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Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion - Page 10503

Forum Index > Dota 2 General
Post a Reply
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RIP LiquidDota

TI 2023 thread: https://tl.net/forum/dota-2-general/617317-ti-2023
emperorchampion
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
Canada9496 Posts
Last Edited: 2022-01-25 16:26:19
January 25 2022 16:21 GMT
#210041
On a related note, I suppose that valve is suffering from their own success when it comes to dota and csgo. I imagine that you don't take a job at the best game dev to just work on dota for 10+ years, you want to be on the cutting edge. I can barely work on a project for more than few years before it gets way too tedious. I don't blame valve at all that they don't care about dota anymore. They need to take the csgo route and ditch the international, bring back community funding for individual tournaments and let the scene live or die on it's own.

edit:

In terms of the game itself: fix major bugs and release community tools to allow for map changes and balance changes so that someone who still cares can keep things fresh.
TRUEESPORTS || your days as a respected member of team liquid are over
Faruko
Profile Joined April 2013
Chile34171 Posts
January 25 2022 18:17 GMT
#210042
Ross was right // "Jesus Christ nahaz is doing shots before my eyes" (Sn0_Man, 2018)
Faruko
Profile Joined April 2013
Chile34171 Posts
Last Edited: 2022-01-25 18:25:14
January 25 2022 18:21 GMT
#210043
On January 26 2022 01:14 emperorchampion wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 24 2022 00:53 Faruko wrote:


Well this is just sad


I don't know if "carried", because the game wouldn't exist without turtle rock. But certainly refined. I can believe that the core game loop wasn't really changed after valve got involved.

I think Gabe's quote towards the end about L4D2 sums up my feelings about back 4 blood: why would I get back 4 blood if L4D2 already exists? I think B4B caters to the call of duty crowd that buy games just because they are new and shiny. Of course when you look under the hood and see all the missing features there is no way that turtle rock can compete with the resources and experience at valve.

I think in general so few new game add value to what already exists these days. I really appreciate that valve is one of the companies that tries to innovate when they make new games. Otherwise it's basically just indie devs that are making interesting games.

My personal take about indie games is that, the industry is no longer enticing enough to bring the new brightest minds because Game Developing have not get in times with salaries (probably because paying more while games are having way longer cycles means your budget must go up by a lot)

A hit indie game could make you way more money than working on a big studio for a game, and indie games are doing really well... i do expect the cycle to break a little since we are hitting the points of TOO MANY indie games, meaning not every game is a safe bet.

New minds found a way to generate money for themselves without having to go to a big company.

And with Steam, Nintendo, Microsoft and Sony being so open to bring many indie games to their platform to bolster their offer, its easier than ever.
Ross was right // "Jesus Christ nahaz is doing shots before my eyes" (Sn0_Man, 2018)
Artisreal
Profile Joined June 2009
Germany9235 Posts
January 25 2022 19:43 GMT
#210044
dat new Crossfire RTS game reminded me of KKnD2 Krossfire.

damn that was a fun game to play back then.
passive quaranstream fan
PassiveAce
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States18076 Posts
January 25 2022 21:31 GMT
#210045
On January 26 2022 03:17 Faruko wrote:
https://twitter.com/blizzard_ent/status/1486038723468795906

they should call it "announced survival game"?
Call me Marge Simpson cuz I love you homie
emperorchampion
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
Canada9496 Posts
January 25 2022 23:39 GMT
#210046
On January 26 2022 06:31 PassiveAce wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 26 2022 03:17 Faruko wrote:
https://twitter.com/blizzard_ent/status/1486038723468795906

they should call it "announced survival game"?

would be in-line with the blizzard quality we've come to expect over the past few years
TRUEESPORTS || your days as a respected member of team liquid are over
emperorchampion
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
Canada9496 Posts
January 25 2022 23:47 GMT
#210047
On January 26 2022 03:21 Faruko wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 26 2022 01:14 emperorchampion wrote:
On January 24 2022 00:53 Faruko wrote:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EdRLNUGmFC8

Well this is just sad


I don't know if "carried", because the game wouldn't exist without turtle rock. But certainly refined. I can believe that the core game loop wasn't really changed after valve got involved.

I think Gabe's quote towards the end about L4D2 sums up my feelings about back 4 blood: why would I get back 4 blood if L4D2 already exists? I think B4B caters to the call of duty crowd that buy games just because they are new and shiny. Of course when you look under the hood and see all the missing features there is no way that turtle rock can compete with the resources and experience at valve.

I think in general so few new game add value to what already exists these days. I really appreciate that valve is one of the companies that tries to innovate when they make new games. Otherwise it's basically just indie devs that are making interesting games.

My personal take about indie games is that, the industry is no longer enticing enough to bring the new brightest minds because Game Developing have not get in times with salaries (probably because paying more while games are having way longer cycles means your budget must go up by a lot)

A hit indie game could make you way more money than working on a big studio for a game, and indie games are doing really well... i do expect the cycle to break a little since we are hitting the points of TOO MANY indie games, meaning not every game is a safe bet.

