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On January 04 2013 03:30 MiQ wrote:
I wish I could make promises and work on nothing for 8 months and still keep my job.
Yeah damn, to be fair they have been doing stuff and the game is slightly better than it was at release, but not by much.
I would have thought blizz would moderate their development teams better to make sure they didn't completely fuck the name of their company, a lot of people don't know that D3 is made by a completely different team to their other games.
Still, when you put your company logo on something you better make sure that thing has quality, blizz didn't need this shit stain on their name and they should be more careful with who they let design and what they let them do in the future.
I don't know how the design team of D3 still has their job, I guess blizz shareholders are happy that Jay managed to gouge millions out of diablo fans with this turd but the mark it leaves on their brand is going to render any gains pointless.
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will there be duels for money ?
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On January 04 2013 07:25 YourMom wrote:
will there be duels for money ?
Blizzard will take 15% of it.
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On January 04 2013 07:30 Chairman Ray wrote:Blizzard will take 15% of it.
Lol... now that I think about it, maybe Blizz is just holding out trying to figure out a way to monetize PvP.
Fantasy Diablo 3 TDM. Bet on teams/players and win money with Blizz taking a cut. Makes more and more sense now!
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On December 30 2012 04:10 Assault_1 wrote:
so blizz can balance the world's most popular and complex RTS games but cant balance a battle arena?
nope, ever play WoW arenas? never has been completely balanced and never will be lol.
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On January 04 2013 07:25 YourMom wrote:
will there be duels for money ?
in hardcore mode too imo
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I am honestly surprised they haven't implemented a HC hero revive for $30 or something.
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On January 04 2013 07:45 Burrfoot wrote:Show nested quote +On January 04 2013 07:30 Chairman Ray wrote:On January 04 2013 07:25 YourMom wrote:
will there be duels for money ? Blizzard will take 15% of it. Lol... now that I think about it, maybe Blizz is just holding out trying to figure out a way to monetize PvP. Fantasy Diablo 3 TDM. Bet on teams/players and win money with Blizz taking a cut. Makes more and more sense now!
We already know that's the case.
They insist on using PvE gear in PvP. Also they insist on it being "competitive" PvP.
PvE gear + competitive will never add up successfully if you want fair, balanced gameplay.
The only way that equation makes sense is if...
PvE gear + competitive = monetized PvP through RMAH to be competitive.
Take away the competitive format, and you will have a fun PvP mode with happy customers, but not monetized PvP.
Take away the PvE gear and you will have happy customers and competitive PvP, but not monetized.
Now their formula makes sense....
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On January 04 2013 12:36 Spyridon wrote:Show nested quote +On January 04 2013 07:45 Burrfoot wrote:On January 04 2013 07:30 Chairman Ray wrote:On January 04 2013 07:25 YourMom wrote:
will there be duels for money ? Blizzard will take 15% of it. Lol... now that I think about it, maybe Blizz is just holding out trying to figure out a way to monetize PvP. Fantasy Diablo 3 TDM. Bet on teams/players and win money with Blizz taking a cut. Makes more and more sense now! We already know that's the case. They insist on using PvE gear in PvP. Also they insist on it being "competitive" PvP. PvE gear + competitive will never add up successfully if you want fair, balanced gameplay. The only way that equation makes sense is if... PvE gear + competitive = monetized PvP through RMAH to be competitive. Take away the competitive format, and you will have a fun PvP mode with happy customers, but not monetized PvP. Take away the PvE gear and you will have happy customers and competitive PvP, but not monetized. Now their formula makes sense....
Um, they specifically said that PvP was not meant to be competitive. At least not in the eSports sense. If you mean competitive as in you can brag about being better than other people and that it would have some semblance of balance, then ya, I guess they did insist on that.
Anyways, whether they have PvP gear or PvE gear it all goes through the AH (I'm assuming) and they'll get their cut that way.
