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US Politics Mega-thread - Page 1768

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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.

In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up!

NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious.
Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action.
Millitron
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States2611 Posts
March 26 2015 16:15 GMT
#35341
On March 26 2015 13:18 Sermokala wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 26 2015 09:00 puerk wrote:
You guys are missing the point. The question that started this discussion was:

On March 25 2015 13:56 Aveng3r wrote:
Guy on deadspin writes "shouldn't cops have to treat those that they shoot?"

Kinda seems like a decent idea. has a motion like this ever been passed around congress?


Then Sermakola made it into a "cops have to kill suspects as effective as they can to keep us all safe, because fuck suspects"

So please stop discussing "total disarmament" or some kind of ridiculous straw man and focus on the brought up issue: should police serve and protect, even criminals and suspects?

The problem with that is there is a HUGE difference between the inner city and outer city. inner city cops are often paid barly above minimum wage and are told to risk their lives with a gun and a bullet proof vest in a city filled with people who don't like them and that they don't understand. Outer city cops are paid middle class wages can measure the last murder in decades and can actually give a crap about them.

If you want more information about it I would suggest that people watch the documentary "cocaine cowboys" and then something about the Hollywood shootout. cops with handguns and shirts were being slaughtered by guys with automatic drum fed ak-47's bullet proof vests. Both are good information on the militarization of cops in america.


In the North Hollywood shootout, only the bank robbers were killed. No innocents died.
Who called in the fleet?
Mohdoo
Profile Joined August 2007
United States15743 Posts
March 26 2015 16:36 GMT
#35342
Interesting to see how each party is managing 2016.

Democrats are slowly leaking Clinton baggage, bit by bit so that it's all exhausted by the time of the election and republicans look petty for bringing it up when it's "old news that's already been addressed".

Republicans are using Ted Cruz as their typical "anti science to the point of crazy and just generally crazy" to make everyone else look more moderate. They did the same thing in 2012 to help Romney, but I think it accidentally went too far when Romney had to speak out against planned parenthood. I'm curious to see how the GOP manages Cruz going forward.
Gorsameth
Profile Joined April 2010
Netherlands22284 Posts
March 26 2015 16:58 GMT
#35343
On March 27 2015 01:36 Mohdoo wrote:
Interesting to see how each party is managing 2016.

Democrats are slowly leaking Clinton baggage, bit by bit so that it's all exhausted by the time of the election and republicans look petty for bringing it up when it's "old news that's already been addressed".

Republicans are using Ted Cruz as their typical "anti science to the point of crazy and just generally crazy" to make everyone else look more moderate. They did the same thing in 2012 to help Romney, but I think it accidentally went too far when Romney had to speak out against planned parenthood. I'm curious to see how the GOP manages Cruz going forward.

The GOP doesnt manage Cruz. I think he has shown that plenty of times already by forcing the GOP leadership into bad situations.
It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
March 26 2015 17:13 GMT
#35344
Indiana Gov. Mike Pence (R) did it. On Thursday, he signed a controversial religious freedom bill into law that protects business owners from being required to serve same-sex couples if they have religious objections.

Pence said signing the bill into law makes sure that "religious liberty" is completely protected in the state.

"The Constitution of the United States and the Indiana Constitution both provide strong recognition of the freedom of religion, but today, many people of faith feel their religious liberty is under attack by government action," Pence said in a statement.

A number of businesses strongly voiced opposition to the law. The large tabletop gaming convention Gen Con threatened to leave the state if Pence the bill, but is locked into a contract until 2020. Star Trek actor George Takei also warned that the law could result in a damaging boycott of the state.

On Wednesday, leaders from the Disciples of Christ church said that if the bill was signed into law the church could possibly move its planned 6,000 person General Assembly meeting in Indianapolis to another location.

Just a week before the NCAA's March Madness Final Four games in downtown Indianapolis, the NCAA released a statement saying it was "examining the details" of the bill." The statement did not condemn the legislation but it did say that it was for "an inclusive environment where all individuals enjoy equal access to events."


