EPTSC2 Grandmaster or Chess Grandmaster - Page 2
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Redmark
Canada2129 Posts
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Boblion
France8043 Posts
On February 22 2012 11:11 Risen wrote: Owing in no small part to the limitations of human mechanics, a computer can easily beat a human in sc2 if the programming time was to be allotted for it. Program it to react to scouting information properly and it will quickly win nearly every game it plays. They can't even solve chess and you think they can make a proper AI for Sc2 ? hahahaha | ||
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Azzur
Australia6260 Posts
First, we have to make some assumptions: I'm going to assume that GM is "working as intended" and the GM to get into is NA, EU or KR and not some low population server (e.g. SEA). In chess, the term Grandmaster was first given to 5 players by some Russian Tsar after a particular tournament (I think it's St Petersburg). In the past, it was extremely hard to become a chess Grandmaster - but now, it's actually quite different. Chess has been "solved" in the sense that many of the concepts are now readily understood and can be mathematically represented. So much so that the best chess players are now computers. Also, chess has now alot of explored territory - so much so that many openings now span 20+ moves and finding new moves in a given position are quite rare. Basically, if someone did some intensive training (2-3 months?) with a good coach, armed with a good database and computer (to look for novelties) can do pretty well. You'll still need to get over your nerves and translate it into match practice but you'll be pretty good and can try and become a Grandmaster. I still think that a chess Grandmaster is harder, but not by the margin that some people are thinking. If chess was where it was 30 years ago, then I would say chess by a huge margin, but it's the year 2012 at the moment. | ||
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Risen
United States7927 Posts
On February 22 2012 11:22 Boblion wrote: They can't even solve chess and you think they can make a proper AI for Sc2 ? hahahaha Why would making an AI for sc2 be hard? Where does the difficulty arise? There is a proper response to everything in sc2. See 1rax FE do X, see 2rax do X, scout denied, play safe and do X and beat him through superior mechanics and macro since you're a computer. | ||
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Azzur
Australia6260 Posts
On February 22 2012 11:36 Risen wrote: Why would making an AI for sc2 be hard? Where does the difficulty arise? There is a proper response to everything in sc2. See 1rax FE do X, see 2rax do X, scout denied, play safe and do X and beat him through superior mechanics and macro since you're a computer. Absolutely - I reckon it's possible to make an impossible to beat AI And the poster you quoted is quite mistaken - chess is not "solved" but the AI > humans | ||
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snakeeyez
United States1231 Posts
On February 22 2012 11:22 Boblion wrote: They can't even solve chess and you think they can make a proper AI for Sc2 ? hahahaha I think AI can consistently beat grandmaster chess players at chess. If I remember right I think they did solve chess already. Lets ask is it harder to beat jaedong or flash at brood war or to beat a chess grandmaster? I think brood war is a much better place to study AI then starcraft 2 because its much older and arguably has better balance. | ||
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Whatson
United States5357 Posts
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MooMooMugi
United States10531 Posts
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Quenchiest
Canada286 Posts
He probably comes here and asks the question because people in his stream are always bringing up how SC2 is the chess of the video game world. | ||
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Iranon
United States983 Posts
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Boblion
France8043 Posts
On February 22 2012 11:41 Azzur wrote: Absolutely - I reckon it's possible to make an impossible to beat AI And the poster you quoted is quite mistaken - chess is not "solved" but the AI > humans I said it was solved ? | ||
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Azzur
Australia6260 Posts
On February 22 2012 11:45 snakeeyez wrote: I think AI can consistently beat grandmaster chess players at chess. If I remember right I think they did solve chess already. Lets ask is it harder to beat jaedong or flash at brood war or to beat a chess grandmaster? I think brood war is a much better place to study AI then starcraft 2 because its much older and arguably has better balance. Actually, chess AI is even more than beating random grandmasters - the AI beats the very top humans now regularly. | ||
HawaiianPig
Canada5155 Posts
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