I love when Artosis on any stream tells something that isnt true and this is one of em. This is not to poke fun of Artosis because he isnt a true BW nerd Or maybe it is, i dunno, anyways onto the TRUTH:
They did patch out the normal way of putting sieged tanks under buildings but it still isnt fixed. (patched: siege state before building lands)
If you give siege mode command late enough in a north-west pointing direction you will have a good enough time-window for building to land before tank turns around to hit siege state.
The check for sieged tanks is just as the building hits the ground and not continued checks after.
On April 23 2022 16:53 stambe wrote: Can you explain in detail how to put Siege Tanks under buildings ? I havent seen that bug since the original one in like 1999/2000.
1. Start landing building. 2. Move tank into position and face north-west. 3. Just as building is about to hit the ground, click siege.
I'd say approximately 50% of Artosis' claims are true, and the other 50% appear to be part of an alternate reality. So at the end of the day Artosis isn't never not wrong about nothing in particular.
On April 23 2022 15:55 MeSaber wrote:The check for sieged tanks is just as the building hits the ground and not continued checks after.
Pretty sure the check happens the very moment when the Tank switches into the (fully) sieged Tank model. That's why Tanks can rarely even blow up on things like Missile Turrets, too. That would also be consistent with what you describe here – that if the Tank is already fully sieged before the Building "touches ground" it does not undergo the collision check and hence stays alive. LUCKYNEWB's video looks like the Tank needs to siege late though… Hmm…
On April 23 2022 19:13 kogeT wrote: Try debunking that P is imba.
P are 43% of players but just 41% of S rank. It is a statistical truth that P are underrepresented at S rank. It is relatively easy to get B with Protoss, they make up more of B than they should based on raw numbers, but it is relatively hard to get S with Protoss. Protoss players have a much harder time hitting S than their Terran brethren for example. The stats don't lie.
@Kwark but just because ure a constant S rank holder doesnt mean you know everything about the game, you just know what you have to do to beat others, not how everything is implemented or works technically.
This is where Artosis is most funny. He THINKS he knows everything about the game as hes been in this game as long as he can remember but yeah obviously he dont.
Most of the time hes correct though. Which is expected from someone who been here that long
On April 30 2022 14:20 KwarK wrote: Also there's no reason to think that a full time professional player that can't hold S is an authority on anything so this thread is pointless.
There's even less reason to think that stream cheaters should have any authority on anything.
On April 30 2022 14:20 KwarK wrote: Also there's no reason to think that a full time professional player that can't hold S is an authority on anything so this thread is pointless.
There's even less reason to think that stream cheaters should have any authority on anything.
Not a stream cheater. The mystery of how the 2400 player beats the 2200 player doesn’t need cheating to solve.
On April 30 2022 14:20 KwarK wrote: Also there's no reason to think that a full time professional player that can't hold S is an authority on anything so this thread is pointless.
There's even less reason to think that stream cheaters should have any authority on anything.
Not a stream cheater. The mystery of how the 2400 player beats the 2200 player doesn’t need cheating to solve.
Bro, you've sniped Artosis many times, you've admitted to sniping, and you've even responded to what he's saying onstream in the ingame chat, along with many suspicious moves. It's fairly obvious to anyone with more than 3 brain cells.
On April 30 2022 14:20 KwarK wrote: Also there's no reason to think that a full time professional player that can't hold S is an authority on anything so this thread is pointless.
There's even less reason to think that stream cheaters should have any authority on anything.
Not a stream cheater. The mystery of how the 2400 player beats the 2200 player doesn’t need cheating to solve.
Bro, you've sniped Artosis many times, you've admitted to sniping, and you've even responded to what he's saying onstream in the ingame chat, along with many suspicious moves. It's fairly obvious to anyone with more than 3 brain cells.
On April 30 2022 14:20 KwarK wrote: Also there's no reason to think that a full time professional player that can't hold S is an authority on anything so this thread is pointless.
There's even less reason to think that stream cheaters should have any authority on anything.
Not a stream cheater. The mystery of how the 2400 player beats the 2200 player doesn’t need cheating to solve.
Bro, you've sniped Artosis many times, you've admitted to sniping, and you've even responded to what he's saying onstream in the ingame chat, along with many suspicious moves. It's fairly obvious to anyone with more than 3 brain cells.
On April 30 2022 14:20 KwarK wrote: Also there's no reason to think that a full time professional player that can't hold S is an authority on anything so this thread is pointless.
There's even less reason to think that stream cheaters should have any authority on anything.
Not a stream cheater. The mystery of how the 2400 player beats the 2200 player doesn’t need cheating to solve.
Bro, you've sniped Artosis many times, you've admitted to sniping, and you've even responded to what he's saying onstream in the ingame chat, along with many suspicious moves. It's fairly obvious to anyone with more than 3 brain cells.
On May 01 2022 06:23 Timebon3s wrote: I know a lot of people say single target dps is higher on an unsigned tank than on a tank in siege mode. Is this really true?
On May 01 2022 06:23 Timebon3s wrote: I know a lot of people say single target dps is higher on an unsigned tank than on a tank in siege mode. Is this really true?
Should someone this dishonest and toxic be taken seriously by adults?
Hello new user here but long time viewer of Artosis also a lurker of these forums and can be another voice in confirming that he in fact does stream snipe. Individual in question should be ashamed there really isn't an excuse to justify behavior like that and hope the person in question gets the help they need.
Should someone this dishonest and toxic be taken seriously by adults?
I’m denying the stream cheating.
you've even responded to what he's saying onstream in the ingame chat, along with many suspicious moves
is pure fiction. I know it’s fiction because I was there and I’d have known if I was stream cheating. I’m not sure where you’re getting this from, maybe Artosis has been making up lies about me again. He does that a lot. For example he once claimed that I intervened in a Starcraft 2 tournament I’ve never heard of (I’ve nothing to do with sc2) to stop him winning due to some old grudge dating from years before either of us had ever interacted with the other.
He consistently claimed on his stream that I was targeting him despite an open offer for us to alternate leaving games (I volunteered to leave first as a good faith gesture). We’d randomly hit each other on ladder (though that doesn’t happen much anymore due to MMR difference) and he would bitch and whine about how he wished he didn’t have to play me despite knowing that he could at any time ask me to leave. Y’all are a bunch of weirdos who somehow don’t know the difference between real life and entertainment. He’s making a show and that casting people as villains against their will makes him drama and views.
About a year and a half ago we queued randomly and I again restated my willingness to leave if he left next time, just like I always did back then. He finally accepted and I voluntarily left because I really don’t like playing him and I really hate the way you fanboys follow me around making shit up. For a few months we successfully alternated leaving without drama at all until he broke the deal. That was a pretty shitty thing for him to do, I’d left the previous game while on my BSL account and hundreds of MMR higher. It probably cost me proleague qualification that season but we had a deal and I’m an honourable player. Then on his turn he refused to leave because he was close to S (lol who the fuck cares about S), dishonouring our deal and cheating for points.
He claims that I dishonoured the deal first but I can provide the replay where it was his turn and he refused to leave. There’s no point getting into who to believe, he broke it on May 27 and the game he uses as justification for breaking it was on May 30. May 30 is after May 27. + Show Spoiler +
I still don’t target him or harass him. You can check the vods of the streams in which we hit each other on ladder, I don’t snipe him or queue to hit him. But he insists on harassing me, lying about me, encouraging his dumb fucking simps to send me abuse. Something to keep in mind next time he makes some claim about me is that he’s either a liar or May 30 is before May 27.
you've even responded to what he's saying onstream in the ingame chat, along with many suspicious moves
is pure fiction. I know it’s fiction because I was there and I’d have known if I was stream cheating. I’m not sure where you’re getting this from, maybe Artosis has been making up lies about me again. He does that a lot. For example he once claimed that I intervened in a Starcraft 2 tournament I’ve never heard of (I’ve nothing to do with sc2) to stop him winning due to some old grudge dating from years before either of us had ever interacted with the other.
He consistently claimed on his stream that I was targeting him despite an open offer for us to alternate leaving games (I volunteered to leave first as a good faith gesture). We’d randomly hit each other on ladder (though that doesn’t happen much anymore due to MMR difference) and he would bitch and whine about how he wished he didn’t have to play me despite knowing that he could at any time ask me to leave. Y’all are a bunch of weirdos who somehow don’t know the difference between real life and entertainment. He’s making a show and that casting people as villains against their will makes him drama and views.
About a year and a half ago we queued randomly and I again restated my willingness to leave if he left next time, just like I always did back then. He finally accepted and I voluntarily left because I really don’t like playing him and I really hate the way you fanboys follow me around making shit up. For a few months we successfully alternated leaving without drama at all until he broke the deal. That was a pretty shitty thing for him to do, I’d left the previous game while on my BSL account and hundreds of MMR higher. It probably cost me proleague qualification that season but we had a deal and I’m an honourable player. Then on his turn he refused to leave because he was close to S (lol who the fuck cares about S), dishonouring our deal and cheating for points.
He claims that I dishonoured the deal first but I can provide the replay where it was his turn and he refused to leave. There’s no point getting into who to believe, he broke it on May 27 and the game he uses as justification for breaking it was on May 30. May 30 is after May 27. + Show Spoiler +
I still don’t target him or harass him. You can check the vods of the streams in which we hit each other on ladder, I don’t snipe him or queue to hit him. But he insists on harassing me, lying about me, encouraging his dumb fucking simps to send me abuse. Something to keep in mind next time he makes some claim about me is that he’s either a liar or May 30 is before May 27.
It sounds like you decided to make yourself a villain because he did his usual post-loss bitching that he does on every stream against every opponent and it offended your narcissism so you decided to streamsnipe him and are now acting surprised that people think it was bad behavior. So are we supposed to take it that if you complain about your opponent that justifies them streamsniping you going forward?
People seem to always conflate the two for some weird reason. Stream sniping is not the same as stream cheating. It may be that the new posters here don't know the difference. If you and someone else have close enough MMRs and queue at the same time in BW, since it's a global ladder, there is a chance that you could get matched up against them. This is what Kwark did, he decided to hit the queue button after Artosis hit his own queue button.
After that, he played the game normally. Keep in mind that Kwark streams his games and has low APM to begin with. Imagine the detriment to his gameplay if he was actually watching Artosis's pov while he was trying to play the game. Watching the pov during a game is what stream cheating is. As for what Artosis said on stream, if the information is targeted rather than general, it's reasonable for someone to take offense to it considering everyone has their own thresholds after all.
One thing to note is that Kwark could easily check out the game vod afterwards to see what Artosis was saying during their game, and relay that same information the next time he drops by his stream. This is in reference to the other poster. Hope this explains things.
Also if I could hear Artosis’s stream while playing then you’d be able to hear it on my stream, mine would restream that audio. I can confidently assert that there are zero instances of me responding to something he said on stream while playing him because, and again this is something I would know about because I was there, I’m not a stream cheater. I don’t need an explanation for that because it never happened.
Also I think even Artosis would admit that given the relative skill levels it would be near impossible for him to take games from me if I were stream cheating. He has taken games from me.
Should someone this dishonest and toxic be taken seriously by adults?
I’m denying the stream cheating.
you've even responded to what he's saying onstream in the ingame chat, along with many suspicious moves
is pure fiction. I know it’s fiction because I was there and I’d have known if I was stream cheating. I’m not sure where you’re getting this from, maybe Artosis has been making up lies about me again. He does that a lot. For example he once claimed that I intervened in a Starcraft 2 tournament I’ve never heard of (I’ve nothing to do with sc2) to stop him winning due to some old grudge dating from years before either of us had ever interacted with the other.
He consistently claimed on his stream that I was targeting him despite an open offer for us to alternate leaving games (I volunteered to leave first as a good faith gesture). We’d randomly hit each other on ladder (though that doesn’t happen much anymore due to MMR difference) and he would bitch and whine about how he wished he didn’t have to play me despite knowing that he could at any time ask me to leave. Y’all are a bunch of weirdos who somehow don’t know the difference between real life and entertainment. He’s making a show and that casting people as villains against their will makes him drama and views.
About a year and a half ago we queued randomly and I again restated my willingness to leave if he left next time, just like I always did back then. He finally accepted and I voluntarily left because I really don’t like playing him and I really hate the way you fanboys follow me around making shit up. For a few months we successfully alternated leaving without drama at all until he broke the deal. That was a pretty shitty thing for him to do, I’d left the previous game while on my BSL account and hundreds of MMR higher. It probably cost me proleague qualification that season but we had a deal and I’m an honourable player. Then on his turn he refused to leave because he was close to S (lol who the fuck cares about S), dishonouring our deal and cheating for points.
He claims that I dishonoured the deal first but I can provide the replay where it was his turn and he refused to leave. There’s no point getting into who to believe, he broke it on May 27 and the game he uses as justification for breaking it was on May 30. May 30 is after May 27. + Show Spoiler +
I still don’t target him or harass him. You can check the vods of the streams in which we hit each other on ladder, I don’t snipe him or queue to hit him. But he insists on harassing me, lying about me, encouraging his dumb fucking simps to send me abuse. Something to keep in mind next time he makes some claim about me is that he’s either a liar or May 30 is before May 27.
It sounds like you decided to make yourself a villain because he did his usual post-loss bitching that he does on every stream against every opponent and it offended your narcissism so you decided to streamsnipe him and are now acting surprised that people think it was bad behavior. So are we supposed to take it that if you complain about your opponent that justifies them streamsniping you going forward?
I mean yeah, kinda. If you go on a long rant about how your opponent is so bad and then they make you eat your words by making an account called “so bad” and beating you with it then that’s just funny. That’s getting exactly what you deserve, bad manner coming back to haunt you. That ought to have been the end of it right there. He called me so bad, I made him eat those words, matter settled, but instead he’s insisted on harassing me through his simps for the last two years.
On May 02 2022 08:51 KwarK wrote: Also if I could hear Artosis’s stream while playing then you’d be able to hear it on my stream, mine would restream that audio.
New user chiming in, this is factually incorrect. You can just set obs to not capture chrome's audio, or whatever streaming / browsing software combo you use. Trying to mislead the uninformed with assertions like this is why people here aren't entirely on your side. Just stick to what's true and you could make your point a lot clearer
On May 02 2022 08:51 KwarK wrote: Also if I could hear Artosis’s stream while playing then you’d be able to hear it on my stream, mine would restream that audio.
New user chiming in, this is factually incorrect. You can just set obs to not capture chrome's audio, or whatever streaming / browsing software combo you use. Trying to mislead the uninformed with assertions like this is why people here aren't entirely on your side. Just stick to what's true and you could make your point a lot clearer
I don’t really know how OBS works and so the assertion stands. We’re talking about my stream, not a competent streamer’s stream. If I had it open you’d all hear it. That’s a factually correct assertion as it relates entirely to my own knowledge or lack thereof.
