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I feel that even tho Protoss got a change with the warp ins they just got buffed in both areas.
Defense wise because you get defense in 2 seconds. This is a good change !
Offense wise cuz you have the warp prism. This is the worst change ever !
Protoss player just stopped using pylons, instead their going for warp prism and just do the same old all ins.
I feel like warp prism should have the old 5-6 sec warp in and not the 2 sec warp in that supposed to help defenders advantage.
2 sec for defense or when you have pylon and warpgate on the map
5-6 sec at warp prism for normal warp ins
16 sec at pylons without warpgate or nexus
Also i will quote Snute, i feel his right again.
On August 23 2015 20:44 Liquid`Snute wrote:Nice post!  As MorroW pointed out, Warp Prism in LOTV has to move all the way from the Protoss base before it becomes a real threat. However, it still acts as an UNLIMITED warp-in tunnel once it's there. This is different from Medivac or Overlord that has to 'reload' units that need to walk across the map first. Not much of an issue for Zerg usually, but for Terran, absolutely. Anyway back to the prism. Still only 200 minerals (?), and it takes on average way, way more resources to deflect it than 200 minerals. I think it is unjustified to nerf the forward Pylon hard into the ground while leaving the Warp Prism untouched. The warp prism still acts as an unlimited warp-in tunnel and unlike a Medivac or Overlord it will never stop until killed. Its real threat value isn't 200 minerals, it can be as much as 1500-2000 minerals and gas, sometimes 3000+. With a warp-in time of less than two seconds, even stronger than before. For T and Z (and P), this type of guessing game feels gimmicky from a player perspective. At least in Brood War, you knew that a Shuttle could only contain max 2 archons or 2 reavers (eh maybe just 1? i forgot lol T_T), and then it would have to "reload". I'm strongly against the new nydus worm as well compared to, say, a nydus rocket launcher that would resemble Zerg Drop Pods from the campaign (with a cooldown), or the new Overlord drop. Infinite tunnels are some of the most theoretically powerful and devastating tools in RTS and they should not be thrown around lightly for cheap money imo. If the warp prism all of a sudden becomes deliberately strong for its cheap cost, increasingly mobile and durable, etc., to compensate for other flaws of the race (forward pylons being weak, Protoss mobility being weak), we might have missed the mark again. I would not be surprised to see late-game Protoss turn into "only camp&defend while testing waters with Prisms to open up an opportunity to move out". But that might be what designers and Protoss players want? Dunno
User was banned for this post.
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Austria16289 Posts
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I said it before, I say it again, splitting warp-in and energy power was by far the best solution (i.e. you can only warp around warpgates, Nexi and prisms with standard warp-in time). Huge nerf to strats based on offensive pylons, doesn't buff anything. Perfect. But of course they had to do it in their own complicated and inelegant way that in the end creates more problems than it solved.
And the warp prism problem is going to have to be addressed someday anyway, because let's face it it's already quite a broken unit. We don't get to see it often because robo time is important in most HotS match-ups, but for 200 minerals it does far more than it should, and the retarded long range pick-up is not going to make things any better.
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On September 03 2015 00:00 [PkF] Wire wrote:
I said it before, I say it again, splitting warp-in and energy power was by far the best solution (i.e. you can only warp around warpgates, Nexi and prisms with standard warp-in time). Huge nerf to strats based on offensive pylons, doesn't buff anything. Perfect. But of course they had to do it in their own complicated and inelegant way that in the end creates more problems than it solved.
And the warp prism problem is going to have to be addressed someday anyway, because let's face it it's already quite a broken unit. We don't get to see it often because robo time is important in most HotS match-ups, but for 200 minerals it does far more than it should, and the retarded long range pick-up is not going to make things any better.
They could have done that but if they choose this route they could at least make the warp prism have the wap in time 5-6 sec and not the dumb 2 sec.
I like the pick up range, its cool for micro but 2 sec warp in for them is dumb.
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With the current state of Adepts and Zealots (charge damage - lol) I must admit that my only play now as Protoss (v T) is to get Warp Prism, make a pretend play at the front and then demolish the main with a drop. Now if only I had an Oracle spare to statis ward the ramp.
Broken, totally broken. I would prefer a cool down on the WP or a limit to the number of units it can warp at a time. Obviously these are separate to normal WG cool down and number of warp gates.
Until then I will just have to enjoy free, undeserved wins - oh the agony of it 
Unbannableman - at first I thought that ZerglingSheperd had returned, but the OP seems far too reasonable for that.
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On September 03 2015 00:26 DeadByDawn wrote:With the current state of Adepts and Zealots (charge damage - lol) I must admit that my only play now as Protoss (v T) is to get Warp Prism, make a pretend play at the front and then demolish the main with a drop. Now if only I had an Oracle spare to statis ward the ramp. Broken, totally broken. I would prefer a cool down on the WP or a limit to the number of units it can warp at a time. Obviously these are separate to normal WG cool down and number of warp gates. Until then I will just have to enjoy free, undeserved wins - oh the agony of it Unbannableman - at first I thought that ZerglingSheperd had returned, but the OP seems far too reasonable for that.
A solution to limit the number of units a WP can warp in (the problem Snute mentioned) would be to make warp-ins energy based, like 25 energy per warp-in, so that a full energy warp prism can only drop 4 units and warp-in 8 others at full energy. It would make high templars a cool counter to warp prisms at the same time.
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Funny - it was ZerglingSheperd. Reasonable point though.
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On September 03 2015 00:26 DeadByDawn wrote:With the current state of Adepts and Zealots (charge damage - lol) I must admit that my only play now as Protoss (v T) is to get Warp Prism, make a pretend play at the front and then demolish the main with a drop. Now if only I had an Oracle spare to statis ward the ramp. Broken, totally broken. I would prefer a cool down on the WP or a limit to the number of units it can warp at a time. Obviously these are separate to normal WG cool down and number of warp gates. Until then I will just have to enjoy free, undeserved wins - oh the agony of it Unbannableman - at first I thought that ZerglingSheperd had returned, but the OP seems far too reasonable for that.
I am a resonable man. Yes i might be assholish but im reasonable.
And im glad someone agrees that 2 sec warp prism is pretty stupid, i dont want to take off the power of warp prism with cooldowns and other limits or band aids.
Even more when blizz said the 30 DMG is a bug and sooner or later adepts will get a nerf to early game.
So normal warp in for prism, 5-6 sec is the perfect way to solve this without doing any major band aids.
On September 03 2015 00:38 [PkF] Wire wrote:Show nested quote +On September 03 2015 00:26 DeadByDawn wrote:With the current state of Adepts and Zealots (charge damage - lol) I must admit that my only play now as Protoss (v T) is to get Warp Prism, make a pretend play at the front and then demolish the main with a drop. Now if only I had an Oracle spare to statis ward the ramp. Broken, totally broken. I would prefer a cool down on the WP or a limit to the number of units it can warp at a time. Obviously these are separate to normal WG cool down and number of warp gates. Until then I will just have to enjoy free, undeserved wins - oh the agony of it Unbannableman - at first I thought that ZerglingSheperd had returned, but the OP seems far too reasonable for that. A solution to limit the number of units a WP can warp in (the problem Snute mentioned) would be to make warp-ins energy based, like 25 energy per warp-in, so that a full energy warp prism can only drop 4 units and warp-in 8 others at full energy. It would make high templars a cool counter to warp prisms at the same time.
It would limit them to much, after a fail drop they would have to wait alot.
They would basically be the Overlord Drop that will be useless once it will be moved to lair if it doesnt get a huge buff to speed or more cargo for significant drops.
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I have no idea how to fix the Warp Prism, but--in my experience in both spectating and playing as Terran--it feels incredibly difficult to defend.
Let's put the obvious Adept issue to the side, as we all know--and hope--that this will be fixed eventually (still baffled that they are going to be buffed first, but *shrugs*).
The fast warp-in definitely seems like part of the issue. But also, it essentially grants the Blink ability to all ground units within a range: 6 (it's 6, right?). So this, with the fast warp in, and the relatively quick movement speed, just feels ... too difficult to deal with for how quickly it can come out.
It's to the point where if I'm not using the BQTY-QXC Ghost Rush play, I essentially have to rush to viking. But even then, you might still die to the pressure because now you have a fast lol-Viking in TvP. Unless you get really lucky, or the Protoss gets overly greedy, the viking should never catch the Warp Prism, essentially locking you in your base for a long, long time.
Maybe remove the ranged pick up? Maybe remove pick-up unload while in Phased Mode? Both? Could just modifying the cost fix the issue? I don't know.
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Why was he banned? Was his post offensive? Can someone explain what I am missing here?
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Austria16289 Posts
On September 03 2015 01:12 Phaenoman wrote:
Why was he banned? Was his post offensive? Can someone explain what I am missing here?
Previously banned user.
ZerglingShepard1, DeepBurrow, EasyMoney96 and all those aliases are the same banned guy.
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Ty. I didn't know ZergShep was banned.
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On September 03 2015 01:20 Phaenoman wrote:
Ty. I didn't know ZergShep was banned.
And also MurlocBoss and now OverlordBan. He makes accounts as fast as they can be banned.
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On September 03 2015 01:20 Phaenoman wrote:
Ty. I didn't know ZergShep was banned.
perma banned?
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On September 03 2015 01:16 Big J wrote:Show nested quote +On September 03 2015 01:12 Phaenoman wrote:
Why was he banned? Was his post offensive? Can someone explain what I am missing here? Previously banned user. ZerglingShepard1, DeepBurrow, EasyMoney96 and all those aliases are the same banned guy.
Ha! Dude. I thought people were joking claiming these others were ZS1. Wow.
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Germany25658 Posts
Locking this. Just ignore him please.
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EPT
