EPTwho would you THINK would leave and who would you think they should sign ? (even if you would not want him to leave)
Na`Vi Discussion - Page 18
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Faruko
Chile34167 Posts
who would you THINK would leave and who would you think they should sign ? (even if you would not want him to leave) | ||
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EnSky
Philippines1003 Posts
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EnumaAvalon
Philippines3613 Posts
On July 21 2014 09:48 Faruko wrote: There are rumours of 2 players leaving, Even if its a rumour (which i dont believe, at all) lets play along with them and make little game: who would you THINK would leave and who would you think they should sign ? (even if you would not want him to leave) Where did this rumor come from? But if it's 2, it's either Ppy and Kky or Dondo and XBOCT. | ||
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Faruko
Chile34167 Posts
On July 21 2014 11:07 EnumaAvalon wrote: Where did this rumor come from? But if it's 2, it's either Ppy and Kky or Dondo and XBOCT. Over twitter (Thats why i said i dont believe them, at all), they said there was an argument after the c9 match (shocking I KNOW), and people started talking about it, some people even asked n0point, he completely said they were false, but to be fair, that he took the time to said they were false could either mean A) there are problems or B) they are false, but maybe im reading too much between the lines lol | ||
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EnumaAvalon
Philippines3613 Posts
On July 21 2014 11:36 Faruko wrote: Over twitter (Thats why i said i dont believe them, at all), they said there was an argument after the c9 match (shocking I KNOW), and people started talking about it, some people even asked n0point, he completely said they were false, but to be fair, that he took the time to said they were false could either mean A) there are problems or B) they are false, but maybe im reading too much between the lines lol Ah well. I love this current Na'Vi iteration and I wish them luck in resolving their issues if any. | ||
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Chessz
United States644 Posts
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tadL
Croatia679 Posts
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FHDH
United States7023 Posts
To me this makes the obvious question Xboct. Not only does he not appear to have the fire or the work ethic, but his hero pool and level of play are just insufficient for the current state of the game. Ask yourself this: if Na'Vi dropped Xboct, who would pick him up for a carry? Any top tier team? Any second tier team? Based on how he has been playing this year, I would say no. Xboct, based on his Na'Vi TI4 video profile (see the series on their website) seems incapable of constraining his discontent at the way the team is using him, despite rarely making big plays that don't go the other team's way. In an interview at TI4 he also questioned why anyone would retire after TI4 when the money keeps getting bigger and you can just hang on and retire very comfortably. I would be ok with the former if his performance spoke to being underutilized but it has not. His desire for financial success from the game does not seem matched with work ethic. So maybe Xboct can be convinced to convert his desires into a new year of hard work by all five members of the team. As it is though, if I have to choose between Kky - who does not seem to believe the team can stay how it is - and Xboct, that is an EASY choice. Let Xboct go, and if he really is capable of still being a top-level carry let him go prove it. There are talented young carries out there who can make a big impact and are hungry, guys who would work their asses off if Na'Vi gave them a chance. One last comment: whoever said Dendi's hero pool is incompatible with the current meta, can you expand on this? Dendi can competently play a ridiculous number of heroes, even if he is not known for all of them. If anything the worst part about having Dendi is feeling like you are wasting him if you don't put him on a high-impact hero with a high skill cap (see: Viper, Death's Prophet). | ||
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drusalnik
Bulgaria133 Posts
[B] One last comment: whoever said Dendi's hero pool is incompatible with the current meta, can you expand on this? Dendi can competently play a ridiculous number of heroes, even if he is not known for all of them. If anything the worst part about having Dendi is feeling like you are wasting him if you don't put him on a high-impact hero with a high skill cap (see: Viper, Death's Prophet). Dendi and XBOCT are the 2 people who had the least impact the whole tourney for na'vi. This is mostly because the support duo from Na'Vi doesn't understand how to play this meta and the fact that the game is expanding and just sitting and pulling/farming isn't enough you need to make plays big if you wanna win. Na'Vi played safe whole tournament and got overrun by preaty much every team they faced with a competent duo support. So what i'm saying is just basics there is no synergy between your supports and your core players/carry's. | ||
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FHDH
United States7023 Posts
On July 22 2014 05:15 drusalnik wrote: Dendi and XBOCT are the 2 people who had the least impact the whole tourney for na'vi. This is mostly because the support duo from Na'Vi doesn't understand how to play this meta and the fact that the game is expanding and just sitting and pulling/farming isn't enough you need to make plays big if you wanna win. Na'Vi played safe whole tournament and got overrun by preaty much every team they faced with a competent duo support. So what i'm saying is just basics there is no synergy between your supports and your core players/carry's. Dendi's impact was inconsistent but huge in certain games. That he wasn't put in the position to do a lot in many games, and that a big part of this was the bad support rotations, is something I definitely agree with. It's definitely not about what Dendi can play but what they have practiced as a team. | ||