On May 02 2022 08:51 KwarK wrote: Also if I could hear Artosis’s stream while playing then you’d be able to hear it on my stream, mine would restream that audio.
New user chiming in, this is factually incorrect. You can just set obs to not capture chrome's audio, or whatever streaming / browsing software combo you use. Trying to mislead the uninformed with assertions like this is why people here aren't entirely on your side. Just stick to what's true and you could make your point a lot clearer
On May 02 2022 08:10 BigFan wrote: People seem to always conflate the two for some weird reason. Stream sniping is not the same as stream cheating. It may be that the new posters here don't know the difference. If you and someone else have close enough MMRs and queue at the same time in BW, since it's a global ladder, there is a chance that you could get matched up against them. This is what Kwark did, he decided to hit the queue button after Artosis hit his own queue button.
After that, he played the game normally. Keep in mind that Kwark streams his games and has low APM to begin with. Imagine the detriment to his gameplay if he was actually watching Artosis's pov while he was trying to play the game. Watching the pov during a game is what stream cheating is. As for what Artosis said on stream, if the information is targeted rather than general, it's reasonable for someone to take offense to it considering everyone has their own thresholds after all.
One thing to note is that Kwark could easily check out the game vod afterwards to see what Artosis was saying during their game, and relay that same information the next time he drops by his stream. This is in reference to the other poster. Hope this explains things.
This makes me wonder. How is stream-cheating prevented in online tourneys (esp SC2)?
Is there a 15-30 minute lag in the official stream? Or are players required to have an arbiter physically in the room watching them? Or some kind of software running on player computers that detects switching of programs?
On May 02 2022 08:10 BigFan wrote: People seem to always conflate the two for some weird reason. Stream sniping is not the same as stream cheating. It may be that the new posters here don't know the difference. If you and someone else have close enough MMRs and queue at the same time in BW, since it's a global ladder, there is a chance that you could get matched up against them. This is what Kwark did, he decided to hit the queue button after Artosis hit his own queue button.
After that, he played the game normally. Keep in mind that Kwark streams his games and has low APM to begin with. Imagine the detriment to his gameplay if he was actually watching Artosis's pov while he was trying to play the game. Watching the pov during a game is what stream cheating is. As for what Artosis said on stream, if the information is targeted rather than general, it's reasonable for someone to take offense to it considering everyone has their own thresholds after all.
One thing to note is that Kwark could easily check out the game vod afterwards to see what Artosis was saying during their game, and relay that same information the next time he drops by his stream. This is in reference to the other poster. Hope this explains things.
EXACTLY right. Thank you very much for bothering to make this post. Hopefully these guys will understand the important difference now. Although I'm not holding my breath, to be honest..
On May 02 2022 08:51 KwarK wrote: Also if I could hear Artosis’s stream while playing then you’d be able to hear it on my stream, mine would restream that audio.
New user chiming in, this is factually incorrect. You can just set obs to not capture chrome's audio, or whatever streaming / browsing software combo you use. Trying to mislead the uninformed with assertions like this is why people here aren't entirely on your side. Just stick to what's true and you could make your point a lot clearer
On May 02 2022 08:51 KwarK wrote: Also if I could hear Artosis’s stream while playing then you’d be able to hear it on my stream, mine would restream that audio.
New user chiming in, this is factually incorrect. You can just set obs to not capture chrome's audio, or whatever streaming / browsing software combo you use. Trying to mislead the uninformed with assertions like this is why people here aren't entirely on your side. Just stick to what's true and you could make your point a lot clearer
On May 02 2022 08:51 KwarK wrote: Also if I could hear Artosis’s stream while playing then you’d be able to hear it on my stream, mine would restream that audio.
New user chiming in, this is factually incorrect. You can just set obs to not capture chrome's audio, or whatever streaming / browsing software combo you use. Trying to mislead the uninformed with assertions like this is why people here aren't entirely on your side. Just stick to what's true and you could make your point a lot clearer
>wall of text
How a salty, whiny, barely S player gets such dedicated dickriders is beyond me.
On May 02 2022 05:14 honorablemacroterran wrote: It sounds like you decided to make yourself a villain because he did his usual post-loss bitching that he does on every stream against every opponent and it offended your narcissism so you decided to streamsnipe him and are now acting surprised that people think it was bad behavior. So are we supposed to take it that if you complain about your opponent that justifies them streamsniping you going forward?
Lol, so what on earth justifies Artosis's bm almost every game? Insulting his opponents, calling them stupid, morons, apes, fuck this fuck that... How come you don't see the problems with the guy bitching after every game, but instead attribute narcissism to the guy who feels offended by that.
Stream sniping is in fact the softest "punishment" Artosis can have for his toxic behavior. What does he have to endure lol? Playing (and losing, in a fair manner) a Starcraft game. Imagine behaving like that in a LAN setting, soon somebody will smash a keyboard into his head and everyone will kinda agree he deserves that.
The other day after losing a "lag" game against a BSL fella, Artosis then proceeded to call BSL a "lagging shitshow". Yep, that's the kind of respect he has for the foreign community. If he gets banished from SC altogether, I'd say he deserves it.
I don’t like how he whines about his opponents wether he wins or loses, and calling BSL a laggy shit show is not very nice since it’s one of the very few foreigner tournaments going on. People aren’t hosting it for money, it’s just passion and love for the game that makes people work hard for it. He of everyone should respect that, and on top of that, if you’re sitting in Korea and playing foreigners all over the world, you gotta expect SOME lag. He shouldn’t be banned for all of sc though that’s just crazy.
Watching the tasteless lan now, and it looks like Artosis is genuinely enjoying himself and having a good time. Hard to think is stream person is legitimate… still he is like the ambassador of foreign SC so it hurts to see him shit all over the game and give the impression of being a 10 year old raging faggot tbh.
On May 03 2022 22:40 Timebon3s wrote: Good job please keep it up, it is highly entertaining :D
I mean, while his rage can be funny, there's also the undeniable fact that stream snipers, stream cheaters, and disconnect hackers tend to unfairly push him down from where his MMR should be at.
On May 03 2022 22:40 Timebon3s wrote: Good job please keep it up, it is highly entertaining :D
I mean, while his rage can be funny, there's also the undeniable fact that stream snipers, stream cheaters, and disconnect hackers tend to unfairly push him down from where his MMR should be at.
Everyone deals with smurfs and disc hackers etc. Watch any other streamer and you’ll see the same.
If you were to remove that factor you’d still see him lose to higher MMR players because they’re better at Starcraft than him. It’s not like he’s a 2400 player who is somehow appearing to only have 2200 MMR. If he’s pushed down then everyone is. If he’s really 2400 then 2400s are really 2600, you have to throw out the whole frame of reference for his nonsense to stand up. His ladder experience is very similar to mine, the reason I’m higher is because I can reliably beat B Protoss.
On May 03 2022 22:40 Timebon3s wrote: Good job please keep it up, it is highly entertaining :D
I mean, while his rage can be funny, there's also the undeniable fact that stream snipers, stream cheaters, and disconnect hackers tend to unfairly push him down from where his MMR should be at.
Everyone deals with smurfs and disc hackers etc. Watch any other streamer and you’ll see the same.
If you were to remove that factor you’d still see him lose to higher MMR players because they’re better at Starcraft than him. It’s not like he’s a 2400 player who is somehow appearing to only have 2200 MMR. If he’s pushed down then everyone is. If he’s really 2400 then 2400s are really 2600, you have to throw out the whole frame of reference for his nonsense to stand up. His ladder experience is very similar to mine, the reason I’m higher is because I can reliably beat B Protoss.
I'm not sure why you even bother responding to most of these people. Random nobodies that likely don't even play bw.
On May 03 2022 22:40 Timebon3s wrote: Good job please keep it up, it is highly entertaining :D
I mean, while his rage can be funny, there's also the undeniable fact that stream snipers, stream cheaters, and disconnect hackers tend to unfairly push him down from where his MMR should be at.
Everyone deals with smurfs and disc hackers etc. Watch any other streamer and you’ll see the same.
If you were to remove that factor you’d still see him lose to higher MMR players because they’re better at Starcraft than him. It’s not like he’s a 2400 player who is somehow appearing to only have 2200 MMR. If he’s pushed down then everyone is. If he’s really 2400 then 2400s are really 2600, you have to throw out the whole frame of reference for his nonsense to stand up. His ladder experience is very similar to mine, the reason I’m higher is because I can reliably beat B Protoss.
>completely dodging the issue of stream snipers and stream cheaters why am i not surprised lmao
Because he also is a streamer and suffers the same? The smurfs and new accounts I can understand, however thats the same for everyone who plays on the ladder.
The sniping is like one in a million. Few Koreans know or cares about Artosis, and let’s be honest, how many S rank foreign players do we have, and of how many do u think cheats on Artosis?
On May 03 2022 22:40 Timebon3s wrote: Good job please keep it up, it is highly entertaining :D
I mean, while his rage can be funny, there's also the undeniable fact that stream snipers, stream cheaters, and disconnect hackers tend to unfairly push him down from where his MMR should be at.
Everyone deals with smurfs and disc hackers etc. Watch any other streamer and you’ll see the same.
If you were to remove that factor you’d still see him lose to higher MMR players because they’re better at Starcraft than him. It’s not like he’s a 2400 player who is somehow appearing to only have 2200 MMR. If he’s pushed down then everyone is. If he’s really 2400 then 2400s are really 2600, you have to throw out the whole frame of reference for his nonsense to stand up. His ladder experience is very similar to mine, the reason I’m higher is because I can reliably beat B Protoss.
Even without considering stream snipers, stream cheaters, hackers or discers, he's 'pushed down' far more than his average foreign counterpart. Korean's don't leave against him simply because he lags like they do EVERY other foreigner. Especially those from South America. Ladder inflation is real...
On May 03 2022 22:40 Timebon3s wrote: Good job please keep it up, it is highly entertaining :D
I mean, while his rage can be funny, there's also the undeniable fact that stream snipers, stream cheaters, and disconnect hackers tend to unfairly push him down from where his MMR should be at.
Everyone deals with smurfs and disc hackers etc. Watch any other streamer and you’ll see the same.
If you were to remove that factor you’d still see him lose to higher MMR players because they’re better at Starcraft than him. It’s not like he’s a 2400 player who is somehow appearing to only have 2200 MMR. If he’s pushed down then everyone is. If he’s really 2400 then 2400s are really 2600, you have to throw out the whole frame of reference for his nonsense to stand up. His ladder experience is very similar to mine, the reason I’m higher is because I can reliably beat B Protoss.
>completely dodging the issue of stream snipers and stream cheaters why am i not surprised lmao
I think the snipers thing is massively over represented and again, I feel like I would know. I have never been invited to any secret sniper discord which implies that no such discord exists. I also know that I’m not sniping him because I’ve deliberately done my best to avoid him since the early days. That leaves mostly Oystein who has a job, a family, and is at a very unfriendly time zone for sniping. On any given day nobody anywhere is sniping him.
I’ve also dealt with my fair share of snipers and stream cheaters. There was a recent PvP on eclipse where the guy opened by telling me he was watching my stream and then commented in chat telling me what I was doing while not scouting. It was obviously very frustrating, he went dt while going no detection at all because he knew I didn’t go dt which gave him a huge build order advantage. Anyway, I just won because if you’re a better player it doesn’t matter.
On May 04 2022 01:13 Timebon3s wrote: Because he also is a streamer and suffers the same? The smurfs and new accounts I can understand, however thats the same for everyone who plays on the ladder.
The sniping is like one in a million. Few Koreans know or cares about Artosis, and let’s be honest, how many S rank foreign players do we have, and of how many do u think cheats on Artosis?
LOL Do you think someone wants to snipe Kwark?? There are a few semi-pro/pro Koreans that like to bash "low" rank people for content, but most of them just leave if the turn rate isn't 24. Artosis is the only well known streamer that suffers that. Nyoken too but now that he's in America again you can see on his streams that the Koreans just leave and his MMR is boosted a lot.
Artosis is in my opinion at least top 5 foreign terran right now. Laugh it or not. His high A rank is more worth than Kwark's 2400 S given that fact who he plays against on ladder. And you can see that Arto can play a very good game facing high rank players in tournaments he is invited to. Both playing cheese and standard games.
Best non-Korean Terrans are, imo, Mihu, Dandy, Terror, Gypsy, Nyoken, Spx, Ultra, Mad, with honourable mention to Koget who is inactive and Goku, Maars, Cryoc and JY offracing.
On May 04 2022 04:08 radley wrote: Artosis is in my opinion at least top 5 foreign terran right now. Laugh it or not. His high A rank is more worth than Kwark's 2400 S given that fact who he plays against on ladder. And you can see that Arto can play a very good game facing high rank players in tournaments he is invited to. Both playing cheese and standard games.
On May 02 2022 05:14 honorablemacroterran wrote: It sounds like you decided to make yourself a villain because he did his usual post-loss bitching that he does on every stream against every opponent and it offended your narcissism so you decided to streamsnipe him and are now acting surprised that people think it was bad behavior. So are we supposed to take it that if you complain about your opponent that justifies them streamsniping you going forward?
Lol, so what on earth justifies Artosis's bm almost every game? Insulting his opponents, calling them stupid, morons, apes, fuck this fuck that... How come you don't see the problems with the guy bitching after every game, but instead attribute narcissism to the guy who feels offended by that.
Stream sniping is in fact the softest "punishment" Artosis can have for his toxic behavior. What does he have to endure lol? Playing (and losing, in a fair manner) a Starcraft game. Imagine behaving like that in a LAN setting, soon somebody will smash a keyboard into his head and everyone will kinda agree he deserves that.
The other day after losing a "lag" game against a BSL fella, Artosis then proceeded to call BSL a "lagging shitshow". Yep, that's the kind of respect he has for the foreign community. If he gets banished from SC altogether, I'd say he deserves it.
Yeah believe me I didn't post in this thread to whiteknight for Artosis, he can certainly improve. I posted in this thread because I think people who get offended by his act are rubbish and the king of them all is Kwark.
On May 02 2022 05:14 honorablemacroterran wrote: It sounds like you decided to make yourself a villain because he did his usual post-loss bitching that he does on every stream against every opponent and it offended your narcissism so you decided to streamsnipe him and are now acting surprised that people think it was bad behavior. So are we supposed to take it that if you complain about your opponent that justifies them streamsniping you going forward?
Lol, so what on earth justifies Artosis's bm almost every game? Insulting his opponents, calling them stupid, morons, apes, fuck this fuck that... How come you don't see the problems with the guy bitching after every game, but instead attribute narcissism to the guy who feels offended by that.
Stream sniping is in fact the softest "punishment" Artosis can have for his toxic behavior. What does he have to endure lol? Playing (and losing, in a fair manner) a Starcraft game. Imagine behaving like that in a LAN setting, soon somebody will smash a keyboard into his head and everyone will kinda agree he deserves that.
