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[The Summit 4] LAN Finals Day 1 - Page 10

Forum Index > Dota 2 Tournaments
Post a Reply
Prev 1 8 9 10 11 12 32 Next All
TomatoBisque
Profile Joined March 2013
United States6290 Posts
December 09 2015 21:57 GMT
#181
On December 10 2015 06:55 GumBa wrote:
Was game 1 good?

If you like watching China lose yeah
rip
DucK-
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Singapore11447 Posts
December 09 2015 22:00 GMT
#182
On December 10 2015 06:49 Dracolich70 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 10 2015 05:23 DucK- wrote:
On December 10 2015 05:10 Dracolich70 wrote:
Not sure why some think OG are dependant on patch. They are probably the team to be least dependant on patch.


If you look at their drafting style, you can see how similar they are to Alliance 2013. There is a fixed pattern.

For example:

1) If they are FP, they ban any heroes except Doom/SF/Wisp. They may 2nd ban Doom only if opponent doesn't first ban SF or Wisp. This way, it guarantees them always either of this 3 heroes, while they can control whether or not Doom is given away.

2) They often leave their mid and carry to 4th/5th pick. Their first 3 picks are generally flexible supports. This opens them to adapt and punish via Huskar/Meepo/PL/AM.

For a team so reliant on drafting with a rigid pattern, a patch can shake everything up easily.
They draft according to what they are comfortable with in this patch, but even in similar drafts they play it totally differently, and they will also swap heroes to other players.

Fact of the matter is they have a plethora of strategies, and it doesn't depend on heroes picked, thus patch is totally irrelevant. They are comfortable in playing a farm game, early to mid push, split push, counter push, 4 prot 1, 5 man. They have great team fight communication, and understand itemization and the timings.


A big part of their arsenal is how teams fear their Meepo/Huskar 4th/5th picks, which means they often get free 2nd phase bans. It also allows them to draft around this. A new patch may make Meepo/Huskar irrelevant, and their drafting approach may no longer be effective. For example, they may have to secure cores earlier, which gives their opponents time to prepare.

So yes they do play a wide variety of strategies unlike Alliance 2013, but the major component of their success so far has been more due to their drafting edge.
Diavlo
Profile Joined July 2011
Belgium2915 Posts
December 09 2015 22:03 GMT
#183
On December 10 2015 06:49 Dracolich70 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 10 2015 05:23 DucK- wrote:
On December 10 2015 05:10 Dracolich70 wrote:
Not sure why some think OG are dependant on patch. They are probably the team to be least dependant on patch.


If you look at their drafting style, you can see how similar they are to Alliance 2013. There is a fixed pattern.

For example:

1) If they are FP, they ban any heroes except Doom/SF/Wisp. They may 2nd ban Doom only if opponent doesn't first ban SF or Wisp. This way, it guarantees them always either of this 3 heroes, while they can control whether or not Doom is given away.

2) They often leave their mid and carry to 4th/5th pick. Their first 3 picks are generally flexible supports. This opens them to adapt and punish via Huskar/Meepo/PL/AM.

For a team so reliant on drafting with a rigid pattern, a patch can shake everything up easily.
They draft according to what they are comfortable with in this patch, but even in similar drafts they play it totally differently, and they will also swap heroes to other players.

Fact of the matter is they have a plethora of strategies, and it doesn't depend on heroes picked, thus patch is totally irrelevant. They are comfortable in playing a farm game, early to mid push, split push, counter push, 4 prot 1, 5 man. They have great team fight communication, and understand itemization and the timings.

They still rely on a pretty small set of heroes, it's not particularly bad and it doesn't mean they will falter when the heroes they play get nerfed but you can't say that patches are irrelevant. Every team got hit by patches and some fell off drastically afterwards. OG have played one patch as a team, they might not be as successful in the next one or they might be even better we don't know.
"I don't know how many years on this Earth I got left. I'm gonna get real weird with it."
spudde123
Profile Joined February 2012
4814 Posts
December 09 2015 22:03 GMT
#184
On December 10 2015 06:53 Dracolich70 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 10 2015 06:50 Sn0_Man wrote:
Fact of the matter is wait until a team has played on more than one patch before you declare patch relevant or irrelevant
also fact of the matter is OG aint playing atm lets discuss CHINA IN FLAMES AZARKON IS DOING IT
They have played two patches already. They have by far the most games by any post TI. I have watched 95% of them.

