|
On February 22 2012 03:22 MrTortoise wrote:
tbh in the grand scheme of getting a game ready your complaints seem pretty damn trite
I think your comment is very fair to say. These would be my own words if I never had access to beta I'd imagine. But a first glance and experimentation with the gameplay and I stand by my opinion. Trite, maybe, but I think there is a bit of originality in there after all. All the words are my own, and I'd just like to now see the game reach at least half the potential it could be.
This "grand scheme of things" has been going for who actually knows? 3-5 years? With raw solid data feedback of a 6+ month beta now? And it's this unbalanced at such a low level of the game? It's looking to get exponetially worse as you level higher... ack.
|
On February 22 2012 01:42 Gescom wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2012 01:39 [F_]aths wrote:
I am not 100% sure but I think that the char uses the default attack automatically when he is out of resource. I will test is later today. Yes, all Barb/Monk/DH will do this. Wizard has some 0 AP spells. WD does not have a proper solution to this, I think.
I tested the WD. He does perform a standard attack when he has no mana.
|
On February 22 2012 03:40 [F_]aths wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2012 01:42 Gescom wrote:On February 22 2012 01:39 [F_]aths wrote:
I am not 100% sure but I think that the char uses the default attack automatically when he is out of resource. I will test is later today. Yes, all Barb/Monk/DH will do this. Wizard has some 0 AP spells. WD does not have a proper solution to this, I think. I tested the WD. He does perform a standard attack when he has no mana.
Well that sounds like a good enough of a solution to me. There is still a potential issue of not realizing you're out of mana and closing to melee range unintentionally. But at that point you should just realize you're out of mana and not expect the game to play itself for you and stop yourself lol.
|
On February 22 2012 03:52 FireBearHero wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2012 03:40 [F_]aths wrote:On February 22 2012 01:42 Gescom wrote:On February 22 2012 01:39 [F_]aths wrote:
I am not 100% sure but I think that the char uses the default attack automatically when he is out of resource. I will test is later today. Yes, all Barb/Monk/DH will do this. Wizard has some 0 AP spells. WD does not have a proper solution to this, I think. I tested the WD. He does perform a standard attack when he has no mana. Well that sounds like a good enough of a solution to me. There is still a potential issue of not realizing you're out of mana and closing to melee range unintentionally. But at that point you should just realize you're out of mana and not expect the game to play itself for you and stop yourself lol.
There's a reason holding down Shift is important when attacking with left click.
|
On February 22 2012 03:54 Adila wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2012 03:52 FireBearHero wrote:On February 22 2012 03:40 [F_]aths wrote:On February 22 2012 01:42 Gescom wrote:On February 22 2012 01:39 [F_]aths wrote:
I am not 100% sure but I think that the char uses the default attack automatically when he is out of resource. I will test is later today. Yes, all Barb/Monk/DH will do this. Wizard has some 0 AP spells. WD does not have a proper solution to this, I think. I tested the WD. He does perform a standard attack when he has no mana. Well that sounds like a good enough of a solution to me. There is still a potential issue of not realizing you're out of mana and closing to melee range unintentionally. But at that point you should just realize you're out of mana and not expect the game to play itself for you and stop yourself lol. There's a reason holding down Shift is important when attacking with left click.
Well it isn't an issue for me personally, but newer players might not know to use shift. Like I said, it seems like with a WD doing an auto attack when OOM it is good enough.
|
Since patch 13 I play D3 beta A LOT. The game got so much better with the new skill system. I don't use just one skill, I have to use other skills because the "good" ones are unlocked later. But this gets me to think about how I fight. I fight with much more strategy (casting AOE damage / slow to soften up a group of mobs) than before.
In older patches you either got a new skill which you used, but most time you didn't use that skill. With the new rune system, each level gained is so much more meaningful. Virtually any new level you get reasonable options to change your build.
On February 22 2012 04:13 FireBearHero wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2012 03:54 Adila wrote:On February 22 2012 03:52 FireBearHero wrote:On February 22 2012 03:40 [F_]aths wrote:On February 22 2012 01:42 Gescom wrote:On February 22 2012 01:39 [F_]aths wrote:
I am not 100% sure but I think that the char uses the default attack automatically when he is out of resource. I will test is later today. Yes, all Barb/Monk/DH will do this. Wizard has some 0 AP spells. WD does not have a proper solution to this, I think. I tested the WD. He does perform a standard attack when he has no mana. Well that sounds like a good enough of a solution to me. There is still a potential issue of not realizing you're out of mana and closing to melee range unintentionally. But at that point you should just realize you're out of mana and not expect the game to play itself for you and stop yourself lol. There's a reason holding down Shift is important when attacking with left click. Well it isn't an issue for me personally, but newer players might not know to use shift. Like I said, it seems like with a WD doing an auto attack when OOM it is good enough. Any of the standard (simple) skill description tells you to hold shift to cast without moving.
