My fellow Americans and team liquid goers of other nationalities.. if you have been alive for more than 5 seconds you've probably heard someone say "America has no culture". A recent pm about this matter has truly been irking me.
As an American this "insult" baffles me. I don't understand where it comes from. The United States is the country that brought the world wonderful things such as Broadway and Jazz.
We fight with everyone over what the word "football means".
We Created baseball and basketball which are truly multinational sports.
We erect monuments like the St louis Arch and carve the faces of past leaders into mountain sides.
.
We have cultural holidays just like everyone else!
Every small town and city in this Country is different from the last.
So once again I ask you why are Americans so frequently labeled as cultureless
Certainly we don't have as long as a history as most nations because we simply haven't been around that long.
Maybe it stems from the fact that many elements of our culture evolved from the cultures that immigrants brought here with them. EDIT Somehow this thread developed in a completely predictable yet entirely unfortunate way. I wouldn't have bothered to make it if knew it would make people more angry when it's purpose was to exact opposite.
On January 21 2012 16:41 Demonhunter04 wrote: You forgot to mention that Blizzard is an american company xD
Well I assumed that if someone on a starcraft website doesn't know that then they are hopeless.
On January 21 2012 16:39 {CC}StealthBlue wrote: Never heard someone say America has no Culture, the fact that people wear Nike and Jordan jerseys seems to make the insult redundant.
Culture means to be a group of people with some sort of common identity that separates itself from other groups so just with the single fact that Americans are called Americans and that they live in a country named USA proves that a culture must exist.
yeah its mainly because of your last point, 'Maybe it stems from the fact that many elements of our culture evolved from the cultures that immigrants brought here with them.' and the country is quite young. but anyways this is just like a stereotypical saying, so its not to be taken too seriously.
America doesn't really have a culture. One of the main parts of culture is how/why you do something. In america the only reason you do something is because of money. Its all about business and efficiency. Its why everyone sees us as jerks and cocky bastards, because that's what our business culture brings us up as when we're young.
Great post! the U.S is a relatively young country and much of its culture is that it is extremely multicultural, since the early 1800's america was looked at as the best place to be for immigrants. they bring their culture and beliefs along with it. i for one am a first generation of my family that was born in the U.S, my parents both being immigrants from Lebanon.
Why even waste the time dignifying a stupid statement like America has no culture. Treat it like every other stupid thing people say and just ignore it.
On January 21 2012 16:44 Chro wrote: America doesn't really have a culture. One of the main parts of culture is how/why you do something. In america the only reason you do something is because of money. Its all about business and efficiency. Its why everyone sees us as jerks and cocky bastards, because that's what our business culture brings us up as when we're young.
Is this a joke? Or do you know NOTHING about the developed asian countries?
An Asian person wakes up, slushes through his day, and is routinely exposed to thousands of years of culture in his everyday life through his language, the traditions practiced around him, and the demeanour of the people in his surroundings.
An European person wakes up, slushes through his day, and is routinely exposed to hundreds of years of culture in his everyday life through his language, the traditions practiced around him, and the demeanour of the people in his surroundings.
Americans got like what . . . a few decades at most?
Clearly America is the greatest producer and consumer of popular media, professional sports, etc, but America lacks the depth of cultural traditions seen in many other parts of the world. Its language is new. Its traditions are either new or taken from other cultures.
Most Americans will not be able to tell you anything about how their ancestors lived five hundred years ago. What kind of language they spoke. What traditions they practiced.
It's not that you have no culture, it's just that your culture has lasted less than 300 years at least and is boring comapred to cultures coming from places like Japan, Korea, Italy, France, Spain and many others of the older more culturally defined countries.
In theory when we look at American culture, we need to think, are what so called American cultures actually American. Some are some aren't.
This comes from the basis that most Americans are more or less "not American" by this I mean they may be Chinese-American like myself Korean Spanish etc.
America is a fusion type society where most of their cultures are based upon other cultures. with the exception of Native American culture
Do I agree? probably not, But I can see where they are coming from
Culture is just an abstract idea anyways. Culture can pertain to food, rituals, work, basically anything that is typical for people of a certain area. I never really thought about it, but 'culture' is like a nice version of a 'stereotype'. I'm from the South in America. While I believe that it's important to recognize what those before us in our are have done historically, I really don't believe that it's necessary at all to subscribe yourself entirely to the culture if it doesn't fit you.
Forgive me for any historical errors, American History is not my strong point
I've had people say this to me before (that Americans have no culture), and when I ask them about it, it seems to come from America as a nation is only 200 (or so) years old. Most cultures use the traditions of their ancestors from thousands of years ago to legitimise their culture in its modern incarnation (even though it probably doesn't even resemble the cultural practices of their forefathers but...).
The second half of it is the well known historical notion that the first Americans (and therefore their descendants) were European in origin. I think the argument is "well even if Americans have a culture, most of it is 'borrowed' from British culture so it isn't real or original."
I don't think that either of these things mean that Americans have no culture, the OP outlined some of the popular / well known cultural elements of America like sports or Thanksgiving. I personally don't have much interest in American culture, but that doesn't mean it isn't important, or that it doesn't exist as the OP argued.
P.S. I realise I said I'm not that interested in American culture, this isn't intended as a sneaky dick move, I'm not particularly interested in Finnish / Chinese / Irish (where I live) culture either. I just mentioned it since it was the point of discussion.
America has a pretty strong religious culture as well, like it or lump it. The world may not truly be aware of how saturated the "bible belt" really is.
On January 21 2012 16:44 Wombatsavior wrote: Just gotta say, basketball came from Canada.
Just thought the below was interesting.
The First basketball type game may have been played by the early Olmec people of ancient Mexico as early as 500 years go. The Aztec, and Mayan cultures also had a game similar to basketball, only instead of a rubber ball they used the decapitated skulls of their conquered foes. The First true basketball game as we know it was on January 20th, 1892 in Springfield, Massachusetts. Canadian Doctor James Naismith invented the game for the YMCA to play during the winter months. Naismith wrote simple rules for the game, and nailed up two peach baskets for hoops, most of original Naismith rules are still in place today. Some of the rules have changed a bit, and new rules have been added since then, such as in the original game bouncing the ball was prohibited. Of the 13 rules, nine have been modified and kept in the modern game of basketball, the rest have been disregarded.
I was born in Europe and we moved to Canada and my parents always complain how there is no culture here, and I think it's a justified statement.
Like literally there is culture, but I think what it means, is when you go to Europe you have so many historic buildings that are preserved, you have traditional costumes and traditional get together's, some things are done in very inefficient manners just to keep the tradition going, we look upon the old way of life.
That's how I see it at least. In Canada I feel the clothing is very generic, the houses are very generic, and everything is focused around the economy and more material possessions where as in Europe, especially poorer countries like Slovakia for me, it is more social, and their way of life is based around this culture, it has a flavor to it. North America really does feel like a room empty of furniture while other countries are all different, judging by their clothing, the tools they use, etc.
I am in no way insulting the US and Canada, it's a different way of life, but a large degree I agree that we are pretty culture less. Looking back at heritage we have the First Nations which I guess aren't very appealing to me, and the thing is, here in Canada, people don't care about tradition or culture much at all. Quebec however has a lot more culture compared to the rest of Canada, mostly because they believe in those traditional values.
They are not jelly. OP is insecure and should not have made this thread.
As a short response to the thread I have to say the following:
-USA does have culture. But it is not by the standards of the European or Asian culture who had millenia to develop. -An average resident of the US (of course there are exceptions, the coastal cities, both pacific and atlantic) has a lower standard of elegance and savoir vivre than the average european. To us (and to the more civilized citizens of the coastal regions) someone may seem almost like a caveman -Football is something played with the feet only. (aka soccer for you)
Except from the above, there are a few reasons why people outside the US exaggerate and say US has no culture. Warning: transfering rants about the US. If you don't want to know the truth, don't open the spoiler.
-The proud usage of the word AMERICAN, in every occasion. At least, try to remember what this name is derived from before using it like almost a spell. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Americo_Vespucci -The nationalism AND the low educational standards leading quite a few citizens having no bloody idea what, or where is the rest of the world -The really poor educational system. A huge chunk of US sientists are foreigners, and that is just a sad display of the low stantards of the rest of the population -The fact that there is a bible zone. And the fact that 40% of the US citizens believe the world was created by god in the past 10000 years. (We aren't mass atheists, but we can appreciate the evidence from carbon 14 isotope dating and can see why the bible should at least be taken as something not literal). -The fact that many of you believe that evolution is a theory. This saddens us really really much. -Constant war making and Imperialism, do not help with your image in the eyes of citizens around the world. -Fixation on capitalism. Around the world we discuss politics oppenly. What would happen to me if I said I am of communist ideology, somewhere in texas? -Fixation on terrorism. Get over it. -The cold war. Russia is not the evil empire. -The song "america fuck yeah" is ironic. Some people seem to have trouble understanding that. -Insane obesity rates. -Etc, etc etc
So, you see it's not that you have no culture. Everyone has developed a culture. It's that there are so many things bugging us about your country that we as non US citizens close our eyes to what good you have done and try to focus on the negative side of things.
For me, the bright side is Blues, Jazz, (a small part of) Hollywood and of course the scientific culture the US have developed, driving the whole world forward as a result.
PS: I don't want any answer to the post, I'm merely explaining why europeans refuse to see what good you have done as a country. They just blacklist you as a whole, which is unfair.
On January 21 2012 17:03 Terranist wrote: i've heard that we have no history, but culture? lol. the world revolves around america and everyone else is a jealous hater.
Oh, and as a great example to my post, I quote this guy.
If the United States has no culture because of its age, than neither do Mexico, Brazil or Jamaica.
Notice how the US is different than these places. And also its different from the United Kingdom and the rest of Europe, and also Africa, where most US ancestors came from.
Thus the US has a unique culture of its own. It's quite clearly different than anywhere else in the world.
I'v never heard that- I've heard Canada has no culture. Either we are too much like the Americans or else we define our Canadianism as being "we are NOT Americans."
Perhaps it could be argued that American culture is not very old- as America (that is ignoring the indigenous cultures). Old culture seems to carry greater importance. But I don't think it could be said that America has no culture- perhaps it's the commercialized culture that people react to. Because quite certainly American/ Western culture is very exportable so there must be a culture to export.
Oh and just like a lot of things, we'll fight you for Basketball. No matter how long you've lived in America, if you were born in Canada and if you do something we like, we will claim you. And if you do something we don't like, we will disown you to the Americans just as fast
I would think America is one of the top cultural exporters. Looking at movies, music, literature & video games alone, it wouldn't be hard to find something American in another country. It definitely has culture but not as steeped in tradition compared to another high exporter of culture, Japan (damn you anime).
Hell, just consider English as being an international language. This is due to no small part on America exporting its mass media around the world.
America has culture, it's just that it's a patchwork of mostly identifiable items from other cultures made up over a short period of time when compared to much of the rest of the world. There's nothing wrong with that as far as I'm concerned.
I don't see why it's a big deal. Of the main centre of powers over history, there is much to admire about the Middle East, there is much to admire about Europe, there is much to admire about China, there is much to admire about India and there is much to admire about the newest centre of culture - the US. I think all have issues, but I hate the combative ideas that circulate. "My culture could beat up your culture" mentality is beyond stupid.
Apparently dem cultured folks gonna talk down to us simple hicks about culture.
It's funny to say America has no culture when, people can post comments in threads like "only in America", every place has culture from the fine arts to random shit, what you find just depends where you look. Claiming that a place has no culture is just being an asshole.
People want a claim no refinement in American culture yet when you talk about the classics in music, movies, literature, plays, all forms of entertainment you will find top works done in America. That idea that america has no refinement is just an idea people who want to hate on america subscribe to. Yes america doesn't have 1000+ years of history to subscribe to but it doesn't mean it's not jammed packed.
I know two hobbits that had dinner with two Numenorean men, and felt "rustic" and uncultured when they realized they didn't have a dinner ritual of looking to the West. But as a human looking in through a book, I'd say hobbits have quite an interesting culture, no matter which antagonistic characters referred to them as "imps" or their home as a "ratland." In fact, I'd suggest those meanies were the ones without culture, if anyone.
On January 21 2012 17:17 SilverLeagueElite wrote: I would think America is one of the top cultural exporters. Looking at movies, music, literature & video games alone, it wouldn't be hard to find something American in another country.
You made me think of the Rammstein music video, Amerika. The whole (or at least main) point made by this German band was that American culture has spread too far across the globe.
On January 21 2012 17:19 FuzzyJAM wrote: America has culture, it's just that it's a patchwork of mostly identifiable items from other cultures made up over a short period of time when compared to much of the rest of the world. There's nothing wrong with that as far as I'm concerned.
I don't see why it's a big deal. Of the main centre of powers over history, there is much to admire about the Middle East, there is much to admire about Europe, there is much to admire about China, there is much to admire about India and there is much to admire about the newest centre of culture - the US. I think all have issues, but I hate the combative ideas that circulate. "My culture could beat up your culture" mentality is beyond stupid.
You're just saying that because Scottish Enlightenment helped develop the modern world. Including the United States, even Europe for that matter.
On January 21 2012 17:21 semantics wrote: America has no refinement in culture lol
Apparently dem cultured folks gonna talk down to us simple hicks about culture.
It's funny to say America has no culture when, people can post comments in threads like "only in America", every place has culture from the fine arts to random shit, what you find just depends where you look. Claiming that a place has no culture is just being an asshole.
People want a claim no refinement in American culture yet when you talk about the classics in music, movies, literature, plays, all forms of entertainment you will find top works done in America. That idea that america has no refinement is just an idea people who want to hate on america subscribe to. Yes america doesn't have 1000+ years of history to subscribe to but it doesn't mean it's not jammed packed.
Hyperbole much? It's quite obvious America has culture and the thread reaks of insecurity, it's far less clear (and for me quite obvious to the answer) whether America can match the level of refinement in the fine arts, cuisine and literature that Europeans retain.
Good post, very true. It also irks me when people say that. I find it kind of funny that some people haven't heard people say it, I see it a lot. America has a ton of culture, imo. I guess "culture" is in the eye of the beholder though.
On January 21 2012 17:12 Notfragile wrote: -The proud usage of the word AMERICAN, in every occasion. At least, try to remember what this name is derived from before using it like almost a spell. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Americo_Vespucci -The nationalism AND the low educational standards leading quite a few citizens having no bloody idea what, or where is the rest of the world -The really poor educational system. A huge chunk of US sientists are foreigners, and that is just a sad display of the low stantards of the rest of the population -The fact that there is a bible zone. And the fact that 40% of the US citizens believe the world was created by god in the past 10000 years. (We aren't mass atheists, but we can appreciate the evidence from carbon 14 isotope dating and can see why the bible should at least be taken as something not literal). -The fact that many of you believe that evolution is a theory. This saddens us really really much. -Constant war making and Imperialism, do not help with your image in the eyes of citizens around the world. -Fixation on capitalism. Around the world we discuss politics oppenly. What would happen to me if I said I am of communist ideology, somewhere in texas? -Fixation on terrorism. Get over it. -The cold war. Russia is not the evil empire. -The song "america fuck yeah" is ironic. Some people seem to have trouble understanding that. -Insane obesity rates. -Etc, etc etc
This is a large collection of both idiocy and hypocrisy. I hope not all of Europe is as close-minded and oblivious as this. Proud usage of the word American? WTF? How does that have ANYTHING to do with anything. I'll concede that I think one large chunk(middle school/junior high, some of high school, and the union-supported education really) of our education system is in need of repair. However, how is foreign scientists a bad thing? They come here because they value our universities and research institutions, and we accept the value of foreign researchers. Why is this a problem? Religion is slowly diminishing in importance. Same with not believing in evolution. But this is a problem worldwide, not just in the US. Most of the people I know aren't especially religious. Your comment on imperialism is the one that is the most incorrect and the most bothersome. So, Europe is fresh off of over 500 YEARS of war-making and imperialism, and now you say to America to stop it? And it's not because of moral efforts that you stopped, not to a large extent. The reason European imperialism died down is because of a little event known as WORLD WAR II, which absolutely destroyed European military power. Want to know why America is an imperialist country and European powers are not? Because the US is the most powerful country in the world(military and economy) and the Europeans are not. Besides, events like the Suez Crisis occur here and there. And your little Greece hasn't been making an empire because it's been sucking for thousands of years now. If it wasn't, you'd be doing the same thing. It isn't Americans, it's just human nature. You are clearly not very knowledgeable about the state of the cold war affairs, terrorism, and the like. I don't need to address this because it's an argument stemming from ignorance.
I know you said do not respond to this, but it's hard to ignore a giant blob of hypocrisy and ignorance labeled as "truth."
I know people who say that American History is not as interesting as theirs, but in comparison with the badassery with Europes and Middle Easts history, I can see why.
In numerous languages, culture = tradition and\or knowledge. American popular culture is the world most dominant culture by far. Very few people disagree. But the common cliché is that people living in USA are poorly informed, aware of what is happening in the rest of the world + lack of basic general knowledge (even the political "elites", CF the Republican primaries).
Capital of Morocco ? Speaking 3 languages ? year of gutenberg printing press invention ? Polical parties in India ? Basis of Kant's Philosophy ? Name of the President of China ?....
I love how prejudiced idiots always point out age as a sort of measure of culture, considering that many countries in Europe only formed ~200 years ago as well. Many of the traditions and practices which cultures now identify themselves by were invented along with the concept of "nation" (which is rather new) during the 19th century. ex. Italy, Germany
Not to mention that if we used age as a measure of cultural worth we should all be bowing down to Iraqis, Egyptians, and the Chinese. Civilizations and cultures advance at different rates.
To answer you question OP: the same reason you made the post, because people are nationalistic (though they like to use the word patriotic) idiots.
Should we just create a committee to fashion a tier list of the best cultures in the world and get it over with?
I'm trying to gauge the future of this thread since only a few dissenters do not think the United States has culture, but many more have varying opinions of its adequacy vis-à-vis the rest of the world.
On January 21 2012 17:35 Thaniri wrote: I know people who say that American History is not as interesting as theirs, but in comparison with the badassery with Europes and Middle Easts history, I can see why.
US History is much more about forming stability and such within a relatively homogenous people than in unstable warring Europe. Certainly different, but by no means is US history bland. It has quite a few interesting aspects about it. If you want uninteresting, go to the river valley civilizations. There you will discover the meaning of bland and boring.
