On November 29 2016 03:05 disciple wrote: So every major theory got confirmed. Probably the last logical thing left to happen is to get Ford killed, assuming theres no chance in hell HBO managed to book Hopkins for more than a season.
Instead of killing of Ford they can transport his thoughts and ideas into a (cheaper) host vessel I imagine.
On November 29 2016 03:05 disciple wrote: So every major theory got confirmed. Probably the last logical thing left to happen is to get Ford killed, assuming theres no chance in hell HBO managed to book Hopkins for more than a season.
I expect William to carve up Dolores in the next episode.
Guys, this is - alongside The Wire, Twinpeaks and Fargo - one of the absolute best american TV shows, miles and miles ahead of GoT and lightyears better than LOST.
It's a rare, mystifying puzzle that has confronted me with a number of engaging, mostly clever and "new" scenarios. Yeah, sometimes it's a little heavy handed and no, it isn't a philosophical exegesis of sentience (it's HBO afterall). But still, rarely has the shattering of the narrative made as much sense as here, and rarely has it been as rewarding to put the pieces back together (not unlike Memento, which is by far the best movie the Nolans have made). To all those complaining that they cheated with the timelines etc. Ofc they did, but justifiably so. When we follow Dolores' journey in the show, we also explore the concept of artificial memory. If there is no difference between present experiences and stored memories (which would most likely be the case if we were to build a.i. running on mostly traditional computers), time itself loses meaning. So Dolores got somehow sent on a trip down memory lane (maybe by the M.I.B. in the barn) and is only slowly becoming aware of that fact - just like the viewer, who is put into her perspective and thus deserves to be deceived. Then there is Maeves storyline (which might even end up as nothing more than that - a storyline): Yes, they do humanise her a little too much (I would have hoped they somehow could've focused on a conflict between her "cold", awakening intelligence and her programmed appearance of humanity) and yes her interactions with Felix and Sylvester weren't all that compelling. But take Felix for example: What do we know of him? He works in the basement of a giant facility doing the bloody work of a butcher, while being payed a shit wage. And then out of nowhere Maeve appears, making him the center of her attention. Could she maybe, possibly be what Felix perceives as awake? How couldn't he fall in love with her, how couldn't very little matter more to him than to preserve that life, see it grow... not a groundbreaking story, but not a shallow one either. Or William, he isn't a character with a deep, interesting persona (I dont get the obsession Americans in general seem to have with 3d characters, even David Foster Wallace kept going on about them..) but he beautifully illustrates humanity's cultural path into gaming (without being judgemental of that path in anyway). Especially here on a gaming forum I would've expected to find more appreciation for the playful way behavioral patterns, that games tend to bring out, were referenced. When William snuffs out the life of the young soldier on the beach for example, that seems to be an action, that doesn't make sense. How can he just kill someone, if he has fallen in love with a robot? Well, at this point William wants to be with Dolores and her alone. If I were experiencing a really compelling love/adventure/sex etc. roleplay, I also wouldn't want to get distracted by a third party (in a video game I would try to get to the "fun part"). Now the show isn't telling us that this is morally wrong (I really don't think it is), it simply shows how an everyman like William would adopt constantly shifting perspectives in a place like Westworld. So this show is entertaining, clever, and very satisfying to unravel, what is there not to love? Btw a good mystery puzzle-story (which Lost wasn't, and this show up to ep 9 most definitely was) is very hard to do, and should be appreciated simply for being "a good mystery".
I once had a girlfriend was a pretty awful person. Beautiful and smart, but ultimately just a dick. I was young, and stupid and fell for her. After a good start, the whole thing was disaster, particularly the end.
Then I got a new girlfriend. She was superficially like the first one (what can I say, I have a type) but kind inside and always good to me. Unfortunately, her superficial similarities meant that everyone I knew opposed me being with her... it just felt too much like the abusive one.
Anyway, the first girl's name was Lost and the second's was Westworld.
While I take the metaphor straight, I'm aware you can read it ironically... the guy in denial of the similarity of the two girls by saying the second one's different. Anyway, this is why I think there's a division in the community over this.
I think the first season is an amazing prequel and a good setup for the actual show. It's a unique show because you really could make every season different, and there are limitless possibilities. Characters can never die, and they can be a million different people. I really want to see where they're going to take everything -- and if it's going to be like the film, where there's many different worlds, and what those would be.
I personally doubt the existence of many other worlds at this moment. The plot suggests that Westworld is a one-off... otherwise Ford would not be able to protect it all from destruction. The intellectual property seems, so far, confined to the park itself.
Well, the show emphasizes too much on clever and misleading scenes as well as style. Burning the tent down might be okay for Maeve, she doesn't feel pain the way we do, but Hector certainly does. Then there is the extremely misleading jumps between scenes in different timelines. I am most irritated by Dolores, who seems to have a past trip mixed with a present trip to the same target and, to make it worse, is taking out of the past trip to be examined or whatever only to have then a conversation with someone examining her in the future. That's just intentionally fucking with the audience...
On November 29 2016 03:28 Faun wrote: Guys, this is - alongside The Wire, Twinpeaks and Fargo - one of the absolute best american TV shows, miles and miles ahead of GoT and lightyears better than LOST.
