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On October 21 2013 11:04 TangyOrange wrote:Show nested quote +On October 20 2013 06:43 Darkren wrote:
I alwais tought and stand that threads are far better on meepo, after this patch threads are even better
They give u imba attack speed on every hero, and a nice boost on the primary one Personally, I like getting tranquils to tide me through the early game as most of your damage will be from poof. I usually change to treads after my aghs or after my blink dagger depending on when I need the 16 extra strength and then add on a BoT for the end game. Meepo is a very clunky hero, when moving around he bumps into himself a lot and loses a lot of effective ms from doing so. More ms should be helpful, as should the turn rate buff.
Wait what? All boots give you the exact same stats on all of your clones, since the clones actually get the item in their inventory.
Where do you get the number 16 from?
Myself I'm very unsure of what boots to get. While tranquils have become more viable late, I'm not sure they can contend with treads for fightning. We have:
Treads: 30 AS, 8 str/agi, 50 MS
Tranqs: 4 armor, 65 MS
Treads will superior damage wise with the AS and the possibility to go agi. 4 armor is probably better than 8 str in terms of survivability. I'm not sure how the MS would affect your damage output, but I suspect treads would still come out ahead since you slow your enemies as you hit them anyway.
I really don't like tranquils' active mode either. Since they break on being attacked or attacking I guess they break while jungling as well. While 10 hp reg isn't bad, you'd have to stay put for 13 seconds before actually getting it. In that time you'd be close to your fountain anyway.
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On October 21 2013 14:29 FreeZer wrote:Show nested quote +On October 21 2013 11:04 TangyOrange wrote:On October 20 2013 06:43 Darkren wrote:
I alwais tought and stand that threads are far better on meepo, after this patch threads are even better
They give u imba attack speed on every hero, and a nice boost on the primary one Personally, I like getting tranquils to tide me through the early game as most of your damage will be from poof. I usually change to treads after my aghs or after my blink dagger depending on when I need the 16 extra strength and then add on a BoT for the end game. Meepo is a very clunky hero, when moving around he bumps into himself a lot and loses a lot of effective ms from doing so. More ms should be helpful, as should the turn rate buff. Wait what? All boots give you the exact same stats on all of your clones, since the clones actually get the item in their inventory. Where do you get the number 16 from? Myself I'm very unsure of what boots to get. While tranquils have become more viable late, I'm not sure they can contend with treads for fightning. We have: Treads: 30 AS, 8 str/agi, 50 MS Tranqs: 4 armor, 65 MS Treads will superior damage wise with the AS and the possibility to go agi. 4 armor is probably better than 8 str in terms of survivability. I'm not sure how the MS would affect your damage output, but I suspect treads would still come out ahead since you slow your enemies as you hit them anyway. I really don't like tranquils' active mode either. Since they break on being attacked or attacking I guess they break while jungling as well. While 10 hp reg isn't bad, you'd have to stay put for 13 seconds before actually getting it. In that time you'd be close to your fountain anyway.
Very useful thing to know : on a Meepo with Aghanim, the clones get +16 stat from power treads.
Why you wonder? Well, they get the boots (they always do, may it be Agh or not) but then, with 100% stat sharing, the sweet +8 provided by the power treads to the main Meepo is 100% shared with the clones, who then get +16 stats.
Note that currently, without Agh, the clones still receive +10.4 stats from treads (8 + 30% of 8)
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On October 21 2013 14:29 FreeZer wrote:
I really don't like tranquils' active mode either. Since they break on being attacked or attacking I guess they break while jungling as well. While 10 hp reg isn't bad, you'd have to stay put for 13 seconds before actually getting it. In that time you'd be close to your fountain anyway.
Not true, they don't break on a lot of jungle creeps unless it's been patched pretty recently - some of them they do but you can safely farm a lot of camps with tranquil buff on. Either way, you have two Meepos by the time you want to start jungling - tank with the other one for a while ^^ not that tricky.
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Lalalaland34490 Posts
On October 21 2013 15:11 Cyx. wrote:Show nested quote +On October 21 2013 14:29 FreeZer wrote:
I really don't like tranquils' active mode either. Since they break on being attacked or attacking I guess they break while jungling as well. While 10 hp reg isn't bad, you'd have to stay put for 13 seconds before actually getting it. In that time you'd be close to your fountain anyway. Not true, they don't break on a lot of jungle creeps unless it's been patched pretty recently - some of them they do but you can safely farm a lot of camps with tranquil buff on. Either way, you have two Meepos by the time you want to start jungling - tank with the other one for a while ^^ not that tricky.
I believe he's talking about post 6.79.
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People talking about tranqs are starting to get really confusing.
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On October 21 2013 18:29 GtC wrote:
People talking about tranqs are starting to get really confusing.