Culture is a difficult term to begin with. Ask a sociologist, an anthropologist and an art major to define culture and you'll be surprised.
When people complain about America having no culture here, they are actually most of the time refering to the way the Americans eat. Like what spoon to use when etc. which I always thought of as retarded anyway tbh.
Culture isn't about what you have, or about how many good and cool things that came from america. It's about being a douchebag.
Culture is about being better than other people and disliking mainstream and America is kind of mainstream and you cannot be cultural without being a fucking elitist who thinks better than those people. Also something has to exist for a very long time to be truly elitist enough and America is kind of young.
edit: I've been told that America had no culture by my middle school teacher. Not a very uncommon belief I think.
On January 21 2012 17:35 Thaniri wrote: I know people who say that American History is not as interesting as theirs, but in comparison with the badassery with Europes and Middle Easts history, I can see why.
On January 21 2012 17:09 FiWiFaKi wrote: I was born in Europe and we moved to Canada and my parents always complain how there is no culture here, and I think it's a justified statement.
Like literally there is culture, but I think what it means, is when you go to Europe you have so many historic buildings that are preserved, you have traditional costumes and traditional get together's, some things are done in very inefficient manners just to keep the tradition going, we look upon the old way of life.
That's how I see it at least. In Canada I feel the clothing is very generic, the houses are very generic, and everything is focused around the economy and more material possessions where as in Europe, especially poorer countries like Slovakia for me, it is more social, and their way of life is based around this culture, it has a flavor to it. North America really does feel like a room empty of furniture while other countries are all different, judging by their clothing, the tools they use, etc.
I am in no way insulting the US and Canada, it's a different way of life, but a large degree I agree that we are pretty culture less. Looking back at heritage we have the First Nations which I guess aren't very appealing to me, and the thing is, here in Canada, people don't care about tradition or culture much at all. Quebec however has a lot more culture compared to the rest of Canada, mostly because they believe in those traditional values.
I live in Canada and to say we have no culture is really stupid. The reason people don't think we have culture is because they think of modern Canada. We have deep roots and if you know about aboriginals you would know why we don't have historic buildings or why we don't keep much from them. I don't know where your from in Canada, but most Canadians care about their roots to first nations. So from what I take it, you don't celebrate thanksgiving or the Civic Holiday then?
On January 21 2012 17:22 Ansinjunger wrote: I know two hobbits that had dinner with two Numenorean men, and felt "rustic" and uncultured when they realized they didn't have a dinner ritual of looking to the West. But as a human looking in through a book, I'd say hobbits have quite an interesting culture, no matter which antagonistic characters referred to them as "imps" or their home as a "ratland." In fact, I'd suggest those meanies were the ones without culture, if anyone.
Your example isn't very good. The Numenoreans can trace their heritage back to the beginning of time, invented their own language, ruled Middle-Earth, communed and were descended from the angel-gods, and just generally had an exceptionally developed culture in all the arts. Hobbits, meanwhile, used a language invented by men and didn't really have much in the way of cultural heritage at all - in fact, the Numenoreans knew more about the history of the Hobbits than the Hobbits themselves.
On January 21 2012 17:19 FuzzyJAM wrote: America has culture, it's just that it's a patchwork of mostly identifiable items from other cultures made up over a short period of time when compared to much of the rest of the world. There's nothing wrong with that as far as I'm concerned.
I don't see why it's a big deal. Of the main centre of powers over history, there is much to admire about the Middle East, there is much to admire about Europe, there is much to admire about China, there is much to admire about India and there is much to admire about the newest centre of culture - the US. I think all have issues, but I hate the combative ideas that circulate. "My culture could beat up your culture" mentality is beyond stupid.
You're just saying that because Scottish Enlightenment helped develop the modern world. Including the United States, even Europe for that matter.
Well, there's no doubt that being Scottish and believing my own culture to have contributed a decent amount to the world gives security in telling people to stop waving their dicks around. If I can continue the fantastically graphic metaphor, there's nothing like knowing your own dick is pretty large (at least compared to the rest of you) when it comes to confidence in telling people that size doesn't matter. :D
On a more serious note, it also lets me notice that Scottish culture is closely linked to the rest of Europe. Nothing that Scotland has done would have happened if it weren't for the heritage of Scotland as a part of Europe. America is honestly largely an outworking of European culture, which is realistically Eurasian itself, and there's nothing really wrong with that. Europe is largely an outworking of Roman culture, which is an outworking of Greek culture, which is an outworking of Babylonian culture, and then you can look at lots of specific influence from the Vikings to the Ottomans to the Celts to the Huns to the Caliphates to the Phoenicians, etc. European culture wouldn't exist without the Middle East, which wouldn't exist without Europe and India. American culture wouldn't exist without the rest of the world, and that's fine, because it's a nice illustration of the connection in modern society. A melting pot is a kind of culture and produces unique things; the only difference is that the influences are more apparent and recent.
I don't think it's possible to not have a culture.
Culture: The arts and other manifestations of human intellectual achievement regarded collectively.
When you have civilization, culture is an inevitable by-product. Someone previously mentioned that America doesn't have culture because all we care about is money. Whether you like it or not, that would make capitalism and self-interest a part of our culture. Other people mentioned that we don't have culture because it's borrowed from other countries. Well, that gives America the unique culture of being made up of thousands of different cultures. The fact that we have easy access to Greek food, French food, Chinese food, Korean food, Indian food - all within range of a 30 minute drive or a short subway ride and we don't even think twice about it is a part of our culture.
I also don't think it's possible for one culture to be superior to another. Some people prefer apples to oranges, or vice-versa, but that make it a fact that one is better than the other. They're just different.
Culture is constantly evolving everywhere, and at the end of the day, it is what it is.
Well, while that's an extreme statement, the media/pop culture/entertainment industry has really broken down our cultural values and related things of that nature. Perhaps that what they mean by we have no culture. That said, it's even worse in parts of Europe, and even Japan and Korea, so I don't see why the focus is on the US.
Look at pop culture (music, movies, shows etc) in every single other country in the world and tell me they're not trying to be more like America. Culture is America's #1 export.
What's the difference between the USA and a bowl of yogurt? If you leave the yogurt alone for 200 years it grows a culture.
No but srsly, America has culture, it's just not generally regarded to be particularly high brow. Rioting at football games is part of English culture, but it's not what people bring to mind when they say "English culture". Culture in that sense is things like opera and fox hunting. American culture is viewed as too mass marketed, there is thought to be a lack of intellectualism. I don't hold this view, I'm merely describing what I think the OP meant about america lacking culture.
Also I dispute the idea that baseball is a global sport. It's pretty much only played competitively in North America. The "world series" of baseball is just a bunch of American teams playing lol.
On January 21 2012 17:56 ManicMarine wrote: What's the difference between the USA and a bowl of yogurt? If you leave the yogurt alone for 200 years it grows a culture.
No but srsly, America has culture, it's just not generally regarded to be particularly high brow. Rioting at football games is part of English culture, but it's not what people bring to mind when they say "English culture". Culture in that sense is things like opera and fox hunting. American culture is viewed as too mass marketed, there is thought to be a lack of intellectualism. I don't hold this view, I'm merely describing what I think the OP meant about america lacking culture.
Also I dispute the idea that baseball is a global sport. It's pretty much only played competitively in North America. The "world series" of baseball is just a bunch of American teams playing lol.
On January 21 2012 17:54 pavement ist rad wrote: Look at pop culture (music, movies, shows etc) in every single other country in the world and tell me they're not trying to be more like America. Culture is America's #1 export.
Quantity = Quality assumption....
Assumption two is that pop music, TV shows and movies = culture
America's culture is actually present all across the world.
In everything from the way we dress to the music we listen to.
I have heard people say that America has no culture, but i simply sigh at such a silly comment. It's not even something you can defend, it's just factually not true.
Quantity = Quality assumption....
America produces a great deal of these things but it also produces the best.
America for example has produced "The Wire" which dwarfs anything the rest of the world has ever produced in terms of television productions.
Assumption two is that pop music, TV shows and movies = culture
If America did not have a culture the government wouldn't be able to steer them. The US is a huge country, and diversity in moral values exists in all the states. It may not have a single overwhelming majority across all the states, but neither does Russia or China. And to say that China does not have a culture would be pretty outrageous. They may not have a long history like European countries, but is that really a requirement to culture? I wouldn't say so.
It's probably just an uneducated European that shouts that kind of bull just in the name of being anti-america.
On January 21 2012 18:00 Chaosvuistje wrote: If America did not have a culture the government wouldn't be able to steer them. The US is a huge country, and diversity in moral values exists in all the states. It may not have a single overwhelming majority across all the states, but neither does Russia or China. And to say that China does not have a culture would be pretty outrageous. They may not have a long history like European countries, but is that really a requirement to culture? I wouldn't say so.
It's probably just an uneducated European that shouts that kind of bull just in the name of being anti-america.
Irony has it that China actually undertook a very severe attempt at destroying it's own culture.
On January 21 2012 18:00 zalz wrote: America's culture is actually present all across the world.
In everything from the way we dress to the music we listen to.
I have heard people say that America has no culture, but i simply sigh at such a silly comment. It's not even something you can defend, it's just factually not true.
Assumption two is that pop music, TV shows and movies = culture
They are.
Well I meant that pop art doesn't equate to total culture, it occupies one segment of culture and it derives from maintstream and is rather rudimentary. Anyways goodnight (ON MY END) my fellow insomniac, get some rest
Usually, the criticism of America "having no culture" is on the basis of the "average American".
And even if, from a rational point of view, I know for sure that American has indeed a rich and vivid culture, things like Fox News blatantly spreading lies, close-mindedness about different form of economic conceptions, religion playing a major role in the political scene, evolution considered a theory in spite of blatant scientific proofs and so on, is making me doubt about the quality of American culture, culture being "the common background of knowledge, value and rites shared among the whole population".
Moreover, without being an elitist prick, can I say that American has an uncontested domination in terms of mainstream and pop culture (movies, pop music, etc...) but may not be the best reference in terms of "high culture"?
On January 21 2012 18:00 zalz wrote: America's culture is actually present all across the world.
In everything from the way we dress to the music we listen to.
I have heard people say that America has no culture, but i simply sigh at such a silly comment. It's not even something you can defend, it's just factually not true.
Quantity = Quality assumption....
America produces a great deal of these things but it also produces the best.
America for example has produced "The Wire" which dwarfs anything the rest of the world has ever produced in terms of television productions.
Assumption two is that pop music, TV shows and movies = culture
They are.
Well I meant that pop art doesn't equate to total culture, it occupies one segment of culture and it derives from maintstream and is rather rudimentary. Anyways goodnight my fellow insomniac, get some rest
Dutch people are waking up, we work whilst you sleep.
On January 21 2012 18:00 zalz wrote: America's culture is actually present all across the world.
In everything from the way we dress to the music we listen to.
I have heard people say that America has no culture, but i simply sigh at such a silly comment. It's not even something you can defend, it's just factually not true.
Quantity = Quality assumption....
America produces a great deal of these things but it also produces the best.
America for example has produced "The Wire" which dwarfs anything the rest of the world has ever produced in terms of television productions.
Assumption two is that pop music, TV shows and movies = culture
They are.
Well I meant that pop art doesn't equate to total culture, it occupies one segment of culture and it derives from maintstream and is rather rudimentary. Anyways goodnight my fellow insomniac, get some rest
Dutch people are waking up, we work whilst you sleep.
:S I just thought you stayed awake through the night, well good morning then.
On January 21 2012 18:00 Chaosvuistje wrote: If America did not have a culture the government wouldn't be able to steer them. The US is a huge country, and diversity in moral values exists in all the states. It may not have a single overwhelming majority across all the states, but neither does Russia or China. And to say that China does not have a culture would be pretty outrageous. They may not have a long history like European countries, but is that really a requirement to culture? I wouldn't say so.
It's probably just an uneducated European that shouts that kind of bull just in the name of being anti-america.
Irony has it that China actually undertook a very severe attempt at destroying it's own culture.
Currently China very much embraces its culture and its past.
Nevertheless, elements of traditional Chinese culture will always survive in Taiwan, Japan, and Korea. Sometimes Chinese culture is preserved more in those countries than in mainland China itself.
On January 21 2012 17:36 christophequirion wrote: In numerous languages, culture = tradition and\or knowledge. American popular culture is the world most dominant culture by far. Very few people disagree. But the common cliché is that people living in USA are poorly informed, aware of what is happening in the rest of the world + lack of basic general knowledge (even the political "elites", CF the Republican primaries).
Capital of Morocco ? Speaking 3 languages ? year of gutenberg printing press invention ? Polical parties in India ? Basis of Kant's Philosophy ? Name of the President of China ?....
I see the general point you're trying to make, but who mandated that those specific questions are the "general knowledge" that everyone should know? They are very biased toward the social sciences and history. To be frank, the answers to them have little relevance to most people's everyday lives, so it's a little unfair that you expect everyone to have the same level of interest in the subject as you do. Unless you formally studied history or are interested in the topic of history as a hobby (or maybe planning on being on Jeopardy), how many people actually recall the year the printing press was invented? Or the political parties in India? Sure, we may have briefly memorized it for an exam in high school, but I don't know too many people that would still remember it. Furthermore, I wouldn't deem such people uneducated or unrefined because of it. That would just be pretentious.
Forgive my ignorance for I have no expertise in the field of anthropology (study of culture). I'm only two weeks into the cultural anthropology course at my university, but to base the United States' culture off the longevity of its lifespan is ridiculous. Culture is dynamic; that is to say that it doesn't matter what happened in the past. True, the traditions may not have lasted as long as Asian, European, and Middle Eastern customs, but to deny America's culture is simply ridiculous. Even the American "accent" is a culture, and the idioms that separate American English to English spoken in other parts of the world give credit that America has "grown" much differently than anywhere else in the world. The only real way for you to experience the culture is to come over and see it for yourself. I get culture shock just from visiting other parts of the nation. Yeah, America is a multicultural society, and immigrants directly bring their traditions, causing a "melting pot" society, but even that is a misnomer. Usually, these immigrants stay within their own culture, so instead of a conglomerated mixture of many cultures, you get many, distinct subcultures. It's more of a "mixed salad bowl" culture. You have your "lettuce", "tomatoes", "cucumbers", etc etc. Does that take away from America being America? No. It makes America what it is. It's a culture that thrives on opportunity, and quite frankly, that means a lot of other people want to come and test their luck.
I think USA as a very strong culture but compared to a lot of other cultures, it's not even close to be as huge. Don't forget USA is a 300 years old country. Most of your culture comes from others. That's what i love the most i think.
It's not a bad thing to not have an old culture, sometimes you don't get the shit other have.
Of course the USA has culture. Just because several people might not like the US government or even the attitude of its people doesn't mean they can deny that several significant things have originated from there in its very short lifetime as a nation. I actually have heard a few people say "the USA has no culture" a few times, and I'm not even sure where it comes from. Maybe because not *every* American person likes/does the exact same thing? That'd be nonsense, because I'm pretty sure not every Frenchman likes wine.
PS: Wasn't baseball heavily influenced from a sport played in Britain? I know it became what it is today in the USA probably enough to be called an American invention, but if what I know about it's previous iteration is correct, I think it's unfair to say baseball is a purely American sport without at least explaining one's reasoning in parenthesis. I'll give you basketball, but it's not 100% clear itself.
America literally exports its culture. There is Coca-Cola and McDonald's in nearly every country on earth. Anyone who thinks we have no culture is incredibly stupid.
Next time post a valid example of the other side of the argument. Right now this is "someone said something stupid on the internet so I made a post saying he was wrong"
On January 21 2012 18:00 Chaosvuistje wrote: If America did not have a culture the government wouldn't be able to steer them. The US is a huge country, and diversity in moral values exists in all the states. It may not have a single overwhelming majority across all the states, but neither does Russia or China. And to say that China does not have a culture would be pretty outrageous. They may not have a long history like European countries, but is that really a requirement to culture? I wouldn't say so.
It's probably just an uneducated European that shouts that kind of bull just in the name of being anti-america.
Irony has it that China actually undertook a very severe attempt at destroying it's own culture.
Currently China very much embraces its culture and its past.
Nevertheless, elements of traditional Chinese culture will always survive in Taiwan, Japan, and Korea. Sometimes Chinese culture is preserved more in those countries than in mainland China itself.
I know, but it's amusing to realize that not even 50 years ago they were tearing down any link to the past they could get their hands on whilst many consider them so deeply cultural.
I think, when people are saying "Americans have no culture", they actually mean to say "Americans dont give a shit what happened or happens outside of the US (and this is a bad thing)".
America definitely has a culture, but in terms of complexity and depth, it cannot come close to the rest of the more deep rooted cultures, simply because it's a relatively new country. However, it is very good at marketing its own culture. For example I'm a Turk living in Istanbul, and I regularly see people prepare a small christmas tree for the new year, especially in wealthy, upper class families. Ofcourse this isn't widespread, as Istanbul is a different case, sort of like America, a patchwork of many cultures (Islam, Ottoman, Greek, Armenia(you'd be surprised how many dishes in Turkish cuisine originate from Armenia) and certainly the Western culture ) You'd be an outcast if you did that in some rural Anatolian town.
1st: good point 2nd: that just a proof for every negative stereotype there is, how an earth does this help your cause? 3rd: good point 4th: ohm, okey, other nations erected more significant monuments hundreds years before, without any modern technology 5th: if that's thanksgiving night meal i just wanna inform you that's just an adoptation of harvest-celebrating holidays which are around since forever
I'm not saying that Americans are cultureless, ofc they arent, but you make a pretty weak cause imo
On January 21 2012 17:36 christophequirion wrote: In numerous languages, culture = tradition and\or knowledge. American popular culture is the world most dominant culture by far. Very few people disagree. But the common cliché is that people living in USA are poorly informed, aware of what is happening in the rest of the world + lack of basic general knowledge (even the political "elites", CF the Republican primaries).
Capital of Morocco ? Speaking 3 languages ? year of gutenberg printing press invention ? Polical parties in India ? Basis of Kant's Philosophy ? Name of the President of China ?....
