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On June 07 2012 14:43 Aerisky wrote:
Oh god lol, Durant winning a title before LBJ......he literally would not hear the end of that :/
Those stats though tonight....OKC's FG and 3pt FG%....36-72 and 10-18, respectively. That is unreal.
When can we start calling LBJ the Dan Marino of the nba? Next year if they fail? Or give a few more shots
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On June 07 2012 14:51 ecstatica wrote:Show nested quote +On June 07 2012 12:56 Ace wrote:
I said a healthy Miami team would tear the Celtics apart. But when they lost Bosh in Indy I already said they'd have trouble making the Finals. Kind of like they did regular season. Whend u become such a hater? Im positive healthy Celtics would tear Miami another asshole. I wish they had Bosh all along for these excuses to not come up (who cares how injury ridden Celtics are)
How am I a hater? I'm one of the most pro-Boston Celtics posters you'd find around here.
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Spurs vs Celtics would be a great series to watch.
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United States10774 Posts
On June 07 2012 15:09 Disregard wrote:
Spurs vs Celtics would be a great series to watch.
Would be great indeed, but not as "fun" as Thunder-Heat
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On June 07 2012 13:47 thuracine wrote:Show nested quote +On June 07 2012 13:44 XoXiDe wrote:
I'm glad the finals are on ABC, can actually watch the games in HD instead of trying to make out players in shitty SD. You don't get tnt in hd that sucks bro
dorm cable 
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I'm not a Heat fan but I would like to see a Heat vs. OKC finals rather than watching a game where OKC just stomps over Celtics
I just want to see Wade winning MVP this year since he was robbed of one year by Nash. (Nash can still keep his other year MVP) I'm pretty neutral towards LBJ unlike most fans in the NBA
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Why would the Thunder destroy Boston but not the Heat? Rondo is way better than Miami's PGs, both in terms of ability to guard Westbrook and forcing Westbrook to expend energy defensively.
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And conversely, why would the Thunder stomp Boston when Miami couldn't?
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Canada9720 Posts
whoever wins in the east, i think it'll be a 4-2 win for OKC. THE BEARD SON
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On June 07 2012 15:00 Ace wrote:Show nested quote +On June 07 2012 14:51 ecstatica wrote:On June 07 2012 12:56 Ace wrote:
I said a healthy Miami team would tear the Celtics apart. But when they lost Bosh in Indy I already said they'd have trouble making the Finals. Kind of like they did regular season. Whend u become such a hater? Im positive healthy Celtics would tear Miami another asshole. I wish they had Bosh all along for these excuses to not come up (who cares how injury ridden Celtics are) How am I a hater? I'm one of the most pro-Boston Celtics posters you'd find around here.
I thought you were, but you love Miami more now T_T
I hate how ppl think Cs are in the finals. Tonight is fucking scary.
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On June 07 2012 23:38 CTStalker wrote:
whoever wins in the east, i think it'll be a 4-2 win for OKC. THE BEARD SON
I want a game 7.
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On June 07 2012 23:24 Signet wrote:
Why would the Thunder destroy Boston but not the Heat? Rondo is way better than Miami's PGs, both in terms of ability to guard Westbrook and forcing Westbrook to expend energy defensively.
Theres matchup nightmares and age/health differences that make it almost impossible. Whos guarding Durant? How will Rondo do on Westbrook who possibly dominates him physically? How do we take care of Harden? Whos Celtics big man? How do we even drive to the basket or have an impact in the paint with all those shotblockers?
These are not possible questions, these are major headaches. IF Celtics make it past Miami they will be up against possibly their toughest opponent in big 3 era.
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I thought OKC in 7. Things went better than expected.
God, these guys are scary. Maybe get an assistant coach to create good halfcourt offense and the "D" world will come up in discussions about them.
I'd rather see MIA OKC, though I actually think Boston might have a better shot, coz you have to get into OKC's head to beat these guys. Mindgames, no one beats BOS.
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On June 07 2012 23:46 ecstatica wrote:Show nested quote +On June 07 2012 23:24 Signet wrote:
Why would the Thunder destroy Boston but not the Heat? Rondo is way better than Miami's PGs, both in terms of ability to guard Westbrook and forcing Westbrook to expend energy defensively. Theres matchup nightmares and age/health differences that make it almost impossible. Whos guarding Durant? How will Rondo do on Westbrook who possibly dominates him physically? How do we take care of Harden? Whos Celtics big man? How do we even drive to the basket or have an impact in the paint with all those shotblockers? These are not possible questions, these are major headaches. IF Celtics make it past Miami they will be up against possibly their toughest opponent in big 3 era.