Patch is irrelevant because they are not dependant on heroes to pick strategies.


In the previous patch they played zero LANs and made it through 1 out of 3 qualifiers they played. It's hardly big evidence.

Not that I think they will somehow crumble but at this time I don't really hold them as the big favorite to win the next major either.
Verniy
Profile Joined May 2015
Canada3360 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-12-09 22:04:58
December 09 2015 22:04 GMT
#185
halfway through second phase and doom isn't picked or banned
are we sure this is 6.85?

edit: alright nevermind there he is
Heaven's Halberd is the most criminally underbought item in Dota. Together we can stop this.
DucK-
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Singapore11447 Posts
December 09 2015 22:06 GMT
#186
OK VENGE PICKED VICI LOSS
Spicy_Curry
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States10573 Posts
December 09 2015 22:06 GMT
#187
vg with the venge carry deny pick
High Risk Low Reward
Sn0_Man
Profile Blog Joined October 2012
Tebellong44238 Posts
December 09 2015 22:07 GMT
#188
Venge really isn't an autolose hero
although it could use some tender icefrog lovin
LiquidDota StaffSCIENTISTS BAFFLED | 3275929302
SKC
Profile Joined October 2010
Brazil18828 Posts
December 09 2015 22:09 GMT
#189
VP has a 60% winrate with the hero but people still say its an insta-loss when they pick it.
wooozy
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
3813 Posts
December 09 2015 22:09 GMT
#190
burning venge here we go boys
Asha
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom38255 Posts
December 09 2015 22:09 GMT
#191
Burning Venge hahaha
Verniy
Profile Joined May 2015
Canada3360 Posts
December 09 2015 22:09 GMT
#192
okay burning venge i think VG lost
first ever burning venge in the history of dota 2
Heaven's Halberd is the most criminally underbought item in Dota. Together we can stop this.
Sn0_Man
Profile Blog Joined October 2012
Tebellong44238 Posts
December 09 2015 22:09 GMT
#193
OP shadowshaman lastpick boys
LiquidDota StaffSCIENTISTS BAFFLED | 3275929302
TomatoBisque
Profile Joined March 2013
United States6290 Posts
December 09 2015 22:09 GMT
#194
This is some bannedtwitchmeme shit
rip
plasmidghost
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
Belgium16168 Posts
December 09 2015 22:10 GMT
#195
Yeah picking carry Venge against the only pro team that regularly plays it, gg VG enjoy your spot in the losers bracket
Yugoslavia will always live on in my heart
Artisreal
Profile Joined June 2009
Germany9235 Posts
December 09 2015 22:10 GMT
#196
Everyone says VG lost. I suppose they are going to stomp hard now thanks to all the negative Karma here!
passive quaranstream fan
stuchiu
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
Fiddler's Green42661 Posts
December 09 2015 22:11 GMT
#197
oh shit fy
Moderator
Sn0_Man
Profile Blog Joined October 2012
Tebellong44238 Posts
December 09 2015 22:11 GMT
#198
On December 10 2015 07:10 Artisreal wrote:
Everyone says VG lost. I suppose they are going to stomp hard now thanks to all the negative Karma here!

?
shadow shaman hero
LiquidDota StaffSCIENTISTS BAFFLED | 3275929302
TomatoBisque
Profile Joined March 2013
United States6290 Posts
December 09 2015 22:13 GMT
#199
Honestly it'll be great if VP lose to carry venge
rip
Sn0_Man
Profile Blog Joined October 2012
Tebellong44238 Posts
December 09 2015 22:13 GMT
#200
yepyep this is some good shit
LiquidDota StaffSCIENTISTS BAFFLED | 3275929302
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