On January 21 2012 18:42 g. wrote: you do realise that baseball wasnt created in America?
this
On January 21 2012 18:41 Geo.Rion wrote: 1st: good point 2nd: that just a proof for every negative stereotype there is, how an earth does this help your cause? 3rd: good point 4th: ohm, okey, other nations erected more significant monuments hundreds years before, without any modern technology 5th: if that's thanksgiving night meal i just wanna inform you that's just an adoptation of harvest-celebrating holidays which are around since forever
I'm not saying that Americans are cultureless, ofc they arent, but you make a pretty weak cause imo
this
On January 21 2012 18:39 Bleak wrote: America definitely has a culture, but in terms of complexity and depth, it cannot come close to the rest of the more deep rooted cultures, simply because it's a relatively new country. However, it is very good at marketing its own culture. For example I'm a Turk living in Istanbul, and I regularly see people prepare a small christmas tree for the new year, especially in wealthy, upper class families. Ofcourse this isn't widespread, as Istanbul is a different case, sort of like America, a patchwork of many cultures (Islam, Ottoman, Greek, Armenia(you'd be surprised how many dishes in Turkish cuisine originate from Armenia) and certainly the Western culture ) You'd be an outcast if you did that in some rural Anatolian town.
Hm, don't really know why america has no culture. I can see that the united states of america has no (deep) history, which is certainly true, but culture...? maybe people posting this are mixing things up in their mind.
edit: maybe they are talking about cultural things which arise from hundreds of years of history? (like opera in italy and china)
On January 21 2012 18:00 Chaosvuistje wrote: If America did not have a culture the government wouldn't be able to steer them. The US is a huge country, and diversity in moral values exists in all the states. It may not have a single overwhelming majority across all the states, but neither does Russia or China. And to say that China does not have a culture would be pretty outrageous. They may not have a long history like European countries, but is that really a requirement to culture? I wouldn't say so.
It's probably just an uneducated European that shouts that kind of bull just in the name of being anti-america.
Irony has it that China actually undertook a very severe attempt at destroying it's own culture.
Currently China very much embraces its culture and its past.
Nevertheless, elements of traditional Chinese culture will always survive in Taiwan, Japan, and Korea. Sometimes Chinese culture is preserved more in those countries than in mainland China itself.
I know, but it's amusing to realize that not even 50 years ago they were tearing down any link to the past they could get their hands on whilst many consider them so deeply cultural.
It's all in the name of uniting people under your control. It is difficult to control people with many different values and standards, so you eliminate or grow certain groups so your target audience is easier to reach media/propaganda wise.
It's about as amusing as the pro-russian campaigns during the second world war on the american side, trying to make Russia feel as America's brother in arms. And then when the war was over, flipping around into anti-communism. All within a couple of years.
But I'm getting quite off topic here.
To the people that don't regard American culture as 'high quality', can you explain to me the standard of culture? Where is the high score table which says your culture has now gotten X extra points and is now regarded a sophisticated culture? Because juding a culture based on it's complexity is about as meaningful as judging art based on how aestetically beautiful it is.
The statement America has no culture is baseless. In fact every other culture has assimilated main aspects of americas culture and now cant see the differences to them because they have adopted it.
The reason we hate most of you people is because of people saying "lol everybody mad jelly we #1 greatest country in da world god loves us most" and actually using this type of thinking to decide your public policy, such as thinking you have the right to invade foreign nations as "pre-emptive strikes" (also called aggression or hostile invasion), using your political and economic influence to enforce legislation in other nations(See: Spanish/Irish versions of SOPA), and attempting to apply US law as world law(Julian Assange can't be a traitor if he's not American.)
This coupled with a majority's total ignorance of world geography, understanding foreign cultures (or even caring about them) and not learning a second language really paints a poor picture of America. And while we understand there are people who aren't conditioned to this type of behavior, it is a minority, and thus cannot be called representative of U.S. cultural norms(Since they fall outside the norm).
As long as people like Terranist are around, vocal about their uneducated opinions, and they form a large majority of U.S. citizens, the rest of the world will continue to hate you. Whether it's because of a lack of culture or because of your culture, that exact type of behavior needs to end.
I don't think anyone really believes that America has no culture. Some people might say it however, to state a point by exaggerating. It's not so much the age of American culture which sometimes makes it look rather dubious to Europeans (many European traditions are from the 18th or 19th century aswell while only a few are really ancient), but rather the way it's made up and spread. It sometimes looks like you take the cultural traditions and heritages from many different countries, mix them all together without really having a deep understanding of them and then have big companies marketing them agressively all over the world to make tons of money. This makes American culture look somewhat shallow and superficial from time to time to Europeans (which doesn't mean that we don't 'consume' it though ). A good recent example is the new film ''The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo''. There is a great Swedish version of the very succesful Stieg Larsson novel which is only 3 years old. But instead of just watching it like the rest of world, Americans need to remake it just a few years after the original film has been broadcast.
I know however, that there are several genuine American traditions, which are taken very seriously by many Americans and don't fit into that concept of superficial, commercial rip-off.
On January 21 2012 19:21 HoldenR wrote: The reason we hate most of you people is because of people saying "lol everybody mad jelly we #1 greatest country in da world god loves us most" and actually using this type of thinking to decide your public policy, such as thinking you have the right to invade foreign nations as "pre-emptive strikes" (also called aggression or hostile invasion), using your political and economic influence to enforce legislation in other nations(See: Spanish/Irish versions of SOPA), and attempting to apply US law as world law(Julian Assange can't be a traitor if he's not American.)
I don't recall the US ever having put Jualian Assange on trial as a traitor.
This coupled with a majority's total ignorance of world geography, understanding foreign cultures (or even caring about them) and not learning a second language really paints a poor picture of America. And while we understand there are people who aren't conditioned to this type of behavior, it is a minority, and thus cannot be called representative of U.S. cultural norms(Since they fall outside the norm).
Let's be honest.
The vast majority of Dutch people couldn't find Saudi-Arabia on a map if their life depended on it.
The fact that you can speak english is entirely the result of the power of American culture. You force yourself to learn it because otherwise you couldn't enjoy games and movies to the degree that you can now. American's don't have that. There is no powerfull dutch culture to project and force them to learn dutch.
I think you won't find many people speaking two languages in the UK either.
As long as people like Terranist are around, vocal about their uneducated opinions, and they form a large majority of U.S. citizens, the rest of the world will continue to hate you. Whether it's because of a lack of culture or because of your culture, that exact type of behavior needs to end.
People hate the US so they connect negative traits to it. They are bad, therefore they are stupid. It's not the other way around.
On January 21 2012 19:26 Falan wrote: I don't think anyone really believes that America has no culture. Some people might say it however, to state a point by exaggerating. It's not so much the age of American culture which sometimes makes it look rather dubious to Europeans (many European traditions are from the 18th or 19th century aswell while only a few are really ancient), but rather the way it's made up and spread. It sometimes looks like you take the cultural traditions and heritages from many different countries, mix them all together without really having a deep understanding of them and then have big companies marketing them agressively all over the world to make tons of money. This makes American culture look somewhat shallow and superficial from time to time to Europeans (which doesn't mean that we don't 'consume' it though ). A good recent example is the new film ''The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo''. There is a great Swedish version of the very succesful Stieg Larsson novel which is only 3 years old. But instead of just watching it like the rest of world, Americans need to remake it just a few years after the original film has been broadcast.
I know however, that there are several genuine American traditions, which are taken very seriously by many Americans and don't fit into that concept of superficial, commercial rip-off.
The thing is, even people trolling America are being hypocritical. I'm pretty sure the same people saying America has no culture are the same people who say Americans are stupid/fat, which is really an aspect of a culture you're perceiving. Let it be unsaid whether or not there's truth to the statement, the reason you feel Americans as a group are X/Y is because of a stereotype you hold, and that stereotype can't be created without a difference in culture.
I just loooooooooove americans culture of fastfoods and football!!!
NOT.
Same logic as most people post here: "LULZ, who thinkz americaz has no culture muST BE STUPID!!!!!11oneone EOT". It's not a valid argument. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Culture. Don't hate me, i'm not saying americans has no culture i just think its still kinda developing, mostly borrowed from old continent.
The fact is, that the US don't have their own culture, but instead has tons of different cultures, from other countries. Having created things isn't about culture, but what US has is a mix of many cultures, which is what you call assimilation. Saying US has no culture is lame, though no one here seems to think so, ''Nothingtosay'' just got that from.. no one knows.
Anyway, your arguments is quite bad aswell, having created some stuff has nothing to do with culture lol. But what US has is an assimilated culture based of... tons of other cultures
On January 21 2012 19:36 Deep89 wrote: I just loooooooooove americans culture of fastfoods and football!!!
NOT.
Same logic as most people post here: "LULZ, who thinkz americaz has no culture muST BE STUPID!!!!!11oneone EOT". It's not a valid argument. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Culture. Don't hate me, i'm not saying americans has no culture i just think its still kinda developing, mostly borrowed from old continent.
So wait. Just because you don't like football and fastfood, America has a "developing" culture from the old continent?
I didn't realize baseball was a multinational sport, lol. American football and baseball I thought were basically only played/cared about in the states.
On January 21 2012 19:36 Deep89 wrote: I just loooooooooove americans culture of fastfoods and football!!!
NOT.
Same logic as most people post here: "LULZ, who thinkz americaz has no culture muST BE STUPID!!!!!11oneone EOT". It's not a valid argument. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Culture. Don't hate me, i'm not saying americans has no culture i just think its still kinda developing, mostly borrowed from old continent.
So wait. Just because you don't like football and fastfood, America has a "developing" culture from the old continent?
Horrible argument.
The idea that you can't have culture becuase you don't have a nation with its roots roughly 700 or so years burred in the past is short minded. With that logic i can clam that the Internet produces no culture it's not old enough to, with thing crap that means a child cannot produce culture and that all culture cannot be created only culture is identified long after the fact, some sort of hipster i got culture?. There is no such thing as deep, refined or high culture. All those modifiers are just dickish for saying i don't like country XXX
The statement Americans have no culture is silly I think. Serious question for Americans and other Europeans: Is it required of students to learn poems by heart and present it in front of their class?
On January 21 2012 19:58 dubRa wrote: The statement Americans have no culture is silly I think. Serious question for Americans and other Europeans: Is it required of students to learn poems by heart and present it in front of their class?
Poetry doesn't even get taught in the Netherlands. No, not even as a part of literature.
There's a saying that goes "We are standing on the shoulders of giants." Every culture builds upon those that came before it. America has done this, England has done it, China has done it, etc. I've heard the saying "Americans have not culture" but it's not a collective thing people say. It's elitists and nationalists that say it.
Interesting fact: Paris is considered the epitome of sophisticated cities to japanese citizens. However, when they visit Paris they come to find out the city and it's people don't live up to the stereotype. The result is masses of Japanese tourists returning to Japan severly depressed at the sort of reverse-culture shock. It's so bad, Japan has a 24-hr hotline at it's embassy in Paris you can call to get counseling for what's been called "Paris Syndrome."
I would have to agree with HoldenR and Falan...they do make a point. And the thing about Americans lacking culture...i honestly don't think you can compare America to Europe/Asia... Countries that invented printing press, Renaissance etc to America. Maybe because of relatively young of age of America or maybe it's just different approach to some values in life or maybe it's just that consumerism and recycling of foreign "culture" (and by that i mean primarily movies; ''The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo'' is best example.)
@zalz: the fact that i/a lot of people in the world can speak english i would actually contribute to England and it's expansionism, but i do agree on the part that no one forces americans to learn some other language/get to know some other culture (although if they actually put some effort in they could because their first neighbor is Mexico which, i hope we can all agree on this, has some very vivid and interesting culture...the thing is that they just refuse it) and about the aforementioned movie, might i ask who wrote those reviews? I know this is completely subjectional, but after watching both versions i would have to disagree with critics. Swedish version is much better, at least to me. But on the other hand I always like originals more than remakes.
On January 21 2012 19:52 Starshaped wrote: I didn't realize baseball was a multinational sport, lol. American football and baseball I thought were basically only played/cared about in the states.
Baseball is huge in Japan. But he didn't say football was multinational, he said baseball and basketball, and while both sports are very very minor in most countries, at least you play them, I would be surprised to find any European who didn't play basketball in school during gym class or such.
On January 21 2012 19:58 dubRa wrote: The statement Americans have no culture is silly I think. Serious question for Americans and other Europeans: Is it required of students to learn poems by heart and present it in front of their class?
Poetry doesn't even get taught in the Netherlands. No, not even as a part of literature.
That seems very odd. Is there a reason for that? ;o
On January 21 2012 16:44 Chro wrote: America doesn't really have a culture. One of the main parts of culture is how/why you do something. In america the only reason you do something is because of money. Its all about business and efficiency. Its why everyone sees us as jerks and cocky bastards, because that's what our business culture brings us up as when we're young.
As opposed to Europe, where they do everything for waffles. They can't get enough waffles. I heard there was a huge waffle shortage in Greece recently, and a lot of the countries that surrounded Greece didn't want to give their waffles up to help the waffleless.
On January 21 2012 19:52 Starshaped wrote: I didn't realize baseball was a multinational sport, lol. American football and baseball I thought were basically only played/cared about in the states.
Baseball is huge in Japan. But he didn't say football was multinational, he said baseball and basketball, and while both sports are very very minor in most countries, at least you play them, I would be surprised to find any European who didn't play basketball in school during gym class or such.
I wouldn't say basketball is minor in most countries at all. I would imagine it is the most popular indoor sport in Europe by some margin.
Baseball is a whole different matter, I can't really tell why it was put in the same basket (pardon the pun) with basketball in the OP.
On January 21 2012 16:51 KimJongChill wrote: They probably mean to say that America lacks cultural refinement.
This. Some of the things you see as american culture might still be seen as just a "trend" whilst other countries have had time to grow and evolve several cultural aspects.
I can just imagine someone sitting around in his/her jeans smoking tabacco saying America has no culture on the internet. Maybe after they say it they will reward themselves with a coke or something while they phone their friend.
People just take our culture and then cant seem to find ours because they made it part of their own.
On a side note I lol'd at the people who say that its dumb that "Lots of Americans think that evolution is a theory." It is a theory.... so is gravity. Try looking up what a scientific theory means. Also the guy who posted a video of dumb Americans, you could make the same video in any country.
My guess of where this veiw comes from is the stereotypical veiw of the way history/geography in american schools is taught: with a large emphisis on american values and all presesnted in a pro-america way.
On January 21 2012 19:58 dubRa wrote: The statement Americans have no culture is silly I think. Serious question for Americans and other Europeans: Is it required of students to learn poems by heart and present it in front of their class?
England here, the english GCSE (exam for 16 year olds) requires study of 3 clusters of poems: one is poems from different cultures, the second is pre-1914 poems with poets like Ben johnson, Charles Tichborne and Shakespeare and the last was post-1914 peoms, with poets like Carol anne Duffy and Simon Armitage.
On January 21 2012 19:58 dubRa wrote: The statement Americans have no culture is silly I think. Serious question for Americans and other Europeans: Is it required of students to learn poems by heart and present it in front of their class?
it's a very different kind of challenge then the usual tests/homeworks, it kinda forces you to deal with stage fright and such. I hated it a lot though
@medzo: jeans is debatable being American (Levi Strauss, you know what i mean) but tobacco would be more of an native Americans "thing", unless you count them in modern day understanding of American culture, but that would make any debate/discussion silly and would unfortunately exclude all the things immigrants have done (in a way, i f you know what i mean)
OP I don't think you understand what people mean when they make that statement. They're not saying that Americans as a people haven't got a unique culture. What they're saying is that Americans tend to be less cultivated (ie possess less knowledge) about the rest of the world than your average individual
I fail to see how anything -except of jazz- mentioned in OP should be an argument against "americans have no culture". You can argue about semantics (or maybe that's the point of the thread?), but if someone asks about american culture and you mention american football, he will probably think you're joking.
Here is a list of the dates of the formation of every country that exists in the world.
The United States is the oldest country in the America's. Older than Brazil, Mexico, Argentina, etc. But most people would say these countries have more culture than the US. Why? Most of their modern day citizens are also descendants from other places, i.e Spain, Africa, etc..
The Unites States of America is also older than the following countries in Europe: Germany, Austria, Belgium, Finland, Hungary, Netherlands, Norway, Sweden, Switzerland to name a few. In fact, the US is actually older than most European countries.
So you see, if you want to base culture on when the country was formed, then the US actually has one of the most cultured countries in the world...
The only reason why people say countries in Europe have more culture is because those countries were formed from people that had customs and cultural identities from many years before.
Here is a link for the people who make fun of Americans who use the word "soccer." The term was in fact used in British society along with the word "football" to describe the game many many years ago. The word subsequently fell out of favor and "football" was later used predominantly.
On January 21 2012 19:52 Starshaped wrote: I didn't realize baseball was a multinational sport, lol. American football and baseball I thought were basically only played/cared about in the states.
Baseball is huge in Japan. But he didn't say football was multinational, he said baseball and basketball, and while both sports are very very minor in most countries, at least you play them, I would be surprised to find any European who didn't play basketball in school during gym class or such.
I wouldn't say basketball is minor in most countries at all. I would imagine it is the most popular indoor sport in Europe by some margin.
Baseball is a whole different matter, I can't really tell why it was put in the same basket (pardon the pun) with basketball in the OP.
Basketball isn't even close to handball, which is far more likely to be the most popular indoor sport in Europe.
Here is a list of the dates of the formation of every country that exists in the world.
The United States is the oldest country in the America's. Older than Brazil, Mexico, Argentina, etc. But most people would say these countries have more culture than the US. Why? Most of their modern day citizens are also descendants from other places, i.e Spain, Africa, etc..
The Unites States of America is also older than the following countries in Europe: Germany, Austria, Belgium, Finland, Hungary, Netherlands, Norway, Sweden, Switzerland to name a few. In fact, the US is actually older than most European countries.
So you see, if you want to base culture on when the country was formed, then the US actually has one of the most cultured countries in the world...
The only reason why people say countries in Europe have more culture is because those countries were formed from people that had customs and cultural identities from many years before.
Excuse me, did you just claim USA is older than Sweden? Sweden became sweden when gustav vasa was crowned king, which was in 1523. Please explain to me how USA is even close?
On January 21 2012 19:52 Starshaped wrote: I didn't realize baseball was a multinational sport, lol. American football and baseball I thought were basically only played/cared about in the states.