True, and I definitely agree with your last line. OKC feels like the favorite against either Eastern team.
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On June 07 2012 23:46 ecstatica wrote:Show nested quote +On June 07 2012 23:24 Signet wrote:
Why would the Thunder destroy Boston but not the Heat? Rondo is way better than Miami's PGs, both in terms of ability to guard Westbrook and forcing Westbrook to expend energy defensively. Theres matchup nightmares and age/health differences that make it almost impossible. Whos guarding Durant? How will Rondo do on Westbrook who possibly dominates him physically? How do we take care of Harden? Whos Celtics big man? These are not possible questions, these are major headaches.
They've done an OK job of guarding Wade and James. Pierce/Pietrus will probably be on Durant mostly. The Heat are as good or better in transition, and I think the Celtics are playing great team defense in general right now.
I do agree with you about the big man. The Celtics will need some minutes out of Stiemsma and maybe even Hollins otherwise they're going to get worn down.
IF Celtics make it past Miami they will be up against possibly their toughest opponent in big 3 era.
Definitely a much tougher task then any team they beat in 2008. You're right.
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United States4471 Posts
On June 07 2012 23:46 ecstatica wrote:Show nested quote +On June 07 2012 23:24 Signet wrote:
Why would the Thunder destroy Boston but not the Heat? Rondo is way better than Miami's PGs, both in terms of ability to guard Westbrook and forcing Westbrook to expend energy defensively. Theres matchup nightmares and age/health differences that make it almost impossible. Whos guarding Durant? How will Rondo do on Westbrook who possibly dominates him physically? How do we take care of Harden? Whos Celtics big man? How do we even drive to the basket or have an impact in the paint with all those shotblockers? These are not possible questions, these are major headaches. IF Celtics make it past Miami they will be up against possibly their toughest opponent in big 3 era.
I don't know if I agree with your last sentence. I know this is going to sound biased coming from a Lakers fan, I think that the Kobe/Gasol/Odom Lakers teams were just as good, if not better. Even though Bynum wasn't 100% most of the time, the Odom/Gasol/Bynum frontcourt was a nightmare to face in the postseason where controlling the paint is essential. Add in the fact that the Lakers teams were more experienced and playoff-tested, and I think that they should at least be considered as tough as this current OKC team.
OKC is an amazing team, but they're still prone to making unforced mistakes and rely a bit too much on their athleticism to cover them. On offense, they rely on jumpshooting and getting to the line too much and don't have a single post threat, which explains why they are prone to offensive dry spells. Their frontcourt is really only capable of dominating on defense, Game 4 vs the Spurs was a major aberration. People are talking about how they took out each of the previous Western Conference champions over the past decade on the way, but these were hardly the same championship teams.
The Mavs got completely stripped down after winning the championship last season by losing key players like Chandler and Barea, were impacted by the shortened compacted schedule by having less time to get used to the lineup changes, having to sit Kidd for long stretches to save him for the postseason, and Dirk starting the season out of shape (like many other players since they didn't even know if there would be a season). None of this is OKC's fault, but the bottom line is that they did not beat the team that won the Finals last year.
The Spurs are nothing like the championship teams of the past, and were playing with a lot of new players who were asked to play important roles. The big 3 were still there, but you had additions all over like Leonard, Green, SJax and Diaw, all of whom were very important to their success. I actually think the team overachieved considering how many new players they had and having to incorporate them during a shortened and compacted schedule. Popovic did a great job of doing the best anyone could in that situation by preserving his stars and giving the newer players more PT to gain confidence and familiarity with each other, but there's only so much that he could do. The Spurs played a style that requires great teamwork and contributions from everyone. The shortened/compacte schedule gave them less time to gel, and to really test their new or young role players. I actually think their regular season success actually hurt them because it was predicated so much on depth (which is great in a compacted schedule just b/c other teams are tired, but just isn't as useful in the postseason) and made it so that the younger role players like Neal, Leonard and Green never had to really face adversity or be tested.
The Lakers had a whole host of issues to deal with this season, starting with the failed CP3 trade and all of its ramifications (i.e. Odom leaving and Pau being unsettled and out of sorts all season). In addition, they had a new coach and new system, with no time to get used to either. They had a lot of role players who weren't used to playing together, i.e. McRoberts, Murphy, Goudelock, Ebanks, Sessions, Hill, etc., and had little to no time to gain familiarity with each other. This was nothing like the team that had made it to the Finals and won two rings over the past few seasons.
