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On January 04 2016 09:56 Lebesgue wrote:Show nested quote +On January 04 2016 09:42 FuzzyJAM wrote:
I still think the best way you can have a good villain in the next movie is if Rey fucks shit up, kills Snoke, proclaims herself Empress and becomes the antagonist of a reformed Kylo for the third film. I'm not sure how else you set up a Rey/Kylo duel where the victory (a) goes to the goodies and (b) is a satisfying overcoming of an obstacle. Yes, yes, Kylo was injured, but we've still seen him lose to her the first time she touched a lightsaber, so unless a huge deal is made about how much stronger he now is, it's not going to be great if he's the dark lord the hero defeats.
Of course, there are a few ways that Kylo could be made to be seen as a real threat again, or we could have another villain, or maybe we're done with lightsaber battles. . .meh. Two films to go, I guess. We'll see how they work it. The problem is that in the movie is no coherent story progression. It really feels everything is glued together just for the sake of showing u a new world, bringing old characters in, some "cool fights". Rey's character is just the clearest evidence of that. JJ Abrams should have played KOTOR I and II to learn how to write a cool story in SW world.
I feel like this is borne out in the writers' talk here:. They sound so much more concerned with crowd-pleasing character introductions than with writing a good story, like they are really just throwing everything around to fit with bringing back characters.
Also evinced in replacing the main screenwriter half-way through. It seems pretty clear that they didn't have a clear storytelling direction. It sort of explains how utter dumbness like everything about Starkiller Base makes its way to a final movie.
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Japan11286 Posts
I don't know why anyone would criticize Snoke's CGI when he's a hologram...
On January 04 2016 08:28 CobaltBlu wrote:
You know how Obi-Wan taught Luke to deflect blaster bolts? He blocks his vision and says "Stretch out with your feelings". This is how it works in Star Wars.
If I remember correctly, Luke was already practicing blaster deflection without the force before Obi-wan told him how pros do it. Obi-wan taught him how deflect first then how to tap into the force.
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IIRC Luke got zapped in the face by a training droid repeatedly until Obi Wan let him in on the big secret of using his feelings/ The Force and he suddenly got the hang of it.
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On January 04 2016 05:41 Volband wrote:Show nested quote +On January 04 2016 05:10 palexhur wrote:On January 04 2016 02:15 Volband wrote:On January 04 2016 02:01 palexhur wrote:On January 04 2016 01:34 Volband wrote:Oh, the cringe of 9gag, where people use or pretend to be kids in hopes to somehow strengthen their opinion. "I'm only 10 years old but I think TFA lacked depth, and tried to cover it with action scenes. I was much more interested in the politics than some fancy X-Wing action. Am I the only one ????!!!!!!" or "I brought my 10 years old kid with me to watch TFA in the movies. I did not like it, but tried my best not to show it to him. After the movie, he grabbed me by the arm and said: dad, this movie was terrible. I want to go home and rewatch the OT instead, because it's just so much better." *Siiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhh* Just... don't. On January 04 2016 01:33 trulojucreathrma.com wrote:
Rey being trained and mind-wiped, that I estimate 20/80 against. Makes sense, but not very likely because the things it fixes aren't seen as problems. More likely Rey is just a Mary Sue. That's just needed because we can't have fumbling panicked people today in Hollywood blockbusters. Everyone the audience has to care for is already overly perfect.They already want Finn to suddenly be a bad-ass. If he can do what he can, what can a force sensitive future Jedi do? I want statistics about how many people googled Mary Sue after TFA and started to include it in their dictionary. If people think Rey is a Mary Sue, then it won't need much time for that term to lose all of its meaning. I just googled the term and She is a Mary Sue in Chaper VII. Good. Please, keep using it from now on, and in 10 years time, whenever a character in a movie does something cool, like shooting a bad guy, half of the audience will go "omfg, another Mary Sue... I should've known. They are everywhere!!!" Lol I wont use shit because you said to me, but keep coming ........ just figure out what the dots are for ,hf. I was just trying to help you to become even more of an embodiment of the senseless, rage-driven fella. It would be great if the likes of you would start misusing terms like Mary Sue, so it wouldn't even be needed to correct you, because everyone could just add 1+1 together based on your posts that you are just hoarding all kinds of shit together, because you just can't stand the existence of TFA, so you take anything you can. Basically you are your own parody, but don't keep it up because I said so, I'm sure you would've done it anyway.
this just confirm that you are the exact representation of those dots, so bad now you just bored me to death, have fun.
