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US Politics Mega-thread - Page 4408

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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.

In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up!

NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious.
Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action.
GGTeMpLaR
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
United States7226 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-07-22 16:51:20
July 22 2016 16:48 GMT
#88141
On July 23 2016 01:27 PassiveAce wrote:
sum cartoons

+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]

[image loading]


Don't forget it was the Cruz campaign that 'accidentally' posted a nude photo of Trump's wife that started the entire slugfest.

People just want to forget it was an escalation of conflict and just assume this is another example of 'Trump playing dirty' by attacking Cruz's wife without motivation because they plays into their confirmation bias of him being the worst thing ever.
farvacola
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States18875 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-07-22 16:48:53
July 22 2016 16:48 GMT
#88142
On July 23 2016 01:43 Mohdoo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 23 2016 01:41 farvacola wrote:
lol, gonna be funny when governors like Kasich start campaigning for Hillary.


Do we think that is possible, or more likely that they will simply sit this one out?

That's the beauty of it, all Kasich really needs to do is sit it out, I think. Usually, governors of the same party are some of the most valuable assets a presidential candidate can have.
"when the Dead Kennedys found out they had skinhead fans, they literally wrote a song titled 'Nazi Punks Fuck Off'"
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-07-22 16:49:41
July 22 2016 16:48 GMT
#88143
On July 23 2016 01:43 Mohdoo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 23 2016 01:41 farvacola wrote:
lol, gonna be funny when governors like Kasich start campaigning for Hillary.


Do we think that is possible, or more likely that they will simply sit this one out?

Anything is possible at this point. Trump’s strong arm tactics are going to turn some senators off, especially those that have a long history with the party and don’t like its direction. People strongly dislike the political parties. So saying “fuck it, I’m doing what I think is best for America and my state” isn’t a terrible pitch. Especially if that state already doesn’t like Trump. But I think it is likely they sit it out and refuse to work with him, which might be just as effective.

There are going to be zero Republicans from MA(yes, they exist) backing Trump. It is political suicide.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
farvacola
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States18875 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-07-22 16:49:27
July 22 2016 16:49 GMT
#88144
Where's JonnyBNoHo to weigh in on that one?
"when the Dead Kennedys found out they had skinhead fans, they literally wrote a song titled 'Nazi Punks Fuck Off'"
PassiveAce
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States18076 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-07-22 16:59:11
July 22 2016 16:58 GMT
#88145
Call me Marge Simpson cuz I love you homie
PassiveAce
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States18076 Posts
July 22 2016 17:00 GMT
#88146
i know a person in MA who will prob vote trump.

no one who matters would do it tho
Call me Marge Simpson cuz I love you homie
Doodsmack
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States7224 Posts
July 22 2016 17:02 GMT
#88147
On July 23 2016 01:48 GGTeMpLaR wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 23 2016 01:27 PassiveAce wrote:
sum cartoons

+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]

[image loading]


Don't forget it was the Cruz campaign that 'accidentally' posted a nude photo of Trump's wife that started the entire slugfest.

People just want to forget it was an escalation of conflict and just assume this is another example of 'Trump playing dirty' by attacking Cruz's wife without motivation because they plays into their confirmation bias of him being the worst thing ever.


Lol confirmation bias..."slugfest", "escalation". It was a super PAC, not Cruz's campaign, that used the photo. Is your argument that it was really Cruz's campaign? Is that just an assumption?
xDaunt
Profile Joined March 2010
United States17988 Posts
July 22 2016 17:03 GMT
#88148
I doubt that Massachusetts is part of Trump's national strategy. However, he is going to target traditionally democratic states that are part of the manufacturing rust belt.
xDaunt
Profile Joined March 2010
United States17988 Posts
July 22 2016 17:04 GMT
#88149
Trump should send ISIS a thank you note for doing its best to get Trump elected.
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
July 22 2016 17:06 GMT
#88150
I doubt that MA is part of anyone's plan beyond where to get lobster and cranberries. But we have a Republican Governor who has basically said he won't be voting for Trump and "might leave the ballot blank" as code that he might vote for a democrat.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
farvacola
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States18875 Posts
July 22 2016 17:06 GMT
#88151
On July 23 2016 02:04 xDaunt wrote:
Trump should send ISIS a thank you note for doing its best to get Trump elected.

