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What Are You Reading 2018 - Page 8

Forum Index > Media & Entertainment
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Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-02-26 20:28:45
February 26 2018 20:27 GMT
#141
You would be correct, in so that I do not engage with literature directly or in any systematic fashion. My focus of study in college was history and education, which often brushes up against the historical impact of specific literary minds. In that aspect I have an appreciation of literature and the study of it, even if I rarely fell compelled to dive into a specific piece. Especially not at the expense of another history book or biography.

But I take issue with the idea that some sort of systematic engagement with literature is required to “like” it. Few people have the luxury to do so outside of their college years and such a study would come that the expense of other hobbies or activities. The word “like” is a poor descriptor if you are attempting to convey some drive to have a comprehensive understanding of literature. It is to slight. A word better suited to describe what dessert someone prefers than to describe a passion they devote themself to.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
IgnE
Profile Joined November 2010
United States7681 Posts
February 26 2018 20:34 GMT
#142
there is nothing particularly special about your college years, and its a truism that "everything comes at the expense of other possibilities." active engagement with anything is work, not a luxurious pastime. just as eating trash is easier than cooking nutritious meals, and loafing around is easier than a regular exercise routine, consuming trivial content is easier than engaging with literature.
The unrealistic sound of these propositions is indicative, not of their utopian character, but of the strength of the forces which prevent their realization.
Jerubaal
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States7684 Posts
February 26 2018 20:36 GMT
#143
Ok, I'd say those examples don't support the claim. Joyce is well known, if not well read. Maugham and Forster are never going to have the widest appeal, but they are known. Heart of Darkness is one of the most read books in American high schools.
I'm not stupid, a marauder just shot my brain.
Carnivorous Sheep
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
Baa?21242 Posts
February 26 2018 20:36 GMT
#144
On February 27 2018 05:27 Plansix wrote:
You would be correct, in so that I do not engage with literature directly or in any systematic fashion. My focus of study in college was history and education, which often brushes up against the historical impact of specific literary minds. In that aspect I have an appreciation of literature and the study of it, even if I rarely fell compelled to dive into a specific piece. Especially not at the expense of another history book or biography.

But I take issue with the idea that some sort of systematic engagement with literature is required to “like” it. Few people have the luxury to do so outside of their college years and such a study would come that the expense of other hobbies or activities. The word “like” is a poor descriptor if you are attempting to convey some drive to have a comprehensive understanding of literature. It is to slight. A word better suited to describe what dessert someone prefers than to describe a passion they devote themself to.


But this is precisely the definition of "not liking" something. If you liked literature (or sports, or history, or video games, or anything), you would make time for it. You sacrifice time spent on Facebook, watching TV, playing board games, whatever, for it. You don't actively dislike literature, but nor do you do anything to show that you do in fact like it. Note that liking something is different from being "okay" with it. I'm sure you're likely "okay" with reading literature, but it presumably ranks pretty low on your list of priorities, below things like learning about history and education, or reading stuff like genre fiction.
TranslatorBaa!
Carnivorous Sheep
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
Baa?21242 Posts
February 26 2018 20:40 GMT
#145
On February 27 2018 05:36 Jerubaal wrote:
Ok, I'd say those examples don't support the claim. Joyce is well known, if not well read. Maugham and Forster are never going to have the widest appeal, but they are known. Heart of Darkness is one of the most read books in American high schools.


Er, I don't know what the claim is, I thought it was just a question.

If you are referring to the claim that "Americans don't engage with world lit" (generalized), then I will point you to the statistic that somewhere around 3%, or fewer, of books published in America is in translation, far lower than most other countries. Amazon, with an initiative of publishing a paltry ~70 books in translation, is the largest single publisher of foreign fiction in America, having overtaken the previous leader of Dalkey, who did ~40 per year.
TranslatorBaa!
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-02-26 20:49:28
February 26 2018 20:41 GMT
#146
I completely disagree. College and university are the time when people are given space to explore any number of topics of study in depth and select the one they have a passion for. That is higher education exists. It is completely possible to “like” a given subject, but not pursue a long term study of that subject. I liked the study of film and critique in college. I still have a passing interest in it and like to dive into that subject from time to time. It is not my profession or the main stay of my leisure time.

