EPTOn August 24 2014 10:42 yyfpulls wrote:
Was NAR this bad when they started out? lol
Was NAR this bad when they started out? lol
nah but they had korok to counter balance sneyking
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Spicy_Curry
United States10573 Posts
nah but they had korok to counter balance sneyking | ||
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DoctorHeckle
United States192 Posts
I still feel like the roster isn't complete, or too saturated. They have no real offlaner (PLEASE no more EGM off ;___;), just two really good mids and a carry player with PK. Sing could go off like he did in MLG, and if he could get good at the position and ease into its hero pool and how the role should be played in 6.82, I think the team's gonna do fine. | ||
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WolfintheSheep
Canada14127 Posts
On August 24 2014 10:53 Evander Berry Wall wrote: Like I say, a team of great players is not necessarily a great team. On the other hand, Newbee had a pretty rocky start, so you never know what good things may come. Yeah, and they fixed that rocky start by replacing players. | ||
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uishax
153 Posts
On August 24 2014 10:06 DavoS wrote: Look at my C9 flair (I don't know what team to replace it with yet). Now when I say something like "I wish TT was as consistent as C9 I want that to sink in They are not 'inconsitent', just damn awful. Getting dumpstered by T3,T4 teams is a bad sign for things to come. | ||
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Bigtony
United States1606 Posts
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DucK-
Singapore11447 Posts
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parkin
1080 Posts
I think they overrate Razor and their strategies could be more solid. For example look at how they drafted against a pugna+bristle+tinker. Drafting a Prophet into a tinker is bad. And a veno+ember versus bristle+pugna is to slow and greedy imo. At least when ember goes 4-1-4. He should have gone higher SoF earlier for high ground defense i think. | ||
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Yamulo
United States2096 Posts
On August 24 2014 14:51 Bigtony wrote: How many professional games do you think EGM has played offlane that we are calling him burden? Like any team they need a unified vision or they are going to crash and burn, no matter how talented they are individually (and the only players I really rate on tinker would be sing and hypothetically EGM if he's really joining up). Qojqva carried Team Liquid and is at least as good as singsing. Just look at his stats from TI4. Nahaz was saying he was one of, if not the best, in terms of raw stats at TI4. I'm not sure if he is better than sing, especially since they don't play the same style, but he deserves respect. | ||
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SnowfaLL
Canada730 Posts
If the players just realize what they are doing and ADAPT to this meta, this team could be insanely good. But Bulba and Qojvqa are locked in their ways, and if they are the ingame captains/drafters of this team, you could literally put Burning, iceiceice and LaNm with them and the team would lose vs tier 3 teams. | ||
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FlyBeavs
Canada34 Posts
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ForTehDarkseid
8139 Posts
On August 24 2014 14:04 uishax wrote: They are not 'inconsitent', just damn awful. Getting dumpstered by T3,T4 teams is a bad sign for things to come. How the heck Empire and VP are considered a tier-3 team? TT just need to scrim more and get Pajkatt drafting instead of Bulba, imo. | ||
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uishax
153 Posts
On August 24 2014 19:03 ForTehDarkseid wrote: How the heck Empire and VP are considered a tier-3 team? TT just need to scrim more and get Pajkatt drafting instead of Bulba, imo. Gee, how did they lose I league qualifiers? Must be to Newbee right? Anyways, Empire and VP just made their roster changes, (Empire got poached by Navi again), still they adjusted much quicker and demolished TInker. | ||
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AwfuL_
Netherlands6976 Posts
On August 24 2014 09:50 Yamulo wrote: Bulba was the captain at TI4 and that went well, much better than it did with TC or Wayto. Liquid has seen plenty of good results with TC as captain. He was the captain for most of Liquid's previous roster too, so his results include the fairly high finishes in tournaments like D2L as well as the TI3 result. I think his captaining was usually fine on a strategic level, but he was not able to right the ship once last year's roster lost their way. And to be fair to him neither wayto, fluff or bulba have been able to solve Liquid's core problem of being made up of introverted people who stop communicating when things go awry. Bulba's captaining looked great at first because they found a few picks they were able to win games with, as well as found some confidence in themselves after stomping DK in scrims. And a Liquid that finds their confidence and gets the picks it wants has ALWAYS been able to stomp tier 1 teams. His captaining and drafting looked a whole less good in the games where they got their raxes pushed at 20 minutes in. A bit more ontopic, I don't see Team Tinker being any better than Team Liquid was. We can't know for sure but it seems it's the exact same thing, a mix of good players that doesn't necessarily make a coherent team, and doesn't seem to have a strong captain. | ||