It's a rare, mystifying puzzle that has confronted me with a number of engaging, mostly clever and "new" scenarios. Yeah, sometimes it's a little heavy handed and no, it isn't a philosophical exegesis of sentience (it's HBO afterall). But still, rarely has the shattering of the narrative made as much sense as here, and rarely has it been as rewarding to put the pieces back together (not unlike Memento, which is by far the best movie the Nolans have made). To all those complaining that they cheated with the timelines etc. Ofc they did, but justifiably so. When we follow Dolores' journey in the show, we also explore the concept of artificial memory. If there is no difference between present experiences and stored memories (which would most likely be the case if we were to build a.i. running on mostly traditional computers), time itself loses meaning. So Dolores got somehow sent on a trip down memory lane (maybe by the M.I.B. in the barn) and is only slowly becoming aware of that fact - just like the viewer, who is put into her perspective and thus deserves to be deceived. Then there is Maeves storyline (which might even end up as nothing more than that - a storyline): Yes, they do humanise her a little too much (I would have hoped they somehow could've focused on a conflict between her "cold", awakening intelligence and her programmed appearance of humanity) and yes her interactions with Felix and Sylvester weren't all that compelling. But take Felix for example: What do we know of him? He works in the basement of a giant facility doing the bloody work of a butcher, while being payed a shit wage. And then out of nowhere Maeve appears, making him the center of her attention. Could she maybe, possibly be what Felix perceives as awake? How couldn't he fall in love with her, how couldn't very little matter more to him than to preserve that life, see it grow... not a groundbreaking story, but not a shallow one either. Or William, he isn't a character with a deep, interesting persona (I dont get the obsession Americans in general seem to have with 3d characters, even David Foster Wallace kept going on about them..) but he beautifully illustrates humanity's cultural path into gaming (without being judgemental of that path in anyway). Especially here on a gaming forum I would've expected to find more appreciation for the playful way behavioral patterns, that games tend to bring out, were referenced. When William snuffs out the life of the young soldier on the beach for example, that seems to be an action, that doesn't make sense. How can he just kill someone, if he has fallen in love with a robot? Well, at this point William wants to be with Dolores and her alone. If I were experiencing a really compelling love/adventure/sex etc. roleplay, I also wouldn't want to get distracted by a third party (in a video game I would try to get to the "fun part"). Now the show isn't telling us that this is morally wrong (I really don't think it is), it simply shows how an everyman like William would adopt constantly shifting perspectives in a place like Westworld. So this show is entertaining, clever, and very satisfying to unravel, what is there not to love? Btw a good mystery puzzle-story (which Lost wasn't, and this show up to ep 9 most definitely was) is very hard to do, and should be appreciated simply for being "a good mystery".
If you think this and Twin Peaks are good shows. You should definitely watch this:
Amazing doesn't even begin to describe how good this show actually is (think Twin Peaks meets John Carpenter's The Thing).
Haha, when i do write something in english, I try to maximize my fancy word count, just to extend my vocabulary. Looked the word up again, yep wrongly used!
Amazing doesn't even begin to describe how good this show actually is
I wholeheartedly agree (was talking about other american shows in the other post). Another (pretty old) take on the mystery genre is "The Kingdom". It's unfished, but easily Lars von Triers most accessible work and a supreme parody of hospital shows... I'm super excited for the 3rd season of Twin Peaks next year, supposedly they gave Mr Lynch free reign this time. Could be glorious (I'm still in love with Cooper)
I am most irritated by Dolores, who seems to have a past trip mixed with a present trip to the same target and, to make it worse, is taking out of the past trip to be examined or whatever only to have then a conversation with someone examining her in the future. That's just intentionally fucking with the audience...
Well, it doesn't seem to be all that unclear. First Dolores tries the mave when Arnold is still alive (Arnold is easily identifiable by his clothes). Then Dolores goes on a trip with William (it isn't 100 % clear, that she actually finds the maze in this timeframe as the city is buried). In the present time frame Dolores memory gets triggered (most likely by the MIB, "Let's get ourselves reacquainted") and then she recalls her adventure with William. In this timeframe she gets pulled out in Pariah to be interviewed by Ford. For Dolores it is hardly possible to differentiate between memory and present (what would the difference even be, if memories didn't decay..). So for the audience it was a little confusing for the most part as well. But if you actually payed attention, there were a lot of visual clues that made it pretty easy to identify the different timeframes (and why they were used). This is a puzzle (and if you dont enjoy puzzles, ignore the show, but dont claim it's bad), but a puzzle with a narrative foundation.
The biggest mystery for me so far is Bernard getting rid of Elsie. After all, she was onto the plot of stealing the stories, so actually helping Ford against the planned takeover. Why take her out?
On November 29 2016 12:15 Manit0u wrote: The biggest mystery for me so far is Bernard getting rid of Elsie. After all, she was onto the plot of stealing the stories, so actually helping Ford against the planned takeover. Why take her out?
EPT
when i do write something in english, I try to maximize my fancy word count, just to extend my vocabulary. Looked the word up again, yep wrongly used!