Baseball is huge in Japan. But he didn't say football was multinational, he said baseball and basketball, and while both sports are very very minor in most countries, at least you play them, I would be surprised to find any European who didn't play basketball in school during gym class or such.
I wouldn't say basketball is minor in most countries at all. I would imagine it is the most popular indoor sport in Europe by some margin.
Baseball is a whole different matter, I can't really tell why it was put in the same basket (pardon the pun) with basketball in the OP.
Basketball isn't even close to handball, which is far more likely to be the most popular indoor sport in Europe.
There is Europe outside of Scandinavia.
That said, in all honesty I'm actually not sure off the top of my head that basketball is more popular. But intuitively it does seem to be the case considering most of eastern Europe, Russia, Turkey, etc.
On January 21 2012 20:30 ondik wrote: I fail to see how anything -except of jazz- mentioned in OP should be an argument against "americans have no culture". You can argue about semantics (or maybe that's the point of the thread?), but if someone asks about american culture and you mention american football, he will probably think you're joking.
Why is it that I've never seen a Czech say anything neutral or pro American? Only negative. Did we do something to you guys? I'm genuinely curious. I have nothing against your nation, it even has a cool name. It just seems like our nations should have no reason to oppose one another.
On January 21 2012 20:27 Kotreb wrote: @medzo: jeans is debatable being American (Levi Strauss, you know what i mean) but tobacco would be more of an native Americans "thing", unless you count them in modern day understanding of American culture, but that would make any debate/discussion silly and would unfortunately exclude all the things immigrants have done (in a way, i f you know what i mean)
No I dont really follow you. Native Americans play a big part of American culture.
Levi Strauss became an American and then he made Levi jeans in California. Since jeans were produced and made popular in America, I consider it American.
On January 21 2012 20:30 ondik wrote: I fail to see how anything -except of jazz- mentioned in OP should be an argument against "americans have no culture". You can argue about semantics (or maybe that's the point of the thread?), but if someone asks about american culture and you mention american football, he will probably think you're joking.
Why would American Football not be part of American culture?
On January 21 2012 20:30 False_Peace wrote: The Unites States of America is also older than the following countries in Europe: Germany, Austria, Belgium, Finland, Hungary, Netherlands, Norway, Sweden, Switzerland to name a few. In fact, the US is actually older than most European countries.
While obviously not true to begin with, I'd just like to address my own country: 1523-06-06 That's the formation of "Sweden". Even then, Sweden existed before that, in less clear forms.
The fact is that America has no heritage older than about 300 years not counting the Indians.
Lastly, the "America has no culture" thing is a jab from Europeans at their ally and friend and counting other former colonies therefore becomes quite silly.
Here is a list of the dates of the formation of every country that exists in the world.
The United States is the oldest country in the America's. Older than Brazil, Mexico, Argentina, etc. But most people would say these countries have more culture than the US. Why? Most of their modern day citizens are also descendants from other places, i.e Spain, Africa, etc..
The Unites States of America is also older than the following countries in Europe: Germany, Austria, Belgium, Finland, Hungary, Netherlands, Norway, Sweden, Switzerland to name a few. In fact, the US is actually older than most European countries.
So you see, if you want to base culture on when the country was formed, then the US actually has one of the most cultured countries in the world...
The only reason why people say countries in Europe have more culture is because those countries were formed from people that had customs and cultural identities from many years before.
stop saying things that are wrong:
Sweden 1523-06-06 Gustav Vasa elected King of Sweden and marking a definite secession from the Kalmar Union. Vatican City 1274 Birth of current form of government the Papal conclave in 1274 Norway 872 King Harald I of Norway unifies the Petty kingdoms of Norway.
And now look at the United States of America :
United States 1787-09-17 Ratification of the United States Constitution replaced the previous Articles of Confederation creating a new system of government.
Here is a list of the dates of the formation of every country that exists in the world.
The United States is the oldest country in the America's. Older than Brazil, Mexico, Argentina, etc. But most people would say these countries have more culture than the US. Why? Most of their modern day citizens are also descendants from other places, i.e Spain, Africa, etc..
The Unites States of America is also older than the following countries in Europe: Germany, Austria, Belgium, Finland, Hungary, Netherlands, Norway, Sweden, Switzerland to name a few. In fact, the US is actually older than most European countries.
So you see, if you want to base culture on when the country was formed, then the US actually has one of the most cultured countries in the world...
The only reason why people say countries in Europe have more culture is because those countries were formed from people that had customs and cultural identities from many years before.
Excuse me, did you just claim USA is older than Sweden? Sweden became sweden when gustav vasa was crowned king, which was in 1523. Please explain to me how USA is even close?
Sorry, the Sweden reference was a mistake. Sweden was in fact created in 1523 as you say, so it is older. However I believe my point is still valid that The United States is an older country than the majority of most European countries and all of North and South America.
On January 21 2012 17:38 Streltsy wrote: I love how prejudiced idiots always point out age as a sort of measure of culture, considering that many countries in Europe only formed ~200 years ago as well. Many of the traditions and practices which cultures now identify themselves by were invented along with the concept of "nation" (which is rather new) during the 19th century. ex. Italy, Germany
Germany as a cultural nation is way older than Germany itself, there have been german countries for hundreds of years which shared a common culture and some of them don't even belong to germany today. Best example: Austria Our cultures are pretty much the same and a little bit lesser extent our history too. Goethe lived in a time where there was no UNIFIED Germany, but when he said German people knew what he ment. Try educating yourself a bit before saying something like that.
Here is a list of the dates of the formation of every country that exists in the world.
The United States is the oldest country in the America's. Older than Brazil, Mexico, Argentina, etc. But most people would say these countries have more culture than the US. Why? Most of their modern day citizens are also descendants from other places, i.e Spain, Africa, etc..
The Unites States of America is also older than the following countries in Europe: Germany, Austria, Belgium, Finland, Hungary, Netherlands, Norway, Sweden, Switzerland to name a few. In fact, the US is actually older than most European countries.
So you see, if you want to base culture on when the country was formed, then the US actually has one of the most cultured countries in the world...
The only reason why people say countries in Europe have more culture is because those countries were formed from people that had customs and cultural identities from many years before.
stop saying things that are wrong:
Sweden 1523-06-06 Gustav Vasa elected King of Sweden and marking a definite secession from the Kalmar Union. Vatican City 1274 Birth of current form of government the Papal conclave in 1274 Norway 872 King Harald I of Norway unifies the Petty kingdoms of Norway.
And now look at the United States of America :
United States 1787-09-17 Ratification of the United States Constitution replaced the previous Articles of Confederation creating a new system of government.
And guess what? Who discover america? European
The natives discovered America about an eternity before Europeans discovered the world wasn't flat. Not Europeans. Europeans were, not ironically, the imperialist jackasses who committed genocide so they could claim land.
Here is a list of the dates of the formation of every country that exists in the world.
The United States is the oldest country in the America's. Older than Brazil, Mexico, Argentina, etc. But most people would say these countries have more culture than the US. Why? Most of their modern day citizens are also descendants from other places, i.e Spain, Africa, etc..
The Unites States of America is also older than the following countries in Europe: Germany, Austria, Belgium, Finland, Hungary, Netherlands, Norway, Sweden, Switzerland to name a few. In fact, the US is actually older than most European countries.
So you see, if you want to base culture on when the country was formed, then the US actually has one of the most cultured countries in the world...
The only reason why people say countries in Europe have more culture is because those countries were formed from people that had customs and cultural identities from many years before.
Here is a link for the people who make fun of Americans who use the word "soccer." The term was in fact used in British society along with the word "football" to describe the game many many years ago. The word subsequently fell out of favor and "football" was later used predominantly.
You link to a wiki article that says the Netherlands was formed in 1578, then you say the U.S. is older than the Netherlands.
Here is a list of the dates of the formation of every country that exists in the world.
The United States is the oldest country in the America's. Older than Brazil, Mexico, Argentina, etc. But most people would say these countries have more culture than the US. Why? Most of their modern day citizens are also descendants from other places, i.e Spain, Africa, etc..
The Unites States of America is also older than the following countries in Europe: Germany, Austria, Belgium, Finland, Hungary, Netherlands, Norway, Sweden, Switzerland to name a few. In fact, the US is actually older than most European countries.
So you see, if you want to base culture on when the country was formed, then the US actually has one of the most cultured countries in the world...
The only reason why people say countries in Europe have more culture is because those countries were formed from people that had customs and cultural identities from many years before.
Excuse me, did you just claim USA is older than Sweden? Sweden became sweden when gustav vasa was crowned king, which was in 1523. Please explain to me how USA is even close?
Sorry, the Sweden reference was a mistake. Sweden was in fact created in 1523 as you say, so it is older. However I believe my point is still valid that The United States is an older country than the majority of most European countries and all of North and South America.
Thing is, even if USA is an older country by technicallity than, say, Germany and Finland, it doesn't have any relevance. The group of people who formed Germany had been "germans" for many hundreds of years before the current modern country of Germany was formed. Finish people had their culture separate from Russians before they became autonomous. The same can't be said for USA, since before USA was formally formed, it was just angry englishmen.
On January 21 2012 20:30 False_Peace wrote: The Unites States of America is also older than the following countries in Europe: Germany, Austria, Belgium, Finland, Hungary, Netherlands, Norway, Sweden, Switzerland to name a few. In fact, the US is actually older than most European countries.
While obviously not true to begin with, I'd just like to address my own country: 1523-06-06 That's the formation of "Sweden". Even then, Sweden existed before that, in less clear forms.
The fact is that America has no heritage older than about 300 years not counting the Indians.
Lastly, the "America has no culture" thing is a jab from Europeans at their ally and friend and counting other former colonies therefore becomes quite silly.
"The actual age of the kingdom of Sweden is unknown. It depends mostly on whether Sweden should be considered a nation when the Svear (Sweonas) ruled Svealand or if the emergence of the nation started with the Svear and the Götar (Geats) of Götaland being united under one ruler. In the first case, Sweden was first mentioned as having one single ruler in the year 98 by Tacitus, but it is almost impossible to know for how long it had been this way. However, historians usually start the line of Swedish monarchs from when Svealand and Götaland were ruled under the same king, namely Erik the Victorious (Geat) and his son Olof Skötkonung in the 10th century. These events are often described as the consolidation of Sweden, although substantial areas were conquered and incorporated later."
Here is a list of the dates of the formation of every country that exists in the world.
The United States is the oldest country in the America's. Older than Brazil, Mexico, Argentina, etc. But most people would say these countries have more culture than the US. Why? Most of their modern day citizens are also descendants from other places, i.e Spain, Africa, etc..
The Unites States of America is also older than the following countries in Europe: Germany, Austria, Belgium, Finland, Hungary, Netherlands, Norway, Sweden, Switzerland to name a few. In fact, the US is actually older than most European countries.
So you see, if you want to base culture on when the country was formed, then the US actually has one of the most cultured countries in the world...
The only reason why people say countries in Europe have more culture is because those countries were formed from people that had customs and cultural identities from many years before.
Your post is kind of true. But I think the statement is meant as in US as a society is new, not necessarily as a political entity. Creation of Germany was not like creation of US, there was no sudden emergence of a whole new society on the ashes of aboriginal societies.
And to nitpick, Netherlands, Hungary, Norway, Sweden and Switzerland are much older than US even politically. You can even make case for Germany and even Austria. Only Finland and Belgium actually fit your statement.
As for the OP. I think saying that US has no culture is strange, but I agree that their culture feels bland and somewhat artificial. Maybe it is how there are no fixed points in there, I don't know , I did not go much deeper into that other than the feeling that I (and I think many other) have. For example architecture of buildings for habitation in US is, from my point of view, terrible. Industrial/business one is fine. But houses are the worst kind of kitsch imaginable. They just do not fit their surroundings at all and I think it has something to do with a lack of historical precedent as I see the same phenomena showing up in Europe recently.
On January 21 2012 20:30 False_Peace wrote: The Unites States of America is also older than the following countries in Europe: Germany, Austria, Belgium, Finland, Hungary, Netherlands, Norway, Sweden, Switzerland to name a few. In fact, the US is actually older than most European countries.
Please... Do not confuse the date of latest sovereignty with actual age of the country. You must also take into account the fact that most countries in Europe were losing and regaining their sovereignty numerous times over the years. It's not like when you lose sovereignty and then get it back you're suddenly a different country with new culture and everything.
Take Poland for example, since 960 (first date it appears as a sovereign country, not just a bunch of tribes) Poland has not only shifted its borders many times, it has also been taken apart by foreign countries at least 3 times, one of them resulting in Poland disappearing from the maps of the world entirely. Does it mean that the country is younger than USA? I don't think so.
USA didn't have to go through all the wars, dynastic politics and what not that European countries did. Check this out:
On January 21 2012 20:27 Kotreb wrote: @medzo: jeans is debatable being American (Levi Strauss, you know what i mean) but tobacco would be more of an native Americans "thing", unless you count them in modern day understanding of American culture, but that would make any debate/discussion silly and would unfortunately exclude all the things immigrants have done (in a way, i f you know what i mean)
No I dont really follow you. Native Americans play a big part of American culture.
Levi Strauss became an American and then he made Levi jeans in California. Since jeans were produced and made popular in America, I consider it American.
As in continent culture, than sure, but in terms of American culture as in people than you have to differentiate it because although they were defeated/enslaved/call it whatever you like i can't see any part of their culture incorporated into american culture after the arrival if immigrants. Correct me if i'm wrong please. The way i see it you can either use term culture and link it either towards indians or since the arrival of immigrants because these two cultures never really melted into one like what happened before the "conqured nations"...
edit: Croatia has been here since the beginning of the 7th century, and as a kingdom since the beginning of the 10th/late 9th century.
Here is a list of the dates of the formation of every country that exists in the world.
The United States is the oldest country in the America's. Older than Brazil, Mexico, Argentina, etc. But most people would say these countries have more culture than the US. Why? Most of their modern day citizens are also descendants from other places, i.e Spain, Africa, etc..
The Unites States of America is also older than the following countries in Europe: Germany, Austria, Belgium, Finland, Hungary, Netherlands, Norway, Sweden, Switzerland to name a few. In fact, the US is actually older than most European countries.
So you see, if you want to base culture on when the country was formed, then the US actually has one of the most cultured countries in the world...
The only reason why people say countries in Europe have more culture is because those countries were formed from people that had customs and cultural identities from many years before.
Here is a link for the people who make fun of Americans who use the word "soccer." The term was in fact used in British society along with the word "football" to describe the game many many years ago. The word subsequently fell out of favor and "football" was later used predominantly.
You sir have no idea what you talk about and just for you, I'm going to quote myself here:
On January 21 2012 20:42 SilentchiLL wrote:
Germany as a cultural nation is way older than Germany itself, there have been german countries for hundreds of years which shared a common culture and some of them don't even belong to germany today. Best example: Austria Our cultures are pretty much the same and a little bit lesser extent our history too. Goethe lived in a time where there was no UNIFIED Germany, but when he said German people knew what he ment. Try educating yourself a bit before saying something like that.
On January 21 2012 17:54 pavement ist rad wrote: Look at pop culture (music, movies, shows etc) in every single other country in the world and tell me they're not trying to be more like America. Culture is America's #1 export.
Quantity = Quality assumption....
Assumption two is that pop music, TV shows and movies = culture
I see this way too often in this thread. (Not that it's not a form of culture, but I wouldn't compare it to certain other things and feel good about myself afterwards)
Here is a list of the dates of the formation of every country that exists in the world.
The United States is the oldest country in the America's. Older than Brazil, Mexico, Argentina, etc. But most people would say these countries have more culture than the US. Why? Most of their modern day citizens are also descendants from other places, i.e Spain, Africa, etc..
The Unites States of America is also older than the following countries in Europe: Germany, Austria, Belgium, Finland, Hungary, Netherlands, Norway, Sweden, Switzerland to name a few. In fact, the US is actually older than most European countries.
So you see, if you want to base culture on when the country was formed, then the US actually has one of the most cultured countries in the world...
The only reason why people say countries in Europe have more culture is because those countries were formed from people that had customs and cultural identities from many years before.
Here is a link for the people who make fun of Americans who use the word "soccer." The term was in fact used in British society along with the word "football" to describe the game many many years ago. The word subsequently fell out of favor and "football" was later used predominantly.
how can USA be older than Netherlands? Did You know that New York was founded by the Dutch and the first name of that city was New Amsterdam?
"The Unites States of America is also older than the following countries in Europe: Germany, Austria, Belgium, Finland, Hungary, Netherlands, Norway, Sweden, Switzerland to name a few. In fact, the US is actually older than most European countries."
Epic statement, but the USA was founded by imigrants, imigrants from european countries, so how its possible that it's older then that countries?
It's just me or reaaaally in the USA people are learning like what happened every day in the USA since the XVIII century, but they dont now anything about european/asian history?
I think it depends on what you mean by culture. At face value, the statement that "Americans have no culture" is plainly wrong. If you are an American, all you have to do is go on a bit of travelling to see that. The OP provides a number of different examples of American culture. Further to that, a number of countries fear being "Americanised", which is clearly a statement that implicitly assume the existence of American culture. I suspect though, when people make that sort of statement, they either have in mind things like mediaeval European buildings, Pacific island nations, tribal colonies and ancient China, or they are merely expressing frustration at American egoism.
Does the age of a nation reflect on when the current form of government was developed? No.
That wikipedia article considered a nation a "cultural or ethnic grouping" which should be painfully obvious that the US's "cultural or ethnic grouping" is young compared to most other nations.
Here is a list of the dates of the formation of every country that exists in the world.
The United States is the oldest country in the America's. Older than Brazil, Mexico, Argentina, etc. But most people would say these countries have more culture than the US. Why? Most of their modern day citizens are also descendants from other places, i.e Spain, Africa, etc..
The Unites States of America is also older than the following countries in Europe: Germany, Austria, Belgium, Finland, Hungary, Netherlands, Norway, Sweden, Switzerland to name a few. In fact, the US is actually older than most European countries.
So you see, if you want to base culture on when the country was formed, then the US actually has one of the most cultured countries in the world...
The only reason why people say countries in Europe have more culture is because those countries were formed from people that had customs and cultural identities from many years before.
Here is a link for the people who make fun of Americans who use the word "soccer." The term was in fact used in British society along with the word "football" to describe the game many many years ago. The word subsequently fell out of favor and "football" was later used predominantly.