New minds found a way to generate money for themselves without having to go to a big company.

And with Steam, Nintendo, Microsoft and Sony being so open to bring many indie games to their platform to bolster their offer, its easier than ever.


I'm not sure if game dev was ever really about the salary, but I don't know how things were in the 90s. I agree though that you can make more as an indie dev if you have a great game, though it's like that with every "startup", you trade some stability and security for potentially big money.
TRUEESPORTS || your days as a respected member of team liquid are over
quitsmoking02
Profile Joined January 2022
1 Post
Last Edited: 2022-01-26 07:36:25
January 26 2022 07:36 GMT
#210048
Bot edit.

User was banned for this post.
Faruko
Profile Joined April 2013
Chile34171 Posts
January 26 2022 12:54 GMT
#210049
On January 26 2022 08:47 emperorchampion wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 26 2022 03:21 Faruko wrote:
On January 26 2022 01:14 emperorchampion wrote:
On January 24 2022 00:53 Faruko wrote:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EdRLNUGmFC8

Well this is just sad


I don't know if "carried", because the game wouldn't exist without turtle rock. But certainly refined. I can believe that the core game loop wasn't really changed after valve got involved.

I think Gabe's quote towards the end about L4D2 sums up my feelings about back 4 blood: why would I get back 4 blood if L4D2 already exists? I think B4B caters to the call of duty crowd that buy games just because they are new and shiny. Of course when you look under the hood and see all the missing features there is no way that turtle rock can compete with the resources and experience at valve.

I think in general so few new game add value to what already exists these days. I really appreciate that valve is one of the companies that tries to innovate when they make new games. Otherwise it's basically just indie devs that are making interesting games.

My personal take about indie games is that, the industry is no longer enticing enough to bring the new brightest minds because Game Developing have not get in times with salaries (probably because paying more while games are having way longer cycles means your budget must go up by a lot)

A hit indie game could make you way more money than working on a big studio for a game, and indie games are doing really well... i do expect the cycle to break a little since we are hitting the points of TOO MANY indie games, meaning not every game is a safe bet.

New minds found a way to generate money for themselves without having to go to a big company.

And with Steam, Nintendo, Microsoft and Sony being so open to bring many indie games to their platform to bolster their offer, its easier than ever.


I'm not sure if game dev was ever really about the salary, but I don't know how things were in the 90s. I agree though that you can make more as an indie dev if you have a great game, though it's like that with every "startup", you trade some stability and security for potentially big money.


I just that until id say early 2010, indie games were kinda hard to distribute, nowadays everyone is doing it so its a lot easier to get your game out
Ross was right // "Jesus Christ nahaz is doing shots before my eyes" (Sn0_Man, 2018)
emperorchampion
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
Canada9496 Posts
Last Edited: 2022-01-26 14:01:45
January 26 2022 13:58 GMT
#210050
On January 26 2022 21:54 Faruko wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 26 2022 08:47 emperorchampion wrote:
On January 26 2022 03:21 Faruko wrote:
On January 26 2022 01:14 emperorchampion wrote:
On January 24 2022 00:53 Faruko wrote:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EdRLNUGmFC8

Well this is just sad


I don't know if "carried", because the game wouldn't exist without turtle rock. But certainly refined. I can believe that the core game loop wasn't really changed after valve got involved.

I think Gabe's quote towards the end about L4D2 sums up my feelings about back 4 blood: why would I get back 4 blood if L4D2 already exists? I think B4B caters to the call of duty crowd that buy games just because they are new and shiny. Of course when you look under the hood and see all the missing features there is no way that turtle rock can compete with the resources and experience at valve.

I think in general so few new game add value to what already exists these days. I really appreciate that valve is one of the companies that tries to innovate when they make new games. Otherwise it's basically just indie devs that are making interesting games.

My personal take about indie games is that, the industry is no longer enticing enough to bring the new brightest minds because Game Developing have not get in times with salaries (probably because paying more while games are having way longer cycles means your budget must go up by a lot)

A hit indie game could make you way more money than working on a big studio for a game, and indie games are doing really well... i do expect the cycle to break a little since we are hitting the points of TOO MANY indie games, meaning not every game is a safe bet.

New minds found a way to generate money for themselves without having to go to a big company.

And with Steam, Nintendo, Microsoft and Sony being so open to bring many indie games to their platform to bolster their offer, its easier than ever.


I'm not sure if game dev was ever really about the salary, but I don't know how things were in the 90s. I agree though that you can make more as an indie dev if you have a great game, though it's like that with every "startup", you trade some stability and security for potentially big money.


