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On April 17 2012 06:46 Judicator wrote:Show nested quote +On April 17 2012 05:49 Tryhat wrote:On April 17 2012 04:40 Ack1027 wrote:On April 17 2012 04:37 Comeh wrote:On April 17 2012 04:30 Ack1027 wrote:On April 17 2012 04:26 Yoshi- wrote:
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in dota1 morphling wouldn't gain any hp while under the effect of ice blast(when he morphs from agi to str)
in dota2 this does happen • HP freeze prevents most kinds of healing including those from skills or items. Morph's stat morph is not healing, its intended to keep the same hp %. If you are at 50% hp and then drop a vanguard, you should still be at 50% hp. So in fact, what you're complaining about as a bug is not even a bug, its just following the rules of AA's ulti. Buff? And, to respond to your condescending tone, the problem here-in-lies that there is an inconsistency issue between dota 1 and dota 2, and the inconsistency lies in the engine limitation of WC3. The question remains, should we stick with the dota 1 trend and cling to the WC3 engine as close as we can, or stick with how it works in Dota 2? That or I don't understand anything. ? What is so hard to understand about this? Anything that the engine in wc3 did not allow Icefrog to do, he is going to take the opportunity to make it work the way he, the game creator, wants it to work in dota2. As already explained, it's not a bug, it's not a buff, its just that in dota1 morph doesn't keep the same ratio of HP when he morphs. However, if you look at the rules of AA's ulti and Morph's Morph. It should logically follow to anyone who has read those skills that Morph should ' gain hp ' <----- again wrong term. In other words: He *should* gain hp, but he *doesn't.* That's what people are calling a bug, and that's what you are so angry with them for. Yet you seem to agree with them... The fuck is wrong with people that they can't do simple math? 50% of 1000 HP = 500 50% of 1500 HP = 750 That is why you see Morph's current HP rise not because he's magically gaining HP, relative amounts are the same, quit dealing with absolutes.
I might ask what's wrong with people who can't seem to comprehend what they just read. No one has talkd about what you're going on about, but good job explaining it I guess?
Also, I have a Ph.D. in mathematics. You?
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^ lol proof or gtfo (please  )
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wowow . step back. we got a bad ass over here. Ph.D in Maths. well done sir
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and for that (stupid) kunkka splash+lothar sh!t, i will email icefrog right now >_>
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On April 17 2012 08:42 BurningSera wrote:
and for that (stupid) kunkka crit+lothar sh!t, i will email icefrog right now >_>
Argh it is not stupid!! *watches as an entire wave of creeps die in one hit*
So beautiful.
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On April 17 2012 08:44 Nilrem wrote:Show nested quote +On April 17 2012 08:42 BurningSera wrote:
and for that (stupid) kunkka crit+lothar sh!t, i will email icefrog right now >_> Argh it is not stupid!! *watches as an entire wave of creeps die in one hit* So beautiful.
I will not admit the fact that our team just get owned by the same sh!t and now i have a legit reason to email him
Game in spoiler:
+ Show Spoiler +i bought gem to prevent that gay shit to happen but our retarded bh killed the gem after i died. in the next battle kunkka ww come in and splash three of these guys who had no idea that would happen and die instantly. game id 11588381. i flamed them: yes, your magic wand or null talisman is more important than winning game.
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On April 17 2012 08:49 BurningSera wrote:Show nested quote +On April 17 2012 08:44 Nilrem wrote:On April 17 2012 08:42 BurningSera wrote:
and for that (stupid) kunkka crit+lothar sh!t, i will email icefrog right now >_> Argh it is not stupid!! *watches as an entire wave of creeps die in one hit* So beautiful. I will not admit the fact that our team just get owned by the same sh!t and now i have a legit reason to email him Game in spoiler: + Show Spoiler +i bought gem to prevent that gay shit to happen but our retarded bh killed the gem after i died. in the next battle kunkka ww come in and splash three of these guys who had no idea that would happen and die instantly. game id 11588381. i flamed them: yes, your magic wand or null talisman is more important for winning game.
I am sure you have good intentions but... you are making me want to log on and use it right now. Although I play primarily SD/RD so might be difficult haha.