The other day after losing a "lag" game against a BSL fella, Artosis then proceeded to call BSL a "lagging shitshow". Yep, that's the kind of respect he has for the foreign community. If he gets banished from SC altogether, I'd say he deserves it.
Yeah believe me I didn't post in this thread to whiteknight for Artosis, he can certainly improve. I posted in this thread because I think people who get offended by his act are rubbish and the king of them all is Kwark.
I'd like to know what kind of logic you're using to judge people. + Man who insults everything everyone that he doesn't like = can improve. + People who get offended by said man = narcissism and rubbish.
On May 04 2022 05:32 Magic Powers wrote: I have reliable trustmebro sources that Artosis is literally the only streamer who's being unfairly targeted by snipers and cheaters.
Never said he's the only one. But because of him being the most popular English Brood War streamer, he would get a much larger amount of them than others would.
On May 02 2022 05:14 honorablemacroterran wrote: It sounds like you decided to make yourself a villain because he did his usual post-loss bitching that he does on every stream against every opponent and it offended your narcissism so you decided to streamsnipe him and are now acting surprised that people think it was bad behavior. So are we supposed to take it that if you complain about your opponent that justifies them streamsniping you going forward?
Lol, so what on earth justifies Artosis's bm almost every game? Insulting his opponents, calling them stupid, morons, apes, fuck this fuck that... How come you don't see the problems with the guy bitching after every game, but instead attribute narcissism to the guy who feels offended by that.
Stream sniping is in fact the softest "punishment" Artosis can have for his toxic behavior. What does he have to endure lol? Playing (and losing, in a fair manner) a Starcraft game. Imagine behaving like that in a LAN setting, soon somebody will smash a keyboard into his head and everyone will kinda agree he deserves that.
The other day after losing a "lag" game against a BSL fella, Artosis then proceeded to call BSL a "lagging shitshow". Yep, that's the kind of respect he has for the foreign community. If he gets banished from SC altogether, I'd say he deserves it.
Yeah believe me I didn't post in this thread to whiteknight for Artosis, he can certainly improve. I posted in this thread because I think people who get offended by his act are rubbish and the king of them all is Kwark.
I'd like to know what kind of logic you're using to judge people. + Man who insults everything everyone that he doesn't like = can improve. + People who get offended by said man = narcissism and rubbish.
Artosis knows he's an entertainer, but you take the bombast seriously and act sanctimoniously in response. Also, there's a big difference between talking shit and streamsniping someone. Talking shit is easily ignored. I was talking about his gameplay, by the way, not his general behavior on stream. His content is top notch and brings laughter to thousands on a daily basis even if his play isn't exceptionally good.
On May 04 2022 05:32 Magic Powers wrote: I have reliable trustmebro sources that Artosis is literally the only streamer who's being unfairly targeted by snipers and cheaters.
Never said he's the only one. But because of him being the most popular English Brood War streamer, he would get a much larger amount of them than others would.
I agree, Artosis is by far the biggest of all the horribly mistreated streaming victims out there. I weep for him, and we must assure that the folk know of his plights.
On May 04 2022 12:26 barcodejester wrote: you can crush interceptors with buildings. ebays are the counter to carriers
If only there were any buildable terrain where you'd want to fight. Maps have been carefully crafted to prevent this strat, there's basically nowhere buildable outside of your bases and when they see ebays flying in they just turn around and go somewhere else.
On May 02 2022 05:14 honorablemacroterran wrote: It sounds like you decided to make yourself a villain because he did his usual post-loss bitching that he does on every stream against every opponent and it offended your narcissism so you decided to streamsnipe him and are now acting surprised that people think it was bad behavior. So are we supposed to take it that if you complain about your opponent that justifies them streamsniping you going forward?
Lol, so what on earth justifies Artosis's bm almost every game? Insulting his opponents, calling them stupid, morons, apes, fuck this fuck that... How come you don't see the problems with the guy bitching after every game, but instead attribute narcissism to the guy who feels offended by that.
Stream sniping is in fact the softest "punishment" Artosis can have for his toxic behavior. What does he have to endure lol? Playing (and losing, in a fair manner) a Starcraft game. Imagine behaving like that in a LAN setting, soon somebody will smash a keyboard into his head and everyone will kinda agree he deserves that.
The other day after losing a "lag" game against a BSL fella, Artosis then proceeded to call BSL a "lagging shitshow". Yep, that's the kind of respect he has for the foreign community. If he gets banished from SC altogether, I'd say he deserves it.
Yeah believe me I didn't post in this thread to whiteknight for Artosis, he can certainly improve. I posted in this thread because I think people who get offended by his act are rubbish and the king of them all is Kwark.
I'd like to know what kind of logic you're using to judge people. + Man who insults everything everyone that he doesn't like = can improve. + People who get offended by said man = narcissism and rubbish.
Artosis knows he's an entertainer, but you take the bombast seriously and act sanctimoniously in response. Also, there's a big difference between talking shit and streamsniping someone. Talking shit is easily ignored. I was talking about his gameplay, by the way, not his general behavior on stream. His content is top notch and brings laughter to thousands on a daily basis even if his play isn't exceptionally good.
Dude you keep downplaying the toxicity of Artosis's behavior on stream. Can improve? Bombast? Lmao. On the other hand how come you use all kinds of negative terms to describe people who get offended by him? Such fanboyism at its finest.
Let's face the truth here: he's a dick on stream. Yeah he's an entertainer. But being an entertainer doesn't give you the right to shit on everyone. I do find some of his stuff is funny, but there must be a line somewhere.
And lmao at talking shit is easily ignored. Yeah, because you are the one doing the shit talking. So after I insult someone I'll just advise them to ignore it. Yep, it works like that. Easy peasy. I insult you because I'm an entertainer ans I'm allowed to, and if you feel offended it's because you're rubbish people. Hahahaha. Stop riding his dick dude.
Plus I'd also like to know the mental struggle of being stream sniped. So you hit the queue button on ladder and you play a game of Starcraft, with or without knowing that the opponent was deliberately trying to match you. You win the game if you're better and lose if you're worse. Just like every other game. Hmm I can't imagine the trauma such experience gives. Must be tough man. Must be tough.
On May 02 2022 05:14 honorablemacroterran wrote: It sounds like you decided to make yourself a villain because he did his usual post-loss bitching that he does on every stream against every opponent and it offended your narcissism so you decided to streamsnipe him and are now acting surprised that people think it was bad behavior. So are we supposed to take it that if you complain about your opponent that justifies them streamsniping you going forward?
Lol, so what on earth justifies Artosis's bm almost every game? Insulting his opponents, calling them stupid, morons, apes, fuck this fuck that... How come you don't see the problems with the guy bitching after every game, but instead attribute narcissism to the guy who feels offended by that.
Stream sniping is in fact the softest "punishment" Artosis can have for his toxic behavior. What does he have to endure lol? Playing (and losing, in a fair manner) a Starcraft game. Imagine behaving like that in a LAN setting, soon somebody will smash a keyboard into his head and everyone will kinda agree he deserves that.
The other day after losing a "lag" game against a BSL fella, Artosis then proceeded to call BSL a "lagging shitshow". Yep, that's the kind of respect he has for the foreign community. If he gets banished from SC altogether, I'd say he deserves it.
Yeah believe me I didn't post in this thread to whiteknight for Artosis, he can certainly improve. I posted in this thread because I think people who get offended by his act are rubbish and the king of them all is Kwark.
I'd like to know what kind of logic you're using to judge people. + Man who insults everything everyone that he doesn't like = can improve. + People who get offended by said man = narcissism and rubbish.
Artosis knows he's an entertainer, but you take the bombast seriously and act sanctimoniously in response. Also, there's a big difference between talking shit and streamsniping someone. Talking shit is easily ignored. I was talking about his gameplay, by the way, not his general behavior on stream. His content is top notch and brings laughter to thousands on a daily basis even if his play isn't exceptionally good.
Dude you keep downplaying the toxicity of Artosis's behavior on stream. Can improve? Bombast? Lmao. On the other hand how come you use all kinds of negative terms to describe people who get offended by him? Such fanboyism at its finest.
Let's face the truth here: he's a dick on stream. Yeah he's an entertainer. But being an entertainer doesn't give you the right to shit on everyone. I do find some of his stuff is funny, but there must be a line somewhere.
And lmao at talking shit is easily ignored. Yeah, because you are the one doing the shit talking. So after I insult someone I'll just advise them to ignore it. Yep, it works like that. Easy peasy. I insult you because I'm an entertainer ans I'm allowed to, and if you feel offended it's because you're rubbish people. Hahahaha. Stop riding his dick dude.
Plus I'd also like to know the mental struggle of being stream sniped. So you hit the queue button on ladder and you play a game of Starcraft, with or without knowing that the opponent was deliberately trying to match you. You win the game if you're better and lose if you're worse. Just like every other game. Hmm I can't imagine the trauma such experience gives. Must be tough man. Must be tough.
On May 02 2022 05:14 honorablemacroterran wrote: It sounds like you decided to make yourself a villain because he did his usual post-loss bitching that he does on every stream against every opponent and it offended your narcissism so you decided to streamsnipe him and are now acting surprised that people think it was bad behavior. So are we supposed to take it that if you complain about your opponent that justifies them streamsniping you going forward?
Lol, so what on earth justifies Artosis's bm almost every game? Insulting his opponents, calling them stupid, morons, apes, fuck this fuck that... How come you don't see the problems with the guy bitching after every game, but instead attribute narcissism to the guy who feels offended by that.
Stream sniping is in fact the softest "punishment" Artosis can have for his toxic behavior. What does he have to endure lol? Playing (and losing, in a fair manner) a Starcraft game. Imagine behaving like that in a LAN setting, soon somebody will smash a keyboard into his head and everyone will kinda agree he deserves that.
The other day after losing a "lag" game against a BSL fella, Artosis then proceeded to call BSL a "lagging shitshow". Yep, that's the kind of respect he has for the foreign community. If he gets banished from SC altogether, I'd say he deserves it.
Yeah believe me I didn't post in this thread to whiteknight for Artosis, he can certainly improve. I posted in this thread because I think people who get offended by his act are rubbish and the king of them all is Kwark.
I'd like to know what kind of logic you're using to judge people. + Man who insults everything everyone that he doesn't like = can improve. + People who get offended by said man = narcissism and rubbish.
Artosis knows he's an entertainer, but you take the bombast seriously and act sanctimoniously in response. Also, there's a big difference between talking shit and streamsniping someone. Talking shit is easily ignored. I was talking about his gameplay, by the way, not his general behavior on stream. His content is top notch and brings laughter to thousands on a daily basis even if his play isn't exceptionally good.
Dude you keep downplaying the toxicity of Artosis's behavior on stream. Can improve? Bombast? Lmao. On the other hand how come you use all kinds of negative terms to describe people who get offended by him? Such fanboyism at its finest.
Let's face the truth here: he's a dick on stream. Yeah he's an entertainer. But being an entertainer doesn't give you the right to shit on everyone. I do find some of his stuff is funny, but there must be a line somewhere.
And lmao at talking shit is easily ignored. Yeah, because you are the one doing the shit talking. So after I insult someone I'll just advise them to ignore it. Yep, it works like that. Easy peasy. I insult you because I'm an entertainer ans I'm allowed to, and if you feel offended it's because you're rubbish people. Hahahaha. Stop riding his dick dude.
Plus I'd also like to know the mental struggle of being stream sniped. So you hit the queue button on ladder and you play a game of Starcraft, with or without knowing that the opponent was deliberately trying to match you. You win the game if you're better and lose if you're worse. Just like every other game. Hmm I can't imagine the trauma such experience gives. Must be tough man. Must be tough.
You must absolutely hate stand-up comedy then. If you can't ignore people whom you don't respect talking shit then you might just be a narcissist after all. Your post sounds like you are on the verge of tears over a guy who rages every stream. Part of growing up is learning to ignore people who aggravate you when you pay attention to them but you don't have to pay attention to them if you don't want to.
On May 04 2022 22:22 honorablemacroterran wrote: You must absolutely hate stand-up comedy then. If you can't ignore people whom you don't respect talking shit then you might just be a narcissist after all. Your post sounds like you are on the verge of tears over a guy who rages every stream. Part of growing up is learning to ignore people who aggravate you when you pay attention to them but you don't have to pay attention to them if you don't want to.
Lmao. Look at this hypocrite, everybody! Accusing people of narcissism, telling them to ignore people who talk shit because it's a grown-up thing. Yet he's here digging up an old post on reddit to accuse Kwark of dishonesty and toxicity (which is proven false already).
And to be clear, ignore is an option, not an obligation. If you talk shit, people have the right to criticize you, or even taking action against you. I'm surprised a "grown-up" like you is not aware of such an obvious concept.
You're just pretending to be a noble man because you are taking the side of the person who talks shit, my friend. Of course when you are the one at fault, your advice would be for people to let you get away lololol.
On May 04 2022 22:22 honorablemacroterran wrote: You must absolutely hate stand-up comedy then. If you can't ignore people whom you don't respect talking shit then you might just be a narcissist after all. Your post sounds like you are on the verge of tears over a guy who rages every stream. Part of growing up is learning to ignore people who aggravate you when you pay attention to them but you don't have to pay attention to them if you don't want to.
Lmao. Look at this hypocrite, everybody! Accusing people of narcissism, telling them to ignore people who talk shit because it's a grown-up thing. Yet he's here digging up an old post on reddit to accuse Kwark of dishonesty and toxicity (which is proven false already).
And to be clear, ignore is an option, not an obligation. If you talk shit, people have the right to criticize you, or even taking action against you. I'm surprised a "grown-up" like you is not aware of such an obvious concept.
You're just pretending to be a noble man because you are taking the side of the person who talks shit, my friend. Of course when you are the one at fault, your advice would be for people to let you get away lololol.
Of course people have a right to criticize Artosis but you sound like a crybaby if he actually offends you given what a clownshow his stream is.
How did a thread go from factually debunking one of many Artosis bullshit claims to this?
The power of braindead toxic fanboys of a toxic person I guess. Excuses are made for Artosis being toxic, excuses are made for his fanboys targeting another player that Artosis has directed his fanboys towards (to be fair Kwark is an egotistical cretin, but in this case it really isn't his fault), but somehow it is the victim's fault for getting shit on by fans coming out of the woodwork and people who deplore such behaviour are the ones at fault? Such double standards.
Also got to laugh at the people saying Artosis being top 5 foreigner terran. He's really 2600 not 2200 because cheaters. Yeah sure, you and everyone else at 2200. What are the actual 2600 then?
On May 02 2022 05:14 honorablemacroterran wrote: It sounds like you decided to make yourself a villain because he did his usual post-loss bitching that he does on every stream against every opponent and it offended your narcissism so you decided to streamsnipe him and are now acting surprised that people think it was bad behavior. So are we supposed to take it that if you complain about your opponent that justifies them streamsniping you going forward?