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On January 04 2013 13:22 Wuster wrote:Show nested quote +On January 04 2013 12:36 Spyridon wrote:On January 04 2013 07:45 Burrfoot wrote:On January 04 2013 07:30 Chairman Ray wrote:On January 04 2013 07:25 YourMom wrote:
will there be duels for money ? Blizzard will take 15% of it. Lol... now that I think about it, maybe Blizz is just holding out trying to figure out a way to monetize PvP. Fantasy Diablo 3 TDM. Bet on teams/players and win money with Blizz taking a cut. Makes more and more sense now! We already know that's the case. They insist on using PvE gear in PvP. Also they insist on it being "competitive" PvP. PvE gear + competitive will never add up successfully if you want fair, balanced gameplay. The only way that equation makes sense is if... PvE gear + competitive = monetized PvP through RMAH to be competitive. Take away the competitive format, and you will have a fun PvP mode with happy customers, but not monetized PvP. Take away the PvE gear and you will have happy customers and competitive PvP, but not monetized. Now their formula makes sense.... Um, they specifically said that PvP was not meant to be competitive. At least not in the eSports sense. If you mean competitive as in you can brag about being better than other people and that it would have some semblance of balance, then ya, I guess they did insist on that. Anyways, whether they have PvP gear or PvE gear it all goes through the AH (I'm assuming) and they'll get their cut that way.
I love when blizzard gives those lame reasons
"not meant to be competitive" means they're too lazy to balance it
removing skill/stat trees is more simplified game design
removing team deathmatch because once again, too lazy to balance
look how simple the items are.. every class looks for the same 5 stats.
this game couldve been made by a small company in 12 months
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My money says they will try to turn d3 pvp into a dota/moba-style game type. That's what I hear when he talks about adding deeper objective game play and possible PvE elements in PvP.
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On January 04 2013 10:48 zbedlam wrote:
I am honestly surprised they haven't implemented a HC hero revive for $30 or something.
Come on Blizz are bad sometimes but this ain't WarZ 
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On January 04 2013 13:22 Wuster wrote:Show nested quote +On January 04 2013 12:36 Spyridon wrote:On January 04 2013 07:45 Burrfoot wrote:On January 04 2013 07:30 Chairman Ray wrote:On January 04 2013 07:25 YourMom wrote:
will there be duels for money ? Blizzard will take 15% of it. Lol... now that I think about it, maybe Blizz is just holding out trying to figure out a way to monetize PvP. Fantasy Diablo 3 TDM. Bet on teams/players and win money with Blizz taking a cut. Makes more and more sense now! We already know that's the case. They insist on using PvE gear in PvP. Also they insist on it being "competitive" PvP. PvE gear + competitive will never add up successfully if you want fair, balanced gameplay. The only way that equation makes sense is if... PvE gear + competitive = monetized PvP through RMAH to be competitive. Take away the competitive format, and you will have a fun PvP mode with happy customers, but not monetized PvP. Take away the PvE gear and you will have happy customers and competitive PvP, but not monetized. Now their formula makes sense.... Um, they specifically said that PvP was not meant to be competitive. At least not in the eSports sense. If you mean competitive as in you can brag about being better than other people and that it would have some semblance of balance, then ya, I guess they did insist on that. Anyways, whether they have PvP gear or PvE gear it all goes through the AH (I'm assuming) and they'll get their cut that way.
Why would balance issues be one of the primary reasons to delay it if it wasn't competitive?
Or better yet... If it's not intended to be competitive, then why did Jay say in the PvP blog "if TDM was casual PvP like WoW BG things would be fine"?
If it's not casual PvP, then what would be appropriate to call it other than "competitive"?
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I still think rmah is the biggest mistake they brought into d3. pay to win is just a horrible concept. but i see that there are costs (servers, maintenance etc.) they want to keep covered. it's still better than a monthy fee. i'd never pay a fee for a video game.
yes there is an alternative to 'pay to win': farm like a madman. but it's just boring. d2 for me was leveling and trading. the gold ah is a cool idea which makes trading forums not so important anymore. the 15% blizz scam keeps d2jsp alive though. ive never been a real hardcore d2 player and never really battled pvp there. but d2 was the best rpg i ever played and i always fell back to it.
me and most of my friends stopped playing d3 since a few weeks/months. it's just boring and not rewarding. the game engine is freaking fantastic and beautiful and i would love to keep on playing. but leveling is no part of the game since you can get a char to lvl 60 within hours. and the loot is 99% crap. uber bosses are a waste since the ring is just too bad. paragon levels are ok, but i have no real motivation to level them. MF doesnt make the loot better. just more crap.
i'd love a tdm arena thing to just battle with my friends. even if there is no real balance. would be fun and bring some players back. also there are so many ways to tweak balance. capping dmg/stats, debuffs, extra pvp gear etc etc... i dont like the dota system but i think it would be a fantastic pvp method for d3 too. and not even too hard to implement. for blizzdudes.
this all makes me think that blizz doesn't put enough effort into the game. if they really worked hard on a solution there would have been one months ago. i don't really get why.
no way you can call d3 a bad game. the lack of endgame is a major complaint. but it is better than most other games.
just my thoughts =)
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The flip side of "pay2win" I that you can "cashout". I'm preparing my tax package for my return after buying a whole bunch of stock on te 31st (woo fiscal cliff!) and made sure I safely avoided the 20k/200 limit on PayPal transactions before they report income to the fed. (Made $4k tax free from D3 in 2012)
So don't hate on pay2win! I love it!