On February 27 2018 05:36 Carnivorous Sheep wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 27 2018 05:27 Plansix wrote:
You would be correct, in so that I do not engage with literature directly or in any systematic fashion. My focus of study in college was history and education, which often brushes up against the historical impact of specific literary minds. In that aspect I have an appreciation of literature and the study of it, even if I rarely fell compelled to dive into a specific piece. Especially not at the expense of another history book or biography.

But I take issue with the idea that some sort of systematic engagement with literature is required to “like” it. Few people have the luxury to do so outside of their college years and such a study would come that the expense of other hobbies or activities. The word “like” is a poor descriptor if you are attempting to convey some drive to have a comprehensive understanding of literature. It is to slight. A word better suited to describe what dessert someone prefers than to describe a passion they devote themself to.


But this is precisely the definition of "not liking" something. If you liked literature (or sports, or history, or video games, or anything), you would make time for it. You sacrifice time spent on Facebook, watching TV, playing board games, whatever, for it. You don't actively dislike literature, but nor do you do anything to show that you do in fact like it. Note that liking something is different from being "okay" with it. I'm sure you're likely "okay" with reading literature, but it presumably ranks pretty low on your list of priorities, below things like learning about history and education, or reading stuff like genre fiction.


I’m sorry, I have to take issue with this interpretation of the word “like”. Someone interest for literature as a hobby isn’t obliterated when they have their first child and the majority of their time is taken up with keeping that child alive. I don’t have time to play Dota 2 right now in my life, but I still like Dota 2 and enjoy my interactions with it. What you are describing is strong than a casual interest in literature. I don’t disagree with your points, but the word “like” is inadequate to describe what you are attempting to convey.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
Carnivorous Sheep
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
Baa?21242 Posts
February 26 2018 20:50 GMT
#147
Having a passing interest in something doesn't qualify as liking something. I don't go around saying I like figure skating because I watch the Olympics once every few years, but I really enjoy it when I do watch it.
TranslatorBaa!
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
February 26 2018 20:57 GMT
#148
That is liking figure skating. You find it agreeable and enjoyable, which are synonymous with liking something. Someone who purports to like cheese cake is not expected to seek a deep understanding of all versions of cheese cake.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
Sermokala
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States13924 Posts
February 26 2018 21:00 GMT
#149
On February 27 2018 05:40 Carnivorous Sheep wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 27 2018 05:36 Jerubaal wrote:
Ok, I'd say those examples don't support the claim. Joyce is well known, if not well read. Maugham and Forster are never going to have the widest appeal, but they are known. Heart of Darkness is one of the most read books in American high schools.


Er, I don't know what the claim is, I thought it was just a question.

If you are referring to the claim that "Americans don't engage with world lit" (generalized), then I will point you to the statistic that somewhere around 3%, or fewer, of books published in America is in translation, far lower than most other countries. Amazon, with an initiative of publishing a paltry ~70 books in translation, is the largest single publisher of foreign fiction in America, having overtaken the previous leader of Dalkey, who did ~40 per year.

I think this is mostly a commercial problem with other countries more then anything. American (and likewise other english speaking countries) releases can get a audience base thats larger then any other country before being considered for foreign publishing. While a book genre like litrpg's flourish in places like russia but struggle to tranlsate into English due to a lack of idea if its comercialy viable.

Just look at the Asian markets and Manga. There is a ton of it that never goes past native shores but is widly enjoyed in the west due to pirate-type fan translations.
A wise man will say that he knows nothing. We're gona party like its 2752 Hail Dark Brandon
Carnivorous Sheep
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
Baa?21242 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-02-26 21:06:20
February 26 2018 21:03 GMT
#150
I'm talking about literature, not commercial fiction. And the American literary scene is rightfully considered insular by Europeans. Just see, for example, the proliferation and dominance of MFA programs on literary fiction in the anglosphere. By virtue of proximity and heritage, Great Britain is better than America in this regard.

And Americans do the least reading of "key national literature" of other countries. Stuff like Goethe/Holderlin/Schiller, Pushkin's poetry, anything beyond Inferno, any French lit that's not Camus-tier, etc.
TranslatorBaa!
The_Red_Viper
Profile Blog Joined August 2013
19533 Posts
February 26 2018 21:04 GMT
#151
On February 27 2018 05:50 Carnivorous Sheep wrote:
Having a passing interest in something doesn't qualify as liking something. I don't go around saying I like figure skating because I watch the Olympics once every few years, but I really enjoy it when I do watch it.

