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Meiffeltower
Sweden674 Posts
On January 18 2016 21:15 bluzi wrote: Are alliance playing today ? seems unlikely ... but could be oh god.. not this again.. Dota Pit League schedules ARE NOT TO BE TRUSTED. I dont know but i dont think they are playing. I think that Kelly tweeted they are traveling today and arrive in Sweden around 23:00 CET .. | ||
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bluzi
4703 Posts
On January 18 2016 22:55 Meiffeltower wrote: oh god.. not this again.. Dota Pit League schedules ARE NOT TO BE TRUSTED. I dont know but i dont think they are playing. I think that Kelly tweeted they are traveling today and arrive in Sweden around 23:00 CET .. 100% , Domo arigato | ||
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spudde123
4814 Posts
Imo to beat the sort of strategy Alliance is commonly running with a good safelane, s4 with a playmaking hero and Bulldog as the secondary carry you have to be able to smash the other 4 Alliance members during the time Bulldog has not yet caught up, or you have to be able to just trade farm and have a lineup that can compete as the game goes later. s4 is often the key player in Alliance's early fighting power due to his hero, so delaying his progression is pretty key. But because of the sort of heroes Bulldog tends to have (LD/NP/Brood for example) you often can't just leave him alone unless you have a very suitable safelaner for that specific matchup. It's not so easy to find the balance where you are strong enough in the lanes and early fights but you also don't put yourself under a massive clock. | ||
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wims80
1892 Posts
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Jotoco
Brazil1342 Posts
It complements itself so nicely it is hard to pin point ONE single flaw to exploit. As both of you said, if you focus on one of the cores, the other two will probably run with it and you will be screwed. You have to win all three lanes to best Alliance, imo. That or outcarry then while not losing too hard. How to do that? Hard to say. Only that you need lane bullies and pressure, as evidenced by some of the bans Alliance made (Razor, DP, OD). These bans, for me, evidence that Alliance wants to make sure at least one or two lanes will go very well and they can push towers early to an advantage. They can, and will, trade roles occasionally. Just look at the item build flexibility Loda has. He will farm for early, mid or late, as needed. Bulldog will almost always stay greedy, but will try to change styles, coming into fights or staying in jungle. S4 will tempo control if he goes well, if not, Loda and/or Bulldog will pressure the enemy to create space for S4 to catch up, and then he resumes his tempo control. And all of that is only looking at the 3 cores. Akke and EGM are easily one of the best support duos in the world and can complement any of those strategies superbly, going aggressive or passive as needed, while keeping vision on the right places. It is really hard to defeat Alliance now, your lanes need to be superb and then you need to withstand the push or push yourself to not let then recover. All of these against a team with very fine team execution. | ||
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towel
Sweden156 Posts
 Maybe the invites were decided long before wca and starladder. Time to root for another team then (Team Spirit) | ||
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DucK-
Singapore11447 Posts
Meanwhile because of all the attention, loda and s4 have good farm in their lanes and are strong enough to carry the team through mid game. Then they end up with a window where they have 2 big cores + 1 powerful tempo hero. Loda and s4 are the ones alliance rely on to bring them to this window. But if loda and s4 gets shut down, all alliance has is just a single core LD which is crap. Teams need to realise that the farmed LD serves to bring alliance 5man to a higher level, but if its the only farmed hero then it is useless. Also perhaps consider to just straight out ban NP and LD. Who cares if alliance get wisp bat puck Chen. Alliance are not any more special with them than other teams running those heroes. The same can't be said with LD and NP. | ||
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sunrazgriz
Vatican City State1573 Posts
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DucK-
Singapore11447 Posts
On January 19 2016 20:45 sunrazgriz wrote: liquid did ban np and ld , they ended up getting weaver for bulldong and he got the highest kill at the game That game was all kuro fault for picking just earth spirit as their sole disable. | ||
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wims80
1892 Posts
On January 19 2016 22:08 DucK- wrote: That game was all kuro fault for picking just earth spirit as their sole disable. I thought it was Alliance outskilling and outplaying Liquid, but whatever. It's all in the eye of the beholder | ||
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DucK-
Singapore11447 Posts
On January 20 2016 01:08 wims80 wrote: I thought it was Alliance outskilling and outplaying Liquid, but whatever. It's all in the eye of the beholder Alliance played well and drafted well. But Liquid made it easy for them too with that shit draft. | ||
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sang
United States251 Posts