Haha sorry, that might have been my fault. Let me summarise. I like tranquil boots on Meepo because it is a strong and cheap early game item which helps him get through his weak early game phase.
I find the health regen very useful for laning as, being Meepo, generally people will be trying to shut down your farm.Similarly for jungling when you are forced to take damage, the regen is useful as well.
I personally prefer the MS over the AS as in the early game when your stats are still relatively weak, AS may not have as much mileage as later on. On the other hand, MS is helpful for chasing/ running away. Even more so in the early game when the majority of your damage will be from poofing, having the MS to get into a location to get off a poof could be critical and could mean the difference between a kill and a death.
I also find that Meepo has the tendency to get kited in the early game team fights when you do not have enough Meepos to cast many earthbinds or stack enough slows on multiple heroes. Meepo suffers in such situations where he has to switch targets after killing or in a situation where the enemy is trying to disengage and retreat. In which case more MS will be useful.
However, like I said, tranquil boots are an early game item and later on in the game when the proportion of your damage shifts away from being poof-heavy to shovel-heavy, treads will prove to be more valuable. It is also here that you may have a blink dagger to help solve your mobility issues. Therefore, I do recommend changing your boots to treads later on although with the new boots losing the ability to be disassembled, I am not sure how economical this may be.
I hope this helped to clear some of the confusion.
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Why prefer treads over BoT?
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Lalalaland34490 Posts
On October 21 2013 22:51 Laserist wrote:
Why prefer treads over BoT?
Because BoT = 2000 gold for no combat ability beyond some move speed. Treads are also the only boots which give a huge boost of survivability to your clones since it's the only item they can carry.
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On October 21 2013 23:07 Firebolt145 wrote:Because BoT = 2000 gold for no combat ability beyond some move speed. Treads are also the only boots which give a huge boost of survivability to your clones since it's the only item they can carry.
I prefer BoT over any boots mid to late game since it gives you so much mobility, gank & farm power aside move speed. Meepo can easily afford 1K more gold for what BoT gives. Try it , you'll find it useful.
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Lalalaland34490 Posts
On October 21 2013 23:18 Laserist wrote:Show nested quote +On October 21 2013 23:07 Firebolt145 wrote:On October 21 2013 22:51 Laserist wrote:
Why prefer treads over BoT? Because BoT = 2000 gold for no combat ability beyond some move speed. Treads are also the only boots which give a huge boost of survivability to your clones since it's the only item they can carry. I prefer BoT over any boots mid to late game since it gives you so much mobility, gank & farm power aside move speed. Meepo can easily afford 1K more gold for what BoT gives. Try it , you'll find it useful.
I'm well aware of what BoTs offer. I'm not saying Treads are better than BoTs, I'm simply saying why some people prefer them over BoTs.
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Just tested Meepo on 6.79.
It's horrible.
OK, to be more honest, it was just significantly harder. Now, my Meepo in the jungle was forced to do trips to the fountain (twice in the game) whereas it was simply never ever required before.
A Meepo at lvl 4 really can't do shit. Apart from stacking a camp, once per minute. I mean, even clearing the easy camp (with a poof lvl 2) takes a significant hit on the total HP.
The only nice thing is that now I am forced to tread switch, which is surprisingly easy with Meepo : you can tread switch after you click on poof, but before the channeling end, to save up mana.
I personally don't know how to build him properly now. Magic stick or no magic stick? Treads -> Mek -> Agh, or do you skip Mek entirely (very hard to keep your HP up in this case)? Do you consider small aura items such as basilus (probably a bad idea) or headdress (perhaps a good idea)?
Edit : Oh, and the idea that Meepo can gank lvl 4 is absurd. Meepo at lvl 4 is super weak. I even wonder if he is among the top 10% worst hero at that level.
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On October 22 2013 11:26 fezvez wrote:
Just tested Meepo on 6.79.
It's horrible.
OK, to be more honest, it was just significantly harder. Now, my Meepo in the jungle was forced to do trips to the fountain (twice in the game) whereas it was simply never ever required before.
A Meepo at lvl 4 really can't do shit. Apart from stacking a camp, once per minute. I mean, even clearing the easy camp (with a poof lvl 2) takes a significant hit on the total HP.
The only nice thing is that now I am forced to tread switch, which is surprisingly easy with Meepo : you can tread switch after you click on poof, but before the channeling end, to save up mana.
I personally don't know how to build him properly now. Magic stick or no magic stick? Treads -> Mek -> Agh, or do you skip Mek entirely (very hard to keep your HP up in this case)? Do you consider small aura items such as basilus (probably a bad idea) or headdress (perhaps a good idea)?