Source
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
dAPhREAk
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Nauru12397 Posts
March 26 2015 17:16 GMT
#35345
learned about that from Takei feed. extremely likely to be held unconstitutional.
wei2coolman
Profile Joined November 2010
United States60033 Posts
March 26 2015 17:18 GMT
#35346
On March 27 2015 02:13 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
Show nested quote +
Indiana Gov. Mike Pence (R) did it. On Thursday, he signed a controversial religious freedom bill into law that protects business owners from being required to serve same-sex couples if they have religious objections.

Pence said signing the bill into law makes sure that "religious liberty" is completely protected in the state.

"The Constitution of the United States and the Indiana Constitution both provide strong recognition of the freedom of religion, but today, many people of faith feel their religious liberty is under attack by government action," Pence said in a statement.

A number of businesses strongly voiced opposition to the law. The large tabletop gaming convention Gen Con threatened to leave the state if Pence the bill, but is locked into a contract until 2020. Star Trek actor George Takei also warned that the law could result in a damaging boycott of the state.

On Wednesday, leaders from the Disciples of Christ church said that if the bill was signed into law the church could possibly move its planned 6,000 person General Assembly meeting in Indianapolis to another location.

Just a week before the NCAA's March Madness Final Four games in downtown Indianapolis, the NCAA released a statement saying it was "examining the details" of the bill." The statement did not condemn the legislation but it did say that it was for "an inclusive environment where all individuals enjoy equal access to events."


Source

I don't know why they don't just frame it as freedom of business to choose whether or not they want to accommodate guests? Without having to put a 'religious' spin on it, targeting specifically same-sex couple...

Make it an issue of freedom of business owners to choose who they want to provide services to, rather than one targeted at a subgroup of people like lgbt community...
liftlift > tsm
dAPhREAk
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Nauru12397 Posts
March 26 2015 17:22 GMT
#35347
On March 27 2015 02:18 wei2coolman wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 27 2015 02:13 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
Indiana Gov. Mike Pence (R) did it. On Thursday, he signed a controversial religious freedom bill into law that protects business owners from being required to serve same-sex couples if they have religious objections.

Pence said signing the bill into law makes sure that "religious liberty" is completely protected in the state.

"The Constitution of the United States and the Indiana Constitution both provide strong recognition of the freedom of religion, but today, many people of faith feel their religious liberty is under attack by government action," Pence said in a statement.

A number of businesses strongly voiced opposition to the law. The large tabletop gaming convention Gen Con threatened to leave the state if Pence the bill, but is locked into a contract until 2020. Star Trek actor George Takei also warned that the law could result in a damaging boycott of the state.

On Wednesday, leaders from the Disciples of Christ church said that if the bill was signed into law the church could possibly move its planned 6,000 person General Assembly meeting in Indianapolis to another location.

Just a week before the NCAA's March Madness Final Four games in downtown Indianapolis, the NCAA released a statement saying it was "examining the details" of the bill." The statement did not condemn the legislation but it did say that it was for "an inclusive environment where all individuals enjoy equal access to events."


Source

I don't know why they don't just frame it as freedom of business to choose whether or not they want to accommodate guests? Without having to put a 'religious' spin on it, targeting specifically same-sex couple...

Make it an issue of freedom of business owners to choose who they want to provide services to, rather than one targeted at a subgroup of people like lgbt community...

legally, it wouldnt make much of a difference. instead of a facial challenge (i.e., the language of the statute is unconstitutional), it would face an as applied challenge (i.e., the language is fine, but how it is intended to and actually applied is unconstitutional).
Adila
Profile Joined April 2010
United States874 Posts
March 26 2015 17:28 GMT
#35348
It would be nice if the law also forced the businesses to put up a sign stating their beliefs. How else will people know what businesses to avoid?
wei2coolman
Profile Joined November 2010
United States60033 Posts
March 26 2015 17:28 GMT
#35349
On March 27 2015 02:22 dAPhREAk wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 27 2015 02:18 wei2coolman wrote:
On March 27 2015 02:13 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
Indiana Gov. Mike Pence (R) did it. On Thursday, he signed a controversial religious freedom bill into law that protects business owners from being required to serve same-sex couples if they have religious objections.

Pence said signing the bill into law makes sure that "religious liberty" is completely protected in the state.

