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On August 11 2013 07:40 r.Evo wrote:Show nested quote +On August 11 2013 07:39 teapoted wrote:On August 11 2013 07:38 r.Evo wrote:On August 11 2013 07:36 TheYango wrote:
The thing that people are not respecting is how much of a gold disadvantage having double/triple buybacks on your position 1-3 heroes actually allows you to fight ridiculous high ground defense fights. If they splitpush a big creep wave into your tier 3, and then give up 3+ buybacks to hold their lane while you lose yours, that's actually a net gain for a split-push based team.
Even with an Alch double your net worth, you still don't win 7v5/8v5 fights on enemy high ground. Chinese teams are deathly aware of this because pushing high ground in 2009/2010 was a nightmare when there was no buyback CD and buybacks were cheaper, so even with 1 core, you'd still be trying to push through double/triple buybacks from the same hero.
People who have been watching the game that long should remember a certain LGD vs. EHOME game where LGD played a 5 intel hero comp against a Sniper + Shadowfiend dual core--the game was long over for them after Sniper and Shadowfiend got their items up, but they defended and Aegis+Cheese push with Storm's triple buyback. We just saw DK holding highground against a 20k+ gold advantage against probably the most aggressive team left in the tournament besides Na'Vi. It's just easy to forget. It's easy to forget when you have a bunch of preconceived notions. WE SHALL PERSEVERE THROUGH THE ARMIES OF UNEDUCATED DOTA GO TONGFU, IG IS TILTING, FINISH THEM OFF AND STOP BEING PUSSIES
Join us in the chant:
GO GO TONGFU
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On August 11 2013 07:40 Mataza wrote:Show nested quote +On August 11 2013 07:39 SilverStar wrote:
I don't feel the chemistry of iG. They all seem so unhappy. Rumors say they all hate each other or something.
I think it's between Chuan and Zhou.
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On August 11 2013 07:38 teapoted wrote:
I wonder what a pissed off iG will draft.
Looking at their pod, not very pleased.
What exactly is that? Don't just tease with information, you hoarder
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United States47024 Posts
On August 11 2013 07:40 maru~ wrote:Show nested quote +On August 11 2013 07:38 r.Evo wrote:On August 11 2013 07:36 TheYango wrote:
The thing that people are not respecting is how much of a gold disadvantage having double/triple buybacks on your position 1-3 heroes actually allows you to fight ridiculous high ground defense fights. If they splitpush a big creep wave into your tier 3, and then give up 3+ buybacks to hold their lane while you lose yours, that's actually a net gain for a split-push based team.
Even with an Alch double your net worth, you still don't win 7v5/8v5 fights on enemy high ground. Chinese teams are deathly aware of this because pushing high ground in 2009/2010 was a nightmare when there was no buyback CD and buybacks were cheaper, so even with 1 core, you'd still be trying to push through double/triple buybacks from the same hero.
People who have been watching the game that long should remember a certain LGD vs. EHOME game where LGD played a 5 intel hero comp against a Sniper + Shadowfiend dual core--the game was long over for them after Sniper and Shadowfiend got their items up, but they defended and Aegis+Cheese push with Storm's triple buyback. We just saw DK holding highground against a 20k+ gold advantage against probably the most aggressive team left in the tournament besides Na'Vi. It's just easy to forget. To be fair though, that was mostly Orange throwing.
And people would have called it Tongfu throwing as well if Tongfu tried to force a push through, lost to a double/triple buyback and lost a T3 tower or rax to Furion TPing to that lane and pushing after the won fight.
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On August 11 2013 07:40 Intact wrote:Show nested quote +On August 11 2013 07:37 4mgg wrote:On August 11 2013 07:35 Intact wrote:
Entire Dota world is excited for Alliance-Na'vi, gets trolled by 20 chinese guys playing no rush 60 min 4 games straight. Entire Dota world? SEA scene is nothing? And Orange isn't chinese. All this ignorance.. Just saying, showing these matches before Alliance and Na'vi is retarded by Valve, it getting way to late for most of Europe to watch their favorite teams.
Try waking up at 3am just to get to watch the games.
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Bearded Elder29904 Posts
Naga? Oh gawd iG... why u draft this.
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On August 11 2013 07:40 Intact wrote:Show nested quote +On August 11 2013 07:37 4mgg wrote:On August 11 2013 07:35 Intact wrote:
Entire Dota world is excited for Alliance-Na'vi, gets trolled by 20 chinese guys playing no rush 60 min 4 games straight. Entire Dota world? SEA scene is nothing? And Orange isn't chinese. All this ignorance.. Just saying, showing these matches before Alliance and Na'vi is retarded by Valve, it getting way to late for most of Europe to watch their favorite teams.
So the entire Dota scene revolves around Europe then? I've been up since 3am in the morning. its almost 7am in the morning right now. Please have respect for the people in Asia as well. We sacrifice a lot too.
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On August 11 2013 07:40 wurm wrote:
Post TI3 Chinese shuffle will be really interesting. iG have been on the rocks ever since their TI2 win. LGD had an early exit and a lot of DK players may be retiring.
LGD.cn will hold their roster intact.
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United Kingdom14464 Posts
LOL that camera man standing on one leg
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On August 11 2013 07:40 EchoZ wrote:YYF trying to keep the team together.
