodor is holding the door under his own will because his eyes are no longer white. And it seems like he's doing it with an expression of deep understanding and no longer a gentle giant.
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Hodor knew what he was doing. The only way they can kill that character and not make it seem horrible is if he willingly gives up his life for the others. This season is doing a good job of showing that bravery something that someone has all the time.
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On May 23 2016 23:51 Logo wrote:Show nested quote +On May 23 2016 23:49 Plansix wrote:
I thought it was pretty clear he couldn’t figure out how to leave. That he was trying to, but couldn’t pull himself back to the real world. No but like they were told to leave immediately, then the Three Eyed Raven pulled Bran back into his visions. It's a bit of mixed messages to say "Leave now" then "Wait check this vision out". The part of Bran being stuck in the vision seems fine to me. It makes sense to complete the loop, but it'd be nice if there was more motivation behind it than that. Like even with the Three Eye Raven being well motivated, Bran has no idea what's going on and he's just gotten really conflicted information. At the very least he should be freaking out not just chilling in the vision like normal.
In inside the episode they explain it as that Bran needed more time to learn and train with the raven, but Bran sped up everything by getting marked by the night king during his solo warging adventure, and now the Three Eyed Raven needs to 'upload' most of what he knows to Bran quickly in a state of duress
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Yea, I saw the scene as crippled bran is not much help in packing up the sled etc. anyway, so they use the limited time they still have left to at least get some more infos from the raven into bran before they leave. Turns out the walkers arrived before they were ready to leave though.
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who would win. Zombie Clegane or Zombie Hodor
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On May 24 2016 00:39 FueledUpAndReadyToGo wrote:Show nested quote +On May 23 2016 23:51 Logo wrote:On May 23 2016 23:49 Plansix wrote:
I thought it was pretty clear he couldn’t figure out how to leave. That he was trying to, but couldn’t pull himself back to the real world. No but like they were told to leave immediately, then the Three Eyed Raven pulled Bran back into his visions. It's a bit of mixed messages to say "Leave now" then "Wait check this vision out". The part of Bran being stuck in the vision seems fine to me. It makes sense to complete the loop, but it'd be nice if there was more motivation behind it than that. Like even with the Three Eye Raven being well motivated, Bran has no idea what's going on and he's just gotten really conflicted information. At the very least he should be freaking out not just chilling in the vision like normal. In inside the episode they explain it as that Bran needed more time to learn and train with the raven, but Bran sped up everything by getting marked by the night king during his solo warging adventure, and now the Three Eyed Raven needs to 'upload' most of what he knows to Bran quickly in a state of duress
Yeah I guess that makes sense. Though in that case I would have liked it more if we learned that the CotF created the White Walkers during that time rather than before. At least then you see Bran gaining some information, then having to control Hodor.
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I really dislike sansa, yeah she has the right to be angry and upset but now she acts as if she knows what she is doing and wants to take the lead?
I hope she doesn't mess up enough to get Jon killed off.
The whole thing just feels like a big set up for sansa pushing Jon snow to his death.
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On May 24 2016 01:00 ETisME wrote:
I really dislike sansa, yeah she has the right to be angry and upset but now she acts as if she knows what she is doing and wants to take the lead?
I hope she doesn't mess up enough to get Jon killed off.
The whole thing just feels like a big set up for sansa pushing Jon snow to his death.
if anything she is setting herself up to eat shit. There is absolutely noway Jon Snow dies anytime soon after the whole resurrection, c'mon mang. Dany, Jon and Bran have plot armor so thick a dragon couldn't pierce it.
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EPT
