EPTOn August 09 2015 12:24 FHDH wrote:
I, also, hate American infrastructure /angryface
I, also, hate American infrastructure /angryface
Sad thing for the players is that many countries consider competition earnings to be non-taxable.
[TI5] Main Event Day 6 - Page 355
| Forum Index > Dota 2 Tournaments |
A few USA chants are fine but please don't do it too much. Stop the stupid USA arguments, thanks. On another note, CDEC flairs are now live. Sorry about the delay on that. | ||
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WolfintheSheep
Canada14127 Posts
Sad thing for the players is that many countries consider competition earnings to be non-taxable. | ||
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nothingmuch
448 Posts
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FHDH
United States7023 Posts
On August 09 2015 12:29 WolfintheSheep wrote: Sad thing for the players is that many countries consider competition earnings to be non-taxable. Well it's a real job here in the US like any other so those must be governments that breed losers tbqh | ||
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FairForever
Canada2392 Posts
On August 09 2015 12:28 FiWiFaKi wrote: A bit off topic, but what are your costs to simply move a company elsewhere for lower tax rates? Considering it doesn't really matter where Valve is located to do their work. There are rules against such inversions that now come into play, after the Burger King / Tim Hortons inversion moving the company to Canada. At the end of the day though, assuming the event is held in the U.S., even if you managed to somehow make Valve a non-U.S. company it would still be taxed on its earnings relating to its permanent establishment in the United States, which could be argued to be most if not all of the income relating to The International. | ||
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Krishan.bif
Philippines491 Posts
![[image loading]](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CL7ve0AXAAAX2v0.png) | ||
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FairForever
Canada2392 Posts
On August 09 2015 12:31 FHDH wrote: Well it's a real job here in the US like any other so those must be governments that breed losers tbqh Agreed - it's hard to argue that it should be non-taxable. It's a job (albeit with high possibility of very little to no income). | ||
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FHDH
United States7023 Posts
On August 09 2015 12:31 Krishan.bif wrote: Grats fear y u do this  | ||
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FiWiFaKi
Canada9858 Posts
On August 09 2015 12:28 Yurie wrote: Pure player numbers isn't the only factor. Just as important is the question on how rich they are and if they are willing to spend money. If you can change those % with the same amount of players the money goes up. Getting more players is probably more realistic though. Yes, that's what they did this year. They increased the extra spending to the prize pool per player by giving more hats, more time, etc. But even then, they went from 9.4mil added, to 16.5mil added. So this 75% increase is in part to milking it more, and the 10%~ higher player base. However, last year to me there seemed to be a lot of wasted potential, while this year I felt like they milked it quite hard, and don't think they can top that by any significant amount. If the player base stays more or less the same, or goes up <20%, the hype will be lower with all the majors, and if it doesn't seem like there will be a new esports record, people wont be as motivated to spend money. It's very possible that the overall sum is greater for the majors + TI, but TI5 > TI6 prize pool is my prediction. | ||
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Rebs
Pakistan10726 Posts
On August 09 2015 12:28 FiWiFaKi wrote: A bit off topic, but what are your costs to simply move a company elsewhere for lower tax rates? Considering it doesn't really matter where Valve is located to do their work. Well not much you can incoprorate wherever and work wherever and maybe save some, but then you are just taking on the the IRS and they will find a way to needle you then. Its not worth it in the long run. Burger King for example bought out Timmy Ho's and incoporated in Canada to get about 2-300 million in tax breaks. And then the IRS started being dicks and auditing them, tax dodging is kind of a dick move and they will find ways to tax you in other ways. TL:DR inversion .. dont do it | ||
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FairForever
Canada2392 Posts
On August 09 2015 12:26 Rebs wrote: Doesnt matter, the company is incorporated in the US. You can hold the event wherever. Majors will probably have alot of outsourcing so then taxation will vary based on whose resources are being employed for what. This is not completely true. You could theoretically incorporate in another jurisdiction which then runs its own event. Tax treaties should generally also prevent double taxation to the extent you have income relating to majors hosted outside of the United States. And you can pay low tax rates in another jurisdiction - but you will still get hit on the way in when you try to repatriate the funds into the United States. So unless they continually reinvest in such low-tax jurisdiction, there will be problems. | ||
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FiWiFaKi
Canada9858 Posts