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ForTehDarkseid
8139 Posts
On August 24 2014 20:12 uishax wrote: Gee, how did they lose I league qualifiers? Must be to Newbee right? Anyways, Empire and VP just made their roster changes, (Empire got poached by Navi again), still they adjusted much quicker and demolished TInker. I didn't watch that game. Was it Excalibur playing or EGM? Either way, i-league doesn't mean shit, there would be four Chinese teams fighting for money, not worth the trip at all. Current VP Roster >> TI4 VP roster, and Empire lost only hard support. | ||
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bluzi
4703 Posts
On August 25 2014 00:01 ForTehDarkseid wrote: I didn't watch that game. Was it Excalibur playing or EGM? Either way, i-league doesn't mean shit, there would be four Chinese teams fighting for money, not worth the trip at all. Current VP Roster >> TI4 VP roster, and Empire lost only hard support. not worth the trip ? what do you mean ? playing LAN events for new teams is the best thing , it makes your team members bond as they hang out togther all the time , makes you scrim harder and more seriously as you have a big LAN coming up. they have 0 expectations so whatever you acheive is a bonus. for new teams its not all about the money as you state...(at the begging of course) | ||
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corpsepose
1678 Posts
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WolfintheSheep
Canada14127 Posts
On August 24 2014 19:03 ForTehDarkseid wrote: How the heck Empire and VP are considered a tier-3 team? TT just need to scrim more and get Pajkatt drafting instead of Bulba, imo. VP haven't been very good for a long while. They have occasional shows of brilliance, but usually aren't even guaranteed a win against teams like Next.kz or MYM. They may be at the top of Tier 3 teams, but they're still a really weak team on most days. Empire may not be tier-3 easy win level, but they're currently one of the weakest of professional organizations. On August 25 2014 02:38 corpsepose wrote: how about you guys let them ease into whatever newfound roles theyre practicing for the team instead of shitting on them from the get go? its actually absurd how readily people assume theyve figured out a new teams issues and subsequently write them off in their minds without even waiting to watch their growth as a team. Team Tinker is basically made from scratch. There shouldn't be "easing" into roles, they should have players that are already comfortable in those roles. If this team is just 5 guys joking around and pretending to be competitive, fine, whatever. They lose some qualifiers, then go on to real teams. If they're actually trying to be a tournament contender, then you need 5 players that are good at their roles and will get better, not 3 players who are headless chickens who need time to be decent. | ||
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ForTehDarkseid
8139 Posts
On August 25 2014 03:36 WolfintheSheep wrote: VP haven't been very good for a long while. They have occasional shows of brilliance, but usually aren't even guaranteed a win against teams like Next.kz or MYM. They may be at the top of Tier 3 teams, but they're still a really weak team on most days. Empire may not be tier-3 easy win level, but they're currently one of the weakest of professional organizations. Where did you get all that confidence coming from when the pro season has barely even started and more than half of teams haven't announced their lineups. | ||
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WolfintheSheep
Canada14127 Posts
On August 25 2014 04:10 ForTehDarkseid wrote: Where did you get all that confidence coming from when the pro season has barely even started and more than half of teams haven't announced their lineups. Empire and VP haven't changed that many players, and their play hasn't gotten that much better in the games we've seen so far. And the benchmark is still teams like EG and Newbee who barely touched their rosters. I mean, sure, if you really need that safety blanket of reassurance, we can pretend that Empire and VP magically became world-class tournament champions, and that's the only reason Team Tinker lost...but really? | ||
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ForTehDarkseid
8139 Posts
On August 25 2014 04:28 WolfintheSheep wrote: Empire and VP haven't changed that many players, and their play hasn't gotten that much better in the games we've seen so far. And the benchmark is still teams like EG and Newbee who barely touched their rosters. I mean, sure, if you really need that safety blanket of reassurance, we can pretend that Empire and VP magically became world-class tournament champions, and that's the only reason Team Tinker lost...but really? Empire was never a tier-3 team to begin with and were considered a tier-1 worthy opponents before TI4. New VP is basically old ROX+God+1 which is a tremendous upgrade over their old roster. Newbee lost their captain, drafter and if Banana decides to retire arguably best position 4 support in China on top of that, so you can't conclude anything about Eastern dota yet. TT is tier-2 team for now, people who expect more from them right from the get go are silly, imo. | ||
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