Edit : Oh, and the idea that Meepo can gank lvl 4 is absurd. Meepo at lvl 4 is super weak. I even wonder if he is among the top 10% worst hero at that level.
Having just played my first games of Meepo on the new patch, here's my thoughts on this.
Having an extra Meepo at level 4 doesn't let you jungle very well, it's true, but the ability to send your Meepo back to fountain without losing XP is amazing, and by the time you're back at full HP and mana on both Meepos you can be level 5 which is not nearly as bad as you make it out to be - a 240 damage nuke and 4 seconds of root is nothing to laugh at on anyone even if their base stats aren't great (or a 200 damage nuke at level 4). New tranquils didn't seem as awesome as before then I played a game without them and it was actually WAY more painful - they're less noticeable but still pretty good.
As far as build, I'm leaning towards aghs->blink->heart as my items of choice usually so far, but it hasn't changed much - mek->blink->aghs is still really strong as well, and you can use all the same items post-aghs as before. Other than that, he honestly hasn't changed THAT much as a hero - most of what I've written here still applies with a few changes to the early game builds and mindset sections. His midgame is still almost exactly the same - you can hardly tell he's a different hero.
e: as far as early-game items goes, I still think basi is a great idea, it hasn't changed and still gives him the same things. Also still think upgrading your stick (if you even get one) is a waste of money. If anything I'm leaning towards more raw boots aghs rush Meepo builds now that tranquils have been nerfed a bit but boots-wise he's still pretty similar with maybe a little more emphasis on treads if you're not planning on just laning/jungling for levels 1-7. I would still buy headdress if you're going mek (obviously) but never otherwise I don't think - again, wasted money that could be a faster aghs.
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my experience with meepo also thinks tranquil not good
net is actually now a lot better than geostrike with less cast point
level 2 poof is enough to flash
net poof poof +meepo net
poor man's shield and ring of basilius
later on get agility tread
meepo now becomes a huge presence in lane, especially against any other agility hero
meepo against sf is amazingly strong after meepo hits level 5 with level 2 net/poof
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meepo would get destroyed by sf. wouldnt even be a contest. despite having a clone at lvl 4 meepo still cant kill anyone mid unless its like...rubick. probs a couple more but rubick is the only hero i can think of atm who might lane against a meepo and only has 1 nuke.
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On October 21 2013 15:03 fezvez wrote:
Very useful thing to know : on a Meepo with Aghanim, the clones get +16 stat from power treads.
Mind blown!! Over 100 games on Meepo and I had no idea about this XD. Seems I'm definately going to prefer treads then.
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I really think that Meepo will be played like he used to be played long time ago, and that is going solo lane(preferably mid) and gank as soon as he gets his clone.
I do think that people are playing him wrong in this version, stacking neutrals and farming, when this patch nerfed everything about carries, farming, split-pushing, gaining gold and XP from neutrals, while it supports ganking a lot. I mean, it isn't wrong to play him as a farming carry, but he definitely isn't as strong in that field as he used to be last version.
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Netherlands6142 Posts
Only played one game so far but love it. Get basi brown boots, stack the hard camp and farm the small camp with 2nd Meepo at lvl 4, farm the stacks or go ganking around lvl 5/6 with lvl 3 Poof. Then farm lane/jungle for level 11 and BoT and from there it's smooth sailing xD I've become a bit of a fan of BoT first with 3 Meepoes. You can be anywhere at anytime with full health. It's a bit greedy but I love it x)
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Well, I am watching N0tail right now, he is playing Meepo. As I said, he is playing him differently, he max third skill first, then Earthbind and Poof, and is rushing Treads and Blink and among first items he gets Orb of Venom, and ganks all over the map. At least he played him that way in the game I was watching.
I must say, his casting animation for Earthbind is enormously buffed.
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On October 23 2013 00:20 Ramiz1989 wrote:
Well, I am watching N0tail right now, he is playing Meepo. As I said, he is playing him differently, he max third skill first, then Earthbind and Poof, and is rushing Treads and Blink and among first items he gets Orb of Venom, and ganks all over the map. At least he played him that way in the game I was watching.
I must say, his casting animation for Earthbind is enormously buffed.
I've seen him doing the Geostrike/OoV build a bunch before, I doubt that's much to do with the patch.
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A couple more games also tells me tranquils are no good - they're really support boots now which I'm okay with but I'm liking treads first a lot more now, or keeping brown boots and rushing either aghs/blink or mek/blink and then turning them into bts after your core ganking items are done. I also like taking two points in Earthbind before leveling Geostrike a lot more than I did when I wrote the guide ^^ though that is not really so much the patch, even though the patch did make it better, I've just started to like the build more.
Gotta go to class now but will play and write more when I'm home ^^
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EPT