Lol, so what on earth justifies Artosis's bm almost every game? Insulting his opponents, calling them stupid, morons, apes, fuck this fuck that... How come you don't see the problems with the guy bitching after every game, but instead attribute narcissism to the guy who feels offended by that.
Stream sniping is in fact the softest "punishment" Artosis can have for his toxic behavior. What does he have to endure lol? Playing (and losing, in a fair manner) a Starcraft game. Imagine behaving like that in a LAN setting, soon somebody will smash a keyboard into his head and everyone will kinda agree he deserves that.
The other day after losing a "lag" game against a BSL fella, Artosis then proceeded to call BSL a "lagging shitshow". Yep, that's the kind of respect he has for the foreign community. If he gets banished from SC altogether, I'd say he deserves it.
Yeah believe me I didn't post in this thread to whiteknight for Artosis, he can certainly improve. I posted in this thread because I think people who get offended by his act are rubbish and the king of them all is Kwark.
I'd like to know what kind of logic you're using to judge people. + Man who insults everything everyone that he doesn't like = can improve. + People who get offended by said man = narcissism and rubbish.
Artosis knows he's an entertainer, but you take the bombast seriously and act sanctimoniously in response. Also, there's a big difference between talking shit and streamsniping someone. Talking shit is easily ignored. I was talking about his gameplay, by the way, not his general behavior on stream. His content is top notch and brings laughter to thousands on a daily basis even if his play isn't exceptionally good.
Dude you keep downplaying the toxicity of Artosis's behavior on stream. Can improve? Bombast? Lmao. On the other hand how come you use all kinds of negative terms to describe people who get offended by him? Such fanboyism at its finest.
Let's face the truth here: he's a dick on stream. Yeah he's an entertainer. But being an entertainer doesn't give you the right to shit on everyone. I do find some of his stuff is funny, but there must be a line somewhere.
And lmao at talking shit is easily ignored. Yeah, because you are the one doing the shit talking. So after I insult someone I'll just advise them to ignore it. Yep, it works like that. Easy peasy. I insult you because I'm an entertainer ans I'm allowed to, and if you feel offended it's because you're rubbish people. Hahahaha. Stop riding his dick dude.
Plus I'd also like to know the mental struggle of being stream sniped. So you hit the queue button on ladder and you play a game of Starcraft, with or without knowing that the opponent was deliberately trying to match you. You win the game if you're better and lose if you're worse. Just like every other game. Hmm I can't imagine the trauma such experience gives. Must be tough man. Must be tough.
You must absolutely hate stand-up comedy then. If you can't ignore people whom you don't respect talking shit then you might just be a narcissist after all. Your post sounds like you are on the verge of tears over a guy who rages every stream. Part of growing up is learning to ignore people who aggravate you when you pay attention to them but you don't have to pay attention to them if you don't want to.
I vividly remember the last stand-up comedy routine that I went to. Was a funny dude. Towards the end of his show he invited me to the stage. I felt honored, so my legs carried me through the rows of seats. As I stood a few feet next to the brilliant man, he asked me how my day was. I said I was great, and that I had just been promoted a day earlier. Suddenly his face appeared to crumple as he had a slightly annoyed look on his face. In front of the large audience he said to me words that I'll never forget because they were so funny: 'your game is weak, you'll never amount to anything and you should be ranked much lower with your horrible work ethic'. There was little laughter, but the audience seemed almost as stunned as I was. There I was, being given the honor of being taught the great comedy that was my life by a great comedian. A few people threw cash onto the stage. I think moments before the show ended I saw Mario enter the hall. After one last sip from my drink I left for home. I'll never forget this great day, it was hilarious and also full of wisdom. What a great guy, he'll go on to be a big name beloved by everyone.
On May 04 2022 22:22 honorablemacroterran wrote: You must absolutely hate stand-up comedy then. If you can't ignore people whom you don't respect talking shit then you might just be a narcissist after all. Your post sounds like you are on the verge of tears over a guy who rages every stream. Part of growing up is learning to ignore people who aggravate you when you pay attention to them but you don't have to pay attention to them if you don't want to.
Lmao. Look at this hypocrite, everybody! Accusing people of narcissism, telling them to ignore people who talk shit because it's a grown-up thing. Yet he's here digging up an old post on reddit to accuse Kwark of dishonesty and toxicity (which is proven false already).
And to be clear, ignore is an option, not an obligation. If you talk shit, people have the right to criticize you, or even taking action against you. I'm surprised a "grown-up" like you is not aware of such an obvious concept.
You're just pretending to be a noble man because you are taking the side of the person who talks shit, my friend. Of course when you are the one at fault, your advice would be for people to let you get away lololol.
Of course people have a right to criticize Artosis but you sound like a crybaby if he actually offends you given what a clownshow his stream is.
For context, he invented an entire backstory for the supposed grudge and some of his viewers who can’t tell the difference between entertainment and reality started messaging me shit on Reddit and TL (though that was a while ago and I think he’s been better about the egregious lies lately). When he has a platform as big as his the lies do actually impact people. I have weird Reddit stalkers like this lunatic because of the shit Artosis made up about me. https://m.imgur.com/a/LWu6Xqe https://www.reddit.com/r/broodwar/comments/kbmdil/comment/gfn8bfc/
Bizarre stuff given that I don’t have multiple children, have no webcam, and that regular viewers will know from my work stories that I am absolutely killing it professionally.
He hasn’t made up any new lies about me lately as far as I know but it sure would be nice if he clarified to the minority of his viewers who are insane that it’s entertainment and shouldn’t be taken seriously. If he also told them that I apologized to him for the sniping, that there’s no evidence that I ever cheated against him, that I made repeated offers to avoid each other, that I voluntarily left when he accepted that deal, and that he’s the one that broke it then that’d be great.
His stream is funny and I’m glad he’s able to make a living from bw. He’s undeniably done a lot for the community over the years. It’s regrettable that things worked out the way they did because when I came back to bw in 2020 I subscribed to his stream and was a fan. The problem is that topics like this even get made when his stream is entertainment, not an impartial overview on bw. He’s so successful that the cultivated toxicity of his stream bleeds out into the wider community as hate for certain players, races, play styles etc.
On May 04 2022 22:22 honorablemacroterran wrote: You must absolutely hate stand-up comedy then. If you can't ignore people whom you don't respect talking shit then you might just be a narcissist after all. Your post sounds like you are on the verge of tears over a guy who rages every stream. Part of growing up is learning to ignore people who aggravate you when you pay attention to them but you don't have to pay attention to them if you don't want to.
Lmao. Look at this hypocrite, everybody! Accusing people of narcissism, telling them to ignore people who talk shit because it's a grown-up thing. Yet he's here digging up an old post on reddit to accuse Kwark of dishonesty and toxicity (which is proven false already).
And to be clear, ignore is an option, not an obligation. If you talk shit, people have the right to criticize you, or even taking action against you. I'm surprised a "grown-up" like you is not aware of such an obvious concept.
You're just pretending to be a noble man because you are taking the side of the person who talks shit, my friend. Of course when you are the one at fault, your advice would be for people to let you get away lololol.
Of course people have a right to criticize Artosis but you sound like a crybaby if he actually offends you given what a clownshow his stream is.
For context, he invented an entire backstory for the supposed grudge and some of his viewers who can’t tell the difference between entertainment and reality started messaging me shit on Reddit and TL (though that was a while ago and I think he’s been better about the egregious lies lately). When he has a platform as big as his the lies do actually impact people. I have weird Reddit stalkers like this lunatic because of the shit Artosis made up about me. https://m.imgur.com/a/LWu6Xqe https://www.reddit.com/r/broodwar/comments/kbmdil/comment/gfn8bfc/
Bizarre stuff given that I don’t have multiple children, have no webcam, and that regular viewers will know from my work stories that I am absolutely killing it professionally.
He hasn’t made up any new lies about me lately as far as I know but it sure would be nice if he clarified to the minority of his viewers who are insane that it’s entertainment and shouldn’t be taken seriously. If he also told them that I apologized to him for the sniping, that there’s no evidence that I ever cheated against him, that I made repeated offers to avoid each other, that I voluntarily left when he accepted that deal, and that he’s the one that broke it then that’d be great.
His stream is funny and I’m glad he’s able to make a living from bw. He’s undeniably done a lot for the community over the years. It’s regrettable that things worked out the way they did because when I came back to bw in 2020 I subscribed to his stream and was a fan. The problem is that topics like this even get made when his stream is entertainment, not an impartial overview on bw. He’s so successful that the cultivated toxicity of his stream bleeds out into the wider community as hate for certain players, races, play styles etc.
Why do you always have to constantly remind people how successful and hard working you all the time? It is extremely egotistical.
Artosis shit on you because you always streamed sniped and trolled him. Until that, I do not think I had ever heard of you before, except maybe once or twice of people noting your low apm compared to your mmr. You keep acting as though you are a victim when you are also absolutely an agitator as well. You pop in constantly in random threads to bash on artosis and then complain when him and his fans do not like you.
As for hating certain races and playstyles, based on reading TL people have hated brood war protoss for a VERY long time. People thinking protoss is easy and that PvT is unfair is not some artosis creation, and people disliking cheese is basically in every RTS game since the begging.
TIL if I hate a certain strat that my opponent plays that gives me license to send verbal abuse towards them and I should not be criticized for that behavior even if I do it almost every time.
On May 02 2022 05:14 honorablemacroterran wrote: It sounds like you decided to make yourself a villain because he did his usual post-loss bitching that he does on every stream against every opponent and it offended your narcissism so you decided to streamsnipe him and are now acting surprised that people think it was bad behavior. So are we supposed to take it that if you complain about your opponent that justifies them streamsniping you going forward?
Lol, so what on earth justifies Artosis's bm almost every game? Insulting his opponents, calling them stupid, morons, apes, fuck this fuck that... How come you don't see the problems with the guy bitching after every game, but instead attribute narcissism to the guy who feels offended by that.
Stream sniping is in fact the softest "punishment" Artosis can have for his toxic behavior. What does he have to endure lol? Playing (and losing, in a fair manner) a Starcraft game. Imagine behaving like that in a LAN setting, soon somebody will smash a keyboard into his head and everyone will kinda agree he deserves that.
The other day after losing a "lag" game against a BSL fella, Artosis then proceeded to call BSL a "lagging shitshow". Yep, that's the kind of respect he has for the foreign community. If he gets banished from SC altogether, I'd say he deserves it.
Yeah believe me I didn't post in this thread to whiteknight for Artosis, he can certainly improve. I posted in this thread because I think people who get offended by his act are rubbish and the king of them all is Kwark.
I'd like to know what kind of logic you're using to judge people. + Man who insults everything everyone that he doesn't like = can improve. + People who get offended by said man = narcissism and rubbish.
Artosis knows he's an entertainer, but you take the bombast seriously and act sanctimoniously in response. Also, there's a big difference between talking shit and streamsniping someone. Talking shit is easily ignored. I was talking about his gameplay, by the way, not his general behavior on stream. His content is top notch and brings laughter to thousands on a daily basis even if his play isn't exceptionally good.
Dude you keep downplaying the toxicity of Artosis's behavior on stream. Can improve? Bombast? Lmao. On the other hand how come you use all kinds of negative terms to describe people who get offended by him? Such fanboyism at its finest.
Let's face the truth here: he's a dick on stream. Yeah he's an entertainer. But being an entertainer doesn't give you the right to shit on everyone. I do find some of his stuff is funny, but there must be a line somewhere.
And lmao at talking shit is easily ignored. Yeah, because you are the one doing the shit talking. So after I insult someone I'll just advise them to ignore it. Yep, it works like that. Easy peasy. I insult you because I'm an entertainer ans I'm allowed to, and if you feel offended it's because you're rubbish people. Hahahaha. Stop riding his dick dude.
Plus I'd also like to know the mental struggle of being stream sniped. So you hit the queue button on ladder and you play a game of Starcraft, with or without knowing that the opponent was deliberately trying to match you. You win the game if you're better and lose if you're worse. Just like every other game. Hmm I can't imagine the trauma such experience gives. Must be tough man. Must be tough.
You must absolutely hate stand-up comedy then. If you can't ignore people whom you don't respect talking shit then you might just be a narcissist after all. Your post sounds like you are on the verge of tears over a guy who rages every stream. Part of growing up is learning to ignore people who aggravate you when you pay attention to them but you don't have to pay attention to them if you don't want to.
I vividly remember the last stand-up comedy routine that I went to. Was a funny dude. Towards the end of his show he invited me to the stage. I felt honored, so my legs carried me through the rows of seats. As I stood a few feet next to the brilliant man, he asked me how my day was. I said I was great, and that I had just been promoted a day earlier. Suddenly his face appeared to crumple as he had a slightly annoyed look on his face. In front of the large audience he said to me words that I'll never forget because they were so funny: 'your game is weak, you'll never amount to anything and you should be ranked much lower with your horrible work ethic'. There was little laughter, but the audience seemed almost as stunned as I was. There I was, being given the honor of being taught the great comedy that was my life by a great comedian. A few people threw cash onto the stage. I think moments before the show ended I saw Mario enter the hall. After one last sip from my drink I left for home. I'll never forget this great day, it was hilarious and also full of wisdom. What a great guy, he'll go on to be a big name beloved by everyone.
I think you might be missing or just in general don't appreciate what this sort of humor is. The humor is watching him get into such a state over a little casual ladder action. That's why his viewers bombard him with troll donations even in the middle of games he is losing. It's not that he's telling jokes per se like a standup comedian would. The similarity is that in both cases, stand-up comedians and Artosis, they direct mean words at people for the sake of humor and they shouldn't be taken seriously.
On May 05 2022 03:37 Magic Powers wrote: TIL if I hate a certain strat that my opponent plays that gives me license to send verbal abuse towards them and I should not be criticized for that behavior even if I do it almost every time.
If you are a Protoss player I would have thought you would find his rage even funnier, seeing as it's ultimately impotent and you can continue to play how you like.
On May 02 2022 05:14 honorablemacroterran wrote: It sounds like you decided to make yourself a villain because he did his usual post-loss bitching that he does on every stream against every opponent and it offended your narcissism so you decided to streamsnipe him and are now acting surprised that people think it was bad behavior. So are we supposed to take it that if you complain about your opponent that justifies them streamsniping you going forward?
Lol, so what on earth justifies Artosis's bm almost every game? Insulting his opponents, calling them stupid, morons, apes, fuck this fuck that... How come you don't see the problems with the guy bitching after every game, but instead attribute narcissism to the guy who feels offended by that.
Stream sniping is in fact the softest "punishment" Artosis can have for his toxic behavior. What does he have to endure lol? Playing (and losing, in a fair manner) a Starcraft game. Imagine behaving like that in a LAN setting, soon somebody will smash a keyboard into his head and everyone will kinda agree he deserves that.