I just that until id say early 2010, indie games were kinda hard to distribute, nowadays everyone is doing it so its a lot easier to get your game out


Very true, the steam green light program was definitely a game (heh) changer. Also tools like blender, game engines and just general programming knowledge have exploded in the last few years. I imagine that even 10 years ago you had to be a programmer to make a game, with the tools that exist now I don't think you really need to know that much to get started.


edit: I suppose that in the physical game days you could still develop the game independently (assuming you had the skills), then you just had to find a publisher to distribute it. I have no idea what cut the publishers took, but I imagine the standard rate was slightly above the 30% that valve asks for now.
TRUEESPORTS || your days as a respected member of team liquid are over
Faruko
Profile Joined April 2013
Chile34171 Posts
January 26 2022 22:11 GMT
#210051
Replaying ME with the Legendary Edition

Mordin, Garrus and Wrex might be the best companions ever, especially mordin
Ross was right // "Jesus Christ nahaz is doing shots before my eyes" (Sn0_Man, 2018)
PoulsenB
Profile Joined June 2011
Poland7711 Posts
January 26 2022 22:14 GMT
#210052
On January 27 2022 07:11 Faruko wrote:
Replaying ME with the Legendary Edition

Mordin, Garrus and Wrex might be the best companions ever, especially mordin

yeah they are great

I should finally play LE as well, I only done prologue in ME1 so far
IdrA fan forever <3 || the clueless one || Marci must be protected at all costs
Erasme
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
Bahamas15899 Posts
Last Edited: 2022-01-27 08:53:34
January 27 2022 08:45 GMT
#210053
garrus is the goat
its also perfect for the hardest difficulty cuz hes a sniper
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d7lxwFEB6FI “‘Drain the swamp’? Stupid saying, means nothing, but you guys loved it so I kept saying it.”
keoni0369
Profile Joined January 2022
1 Post
Last Edited: 2022-01-27 09:10:20
January 27 2022 09:10 GMT
#210054
Bot edit.

User was banned for this post.
goody153
Profile Blog Joined April 2013
44122 Posts
January 27 2022 10:47 GMT
#210055
Being sick sucks and this is probably covid
On January 27 2022 07:11 Faruko wrote:
Replaying ME with the Legendary Edition

Mordin, Garrus and Wrex might be the best companions ever, especially mordin

I really have to play this game at some point. I did enjoy their dragon age franchise
this is a quote
Faruko
Profile Joined April 2013
Chile34171 Posts
January 27 2022 11:27 GMT
#210056
On January 27 2022 17:45 Erasme wrote:
garrus is the goat
its also perfect for the hardest difficulty cuz hes a sniper


Also this

Ross was right // "Jesus Christ nahaz is doing shots before my eyes" (Sn0_Man, 2018)
Erasme
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
Bahamas15899 Posts
Last Edited: 2022-01-27 11:30:46
January 27 2022 11:29 GMT
#210057
rofl i was so sure goinjg full sniper squad was the best but now i gotta try this

On January 27 2022 19:47 goody153 wrote:
Being sick sucks and this is probably covid
Show nested quote +
On January 27 2022 07:11 Faruko wrote:
Replaying ME with the Legendary Edition

Mordin, Garrus and Wrex might be the best companions ever, especially mordin

I really have to play this game at some point. I did enjoy their dragon age franchise


ME is so far above dragon age its not even funny
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d7lxwFEB6FI “‘Drain the swamp’? Stupid saying, means nothing, but you guys loved it so I kept saying it.”
PoulsenB
Profile Joined June 2011
Poland7711 Posts
Last Edited: 2022-01-27 12:37:19
January 27 2022 12:35 GMT
#210058
On January 27 2022 20:27 Faruko wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 27 2022 17:45 Erasme wrote:
garrus is the goat
its also perfect for the hardest difficulty cuz hes a sniper


Also this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZPbB4qfsA14

I tried this out in my last playthrough, it's so stupidly strong I refused to use it lmao. It also works on James and Ashley.
IdrA fan forever <3 || the clueless one || Marci must be protected at all costs
botanicalfarms569
Profile Joined January 2022
1 Post
Last Edited: 2022-01-28 16:19:06
January 28 2022 16:19 GMT
#210059
Bot edit.

User was banned for this post.
Faruko
Profile Joined April 2013
Chile34171 Posts
January 29 2022 15:22 GMT
#210060
On January 27 2022 20:29 Erasme wrote:
rofl i was so sure goinjg full sniper squad was the best but now i gotta try this

Show nested quote +
On January 27 2022 19:47 goody153 wrote:
Being sick sucks and this is probably covid
On January 27 2022 07:11 Faruko wrote:
Replaying ME with the Legendary Edition

Mordin, Garrus and Wrex might be the best companions ever, especially mordin

I really have to play this game at some point. I did enjoy their dragon age franchise


ME is so far above dragon age its not even funny

Bioware should have just went full ME world and make spin offs and all that. I can see an Assassin's creed kinda game with Thane, a full action game with Garrus, a game ala star wars squadrons, hell even rts with all the races and what not.

So much wasted potential
Ross was right // "Jesus Christ nahaz is doing shots before my eyes" (Sn0_Man, 2018)
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