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r.Evo
Germany14080 Posts
I disagreed with this paragraph because your argument makes no sense: Oh please, Undying only gain 0.75int more than Brew's. At level 11, he only has 100+ mana than Brewmaster, and he has 4 active spells that require 100+ mana each, one of them is spammable (hell, even his 2nd skill has less cd than Brew's stomp). Undying in no way have enough mana to use all the spells more than Brewmaster using his. If Undying can get mek, so can Brew. | ||
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Entertaining
Canada793 Posts
2 most common ways to play undying are: The 2-3 slot, getting phase boots vanguard, tanky items ect. and the 4-5 slot. Getting arcanes, mek and other utility items. you dont get mek on brew because he fights in his ulti form (cant use items) AND would be getting it late because he needs his blink first. its just too inconvenient. | ||
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evilfatsh1t
Australia8819 Posts
On November 18 2012 15:25 Entertaining wrote: mek is standard on undying. wtf is this argument. 2 most common ways to play undying are: The 2-3 slot, getting phase boots vanguard, tanky items ect. and the 4-5 slot. Getting arcanes, mek and other utility items. you dont get mek on brew because he fights in his ulti form (cant use items) AND would be getting it late because he needs his blink first. its just too inconvenient. the argument isnt how to build undying. canikizu is arguing that mek shouldnt be gotten as a replacement to every survivability item a semi-carry could get, simply because they could get it out faster and the team doesnt currently have one. after reading this whole argument again i find myself totally agreeing with canikizu and im sitting here wondering why the argument even started. there was hardly a conflict in opinions to start with, so we should all just drop it. mek can be gotten on semi carries if the situation calls or allows for it, but it isnt compulsory. ps. undying in the 4-5 position is terrible and should never be played like that ever. i dunno how you plan on getting arcanes and mek and "other utility items", when in fact, the price of these items are pretty much the same as your 2-3 position's item build. pps. if im wrong about this whole argument and what canikizu was trying to say then my apologies. it just seemed like some people wanted this thread to turn into a huge clusterfuck and started derailing the posts with irrelevant questions that led to an argument (me included). | ||
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Unleashing
Denmark14978 Posts
On November 18 2012 17:40 evilfatsh1t wrote: ps. undying in the 4-5 position is terrible and should never be played like that ever. i dunno how you plan on getting arcanes and mek and "other utility items", when in fact, the price of these items are pretty much the same as your 2-3 position's item build. I suppose the best teams in the world don't know how to play undying? OT: I have a question, do illusions from bat rider trigger napalm? I never tested that myself. | ||
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igotmyown
United States4291 Posts
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LAN-f34r
New Zealand2099 Posts
On November 17 2012 19:47 Qbek wrote: The CD is probably to prevent some abuses, maybe the steal happens before the real attack and you can animation cancel to steal a lot, email icefrog and ask! That would make sense. On November 18 2012 08:47 canikizu wrote: So would you really want to get mek on TA, Brewmaster, Puck, Magmus instead of blinkdagger? or mek on Invoker, qop, storm spirit instead of mana regen items? or mek on Night Stalker, Chaos Knight instead of tanky items? In theory, Mek is always a good items on everybody for the cost, noone can deny it, but semi-carry heroes are those who always need specific items to make them really shine, Going mek just because your team don't have it is not a good enough reason. He said most heroes, not all. Of course TA and brew etc need a blink. The thing is, a lot of those heroes would be itemizing a survivability item in the 1500-2500 gold range anyway (Vanguard, Hood, Janggo, etc.) TA and brew are not in the list of "a lot of those heroes". They don't build a cheap survival item (well, brew may get a drum). Mek is just a great item. If a carry is getting a cheap survivability item anyway, mek is a great choice. If you look at the list of semi-carries, and see ones that are both mana-independent (ie not nightstalker or brew) and item independent (don't need a blink dagger, don't need to build mana items), you have a list consisting of (almost all) good mek holders. Unrelated, qop mek doesn't seem all too bad. Must remember that next time I and experimenting with items on her (I can never figure out what that hero wants). | ||
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JumboJohnson
537 Posts
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whereismymind
United Kingdom717 Posts
I saw gameplay of Clinkz in this video: Can you please explain what is that moving of hero before he do LAST HIT? Like before last hit hero moves very "glitchy".. Is that combination of attack and hold? Question for TL: Do you use auto cast for Searing Arrows in fights versus another heroes? I saw this guy in video, he presses W and shoot. Isn't that very slow versus auto-cast? (I know you have mana problems if you use auto-cast all the time) Can you advice me how patient should I be in fights versus another heroes? I get burned very fast versus another heroes if I go 1v1, since I don't do much damage? What is my goal with Clinkz? Like hit very low health heroes and run? Any advices how to play this hero? thanks | ||
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Unleashing
Denmark14978 Posts
You only turn on auto cast in teamfights IMO, or when your mana regen outweighs your usage(This is very rarely) And if you don't do a lot of damage 1v1 as clinkz then something has gone wrong, when you orchid them and start focusing them down with strafe and searing arrows it should hurt like a mofo in an 1v1 situation. | ||
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whereismymind
United Kingdom717 Posts