On January 20 2016 02:29 DucK- wrote: Alliance played well and drafted well. But Liquid made it easy for them too with that shit draft. rofl you make no sense whatsoever. Your logic is that Alliance played well and drafted well but we need to attach an astrisk next to it because liquid didn't play/draft up to par... Thats like saying football Team A played better than Team B who didn't play as good...but it would have been different if Team B played better, but maybe still not as good as Team A...because then Team A couldn't have played better than Team B? seriously... I see so many EG/Liquid fanboys and Alliance haters trying to qualify their losses/Alliance's win with conditions of drafting better or playing better or whatever else. Here are the facts: Alliance outdrafted and outplayed both Secret, Liquid and EG to win Starladder. By definition, that means they were better, there is no qualification necessary. Want to know why EG and Liquid drafted/played "poorly"? It wasn't because they are bad. No. It was because Alliance outdrafted and outplayed them. No conditional statements need to be attached. They got beat. Period. | ||
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bluzi
4703 Posts
On January 20 2016 02:29 DucK- wrote: Alliance played well and drafted well. But Liquid made it easy for them too with that shit draft. They made it easy implies they couldve made it harder , hindsight is 20 20 and if you talked to KKY he could explain and convince you that his draft made sense during the pick phases , it just didnt work out as planned , you seem to go around and blaming no stun lineups , but this is the way the game is played , tons of lineups lack hard disables and they still work , are they harder to execute ? sure , do they have plus sides of course , it depends on so many variables that just saying "only ES have stuns" and make it sound like kky is somehow unaware of the amount of stuns his team has is dumb (this is a general respond to other threads where you blame no stun as to why liquid lost). Duck open your eyes please , in EVERY SPORT AND EVERY GAME you can blame the losers for making mistakes that cost them the game : " hey he didnt guard messi and let him put the ball between his legs , his fault barca scored" or you can see it "OMG MESSI IS A GENUIS LOOK AT THAT GOALLLLLLL" , its all in the prespective , and you my friend are biased. | ||
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DucK-
Singapore11447 Posts
My response is because sunrazgriz replied that even with NP/LD banned, Alliance shown that they could just pick Weaver. That is just wrong because the only reason Weaver worked in their draft was because Liquid had a shit draft with only Earth Spirit as their disable. | ||
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DucK-
Singapore11447 Posts
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spudde123
4814 Posts
It is also fine to think a team drafted or played below their usual level. It doesn't mean the other team wasn't better, but it maybe influences how you expect things to go in the future. Whether that thought is accurate or whether perhaps the other team just made you look bad is another story, but even a good team just doing a mistake in draft or play is not anything unusual. | ||
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GinNtoniC
Sweden2945 Posts
On January 20 2016 04:18 DucK- wrote: Look. Alliance played well, and they deserve the win. But the fact is Liquid has a shit draft. Will Liquid win with a better draft? Who knows. My response is because sunrazgriz replied that even with NP/LD banned, Alliance shown that they could just pick Weaver. That is just wrong because the only reason Weaver worked in their draft was because Liquid had a shit draft with only Earth Spirit as their disable. I'm actually right behind you on this one. What you're saying is that Weaver only worked in a particular situation because the enemy team lacked disables. I'm on board with this and this is generally how Weaver functions. I'm as much a diehard [A]-fan as these other lads but I'll admit your analysis is correct on this one. Whether or not you tend to bash on teams not picking enough hard disables, I can't say. I haven't followed your posting history enough. I think you generally try to keep a balanced approach to post-game analysis. It's easy to get carried away and praise the winning team. Alliance did play well. Was their draft great? Sure, considering they got a lot of comfort heroes and know how to play to their strengths. Have they suddenly figured out the patch and are miles ahead of every other team as they were in 2013? Hardly. The competition is much stiffer now than it was 3 years ago. I for one am overjoyed seeing their (our?) great results this past month, but let's not get carried away. I'm convinced both Secret and EG will bounce back, not to mention OG. We have a huge target painted on our backs now; the other teams will be coming for us. | ||
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Zea!
9589 Posts
 :Loda's interview after win  : | ||
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sunrazgriz
Vatican City State1573 Posts
On January 20 2016 04:18 DucK- wrote: Look. Alliance played well, and they deserve the win. But the fact is Liquid has a shit draft. Will Liquid win with a better draft? Who knows. My response is because sunrazgriz replied that even with NP/LD banned, Alliance shown that they could just pick Weaver. That is just wrong because the only reason Weaver worked in their draft was because Liquid had a shit draft with only Earth Spirit as their disable. in game Alliance almost lost ,with DP , IO and gryo sure are better draft , only to FATA fault he died without buyback Alliance had opening to push. but in game two , what you are saying is true, Alliance have a better draft. liquid rely too much on jerax. | ||
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bluzi
4703 Posts
On January 20 2016 07:08 Zea! wrote: Dong's interview before finals :https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T7lEyeRDfh8 Loda's interview after win :https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k7aaUh51nLw Thanks! nice catch good ones for sure | ||
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