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Racket
3023 Posts
Dendi always get the best out of confusions and messy fights, as we saw this TI the team didn't quite focused on that but instead they tried to copy/mimic their opponents. Na`Vi always was an active and aggressive team, they changed that (I don't know why, maybe they felt overwhelmed by the lasts patches + lack of practice), it turned out bad. | ||
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EnumaAvalon
Philippines3613 Posts
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Gevna
France2332 Posts
I think this patch is so big in term of meta change and quite recent too, that it will probably take a long time for the teams to figure it out, it's not that dramatic if Puppey is struggling to find a comfort zone. To me, the final showed that newbee definitely was the only team to really understand this patch. | ||
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FHDH
United States7023 Posts
On July 22 2014 08:26 Gevna wrote: I think all five players are fine skill wise. The problem this TI was definitely the draft, the understanding of the meta, and the movements on the map. I feel it's more due to the lack of practice than anything else. So here's the problem. Players on the team knew. I watched Dendi on a rare recent stream where he was on mic talking about how he wants to practice all the time. He wants to win everything. Kuroky is the same way. There are reasons they have not been working like this, and those reasons are players who don't share the work ethic. I don't think that just mysteriously vanishes because they each only got $100k out of this tournament. If any player is not on board with a new Na'Vi that practices hard and has five players with a burning competitive spirit, that player should be gone, because he is holding others back. I've already expressed who I think the problem is in this scenario. Maybe I'm wrong. But I don't think I'm wrong about WHAT the problem is. | ||
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Seraphic
United States3849 Posts
On July 22 2014 10:13 FHDH wrote: So here's the problem. Players on the team knew. I watched Dendi on a rare recent stream where he was on mic talking about how he wants to practice all the time. He wants to win everything. Kuroky is the same way. There are reasons they have not been working like this, and those reasons are players who don't share the work ethic. I don't think that just mysteriously vanishes because they each only got $100k out of this tournament. If any player is not on board with a new Na'Vi that practices hard and has five players with a burning competitive spirit, that player should be gone, because he is holding others back. I've already expressed who I think the problem is in this scenario. Maybe I'm wrong. But I don't think I'm wrong about WHAT the problem is. It's just hard to replace the players on Na'Vi and expect better results honestly. Personally when you talk about Na'Vi's performance, a lot of other fans will come and say that we are just angry fans that want etc etc. Hvost is good... when he is performing well (to say the least) not only can he farm like a mad man, he TPs when his team calls him too. However, his style of play only allows him to be on certain heroes that can offset his overly aggressive mentality. Dendi, as much as I love him, has been having issues regarding heroes of the meta currently which doesn't suit his style of play. Puppey and Kky hasn't been roaming as much as they have done before. This entire TI4 seems like they gone off a different route of style that isn't typical of how they tend to play in the past. VG played nearly identical to how Na'Vi of old used to play. Face rush, over aggressive tower dive and push, backed up by brilliant plays of late game if need be. Unless they solve whatever is troubling them, this team will change. If we like it or not. | ||
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FHDH
United States7023 Posts
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DucK-
Singapore11446 Posts
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FHDH
United States7023 Posts
On July 23 2014 15:40 DucK- wrote: You could say the meta doesn't suit dendi or navi, but I would say why are they even following the meta at all. All their drafts are so focused on trends rather than their strengths. How do you even excel in playing something you're not comfortable in. If you are good, you will do well won your own style. I think this is a ridiculous thing to say anyway. If they spent more time working they would have found their place in the current patch, even if that is exactly the style they were successful with before. Every problem with how they played, including strategy, was problematic from lack of practice. | ||
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LemOn
United Kingdom8629 Posts
I'd like to see all CIS lineup again with at least one up an coming player passionate and hungry for practice | ||
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EnumaAvalon
Philippines3613 Posts
On July 23 2014 16:30 LemOn wrote: I can't see ppy/dendi/xboct being separated. These three ARE Na'Vi and always have been I'd like to see all CIS lineup again with at least one up an coming player passionate and hungry for practice Well, AA looked good in the qualifiers IMO... | ||
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