"The Constitution of the United States and the Indiana Constitution both provide strong recognition of the freedom of religion, but today, many people of faith feel their religious liberty is under attack by government action," Pence said in a statement.

A number of businesses strongly voiced opposition to the law. The large tabletop gaming convention Gen Con threatened to leave the state if Pence the bill, but is locked into a contract until 2020. Star Trek actor George Takei also warned that the law could result in a damaging boycott of the state.

On Wednesday, leaders from the Disciples of Christ church said that if the bill was signed into law the church could possibly move its planned 6,000 person General Assembly meeting in Indianapolis to another location.

Just a week before the NCAA's March Madness Final Four games in downtown Indianapolis, the NCAA released a statement saying it was "examining the details" of the bill." The statement did not condemn the legislation but it did say that it was for "an inclusive environment where all individuals enjoy equal access to events."


Source

I don't know why they don't just frame it as freedom of business to choose whether or not they want to accommodate guests? Without having to put a 'religious' spin on it, targeting specifically same-sex couple...

Make it an issue of freedom of business owners to choose who they want to provide services to, rather than one targeted at a subgroup of people like lgbt community...

legally, it wouldnt make much of a difference. instead of a facial challenge (i.e., the language of the statute is unconstitutional), it would face an as applied challenge (i.e., the language is fine, but how it is intended to and actually applied is unconstitutional).

I don't understand how the intention is unconstitutional though?
Why shouldn't businesses or people have the right to refuse service? Someone shouldn't be able to force another person for their service just because they waved money at them.
liftlift > tsm
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
March 26 2015 17:28 GMT
#35350
Sen. Ted Cruz hasn’t made a final decision on whether he will sign up for Obamacare but will make up his mind “in the coming days,” a spokesman said Wednesday.

Rick Tyler, national spokesman for the Texas Republican senator’s newly launched presidential campaign, also defended Cruz against charges of hypocrisy for suggesting that he might enroll in Affordable Care Act health exchanges.

“Senator Cruz and his wife are still weighing options for their family,” Tyler wrote in an email to POLITICO when asked about the senator’s current thinking on enrolling in an ACA health insurance exchange, adding that the senator would make a decision shortly.

Tyler said that Cruz — who has vigorously opposed and vowed to repeal Obamacare — was subject to a law with which he disagrees. “That’s like saying he’s not going to pay the taxes he voted against,” he wrote.

Cruz, meanwhile, slammed the media coverage of his family’s health care dilemma, saying the mainstream media is playing “gotcha games.”


Source
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
Simberto
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Germany11813 Posts
March 26 2015 17:30 GMT
#35351
But the problem here is that as far as i know, businesses do not have the freedom to categorically discriminate against specific groups of people.

Once again, the example of a business that decides that they don't want to serve black people comes to mind. As far as i know, that is not legal in the US. So to be bigotted and not serve gay people categorically just because they are gay, as opposed to sometimes not serving single gay people because that specific person is an asshole, you need that religious freedom to protect your freedom to be a bigotted idiot.
Millitron
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States2611 Posts
March 26 2015 17:33 GMT
#35352
On March 27 2015 02:28 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
Show nested quote +
Sen. Ted Cruz hasn’t made a final decision on whether he will sign up for Obamacare but will make up his mind “in the coming days,” a spokesman said Wednesday.

Rick Tyler, national spokesman for the Texas Republican senator’s newly launched presidential campaign, also defended Cruz against charges of hypocrisy for suggesting that he might enroll in Affordable Care Act health exchanges.

“Senator Cruz and his wife are still weighing options for their family,” Tyler wrote in an email to POLITICO when asked about the senator’s current thinking on enrolling in an ACA health insurance exchange, adding that the senator would make a decision shortly.

Tyler said that Cruz — who has vigorously opposed and vowed to repeal Obamacare — was subject to a law with which he disagrees. “That’s like saying he’s not going to pay the taxes he voted against,” he wrote.

Cruz, meanwhile, slammed the media coverage of his family’s health care dilemma, saying the mainstream media is playing “gotcha games.”


Source

Not sure how following the law is hypocrisy. If anything, taking advantage of the fact that he's a senator and is thus exempt from having to enroll seems more hypocritical to me.