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On January 04 2013 13:53 Assault_1 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 04 2013 13:22 Wuster wrote:On January 04 2013 12:36 Spyridon wrote:On January 04 2013 07:45 Burrfoot wrote:On January 04 2013 07:30 Chairman Ray wrote:On January 04 2013 07:25 YourMom wrote:
will there be duels for money ? Blizzard will take 15% of it. Lol... now that I think about it, maybe Blizz is just holding out trying to figure out a way to monetize PvP. Fantasy Diablo 3 TDM. Bet on teams/players and win money with Blizz taking a cut. Makes more and more sense now! We already know that's the case. They insist on using PvE gear in PvP. Also they insist on it being "competitive" PvP. PvE gear + competitive will never add up successfully if you want fair, balanced gameplay. The only way that equation makes sense is if... PvE gear + competitive = monetized PvP through RMAH to be competitive. Take away the competitive format, and you will have a fun PvP mode with happy customers, but not monetized PvP. Take away the PvE gear and you will have happy customers and competitive PvP, but not monetized. Now their formula makes sense.... Um, they specifically said that PvP was not meant to be competitive. At least not in the eSports sense. If you mean competitive as in you can brag about being better than other people and that it would have some semblance of balance, then ya, I guess they did insist on that. Anyways, whether they have PvP gear or PvE gear it all goes through the AH (I'm assuming) and they'll get their cut that way. I love when blizzard gives those lame reasons "not meant to be competitive" means they're too lazy to balance it removing skill/stat trees is more simplified game design removing team deathmatch because once again, too lazy to balance look how simple the items are.. every class looks for the same 5 stats. this game couldve been made by a small company in 12 months
I don't think you read the blog very well. They never gave the indication that they were being lazy imho. They said that TDM as it existed had a very limited appeal and rather than release something that they didn't feel measured up to their company's standards they're shelving it for now. I don't see how that makes them lazy? I'm a software developer as well and I wouldn't want my name attached to something that I don't think is the best possible quality I can produce. If they can find a way to make it fun and viable long term then I'm sure they'll add it.
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On January 04 2013 23:20 Achaia wrote:Show nested quote +On January 04 2013 13:53 Assault_1 wrote:On January 04 2013 13:22 Wuster wrote:On January 04 2013 12:36 Spyridon wrote:On January 04 2013 07:45 Burrfoot wrote:On January 04 2013 07:30 Chairman Ray wrote:On January 04 2013 07:25 YourMom wrote:
will there be duels for money ? Blizzard will take 15% of it. Lol... now that I think about it, maybe Blizz is just holding out trying to figure out a way to monetize PvP. Fantasy Diablo 3 TDM. Bet on teams/players and win money with Blizz taking a cut. Makes more and more sense now! We already know that's the case. They insist on using PvE gear in PvP. Also they insist on it being "competitive" PvP. PvE gear + competitive will never add up successfully if you want fair, balanced gameplay. The only way that equation makes sense is if... PvE gear + competitive = monetized PvP through RMAH to be competitive. Take away the competitive format, and you will have a fun PvP mode with happy customers, but not monetized PvP. Take away the PvE gear and you will have happy customers and competitive PvP, but not monetized. Now their formula makes sense.... Um, they specifically said that PvP was not meant to be competitive. At least not in the eSports sense. If you mean competitive as in you can brag about being better than other people and that it would have some semblance of balance, then ya, I guess they did insist on that. Anyways, whether they have PvP gear or PvE gear it all goes through the AH (I'm assuming) and they'll get their cut that way. I love when blizzard gives those lame reasons "not meant to be competitive" means they're too lazy to balance it removing skill/stat trees is more simplified game design removing team deathmatch because once again, too lazy to balance look how simple the items are.. every class looks for the same 5 stats. this game couldve been made by a small company in 12 months I don't think you read the blog very well. They never gave the indication that they were being lazy imho. They said that TDM as it existed had a very limited appeal and rather than release something that they didn't feel measured up to their company's standards they're shelving it for now. I don't see how that makes them lazy? I'm a software developer as well and I wouldn't want my name attached to something that I don't think is the best possible quality I can produce. If they can find a way to make it fun and viable long term then I'm sure they'll add it.