On August 09 2015 12:31 FairForever wrote: There are rules against such inversions that now come into play, after the Burger King / Tim Hortons inversion moving the company to Canada. At the end of the day though, assuming the event is held in the U.S., even if you managed to somehow make Valve a non-U.S. company it would still be taxed on its earnings relating to its permanent establishment in the United States, which could be argued to be most if not all of the income relating to The International. You don't happen to have a pdf I could read about some of the law regarding this? I'm quite curious. Like they could just host TI in a different country also... And curious to see how much power the government has over the large corporations. | ||
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plasmidghost
Belgium16168 Posts
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FairForever
Canada2392 Posts
On August 09 2015 12:34 FiWiFaKi wrote: You don't happen to have a pdf I could read about some of the law regarding this? I'm quite curious. Like they could just host TI in a different country also... And curious to see how much power the government has over the large corporations. I'm not a U.S. tax expert (I am a Canadian tax expert, though obviously I deal with a lot of multinational companies). They could theoretically host TI in a different country and not pay U.S. tax - but at the end of the day, either you've set up a branch in the non-U.S. jurisdiction (for which you end up having to pay branch tax anyway), or you've set up a subsidiary corporation, which will be taxed at the rates of its local jurisdiction. However, when the subsidiary corporation tries to pay a dividend to the United States Valve company, it will get hit with a Dividend Withholding Tax which can be up to 30% in certain instances. And tax isn't everything. There are real business reasons for wanting to host the event in U.S. | ||
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FiWiFaKi
Canada9858 Posts
On August 09 2015 12:33 Rebs wrote: Well not much you can incoprorate wherever and work wherever and maybe save some, but then you are just taking on the the IRS and they will find a way to needle you then. Its not worth it in the long run. Burger King for example bought out Timmy Ho's and incoporated in Canada to get about 2-300 million in tax breaks. And then the IRS started being dicks and auditing them, tax dodging is kind of a dick move and they will find ways to tax you in other ways. TL:DR inversion .. dont do it Tax dodging might be a dick move, but if it can save you million of dollars within legality of the law, I don't blame you. At the end of the day, in the traditional economic sense, the goal of a company is to maximize their profits within legal means. Government makes sure that the actions to optimize efficiency are to the benefit of the society, and regulate from there. | ||
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infiniteJest
United States187 Posts
sumail and aui SO happy they left EG ppd must be feeling SO vindicated . . . | ||
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Rebs
Pakistan10726 Posts
On August 09 2015 12:33 FairForever wrote: This is not completely true. You could theoretically incorporate in another jurisdiction which then runs its own event. Tax treaties should generally also prevent double taxation to the extent you have income relating to majors hosted outside of the United States. And you can pay low tax rates in another jurisdiction - but you will still get hit on the way in when you try to repatriate the funds into the United States. So unless they continually reinvest in such low-tax jurisdiction, there will be problems. Yeah well its not profitable to do that anymore even if you dont bring any money back. http://www.wsj.com/articles/treasury-to-unveil-measures-to-combat-tax-inversions-1411421056 | ||
stuchiu
Fiddler's Green42661 Posts
On August 09 2015 12:36 infiniteJest wrote: rtz and zai must be SO salty right now giving up playing with universe,fear and ppd . . . sumail and aui SO happy they left EG ppd must be feeling SO vindicated . . . I just wanted someone to ask ppd if he had any callouts for former teammates :[ | ||
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dtz
5834 Posts
And felt like the analysts should have talked about the game after that. Surely mad and co had things to say about the game. Felt weird that they dissected every other series but not the final one. | ||
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FairForever
Canada2392 Posts
On August 09 2015 12:37 Rebs wrote: Yeah well its not profitable to do that anymore even if you dont bring any money back. http://www.wsj.com/articles/treasury-to-unveil-measures-to-combat-tax-inversions-1411421056 Correct that they came about after the Burger King - Tim Horton's inversion. I haven't read the legislation but my understanding is that these are supposed to combat phantom inversions. To the extent you're running an event in another jurisdiction that would not relevant in this situation. Many U.S. companies hold subsidiaries in non-U.S. jurisdictions in order to have operations in such stated jurisdictions. This would be an example of that. | ||
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WolfintheSheep
Canada14127 Posts
On August 09 2015 12:31 FairForever wrote: Agreed - it's hard to argue that it should be non-taxable. It's a job (albeit with high possibility of very little to no income). And that's exactly why it's not considered a job and non-taxable, and treated as windfall earnings. And some countries don't tax windfalls. | ||
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