I did watch portions of the replay. Man, the laning against him was terrible. Although he got some deaths, he was allowed to free-farm so much. It was like asking for him to get his gear. Like, he took the T1 bottom tower without issues, and managed to start attacking the T2 (on his own) before anyone even went to do anything.
For myself, I think it is one of those subtle tricks where it is nice to have in the game. It makes the item play a unique role for Kunkka, and I am all for uniqueness in the game. I understand how it can be considered strong and annoyed. I have laned against him and the splash, with a competent player is so annoying. But still, it forces you into a different play style. It is like going against SA. You are now forced to play differently as a team.
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He's since been rebuffed a bit but everything is a bit weaker, stat growths, tidebringer radius/cd, ult cd, etc. but the point is, having a hero that is almost completely luck-based in its implementation lategame tends to not be a good idea, especially in a way that is significantly stronger than its dota counterpart
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got into a discussion while playing yesterday. my friend randomed CM. I commented what a crappy hero she was and he defended with these points
1. mana regen aura is really good
2. amazing slow, and amazing disable
my point was she's terrible cuz she has crappy ms. a support like wd can throw a stun do his thing and hide back, cm can't do that.
also her ult is more or less useless cuz she needs t be in e middle of a tf where shell die instantly and it'll get cancelled in a second and damage is so inconsistent. mana regen aura is useless given how common arcane boots are.
and when it comes to slow veno does it better and if I'm not wrong frostbite has terrible cast range.
wanna here your thoughts.
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On April 17 2012 09:26 Nilrem wrote:Show nested quote +On April 17 2012 08:49 BurningSera wrote:On April 17 2012 08:44 Nilrem wrote:On April 17 2012 08:42 BurningSera wrote:
and for that (stupid) kunkka crit+lothar sh!t, i will email icefrog right now >_> Argh it is not stupid!! *watches as an entire wave of creeps die in one hit* So beautiful. I will not admit the fact that our team just get owned by the same sh!t and now i have a legit reason to email him Game in spoiler: + Show Spoiler +i bought gem to prevent that gay shit to happen but our retarded bh killed the gem after i died. in the next battle kunkka ww come in and splash three of these guys who had no idea that would happen and die instantly. game id 11588381. i flamed them: yes, your magic wand or null talisman is more important for winning game. I am sure you have good intentions but... you are making me want to log on and use it right now. Although I play primarily SD/RD so might be difficult haha. I did watch portions of the replay. Man, the laning against him was terrible. Although he got some deaths, he was allowed to free-farm so much. It was like asking for him to get his gear. Like, he took the T1 bottom tower without issues, and managed to start attacking the T2 (on his own) before anyone even went to do anything. For myself, I think it is one of those subtle tricks where it is nice to have in the game. It makes the item play a unique role for Kunkka, and I am all for uniqueness in the game. I understand how it can be considered strong and annoyed. I have laned against him and the splash, with a competent player is so annoying. But still, it forces you into a different play style. It is like going against SA. You are now forced to play differently as a team.
rofl it's around 50mins mark at the sentinel's bot t3 if you wanna see that 'lol?' moment. and bh killed the gem after i ninja ultied furi and morph across the river.
i dont think that sh!t should exist in dota because it is a stupidly cheap and overly effective build that allow you to abuse an opportunistic one hit gg game mechanic (which is something shouldnt exist in dota).
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I am not an expert on CM late game, but she has more potential and damage output than veno early game. Her cooldowns in general are less than venos. The slow for veno is ok, but Cm is much strong. What makes veno great is his ability to damage even while dead (plague wards and ult), there is also the ability to keep eyes all around the hero with the wards.
Venomancers cooldown is 22 seconds for gale. That is quite a lot and does not really allow multiple uses. Keep in mind with Wd's stun, it is similar to WR's in that, it needs something near by. Although more specific, it needs something to bounce off of. So it can be brilliant or really short (so very situational), where as for CM, it just depends on CD.
For myself, I do not think of her as terrible. She has her place, and there are better supports out there that I would rather have. But still would not go so far as to say she is crappy.