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Finally saw it today and somewhat agree with what people are usually criticizing.
It was an okay movie and I feel it's being somewhat over-hyped. It has some hard flaws for me to overlook. Mostly being way too much copied on a new hope, some cringing nostalgia/fan service and some plot annoyances like Rei's sudden knowledge or everyone agreeing on a crappy plan from a total stranger after a 5min meeting, things like that that I could have overlooked if I didn't felt I was simply getting an already known plot.
Despite this in the end it was entertaining and better than Ep 1-2-3 so I guess that's a good start and worth the 7$ I paid for it. Its a bit disappointing because I think I remember JJAbrams making a better job at rebooting Star Trek.
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On January 04 2016 11:58 c3rberUs wrote:
I don't know why anyone would criticize Snoke's CGI when he's a hologram...
Because he looks like a hologram of a CGI character?
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On January 04 2016 15:33 rezoacken wrote:
Despite this in the end it was entertaining and better than Ep 1-2-3 so I guess that's a good start and worth the 7$ I paid for it. Its a bit disappointing because I think I remember JJAbrams making a better job at rebooting Star Trek.
You do remember correctly. The rebooted Star Trek is great. And I hate the original Star Treks
I just went and saw it again. A few things stick out and my opinion has changed somewhat regarding Rey.
All her mech knowledge is fine to me. Even her repairs on the Falcon and all the shit she did on Starkiller Base. The girl spent her whole life scavenging Imperial crap and the First Order is not much different. The Star Wars universe is also in a technological stasis. There's virtually no major advancements in tech over the centuries. Even the Death Star and its 2 copies are not new. So her being able to do what she did on Starkiller Base after escaping is fine. Shes been surrounded by that stuff her whole life.
Piloting skills are garbage. She has AT MOST driven a speeder bike. Bullshit that she could pull that crap off.
Force Sensitivity does not make you a master pilot. Anakin Skywalker could pod race because he was force sensitive and practised doing it. His first pod race wasn't the bonta eve classic. Most of his flight to the droid control ship was spent on auto pilot and him crashing into the hanger was a result of him being a bad, inexperienced pilot that got shot down. His experience as a pod racer helps him navigate through the hanger and point blank range with a high end starfighter on a whatever the fuck that was that's 5 times the size of his ship and even a stormtrooper could make that shot. His flying ability is practised and his force sensitivity enhances it. Rey just jumps into the Falcon and is pulling stupid shit like gravity assisted free falling u-turns to line up a shot for a stationary gun emplacement against a TIE Fighter. Looks bad ass but is really just half assed writing.
Her and Finn's duel with Ren is fine. She's a fighter. I hope they write her a double bladed lightsaber. That would make me very happy.
I now agree Ren was playing with his food. Right after Finn scores a hit on Ren's shoulder, his attacks become more potent. He goes right in for the kill first chance he gets. Finn should be dead but poor writing will save his life. Reys mind read thing, for lightsaber combat I guess, shouldn't work. Even after the Bowcaster shot (that sent stormtroops flying ten feet backwards on hits and 5 feet upwards on misses at the feet of them.... more bad writing) and the glancing strike Finn got in I do not think she should have been able to mind rape Ren that easily. Would have been a better fight if she just won a close duel. Instead she gets beat then mind rapes ren then physicaly rapes Ren. Then the planet splits because the writing in the movie is just fucking awful and lazy.
I also forgot how awesome that panoramic scene with Finn shooting stormtroopers while Poe is obliterating TIE's in the air was. Or maybe because I watched it in IMAX this time it seemed more awesome.