How can you trust the internal testers, their logic is ridiculously flawed. They let a boring key hunt for a ring get implemented but decide to scrap TDM? The people who played it at blizzcon certainly gave good feedback on it.
Off the top of my head heres some of the things they couldve done
- 1v1/2v2/ffa etc ladder system
- betting gold on the matches before the round begins
- allowing random monsters to fight with you
- spectator/replay system
The best part is that most of those can be taken straight from the sc2 engine. Theres no way something like that would be "boring" if done correctly. Hardly any effort was put into the D2 pvp, yet it was mad fun. When they say boring its obvious theres other reasons for scrapping it.
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On January 04 2013 07:45 Burrfoot wrote:Show nested quote +On January 04 2013 07:30 Chairman Ray wrote:On January 04 2013 07:25 YourMom wrote:
will there be duels for money ? Blizzard will take 15% of it. Lol... now that I think about it, maybe Blizz is just holding out trying to figure out a way to monetize PvP. Fantasy Diablo 3 TDM. Bet on teams/players and win money with Blizz taking a cut. Makes more and more sense now!
Easiest way to remove PvE gear imbalance and monetize PvP: make PvP-only gear that can only be purchased direct from Blizzard in the RMAH.
Edit: Probably need to make it purchasable with "PvP win points" or something too.
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Sigh... we're getting Jay Wilson'd again. No one does it better than the man himself!
"not up to our standards..." Well then how did D3 get released when it did then?
"... is boring and repetitive" Uhhh, well that's how you designed D3 to be, so where's the problem?
Jay Wilson, lying to the public to cover his fat ass as much as he can.
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On January 04 2013 23:20 Achaia wrote:Show nested quote +On January 04 2013 13:53 Assault_1 wrote:On January 04 2013 13:22 Wuster wrote:On January 04 2013 12:36 Spyridon wrote:On January 04 2013 07:45 Burrfoot wrote:On January 04 2013 07:30 Chairman Ray wrote:On January 04 2013 07:25 YourMom wrote:
will there be duels for money ? Blizzard will take 15% of it. Lol... now that I think about it, maybe Blizz is just holding out trying to figure out a way to monetize PvP. Fantasy Diablo 3 TDM. Bet on teams/players and win money with Blizz taking a cut. Makes more and more sense now! We already know that's the case. They insist on using PvE gear in PvP. Also they insist on it being "competitive" PvP. PvE gear + competitive will never add up successfully if you want fair, balanced gameplay. The only way that equation makes sense is if... PvE gear + competitive = monetized PvP through RMAH to be competitive. Take away the competitive format, and you will have a fun PvP mode with happy customers, but not monetized PvP. Take away the PvE gear and you will have happy customers and competitive PvP, but not monetized. Now their formula makes sense.... Um, they specifically said that PvP was not meant to be competitive. At least not in the eSports sense. If you mean competitive as in you can brag about being better than other people and that it would have some semblance of balance, then ya, I guess they did insist on that. Anyways, whether they have PvP gear or PvE gear it all goes through the AH (I'm assuming) and they'll get their cut that way. I love when blizzard gives those lame reasons "not meant to be competitive" means they're too lazy to balance it removing skill/stat trees is more simplified game design removing team deathmatch because once again, too lazy to balance look how simple the items are.. every class looks for the same 5 stats. this game couldve been made by a small company in 12 months I don't think you read the blog very well. They never gave the indication that they were being lazy imho. They said that TDM as it existed had a very limited appeal and rather than release something that they didn't feel measured up to their company's standards they're shelving it for now. I don't see how that makes them lazy? I'm a software developer as well and I wouldn't want my name attached to something that I don't think is the best possible quality I can produce. If they can find a way to make it fun and viable long term then I'm sure they'll add it.
I somewhat disagree with "no indications that they were being lazy".
The game mode was playable at blizzcon 2010!
I'm a software developer too, and have a good knowledge of game development, and there's no way in hell you couldn't get the TDM from 2010 to be fun and playable with 2 years of work. Better yet, just take the 7-8 months since they announced the delay to PvP, in that amount of time you could easily have all the problems solved.
If you are working on a TDM mode for 2 years and can't get it fun and playable, that reeks of laziness.
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EPT