For someone so concerned with FP, I hope the irony of this sentiment is not lost on you
"when the Dead Kennedys found out they had skinhead fans, they literally wrote a song titled 'Nazi Punks Fuck Off'"
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
July 22 2016 17:14 GMT
#88152
Yeah this election will come to down to one area. The rust belt. NAFTA is the weight around Clinton's neck.
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
zlefin
Profile Blog Joined October 2012
United States7689 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-07-22 17:17:48
July 22 2016 17:17 GMT
#88153
or at least the blame people place on NAFTA, regardless of the accuracy thereof.
Though there's gonna be a lot of factors in play; hard to say which ones were the most relevant.
Great read: http://shorensteincenter.org/news-coverage-2016-general-election/ great book on democracy: http://press.princeton.edu/titles/10671.html zlefin is grumpier due to long term illness. Ignoring some users.
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
July 22 2016 17:18 GMT
#88154
Bill Clinton can not go campaign in the rust belt areas the commercials write themselves.
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
PassiveAce
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States18076 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-07-22 17:23:16
July 22 2016 17:23 GMT
#88155
eieio (tl dota staff) saw him hanging out at a coffeeshop randomly on a walk in detroit
Call me Marge Simpson cuz I love you homie
xDaunt
Profile Joined March 2010
United States17988 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-07-22 17:25:36
July 22 2016 17:24 GMT
#88156
On July 23 2016 02:17 zlefin wrote:
or at least the blame people place on NAFTA, regardless of the accuracy thereof.
Though there's gonna be a lot of factors in play; hard to say which ones were the most relevant.

When it comes to the issues, I think that it is pretty clear at this point that trade policy/blue collar economic interests will be the dominant issue, along with immigration and terrorism. As things are going, Hillary is decidedly disadvantaged in these areas. Hillary is arguably stronger on the lesser issues, but I don't think that they are going to drive people like the big ones previously listed. Hillary's saving grace is that Trump is an asshole, but this advantage is offset to at least some degree by her own personal baggage. The democrats really have disadvantaged themselves by coronating Hillary instead of running a truly open and competitive primary.
Adreme
Profile Joined June 2011
United States5574 Posts
July 22 2016 17:27 GMT
#88157
On July 23 2016 02:14 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
Yeah this election will come to down to one area. The rust belt. NAFTA is the weight around Clinton's neck.


The election comes down to Flordia and Nevada. If she takes both of them he can run the board in the rust belt even taking Penn and she still wins which she is VERY likely to do due to Trumps high negatives among hispanics and both states having high hispanic populations.
TheTenthDoc
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States9561 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-07-22 17:30:17
July 22 2016 17:27 GMT
#88158
The states in play this year are going to be interesting, that's for sure. Did not think I would see Utah possibly up for grabs by a Democratic presidential candidate.

On July 23 2016 02:24 xDaunt wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 23 2016 02:17 zlefin wrote:
or at least the blame people place on NAFTA, regardless of the accuracy thereof.
Though there's gonna be a lot of factors in play; hard to say which ones were the most relevant.

When it comes to the issues, I think that it is pretty clear at this point that trade policy/blue collar economic interests will be the dominant issue, along with immigration and terrorism. As things are going, Hillary is decidedly disadvantaged in these areas. Hillary is arguably stronger on the lesser issues, but I don't think that they are going to drive people like the big ones previously listed. Hillary's saving grace is that Trump is an asshole, but this advantage is offset to at least some degree by her own personal baggage. The democrats really have disadvantaged themselves by coronating Hillary instead of running a truly open and competitive primary.


If Clinton can translate the terrorism and trade into foreign policy, she can easily turn that weakness. Most of the polls have her up in FP-it especially helps that Trump has shown no evidence of ability to cogently argue about trade policy (he can orate on it but not argue it) and has gone off script in the past on the issue.
Gorsameth
Profile Joined April 2010
Netherlands22702 Posts
July 22 2016 17:28 GMT
#88159
On July 23 2016 01:39 GGTeMpLaR wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 22 2016 23:59 LegalLord wrote:
From a few days ago, for those that have mentioned this issue before:

CLEVELAND— Donald Trump has followed through on his promise to forgive personal loans to his campaign.

The Republican presidential nominee forgave about $47.5 million in loans, according to a Federal Election Commission report filed Wednesday. Trump previously said he did so, but had so far not offered evidence.