I'm sorry but that's stupid. The Republic of Turkey was founded on 1923, but its roots go back to 11th century, to the Oguz clanate of Turks coming to Anatolia. So it would be wrong and retarded to say that Republic of Turkey only is 88 years old and therefore US being older than it. Culture is something that is carried over throughout time and changes in time.
Here is a list of the dates of the formation of every country that exists in the world.
The United States is the oldest country in the America's. Older than Brazil, Mexico, Argentina, etc. But most people would say these countries have more culture than the US. Why? Most of their modern day citizens are also descendants from other places, i.e Spain, Africa, etc..
The Unites States of America is also older than the following countries in Europe: Germany, Austria, Belgium, Finland, Hungary, Netherlands, Norway, Sweden, Switzerland to name a few. In fact, the US is actually older than most European countries.
So you see, if you want to base culture on when the country was formed, then the US actually has one of the most cultured countries in the world...
The only reason why people say countries in Europe have more culture is because those countries were formed from people that had customs and cultural identities from many years before.
Here is a link for the people who make fun of Americans who use the word "soccer." The term was in fact used in British society along with the word "football" to describe the game many many years ago. The word subsequently fell out of favor and "football" was later used predominantly.
I'm sorry but that's stupid. The Republic of Turkey was founded on 1923, but its roots go back to 11th century, to the Oguz clanate of Turks coming to Anatolia. So it would be wrong and retarded to say that Republic of Turkey only is 88 years old.
He confused "age of latest political sovereignty" with "age of culture". Don't worry, he's the only person here who thinks this is true.
Here is a list of the dates of the formation of every country that exists in the world.
The United States is the oldest country in the America's. Older than Brazil, Mexico, Argentina, etc. But most people would say these countries have more culture than the US. Why? Most of their modern day citizens are also descendants from other places, i.e Spain, Africa, etc..
The Unites States of America is also older than the following countries in Europe: Germany, Austria, Belgium, Finland, Hungary, Netherlands, Norway, Sweden, Switzerland to name a few. In fact, the US is actually older than most European countries.
So you see, if you want to base culture on when the country was formed, then the US actually has one of the most cultured countries in the world...
The only reason why people say countries in Europe have more culture is because those countries were formed from people that had customs and cultural identities from many years before.
Here is a link for the people who make fun of Americans who use the word "soccer." The term was in fact used in British society along with the word "football" to describe the game many many years ago. The word subsequently fell out of favor and "football" was later used predominantly.
ohm, no, Hungary is Hungary officially since 1000 with the crowning of Stephen the first. It was a sovereign and acknowledged kingdom by all major actors of the time (other kingdoms and entites and the Catholic Church). Your source highlights 1989 which is ridiculous, yes, it became Republic of Hungary in that year, after the collapse of the USSR, but c'mon it's funny to even consider it.
Also, every single one of the European states mentioned existed way before the the USA, with a bit different name (or just the same). Maybe Germany, Norway and Finland can be considered "new" states since they existed in a very different form, but Sweden, Switzerland, Netherlands, Hungary are completely out of question
Actually, Sweden and the Netherlands had colonial establishments in the New World which later became the USA
Nice thread you Americans got here. I'm thinking of creating my own... Because sometimes when I'm on the internet people call me mad, when I'm actually not .
When I visited New York the one thing that really struck me was the lack of old buildings. The few 'old' buildings in Manhattan are only like 200 years old. Compared to most cities in Europe, where you can find buildings over 400 years old everywhere in the city centres, that's quite a shocker.
In Europe our culture comes from very old traditions, going back hundreds of years. The civilized United States simply aren't that old. To the guy above saying that the United States are older than most countries in Europe: the names of the countries may have changed, but we had people living here for thousands of years. When the Europeans came to America they killed all the inhabitants, thus destroying any culture that was going on there.
Here is a list of the dates of the formation of every country that exists in the world.
The United States is the oldest country in the America's. Older than Brazil, Mexico, Argentina, etc. But most people would say these countries have more culture than the US. Why? Most of their modern day citizens are also descendants from other places, i.e Spain, Africa, etc..
The Unites States of America is also older than the following countries in Europe: Germany, Austria, Belgium, Finland, Hungary, Netherlands, Norway, Sweden, Switzerland to name a few. In fact, the US is actually older than most European countries.
So you see, if you want to base culture on when the country was formed, then the US actually has one of the most cultured countries in the world...
The only reason why people say countries in Europe have more culture is because those countries were formed from people that had customs and cultural identities from many years before.
Excuse me, did you just claim USA is older than Sweden? Sweden became sweden when gustav vasa was crowned king, which was in 1523. Please explain to me how USA is even close?
Sorry, the Sweden reference was a mistake. Sweden was in fact created in 1523 as you say, so it is older. However I believe my point is still valid that The United States is an older country than the majority of most European countries and all of North and South America.
Not really. Countries in Europe that are clearly younger than US are : Latvia, Estonia, Finland, Belarus, Belgium, Malta, Slovenia and that is about it. You might add Romania, Italy, Slovakia, Moldova and Ukraine to the mix depending on your definitions.
Well, americans HAVE a culture. But its so new and most of it is borrowed. Also, the cultural elements are not deep. You cant write a book about only rituals in an american culturaş element. But you can write a whole book abou traditions in Turkish rugs or Turkish traditional clothes. They will have deep details and will also have a long history to form those shapes they even have connections with hittites or gobeklitepe, te first temple ever made.
By the "no culture", that means both that is an Europa 2.0 (better or worse, you choose). But that also means, that Americans knows less things than other people in the world, they're just less educated. I can't find the source, but i saw a study that showed that 3 out of 4 American can't tell where USA are on a USA-centered map.
There is an American culture per say, but it's not an original one, Melting pot maybe not the best term, but it's something similar.
people saying that a country doesn't have culture simply don't know what culture means. I've had a semester of different cultures on my university and what I learned is that people see culture way to shallow. Like 'american football' is part of the American culture, sure this is true but it goes a lot deeper than this. Culture is about how people in a country think about stuff for example tolerance. The average Dutch is very tolerant, that's what culture is about not whether you wear lederhosen or not.
Well, americans HAVE a culture. But its so new and most of it is borrowed. Also, the cultural elements are not deep. You cant write a book about only rituals in an american culturaş element. But you can write a whole book abou traditions in Turkish rugs or Turkish traditional clothes. They will have deep details and will also have a long history to form those shapes they even have connections with hittites or gobeklitepe, te first temple ever made.
On January 21 2012 20:55 Khenra wrote: When I visited New York the one thing that really struck me was the lack of old buildings. The few 'old' buildings in Manhattan are only like 200 years old. Compared to most cities in Europe, where you can find buildings over 400 years old everywhere in the city centres, that's quite a shocker.
In Europe our culture comes from very old traditions, going back hundreds of years. The civilized United States simply aren't that old. To the guy above saying that the United States are older than most countries in Europe: the names of the countries may have changed, but we had people living here for thousands of years. When the Europeans came to America they killed all the inhabitants, thus destroying any culture that was going on there.
That's a part of our culture -- modernization. Nothing but the best. There are still some pretty old buildings in New York, especially the Churches and most notably Federal Hall, built in 1842, complete with the statue of George Washington, first President of the United States.
the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc. There are always people who hate whoevers on top, and it doesn't have to be about just countries.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
On January 21 2012 21:01 white_horse wrote: the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
oh gosh nothing but trees? true. but they didnt apear from nowhere, those guy who build that culture... they came from Europe
I have nothing against USA, but really, dont say stupid things.
On January 21 2012 21:01 white_horse wrote: the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
oh gosh nothing but trees? true. but they did apear from nowhere, those guy who build that culture... they came from Europe
*annihilated the existing culture and built a new one
On January 21 2012 21:01 white_horse wrote: the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
oh gosh nothing but trees? true. but they did apear from nowhere, those guy who build that culture... they came from Europe
No, they left Europe and then broke political connections through military action. There's a qualitative difference.
It's important to now separate the two factions that existed after settlement. The Europeans loyal to Europe, and the Europeans loyal to this new land.
On January 21 2012 21:01 white_horse wrote: the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
oh gosh nothing but trees? true. but they did apear from nowhere, those guy who build that culture... they came from Europe
*annihilated the existing culture and built a new one
True, Cortez, Vasco da Gama, even Columbus.. and noone should be proud of that :/
so America doesn't have castles and stuff, but that's because it wasn't created in mid-evil times. so duh that's why you don't see it.... do you guys see the reason now?
On January 21 2012 20:55 Khenra wrote: When I visited New York the one thing that really struck me was the lack of old buildings. The few 'old' buildings in Manhattan are only like 200 years old. Compared to most cities in Europe, where you can find buildings over 400 years old everywhere in the city centres, that's quite a shocker.
In Europe our culture comes from very old traditions, going back hundreds of years. The civilized United States simply aren't that old. To the guy above saying that the United States are older than most countries in Europe: the names of the countries may have changed, but we had people living here for thousands of years. When the Europeans came to America they killed all the inhabitants, thus destroying any culture that was going on there.
That's a part of our culture -- modernization. Nothing but the best. There are still some pretty old buildings in New York, especially the Churches and most notably Federal Hall, built in 1842, complete with the statue of George Washington, first President of the United States.
1842 isn't that old though, for example in Amsterdam you have mutiple buildings from the 16th and 17th century and there are cities that have way older buildings ( Rome, Athens). So while 1842 is a while ago it's not nearly as long as buildings in Europe which is only a logical consequence of not excisting as long obviously.
On January 21 2012 20:55 Khenra wrote: When I visited New York the one thing that really struck me was the lack of old buildings. The few 'old' buildings in Manhattan are only like 200 years old. Compared to most cities in Europe, where you can find buildings over 400 years old everywhere in the city centres, that's quite a shocker.
In Europe our culture comes from very old traditions, going back hundreds of years. The civilized United States simply aren't that old. To the guy above saying that the United States are older than most countries in Europe: the names of the countries may have changed, but we had people living here for thousands of years. When the Europeans came to America they killed all the inhabitants, thus destroying any culture that was going on there.
That's a part of our culture -- modernization. Nothing but the best. There are still some pretty old buildings in New York, especially the Churches and most notably Federal Hall, built in 1842, complete with the statue of George Washington, first President of the United States.
1842 isn't that old though, for example in Amsterdam you have mutiple buildings from the 16th and 17th century and there are cities that have way older buildings ( Rome, Athens). So while 1842 is a while ago it's not nearly as long as buildings in Europe which is only a logical consequence of not excisting as long obviously.
But consider the age of the buildings versus the age of the country. I'm sure they're relatively close in this respect. Also, you should see the Washington, DC area sometime if you haven't. A lot of cool things from the 1600's-1800's are there.
And even then, in 1776 it was mostly Europeans and some Native Americans. Not until recently did we get the massive influx of immigrants, which I then consider the "American" culture. So the "American" culture (a gigantic mix from different ethnicities) is damn young.
On January 21 2012 21:01 white_horse wrote: the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc. There are always people who hate whoevers on top, and it doesn't have to be about just countries.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
You cannot dismiss everyone's critic as saying "well it must just because you're jealous because we're better than you!!"
This is why the rest of the world hates your country. The "A" in USA might as well stand for arrogance, and it's people like you who make the rest of the world hate you. Be proud.
I don't know why you feel offended OP. Every country, every nation has a culture. This OP is good but unnecessary in my opinion. Anyway the other day I watched Moonshiners, a show on Discovery. That is one aspect of american culture in my opinion, and I loved it.
It's just me or reaaaally in the USA people are learning like what happened every day in the USA since the XVIII century, but they dont now anything about european/asian history?
I have never in my life met even a single person in Holland that could give an accurate description of the US civil war.
I seriously believe that not even 10% of europeans could name the 2 sides in the US civil war.
On January 21 2012 21:01 white_horse wrote: the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc. There are always people who hate whoevers on top, and it doesn't have to be about just countries.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
Seriously? this has got to be a joke...believe it or not, almost no one is jealous of your "#1" position...contrary to the popular belief in America, Europeans do NOT strive to be like you. And think again if you believe that you're #1 in terms of wealth or economy...considering that the latest news report that the unemployment rate is ~50% in America and a lot of business are going down :/
On January 21 2012 21:01 white_horse wrote: the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc. There are always people who hate whoevers on top, and it doesn't have to be about just countries.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
You cannot dismiss everyone's critic as saying "well it must just because you're jealous because we're better than you!!"
This is why the rest of the world hates your country. The "A" in USA might as well stand for arrogance, and it's people like you who make the rest of the world hate you. Be proud.
And now every point you made in this thread is irrelevant, because you've just proven you only made said points because you hate America and Americans. Thanks for stooping to his level. You do your people great justice when you do that.
On January 21 2012 21:01 white_horse wrote: the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc. There are always people who hate whoevers on top, and it doesn't have to be about just countries.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
Seriously? this has got to be a joke...believe it or not, almost no one is jealous of your "#1" position...contrary to the popular belief in America, Europeans do NOT strive to be like you. And think again if you believe that you're #1 in terms of wealth or economy...considering that the latest news report that the unemployment rate is ~50% in America and a lot of business are going down :/
Whichever news organization told Croatians that unemployment is ~50% in America fucking lied so hard that the world population decreased by 10% because their brains exploded from the stupidity.
On January 21 2012 20:55 Khenra wrote: When I visited New York the one thing that really struck me was the lack of old buildings. The few 'old' buildings in Manhattan are only like 200 years old. Compared to most cities in Europe, where you can find buildings over 400 years old everywhere in the city centres, that's quite a shocker.
In Europe our culture comes from very old traditions, going back hundreds of years. The civilized United States simply aren't that old. To the guy above saying that the United States are older than most countries in Europe: the names of the countries may have changed, but we had people living here for thousands of years. When the Europeans came to America they killed all the inhabitants, thus destroying any culture that was going on there.
That's a part of our culture -- modernization. Nothing but the best. There are still some pretty old buildings in New York, especially the Churches and most notably Federal Hall, built in 1842, complete with the statue of George Washington, first President of the United States.
1842 isn't that old though, for example in Amsterdam you have mutiple buildings from the 16th and 17th century and there are cities that have way older buildings ( Rome, Athens). So while 1842 is a while ago it's not nearly as long as buildings in Europe which is only a logical consequence of not excisting as long obviously.
But consider the age of the buildings versus the age of the country. I'm sure they're relatively close in this respect.
I guess that's true, but like I said earlier culture isn't just old buildings, America obviously has a culture though a lot of things in Europe came over from America because they've been the country with the most power for a couple of decades thats just how it works.
On January 21 2012 20:55 Khenra wrote: When I visited New York the one thing that really struck me was the lack of old buildings. The few 'old' buildings in Manhattan are only like 200 years old. Compared to most cities in Europe, where you can find buildings over 400 years old everywhere in the city centres, that's quite a shocker.
In Europe our culture comes from very old traditions, going back hundreds of years. The civilized United States simply aren't that old. To the guy above saying that the United States are older than most countries in Europe: the names of the countries may have changed, but we had people living here for thousands of years. When the Europeans came to America they killed all the inhabitants, thus destroying any culture that was going on there.
That's a part of our culture -- modernization. Nothing but the best. There are still some pretty old buildings in New York, especially the Churches and most notably Federal Hall, built in 1842, complete with the statue of George Washington, first President of the United States.
1842 is not old. Highschool I attended is older...
It's just me or reaaaally in the USA people are learning like what happened every day in the USA since the XVIII century, but they dont now anything about european/asian history?
I have never in my life met even a single person in Holland that could give an accurate description of the US civil war.
I seriously believe that not even 10% of europeans could name the 2 sides in the US civil war.
That only means that your history(and maybe english) classes are pretty bad(this isn't ment as an insult here, I just thought that that claim and especially the number you gave are rediculous)
On January 21 2012 21:01 white_horse wrote: the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc. There are always people who hate whoevers on top, and it doesn't have to be about just countries.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
Seriously? this has got to be a joke...believe it or not, almost no one is jealous of your "#1" position...contrary to the popular belief in America, Europeans do NOT strive to be like you. And think again if you believe that you're #1 in terms of wealth or economy...considering that the latest news report that the unemployment rate is ~50% in America and a lot of business are going down :/
To further address this, the unemployment rate is officially 8.5%. What the fuck kind of news do you people get over there?
It's just me or reaaaally in the USA people are learning like what happened every day in the USA since the XVIII century, but they dont now anything about european/asian history?
I have never in my life met even a single person in Holland that could give an accurate description of the US civil war.
I seriously believe that not even 10% of europeans could name the 2 sides in the US civil war.
That only means that your history(and maybe english) classes are pretty bad(this isn't ment as an insult here, I just thought that that claim and especially the number you gave are rediculous)
I know the sides and some of the reasons for that war, but no details (and mind you, I've been studying history for 3 years at the university). It's just so insignificant compared to the history of the rest of the world that except people who'd like to specialize in history of USA don't even bother to learn about it. I guess this would be accurate for Holland too. I don't think I had more than 1 class in highschool that would cover the subject of US civil war.
Never heard someone say America has no culture cause that's obviously not true. What is true though is that Americans (in general) are terribly ignorant about other cultures.
It's just me or reaaaally in the USA people are learning like what happened every day in the USA since the XVIII century, but they dont now anything about european/asian history?
I have never in my life met even a single person in Holland that could give an accurate description of the US civil war.
I seriously believe that not even 10% of europeans could name the 2 sides in the US civil war.
That only means that your history(and maybe english) classes are pretty bad(this isn't ment as an insult here, I just thought that that claim and especially the number you gave are rediculous)
I know the sides and some of the reasons for that war, but no details (and mind you, I've been studying history for 3 years at the university). It's just so insignificant compared to the history of the rest of the world that except people who'd like to specialize in history of USA don't even bother to learn about it.
Do you know how much Polish history I've learned? There are very few parts of history which are universally relevant. Everyone has their own history that mostly everyone else doesn't learn.
On January 21 2012 19:58 dubRa wrote: The statement Americans have no culture is silly I think. Serious question for Americans and other Europeans: Is it required of students to learn poems by heart and present it in front of their class?
American here. In high school (age 14-18) I remember having to memorize portions of Hamlet, Romeo and Juliet, and A Tale of Two Cities and reciting them in front of the class. I feel like there were more, as well as a poem or two, but these are the ones that I can still recite today.