Anyways. All I wanted to add lol
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You really should watch the old movies again and tell us how every second scene is awful writing as well, because by those standards it certainly is.
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Saw it during the holidays and I think it's a good movie. I'm looking forward to the rest of the movies and that's more than I hoped for. I just don't get why Rei is so powerful. I'm okay with Kylo Ren/Ben not being a super badass for now, he is still young and his training isn't finished. They are building him up, that's okay. Luke wasn't all powerful at the start too.
But freaking Rei can already mind control people and overpower Ben right after awakening the force and then proceeds to kick his ass in a light saber duel when it's the first time she holds one. Not sure what will happen, how is any future fight between them supposed to be exciting after she gets training from Luke? (90% Luke is her father btw, but that still should not make her that much more powerful than Ben, they are both Anakin's grand children.)
Well I will trust that they have something in store for us, loved the rest of the movie and scenes like Poe destrying TIE fighters in his X-Wing were awesome  .
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On January 04 2016 09:29 Lebesgue wrote:Show nested quote +On January 04 2016 09:01 AlgeriaT wrote:
So does anyone besides me hate Snoke?
The CGI doesn't cut it. Couldn't they just have used a live actor?
And his blown up size just feels like an arbitrary gimmick, making those scenes stick out from the rest of the movie in a really bad way.
To top it off, he just looks way, way too much like Gollum. Which, with Andy Serkis playing the part, makes his appearance feel like a weird joke-crossover to LotR. At the same time, the CGI combined with the ambiance of that huge room also gives the impression of a totally non sequitur nod to the navigator room in Prometheus. Too many strange design choices here.
And then there's of course the name. "Snoke", wtf? I don't give a crap if he was called that in some of the books. The name is simply stupid. Sounds anything but evil, like a cartoon dog or something. It would have been a fitting name for that blue flying thing that initially owns Anakin in Ep. I. Or Jar-Jar.
JJ, please. This dude is supposed to be the most evil character in the whole movie. It's an important role. Look at The Emperor. That's how you do it. This is shit. The Snoke scenes stung my eye like a freaking toothpick jammed all the way in to the optic nerve. In an otherwise pretty cool movie, as far beyond Episodes I-III as anyone could have realistically hoped.
Am I alone in my nerd rage here? I'm with you on that one. I am still scratching my had why the hell they make his hologram (or whatever it was) so huge. Maybe so we understand that "this is a really bad guy who is in charge"? And yeah, he really does look like the navigator from Prometheus, that was my first thought I saw Snoke. Finally, the same is anything but memorable. I could call a pet with this name. Two additional really disappointing parts: 1. Kylo Ren was badass as long as he was wearing a mask. As soon as he took it off he, his character quickly went down the shitter. We saw a young Severus Snape from Harry Potter who is nothing but a clueless teenager. He is just pathetic. So in the end we have a movie about two completely clueless teenagers (Kylo Ren and Rey) 2. Rey character. No development. She is goddamn best in everything. Incredible pilot, incredible mechanic, stronger in force without any training than Kylo Ren, better in lightsaber duels than Kylo Ren. She just say "oh, force", and then beats the crap out of Kylo Ren. Are you for real!? Where is her development as a character? Luke was trained by Obi-Wan and Yoda. And he progressed so fast because he was exceptionally gifted. Other Jedi are trained since young kids. And here we have a character who suddenly wields the force with no training whatsoever. It feels like they wanted to make a cooler version of young Luke and they way overdid it. My verdict: Nice cinematography, decent acting, Micheal-Bay type of a plot, and lack of originality in every aspect.
This is also my opinion.
I'd even go as far as to say that Kylo Ren is an even worse character than Jar Jar, more for comic relief than evil bad guy, and Rey is even more OP than Protoss deathballs without anyone having to teach her how to 1a. Luke was an interesting character, because he started weak, e.g. got trashed by a tusken raider and had to get saved by Obi Wan. Only under the guidance of Obi Wan did he managed to become not-terrible, but until Yoda trained him he was still a Silver league scrub and not in any way strong enough to fight Darth Vader.