|
Dont be confused with the fact that just because runes skills are part of the beta test that the system is now better than it was before where they were in act 2.
|
On February 22 2012 04:34 [F_]aths wrote:Since patch 13 I play D3 beta A LOT. The game got so much better with the new skill system. I don't use just one skill, I have to use other skills because the "good" ones are unlocked later. But this gets me to think about how I fight. I fight with much more strategy (casting AOE damage / slow to soften up a group of mobs) than before. In older patches you either got a new skill which you used, but most time you didn't use that skill. With the new rune system, each level gained is so much more meaningful. Virtually any new level you get reasonable options to change your build. Show nested quote +On February 22 2012 04:13 FireBearHero wrote:On February 22 2012 03:54 Adila wrote:On February 22 2012 03:52 FireBearHero wrote:On February 22 2012 03:40 [F_]aths wrote:On February 22 2012 01:42 Gescom wrote:On February 22 2012 01:39 [F_]aths wrote:
I am not 100% sure but I think that the char uses the default attack automatically when he is out of resource. I will test is later today. Yes, all Barb/Monk/DH will do this. Wizard has some 0 AP spells. WD does not have a proper solution to this, I think. I tested the WD. He does perform a standard attack when he has no mana. Well that sounds like a good enough of a solution to me. There is still a potential issue of not realizing you're out of mana and closing to melee range unintentionally. But at that point you should just realize you're out of mana and not expect the game to play itself for you and stop yourself lol. There's a reason holding down Shift is important when attacking with left click. Well it isn't an issue for me personally, but newer players might not know to use shift. Like I said, it seems like with a WD doing an auto attack when OOM it is good enough. Any of the standard (simple) skill description tells you to hold shift to cast without moving.
Is that a newer change? I don't remember seeing that when I was playing, but it is definitely possible that I just missed it.
|
On February 22 2012 04:37 Medrea wrote:
Dont be confused with the fact that just because runes skills are part of the beta test that the system is now better than it was before where they were in act 2.
Random skill progression sounds to be fun. The rune system as it is now is in fact fun.
I am very sad about the magnitude of misconception in this entire thread. Most worries voiced are completely imaginary. Some UI issues (for example it's quite some work to just swap the hotkey / mousebutton assignment of skills) are still there but those issues are not even mentioned in this thread because hardly anyone here actually plays the game.
|
Considering what was said, isn't it more accurate to say that Blizzard did a... forward backflip?
|
On February 22 2012 04:45 [F_]aths wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2012 04:37 Medrea wrote:
Dont be confused with the fact that just because runes skills are part of the beta test that the system is now better than it was before where they were in act 2. Random skill progression sounds to be fun. The rune system as it is now is in fact fun. I am very sad about the magnitude of misconception in this entire thread. Most worries voiced are completely imaginary. Some UI issues (for example it's quite some work to just swap the hotkey / mousebutton assignment of skills) are still there but those issues are not even mentioned in this thread because hardly anyone here actually plays the game.
Sorry I dont like being handed shit for free at random times. Gems and Loot cant support the end game alone.
Even if you like the changes. Dont you think they should add to the game instead of just giving everything the axe?
|
TBH, I love the mechanics of the changes in this patch.
I don't at all like the way the UI is now, but I have hope that it will be iterated on and potentially solved. The rune unlocks are fun IMO, and they really do encourage skill variety.
It seems that when you unlock a rune at low levels it is nearly always better to switch back to a previous skill that now has a rune, rather than to remain with a skill that has no rune. Although I haven't played all classes yet, it feels this way on Barb, Monk and Wizard. There are some instances where maybe you don't want the effects the rune provides and in that case you just don't go back to that spell.
|
Well you only have access to a small handful of runes, as they unlock your choices will become more personal and less obligatory.
Before they were always personal preference since runes dropped a lot and you unlocked all skills pretty quickly. Now there is an obligatory period where you have to play a build you dont want to play until Blizzard unlocks the runes for you.
I really wanted to play an Exploding fist monk where the explosion had that chain reaction rune. That sounded cool, now I have to wait until level 54 to do that instead of act 2 >.>
|
it's kind of unfortunate that for certain builds you may have to wait until later in the game before it becomes viable but one thing that didn't sound fun speaking as somebody who's probably going to be switching my skills around a lot just to play around with them, keeping physical rune items around to do that seems more annoying than anything else
|
Well the beta sentiment was that once a rune is used upon a skill it gets consumed by the UI so you would never have to accomodate it in your inventory, even if you switch it out. Only once its replaced entirely would the UI grant the actual item back to you. So you can switch at will and never worry about an inventory stuff with runes.
No need to hold onto all those runes after all.