Back to the OP, I have heard people say that America has no culture, but many of those have been during political discussions on HerO's stream, so I try to ignore them before I start raging. I think a lot of the confusion surrounding culture in general derives from the ambiguity in the word itself. It has many meanings, and the meaning being used is often not given. I don't think there's any situation where someone could say the US has no culture, but I do feel that one could say that we are less culturally advanced than other nations. We have our own mannerisms, dialects, and traditions, that are specific to our nation/state/etc, but in terms of things that can be said to be truly "American", I think other countries have a bit of a leg up on us. That's not to say that we're that far behind (I think we're advancing rather quickly), but other countries have certainly had more time to develop.
It's just me or reaaaally in the USA people are learning like what happened every day in the USA since the XVIII century, but they dont now anything about european/asian history?
I have never in my life met even a single person in Holland that could give an accurate description of the US civil war.
I seriously believe that not even 10% of europeans could name the 2 sides in the US civil war.
That only means that your history(and maybe english) classes are pretty bad(this isn't ment as an insult here, I just thought that that claim and especially the number you gave are rediculous)
I know the sides and some of the reasons for that war, but no details (and mind you, I've been studying history for 3 years at the university). It's just so insignificant compared to the history of the rest of the world that except people who'd like to specialize in history of USA don't even bother to learn about it.
Do you know how much Polish history I've learned? There are very few parts of history which are universally relevant. Everyone has their own history that mostly everyone else doesn't learn.
Well, our histories are tied at some points We even have the same heroes.
Thaddeus Kosciusko was described by Thomas Jefferson as the "Purest son of Liberty", and George Washington commented that "He served America with courage and distinction". He is called The Father of West Point and the Father of American Artillery.
On January 21 2012 21:01 white_horse wrote: the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc. There are always people who hate whoevers on top, and it doesn't have to be about just countries.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
Seriously? this has got to be a joke...believe it or not, almost no one is jealous of your "#1" position...contrary to the popular belief in America, Europeans do NOT strive to be like you. And think again if you believe that you're #1 in terms of wealth or economy...considering that the latest news report that the unemployment rate is ~50% in America and a lot of business are going down :/
To further address this, the unemployment rate is officially 8.5%. What the fuck kind of news do you people get over there?
Than you have my apologies about the unemployment rate, i was wrong. But I still stand behind my statement that you are not leading economical force because there are more stable and self-preserving economies (Norway, Sweden, Turkey and India are rising pretty fast...)
On January 21 2012 20:55 Khenra wrote: When I visited New York the one thing that really struck me was the lack of old buildings. The few 'old' buildings in Manhattan are only like 200 years old. Compared to most cities in Europe, where you can find buildings over 400 years old everywhere in the city centres, that's quite a shocker.
In Europe our culture comes from very old traditions, going back hundreds of years. The civilized United States simply aren't that old. To the guy above saying that the United States are older than most countries in Europe: the names of the countries may have changed, but we had people living here for thousands of years. When the Europeans came to America they killed all the inhabitants, thus destroying any culture that was going on there.
That's a part of our culture -- modernization. Nothing but the best. There are still some pretty old buildings in New York, especially the Churches and most notably Federal Hall, built in 1842, complete with the statue of George Washington, first President of the United States.
1842 isn't that old though, for example in Amsterdam you have mutiple buildings from the 16th and 17th century and there are cities that have way older buildings ( Rome, Athens). So while 1842 is a while ago it's not nearly as long as buildings in Europe which is only a logical consequence of not excisting as long obviously.
America is lacking many of the cultural aspects. There are some unique stuff, but so few. ( ye there is basketball and stuff but they are not the only sports in the world that is unique for one culture )
For example , do americans have marriage traditions, or a history of cannon forgery, a building style or unique clothes ?
Modernisation is not an aspect of culture, since culture relates to old common actions in the past. Were you modernising everything even in your oldest past (which isnt even past enough, since some cultural events relate to 14 thousand years ago, I can tell you one if you ask)?
It's just me or reaaaally in the USA people are learning like what happened every day in the USA since the XVIII century, but they dont now anything about european/asian history?
I have never in my life met even a single person in Holland that could give an accurate description of the US civil war.
I seriously believe that not even 10% of europeans could name the 2 sides in the US civil war.
That only means that your history(and maybe english) classes are pretty bad(this isn't ment as an insult here, I just thought that that claim and especially the number you gave are rediculous)
I know the sides and some of the reasons for that war, but no details (and mind you, I've been studying history for 3 years at the university). It's just so insignificant compared to the history of the rest of the world that except people who'd like to specialize in history of USA don't even bother to learn about it.
Do you know how much Polish history I've learned? There are very few parts of history which are universally relevant. Everyone has their own history that mostly everyone else doesn't learn.
Well, our histories are tied at some points We even have the same heroes.
Thaddeus Kosciusko was described by Thomas Jefferson as the "Purest son of Liberty", and George Washington commented that "He served America with courage and distinction". He is called The Father of West Point and the Father of American Artillery.
And if I had ever taken an Eastern European History course, I'd probably have learned that. I think that's pretty cool that we have "ancient" connections.
It's just me or reaaaally in the USA people are learning like what happened every day in the USA since the XVIII century, but they dont now anything about european/asian history?
I have never in my life met even a single person in Holland that could give an accurate description of the US civil war.
I seriously believe that not even 10% of europeans could name the 2 sides in the US civil war.
i dont know about that, we've learnt the US civil war in highschool
On January 21 2012 21:01 white_horse wrote: the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc. There are always people who hate whoevers on top, and it doesn't have to be about just countries.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
Seriously? this has got to be a joke...believe it or not, almost no one is jealous of your "#1" position...contrary to the popular belief in America, Europeans do NOT strive to be like you. And think again if you believe that you're #1 in terms of wealth or economy...considering that the latest news report that the unemployment rate is ~50% in America and a lot of business are going down :/
To further address this, the unemployment rate is officially 8.5%. What the fuck kind of news do you people get over there?
Maybe he ment the unemployment rate of the youth? Last number I remember is the unemployment rate of the black youth, which was about 50%, no idea how high it is now
EDIT: Google says I'm right, but to clarify that this post wasn't about racism,
The rate for whites decreased by 1.0 percentage point to 62.2 percent.
On January 21 2012 21:01 white_horse wrote: the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
oh gosh nothing but trees? true. but they did apear from nowhere, those guy who build that culture... they came from Europe
No, they left Europe and then broke political connections through military action. There's a qualitative difference.
It's important to now separate the two factions that existed after settlement. The Europeans loyal to Europe, and the Europeans loyal to this new land.
Neither of those two factions existed... ever. They didn't even exist in a figurative sense. That is a completely romanticized and made up oversimplification of what actually happened and what made people leave Europe to America or side with that "military action" against European imperialism.
Do you really think that most of the Irish people that left to America felt no connection or loyalty towards their homeland and culture? That would be very ironic considering that loyalty is actually a huge part of why they had to leave in the first place. Do Jewish people share no connection or loyalty to their culture and tradition?
Even today, a big part of US population is very aware of their real cultural origin and actively embraces it.
On January 21 2012 21:01 white_horse wrote: the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
oh gosh nothing but trees? true. but they didnt apear from nowhere, those guy who build that culture... they came from Europe
I have nothing against USA, but really, dont say stupid things.
Yeah it was just way to characterize how there wasn't a european style "country". I'm sure there was more than just trees on the north american continent, thanks for pointing that out.
to say that america doesn't have a culture is silly to begin with because there isn't an existing "american race" that has a "culture" that europeans would consider what they think is "developed" culture. The american culture that you see today is made up from immigrants. what is wrong about that and what is so wrong that the descendents of these immigrants don't have a culture that what you think is "developed"?
On January 21 2012 21:01 white_horse wrote: the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
oh gosh nothing but trees? true. but they did apear from nowhere, those guy who build that culture... they came from Europe
No, they left Europe and then broke political connections through military action. There's a qualitative difference.
It's important to now separate the two factions that existed after settlement. The Europeans loyal to Europe, and the Europeans loyal to this new land.
Neither of those two factions existed... ever. They didn't even exist in a figurative sense. That is a completely romanticized and made up oversimplification of what actually happened and what made people leave Europe to America or side with that "military action" against European imperialism.
Do you really think that most of the Irish people that left to America felt no connection or loyalty towards their homeland and culture? That would be very ironic considering that loyalty is actually a huge part of why they had to leave in the first place. -__-
Study actual American history from pre-Revolutionary War to the ratification of the Constitution, and make sure you read all of the Federalist papers.
It's just me or reaaaally in the USA people are learning like what happened every day in the USA since the XVIII century, but they dont now anything about european/asian history?
I have never in my life met even a single person in Holland that could give an accurate description of the US civil war.
I seriously believe that not even 10% of europeans could name the 2 sides in the US civil war.
That only means that your history(and maybe english) classes are pretty bad(this isn't ment as an insult here, I just thought that that claim and especially the number you gave are rediculous)
I know the sides and some of the reasons for that war, but no details (and mind you, I've been studying history for 3 years at the university). It's just so insignificant compared to the history of the rest of the world that except people who'd like to specialize in history of USA don't even bother to learn about it.
Do you know how much Polish history I've learned? There are very few parts of history which are universally relevant. Everyone has their own history that mostly everyone else doesn't learn.
Well, our histories are tied at some points We even have the same heroes.
Thaddeus Kosciusko was described by Thomas Jefferson as the "Purest son of Liberty", and George Washington commented that "He served America with courage and distinction". He is called The Father of West Point and the Father of American Artillery.
And if I had ever taken an Eastern European History course, I'd probably have learned that. I think that's pretty cool that we have "ancient" connections.
You would have to take Central European History. Poland is not Eastern Europe
It's just me or reaaaally in the USA people are learning like what happened every day in the USA since the XVIII century, but they dont now anything about european/asian history?
I have never in my life met even a single person in Holland that could give an accurate description of the US civil war.
I seriously believe that not even 10% of europeans could name the 2 sides in the US civil war.
That only means that your history(and maybe english) classes are pretty bad(this isn't ment as an insult here, I just thought that that claim and especially the number you gave are rediculous)
I know the sides and some of the reasons for that war, but no details (and mind you, I've been studying history for 3 years at the university). It's just so insignificant compared to the history of the rest of the world that except people who'd like to specialize in history of USA don't even bother to learn about it.
Do you know how much Polish history I've learned? There are very few parts of history which are universally relevant. Everyone has their own history that mostly everyone else doesn't learn.
Well, our histories are tied at some points We even have the same heroes.
Thaddeus Kosciusko was described by Thomas Jefferson as the "Purest son of Liberty", and George Washington commented that "He served America with courage and distinction". He is called The Father of West Point and the Father of American Artillery.
And if I had ever taken an Eastern European History course, I'd probably have learned that. I think that's pretty cool that we have "ancient" connections.
You would have to take Central European History. Poland is not Eastern Europe
History courses in my land don't usually separate Europe into Western/Central/Eastern, just West/East. At least from what I've seen, I'm sure there's someone out there in a Central European History course.
On January 21 2012 21:01 white_horse wrote: the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc. There are always people who hate whoevers on top, and it doesn't have to be about just countries.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
You cannot dismiss everyone's critic as saying "well it must just because you're jealous because we're better than you!!"
This is why the rest of the world hates your country. The "A" in USA might as well stand for arrogance, and it's people like you who make the rest of the world hate you. Be proud.
And now every point you made in this thread is irrelevant, because you've just proven you only made said points because you hate America and Americans. Thanks for stooping to his level. You do your people great justice when you do that.
You take issue with the reply but not with the initial post? So I assume that you believe that people that dislike America are just jealous?
Every post you have made in this thread is thus irrelevant.
PS. I felt really stupid typing that, I hope you felt the same (but i suspect you didn't).
I don't think Americans care whether they have their own culture or not. More likely, most people in America stem from so many different nationalities ( we are the most diverse country in the world, are we not?) they adopt their families original heritage.
Anyways America is very young and it's creating its own unique culture and history everyday. Five hundred years from now, America will probably be compared to countries like Egypt, Rome, Greece, Great Brit, etc...
On January 21 2012 21:01 white_horse wrote: the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc. There are always people who hate whoevers on top, and it doesn't have to be about just countries.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
You cannot dismiss everyone's critic as saying "well it must just because you're jealous because we're better than you!!"
This is why the rest of the world hates your country. The "A" in USA might as well stand for arrogance, and it's people like you who make the rest of the world hate you. Be proud.
And now every point you made in this thread is irrelevant, because you've just proven you only made said points because you hate America and Americans. Thanks for stooping to his level. You do your people great justice when you do that.
You take issue with the reply but not with the initial post? So I assume that you believe that people that dislike America are just jealous?
Every post you have made in this thread is thus irrelevant.
PS. I felt really stupid typing that, I hope you felt the same (but i suspect you didn't).
I said you stooped to his level, implying his level was quite low. You and he took the same path, a stupid one based on nationalist pride.
On January 21 2012 21:01 white_horse wrote: the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
oh gosh nothing but trees? true. but they didnt apear from nowhere, those guy who build that culture... they came from Europe
I have nothing against USA, but really, dont say stupid things.
Yeah it was just way to characterize how there wasn't a european style "country". I'm sure there was more than just trees on the north american continent, thanks for pointing that out.
to say that america doesn't have a culture is silly to begin with because there isn't an existing "american race" that has a "culture" that europeans would consider what they think is "developed" culture. The american culture that you see today is made up from immigrants. what is wrong about that and what is so wrong that the descendents of these immigrants don't have a culture that what you think is "developed"?
I think the problem is that america doesn't have one culture, it has many cultures as a multicultural country. The Melting Pot didn't work, the salad bowl kinda did, and that's where you're at right now. Although many citizens of the USA have certain "american" things they share with each other you're still no fully american country, large parts of your people just belong to a country with many people from all over the world connected by certain "american" traditions and habits. Notice that I'm not saying that there are no "american" americans, but large parts of your citizens consider themselves americans and others would say they are americans too, while they still kept parts of the culture of the countries they or their driect ancestors came from, which they don't share with most of their fellow americans.
On January 21 2012 21:24 mdb wrote: America has the best culture if you ask me
America is so culturally diverse, you cant really say it has the best culture. The country has had so many different people settle there through immigration since the birth of the country, it has taken on influences from all over Europe. Nowadays American popculture is everywhere, especially music.
It's just me or reaaaally in the USA people are learning like what happened every day in the USA since the XVIII century, but they dont now anything about european/asian history?
I have never in my life met even a single person in Holland that could give an accurate description of the US civil war.
I seriously believe that not even 10% of europeans could name the 2 sides in the US civil war.
That only means that your history(and maybe english) classes are pretty bad(this isn't ment as an insult here, I just thought that that claim and especially the number you gave are rediculous)
I know the sides and some of the reasons for that war, but no details (and mind you, I've been studying history for 3 years at the university). It's just so insignificant compared to the history of the rest of the world that except people who'd like to specialize in history of USA don't even bother to learn about it.
Do you know how much Polish history I've learned? There are very few parts of history which are universally relevant. Everyone has their own history that mostly everyone else doesn't learn.
Well, our histories are tied at some points We even have the same heroes.
Thaddeus Kosciusko was described by Thomas Jefferson as the "Purest son of Liberty", and George Washington commented that "He served America with courage and distinction". He is called The Father of West Point and the Father of American Artillery.
And if I had ever taken an Eastern European History course, I'd probably have learned that. I think that's pretty cool that we have "ancient" connections.
You would have to take Central European History. Poland is not Eastern Europe
That actually suprised me, I would've considered Germany to be the(geographically) most eastern country of Central Europe and Poland the(geographically) most western country of eastern europe.
On January 21 2012 21:01 white_horse wrote: the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
oh gosh nothing but trees? true. but they didnt apear from nowhere, those guy who build that culture... they came from Europe
I have nothing against USA, but really, dont say stupid things.
Yeah it was just way to characterize how there wasn't a european style "country". I'm sure there was more than just trees on the north american continent, thanks for pointing that out.
to say that america doesn't have a culture is silly to begin with because there isn't an existing "american race" that has a "culture" that europeans would consider what they think is "developed" culture. The american culture that you see today is made up from immigrants. what is wrong about that and what is so wrong that the descendents of these immigrants don't have a culture that what you think is "developed"?
I think the problem is that america doesn't have one culture, it has many cultures as a multicultural country. The Melting Pot didn't work, the salad bowl kinda did, and that's where you're at right now. Although many citizens of the USA have certain "american" things they share with each other you're still no fully american country, large parts of your people just belong to a country with many people from all over the world connected by certain "american" traditions and habits. Notice that I'm not saying that there are no "american" americans, but large parts of your citizens consider themselves americans and others would say they are americans too, while they still kept parts of the culture of the countries they or their driect ancestors came from, which they don't share with most of their fellow americans.
Thank you for understanding this. American culture is made up of a thousand other cultures practiced within arms length of one another. It's a very rare occasion that I am in a room full of people who are just like me, and in truth, I prefer the diversity.
On January 21 2012 21:01 white_horse wrote: the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
oh gosh nothing but trees? true. but they did apear from nowhere, those guy who build that culture... they came from Europe
No, they left Europe and then broke political connections through military action. There's a qualitative difference.
It's important to now separate the two factions that existed after settlement. The Europeans loyal to Europe, and the Europeans loyal to this new land.
Neither of those two factions existed... ever. They didn't even exist in a figurative sense. That is a completely romanticized and made up oversimplification of what actually happened and what made people leave Europe to America or side with that "military action" against European imperialism.
Do you really think that most of the Irish people that left to America felt no connection or loyalty towards their homeland and culture? That would be very ironic considering that loyalty is actually a huge part of why they had to leave in the first place. -__-
Study actual American history from pre-Revolutionary War to the ratification of the Constitution, and make sure you read all of the Federalist papers.
Obviously I am going to devote several months of my life to study a topic some random forum user recommended because he had no other means of defending the nonsensical claims he made. That seems perfectly reasonable.
On January 21 2012 21:01 white_horse wrote: the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc. There are always people who hate whoevers on top, and it doesn't have to be about just countries.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
You cannot dismiss everyone's critic as saying "well it must just because you're jealous because we're better than you!!"
This is why the rest of the world hates your country. The "A" in USA might as well stand for arrogance, and it's people like you who make the rest of the world hate you. Be proud.