Add to it that the whole story is... very nonsensical, with the deathstar-planet (deathplanet?) and all that, and you end up with a movie that only gets carried by Harrison Ford, the decent acting of his supporting actors and the well paced action.
It's not terrible, it's just not great either. I don't understand why people hype it so much.
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Yes Kylo Ren 100% is for comic relief only and it's even worse executed than Jar Jar.
Do you guys even read what you write? Do you really believe it? It's amazing how stupid these comments are tbh
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On January 04 2016 21:28 The_Red_Viper wrote:
You really should watch the old movies again and tell us how every second scene is awful writing as well, because by those standards it certainly is.
Just no. ANH is undoubtedly better written than TFA.
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On January 04 2016 22:04 kwizach wrote:Show nested quote +On January 04 2016 21:28 The_Red_Viper wrote:
You really should watch the old movies again and tell us how every second scene is awful writing as well, because by those standards it certainly is. Just no. ANH is undoubtedly better written than TFA.
Asbolutely. The deathstar's weakness is my favorite part
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On January 04 2016 22:13 The_Red_Viper wrote:Show nested quote +On January 04 2016 22:04 kwizach wrote:On January 04 2016 21:28 The_Red_Viper wrote:
You really should watch the old movies again and tell us how every second scene is awful writing as well, because by those standards it certainly is. Just no. ANH is undoubtedly better written than TFA. Asbolutely. The deathstar's weakness is my favorite part
There's a difference between having no flaw in the script whatsoever and being as poorly written as another movie. Is the script of ANH flawless? No. Is it still miles ahead of TFA? Yes.
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On January 04 2016 22:16 kwizach wrote:Show nested quote +On January 04 2016 22:13 The_Red_Viper wrote:On January 04 2016 22:04 kwizach wrote:On January 04 2016 21:28 The_Red_Viper wrote:
You really should watch the old movies again and tell us how every second scene is awful writing as well, because by those standards it certainly is. Just no. ANH is undoubtedly better written than TFA. Asbolutely. The deathstar's weakness is my favorite part There's a difference between having no flaw in the script whatsoever and being as poorly written as another movie. Is the script of ANH flawless? No. Is it still miles ahead of TFA? Yes.
Well you saying so makes it true obviously. I doubt there would be any meaningful discussion here so i won't even try to "analyze" the old movies.
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On January 04 2016 22:22 The_Red_Viper wrote:Show nested quote +On January 04 2016 22:16 kwizach wrote:On January 04 2016 22:13 The_Red_Viper wrote:On January 04 2016 22:04 kwizach wrote:On January 04 2016 21:28 The_Red_Viper wrote:
You really should watch the old movies again and tell us how every second scene is awful writing as well, because by those standards it certainly is. Just no. ANH is undoubtedly better written than TFA. Asbolutely. The deathstar's weakness is my favorite part There's a difference between having no flaw in the script whatsoever and being as poorly written as another movie. Is the script of ANH flawless? No. Is it still miles ahead of TFA? Yes. Well you saying so makes it true obviously. I doubt there would be any meaningful discussion here so i won't even try to "analyze" the old movies.
I have extensively detailed the many flaws I see in the script of TFA in this thread. The two simply do not compare.
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On January 04 2016 22:13 The_Red_Viper wrote:Show nested quote +On January 04 2016 22:04 kwizach wrote:On January 04 2016 21:28 The_Red_Viper wrote:
You really should watch the old movies again and tell us how every second scene is awful writing as well, because by those standards it certainly is. Just no. ANH is undoubtedly better written than TFA. Asbolutely. The deathstar's weakness is my favorite part
Hey, at least it required stealing the actual plans to the first Death Star to know where exactly to blow it up in a gimmicky shot in New Hope. I mean it's a lot easier to find a weakness when you have the entire schematic for a structure.
In TFA the bloody janitors know how to make the entire planet go kablooie.
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Flawless script. Flawless.