OKC, on the other hand, had the exact same roster as last season, except you swap out Maynor for Fisher. They were already familiar with each other, had previous postseason experience with each other, and had virtually no health issues. This season was a perfect storm for a young and athletic team, coming in with familiarity with their coach, system and roster. The regular season was compacted, and the postseason was to an extent as well (the back-to-back playoff games were just ridiculous). Their opponents were all relying on older stars (Kidd/Dirk, Kobe/Gasol, Duncan/Manu) and dealing with significant roster changes with less time and rest.
With all of that said, this Thunders team is simply amazing. Their big 3 are incredible talents, they've got a great frontcourt capable of controlling the paint, their role players who understand and are very capable in their roles, and they are very well coached. Would they be championship contenders in a regular, non-compacted/shortened season? Absolutely, without a doubt. Is it likely they would have made the Finals anyway? I would say the probability would still have been high. However, I still think the circumstances surrounding this season and their biggest threats (DAL, LAL and SAS) did give them an advantage, and may have pushed their Finals appearance schedule up a bit.
Back to the original point, I don't think that they're a tougher opponent than the Lakers of the past few seasons or even the Heat of last year. The Lakers teams were more experienced and capable of dominating the paint on both sides of the court, and the Heat had/have an arguably better and more experienced big 3 with inferior depth (less important in postseason). I would argue that they're at least as tough, if not tougher.
I would definitely agree that these circumstances are clearly the toughest for the Celtics this year, as they're dealing with an absurdly depleted roster, have significant health issues to key players, and have also been adversely affected by the shortened/compacted schedule. Fortunately for them, their biggest threats in the East were hit by major injuries as well, i.e. Rose, D12 and Bosh all injured, otherwise I don't think they had any chance of making it even this far. Good news for them is that OKC, like MIA, relies heavily on perimeter players and have no dominant big man to punish their one-man show frontcourt.
Edit: TL;DR - I think Lakers and Heat of past few years were just as tough if not tougher opponents for Celtics in the postseason. OKC is great but they had favorable circumstances all season-long, and have their own weaknesses.
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United States4471 Posts
Oh, and I just want to briefly rant about that BS technical on SJax last night. He didn't say anything or make any sort of gesture. Just a look. How many times has Westbrook sneered at or stared down his opponents after a play in the postseason, let alone this series? How many times has Harden stared down someone after making a play? It's completely absurd to let all of that go time after time, and then hit SJax for a pretty innocuous look at a Spurs bench that was surely talking shit all game and making all sorts of noise behind him as he was taking the shot.
And that ties into another pet peeve of mine. Why are teams' benches allowed to distract opposing players from the sidelines? They're often literally only inches away from the players, and they're given carte blanche to scream, yell, wave, clap, etc. in an effort to distract players. How is that even remotely okay? To allow that and then give SJax a technical for looking at the bench? Complete and utter bullshit.
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On June 08 2012 03:05 XaI)CyRiC wrote:
Edit: TL;DR - I think Lakers and Heat of past few years were just as tough if not tougher opponents for Celtics in the postseason. OKC is great but they had favorable circumstances all season-long, and have their own weaknesses.
the lakers, mavs, etc were built to compete against the celtics formula - strong inside presence and star players from beyond the line. but that is now an aged formula. and now they are stuck with the formula because their teams are mostly vets, while most other teams have gone small and young (intentionally or not). these teams fell behind in speed and explosiveness, which was vastly apparent in LA vs nugget/okc, mavs vs okc.
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On June 08 2012 03:20 XaI)CyRiC wrote:
Oh, and I just want to briefly rant about that BS technical on SJax last night. He didn't say anything or make any sort of gesture. Just a look. How many times has Westbrook sneered at or stared down his opponents after a play in the postseason, let alone this series? How many times has Harden stared down someone after making a play? It's completely absurd to let all of that go time after time, and then hit SJax for a pretty innocuous look at a Spurs bench that was surely talking shit all game and making all sorts of noise behind him as he was taking the shot.
And that ties into another pet peeve of mine. Why are teams' benches allowed to distract opposing players from the sidelines? They're often literally only inches away from the players, and they're given carte blanche to scream, yell, wave, clap, etc. in an effort to distract players. How is that even remotely okay? To allow that and then give SJax a technical for looking at the bench? Complete and utter bullshit.
That was a terrible call. I'm broadly okay with the benches being able to yell at or distract the opposing players, and besides trying to officiate that out of the game would be a nightmare. But with that in mind, the players on the court can't be expected to not respond in any way.
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http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/nba-playoffs-marred-by-officiating-boston-celtics-miami-heat-okc-thunder-san-antonio-spurs-060712
+ Show Spoiler + NBA refs have been biggest flop
We can’t see the Boston Celtics. Their shocking and amazing run to a 3-2 advantage in the Eastern Conference finals has been blotted out by the stars of these NBA playoffs — Kevin Durant, LeBron James, Dwyane Wade, Joey Crawford, Bill Kennedy, Derrick Stafford, Ed Malloy, Dan Crawford and Flop City.