It literally looks like:
yyyy: YOU MOR
YYF: SHUTUP
xxxx: YOU FUCKING PIECE OF
YYF: SHUTUP
zzzz: HOW COULD YOU
YYF: SHUT UP ALL OF YOU
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On August 11 2013 07:41 TheYango wrote:Show nested quote +On August 11 2013 07:40 maru~ wrote:On August 11 2013 07:38 r.Evo wrote:On August 11 2013 07:36 TheYango wrote:
The thing that people are not respecting is how much of a gold disadvantage having double/triple buybacks on your position 1-3 heroes actually allows you to fight ridiculous high ground defense fights. If they splitpush a big creep wave into your tier 3, and then give up 3+ buybacks to hold their lane while you lose yours, that's actually a net gain for a split-push based team.
Even with an Alch double your net worth, you still don't win 7v5/8v5 fights on enemy high ground. Chinese teams are deathly aware of this because pushing high ground in 2009/2010 was a nightmare when there was no buyback CD and buybacks were cheaper, so even with 1 core, you'd still be trying to push through double/triple buybacks from the same hero.
People who have been watching the game that long should remember a certain LGD vs. EHOME game where LGD played a 5 intel hero comp against a Sniper + Shadowfiend dual core--the game was long over for them after Sniper and Shadowfiend got their items up, but they defended and Aegis+Cheese push with Storm's triple buyback. We just saw DK holding highground against a 20k+ gold advantage against probably the most aggressive team left in the tournament besides Na'Vi. It's just easy to forget. To be fair though, that was mostly Orange throwing. And people would have called it Tongfu throwing as well if Tongfu tried to force a push through, lost to a double/triple buyback and lost a T3 tower or rax to Furion TPing to that lane and pushing after the won fight.
To be honest, I think they HAD to do that.
But I also think IG massively misplayed that teamfight on several fronts, and should have won.
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On August 11 2013 07:40 Intact wrote:Show nested quote +On August 11 2013 07:37 4mgg wrote:On August 11 2013 07:35 Intact wrote:
Entire Dota world is excited for Alliance-Na'vi, gets trolled by 20 chinese guys playing no rush 60 min 4 games straight. Entire Dota world? SEA scene is nothing? And Orange isn't chinese. All this ignorance.. Just saying, showing these matches before Alliance and Na'vi is retarded by Valve, it getting way to late for most of Europe to watch their favorite teams.
Yeah...how dare they stick to their schedule and dont throw everything overboard because 2 western teams meet far into the tournament.
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I'm really not sure why there was so much bashing on that last game, I thought it was great to watch (and I'm a massive na'vi fanboy.) Some great highground defense and split pushing.
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On August 11 2013 07:40 Saryph wrote:Show nested quote +On August 11 2013 07:38 WindWolf wrote:
Tobi sounds weird in the client for me He sounds crazy sick on my stream.
Good that I'm not alone
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On August 11 2013 07:41 WindWolf wrote:Show nested quote +On August 11 2013 07:39 Mataza wrote:On August 11 2013 07:38 l3loodraven wrote:On August 11 2013 07:35 clusen wrote:
What's so special about a glados announcer? it would be a triumph We should make a note here: huge success. It would be hard to overstate our satisfaction
Aperture Dota
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United Kingdom24425 Posts
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Bearded Elder29904 Posts
ANTIMAGE AND NAIX?
FUCK IG FUCK
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On August 11 2013 07:42 r.Evo wrote:Show nested quote +On August 11 2013 07:40 EchoZ wrote:On August 11 2013 07:39 r.Evo wrote:
iG booth oh god. Oh god.
OH GAWD. YYF trying to keep the team together. It literally looks like: yyyy: YOU MOR YYF: SHUTUP xxxx: YOU FUCKING PIECE OF YYF: SHUTUP zzzz: HOW COULD YOU YYF: SHUT UP ALL OF YOU
replace yyyy/zzzz with Chuan.
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On August 11 2013 07:40 EchoZ wrote:YYF trying to keep the team together.
Hmm interesting, my pc cant handle having the booth camera up at the same time as the main stream, so it's interesting hearing how the players are reacting in there.
I guess that explains one of the reasons they aren't the same iG, chemistry and bonding is so important.
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On August 11 2013 07:40 dtz wrote:Show nested quote +On August 11 2013 07:36 TheYango wrote:
The thing that people are not respecting is how much having double/triple buybacks on your position 1-3 heroes actually allows you to fight ridiculous high ground defense fights. If they splitpush a big creep wave into your tier 3, and then give up 3+ buybacks to hold their lane while you lose yours, that's actually a net gain for a split-push based team.
Even with an Alch double your net worth, you still don't win 5v7/5v8 fights on enemy high ground. Chinese teams are deathly aware of this because pushing high ground in 2009/2010 was a nightmare when there was no buyback CD and buybacks were cheaper, so even with 1 core, you'd still be trying to push through double/triple buybacks from the same hero.
People who have been watching the game that long should remember a certain LGD vs. EHOME game where LGD played a 5 intel hero comp against a Sniper + Shadowfiend dual core--the game was long over for them after Sniper and Shadowfiend got their items up, but they defended and Aegis+Cheese push with Storm's triple buyback. Yeah actually i have thought that maybe it should be possible to buyback in the spot where you die because currently buyback is too big of a defender's advantage. Maybe if you buyback within 10 second then you can revive in the spot where you die or something. Will favor teams ending the games early and hitting a timing when they got a good advantage. Also promotes aggressive play in general. We might see 10v10 fights from early game. Haven't really thought about repercussions though so this might be a dumb idea. imo they should just get rid of buybacks altogether and give us more ways to spend our gold. I don't think buyback is a good mechanic.
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EPT