Ok, I think I can't do enough damage versus melee, but I do more versus casters. Versus caster I take orchid for silence + 30% damage, veruss melee I don't have serious answer since they just roflstomp me, and it's very hard to get monkey bar + hex stick for melee  It's pretty hard if my Clinkz does like 150dmx max per hit at lvl 11-12, that menas I have to make 10 hits versus 1500 hp melee.. until my 10 hits he roflstomp me I guess I have to gank in group. | ||
TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On November 19 2012 04:58 Sqisgar wrote: Does Drum's speed boost stack with Razor's speed boost from Unstable Current? Yes, but only up to the cap of 522. | ||
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valheru
Australia966 Posts
Question for TL: Do you use auto cast for Searing Arrows in fights versus another heroes? I saw this guy in video, he presses W and shoot. Isn't that very slow versus auto-cast? (I know you have mana problems if you use auto-cast all the time) I think you're talking about orbwalking. Right clicks on other heroes make enemy creeps attack you but using spells doesn't draw the aggro. Using arrows on auto counts as a right click and clicking w on them counts as a spell and doesn't draw aggro. Or I could be reading this wrong and he's doing something completely different, but I think this is orbwalking. | ||
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JumboJohnson
537 Posts
Cool good to know, how about the boost from Yasha? Same thing? | ||
Firebolt145
Lalalaland34501 Posts
On November 19 2012 07:37 whereismymind wrote: Oh thanks for fast response.. Ok, I think I can't do enough damage versus melee, but I do more versus casters. Versus caster I take orchid for silence + 30% damage, veruss melee I don't have serious answer since they just roflstomp me, and it's very hard to get monkey bar + hex stick for melee It's pretty hard if my Clinkz does like 150dmx max per hit at lvl 11-12, that menas I have to make 10 hits versus 1500 hp melee.. until my 10 hits he roflstomp me I guess I have to gank in group.You shouldn't see it in pure numbers. It's not a question of 'I need 10 hits to kill him, he needs less to kill me'. The game is much less about fancy math and much more about the way you carry it out. Orchids is still great against 'melee' heroes, because melee heroes all also have spells and silence is great against everyone. And just because a hero is melee doesn't make them inherently tanky; many of the squishiest heroes in the game are melee (slark, for example). Your orchids doesn't just silence them but also makes them take 25% more damage, so there's no reason not to use it on melee heroes. Also, melee heroes sometimes have the most important spells to stop. Magnus, Tidehunter and Sandking are just a few off the top of my head that are melee yet orchids has a devastating effect on them. | ||
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Blitzkrieg0
United States13132 Posts
On November 19 2012 08:38 Sqisgar wrote: Cool good to know, how about the boost from Yasha? Same thing? The maximum movespeed is 522. Razor's speed boost from Unstable Current will stack with any movespeed bonus. | ||
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pullarius1
United States523 Posts
Thanks. | ||
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PassiveAce
United States18076 Posts
On November 19 2012 11:35 pullarius1 wrote: What exactly is Helm of the Dominator good for? I've been learning Gyrocopter and Luna as part of my first batch of heroes, and they are two of the four it is recommended four.I get the helm every game because I pretty much just get all the recommended items, but I've noticed that I never really use its active ability, and the helm doesn't seem worth it for its base stats alone. Thanks. you get HoD to stack the ancient camp repeatedly and clear it for $$$ (obviously by using the active ability and stacking with a creep while you farm normally). Gyro and Luna are both heroes who have aoe built into their auto attacks, luna through her passive and Gyro through Flak, this makes it really easy to clear huge ancient camp stacks very quickly. Another popular hero for HoD is Dragon Knight because the second level of his ult gives him aoe. you can easily get upwards 1500 gold with this method very quickly. another edit- also, the lifesteal is very good for the mentioned heroes. | ||
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Blitzkrieg0
United States13132 Posts
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evilfatsh1t
Australia8819 Posts
On November 19 2012 11:35 pullarius1 wrote: What exactly is Helm of the Dominator good for? I've been learning Gyrocopter and Luna as part of my first batch of heroes, and they are two of the four it is recommended four.I get the helm every game because I pretty much just get all the recommended items, but I've noticed that I never really use its active ability, and the helm doesn't seem worth it for its base stats alone. Thanks. well the lifesteal should be a no brainer. lifesteal = live longer in fights good thing is as mentioned above, the ancient stacking technique which comes through the active get a lvl5+ creep and pull ancients at 51 repeatedly then kill them all with your hero luna, pa are all good examples of where this happens the most. the other thing about hotd is that if you get to the very late stages of the game it builds into satanic, one of the best items in the game. honestly i wouldnt get hotd on gyro as he doesnt need the lifesteal that much, but hard carries like pa and luna are prime candidates | ||
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Barbiero
Brazil5259 Posts
On November 19 2012 11:52 evilfatsh1t wrote: well the lifesteal should be a no brainer. lifesteal = live longer in fights good thing is as mentioned above, the ancient stacking technique which comes through the active get a lvl5+ creep and pull ancients at 51 repeatedly then kill them all with your hero luna, pa are all good examples of where this happens the most. the other thing about hotd is that if you get to the very late stages of the game it builds into satanic, one of the best items in the game. honestly i wouldnt get hotd on gyro as he doesnt need the lifesteal that much, but hard carries like pa and luna are prime candidates hotd on gyro is actually incredibly powerful and worth it if you remember to stack the camps. However, if you can get a teammate(like a Chen) to do that for you, you should probably just skip hotd until you are farmed enough that lifesteal actually matters. | ||
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