You don’t recognize those last six names? Sure you do. Their names trend on Twitter on a nightly basis. They’re cussed and discussed on talk radio on a daily basis. They’re the newest, biggest stars of the NBA. They’re turning what should be a showcase of what is right and good about the NBA into an advertisement for what is wrong with the league.
They’re NBA refs and their trusty foil, the whistle-baiting, soccer-ploy flopping.
The refs and The Flop have squeezed Kevin Garnett, Paul Pierce, Rajon Rondo, Doc Rivers and Celtics Pride to the back of the playoff storylines. I get that the Heat's collapse and the on-court fraying of James and Wade are more fascinating than the Boston dinosaurs rising up to rule the East.
But it’s a tragedy that the league’s most historic franchise is taking a backseat to the men in striped shirts.
The refs and The Flop are the reason I have tremendous apprehension about Thursday's Celtics-Heat Game 6. I’m afraid the highly skilled, highly compelling players won’t decide this elimination contest and the refs and Oscar-worthy acting will.
Wednesday night, Durant and the Thunder extinguished the Spurs, rallying from an 18-point deficit to win 107-99. Durant was remarkable. He played all 48 minutes. He scored 34 points, grabbed 14 rebounds, handed out five assists, blocked two shots and snatched a steal.
Rondo and James have put together more impressive stat lines, but no one has played better during these playoffs than Durant did Wednesday. His combination of movement without the ball and ability to put the ball on the floor to create his own shot and open looks for others was the best I’ve seen since Michael Jordan in his prime. Durant was Carmelo Anthony, Ray Allen and Chris Paul rolled into one 6-foot-9 package.
He so frustrated the Spurs that tiny Tony Parker tried to match Durant shot for shot and play for play. After a 7-for-9, 16-point, six-assist first quarter, Parker made a fool of himself the last three quarters, jacking difficult shots early in the shot clock and taking his teammates, particularly Manu Ginobili, out of rhythm. Parker hit five of 18 shots the final 36 minutes.
Durant’s destruction of Parker should’ve been the lone storyline. It wasn’t. Joe Crawford, Bill Kennedy and Randy Mott took over the fourth quarter with their whistles. They called five fouls on the Spurs in less than four minutes, putting the Thunder in the bonus with 8:19 to play. On a night when both teams looked for shots in the paint, the Thunder shot 31 free throws and the Spurs attempted 18.
OKC outplayed San Antonio and deserved the victory. But the officiating was horrendous. Given Joe Crawford’s well-documented history with Tim Duncan, it's incredulous that Crawford is assigned to Spurs games.
The officiating in the Eastern Conference finals has been every bit as bad. The Celtics can pretty much plan on getting at least two technical fouls Thursday night.
I’m not charging conspiracy. I’m charging incompetence. I’m charging out-of-control egos. The refs view themselves as stars. I’m blaming HD TVs. Seriously. You think the Kardashians are the only people in love with fame? Most of America wants to be a reality-TV star, and you think these old men don’t love their celebrity?
This is going to sound crazy, but I’d make all refs — basketball and football — wear masks. Make 'em numbers instead of names. No. 19 could control his ego better than Joe Crawford and his NFL equivalent, Ed Hochuli.
Now, I’m not putting the whole thing on the refs. The Flop is absolutely ruining basketball and making the game far more difficult to officiate. The best athletes in the world fall down spectacularly at the mere thought of contact. Between the flops and the constant glares and whining of the players, the refs are constantly under high stress.
The solution is an instant-replay official who works in conjunction with the refs on the floor. The instant-replay ref should review all potential flops and reward the victim of a flop two free throws. The free throws could be awarded after every dead-ball timeout. Yes, it’s a judgment call, but so are technical fouls. And flopping must be stopped.
Basketball isn’t soccer. Basketball doesn’t want to be soccer. Basketball is a wonderfully fluid game played by the most breathtaking athletes in the world. Flopping is getting in the way of fans appreciating that.
We can’t appreciate the beauty of what the Celtics are potentially pulling off because of all the flopping bodies and bloated egos in our way. Yes, James and Wade flop and have bloated egos, but I’m mostly talking about the refs.
Normally i can't stand ANYTHING written by Jason Whitlock, but every ant has his day and this is his.
Something needs to be done about the officiating in the NBA, it has been on a downward decline for the last few years now and these playoffs have just been a perfect example so far of why something must be done.
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EPT