It really does seem like the media is playing gotcha games.
Who called in the fleet?
dAPhREAk
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Nauru12397 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-03-26 17:34:49
March 26 2015 17:34 GMT
#35353
On March 27 2015 02:28 wei2coolman wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 27 2015 02:22 dAPhREAk wrote:
On March 27 2015 02:18 wei2coolman wrote:
On March 27 2015 02:13 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
Indiana Gov. Mike Pence (R) did it. On Thursday, he signed a controversial religious freedom bill into law that protects business owners from being required to serve same-sex couples if they have religious objections.

Pence said signing the bill into law makes sure that "religious liberty" is completely protected in the state.

"The Constitution of the United States and the Indiana Constitution both provide strong recognition of the freedom of religion, but today, many people of faith feel their religious liberty is under attack by government action," Pence said in a statement.

A number of businesses strongly voiced opposition to the law. The large tabletop gaming convention Gen Con threatened to leave the state if Pence the bill, but is locked into a contract until 2020. Star Trek actor George Takei also warned that the law could result in a damaging boycott of the state.

On Wednesday, leaders from the Disciples of Christ church said that if the bill was signed into law the church could possibly move its planned 6,000 person General Assembly meeting in Indianapolis to another location.

Just a week before the NCAA's March Madness Final Four games in downtown Indianapolis, the NCAA released a statement saying it was "examining the details" of the bill." The statement did not condemn the legislation but it did say that it was for "an inclusive environment where all individuals enjoy equal access to events."


Source

I don't know why they don't just frame it as freedom of business to choose whether or not they want to accommodate guests? Without having to put a 'religious' spin on it, targeting specifically same-sex couple...

Make it an issue of freedom of business owners to choose who they want to provide services to, rather than one targeted at a subgroup of people like lgbt community...

legally, it wouldnt make much of a difference. instead of a facial challenge (i.e., the language of the statute is unconstitutional), it would face an as applied challenge (i.e., the language is fine, but how it is intended to and actually applied is unconstitutional).

I don't understand how the intention is unconstitutional though?
Why shouldn't businesses or people have the right to refuse service? Someone shouldn't be able to force another person for their service just because they waved money at them.

because it will be applied to discriminate against homosexuals. facially constitutional laws that are pretext (i.e., the true intent is to discriminate against a specific group) will not be allowed.

now if the true intent was to just allow business owners to refuse service to customers AND its not applied in a discriminatory fashion against protected groups, it would pass muster. however, we know that is not what is intended or how it will be applied.
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
March 26 2015 17:40 GMT
#35354
The US coal sector is in a “structural decline” which has sent 26 companies bust in the last three years, according to financial analysts.

A report by the Carbon Tracker Initiative found that in the past five years the US coal industry lost 76% of its value. At least 264 mines were closed between 2011 and 2013. The world’s largest private coal company, Peabody Energy, lost 80% of its share price.

These declines were in spite of the Dow Jones industrial average increasing by 69% during the same period. Authors said this indicated a decoupling of US economic growth from coal.

Co-author Luke Sussams said the coal industry had been pummelled by cheap shale gas and a series of Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) regulations.

“It was something of a one-two punch. Gas took the legs out from the sector and the EPA really held it down,” he said.

The US shale gas price fell 80% since 2008. Meanwhile, renewable energy has become increasingly competitive. From 2005 to 2013 the amount of US electricity generated by burning coal dropped by 10.5%. This was picked up by gas (8.7%) and renewables (4.1%).

But Chiza Vitta, a credit analyst from Standard and Poor’s, said he did not believe coal was in a terminal decline, although its share of the US electricity market would diminish somewhat in the coming years.

Vitta said the drop in share prices noted by Carbon Tracker was due to a complex series of factors, including a cyclical dip in metallurgical coal demand. He said despite the slowdown “coal will continue to be an integral part of the energy portfolio. It’s going to get a little smaller so the share price is going to fall. But there is always going to be a place for coal”.