And now every point you made in this thread is irrelevant, because you've just proven you only made said points because you hate America and Americans. Thanks for stooping to his level. You do your people great justice when you do that.
You take issue with the reply but not with the initial post? So I assume that you believe that people that dislike America are just jealous?
Every post you have made in this thread is thus irrelevant.
PS. I felt really stupid typing that, I hope you felt the same (but i suspect you didn't).
I said you stooped to his level, implying his level was quite low. You and he took the same path, a stupid one based on nationalist pride.
Nationalist pride? What?
I think you might be confusing me with HoldenR, I think you should learn to read :/
On January 21 2012 21:01 white_horse wrote: the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
oh gosh nothing but trees? true. but they did apear from nowhere, those guy who build that culture... they came from Europe
No, they left Europe and then broke political connections through military action. There's a qualitative difference.
It's important to now separate the two factions that existed after settlement. The Europeans loyal to Europe, and the Europeans loyal to this new land.
Neither of those two factions existed... ever. They didn't even exist in a figurative sense. That is a completely romanticized and made up oversimplification of what actually happened and what made people leave Europe to America or side with that "military action" against European imperialism.
Do you really think that most of the Irish people that left to America felt no connection or loyalty towards their homeland and culture? That would be very ironic considering that loyalty is actually a huge part of why they had to leave in the first place. -__-
Study actual American history from pre-Revolutionary War to the ratification of the Constitution, and make sure you read all of the Federalist papers.
On January 21 2012 21:24 mdb wrote: America has the best culture if you ask me
Which aspect of it is better than others? Advertising is not culture.
They have no advertisements in Turkey? I will get on a plane right now and declare my undying loyalty to the Turkish people.
They advertise well , thats because you find their culture "the best". They make toi think its the best. Is there anything better and more refined than the Turkish culture?
On January 21 2012 21:01 white_horse wrote: the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
oh gosh nothing but trees? true. but they did apear from nowhere, those guy who build that culture... they came from Europe
No, they left Europe and then broke political connections through military action. There's a qualitative difference.
It's important to now separate the two factions that existed after settlement. The Europeans loyal to Europe, and the Europeans loyal to this new land.
Neither of those two factions existed... ever. They didn't even exist in a figurative sense. That is a completely romanticized and made up oversimplification of what actually happened and what made people leave Europe to America or side with that "military action" against European imperialism.
Do you really think that most of the Irish people that left to America felt no connection or loyalty towards their homeland and culture? That would be very ironic considering that loyalty is actually a huge part of why they had to leave in the first place. -__-
Study actual American history from pre-Revolutionary War to the ratification of the Constitution, and make sure you read all of the Federalist papers.
Obviously I am going to devote several months of my life to study a topic some random forum user recommended because he had no other means of defending the nonsensical claims he made. That seems perfectly reasonable.
I have. And while there is a lot of romanticizing going on in history classes in middle school, you get to learn about these men for real in university. The Sons of Liberty really did exist, and there were large factions of anti-British. Whether they came from Ireland or the Netherlands, even if they loved their home land greatly, they still fought for America against the British who sought only to annex the country for wealth.
I have seriously never heard anyone say that America has no culture. But hey, I live in Sweden and we're really the wrong people to say anything about culture, aren't we?
On January 21 2012 21:34 seansye wrote: Anyways America is very young and it's creating its own unique culture and history everyday. Five hundred years from now, America will probably be compared to countries like Egypt, Rome, Greece, Great Brit, etc...
On January 21 2012 21:01 white_horse wrote: the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
oh gosh nothing but trees? true. but they didnt apear from nowhere, those guy who build that culture... they came from Europe
I have nothing against USA, but really, dont say stupid things.
Yeah it was just way to characterize how there wasn't a european style "country". I'm sure there was more than just trees on the north american continent, thanks for pointing that out.
to say that america doesn't have a culture is silly to begin with because there isn't an existing "american race" that has a "culture" that europeans would consider what they think is "developed" culture. The american culture that you see today is made up from immigrants. what is wrong about that and what is so wrong that the descendents of these immigrants don't have a culture that what you think is "developed"?
I think the problem is that america doesn't have one culture, it has many cultures as a multicultural country. The Melting Pot didn't work, the salad bowl kinda did, and that's where you're at right now. Although many citizens of the USA have certain "american" things they share with each other you're still no fully american country, large parts of your people just belong to a country with many people from all over the world connected by certain "american" traditions and habits. Notice that I'm not saying that there are no "american" americans, but large parts of your citizens consider themselves americans and others would say they are americans too, while they still kept parts of the culture of the countries they or their driect ancestors came from, which they don't share with most of their fellow americans.
Thank you for understanding this. American culture is made up of a thousand other cultures practiced within arms length of one another. It's a very rare occasion that I am in a room full of people who are just like me, and in truth, I prefer the diversity.
I don't only undestand you, I understand the guy you argued with too and partially, I agree with him(sorry). One reason why there's a certain dislike of americans(not american individuals) in the world is that you see yourself as the #1, although america has many faults and that disproportional pride and nationalism is one of those faults(although a very human one). For example, somebody here said that america is "[...]economically[...] the #1", he mentioned other things aswell, which might be wrong too, but I especially remember this one because it made me laugh(once again sorry) because of the HUGE export/import deficit america has and several other reasons. Now that doesn't make you a bad people and especially not bad individuals, but you have to understand that this kind of attitude(which could be described as arrogance as one here did) doesn't really make you popular.
On January 21 2012 21:43 Zexion wrote: I have seriously never heard anyone say that America has no culture. But hey, I live in Sweden and we're really the wrong people to say anything about culture, aren't we?
It's so good to see that the propaganda machine in Europe functions so well, that the average European person thinks there is none. Too many people trust their national television broadcasts to be as true as you can be, which shows just how masterful they have become at hiding the true intetions.
A general question to the European posters here, who holds animosity towards Greece or Greek people because they 'caused the euro-crisis'? Now who of you truly knows what caused the euro crisis? I'm willing to bet the number of the former is much higher than the latter.
On January 21 2012 20:55 DOUDOU wrote: imo people says americans have no culture to say that they don't know anything about the world apart from USA
"Correlation does not imply causation" comes to mind with this one. All you are trying to do is justify the ignorance of people around you by comparing it to the ignorance of Americans. No culture does not equal Not knowing anything of the world besides yourself. You might aswell say "Tomatoes are red, that's why the sun is shining".
On January 21 2012 21:14 Laurence wrote: Never heard someone say America has no culture cause that's obviously not true. What is true though is that Americans (in general) are terribly ignorant about other cultures.
And European media has masterfully engineered an elitism in favour of ourselves to spread that message. General populace doesn't care about countries around them because they don't affect them. It is only natural that people from their own countries get fed their own history over those of other nations. Asking an American where Belarus is positioned will yield the same result of asking a European about the position of Michigan.
On January 21 2012 21:24 mdb wrote: America has the best culture if you ask me
Which aspect of it is better than others? Advertising is not culture.
If I remember correctly, every damn nation on the planet uses advertising. It was not invented by the US at all. Julius Caesar used advertising of his godliness on coins. Martin Luther used advertising ( not to be confused with Martin Luther King mind you ). Napoleon used advertising.
Advertising is just a sub-form of propaganda ( the spreading of a message that's beneficial to the sender, but not neccesarily for the reciever ) and no, not just the US is drenched in it. Every nation on earth has it.
On January 21 2012 21:34 seansye wrote: Anyways America is very young and it's creating its own unique culture and history everyday. Five hundred years from now, America will probably be compared to countries like Egypt, Rome, Greece, Great Brit, etc...
On January 21 2012 20:55 Khenra wrote: When I visited New York the one thing that really struck me was the lack of old buildings. The few 'old' buildings in Manhattan are only like 200 years old. Compared to most cities in Europe, where you can find buildings over 400 years old everywhere in the city centres, that's quite a shocker.
In Europe our culture comes from very old traditions, going back hundreds of years. The civilized United States simply aren't that old. To the guy above saying that the United States are older than most countries in Europe: the names of the countries may have changed, but we had people living here for thousands of years. When the Europeans came to America they killed all the inhabitants, thus destroying any culture that was going on there.
That's a part of our culture -- modernization. Nothing but the best. There are still some pretty old buildings in New York, especially the Churches and most notably Federal Hall, built in 1842, complete with the statue of George Washington, first President of the United States.
You can be modern and still have aesthetically pleasing creations, but I am not really having a problem with New York, more with smaller cities and suburbs. Especially glaring is the copying of the styles of ancient Rome and Greece even in public buildings (White house I am looking at you ). Why not use a style that actually fits into the surrounding terrain/plant-life/climate/existing architecture. But that is unfortunately not purely American problem, it is just more visible in US.
On January 21 2012 21:01 white_horse wrote: the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
oh gosh nothing but trees? true. but they didnt apear from nowhere, those guy who build that culture... they came from Europe
I have nothing against USA, but really, dont say stupid things.
Yeah it was just way to characterize how there wasn't a european style "country". I'm sure there was more than just trees on the north american continent, thanks for pointing that out.
to say that america doesn't have a culture is silly to begin with because there isn't an existing "american race" that has a "culture" that europeans would consider what they think is "developed" culture. The american culture that you see today is made up from immigrants. what is wrong about that and what is so wrong that the descendents of these immigrants don't have a culture that what you think is "developed"?
I think the problem is that america doesn't have one culture, it has many cultures as a multicultural country. The Melting Pot didn't work, the salad bowl kinda did, and that's where you're at right now. Although many citizens of the USA have certain "american" things they share with each other you're still no fully american country, large parts of your people just belong to a country with many people from all over the world connected by certain "american" traditions and habits. Notice that I'm not saying that there are no "american" americans, but large parts of your citizens consider themselves americans and others would say they are americans too, while they still kept parts of the culture of the countries they or their driect ancestors came from, which they don't share with most of their fellow americans.
Thank you for understanding this. American culture is made up of a thousand other cultures practiced within arms length of one another. It's a very rare occasion that I am in a room full of people who are just like me, and in truth, I prefer the diversity.
I don't only undestand you, I understand the guy you argued with too and partially, I agree with him(sorry). One reason why there's a certain dislike of americans(not american individuals) in the world is that you see yourself as the #1, although america has many faults and that disproportional pride and nationalism is one of those faults(although a very human one). For example, somebody here said that america is "[...]economically[...] the #1", he mentioned other things aswell, which might be wrong too, but I especially remember this one because it made me laugh(once again sorry) because of the HUGE export/import deficit america has and several other reasons. Now that doesn't make you a bad people and especially not bad individuals, but you have to understand that this kind of attitude(which could be described as arrogance as one here did) doesn't really make you popular.
America is the largest economy in the world.
This is just a fact, i don't see why we need to dispute that. It might not be like that forever, but that doesn't change the current fact of life. The USA is the largest economy in the entire world.
To actually go on and ridicule a person for being accurate is just...
On January 21 2012 21:01 white_horse wrote: the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
oh gosh nothing but trees? true. but they didnt apear from nowhere, those guy who build that culture... they came from Europe
I have nothing against USA, but really, dont say stupid things.
Yeah it was just way to characterize how there wasn't a european style "country". I'm sure there was more than just trees on the north american continent, thanks for pointing that out.
to say that america doesn't have a culture is silly to begin with because there isn't an existing "american race" that has a "culture" that europeans would consider what they think is "developed" culture. The american culture that you see today is made up from immigrants. what is wrong about that and what is so wrong that the descendents of these immigrants don't have a culture that what you think is "developed"?
I think the problem is that america doesn't have one culture, it has many cultures as a multicultural country. The Melting Pot didn't work, the salad bowl kinda did, and that's where you're at right now. Although many citizens of the USA have certain "american" things they share with each other you're still no fully american country, large parts of your people just belong to a country with many people from all over the world connected by certain "american" traditions and habits. Notice that I'm not saying that there are no "american" americans, but large parts of your citizens consider themselves americans and others would say they are americans too, while they still kept parts of the culture of the countries they or their driect ancestors came from, which they don't share with most of their fellow americans.
Thank you for understanding this. American culture is made up of a thousand other cultures practiced within arms length of one another. It's a very rare occasion that I am in a room full of people who are just like me, and in truth, I prefer the diversity.
I don't only undestand you, I understand the guy you argued with too and partially, I agree with him(sorry). One reason why there's a certain dislike of americans(not american individuals) in the world is that you see yourself as the #1, although america has many faults and that disproportional pride and nationalism is one of those faults(although a very human one). For example, somebody here said that america is "[...]economically[...] the #1", he mentioned other things aswell, which might be wrong too, but I especially remember this one because it made me laugh(once again sorry) because of the HUGE export/import deficit america has and several other reasons. Now that doesn't make you a bad people and especially not bad individuals, but you have to understand that this kind of attitude(which could be described as arrogance as one here did) doesn't really make you popular.
So talking about facts suddenly make me the stereotypical arrogant american? Might as well just tell me that you think all americans have some kind of high-horse attitude. America has the biggest economy in the world and the strongest military in the world. Those are facts. Does reading those lines make your stomach hurt? Then you have a complex.
Anyways, did I say that "USA is the strongest and we can do anything we want because everyone else sucks"? I was simply stating in my previous post that because america is a global hegemony, a lot of people find that as a reason to hate it. There are people in china, korea, japan, parts of middle east, parts of europe who bash america yet they want to send their kids there to study at american universities or they want to immigrate there. If that isn't jealousy or a complex I don't what is.
On January 21 2012 20:55 Khenra wrote: When I visited New York the one thing that really struck me was the lack of old buildings. The few 'old' buildings in Manhattan are only like 200 years old. Compared to most cities in Europe, where you can find buildings over 400 years old everywhere in the city centres, that's quite a shocker.
In Europe our culture comes from very old traditions, going back hundreds of years. The civilized United States simply aren't that old. To the guy above saying that the United States are older than most countries in Europe: the names of the countries may have changed, but we had people living here for thousands of years. When the Europeans came to America they killed all the inhabitants, thus destroying any culture that was going on there.
That's a part of our culture -- modernization. Nothing but the best. There are still some pretty old buildings in New York, especially the Churches and most notably Federal Hall, built in 1842, complete with the statue of George Washington, first President of the United States.
You can be modern and still have aesthetically pleasing creations, but I am not really having a problem with New York, more with smaller cities and suburbs. Especially glaring is the copying of the styles of ancient Rome and Greece even in public buildings (White house I am looking at you ). Why not use a style that actually fits into the surrounding terrain/plant-life/climate/existing architecture. But that is unfortunately not purely American problem, it is just more visible in US.
But European architecture is damned beautiful. It would be folly to not go for that style. Should we have our own? Yeah, but not exclusively our own. It should be mixed in.
On January 21 2012 21:01 white_horse wrote: the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
oh gosh nothing but trees? true. but they didnt apear from nowhere, those guy who build that culture... they came from Europe
I have nothing against USA, but really, dont say stupid things.
Yeah it was just way to characterize how there wasn't a european style "country". I'm sure there was more than just trees on the north american continent, thanks for pointing that out.
to say that america doesn't have a culture is silly to begin with because there isn't an existing "american race" that has a "culture" that europeans would consider what they think is "developed" culture. The american culture that you see today is made up from immigrants. what is wrong about that and what is so wrong that the descendents of these immigrants don't have a culture that what you think is "developed"?
I think the problem is that america doesn't have one culture, it has many cultures as a multicultural country. The Melting Pot didn't work, the salad bowl kinda did, and that's where you're at right now. Although many citizens of the USA have certain "american" things they share with each other you're still no fully american country, large parts of your people just belong to a country with many people from all over the world connected by certain "american" traditions and habits. Notice that I'm not saying that there are no "american" americans, but large parts of your citizens consider themselves americans and others would say they are americans too, while they still kept parts of the culture of the countries they or their driect ancestors came from, which they don't share with most of their fellow americans.
Thank you for understanding this. American culture is made up of a thousand other cultures practiced within arms length of one another. It's a very rare occasion that I am in a room full of people who are just like me, and in truth, I prefer the diversity.
I don't only undestand you, I understand the guy you argued with too and partially, I agree with him(sorry). One reason why there's a certain dislike of americans(not american individuals) in the world is that you see yourself as the #1, although america has many faults and that disproportional pride and nationalism is one of those faults(although a very human one). For example, somebody here said that america is "[...]economically[...] the #1", he mentioned other things aswell, which might be wrong too, but I especially remember this one because it made me laugh(once again sorry) because of the HUGE export/import deficit america has and several other reasons. Now that doesn't make you a bad people and especially not bad individuals, but you have to understand that this kind of attitude(which could be described as arrogance as one here did) doesn't really make you popular.
But we ARE the leading nation economically, right now. We have been for a while. We will certainly be overtaken in the future by China and eventually India, but right now we are indeed #1. That is a fact. Is it arrogant to provide factual information? I don't think so, but I guess if that factual information says that you're the best, it'll be viewed as arrogance by lesser parties.
On January 21 2012 21:01 white_horse wrote: the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
oh gosh nothing but trees? true. but they didnt apear from nowhere, those guy who build that culture... they came from Europe
I have nothing against USA, but really, dont say stupid things.
Yeah it was just way to characterize how there wasn't a european style "country". I'm sure there was more than just trees on the north american continent, thanks for pointing that out.
to say that america doesn't have a culture is silly to begin with because there isn't an existing "american race" that has a "culture" that europeans would consider what they think is "developed" culture. The american culture that you see today is made up from immigrants. what is wrong about that and what is so wrong that the descendents of these immigrants don't have a culture that what you think is "developed"?
I think the problem is that america doesn't have one culture, it has many cultures as a multicultural country. The Melting Pot didn't work, the salad bowl kinda did, and that's where you're at right now. Although many citizens of the USA have certain "american" things they share with each other you're still no fully american country, large parts of your people just belong to a country with many people from all over the world connected by certain "american" traditions and habits. Notice that I'm not saying that there are no "american" americans, but large parts of your citizens consider themselves americans and others would say they are americans too, while they still kept parts of the culture of the countries they or their driect ancestors came from, which they don't share with most of their fellow americans.
Thank you for understanding this. American culture is made up of a thousand other cultures practiced within arms length of one another. It's a very rare occasion that I am in a room full of people who are just like me, and in truth, I prefer the diversity.