![[image loading]](http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2015/07/31/22/2AFF883300000578-3181775-image-a-22_1438378328160.jpg)
ANH is super stupid. They hid Luke Skywalker by giving him the same last name as his father. Death Star’s flaw: Hole in the side that leads directly to the reactor, very common on battle stations. Can’t be closed either, even after the Imperials figure out the plan. Tractor beam is powered down, no one notices. Apparently Imperials can’t open their own blast doors(also apparently shooting controls disables controls on the other side, who knew?) Storm Troopers wear helmets in their own, enclosed base to make sure that rebels can easily infiltrate it. Rebels are the worst, with all their leadership in one place to be easily blown up.
And I love it. But that script is all about style and should never be thought about to hard.
On January 04 2016 23:04 TheTenthDoc wrote:Show nested quote +On January 04 2016 22:13 The_Red_Viper wrote:On January 04 2016 22:04 kwizach wrote:On January 04 2016 21:28 The_Red_Viper wrote:
You really should watch the old movies again and tell us how every second scene is awful writing as well, because by those standards it certainly is. Just no. ANH is undoubtedly better written than TFA. Asbolutely. The deathstar's weakness is my favorite part Hey, at least it required stealing the actual plans to the first Death Star to know where exactly to blow it up in a gimmicky shot in New Hope. I mean it's a lot easier to find a weakness when you have the entire schematic for a structure. In TFA the bloody janitors know how to make the entire planet go kablooie.
That is sort of the joke. Han says "There is always a way to blow these up," and then they talk about how to shut down the big gun. Really their plan was to cripple the base, but it ends up blowing up. But the whole concept of a fighter blowing up a huge battle station by preforming a daring bombing run down a long "trench/hole" is super silly.
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On January 04 2016 21:28 The_Red_Viper wrote:
You really should watch the old movies again and tell us how every second scene is awful writing as well, because by those standards it certainly is.
I can't. Every second scene isn't terrible. Other than the silly death star weakness you have a solid movie with drama, good character development for both bad guys are good guys and a mostly coherent plot that has its plot devices origins explained in the movie. It does have its plot holes but the plot holes are not that huge of a deal. Graphics blow by our standards too but whatever. At the time they were amazing.
It's not Flawless but A New Hope is infinitely superior to its 2015 remake
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On January 04 2016 23:08 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On January 04 2016 23:04 TheTenthDoc wrote:On January 04 2016 22:13 The_Red_Viper wrote:On January 04 2016 22:04 kwizach wrote:On January 04 2016 21:28 The_Red_Viper wrote:
You really should watch the old movies again and tell us how every second scene is awful writing as well, because by those standards it certainly is. Just no. ANH is undoubtedly better written than TFA. Asbolutely. The deathstar's weakness is my favorite part Hey, at least it required stealing the actual plans to the first Death Star to know where exactly to blow it up in a gimmicky shot in New Hope. I mean it's a lot easier to find a weakness when you have the entire schematic for a structure. In TFA the bloody janitors know how to make the entire planet go kablooie. That is sort of the joke. Han says "There is always a way to blow these up," and then they talk about how to shut down the big gun. Really their plan was to cripple the base, but it ends up blowing up. But the whole concept of a fighter blowing up a huge battle station by preforming a daring bombing run down a long "trench/hole" is super silly.
Yeah, that's why RotJ is a better scenario than either TFA or ANH (or *shudder* the Phantom Menace blowing up the droid ship). I can believe that if you fly into the center of a moon-sized space ship you have a decent shot at blowing it up. The major problem is the whole "why not put the generator on the Death Star itself" that might be handwaved at some point, probably is in the EU somewhere.
I guess the engineers that figured out how to make the second Death Star require a shot directly into its core must have been asploded when it died so all they had was the idiots that made the first one. Honestly I'd rather deal with Starkiller Base than five Death Star 2.0s.
It does fit with the EU canon that (I think) still stands about how the Empire was absolutely terrible with managing their finances and scraping the bottom of the barrel. Not that that pardons the ANH script which doesn't tell us that at all.
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EPT