That was the most common suggestion for a way to tackle that problem correctly. So blizzard took it one step further and deleted runes altogether.
|
I think the not being able to bind basic attacks thing is clearly just a mistake in design, seeing as there are passives (wizard wand +damage passive, for example) that are made around using the basic attack. I can't imagine that this is the way the game will ship, though, given all the shitty feedback this system has been getting. It just surprises me that apparently they've been testing this system internally for a while and still thought it was a good idea to release as a beta patch.
|
|
|
On February 21 2012 03:17 dacthehork wrote:
- Can't swap skill hotkeys, aka if you want to switch your left cilck skill with right click skill you can't
Wrong. Go into gameplay options and check 'elective skills'. You can now bind skills any way you like (although in a cumbersome way which will probably be improved in a future patch).
I'm pretty sure you're entire post's meat goes wayside once you know this. The rest are just minor UI grievances you seem to be having.
|
On February 22 2012 09:28 willoc wrote:Show nested quote +On February 21 2012 03:17 dacthehork wrote:
- Can't swap skill hotkeys, aka if you want to switch your left cilck skill with right click skill you can't
Wrong. Go into gameplay options and check 'elective skills'. You can now bind skills any way you like (although in a cumbersome way which will probably be improved in a future patch). I'm pretty sure you're entire post's meat goes wayside once you know this. The rest are just minor UI grievances you seem to be having.
I'm pretty sure he means this situation...
LMB - Hungering Arrow
RMB - Bola Shot
Oh crap I want LMB to be bola shot! Let me fix that.
Oh wait you can't directly. You have to...
1. Bind LMB to a random skill not being used.
2. Bind Hungering Arrow to RMB.
2a. Wait for cooldown on LMB to finish.
3. Bind Bola shot to LMB.
3a. Wait for bola shot on LMB to finish.
|
Barrin: Easy buddy, we're on the same side. We both want d3 to flourish. I see you post in SC2 forums all the time... don't think I haven't noticed. I read almost all forums constantly, and I've been here for years longer than what my post count and join date suggests, as I believe you to yours as well.
Onwards. Hell and Inferno I think will be a challenge as well. No doubt, simple tinkering by blizzard will make it so. I don't see where you think I refuted that and all this from my couple sentence reply to you. But with 60 levels and let me see, within 4 hours time from a dirt scratch start, should I have access to almost half my artisan for the overall game and be able to craft items to near level 30? Which don't forget, doesn't reset. I have that forever now. Or maybe think a bit deeper and try to imagine a progression graph of how your collective characters fare against time. Does that in any way seem right to you?
I attacked D3's current wealth management system. And I do believe its all over the map right now. Not properly scaled, outpaces gameplay with every new char after the 1st. Your average poster here would be quick on the keyboard saying ohhh its beta, they don't care, 1st half of 1st act, etc. But they do care. They do read forums occasionally, they do have data and feedback, and you know what else? They have a 6+ month running beta now. And to top it all off, they switched up the rune system just last weekend. Wouldn't you say that's a staple in the entire system? Did you miss that about d3's development? So obviously they care. When is it okay to start balancing these things? Or are they considered balanced if they haven't been changed thus far? We are led to believe so, as the all mighty Bashiok (please, that's sarcasm) PR'ed that they have revamped the gold and item system not too long ago.
By the way, the clear and deeper meaning of that video is that they promise you will die repeatedly. Not just 1st death and prophecy fulfilled, going home. Co mon, to go through an entire d3 career of never dying is laughable to think about, and not a very great argument for anyone. I very much believe even casual gamers will join the bandwagon of a common way to play and become a 'monkey see, monkey do' demographic and come to eventually take on inferno very well. And furthermore, hype it up like it's some feat of immense skill to conquer. Please don't take the tagline of the video literally, that's a very simpleton way of ignoring the underlying meaning of that entire video that you yourself posted. And in that way I would consider it a failed promise.
You really haven't said much of your opinion about the game, just a limited amount of what you think will be hard. Why don't you share some of your insight to the current gameplay mechanics, not just what your "still quite sure of." Maybe I'll take a shot at picking apart some of your points and agreeing with other ones. I've put my thoughts out here, care to share yours?
But to your previous quote, the person you quoted is entirely justifiable. SC2's social system is a mess and likely won't change. And this is what D3 looks to be mimicking. Now it's me who would assume (I'm giving you credit here of being around TL before your join date...) someone from the BW/D2 whatever era, hell, lets just say pre bnet2.0 era would understand. They (blizz) really can't be left alone, and sitting tight and having faith they will pull through is exactly why many long time players all have their panties in a bunch. So I hope you don't blame anonymous posters when they're very skeptical with their concerns for a better system than this "leap backwards" (yes, runes included) which is the thread your posting in...
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