The other day after losing a "lag" game against a BSL fella, Artosis then proceeded to call BSL a "lagging shitshow". Yep, that's the kind of respect he has for the foreign community. If he gets banished from SC altogether, I'd say he deserves it.
Yeah believe me I didn't post in this thread to whiteknight for Artosis, he can certainly improve. I posted in this thread because I think people who get offended by his act are rubbish and the king of them all is Kwark.
I'd like to know what kind of logic you're using to judge people. + Man who insults everything everyone that he doesn't like = can improve. + People who get offended by said man = narcissism and rubbish.
Artosis knows he's an entertainer, but you take the bombast seriously and act sanctimoniously in response. Also, there's a big difference between talking shit and streamsniping someone. Talking shit is easily ignored. I was talking about his gameplay, by the way, not his general behavior on stream. His content is top notch and brings laughter to thousands on a daily basis even if his play isn't exceptionally good.
Dude you keep downplaying the toxicity of Artosis's behavior on stream. Can improve? Bombast? Lmao. On the other hand how come you use all kinds of negative terms to describe people who get offended by him? Such fanboyism at its finest.
Let's face the truth here: he's a dick on stream. Yeah he's an entertainer. But being an entertainer doesn't give you the right to shit on everyone. I do find some of his stuff is funny, but there must be a line somewhere.
And lmao at talking shit is easily ignored. Yeah, because you are the one doing the shit talking. So after I insult someone I'll just advise them to ignore it. Yep, it works like that. Easy peasy. I insult you because I'm an entertainer ans I'm allowed to, and if you feel offended it's because you're rubbish people. Hahahaha. Stop riding his dick dude.
Plus I'd also like to know the mental struggle of being stream sniped. So you hit the queue button on ladder and you play a game of Starcraft, with or without knowing that the opponent was deliberately trying to match you. You win the game if you're better and lose if you're worse. Just like every other game. Hmm I can't imagine the trauma such experience gives. Must be tough man. Must be tough.
You must absolutely hate stand-up comedy then. If you can't ignore people whom you don't respect talking shit then you might just be a narcissist after all. Your post sounds like you are on the verge of tears over a guy who rages every stream. Part of growing up is learning to ignore people who aggravate you when you pay attention to them but you don't have to pay attention to them if you don't want to.
I vividly remember the last stand-up comedy routine that I went to. Was a funny dude. Towards the end of his show he invited me to the stage. I felt honored, so my legs carried me through the rows of seats. As I stood a few feet next to the brilliant man, he asked me how my day was. I said I was great, and that I had just been promoted a day earlier. Suddenly his face appeared to crumple as he had a slightly annoyed look on his face. In front of the large audience he said to me words that I'll never forget because they were so funny: 'your game is weak, you'll never amount to anything and you should be ranked much lower with your horrible work ethic'. There was little laughter, but the audience seemed almost as stunned as I was. There I was, being given the honor of being taught the great comedy that was my life by a great comedian. A few people threw cash onto the stage. I think moments before the show ended I saw Mario enter the hall. After one last sip from my drink I left for home. I'll never forget this great day, it was hilarious and also full of wisdom. What a great guy, he'll go on to be a big name beloved by everyone.
I think you might be missing or just in general don't appreciate what this sort of humor is. The humor is watching him get into such a state over a little casual ladder action. That's why his viewers bombard him with troll donations even in the middle of games he is losing. It's not that he's telling jokes per se like a standup comedian would. The similarity is that in both cases, stand-up comedians and Artosis, they direct mean words at people for the sake of humor and they shouldn't be taken seriously.
Fyi, I love stand up comedy and I struggle to find the similarity between a good stand-up comedian and Artosis.
For once, a comedian tell jokes, but the joke shouldn't be offensive, racist or sexist, or he's considered a bad comedian. Artosis just rages, and offensive is an understatement because on many occasion he just shout "fuck you moron" or something like that to the screen. Please find me a stand-up comedian who does that on EVERY SINGLE show.
I don’t think a comedian is considered bad if his jokes are offensive, sexist or racist. There are plenty who are many of those things and still funny as hell, at least in my opinion. Like Frankie Boyle, Jimmy Carr, Chapelle or Bill Burr.
On May 02 2022 05:14 honorablemacroterran wrote: It sounds like you decided to make yourself a villain because he did his usual post-loss bitching that he does on every stream against every opponent and it offended your narcissism so you decided to streamsnipe him and are now acting surprised that people think it was bad behavior. So are we supposed to take it that if you complain about your opponent that justifies them streamsniping you going forward?
Lol, so what on earth justifies Artosis's bm almost every game? Insulting his opponents, calling them stupid, morons, apes, fuck this fuck that... How come you don't see the problems with the guy bitching after every game, but instead attribute narcissism to the guy who feels offended by that.
Stream sniping is in fact the softest "punishment" Artosis can have for his toxic behavior. What does he have to endure lol? Playing (and losing, in a fair manner) a Starcraft game. Imagine behaving like that in a LAN setting, soon somebody will smash a keyboard into his head and everyone will kinda agree he deserves that.
The other day after losing a "lag" game against a BSL fella, Artosis then proceeded to call BSL a "lagging shitshow". Yep, that's the kind of respect he has for the foreign community. If he gets banished from SC altogether, I'd say he deserves it.
Yeah believe me I didn't post in this thread to whiteknight for Artosis, he can certainly improve. I posted in this thread because I think people who get offended by his act are rubbish and the king of them all is Kwark.
I'd like to know what kind of logic you're using to judge people. + Man who insults everything everyone that he doesn't like = can improve. + People who get offended by said man = narcissism and rubbish.
Artosis knows he's an entertainer, but you take the bombast seriously and act sanctimoniously in response. Also, there's a big difference between talking shit and streamsniping someone. Talking shit is easily ignored. I was talking about his gameplay, by the way, not his general behavior on stream. His content is top notch and brings laughter to thousands on a daily basis even if his play isn't exceptionally good.
Dude you keep downplaying the toxicity of Artosis's behavior on stream. Can improve? Bombast? Lmao. On the other hand how come you use all kinds of negative terms to describe people who get offended by him? Such fanboyism at its finest.
Let's face the truth here: he's a dick on stream. Yeah he's an entertainer. But being an entertainer doesn't give you the right to shit on everyone. I do find some of his stuff is funny, but there must be a line somewhere.
And lmao at talking shit is easily ignored. Yeah, because you are the one doing the shit talking. So after I insult someone I'll just advise them to ignore it. Yep, it works like that. Easy peasy. I insult you because I'm an entertainer ans I'm allowed to, and if you feel offended it's because you're rubbish people. Hahahaha. Stop riding his dick dude.
Plus I'd also like to know the mental struggle of being stream sniped. So you hit the queue button on ladder and you play a game of Starcraft, with or without knowing that the opponent was deliberately trying to match you. You win the game if you're better and lose if you're worse. Just like every other game. Hmm I can't imagine the trauma such experience gives. Must be tough man. Must be tough.
You must absolutely hate stand-up comedy then. If you can't ignore people whom you don't respect talking shit then you might just be a narcissist after all. Your post sounds like you are on the verge of tears over a guy who rages every stream. Part of growing up is learning to ignore people who aggravate you when you pay attention to them but you don't have to pay attention to them if you don't want to.
I vividly remember the last stand-up comedy routine that I went to. Was a funny dude. Towards the end of his show he invited me to the stage. I felt honored, so my legs carried me through the rows of seats. As I stood a few feet next to the brilliant man, he asked me how my day was. I said I was great, and that I had just been promoted a day earlier. Suddenly his face appeared to crumple as he had a slightly annoyed look on his face. In front of the large audience he said to me words that I'll never forget because they were so funny: 'your game is weak, you'll never amount to anything and you should be ranked much lower with your horrible work ethic'. There was little laughter, but the audience seemed almost as stunned as I was. There I was, being given the honor of being taught the great comedy that was my life by a great comedian. A few people threw cash onto the stage. I think moments before the show ended I saw Mario enter the hall. After one last sip from my drink I left for home. I'll never forget this great day, it was hilarious and also full of wisdom. What a great guy, he'll go on to be a big name beloved by everyone.
I think you might be missing or just in general don't appreciate what this sort of humor is. The humor is watching him get into such a state over a little casual ladder action. That's why his viewers bombard him with troll donations even in the middle of games he is losing. It's not that he's telling jokes per se like a standup comedian would. The similarity is that in both cases, stand-up comedians and Artosis, they direct mean words at people for the sake of humor and they shouldn't be taken seriously.
Sure, you have a right to your opinion. I also have an opinion, and strangely it's not in line with yours. Might have something to do with me having taken notice how much unjustified negativity Artosis spreads during his streams towards players who just want to have a fun time, or it might be because I'm extremely biased against a super popular and extremely hilarious god-tier streamer (who's also the most consistently non-S-ranked S-class player of all time). I'm sure there's no way to objectively assess which opinion rests on stronger physical evidence, like video captures and screenshots of Artosis' text messages and other behavior during the games he plays. It's not like we live in a world where such evidence collecting could be done, or has already been done.
On May 02 2022 05:14 honorablemacroterran wrote: It sounds like you decided to make yourself a villain because he did his usual post-loss bitching that he does on every stream against every opponent and it offended your narcissism so you decided to streamsnipe him and are now acting surprised that people think it was bad behavior. So are we supposed to take it that if you complain about your opponent that justifies them streamsniping you going forward?
Lol, so what on earth justifies Artosis's bm almost every game? Insulting his opponents, calling them stupid, morons, apes, fuck this fuck that... How come you don't see the problems with the guy bitching after every game, but instead attribute narcissism to the guy who feels offended by that.
Stream sniping is in fact the softest "punishment" Artosis can have for his toxic behavior. What does he have to endure lol? Playing (and losing, in a fair manner) a Starcraft game. Imagine behaving like that in a LAN setting, soon somebody will smash a keyboard into his head and everyone will kinda agree he deserves that.
The other day after losing a "lag" game against a BSL fella, Artosis then proceeded to call BSL a "lagging shitshow". Yep, that's the kind of respect he has for the foreign community. If he gets banished from SC altogether, I'd say he deserves it.
Yeah believe me I didn't post in this thread to whiteknight for Artosis, he can certainly improve. I posted in this thread because I think people who get offended by his act are rubbish and the king of them all is Kwark.
I'd like to know what kind of logic you're using to judge people. + Man who insults everything everyone that he doesn't like = can improve. + People who get offended by said man = narcissism and rubbish.
Artosis knows he's an entertainer, but you take the bombast seriously and act sanctimoniously in response. Also, there's a big difference between talking shit and streamsniping someone. Talking shit is easily ignored. I was talking about his gameplay, by the way, not his general behavior on stream. His content is top notch and brings laughter to thousands on a daily basis even if his play isn't exceptionally good.
Dude you keep downplaying the toxicity of Artosis's behavior on stream. Can improve? Bombast? Lmao. On the other hand how come you use all kinds of negative terms to describe people who get offended by him? Such fanboyism at its finest.
Let's face the truth here: he's a dick on stream. Yeah he's an entertainer. But being an entertainer doesn't give you the right to shit on everyone. I do find some of his stuff is funny, but there must be a line somewhere.
And lmao at talking shit is easily ignored. Yeah, because you are the one doing the shit talking. So after I insult someone I'll just advise them to ignore it. Yep, it works like that. Easy peasy. I insult you because I'm an entertainer ans I'm allowed to, and if you feel offended it's because you're rubbish people. Hahahaha. Stop riding his dick dude.
Plus I'd also like to know the mental struggle of being stream sniped. So you hit the queue button on ladder and you play a game of Starcraft, with or without knowing that the opponent was deliberately trying to match you. You win the game if you're better and lose if you're worse. Just like every other game. Hmm I can't imagine the trauma such experience gives. Must be tough man. Must be tough.
You must absolutely hate stand-up comedy then. If you can't ignore people whom you don't respect talking shit then you might just be a narcissist after all. Your post sounds like you are on the verge of tears over a guy who rages every stream. Part of growing up is learning to ignore people who aggravate you when you pay attention to them but you don't have to pay attention to them if you don't want to.
I vividly remember the last stand-up comedy routine that I went to. Was a funny dude. Towards the end of his show he invited me to the stage. I felt honored, so my legs carried me through the rows of seats. As I stood a few feet next to the brilliant man, he asked me how my day was. I said I was great, and that I had just been promoted a day earlier. Suddenly his face appeared to crumple as he had a slightly annoyed look on his face. In front of the large audience he said to me words that I'll never forget because they were so funny: 'your game is weak, you'll never amount to anything and you should be ranked much lower with your horrible work ethic'. There was little laughter, but the audience seemed almost as stunned as I was. There I was, being given the honor of being taught the great comedy that was my life by a great comedian. A few people threw cash onto the stage. I think moments before the show ended I saw Mario enter the hall. After one last sip from my drink I left for home. I'll never forget this great day, it was hilarious and also full of wisdom. What a great guy, he'll go on to be a big name beloved by everyone.
I think you might be missing or just in general don't appreciate what this sort of humor is. The humor is watching him get into such a state over a little casual ladder action. That's why his viewers bombard him with troll donations even in the middle of games he is losing. It's not that he's telling jokes per se like a standup comedian would. The similarity is that in both cases, stand-up comedians and Artosis, they direct mean words at people for the sake of humor and they shouldn't be taken seriously.
Sure, you have a right to your opinion. I also have an opinion, and strangely it's not in line with yours. Might have something to do with me having taken notice how much unjustified negativity Artosis spreads during his streams towards players who just want to have a fun time, or it might be because I'm extremely biased against a super popular and extremely hilarious god-tier streamer (who's also the most consistently non-S-ranked S-class player of all time). I'm sure there's no way to objectively assess which opinion rests on stronger physical evidence, like video captures and screenshots of Artosis' text messages and other behavior during the games he plays. It's not like we live in a world where such evidence collecting could be done, or has already been done.
Yeah I think the disconnect is that you are a baby.
This is being blown out of proportion, I'll tell you how this entire thing started. Early 2020, Artosis started streaming BW more regularly, he hits KwarK 1 game, loses and trash talks. KwarK takes offense and proceeds to snipe him/trash talk him in-game (game related stuff but obviously his goal is to get him back).
Obviously Artosis doesn't like this and trash talks KwarK on his stream from that point on etc. Some time passes and KwarK msgs me something to tell Artosis, I tell him it's not my place to do so and that he should msg him directly via TL. From that point I've been pretty much out of the loop w/ everything that's happened afterwards but that's the essence of the beef, it's pretty innocent/game related stuff.
Now if we go back to the start and really think about it, both their perspectives/reactions are understandable. Artosis is just being himself (this is his competitive nature). I've known him for a very long time, trust me when I say he's always been like this and doesn't care about who he offends. He might hold some stuff back if he knows you personally but if he doesn't you're gonna get da full blast (trust me i know).