Source
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
Nyxisto
Profile Joined August 2010
Germany6287 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-03-26 18:18:26
March 26 2015 18:13 GMT
#35355
On March 27 2015 02:28 wei2coolman wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 27 2015 02:22 dAPhREAk wrote:
On March 27 2015 02:18 wei2coolman wrote:
On March 27 2015 02:13 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
Indiana Gov. Mike Pence (R) did it. On Thursday, he signed a controversial religious freedom bill into law that protects business owners from being required to serve same-sex couples if they have religious objections.

Pence said signing the bill into law makes sure that "religious liberty" is completely protected in the state.

"The Constitution of the United States and the Indiana Constitution both provide strong recognition of the freedom of religion, but today, many people of faith feel their religious liberty is under attack by government action," Pence said in a statement.

A number of businesses strongly voiced opposition to the law. The large tabletop gaming convention Gen Con threatened to leave the state if Pence the bill, but is locked into a contract until 2020. Star Trek actor George Takei also warned that the law could result in a damaging boycott of the state.

On Wednesday, leaders from the Disciples of Christ church said that if the bill was signed into law the church could possibly move its planned 6,000 person General Assembly meeting in Indianapolis to another location.

Just a week before the NCAA's March Madness Final Four games in downtown Indianapolis, the NCAA released a statement saying it was "examining the details" of the bill." The statement did not condemn the legislation but it did say that it was for "an inclusive environment where all individuals enjoy equal access to events."


Source

I don't know why they don't just frame it as freedom of business to choose whether or not they want to accommodate guests? Without having to put a 'religious' spin on it, targeting specifically same-sex couple...

Make it an issue of freedom of business owners to choose who they want to provide services to, rather than one targeted at a subgroup of people like lgbt community...

legally, it wouldnt make much of a difference. instead of a facial challenge (i.e., the language of the statute is unconstitutional), it would face an as applied challenge (i.e., the language is fine, but how it is intended to and actually applied is unconstitutional).

I don't understand how the intention is unconstitutional though?
Why shouldn't businesses or people have the right to refuse service? Someone shouldn't be able to force another person for their service just because they waved money at them.


Well then I think it would only be fair to deny these businesses any public service, after all you can't force gay taxpayers to pay for businesses they may not even be allowed to use.
CannonsNCarriers
Profile Joined April 2010
United States638 Posts
March 26 2015 18:25 GMT
#35356
On March 27 2015 02:33 Millitron wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 27 2015 02:28 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
Sen. Ted Cruz hasn’t made a final decision on whether he will sign up for Obamacare but will make up his mind “in the coming days,” a spokesman said Wednesday.

Rick Tyler, national spokesman for the Texas Republican senator’s newly launched presidential campaign, also defended Cruz against charges of hypocrisy for suggesting that he might enroll in Affordable Care Act health exchanges.

“Senator Cruz and his wife are still weighing options for their family,” Tyler wrote in an email to POLITICO when asked about the senator’s current thinking on enrolling in an ACA health insurance exchange, adding that the senator would make a decision shortly.

Tyler said that Cruz — who has vigorously opposed and vowed to repeal Obamacare — was subject to a law with which he disagrees. “That’s like saying he’s not going to pay the taxes he voted against,” he wrote.

Cruz, meanwhile, slammed the media coverage of his family’s health care dilemma, saying the mainstream media is playing “gotcha games.”


Source

Not sure how following the law is hypocrisy. If anything, taking advantage of the fact that he's a senator and is thus exempt from having to enroll seems more hypocritical to me.

It really does seem like the media is playing gotcha games.


Cruz describes ACA as the worst policy mistake in America since slavery. If he signs up for private health insurance on the ACA exchange, and he doesn't burst into flames, then all that bad stuff he said about ACA would be undone by his own relatively positive experience. Do you not understand how a smooth enrollment for private insurance through the ACA exchange website would undercut all of his doom and gloom exaggerations about ACA?
Dun tuch my cheezbrgr
Millitron
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States2611 Posts
March 26 2015 18:30 GMT
#35357
On March 27 2015 03:25 CannonsNCarriers wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 27 2015 02:33 Millitron wrote:
On March 27 2015 02:28 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
Sen. Ted Cruz hasn’t made a final decision on whether he will sign up for Obamacare but will make up his mind “in the coming days,” a spokesman said Wednesday.