Which means you like figure skating. I like asian food, i don't eat it more often than more readily available food. You could maybe say he doesn't like it enough to go out of his way to experience it as often as possible, but that's about it really.


To get back to the topic of this thread, i'll start soon with "when breathe becomes air" and probably some fiction along with it. For the fiction it will probably be McCarthy's "no country for old men" because i wanna watch the movie after i read the book. Anyone read either of these two works?
IU | Sohyang || There is no God and we are his prophets | For if ‘Thou mayest’—it is also true that ‘Thou mayest not.” | Ignorance is the parent of fear |
Carnivorous Sheep
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
Baa?21242 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-02-26 21:07:37
February 26 2018 21:05 GMT
#152
On February 27 2018 06:04 The_Red_Viper wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 27 2018 05:50 Carnivorous Sheep wrote:
Having a passing interest in something doesn't qualify as liking something. I don't go around saying I like figure skating because I watch the Olympics once every few years, but I really enjoy it when I do watch it.

Which means you like figure skating. I like asian food, i don't eat it more often than more readily available food. You could maybe say he doesn't like it enough to go out of his way to experience it as often as possible, but that's about it really.



He doesn't like it enough to make pertinent comments on it, as evidenced by his disregard of Moby Dick in favor of genre fiction.
TranslatorBaa!
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
February 26 2018 21:09 GMT
#153
I just finished up The City of Brass by S. A. Chakraborty, which I found to a very easy read over a long weekend. I’ve been turned off by most traditional European fantasy fiction of late, so it was nice to something new for light reading that wasn’t totally predictable.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
The_Red_Viper
Profile Blog Joined August 2013
19533 Posts
February 26 2018 21:12 GMT
#154
On February 27 2018 06:05 Carnivorous Sheep wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 27 2018 06:04 The_Red_Viper wrote:
On February 27 2018 05:50 Carnivorous Sheep wrote:
Having a passing interest in something doesn't qualify as liking something. I don't go around saying I like figure skating because I watch the Olympics once every few years, but I really enjoy it when I do watch it.

Which means you like figure skating. I like asian food, i don't eat it more often than more readily available food. You could maybe say he doesn't like it enough to go out of his way to experience it as often as possible, but that's about it really.



He doesn't like it enough to make pertinent comments on it, as evidenced by his disregard of Moby Dick in favor of genre fiction.

Do you always enjoy literary fiction more than genre fiction? Every single work you have ever read was superior to any commercial work? While i wouldn't agree with him on moby dick i think it's not a big red flag in general to dislike a specific work for whatever reason. Though i think this discussion doesn't really lead anywhere so i'll stay out of it from now on
IU | Sohyang || There is no God and we are his prophets | For if ‘Thou mayest’—it is also true that ‘Thou mayest not.” | Ignorance is the parent of fear |
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
February 26 2018 21:15 GMT
#155
At this point, I might dive into Moby Dick again just to make sure my early 20 something self didn’t have shitty taste.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
IgnE
Profile Joined November 2010
United States7681 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-02-26 23:09:23
February 26 2018 23:08 GMT
#156
taste is made not given a priori
The unrealistic sound of these propositions is indicative, not of their utopian character, but of the strength of the forces which prevent their realization.
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
February 27 2018 00:25 GMT
#157
I don't think I asserted that quality of one's taste self evident through reason. It is also weird to shit post Kant and not bother to punctuate it.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
Carnivorous Sheep
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
Baa?21242 Posts
February 27 2018 00:36 GMT
#158
kant didnt invent the phrase "a priori"
TranslatorBaa!
Zergneedsfood
Profile Blog Joined September 2008
United States10671 Posts
February 27 2018 00:42 GMT
#159
It was maybe like a month or two ago, but there was a Reddit post talking about how it was unnecessary to read all the encyclopedic entries in Moby Dick, which I thought was fucking absurd, so I ended up posting on another discord's literary channel and gave a short "this is what's wrong with people" rant.

A surprising number of people responded in favor of not reading the whaling chapters, which got me super frustrated, so I went back and reread Moby Dick just so I could refresh my mind and tell them they're wrong.

They never responded to me, but it was worth it. :|
/人◕ ‿‿ ◕人\ Make a contract with me and join TLADT | Onodera isn't actually a girl, she's just a doormat you walk over to get to the girl. - Numy 2015
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
February 27 2018 00:42 GMT
#160
You are correct, Latin existed before Kant brought the word priori into popular vernacular with his writings.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
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