I don't only undestand you, I understand the guy you argued with too and partially, I agree with him(sorry). One reason why there's a certain dislike of americans(not american individuals) in the world is that you see yourself as the #1, although america has many faults and that disproportional pride and nationalism is one of those faults(although a very human one). For example, somebody here said that america is "[...]economically[...] the #1", he mentioned other things aswell, which might be wrong too, but I especially remember this one because it made me laugh(once again sorry) because of the HUGE export/import deficit america has and several other reasons. Now that doesn't make you a bad people and especially not bad individuals, but you have to understand that this kind of attitude(which could be described as arrogance as one here did) doesn't really make you popular.
America is the largest economy in the world.
This is just a fact, i don't see why we need to dispute that. It might not be like that forever, but that doesn't change the current fact of life. The USA is the largest economy in the entire world.
To actually go on and ridicule a person for being accurate is just...
On January 21 2012 21:34 seansye wrote: Anyways America is very young and it's creating its own unique culture and history everyday. Five hundred years from now, America will probably be compared to countries like Egypt, Rome, Greece, Great Brit, etc...
Yeah... no.
By the way, Rome isn't a country.
Ancient Rome was a lot more than a country.
A realm, a republic, an empire if you want but many people will strongly disagree it was a country.
On January 21 2012 21:01 white_horse wrote: the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
oh gosh nothing but trees? true. but they didnt apear from nowhere, those guy who build that culture... they came from Europe
I have nothing against USA, but really, dont say stupid things.
Yeah it was just way to characterize how there wasn't a european style "country". I'm sure there was more than just trees on the north american continent, thanks for pointing that out.
to say that america doesn't have a culture is silly to begin with because there isn't an existing "american race" that has a "culture" that europeans would consider what they think is "developed" culture. The american culture that you see today is made up from immigrants. what is wrong about that and what is so wrong that the descendents of these immigrants don't have a culture that what you think is "developed"?
I think the problem is that america doesn't have one culture, it has many cultures as a multicultural country. The Melting Pot didn't work, the salad bowl kinda did, and that's where you're at right now. Although many citizens of the USA have certain "american" things they share with each other you're still no fully american country, large parts of your people just belong to a country with many people from all over the world connected by certain "american" traditions and habits. Notice that I'm not saying that there are no "american" americans, but large parts of your citizens consider themselves americans and others would say they are americans too, while they still kept parts of the culture of the countries they or their driect ancestors came from, which they don't share with most of their fellow americans.
Thank you for understanding this. American culture is made up of a thousand other cultures practiced within arms length of one another. It's a very rare occasion that I am in a room full of people who are just like me, and in truth, I prefer the diversity.
I don't only undestand you, I understand the guy you argued with too and partially, I agree with him(sorry). One reason why there's a certain dislike of americans(not american individuals) in the world is that you see yourself as the #1, although america has many faults and that disproportional pride and nationalism is one of those faults(although a very human one). For example, somebody here said that america is "[...]economically[...] the #1", he mentioned other things aswell, which might be wrong too, but I especially remember this one because it made me laugh(once again sorry) because of the HUGE export/import deficit america has and several other reasons. Now that doesn't make you a bad people and especially not bad individuals, but you have to understand that this kind of attitude(which could be described as arrogance as one here did) doesn't really make you popular.
America is the largest economy in the world.
This is just a fact, i don't see why we need to dispute that. It might not be like that forever, but that doesn't change the current fact of life. The USA is the largest economy in the entire world.
To actually go on and ridicule a person for being accurate is just...
large=/=best
I think that should be obvious
The quotation says that America's economy is #1. Which is accurate.
On January 21 2012 21:01 white_horse wrote: the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
oh gosh nothing but trees? true. but they didnt apear from nowhere, those guy who build that culture... they came from Europe
I have nothing against USA, but really, dont say stupid things.
Yeah it was just way to characterize how there wasn't a european style "country". I'm sure there was more than just trees on the north american continent, thanks for pointing that out.
to say that america doesn't have a culture is silly to begin with because there isn't an existing "american race" that has a "culture" that europeans would consider what they think is "developed" culture. The american culture that you see today is made up from immigrants. what is wrong about that and what is so wrong that the descendents of these immigrants don't have a culture that what you think is "developed"?
I think the problem is that america doesn't have one culture, it has many cultures as a multicultural country. The Melting Pot didn't work, the salad bowl kinda did, and that's where you're at right now. Although many citizens of the USA have certain "american" things they share with each other you're still no fully american country, large parts of your people just belong to a country with many people from all over the world connected by certain "american" traditions and habits. Notice that I'm not saying that there are no "american" americans, but large parts of your citizens consider themselves americans and others would say they are americans too, while they still kept parts of the culture of the countries they or their driect ancestors came from, which they don't share with most of their fellow americans.
Thank you for understanding this. American culture is made up of a thousand other cultures practiced within arms length of one another. It's a very rare occasion that I am in a room full of people who are just like me, and in truth, I prefer the diversity.
I don't only undestand you, I understand the guy you argued with too and partially, I agree with him(sorry). One reason why there's a certain dislike of americans(not american individuals) in the world is that you see yourself as the #1, although america has many faults and that disproportional pride and nationalism is one of those faults(although a very human one). For example, somebody here said that america is "[...]economically[...] the #1", he mentioned other things aswell, which might be wrong too, but I especially remember this one because it made me laugh(once again sorry) because of the HUGE export/import deficit america has and several other reasons. Now that doesn't make you a bad people and especially not bad individuals, but you have to understand that this kind of attitude(which could be described as arrogance as one here did) doesn't really make you popular.
America is the largest economy in the world.
This is just a fact, i don't see why we need to dispute that. It might not be like that forever, but that doesn't change the current fact of life. The USA is the largest economy in the entire world.
To actually go on and ridicule a person for being accurate is just...
large=/=best
I think that should be obvious
Since when did he suggest that, because america has the largest economy in the world, america is also the best as well?
I'm almost convinced that europeans have their brains hard-wired to accuse americans of being arrogant and uptight whenever theres some kind of discussion that involves the US.
It's just me or reaaaally in the USA people are learning like what happened every day in the USA since the XVIII century, but they dont now anything about european/asian history?
I have never in my life met even a single person in Holland that could give an accurate description of the US civil war.
I seriously believe that not even 10% of europeans could name the 2 sides in the US civil war.
That only means that your history(and maybe english) classes are pretty bad(this isn't ment as an insult here, I just thought that that claim and especially the number you gave are rediculous)
I know the sides and some of the reasons for that war, but no details (and mind you, I've been studying history for 3 years at the university). It's just so insignificant compared to the history of the rest of the world that except people who'd like to specialize in history of USA don't even bother to learn about it.
Do you know how much Polish history I've learned? There are very few parts of history which are universally relevant. Everyone has their own history that mostly everyone else doesn't learn.
Well, our histories are tied at some points We even have the same heroes.
Thaddeus Kosciusko was described by Thomas Jefferson as the "Purest son of Liberty", and George Washington commented that "He served America with courage and distinction". He is called The Father of West Point and the Father of American Artillery.
And if I had ever taken an Eastern European History course, I'd probably have learned that. I think that's pretty cool that we have "ancient" connections.
You would have to take Central European History. Poland is not Eastern Europe
That actually suprised me, I would've considered Germany to be the(geographically) most eastern country of Central Europe and Poland the(geographically) most western country of eastern europe.
Czech republic is most definitely Central Europe and more to the east than Germany But I think if we tried to find a divide between Central and Eastern Europe we would probably end up with a line that goes somewhere in the middle of current Poland.
On January 21 2012 21:01 white_horse wrote: the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
oh gosh nothing but trees? true. but they didnt apear from nowhere, those guy who build that culture... they came from Europe
I have nothing against USA, but really, dont say stupid things.
Yeah it was just way to characterize how there wasn't a european style "country". I'm sure there was more than just trees on the north american continent, thanks for pointing that out.
to say that america doesn't have a culture is silly to begin with because there isn't an existing "american race" that has a "culture" that europeans would consider what they think is "developed" culture. The american culture that you see today is made up from immigrants. what is wrong about that and what is so wrong that the descendents of these immigrants don't have a culture that what you think is "developed"?
I think the problem is that america doesn't have one culture, it has many cultures as a multicultural country. The Melting Pot didn't work, the salad bowl kinda did, and that's where you're at right now. Although many citizens of the USA have certain "american" things they share with each other you're still no fully american country, large parts of your people just belong to a country with many people from all over the world connected by certain "american" traditions and habits. Notice that I'm not saying that there are no "american" americans, but large parts of your citizens consider themselves americans and others would say they are americans too, while they still kept parts of the culture of the countries they or their driect ancestors came from, which they don't share with most of their fellow americans.
Thank you for understanding this. American culture is made up of a thousand other cultures practiced within arms length of one another. It's a very rare occasion that I am in a room full of people who are just like me, and in truth, I prefer the diversity.
I don't only undestand you, I understand the guy you argued with too and partially, I agree with him(sorry). One reason why there's a certain dislike of americans(not american individuals) in the world is that you see yourself as the #1, although america has many faults and that disproportional pride and nationalism is one of those faults(although a very human one). For example, somebody here said that america is "[...]economically[...] the #1", he mentioned other things aswell, which might be wrong too, but I especially remember this one because it made me laugh(once again sorry) because of the HUGE export/import deficit america has and several other reasons. Now that doesn't make you a bad people and especially not bad individuals, but you have to understand that this kind of attitude(which could be described as arrogance as one here did) doesn't really make you popular.
America is the largest economy in the world.
This is just a fact, i don't see why we need to dispute that. It might not be like that forever, but that doesn't change the current fact of life. The USA is the largest economy in the entire world.
To actually go on and ridicule a person for being accurate is just...
large=/=best
I think that should be obvious
A large economy and a large genitalia are very similar. Both are desired. Both can be used to rape and pillage. Both are best when large, independent of the aforementioned rape.
Should we stop raping China and Mexico? Hell yes. Does it make our economy "bad" because we do? No. Is our economy "bad"? Compared to what it was, sure, but we're still doing a hell of a lot better than Tijuana ever was.
Does America lack culture? No. Do people in America lack culture? Many do.
I think by saying that "Country X has/doesn't have Y" is a bit of a sweeping generalization. I know people who are cultured, and people who are uncultured, both groups residing in America. I think the right phrase would be "Many People in America have no culture," which would be true, but the same could be said for many other countries as well.
On January 21 2012 21:34 seansye wrote: Anyways America is very young and it's creating its own unique culture and history everyday. Five hundred years from now, America will probably be compared to countries like Egypt, Rome, Greece, Great Brit, etc...
Yeah... no.
By the way, Rome isn't a country.
Ancient Rome was a lot more than a country.
My history sucks =X.
Btw Europe is not a country either, but when it comes to being compared to America, you guys sure seem to unite.
As a Native American I would like to say the USA has a lot of culture that is just as old, if not older than most of European culture. People in here are saying the USA just got it's culture from other places. While this may be true, where do you think those other places got their culture from? Greece invaded many countries and it's influence impacted the culture of those places (Alexandria, Egypt anyone?), Rome invaded many countries and it's influence heavily impacted those cultures (England hihi), and there are more examples all throughout history. I think most people are confusing culture with history. History is something that effects culture, but culture is not history. France controlling parts of current USA and Canada has effected the current culture of those places.
Not many people of today live life the same way as their ancestors did. I don't see many druids running around the UK lately, or any slaves building pyramids in Egypt, or tyrannical Emperors fucking shit up in Italy. Modern culture, now more than ever, is becoming very blurred between countries. Of course everybody will still have their differences, easily noted in the different accents and fashions within different parts of any country. But with the internet and how much we communicate, everybody is assimilated everybody else's cultures, becoming a World Culture.
If you look at the wikipedia article for culture it states this as the definitions:
Excellence of taste in the fine arts and humanities, also known as high culture An integrated pattern of human knowledge, belief, and behavior that depends upon the capacity for symbolic thought and social learning The set of shared attitudes, values, goals, and practices that characterizes an institution, organization, or group
None of these descriptions has anything to do with age of a culture. If you look at those definitions, the USA has many cultures, which are all part of the national culture, which is part of the global culture. History effects our current culture, but we all share our history in some way. The age of a nation has nothing to do with it's culture at all.
On January 21 2012 21:01 white_horse wrote: the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
oh gosh nothing but trees? true. but they didnt apear from nowhere, those guy who build that culture... they came from Europe
I have nothing against USA, but really, dont say stupid things.
Yeah it was just way to characterize how there wasn't a european style "country". I'm sure there was more than just trees on the north american continent, thanks for pointing that out.
to say that america doesn't have a culture is silly to begin with because there isn't an existing "american race" that has a "culture" that europeans would consider what they think is "developed" culture. The american culture that you see today is made up from immigrants. what is wrong about that and what is so wrong that the descendents of these immigrants don't have a culture that what you think is "developed"?
I think the problem is that america doesn't have one culture, it has many cultures as a multicultural country. The Melting Pot didn't work, the salad bowl kinda did, and that's where you're at right now. Although many citizens of the USA have certain "american" things they share with each other you're still no fully american country, large parts of your people just belong to a country with many people from all over the world connected by certain "american" traditions and habits. Notice that I'm not saying that there are no "american" americans, but large parts of your citizens consider themselves americans and others would say they are americans too, while they still kept parts of the culture of the countries they or their driect ancestors came from, which they don't share with most of their fellow americans.
Thank you for understanding this. American culture is made up of a thousand other cultures practiced within arms length of one another. It's a very rare occasion that I am in a room full of people who are just like me, and in truth, I prefer the diversity.
I don't only undestand you, I understand the guy you argued with too and partially, I agree with him(sorry). One reason why there's a certain dislike of americans(not american individuals) in the world is that you see yourself as the #1, although america has many faults and that disproportional pride and nationalism is one of those faults(although a very human one). For example, somebody here said that america is "[...]economically[...] the #1", he mentioned other things aswell, which might be wrong too, but I especially remember this one because it made me laugh(once again sorry) because of the HUGE export/import deficit america has and several other reasons. Now that doesn't make you a bad people and especially not bad individuals, but you have to understand that this kind of attitude(which could be described as arrogance as one here did) doesn't really make you popular.
America is the largest economy in the world.
This is just a fact, i don't see why we need to dispute that. It might not be like that forever, but that doesn't change the current fact of life. The USA is the largest economy in the entire world.
To actually go on and ridicule a person for being accurate is just...
That person also said wealth, which is far from true, so
I've actually heard this more often than otherwise. In fact, I'm one of the culprits..though I never claimed we have no culture, I claimed our culture is bad. Drugs, Hippies, War: that's what I saw as American culture. Though you put things in a different light. And I agree with you.
On January 21 2012 21:34 seansye wrote: Anyways America is very young and it's creating its own unique culture and history everyday. Five hundred years from now, America will probably be compared to countries like Egypt, Rome, Greece, Great Brit, etc...
Yeah... no.
By the way, Rome isn't a country.
Ancient Rome was a lot more than a country.
My history sucks =X.
Btw Europe is not a country either, but when it comes to being compared to America, you guys sure seem to unite.
That's because if you add all the countries of the European Union, you have something that could be compared to how the US (and its states) would work.
On January 21 2012 21:34 seansye wrote: Anyways America is very young and it's creating its own unique culture and history everyday. Five hundred years from now, America will probably be compared to countries like Egypt, Rome, Greece, Great Brit, etc...
Yeah... no.
By the way, Rome isn't a country.
Ancient Rome was a lot more than a country.
My history sucks =X.
Btw Europe is not a country either, but when it comes to being compared to America, you guys sure seem to unite.
Because Europe and America have a lot in common, on a meta level. For example:
Europe is full of rich cultures, possibly hundreds across the continent. America is full of these same rich cultures, possibly hundreds across the nation.
It's interesting how America seems to almost act as a continent of small nations rather than a country of small states.
On January 21 2012 20:55 Khenra wrote: When I visited New York the one thing that really struck me was the lack of old buildings. The few 'old' buildings in Manhattan are only like 200 years old. Compared to most cities in Europe, where you can find buildings over 400 years old everywhere in the city centres, that's quite a shocker.
In Europe our culture comes from very old traditions, going back hundreds of years. The civilized United States simply aren't that old. To the guy above saying that the United States are older than most countries in Europe: the names of the countries may have changed, but we had people living here for thousands of years. When the Europeans came to America they killed all the inhabitants, thus destroying any culture that was going on there.
That's a part of our culture -- modernization. Nothing but the best. There are still some pretty old buildings in New York, especially the Churches and most notably Federal Hall, built in 1842, complete with the statue of George Washington, first President of the United States.
You can be modern and still have aesthetically pleasing creations, but I am not really having a problem with New York, more with smaller cities and suburbs. Especially glaring is the copying of the styles of ancient Rome and Greece even in public buildings (White house I am looking at you ). Why not use a style that actually fits into the surrounding terrain/plant-life/climate/existing architecture. But that is unfortunately not purely American problem, it is just more visible in US.
But European architecture is damned beautiful. It would be folly to not go for that style. Should we have our own? Yeah, but not exclusively our own. It should be mixed in.
Yes, but pick the European style that suits the environment. Roman-style is not appropriate for most of US.
On January 21 2012 20:55 Khenra wrote: When I visited New York the one thing that really struck me was the lack of old buildings. The few 'old' buildings in Manhattan are only like 200 years old. Compared to most cities in Europe, where you can find buildings over 400 years old everywhere in the city centres, that's quite a shocker.
In Europe our culture comes from very old traditions, going back hundreds of years. The civilized United States simply aren't that old. To the guy above saying that the United States are older than most countries in Europe: the names of the countries may have changed, but we had people living here for thousands of years. When the Europeans came to America they killed all the inhabitants, thus destroying any culture that was going on there.
That's a part of our culture -- modernization. Nothing but the best. There are still some pretty old buildings in New York, especially the Churches and most notably Federal Hall, built in 1842, complete with the statue of George Washington, first President of the United States.
You can be modern and still have aesthetically pleasing creations, but I am not really having a problem with New York, more with smaller cities and suburbs. Especially glaring is the copying of the styles of ancient Rome and Greece even in public buildings (White house I am looking at you ). Why not use a style that actually fits into the surrounding terrain/plant-life/climate/existing architecture. But that is unfortunately not purely American problem, it is just more visible in US.
But European architecture is damned beautiful. It would be folly to not go for that style. Should we have our own? Yeah, but not exclusively our own. It should be mixed in.
Yes, but pick the European style that suits the environment. