iloveoov talks Bisu's possible relation with sAviO - Page 16

On October 11 2013 12:52 BLinD-RawR wrote:

3-3-07 was a legendary revolution.

On October 11 2013 12:58 shaftofpleasure wrote:

that was just a revolution of a build .. didn't made him legendary to me .. boxer, july, oov, savior, nada, flash, grrrr, jd .. those were legendary in their own right .. I guess you can say that, to me, OSL makes you legendary. but that's just me.

On October 11 2013 09:29 Aunvilgod wrote:


heartless? No, the opposite. He feels very sorry for the Koreans who still play SC2 and don't get recognition because SC2 is dead. Streaming BW on Afreeca won't revive SC2 in Korea though, it will prevent it from being revived.

On October 11 2013 14:03 Caladbolg wrote:


That makes you wrong, but you're entitled to an opinion. Yellow was a legend but never won. Compared to him, was ggplay more of a legend? Doubt it. Nalra only got one.... Is he not a legend? But if getting an osl makes you a legend, are the one-off winners legends? How about jangbi, who got 2 straight? If he's a legend, why is a superior protoss not considered legendary?

More than this, he was he only true underdog who slayed a bonjwa at his prime, and made an imbalanced matchup playable for his entire race. If he's not a legend, if the revolution was just about a build that worked, then pretty much nothing in bw history can be legendary

On October 11 2013 15:45 Jayson X wrote:
Well surely we're looking at different perspectives here.

oov is not a player anymore. He's looking at E-Sport as an industry. Looks at it from where it came to where it went. He's done and seen it all as a player and reached heights only a handfull of players ever managed to reach. He saw the industry growing from a dream to reality. Realise when Bisu started out professionally oov already had 2 OSL and 3 MSL under his belt (that's starleague victories to the people who didn't follow BW). oov actively helped building the industry by creating history and him staying in it to coach is a true sign of an active interest to keep it alive and make more history.

sAviOr probably represents the total opposite of oov's philosophy. He was majorly talented but also heavily greedy and had no problem jeopardising a whole industry. See what oov knows because he started out when there was none to only a handfull of people watching (and not the mega event it became) and Bisu judging from his retirement interview does not, is that you need to create history first to get fans. You have to earn it.

So Bisu picked the easy road out. The save choice. Go back to what you know and squeeze out the money that's left. Meanwhile oov has set the task to be a part of building up an industry (again). Wether that endeavour is ultimately possible is something else.

On October 11 2013 14:37 shaftofpleasure wrote:


doesn't really mean that if they won an OSL, they're insta legends to me. but yeah I get your point, still bisu isn't a legendary player in my pov .. because after that revolution, he only dominated 1 match up because of the build itself and after it was countered and normalized he became an above-average player with awesome PvZ sniping skills that failed to show great results in many tournaments. Sure, he was great in his PL runs but if you looked closely, most of the players he fought aren't really big shots ..

but yeah it's just the way I'm seeing it .. great player? yes .. Legendary? not to me

he was so over-hyped back then, too .. I'd root for Best any day than Bisu. So high expectations yet hardly delivers.

On October 11 2013 16:13 sharkie wrote:
Is oov seriously criticizing older players for streaming?

On October 11 2013 16:00 Letmelose wrote:


Bisu's legacy both feeds on, and suffers from excessive media hype that surrounded Bisu. Even if people only remember the media created image of the golden boy of the protoss race, not the player he actually was, that's no reason to go to the other extreme and pretend that he was simply an overrated media hype machine. Bisu was a legendary player, with an even bigger legacy due to is good looks, exciting playstyle, being a member of the most successful, as well as the recognizable team, SK Telecom T1, and of course the dramatic nature of his career.

Bisu had his flaws, but there's only a select few who are byond reproach, and sure his legacy is not on the same level as NaDa, but he would take top ten material in terms of his professional career almost any way you cut it. Top ten in a decade long e-Sports that had the likes of BoxeR, YellOw, NaDa, iloveoov, July, sAviOr, Stork, Jaedong, and Flash. Outside of those nine (who are on a level above, or similar to him in terms of their overall careers in my opinion), who would can you point out as having a professional career that was greater than Bisu's? Grrr... was more of a Starcraft legend (his peak preceded e-Sports in my opinion), rather than a legendary professional Stacraft player, Nal rA was magical, but his erratic nature was even more profound than Bisu's, and is marked by flashes of brilliance, rather than sustained top level consistency, GARIMTO was nothing outside of his memorable OGN StarLeague triumphs, and consistent players such as ChoJJa never reached the heights that Bisu managed.

That's legendary enough, just by the basis of results, and once you start to add sentimental value to it (his destruction of sAviOr at his absolute peak, his influence on the metagame, and his finals victory over Stork in what people will probably first think of when we compare the two), that's when Bisu's legacy really starts to get out of hand. Now I don't agree with with people taking snippets out of a person's career that happened to be the most heavily followed by the media, or adding emotional value to it, but even if you take those factors out, there's no doubt that Bisu left behind a legendary career, unless you start to take points off him for personal reasons, which basically makes you as guilty as people who overrate Bisu for sentimental reasons.

On October 11 2013 16:22 sharkie wrote:


Yeah I did and thats why I am asking:

On October 11 2013 16:00 Letmelose wrote:


Bisu's legacy both feeds on, and suffers from excessive media hype that surrounded Bisu. Even if people only remember the media created image of the golden boy of the protoss race, not the player he actually was, that's no reason to go to the other extreme and pretend that he was simply an overrated media hype machine. Bisu was a legendary player, with an even bigger legacy due to is good looks, exciting playstyle, being a member of the most successful, as well as the recognizable team, SK Telecom T1, and of course the dramatic nature of his career.

Bisu had his flaws, but there's only a select few who are byond reproach, and sure his legacy is not on the same level as NaDa, but he would take top ten material in terms of his professional career almost any way you cut it. Top ten in a decade long e-Sports that had the likes of BoxeR, YellOw, NaDa, iloveoov, July, sAviOr, Stork, Jaedong, and Flash. Outside of those nine (who are on a level above, or similar to him in terms of their overall careers in my opinion), who would can you point out as having a professional career that was greater than Bisu's? Grrr... was more of a Starcraft legend (his peak preceded e-Sports in my opinion), rather than a legendary professional Stacraft player, Nal rA was magical, but his erratic nature was even more profound than Bisu's, and is marked by flashes of brilliance, rather than sustained top level consistency, GARIMTO was nothing outside of his memorable OGN StarLeague triumphs, and consistent players such as ChoJJa never reached the heights that Bisu managed.

That's legendary enough, just by the basis of results, and once you start to add sentimental value to it (his destruction of sAviOr at his absolute peak, his influence on the metagame, and his finals victory over Stork in what people will probably first think of when we compare the two), that's when Bisu's legacy really starts to get out of hand. Now I don't agree with with people taking snippets out of a person's career that happened to be the most heavily followed by the media, or adding emotional value to it, but even if you take those factors out, there's no doubt that Bisu left behind a legendary career, unless you start to take points off him for personal reasons, which basically makes you as guilty as people who overrate Bisu for sentimental reasons.

On October 11 2013 16:42 shaftofpleasure wrote:


Dude, it's my opinion and you're saying that my opinion is wrong. My opinions are not up for debate. The names I listed before had a strong and consistent following. And no I am not attacking Bisu personally. I'm just saying many people would see him as a legendary player but, to me, he just wasn't. It's just like how other people would see as Effort or Jangbi being legendary, if they ever did. I would compare Jangbi, Effort, Fantasy, Stork along with Bisu. Great players, not Legendary but again .. that's just me.