Trump, who is expected to accept the GOP's nomination here Thursday, funded his primary election run mostly through personal loans. His campaign started raising more money from donors in June.

It reported nearly $27 million in total receipts for the month and ended it with more than $20 million on hand.

The Trump campaign directed CNBC to Trump's past statements on his loan forgiveness. In June, Trump called the loans a "contribution to make America great again."

During the primary process, Trump touted his ability to funnel money into his campaign as evidence that he is not beholden to donors. But he has turned to more traditional fundraising ahead of the more demanding general election.

Source


Who was it posting articles about how he hadn't filed evidence yet and was just going to lie about it and never forgive the loans?

Guess that settles that debate.

Another +1 for Trump and -1 for sensationalist media

Its not sensationalist media when there is plenty of evidence to doubt him.
Like the charity organizations that did not receive his Veteran charity money until after the press starting poking around and asking questions.

Yes he has now forgiven the loan, gz. He did what he said he would. It shouldn't be a newsworthy event but it is. Simply because he lies so often.
It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
July 22 2016 17:31 GMT
#88160
On July 23 2016 02:28 Gorsameth wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 23 2016 01:39 GGTeMpLaR wrote:
On July 22 2016 23:59 LegalLord wrote:
From a few days ago, for those that have mentioned this issue before:

CLEVELAND— Donald Trump has followed through on his promise to forgive personal loans to his campaign.

The Republican presidential nominee forgave about $47.5 million in loans, according to a Federal Election Commission report filed Wednesday. Trump previously said he did so, but had so far not offered evidence.

Trump, who is expected to accept the GOP's nomination here Thursday, funded his primary election run mostly through personal loans. His campaign started raising more money from donors in June.

It reported nearly $27 million in total receipts for the month and ended it with more than $20 million on hand.

The Trump campaign directed CNBC to Trump's past statements on his loan forgiveness. In June, Trump called the loans a "contribution to make America great again."

During the primary process, Trump touted his ability to funnel money into his campaign as evidence that he is not beholden to donors. But he has turned to more traditional fundraising ahead of the more demanding general election.

Source


Who was it posting articles about how he hadn't filed evidence yet and was just going to lie about it and never forgive the loans?

Guess that settles that debate.

Another +1 for Trump and -1 for sensationalist media

Its not sensationalist media when there is plenty of evidence to doubt him.
Like the charity organizations that did not receive his Veteran charity money until after the press starting poking around and asking questions.

Yes he has now forgiven the loan, gz. He did what he said he would. It shouldn't be a newsworthy event but it is. Simply because he lies so often.

For reference:

In May, under pressure from the news media, Donald Trump made good on a pledge he made four months earlier: He gave $1 million to a nonprofit group helping veterans’ families.

Before that, however, when was the last time that Trump had given any of his own money to a charity?

If Trump stands by his promises, such donations should be occurring all the time. In the 15 years prior to the veterans donation, Trump promised to donate earnings from a wide variety of his moneymaking enterprises: “The Apprentice.” Trump Vodka. Trump University. A book. Another book. If he had honored all those pledges, Trump’s gifts to charity would have topped $8.5 million.

But in the 15 years prior to the veterans’ gift, public records show that Trump donated about $2.8 million through a foundation set up to give his money away — less than a third of the pledged amount — and nothing since 2009. Records show Trump has given nothing to his foundation since 2008.

Trump and his staff are adamant that he has given away millions privately, off the foundation’s books. Trump won’t release his tax returns, which would confirm such gifts, and his staff won’t supply details. “There’s no way for you to know or understand,” Trump spokeswoman Hope Hicks told BuzzFeed recently.

Hicks did not respond to repeated questions about Trump’s charity from The Washington Post. Trump earlier this month revoked The Post’s press credentials to cover his events.

[Months after fundraiser, Trump says he gave $1 million to veterans group]

In recent weeks, The Post tried to answer the question by digging up records going back to the late 1980s and canvassing a wide swath of nonprofits with some connection to Trump.

That research showed that Trump has a long-standing habit of promising to give to charity. But Trump’s follow-through on those promises was middling — even at the beginning, in his early days as a national celebrity.

In the 1980s, Trump pledged to give away royalties from his first book to fight AIDS and multiple sclerosis. But he gave less to those causes than he did to his older daughter’s ballet school.


Source
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
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