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every time I see cm drafted even in pro games she is usually the one always dying every single team fight. ppl harp about her AOE slow but AA can do that better.
the reason I bring this up is cuz why do so many ppl still draft CM when I believe there are better supports.
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On April 17 2012 11:22 frucisky wrote:
got into a discussion while playing yesterday. my friend randomed CM. I commented what a crappy hero she was and he defended with these points
1. mana regen aura is really good
2. amazing slow, and amazing disable
my point was she's terrible cuz she has crappy ms. a support like wd can throw a stun do his thing and hide back, cm can't do that.
also her ult is more or less useless cuz she needs t be in e middle of a tf where shell die instantly and it'll get cancelled in a second and damage is so inconsistent. mana regen aura is useless given how common arcane boots are.
and when it comes to slow veno does it better and if I'm not wrong frostbite has terrible cast range.
wanna here your thoughts.
obviously there are pros and cons for every hero in dota. cm's greatest strength imo is her early laning power. cheapest slow+disable in early can be very deadly. for example last night, my m8 randomed cm and he told me to pick a hero for laning with her....i picked jugger,,,go figure what happened lol (dota2 game id:11407145 if you are interested).
personally when i play cm i dont max out the aura asap anymore, unless there is some nukers in team. bite+nova is too good (in early and when chasing).
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On April 17 2012 11:22 frucisky wrote:
got into a discussion while playing yesterday. my friend randomed CM. I commented what a crappy hero she was and he defended with these points
1. mana regen aura is really good
2. amazing slow, and amazing disable
my point was she's terrible cuz she has crappy ms. a support like wd can throw a stun do his thing and hide back, cm can't do that.
also her ult is more or less useless cuz she needs t be in e middle of a tf where shell die instantly and it'll get cancelled in a second and damage is so inconsistent. mana regen aura is useless given how common arcane boots are.
and when it comes to slow veno does it better and if I'm not wrong frostbite has terrible cast range.
wanna here your thoughts.
CM used to be top tier support. She's still very strong, altho a bit less popular than before.
Her aura is amazing early game and lets your team spam more spells, which usually translates into being able to win lane a little harder. Arcane boots do make her aura a bit less useful, but the aura is mostly geared towards laning phase, where not every lane/hero will have arcane. Most people don't level her aura past 2, since you want your first two skills to have levels and by the time you can get lvl 3/4 aura arcane boots makes it negligible. Her nova is a spammable, extremely long range aoe nuke that has a significant slow. CM's frostbite is a long snare that assists ganks extremely well. Overall, her kits has a ton of utility.
She isn't without flaws tho. Yes, her movespeed is terrible, but your spells are such long range you really shouldn't be in the middle of the fray anyways. You do tend to die in teamfights 'cause of your crappy stats, but honestly, as a support that's not that big a deal. CM's ulti is rather useless, but her other three skills are so strong it's worth picking her just for that.
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CM is one of the best supports in the game, period. I'd also argue she's the best support with 0 farm.
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On April 17 2012 11:53 Itsmedudeman wrote:
CM is one of the best supports in the game, period. I'd also argue she's the best support with 0 farm.
I sort of prefer SS over CM. But that is due to the sheer number of CC abilities.
(Grats on 5555 posts)
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At least in the dota2 comp scene CM is still very popular, especially when it comes to laning with a melee. Her laning is way stronger than veno/venge.
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Agreed ^^. SS can nuke, push, has more disables. my main issue with her spells are that 2 of em are useless. aura is useful early laning phase and more or less null after arcane.
SS also usually ends up dying cuz he CC but gets nuked down early. but he contributes so much more to teamfights
plus if SS gets farm he can do more, CM is q useless with or without farm.
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On April 17 2012 12:04 frucisky wrote:
Agreed ^^. SS can nuke, push, has more disables. my main issue with her spells are that 2 of em are useless. aura is useful early laning phase and more or less null after arcane.
SS also usually ends up dying cuz he CC but gets nuked down early. but he contributes so much more to teamfights
plus if SS gets farm he can do more, CM is q useless with or without farm.
why would cm be a stronger laner than veno or venge. venos poison harass is sick vs melee heroes and wards keep the carry safe against forest ganks.
vs just has more has damage if I'm jot wrong so better harass.
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EPT