The thing is, players are very competitive and they react to race/skill bashing differently, some get more offended than others. Many players are gonna act the same way KwarK did (and many have, both kors and foreigners). Even if this type of stuff is annoying to deal with, it comes with the territory. He might think he shouldn't need to deal with it but the reality is this type of stuff is bound to happen in most competitive settings.
Now, I also think you're asking to be disliked when you snipe/instigate trash talk against a known streamer/competitive person like Artosis. This entire thing is pretty harmless to me tho, it gets annoying when fans become overly invested and start to character bash, let the players deal with it. Grudges should always stay between players and they should resolve it (or not) however they deem fit.
I'm a purist so I always look at stuff like this from an entertainment/competitive lens, I love it. Players are always gonna like/dislike other players, that's what makes the competitive scene juicy. You just can't take this stuff personally, what happens in-game stays in-game.
TT1’s now edited post reasonably reflects what happened. Amusingly enough he was the catalyst for all this by posting the vod of Artosis BMing me, without that I never would have known.
I had no idea there was beef between Artosis and KwarK before this thread was opened, and I'd bet many/most others didn't know either. I came to dislike and criticize his behavior all on my own, and so did many others who've watched his streams and decided it's not for them. With Artosis being an ambassador of the game I think he's doing much harm to the scene, and that's why I decided to throw my hat in the ring.
The argument I'm hearing is that "Artosis generally creates a negative atmosphere, he's not singling anyone out". Ok, that makes it better. Wait, what? I guess Artosis has the enormous privilege of having a high status in the community due to his most active days as a commentator working alongside the legendary Tasteless, who had paved the way for him. Must be nice to be so immune to criticism thanks to both nostalgic and fresh fans.
On May 05 2022 12:32 Magic Powers wrote: I had no idea there was beef between Artosis and KwarK before this thread was opened, and I'd bet many/most others didn't know either. I came to dislike and criticize his behavior all on my own, and so did many others who've watched his streams and decided it's not for them. With Artosis being an ambassador of the game I think he's doing much harm to the scene, and that's why I decided to throw my hat in the ring.
The argument I'm hearing is that "Artosis generally creates a negative atmosphere, he's not singling anyone out". Ok, that makes it better. Wait, what? I guess Artosis has the enormous privilege of having a high status in the community due to his most active days as a commentator working alongside the legendary Tasteless, who had paved the way for him. Must be nice to be so immune to criticism thanks to both nostalgic and fresh fans.
No matter how you wanna look at it, the foreign BW scene would be dead without Artosis (i witnessed this 1st hand even post SCR, before he streamed). BSL wouldn't be BSL had Artosis not started streaming BW full time, the player base/viewer base would be much lower. So yes he's in a different position, regardless of whether or not you like/dislike how he acts on stream, you need to respect what he does for the game as a whole.
It's the same type of mindset you should have as a player. No matter who your opponent is and how they play you should still respect them for giving you the opportunity to play the game, without an opponent there would be no one to play.
This is what i don't understand with a lot of people, if you don't like him just don't watch him, ignore him. Everyone wants to change something, be it with the game or how someone acts etc. As long as you're not hurting someone on a personal level, let people be themselves.
Artosis acts in an extreme way (gameplay-wise to his detriment a lot of the time, keep that in mind) but he keeps his general trash talk BW related (until someone takes offense and comes back at him, then things start to get more personal). The way he conducts himself in and out of competing (to him that's playing the game, that's his mindset) is genuinely who he is as a person, you want someone to change the essence of who they are? Why? Just because you don't like it? BW is just a game dude, you'll survive.
On May 05 2022 12:32 Magic Powers wrote: I had no idea there was beef between Artosis and KwarK before this thread was opened, and I'd bet many/most others didn't know either. I came to dislike and criticize his behavior all on my own, and so did many others who've watched his streams and decided it's not for them. With Artosis being an ambassador of the game I think he's doing much harm to the scene, and that's why I decided to throw my hat in the ring.
The argument I'm hearing is that "Artosis generally creates a negative atmosphere, he's not singling anyone out". Ok, that makes it better. Wait, what? I guess Artosis has the enormous privilege of having a high status in the community due to his most active days as a commentator working alongside the legendary Tasteless, who had paved the way for him. Must be nice to be so immune to criticism thanks to both nostalgic and fresh fans.
No matter how you wanna look at it, the foreign BW scene would be dead without Artosis (i witnessed this 1st hand even post SCR, before he streamed). BSL wouldn't be BSL had Artosis not started streaming BW full time, the player base/viewer base would be much lower. So yes he's in a different position, regardless of whether or not you like/dislike how he acts on stream, you need to respect what he does for the game as a whole.
It's the same type of mindset you should have as a player. No matter who your opponent is and how they play you should still respect him for giving you the opportunity to play the game, without an opponent there would be no one to play.
I respect Artosis for his positive contributions to the game, and I criticize him for his negative contributions. Artosis the commentator is a force for good. Artosis the streamer almost exclusively spreads negativity.
Criticism of Artosis remains valid regardless of his good aspects. We don't have to accept his constant negativity just because he's also sometimes positive.
Furthermore I strictly do not believe that the foreign scene would be dead without him. That claim does nothing but further his superiority complex. I'd argue that his negativity has caused a number of people to invest less into the game because he spreads so much negativity, directly but also indirectly (as a role model). This is not a myth, it's well-known that a negative environment causes people to leave, and those who stay to be less invested, even if the activity itself would be fun in principle.
Lastly, I consider it ironic that Artosis' fanboys criticize the criticism of Artosis, indicating that they're not happy when criticism negatively impacts the fun they're having, but not self-aware enough to realize their double standard. This is what i don't understand with a lot of Artosis fanboys, if they don't like his critics they can just not listen to them, just ignore them. Hmm...
On May 05 2022 12:32 Magic Powers wrote: I had no idea there was beef between Artosis and KwarK before this thread was opened, and I'd bet many/most others didn't know either. I came to dislike and criticize his behavior all on my own, and so did many others who've watched his streams and decided it's not for them. With Artosis being an ambassador of the game I think he's doing much harm to the scene, and that's why I decided to throw my hat in the ring.
The argument I'm hearing is that "Artosis generally creates a negative atmosphere, he's not singling anyone out". Ok, that makes it better. Wait, what? I guess Artosis has the enormous privilege of having a high status in the community due to his most active days as a commentator working alongside the legendary Tasteless, who had paved the way for him. Must be nice to be so immune to criticism thanks to both nostalgic and fresh fans.
No matter how you wanna look at it, the foreign BW scene would be dead without Artosis (i witnessed this 1st hand even post SCR, before he streamed). BSL wouldn't be BSL had Artosis not started streaming BW full time, the player base/viewer base would be much lower. So yes he's in a different position, regardless of whether or not you like/dislike how he acts on stream, you need to respect what he does for the game as a whole.
It's the same type of mindset you should have as a player. No matter who your opponent is and how they play you should still respect him for giving you the opportunity to play the game, without an opponent there would be no one to play.
I respect Artosis for his positive contributions to the game, and I criticize him for his negative contributions. Artosis the commentator is a force for good. Artosis the streamer almost exclusively spreads negativity.
Criticism of Artosis remains valid regardless of his good aspects. We don't have to accept his constant negativity just because he's also sometimes positive.
Furthermore I strictly do not believe that the foreign scene would be dead without him. That claim does nothing but further his superiority complex. I'd argue that his negativity has caused a number of people to invest less into the game because he spreads so much negativity, directly but also indirectly (as a role model). This is not a myth, it's well-known that a negative environment causes people to leave, and those who stay to be less invested, even if the activity itself would be fun in principle.
Lastly, I consider it ironic that Artosis' fanboys criticize the criticism of Artosis, indicating that they're not happy when criticism negatively impacts the fun they're having, but not self-aware enough to realize their double standard. This is what i don't understand with a lot of Artosis fanboys, if they don't like his critics they can just not listen to them, just ignore them. Hmm...
Yes people are entitled to form opinions and dislike/like whoever they want, I'm not saying otherwise. That's how the world is, you can't control who likes or dislikes you for being yourself. The issue with what you're saying is, for some reason you think he should adhere to your moral standards and you shoebox him as if you're an authority on ethics. Why? Not everyone shares the same values as you do, it's all a matter of perspective.
If you think what he's doing is negative (this is where everyone is entitled to have their own opinion) he's ultimately gonna end up hurting himself by having people dislike him. As a public figure that's not a great thing, yes? So let him worry about that.
Btw i like/value both KwarK and Artosis for their genuine passion for the game (that's what we all have in common), they know this based on our chat interactions. I don't know them well enough personally to make an assessment of them on a personal level.. but i value what they both bring to the scene in their own way. That said, i know both of their competitive characters well enough to know that they're not the type of players to get along with one another . And that's fine, that's the spice of life.
What moral standards are you talking about? I think Artosis is being excessively mean to people and creating a negative environment.
Morality... lmao
I don't even understand your motivation. You're criticizing me for doing the thing that you're doing right now by criticizing my criticism of Artosis, while claiming you don't understand why I'm criticizing him. Critiception.
Excessively mean is a matter of perspective... creating a negative environment for who? I've actually brought this issue up with him in the past from the POV of it hurting his gameplay. He's aware of it but it's hard to change who you are, this is his competitive nature.
On May 05 2022 15:08 Magic Powers wrote: "This is who he is" is not a valid defense of a personal flaw.
This is where me and you differ, i accept him for who he is, that's the starting point. Progress can't be made if you shut someone out. You don't know how much we've talked about this topic in the past, he's aware of everything you dislike about him. Not because he cares about what you think about him, because it hurts him as a competitor.
It's not easy to put yourself out there in front of thousands of people to see your competitive nature and have them judge your perceived flaws. The hard part is doing something about it, bettering yourself, using those same emotions (because everyone has them, if you don't think they do you haven't experienced true competition) in a more productive/constructive way, that's not an easy thing to do. He knows about all this and reads a lot on this topic as well. Like in SC, knowledge is only the first step, the execution is the hard part.
We all have completely different life experiences, you shouldn't be quick to judge/shoebox someone when you can't view their life from their perspective. The funny thing is, you're basically doing the same thing he does in-game, instead you're doing it to talk about his character on a chat forum. What you do is easy, I'm sure it feels gratifying too huh? Moral superiority.. even if it's at subconscious level.
Life lesson buddy, perspective matters a lot, more than anything else in the world tbh. If we can't understand each other we can't help one another. We end up hating each other instead. What we're talking about is childish baby shit compared to the atrocities going on in the world.
"Other things in life are much worse than this" is also not a valid defense of a personal flaw.
I'm not quick to judge Artosis, many people have been observing his outbursts for the past few years. There are hundreds of clips out there showing his behavior. Just a few days ago I tuned into one of his streams and to no surprise I found him misplaying a TvT and berating (i.e. sending text to) his opponent, while said opponent did no more and no less than gain a well-deserved victory. This is not made up, that was just recently. Another time also recently he tried to berate a player by means of chat, several minutes after the game had concluded. Holy smokes. And that's only the tip of the iceberg. Of course he pretty much always berates players verbally on his stream, I guess they're lucky they don't have to hear that.
You did a lot of relativizing here in Artosis' favor, and KwarK also had to correct you on your version of events. I don't think this is an area where you are more qualified than others to determine what people should or shouldn't say about Artosis.
On May 05 2022 11:11 TT1 wrote: I'm a purist so I always look at stuff like this from an entertainment/competitive lens, I love it. Players are always gonna like/dislike other players, that's what makes the competitive scene juicy. You just can't take this stuff personally, what happens in-game stays in-game.
I shouldnt take it personal when he keeps telling his audience that I cheat?
I thought I'd read a blog from Kwark some time ago where he had 120 apm but said strategy beats apm sometimes. Now I read he's S rank in this thread. Who are you!? You seem more and more like an international man of mystery to me lol
On May 05 2022 13:06 Jumperer wrote: The only way to settle this beef is with $10000 Kwark vs Artosis bo69 BSL wrestlemania showmatch with tt1 casting.
10k usd is a bit too much xD but there is only one way to sort this shit out. Battle to the death in a bo7 BW match ffs lets do it!!!!
On May 05 2022 11:11 TT1 wrote: I'm a purist so I always look at stuff like this from an entertainment/competitive lens, I love it. Players are always gonna like/dislike other players, that's what makes the competitive scene juicy. You just can't take this stuff personally, what happens in-game stays in-game.
I shouldnt take it personal when he keeps telling his audience that I cheat?
it already reached a personal lvl for both of you so that's up to you to decide, it takes 2 to get there tho
On May 05 2022 11:11 TT1 wrote: I'm a purist so I always look at stuff like this from an entertainment/competitive lens, I love it. Players are always gonna like/dislike other players, that's what makes the competitive scene juicy. You just can't take this stuff personally, what happens in-game stays in-game.
I shouldnt take it personal when he keeps telling his audience that I cheat?
it already reached a personal lvl for both of you so that's up to you to decide, it takes 2 to get there tho
This is a good example of double standards. Seems like to me you are taking it personally on behalf of Artosis.
On May 05 2022 11:11 TT1 wrote: I'm a purist so I always look at stuff like this from an entertainment/competitive lens, I love it. Players are always gonna like/dislike other players, that's what makes the competitive scene juicy. You just can't take this stuff personally, what happens in-game stays in-game.
I shouldnt take it personal when he keeps telling his audience that I cheat?
it already reached a personal lvl for both of you so that's up to you to decide, it takes 2 to get there tho
This is a good example of double standards. Seems like to me you are taking it personally on behalf of Artosis.
i think that's just a reading comprehension issue on your end
Thanks for the insightfull posts TT1. I think we often forget how it is to be a "personality" or the center of attention on things like streams etc. It is the income for his family, his passion and his personality is at display for all to see. I'm sure it's not easy to combine all those things.
And like a person earlier said, his streams brings joy to many people. It IS a fun stream and I feel his viewers are generally very nice and friendly people and it is a fun place to be, with retarded donations, fun ascii art and stupid jokes. And in the end, is that not all life is about??
Yes and don't get me wrong, i'm not trying to justify the way he acts as being ok. From my POV i also don't like how he acts because i know how much time/effort he puts into getting better (he just ends up hurting himself), i respect that a lot about him. Seeing Artosis improve/succeed is good for the game, he's an important person for the scene (i'd argue the most important person ever for foreign SC).
But at the same time you have to put yourself in his shoes. He's not a progamer, once you're at that level there are certain things that you discover about yourself that allow you to act differently (that process takes a lot of discipline, especially for a game like BW). He's a 40 year old man with a family who has dedicated his life to SC, who puts himself out there for your viewing pleasure, to accomplish his own personal goals.
Yes he has flaws, yes many are gonna take issue with how he acts and how he's figured out to monetize it, this is all human nature. Ultimately none of this is any of our business tho, you shouldn't feel entitled to ask him to change himself because he doesn't meet your standards. You can either choose to be neutral, dislike or like him.. but you have to accept him for who he is. Everything else is really on him and his own goals, that's his prerogative.
And please remember, this is all coming from someone who Artosis had extreme dislike for back in the day, we both didn't like each other at all.
On May 06 2022 02:48 TT1 wrote: Yes and don't get me wrong, i'm not trying to justify the way he acts as being ok. From my POV i also don't like how he acts because i know how much time/effort he puts into getting better (he just ends up hurting himself), i respect that a lot about him. Seeing Artosis improve/succeed is good for the game, he's an important person for the scene (i'd argue the most important person ever for foreign SC).
But at the same time you have to put yourself in his shoes. He's not a progamer, once you're at that level there are certain things that you discover about yourself that allow you to act differently (that process takes a lot of discipline, especially for a game like BW). He's a 40 year old man with a family who has dedicated his life to SC, who puts himself out there for your viewing pleasure, to accomplish his own personal goals.
Yes he has flaws, yes many are gonna take issue with how he acts and how he's figured out to monetize it, this is all human nature. Ultimately none of this is any of our business tho, you shouldn't feel entitled to ask him to change himself because he doesn't meet your standards. You can either choose to be neutral, dislike or like him.. but you have to accept him for who he is. Everything else is really on him and his own goals, that's his prerogative.
And please remember, this is all coming from someone who Artosis had extreme dislike for back in the day, we both didn't like each other at all.
That’s a good post. in a somewhat derailed and stupid thread.
It's not but the least i can do is offer an impartial view of both sides. That was my goal with my 1st post in the thread, i just laid the facts out and gave my own opinion on the matter. Like i've been saying, perspective matters. From there people can form their own opinions.
I don't see impartiality in your actions, because you haven't given the same benefit to the criticism. You very clearly want the criticism to end, but you don't care that Artosis is going to continue berating players.
I want people to form their own opinions on the issue, you want to force feed them your opinions. I don't care about your opinion, do you understand?
My goal isn't to change anyones opinion, that's just a waste of time, you're exhibit A. That said, if someone impartial wants to form an opinion i want them to know the facts and understand the perspective from both sides, that's all.
You know the change my opinion meme guy, you remind me of that guy. To me you have to be very entitled and value your opinion extremely highly, above others (speaking of superiority complex), to think you're special enough to have someone change your views. Someone else might care enough to try do that.. but i don't. You're essentially going around in a loop talking to yourself.
On May 05 2022 15:08 Magic Powers wrote: "This is who he is" is not a valid defense of a personal flaw.
This is where me and you differ, i accept him for who he is, that's the starting point. Progress can't be made if you shut someone out. You don't know how much we've talked about this topic in the past, he's aware of everything you dislike about him. Not because he cares about what you think about him, because it hurts him as a competitor.
It's not easy to put yourself out there in front of thousands of people to see your competitive nature and have them judge your perceived flaws. The hard part is doing something about it, bettering yourself, using those same emotions (because everyone has them, if you don't think they do you haven't experienced true competition) in a more productive/constructive way, that's not an easy thing to do. He knows about all this and reads a lot on this topic as well. Like in SC, knowledge is only the first step, the execution is the hard part.
We all have completely different life experiences, you shouldn't be quick to judge/shoebox someone when you can't view their life from their perspective. The funny thing is, you're basically doing the same thing he does in-game, instead you're doing it to talk about his character on a chat forum. What you do is easy, I'm sure it feels gratifying too huh? Moral superiority.. even if it's at subconscious level.
Life lesson buddy, perspective matters a lot, more than anything else in the world tbh. If we can't understand each other we can't help one another. We end up hating each other instead. What we're talking about is childish baby shit compared to the atrocities going on in the world.
"The funny thing is, you're basically doing the same thing he does in-game, instead you're doing it to talk about his character on a chat forum. What you do is easy, I'm sure it feels gratifying too huh? Moral superiority.. even if it's at subconscious level."
Now think about this, what do you think is more harmful; bandwagon character bashing on a public forum or a 40 year old guy rage venting in a game?
Definitely not the character bashing (if calling a known liar a liar is even bashing) on a near dead bw forum lol. Way less harmful than a popular social media figure broadcasting their vitriol. Like is that even a question?
Also you keep saying you’re very neutral but it’s some weird phrasing. You call TL a public forum, which it is, but it’s hardly a social hub these days. You reframe what he does as venting, rather than harassing, insulting or abusing, even when he’s pausing games so he can type out his insults. You’re adding in his age as if that somehow makes it less impactful when we’re all basically the same age. And you describe the context of his actions as in a game and not, for example, broadcast live to thousands of people on a large social media platform.
I think if he were generally venting about how frustrating a game is in single player without broadcasting it people would have a lot less problems with it. What you described is basically someone getting mad during a game of Rimworld and it’s really not what the issue is.
Very weird phrasing. It’s about as neutral as a special military operation taking place in or around Russian territory.
Fair enough, that's why i said everyone is entitled to their opinion, to me it's easily the former.
And KwarK, we spoke about this yesterday privately. If you were actually ever serious about avoiding all the drama w/ him you know what the answer is.. and let's be real, you've always known. It doesn't take too many brain cells to figure that out, part of you liked engaging with him.
The editing of comments war when Kwark and TT1 argue is golden! Trying to one up each other by editing their comments after reading each others response. (edited 3x for the luls)
On May 06 2022 06:20 TT1 wrote: And KwarK, we spoke about this yesterday privately. If you were actually ever serious about avoiding all the drama w/ him you know what the answer is.. and let's be real, you've always known.
I’m still going to take your advice from yesterday and unilaterally leave our games. It was good advice. It doesn’t matter how in the wrong I think he is, he’s never going to stop being the way he is, all I can do is work around that.
We’re agreed on the answer. I just think it’s weird that you’re neutrally phrasing shit the way you are. I might neutrally describe what I did as a middle aged family man playing an old strategy game that doesn’t hurt anyone.
Artosis personality when streaming BW is absolutely dogsh1t but not surprising. I only knew him for his Tastosis ASL casts back then and I had no problem at all with the guy. But that started to change after watching some of his clips on yt. His rage clips were very entertaining, I watched a lot of them and LOL'd to death then I was curious if his whole stream was this entertaining.
At first, it was somewhat entertaining and delivered "enough" but I realized as soon as the whining and raging stopped the stream had no value for me. I tried watching him in a "legitimately" way but that escalated in no time because of pointless whining and donation spam, and the mute button was not an option because I was mainly there for his infamous acts.
Nowadays is significantly different. His raging, whining and b1tching is still there but what really changed is his attitude towards his opponents, is like he only focuses most of his energy on sh1t talking. I wouldn't mind that much if he at least put some entertainment effort but seems he's running out of juice or something.
Every now and then I check his streams and is always the same disrespect and petty stuff. One of his best qualities, his rage, has been diminished a lot which kills most of the entertainment aspect, at least for me. Yes, I am aware that he raging too much is not healthy for him, I am not a total psycho.
If Artosis would deserve respect then is only because of his "positive contributions" to the foreign scene and Tastosis casts. Everything else about him comes as negative as it can get. A vast majority of his viewers think that the "real" Artosis is the one that casts and the whiny one on the stream is just an act. They are both legitimate. This is not hard to believe considering that casting is actually a legitimately job and unprofessionalism is not tolerated. Could you imagine if the whiny Artosis would take over when casting? It would be hilarious at first but the backlash would surely end him for good.
All in all, despite Artosis negativity, he's only part of the problem. I am fine with Artosis' fans as long as they see him for what he really is. The problem arises when people take his words for granted. Sure, it doesn't help them when Artosis spreads bullsh1t mixing with actual BW knowledge but my god, people can be so mindless.
I used to enjoy watching Artosis. Mostly for the brood war content, partly for the rage and comedic commentary he provided. What stopped me from watching his stream was the endless and annoying TTS donations. If you mute the stream because of TTS, you lose most of the comedy factor. How about back to debunking artosis claims?
On May 06 2022 06:20 TT1 wrote: Fair enough, that's why i said everyone is entitled to their opinion, to me it's easily the former.
Everyone is entitled to their opinion but your opinion happens to be wrong, bro. It's because you don't get the facts right.
Here, let me tell you what the fact is. Artosis is known for: - in-game bm and publicly insulting his opponents - spreading vitriol towards a race or the players of that race - mixing bullshit with the general knowledge of the game - breaking truce then lying about that (as evidenced in the feud with Kwark) - disrespecting the foreign community on many occasions
So you see, it's not quite "old guy rage venting in a game". Now you can form your opinion again and be entitled to it. Hopefully this time it's right.
On May 06 2022 06:20 TT1 wrote: Fair enough, that's why i said everyone is entitled to their opinion, to me it's easily the former.
Everyone is entitled to their opinion but your opinion happens to be wrong, bro. It's because you don't get the facts right.
Here, let me tell you what the fact is. Artosis is known for: - in-game bm and publicly insulting his opponents - spreading vitriol towards a race or the players of that race - mixing bullshit with the general knowledge of the game - breaking truce then lying about that (as evidenced in the feud with Kwark) - disrespecting the foreign community on many occasions
So you see, it's not quite "old guy rage venting in a game". Now you can form your opinion again and be entitled to it. Hopefully this time it's right.
Disrespecting the foreign community, but there would not even be a foreign community without artosis.
Him whining about protoss and zerg while raging is a massive boost to the games viewership. In my experience if people do not have argument and rage to have around a game all the time it loses popularity. As counterintuitive as it sounds, if there was more open toxicity and complaining in the community then the game would most likely be more popular.
Of course, up to you to decide if all that drama is worth. But whatever it takes to keep the game from becoming dead at the least, and artosis on his own fills that quota.
Disrespecting the foreign community, but there would not even be a foreign community without artosis.
Him whining about protoss and zerg while raging is a massive boost to the games viewership. In my experience if people do not have argument and rage to have around a game all the time it loses popularity. As counterintuitive as it sounds, if there was more open toxicity and complaining in the community then the game would most likely be more popular.
Of course, up to you to decide if all that drama is worth. But whatever it takes to keep the game from becoming dead at the least, and artosis on his own fills that quota.
A lot of this is true but is not a healthy way to keep alive the foreign community. Most of his viewers are on his stream because of his infamous behaviour not because it makes the game appealing to them. If he would switch to SC2 then I am willing to bet that his viewership would increase even higher. Heck, even switching to another game with some popularity would drag his viewers without any problems as long as he keeps raging and ranting.
Artosis himself probably doesn't even care about integrity anymore. He's almost 40 and has many kids to feed which gives him even more reason to continue his infamous deeds.
On May 06 2022 06:20 TT1 wrote: Fair enough, that's why i said everyone is entitled to their opinion, to me it's easily the former.
Everyone is entitled to their opinion but your opinion happens to be wrong, bro. It's because you don't get the facts right.
Here, let me tell you what the fact is. Artosis is known for: - in-game bm and publicly insulting his opponents - spreading vitriol towards a race or the players of that race - mixing bullshit with the general knowledge of the game - breaking truce then lying about that (as evidenced in the feud with Kwark) - disrespecting the foreign community on many occasions
So you see, it's not quite "old guy rage venting in a game". Now you can form your opinion again and be entitled to it. Hopefully this time it's right.
Disrespecting the foreign community, but there would not even be a foreign community without artosis.
Lmao this is so not true. How disconnected you are to reality to even come to this statement?
He's not the founder of tl or liquipedia. He's not the organizer of BSL. He's not a donor of any foreign tournaments. Heck, not even casting any.
As for his works in Korea, the foreign community existed before that point. And he's not even the most important person. Tasteless is the one who came there first and paved the way for Artosis.
The only thing you can say is he promotes BW to new foreign viewers. Not in the right way though, mind.
Can't argue with facts can you? That's why when confronted by Kwark, you had nothing to say but "fair enough", then resorted to the usual "personal opinion" cliché.
Notice how in all of your essays in this thread, none of it actually addressed any of Artosis' problems. But you bigged things up and over-generalized, talking about how the world is a bad place and etc. lol, but never addressing the details. All style without substance. Like, what kind of context or perspective should I be aware of to sympathize with Artosis straight up lying?
He's not a donor of any foreign tournaments. Heck, not even casting any.
What, not even a few? This doesn't sound right.. If this is true then I guess Artosis is really deluded thinking that he only belongs in the Korean part of the scene. This sounds really sad.
On May 06 2022 06:20 TT1 wrote: Fair enough, that's why i said everyone is entitled to their opinion, to me it's easily the former.
Everyone is entitled to their opinion but your opinion happens to be wrong, bro. It's because you don't get the facts right.
Here, let me tell you what the fact is. Artosis is known for: - in-game bm and publicly insulting his opponents - spreading vitriol towards a race or the players of that race - mixing bullshit with the general knowledge of the game - breaking truce then lying about that (as evidenced in the feud with Kwark) - disrespecting the foreign community on many occasions
So you see, it's not quite "old guy rage venting in a game". Now you can form your opinion again and be entitled to it. Hopefully this time it's right.
Disrespecting the foreign community, but there would not even be a foreign community without artosis.
Lmao this is so not true. How disconnected you are to reality to even come to this statement?
He's not the founder of tl or liquipedia. He's not the organizer of BSL. He's not a donor of any foreign tournaments. Heck, not even casting any.
As for his works in Korea, the foreign community existed before that point. And he's not even the most important person. Tasteless is the one who came there first and paved the way for Artosis.
The only thing you can say is he promotes BW to new foreign viewers. Not in the right way though, mind.
Yeah but pretty sure we're talking about the modern era of BW. The foreign scene didn't need saving during the prime day when BW is one of the top e-sport. And Pylon show is more SC2 than BW. Artosis fanboys must have thought he created Starcraft himself lol.
Yup and salty haters thinks he hasn’t done anything for bw lol How about The holiday bash, Starcraft remastered launch event and Zotac cup. Does that count?
On May 06 2022 06:20 TT1 wrote: Fair enough, that's why i said everyone is entitled to their opinion, to me it's easily the former.
Everyone is entitled to their opinion but your opinion happens to be wrong, bro. It's because you don't get the facts right.
Here, let me tell you what the fact is. Artosis is known for: - in-game bm and publicly insulting his opponents - spreading vitriol towards a race or the players of that race - mixing bullshit with the general knowledge of the game - breaking truce then lying about that (as evidenced in the feud with Kwark) - disrespecting the foreign community on many occasions
So you see, it's not quite "old guy rage venting in a game". Now you can form your opinion again and be entitled to it. Hopefully this time it's right.
He is also known for be sooooo fucking late with the ASL casts
On May 06 2022 20:49 Timebon3s wrote: Yup and salty haters thinks he hasn’t done anything for bw lol How about The holiday bash, Starcraft remastered launch event and Zotac cup. Does that count?
One of them had larva beating a chinese player with his feet. It had a lot of hits on pornhub and was on the top of Reddit lol The holiday bash and remastered launch events was a lot of fun and had a lot of views. Best thing I ever saw after fake klazart in tl attack.
Can't argue with facts can you? That's why when confronted by Kwark, you had nothing to say but "fair enough", then resorted to the usual "personal opinion" cliché.
Notice how in all of your essays in this thread, none of it actually addressed any of Artosis' problems. But you bigged things up and over-generalized, talking about how the world is a bad place and etc. lol, but never addressing the details. All style without substance. Like, what kind of context or perspective should I be aware of to sympathize with Artosis straight up lying?
You're just pretending to be neutral.
I'll spell it out for you because it seems like you can't add it up yourself. I'm neutral on the essence of the issue because it's dumb gamer/ego shit, that's in the first post i wrote (quoted below). The posts that happened afterwards was me replying back to Magic Powers/KwarK who are on the other side of the issue. I didn't need to respond back to them because for me the issue was dead at that point but i wanted to make them understand (not change their opinion, just understand) Artosis' perspective, because it seemed like they couldn't.
I laid out all the facts that i personally knew about because i was sort of in the middle of the issue at first. KwarK msg'd me to basically smooth things out with Artosis and i told him it's not my place to do so. I won't tell someone whether or not they should forgive or like/dislike someone else, deal with your shit yourself. You have to remember that everything that's happened between KwarK and Artosis has happened between me and him as well, 20 years ago. I've known him for a long time, i know his competitive nature/character. Artosis isn't the type of person that you can force to do something or act in a certain way, that's just not who he is.
So from there KwarK decided to PM him on TL to offer a truce, yada yada yada. For me the issue died after the 1st main interaction, from that point Artosis is going to dislike KwarK until something happens organically that'll change his view on him, that's just who he is. From here the ball is in KwarK's court, he doesn't need to msg Artosis, if he wants the issue to die all he had to do was avoid him. That or embrace the drama and carry on as you normally would. I personally don't give a fuck about whichever option he decides to pick but at least it's a definitive answer, there's no more bullshit back and forth.
Now, KwarK is also a passionate/competitive guy, you have to be that type of person if you're gonna invest time playing a game like BW. Whether or not part of him got irked by future interactions, whether or not he liked pissing him off and the attention that came with it, i don't know. Only he knows why the issue got to this point. For me this is all very simple, either you want the beef/drama or you don't. If you don't then leave the game whenever you match up with him, if you do then just act the fucking part and be yourself. This type of thing only really gets settled in tournaments anyways.
There's no middle point here but that's where KwarK's at. He kept the beef going until it got to a point where now he doesn't want to deal with the drama anymore, that's all on him. Artosis isn't gonna change who he is, you can't force him to do something he doesn't want to do with a person he dislikes. Either deal with it or don't deal with it, that's all there is to it. Here's my original post:
On May 05 2022 11:11 TT1 wrote: This is being blown out of proportion, I'll tell you how this entire thing started. Early 2020, Artosis started streaming BW more regularly, he hits KwarK 1 game, loses and trash talks. KwarK takes offense and proceeds to snipe him/trash talk him in-game (game related stuff but obviously his goal is to get him back).
Obviously Artosis doesn't like this and trash talks KwarK on his stream from that point on etc. Some time passes and KwarK msgs me something to tell Artosis, I tell him it's not my place to do so and that he should msg him directly via TL. From that point I've been pretty much out of the loop w/ everything that's happened afterwards but that's the essence of the beef, it's pretty innocent/game related stuff.
Now if we go back to the start and really think about it, both their perspectives/reactions are understandable. Artosis is just being himself (this is his competitive nature). I've known him for a very long time, trust me when I say he's always been like this and doesn't care about who he offends. He might hold some stuff back if he knows you personally but if he doesn't you're gonna get da full blast (trust me i know).
The thing is, players are very competitive and they react to race/skill bashing differently, some get more offended than others. Many players are gonna act the same way KwarK did (and many have, both kors and foreigners). Even if this type of stuff is annoying to deal with, it comes with the territory. He might think he shouldn't need to deal with it but the reality is this type of stuff is bound to happen in most competitive settings.
Now, I also think you're asking to be disliked when you snipe/instigate trash talk against a known streamer/competitive person like Artosis. This entire thing is pretty harmless to me tho, it gets annoying when fans become overly invested and start to character bash, let the players deal with it. Grudges should always stay between players and they should resolve it (or not) however they deem fit.
I'm a purist so I always look at stuff like this from an entertainment/competitive lens, I love it. Players are always gonna like/dislike other players, that's what makes the competitive scene juicy. You just can't take this stuff personally, what happens in-game stays in-game.
On May 06 2022 20:49 Timebon3s wrote: Yup and salty haters thinks he hasn’t done anything for bw lol How about The holiday bash, Starcraft remastered launch event and Zotac cup. Does that count?
No one is saying that. I was refuting the idiotic point that Artosis is responsible for the whole existence of the foreign BW scene. Participating in those one-off events you mentioned doesn't count towards that point. Not even remotely close. That's like saying there wouldn't be a BSL without Seriosity.
Artosis obviously has two youtube channels and one twitch stream that I acknowledged of promoting BW to foreign viewers. But that's it.
On May 05 2022 11:11 TT1 wrote: I'm a purist so I always look at stuff like this from an entertainment/competitive lens, I love it. Players are always gonna like/dislike other players, that's what makes the competitive scene juicy. You just can't take this stuff personally, what happens in-game stays in-game.
I shouldnt take it personal when he keeps telling his audience that I cheat?
it already reached a personal lvl for both of you so that's up to you to decide, it takes 2 to get there tho
This is a good example of double standards. Seems like to me you are taking it personally on behalf of Artosis.
i think that's just a reading comprehension issue on your end
Wow, that's exactly what a person with double standards would say. I might as well say, read my post again. Then we can go round in circles like you want to.
______
Also got to laugh at the idea that there would not be a foreign community without artosis. A community exists whether or not there is a person who has the most precense or not. All it means is that clicks is centered on that person, instead of being spread elsewhere. Artosis and Tasteless stopped casting live ASL, plenty others stepped up to the task.
On May 05 2022 11:11 TT1 wrote: I'm a purist so I always look at stuff like this from an entertainment/competitive lens, I love it. Players are always gonna like/dislike other players, that's what makes the competitive scene juicy. You just can't take this stuff personally, what happens in-game stays in-game.
I shouldnt take it personal when he keeps telling his audience that I cheat?
it already reached a personal lvl for both of you so that's up to you to decide, it takes 2 to get there tho
This is a good example of double standards. Seems like to me you are taking it personally on behalf of Artosis.
i think that's just a reading comprehension issue on your end
Wow, that's exactly what a person with double standards would say. I might as well say, read my post again.
?????????
Read my last post, this part basically addresses your point, if you had enough reading comprehension you would have added it up/understood it yourself:
"For me this is all very simple, either you want the beef/drama or you don't. If you don't then leave the game whenever you match up with him, if you do then just act the fucking part and be yourself. This type of thing only really gets settled in tournaments anyways."
Basically Oystein embraced it, good for him. Personally i love real competitive drama, it's the purest form of spice in life.
On May 05 2022 11:11 TT1 wrote: I'm a purist so I always look at stuff like this from an entertainment/competitive lens, I love it. Players are always gonna like/dislike other players, that's what makes the competitive scene juicy. You just can't take this stuff personally, what happens in-game stays in-game.
I shouldnt take it personal when he keeps telling his audience that I cheat?
it already reached a personal lvl for both of you so that's up to you to decide, it takes 2 to get there tho
Funny you should say that as I have never really taken anything before that personal. I actually find his rants about me hilarious and I dont take them personal at all. Do you think people are free to say and do as they please as long as its personal?
Now I did let my competitive ego get the best of me when he said he would beat me 9/10 games or 19/20 if we played on LAN after the first game I beat him after randomly playing him on the ladder. Has it been petty behaviour sniping him to prove him wrong? Sure Has it been a productive way to spend my time? Hell no Has it been rewarding proving a loudmouth wrong? For sure.
I have however never, as far as I know, said anything bad to him or BMed him, unless you count replying to him lashing out at end of games hes losing BM. In fact I do enjoy watching his stream and the content he makes in BW, and despite what he think I do not hate him at all. I do find him questioning my integrity deplorable tho, and as far as I can tell from watching the VODs of games afterwards he has not even bothered to watch any reps before he started his slander, and he should be ashamed of that.
On May 05 2022 11:11 TT1 wrote: I'm a purist so I always look at stuff like this from an entertainment/competitive lens, I love it. Players are always gonna like/dislike other players, that's what makes the competitive scene juicy. You just can't take this stuff personally, what happens in-game stays in-game.
I shouldnt take it personal when he keeps telling his audience that I cheat?
it already reached a personal lvl for both of you so that's up to you to decide, it takes 2 to get there tho
Funny you should say that as I have never really taken anything before that personal. I actually find his rants about me hilarious and I dont take them personal at all. Do you think people are free to say and do as they please as long as its personal?
Now I did let my competitive ego get the best of me when he said he would beat me 9/10 games or 19/20 if we played on LAN after the first game I beat him after randomly playing him on the ladder. Has it been petty behaviour sniping him to prove him wrong? Sure Has it been a productive way to spend my time? Hell no Has it been rewarding proving a loudmouth wrong? For sure.
I have however never, as far as I know, said anything bad to him or BMed him, unless you count replying to him lashing out at end of games hes losing BM. In fact I do enjoy watching his stream and the content he makes in BW, and despite what he think I do not hate him at all. I do find him questioning my integrity deplorable tho, and as far as I can tell from watching the VODs of games afterwards he has not even bothered to watch any reps before he started his slander, and he should be ashamed of that.
This is subjective, it depends on the person. You can't control how other people act, only how you act. For me, the only thing that matters are tourneys/official matches so i wait until that point to settle any issues i have. Everything else is just noise, that said i understand your POV.
If you think about it from his POV, he has to deal with people sniping him a lot. So if someone is willing to go through the trouble to snipe him, in his mind there's a good chance that they might be stream cheating as well. Mentally he already chalks the game up to that, that's why i said only tourneys/official matches matter. But as i said before, this comes with the territory of being an outspoken/big streamer in a small community. The people he offends are gonna want to come back at him, he also brings this type of thing onto himself. The question is, does he care? ;;
Anyways, i'm gonna have to tap out here. My fingers are starting to hurt..
On May 05 2022 11:11 TT1 wrote: I'm a purist so I always look at stuff like this from an entertainment/competitive lens, I love it. Players are always gonna like/dislike other players, that's what makes the competitive scene juicy. You just can't take this stuff personally, what happens in-game stays in-game.
I shouldnt take it personal when he keeps telling his audience that I cheat?
it already reached a personal lvl for both of you so that's up to you to decide, it takes 2 to get there tho
This is a good example of double standards. Seems like to me you are taking it personally on behalf of Artosis.
i think that's just a reading comprehension issue on your end
Wow, that's exactly what a person with double standards would say. I might as well say, read my post again.
?????????
Read my last post, this part basically addresses your point, if you had enough reading comprehension you would have added it up/understood it yourself:
"For me this is all very simple, either you want the beef/drama or you don't. If you don't then leave the game whenever you match up with him, if you do then just act the fucking part and be yourself. This type of thing only really gets settled in tournaments anyways."
Basically Oystein embraced it, good for him. Personally i love real competitive drama, it's the purest form of spice in life.
It's not the early 1990s anymore and people are first discovering how to talk on a forum anymore. Nobody thinks you are clever, when you reply to people that they shouldn't take it personally, that you have a reading comprehension on your end, read my post again, that style or writing. Instead of addressing a logical argument you say these sort of attacks on a person. We all know nowadays that's how someone who cannot address a point will say. Talking to you is like talking to someone when starcraft came out, but instead of growing up, you are stuck in what you think is edgy teenager mind.
I'm not the one telling people that they shouldn't take it personally, whilst stuck on the site make single word replies like "lol" and replying within 5 mins of every post you want to counter, whilst simultaneously going full keyboard warrior to the point where you claim your fingers hurt. So hypocritical.
On May 05 2022 11:11 TT1 wrote: I'm a purist so I always look at stuff like this from an entertainment/competitive lens, I love it. Players are always gonna like/dislike other players, that's what makes the competitive scene juicy. You just can't take this stuff personally, what happens in-game stays in-game.
I shouldnt take it personal when he keeps telling his audience that I cheat?
it already reached a personal lvl for both of you so that's up to you to decide, it takes 2 to get there tho
This is a good example of double standards. Seems like to me you are taking it personally on behalf of Artosis.
i think that's just a reading comprehension issue on your end
Wow, that's exactly what a person with double standards would say. I might as well say, read my post again.
?????????
Read my last post, this part basically addresses your point, if you had enough reading comprehension you would have added it up/understood it yourself:
"For me this is all very simple, either you want the beef/drama or you don't. If you don't then leave the game whenever you match up with him, if you do then just act the fucking part and be yourself. This type of thing only really gets settled in tournaments anyways."
Basically Oystein embraced it, good for him. Personally i love real competitive drama, it's the purest form of spice in life.
It's not the early 1990s anymore and people are first discovering how to talk on a forum anymore. Nobody thinks you are clever, when you reply to people that they shouldn't take it personally, that you have a reading comprehension on your end, read my post again, that style or writing. Instead of addressing a logical argument you say these sort of attacks on a person. We all know nowadays that's how someone who cannot address a point will say. Talking to you is like talking to someone when starcraft came out, but instead of growing up, you are stuck in what you think is edgy teenager mind.
I'm not the one telling people that they shouldn't take it personally, whilst stuck on the site make single word replies like "lol" and replying within 5 mins of every post you want to counter, whilst simultaneously going full keyboard warrior to the point where you claim your fingers hurt. So hypocritical.
Damn dude, it's crazy how much you know about me just from me simply saying "don't take it personally" without even understanding the context of it. That's on you, that's work you have to do, i'm not gonna do it for you. I refuse to spoon feed another change my opinion geek because i simply don't care. Just like 2 posts ago when i was forced to write another essay about how i was explaining Artosis' perspective (while arguing with 2 ppl on the other side of the issue!!!) when people accused me of not actually being neutral.. nothing tilts me more than having to do something like that tbh.
I can't argue with a logical wizard like you, you're too powerful. You're 100% right about me, you win! I was wondering how you were able to become such a masterful poster, what training you had to endure to reach such a high lvl.. so i decided to check your post history, it all instantly made sense. Manga manga manga, anime anime anime, politics politics politics, waow! There really is no chance for a teenage boy like me to compete with a PhD chat wiz such as yourself. Much respect buddy.
edit: 32 minutes this time, below my standard but i'll try to up my game in the future to keep up with you
EPT
Or maybe it is, i dunno, anyways onto the TRUTH:![[image loading]](https://i.imgur.com/MTbTOhO.png)
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![[image loading]](https://tl.net/staff/KwarK/Artosisisaliar.png)
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