Rick Tyler, national spokesman for the Texas Republican senator’s newly launched presidential campaign, also defended Cruz against charges of hypocrisy for suggesting that he might enroll in Affordable Care Act health exchanges.

“Senator Cruz and his wife are still weighing options for their family,” Tyler wrote in an email to POLITICO when asked about the senator’s current thinking on enrolling in an ACA health insurance exchange, adding that the senator would make a decision shortly.

Tyler said that Cruz — who has vigorously opposed and vowed to repeal Obamacare — was subject to a law with which he disagrees. “That’s like saying he’s not going to pay the taxes he voted against,” he wrote.

Cruz, meanwhile, slammed the media coverage of his family’s health care dilemma, saying the mainstream media is playing “gotcha games.”


Source

Not sure how following the law is hypocrisy. If anything, taking advantage of the fact that he's a senator and is thus exempt from having to enroll seems more hypocritical to me.

It really does seem like the media is playing gotcha games.


Cruz describes ACA as the worst policy mistake in America since slavery. If he signs up for private health insurance on the ACA exchange, and he doesn't burst into flames, then all that bad stuff he said about ACA would be undone by his own relatively positive experience. Do you not understand how a smooth enrollment for private insurance through the ACA exchange website would undercut all of his doom and gloom exaggerations about ACA?

Like I said though, wouldn't it be worse to take advantage of his senator status to avoid the exchange? This way he goes through the exact same stuff the common man does.

Even if he doesn't have a bad time of it, that doesn't invalidate his statement that the ACA is horrible. Not all bad decisions have immediate negative consequences.
Who called in the fleet?
CannonsNCarriers
Profile Joined April 2010
United States638 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-03-26 18:39:46
March 26 2015 18:38 GMT
#35358
On March 27 2015 03:30 Millitron wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 27 2015 03:25 CannonsNCarriers wrote:
On March 27 2015 02:33 Millitron wrote:
On March 27 2015 02:28 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
Sen. Ted Cruz hasn’t made a final decision on whether he will sign up for Obamacare but will make up his mind “in the coming days,” a spokesman said Wednesday.

Rick Tyler, national spokesman for the Texas Republican senator’s newly launched presidential campaign, also defended Cruz against charges of hypocrisy for suggesting that he might enroll in Affordable Care Act health exchanges.

“Senator Cruz and his wife are still weighing options for their family,” Tyler wrote in an email to POLITICO when asked about the senator’s current thinking on enrolling in an ACA health insurance exchange, adding that the senator would make a decision shortly.

Tyler said that Cruz — who has vigorously opposed and vowed to repeal Obamacare — was subject to a law with which he disagrees. “That’s like saying he’s not going to pay the taxes he voted against,” he wrote.

Cruz, meanwhile, slammed the media coverage of his family’s health care dilemma, saying the mainstream media is playing “gotcha games.”


Source

Not sure how following the law is hypocrisy. If anything, taking advantage of the fact that he's a senator and is thus exempt from having to enroll seems more hypocritical to me.

It really does seem like the media is playing gotcha games.


Cruz describes ACA as the worst policy mistake in America since slavery. If he signs up for private health insurance on the ACA exchange, and he doesn't burst into flames, then all that bad stuff he said about ACA would be undone by his own relatively positive experience. Do you not understand how a smooth enrollment for private insurance through the ACA exchange website would undercut all of his doom and gloom exaggerations about ACA?

Like I said though, wouldn't it be worse to take advantage of his senator status to avoid the exchange? This way he goes through the exact same stuff the common man does.

Even if he doesn't have a bad time of it, that doesn't invalidate his statement that the ACA is horrible. Not all bad decisions have immediate negative consequences.


What? Of course it invalidates (maybe just undercuts) his arguments that ACA is horrible. Presuming he signs up, ACA then would have provided him with the ability to pick up insurance when his wife left work (without having to worry about pre-existing conditions) from a marketplace of private insurance options.

News: "Senator, how was it signing up for private insurance through the ACA exchange website?"

Cruz: "It went fine"

News: "If it went fine for you, and millions like you, why is it so bad?"

Cruz: "..."
Dun tuch my cheezbrgr
Millitron
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States2611 Posts
March 26 2015 18:48 GMT
#35359
On March 27 2015 03:38 CannonsNCarriers wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 27 2015 03:30 Millitron wrote:
On March 27 2015 03:25 CannonsNCarriers wrote:
On March 27 2015 02:33 Millitron wrote:
On March 27 2015 02:28 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
Sen. Ted Cruz hasn’t made a final decision on whether he will sign up for Obamacare but will make up his mind “in the coming days,” a spokesman said Wednesday.

Rick Tyler, national spokesman for the Texas Republican senator’s newly launched presidential campaign, also defended Cruz against charges of hypocrisy for suggesting that he might enroll in Affordable Care Act health exchanges.

“Senator Cruz and his wife are still weighing options for their family,” Tyler wrote in an email to POLITICO when asked about the senator’s current thinking on enrolling in an ACA health insurance exchange, adding that the senator would make a decision shortly.

Tyler said that Cruz — who has vigorously opposed and vowed to repeal Obamacare — was subject to a law with which he disagrees. “That’s like saying he’s not going to pay the taxes he voted against,” he wrote.

Cruz, meanwhile, slammed the media coverage of his family’s health care dilemma, saying the mainstream media is playing “gotcha games.”


Source

Not sure how following the law is hypocrisy. If anything, taking advantage of the fact that he's a senator and is thus exempt from having to enroll seems more hypocritical to me.

It really does seem like the media is playing gotcha games.


Cruz describes ACA as the worst policy mistake in America since slavery. If he signs up for private health insurance on the ACA exchange, and he doesn't burst into flames, then all that bad stuff he said about ACA would be undone by his own relatively positive experience. Do you not understand how a smooth enrollment for private insurance through the ACA exchange website would undercut all of his doom and gloom exaggerations about ACA?

Like I said though, wouldn't it be worse to take advantage of his senator status to avoid the exchange? This way he goes through the exact same stuff the common man does.

Even if he doesn't have a bad time of it, that doesn't invalidate his statement that the ACA is horrible. Not all bad decisions have immediate negative consequences.


What? Of course it invalidates (maybe just undercuts) his arguments that ACA is horrible. Presuming he signs up, ACA then would have provided him with the ability to pick up insurance when his wife left work (without having to worry about pre-existing conditions) from a marketplace of private insurance options.

News: "Senator, how was it signing up for private insurance through the ACA exchange website?"

Cruz: "It went fine"

News: "If it went fine for you, and millions like you, why is it so bad?"

Cruz: "..."

It can be a bad program but still work OK, at least temporarily, for the end user. I've said it before, but the ACA just treats the symptoms of an underlying problem with the US healthcare system. The real problem is out of control prices for treatment. Big pharma can charge basically whatever they want because insurance companies typically pick up the tab for the patients. If insurance wasn't a thing, prices would fall, because otherwise no one could afford any treatment. Big pharma would have no choice, either lower prices so they can actually make sales, or keep prices high and go out of business.

The ACA forces everyone into an insurance plan, which just further keeps prices high. It's essentially just kicking the can down the road.

You have to think long-term.
Who called in the fleet?
Aveng3r
Profile Joined February 2012
United States2411 Posts
March 26 2015 18:56 GMT
#35360
On March 27 2015 01:13 puerk wrote:
As it seems to not have been posted in this thread: http://ric-zai-inc.com/Publications/cops-w0753-pub.pdf
It is only Philadelphia, but it expands and explains the points GreenHorizons was already making, and it is from a law enforcement perspective.

Show nested quote +
Finding: Incidents involving discourtesy, use of force, and allegations of bias by PPD officers leave segments
of the community feeling disenfranchised and distrustful of the police department (finding 17) .
Recommendation: PPD’s academy should significantly increase the scope and duration of its training on core and
advanced community oriented policing concepts (recommendation 17.1).

Interesting read, thanks for sharing. Im about 20 minutes outside of philadelphia area city limits and its nice to know that the police force local to this area is aware of the "police brutality" sentiment.
I carve marble busts of assassinated world leaders - PM for a quote
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