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On June 21 2016 18:42 GinNtoniC wrote:Show nested quote +On June 21 2016 17:15 lookfirewood wrote:
Sure. He also ends by saying "time to fight". To me that signals that he wanted to vent some thoughts, and now leaves it behind and moves on. They must be entitled to have oppinions? They are clearly emotional about the entire thing.
See it this way. For them, ESL was the ONLY way to get invited. The only chance AT ALL to get a chance for an invite. Then you reply:
- "No it wasn't, they had the whole year to show what they are made of"
Well that's exactly what they did, and still didn't get invited, so hence their frustration. Their entire chance for an invite was ESL, they didn't make it, they are sad. Let them clear their throat. Regarding ESL etc, that's not what I said. I consider Dec-Jan more or less irrelevant. Valve should invite the people who they consider to be the strongest in regards to rcecent events. WCA and Starladder wasn't recent. Anyway, they are entitled to whatever bloody opinion they want. That's not my point. By point is that they're only shooting themselves in the foot by clinging to past merits and refusing to realize that they're not a tier 1 team atm. They are entitled to PJSalt all they want, but atm they just seem to be wasting energy being frustrated over something they can't change. On a bright note: Bulldog is owning shit up with Clockwerk in SOLO mmr queue atm. Signs of things to come? Edit: And then 20 mins later he joins a party with S4 who is smurfing with Nara....... Goddamnit S4 
yeah, i saw it too, few days b4 TI qualify, playing 4k pub with Nara. i have no word...
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Jack_knife: Not only are you missing the point, but u are also wrong.
Akke was disappointed about not being invited because he felt valve should take the entire year in mind when sending invites. IF they did that, the invites are unfair to more teams than just A. But valve didn't account for the whole year so he's sad/angry/salty. THAT is the point. How the hell can you be disappointed about akke for saying that? Where's the reason? Sure u can disagree, but the story ends there.
Also ALL teams loses to other teams. If you look at the teams that got invites, they never lost... at all. All of them, 100% wins.
edit: Try to post your stuff in one post so you can be quoted.
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Was Alliance good since TI5 really? Only thing you can say is that they were stable as a team, and won 2 tourneys after patch that happened to fit their style while others were still figuring it out, shuffling players, or plain in dumpster like Chinese teams.
Otherwise their play was pretty unimpressive for what we're used tto see from them. Somewhat solid, but not TOP6 worthy even if the whole year would be taken into account. Which would be close to impossible with all the shuffles, you'd basically get free TI ticket for staying together.
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On June 21 2016 22:49 lookfirewood wrote:
Jack_knife: Not only are you missing the point, but u are also wrong.
Akke was disappointed about not being invited because he felt valve should take the entire year in mind when sending invites. IF they did that, the invites are unfair to more teams than just A. But valve didn't account for the whole year so he's sad/angry/salty. THAT is the point. How the hell can you be disappointed about akke for saying that? Where's the reason? Sure u can disagree, but the story ends there.
Also ALL teams loses to other teams. If you look at the teams that got invites, they never lost... at all. All of them, 100% wins.
edit: Try to post your stuff in one post so you can be quoted.
dude, all of those invited teams are far better or better than [A] now, even LGD, the worst of 6 is stronger than [A] now. am disappointed because akke still think they deserve a invite. i really hope i was wrong, and i really hope they go TI.
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well yeah they won two tournaments in a row. but that doesnt say much. it was a brand new patch, nobody figured it out yet. all in all you can say, they were good for 3 weeks, and that should never be enough for an invite to ti, which is several month later. the strongest teams fom the last 2-3 month should get invites + the ti winner from last year. what they did 6 month ago is not relevant at all. if they can qualify for ti, they have my respect, but i dont believe in it.
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On June 22 2016 00:07 hunter_x wrote:
well yeah they won two tournaments in a row. but that doesnt say much. it was a brand new patch, nobody figured it out yet. all in all you can say, they were good for 3 weeks, and that should never be enough for an invite to ti, which is several month later. the strongest teams fom the last 2-3 month should get invites + the ti winner from last year. what they did 6 month ago is not relevant at all. if they can qualify for ti, they have my respect, but i dont believe in it.
I mean, valve came out and said they wanted TI to be about year long performances and a bunch of drivel like that and Alliance are the oldest complete roster outside of TL/OG to have won any relevant tournament whatsoever much less 2 in a row. I totally don't think they deserve an invite but it's easy to see how valve pushing roster stability and year long performances should heavily favour Alliance. The issue is, Valve just ended up inviting the top recently performing teams like everybody wanted which undermines their stability push and leaves Alliance out in the cold.
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On June 22 2016 00:16 Sn0_Man wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2016 00:07 hunter_x wrote:
well yeah they won two tournaments in a row. but that doesnt say much. it was a brand new patch, nobody figured it out yet. all in all you can say, they were good for 3 weeks, and that should never be enough for an invite to ti, which is several month later. the strongest teams fom the last 2-3 month should get invites + the ti winner from last year. what they did 6 month ago is not relevant at all. if they can qualify for ti, they have my respect, but i dont believe in it. I mean, valve came out and said they wanted TI to be about year long performances and a bunch of drivel like that and Alliance are the oldest complete roster outside of TL/OG to have won any relevant tournament whatsoever much less 2 in a row. I totally don't think they deserve an invite but it's easy to see how valve pushing roster stability and year long performances should heavily favour Alliance. The issue is, Valve just ended up inviting the top recently performing teams like everybody wanted which undermines their stability push and leaves Alliance out in the cold.
aside from lgd and navi, the other invites are all teams, who performed well over a longer time. while alliance only did well for some weeks, and after that, they were just bad. just not enough for an invite
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On June 22 2016 00:20 hunter_x wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2016 00:16 Sn0_Man wrote:On June 22 2016 00:07 hunter_x wrote:
well yeah they won two tournaments in a row. but that doesnt say much. it was a brand new patch, nobody figured it out yet. all in all you can say, they were good for 3 weeks, and that should never be enough for an invite to ti, which is several month later. the strongest teams fom the last 2-3 month should get invites + the ti winner from last year. what they did 6 month ago is not relevant at all. if they can qualify for ti, they have my respect, but i dont believe in it. I mean, valve came out and said they wanted TI to be about year long performances and a bunch of drivel like that and Alliance are the oldest complete roster outside of TL/OG to have won any relevant tournament whatsoever much less 2 in a row. I totally don't think they deserve an invite but it's easy to see how valve pushing roster stability and year long performances should heavily favour Alliance. The issue is, Valve just ended up inviting the top recently performing teams like everybody wanted which undermines their stability push and leaves Alliance out in the cold. aside from lgd and navi, the other invites are all teams, who performed well over a longer time. while alliance only did well for some weeks, and after that, they were just bad. just not enough for an invite
You make no sense , what do you mean "aside from" , of course no one is disputing the Liquid/OG/MVP/Newbee invites.... its about LGD & Navi .... please at least make an effort to understand the discsussion such replies make it sound like you are just casually walking in to the conversation and adding nothing , dont want to sound like a prick cheers.
0 way to jusitfy Navi over Fnatic , really 0
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On June 22 2016 01:09 bluzi wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2016 00:20 hunter_x wrote:On June 22 2016 00:16 Sn0_Man wrote:On June 22 2016 00:07 hunter_x wrote:
well yeah they won two tournaments in a row. but that doesnt say much. it was a brand new patch, nobody figured it out yet. all in all you can say, they were good for 3 weeks, and that should never be enough for an invite to ti, which is several month later. the strongest teams fom the last 2-3 month should get invites + the ti winner from last year. what they did 6 month ago is not relevant at all. if they can qualify for ti, they have my respect, but i dont believe in it. I mean, valve came out and said they wanted TI to be about year long performances and a bunch of drivel like that and Alliance are the oldest complete roster outside of TL/OG to have won any relevant tournament whatsoever much less 2 in a row. I totally don't think they deserve an invite but it's easy to see how valve pushing roster stability and year long performances should heavily favour Alliance. The issue is, Valve just ended up inviting the top recently performing teams like everybody wanted which undermines their stability push and leaves Alliance out in the cold. aside from lgd and navi, the other invites are all teams, who performed well over a longer time. while alliance only did well for some weeks, and after that, they were just bad. just not enough for an invite You make no sense , what do you mean "aside from" , of course no one is disputing the Liquid/OG/MVP/Newbee invites.... its about LGD & Navi .... please at least make an effort to understand the discsussion such replies make it sound like you are just casually walking in to the conversation and adding nothing , dont want to sound like a prick cheers. 0 way to jusitfy Navi over Fnatic , really 0
This really isn't the thread to discuss navi vs fnatic but realistically if you invite fnatic then you can't with a straight face hold sea qualifiers because there aren't any teams left.
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On June 22 2016 01:09 bluzi wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2016 00:20 hunter_x wrote:On June 22 2016 00:16 Sn0_Man wrote:On June 22 2016 00:07 hunter_x wrote:
well yeah they won two tournaments in a row. but that doesnt say much. it was a brand new patch, nobody figured it out yet. all in all you can say, they were good for 3 weeks, and that should never be enough for an invite to ti, which is several month later. the strongest teams fom the last 2-3 month should get invites + the ti winner from last year. what they did 6 month ago is not relevant at all. if they can qualify for ti, they have my respect, but i dont believe in it. I mean, valve came out and said they wanted TI to be about year long performances and a bunch of drivel like that and Alliance are the oldest complete roster outside of TL/OG to have won any relevant tournament whatsoever much less 2 in a row. I totally don't think they deserve an invite but it's easy to see how valve pushing roster stability and year long performances should heavily favour Alliance. The issue is, Valve just ended up inviting the top recently performing teams like everybody wanted which undermines their stability push and leaves Alliance out in the cold. aside from lgd and navi, the other invites are all teams, who performed well over a longer time. while alliance only did well for some weeks, and after that, they were just bad. just not enough for an invite You make no sense , what do you mean "aside from" , of course no one is disputing the Liquid/OG/MVP/Newbee invites.... its about LGD & Navi .... please at least make an effort to understand the discsussion such replies make it sound like you are just casually walking in to the conversation and adding nothing , dont want to sound like a prick cheers. 0 way to jusitfy Navi over Fnatic , really 0
fnatic over navi and lgd? yeah i agree in that case. my point still stands. alliance was good for three weeks, after that they failed everywhere. im not here to make fun of you guys. and i was talking about alliance, because this is the alliance discussion.
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On June 22 2016 01:09 bluzi wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2016 00:20 hunter_x wrote:On June 22 2016 00:16 Sn0_Man wrote:On June 22 2016 00:07 hunter_x wrote:
well yeah they won two tournaments in a row. but that doesnt say much. it was a brand new patch, nobody figured it out yet. all in all you can say, they were good for 3 weeks, and that should never be enough for an invite to ti, which is several month later. the strongest teams fom the last 2-3 month should get invites + the ti winner from last year. what they did 6 month ago is not relevant at all. if they can qualify for ti, they have my respect, but i dont believe in it. I mean, valve came out and said they wanted TI to be about year long performances and a bunch of drivel like that and Alliance are the oldest complete roster outside of TL/OG to have won any relevant tournament whatsoever much less 2 in a row. I totally don't think they deserve an invite but it's easy to see how valve pushing roster stability and year long performances should heavily favour Alliance. The issue is, Valve just ended up inviting the top recently performing teams like everybody wanted which undermines their stability push and leaves Alliance out in the cold. aside from lgd and navi, the other invites are all teams, who performed well over a longer time. while alliance only did well for some weeks, and after that, they were just bad. just not enough for an invite You make no sense , what do you mean "aside from" , of course no one is disputing the Liquid/OG/MVP/Newbee invites.... its about LGD & Navi .... please at least make an effort to understand the discsussion such replies make it sound like you are just casually walking in to the conversation and adding nothing , dont want to sound like a prick cheers. 0 way to jusitfy Navi over Fnatic , really 0
Navi over Fnatic isn't really surprising at all?
Navi has been on fire for months now. Yes they're not quite a tier-1 team and fail vs Liquid/OG but who doesn't. They're slaughtering all the t2 teams. So even without ESL Navi is somewhere up there with fnatic. They finished 7-8th while fnatic did 5-6th and I still think Valve basicly divides it into: top4 gets invites, top8 gets considered for decent results if they stay stable meaning I don't think Valve thinks that much differently about them.
On top of that it has always been: top4 teams to get invite, 2 teams from the most recent tournament (assuming they don't belong into the top4 already), + rest (if there's more) from decent finishers who have been stable. In this case we only had ESL so it's just one team for the top finisher and probably another reason why they reduced it to 6 invites.
That's how Wings and VG.R got into Manila, they just straight up won something as well and getting 2nd place at a tournament that has Liquid and OG (although with bracket luck) is just the exact same situation.
And all that is saying that Navi gets that invite if Vavle stays true to themselves about how things are done completly ignoring Navi's performance outside ESL because like I said, they were up there all the time as well. In fact I really can't seem to understand why so many people thought fnatic would be considered more likely to get an invite when it's been so obviously not the case. Before ESL Navi was maybe slightly below fnatic but really in the same boat. ESL just happened to be the nail in the coffin
And LGD was top4 Manila. So if fnatic replaces one of the teams it would have been MVP if anything... and I don't see that happening at all either.
///edit/// Just to make this absolutely clear: If Alliance gets 2nd place at ESL instead of Navi, or if col gets 2nd place at ESL instead of Navi I'm fairly sure they'd be the invite right now. Same for fnatic. For other teams that haven't shown results at all (VP, Vega?) I'd probably assume a 1st place at ESL would be needed to make up for that.
But with that in mind I just absolutely disagree with his mindset about it being a chance to fail, it was a chance to qualify.
I do see however that it's frustrating that it basicly boils down to 2 tournaments to qualify: Manila & ESL even if it was known beforehand///
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On June 21 2016 23:37 jack_knife wrote:Show nested quote +On June 21 2016 22:49 lookfirewood wrote:
Jack_knife: Not only are you missing the point, but u are also wrong.
Akke was disappointed about not being invited because he felt valve should take the entire year in mind when sending invites. IF they did that, the invites are unfair to more teams than just A. But valve didn't account for the whole year so he's sad/angry/salty. THAT is the point. How the hell can you be disappointed about akke for saying that? Where's the reason? Sure u can disagree, but the story ends there.
Also ALL teams loses to other teams. If you look at the teams that got invites, they never lost... at all. All of them, 100% wins.
edit: Try to post your stuff in one post so you can be quoted. dude, all of those invited teams are far better or better than [A] now, even LGD, the worst of 6 is stronger than [A] now. am disappointed because akke still think they deserve a invite. i really hope i was wrong, and i really hope they go TI.
Missing the point once again...
No one is arguing Alliance is better and should be invited. Try to read man...
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On June 22 2016 00:07 hunter_x wrote:
well yeah they won two tournaments in a row. but that doesnt say much. it was a brand new patch, nobody figured it out yet. all in all you can say, they were good for 3 weeks, and that should never be enough for an invite to ti, which is several month later. the strongest teams fom the last 2-3 month should get invites + the ti winner from last year. what they did 6 month ago is not relevant at all. if they can qualify for ti, they have my respect, but i dont believe in it.
i dont think they were good for 3 weeks, from WCA to SSL, it's really over 3 weeks. lol. they were unbeatable like 3 months long, they beat team liquid every single time when they met, even in shanghai Major, every1 thought they will be in top 4. but 1 thing i agree with you, they dont deserve a invite right now.
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On June 22 2016 02:57 jack_knife wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2016 00:07 hunter_x wrote:
well yeah they won two tournaments in a row. but that doesnt say much. it was a brand new patch, nobody figured it out yet. all in all you can say, they were good for 3 weeks, and that should never be enough for an invite to ti, which is several month later. the strongest teams fom the last 2-3 month should get invites + the ti winner from last year. what they did 6 month ago is not relevant at all. if they can qualify for ti, they have my respect, but i dont believe in it. i dont think they were good for 3 weeks, from WCA to SSL, it's really over 3 weeks. lol. they were unbeatable like 3 months long, they beat team liquid every single time when they met, even in shanghai Major, every1 thought they will be in top 4. but 1 thing i agree with you, they dont deserve a invite right now.
Alliance were unbeatable for 3 month? Wtf man are you on drugs? This is not 2013 man...they only beat Liquid at the Frankfurt Major qualifier, and at starladder. Thats pretty much it.
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On June 22 2016 03:12 hunter_x wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2016 02:57 jack_knife wrote:On June 22 2016 00:07 hunter_x wrote:
well yeah they won two tournaments in a row. but that doesnt say much. it was a brand new patch, nobody figured it out yet. all in all you can say, they were good for 3 weeks, and that should never be enough for an invite to ti, which is several month later. the strongest teams fom the last 2-3 month should get invites + the ti winner from last year. what they did 6 month ago is not relevant at all. if they can qualify for ti, they have my respect, but i dont believe in it. i dont think they were good for 3 weeks, from WCA to SSL, it's really over 3 weeks. lol. they were unbeatable like 3 months long, they beat team liquid every single time when they met, even in shanghai Major, every1 thought they will be in top 4. but 1 thing i agree with you, they dont deserve a invite right now. Alliance were unbeatable for 3 month? Wtf man are you on drugs? This is not 2013 man...they only beat Liquid at the Frankfurt Major qualifier, and at starladder. Thats pretty much it.
go check it by urself.
http://wiki.teamliquid.net/dota2/World_Cyber_Arena/2015
http://wiki.teamliquid.net/dota2/Star_Ladder_Star_Series/Season_13
http://wiki.teamliquid.net/dota2/Captains_Draft_3.0
WCA was in 14.12
last time they rekt ur liquid was 14.02.2016, they looked scary till they lost to Vega.
i guess u are blind or stupid enough.
User was warned for this post
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Hey guys, what's up with all the hate? Don't fight each other, let's just unite all together and give our energies to the boys \o/ \o/ \o/ !!!!!
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On June 22 2016 04:02 jack_knife wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2016 03:12 hunter_x wrote:On June 22 2016 02:57 jack_knife wrote:On June 22 2016 00:07 hunter_x wrote:
well yeah they won two tournaments in a row. but that doesnt say much. it was a brand new patch, nobody figured it out yet. all in all you can say, they were good for 3 weeks, and that should never be enough for an invite to ti, which is several month later. the strongest teams fom the last 2-3 month should get invites + the ti winner from last year. what they did 6 month ago is not relevant at all. if they can qualify for ti, they have my respect, but i dont believe in it. i dont think they were good for 3 weeks, from WCA to SSL, it's really over 3 weeks. lol. they were unbeatable like 3 months long, they beat team liquid every single time when they met, even in shanghai Major, every1 thought they will be in top 4. but 1 thing i agree with you, they dont deserve a invite right now. Alliance were unbeatable for 3 month? Wtf man are you on drugs? This is not 2013 man...they only beat Liquid at the Frankfurt Major qualifier, and at starladder. Thats pretty much it. go check it by urself. http://wiki.teamliquid.net/dota2/World_Cyber_Arena/2015http://wiki.teamliquid.net/dota2/Star_Ladder_Star_Series/Season_13http://wiki.teamliquid.net/dota2/Captains_Draft_3.0WCA was in 14.12 last time they rekt ur liquid was 14.02.2016, they looked scary till they lost to Vega. i guess u are blind or stupid enough. User was warned for this post
at wca liquid beat alliance 2-0 XD
you are a funny guy i must say. and captains draft, really? you know how that works right? i dont ecen count that as a real tournament. fact is they only won wca and starladder, and their head to head vs liquid is really bad. but arguing with delusional people like you is a waste of time
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their head to head is irrelevant. There's 3 different kind of invites and the last one (the one that can get them invited because they don't get one for category1 or 2) is probably some kind of weighted average making more recent tournaments more important.
In that case he's right, more recent tournaments count more but that's really not a surprise to anyone
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wait don't [A] have to go through open qualifiers now?
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On June 22 2016 06:23 Warfie wrote:
wait don't [A] have to go through open qualifiers now?
no they are invited to the full qualifiers...
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EPT
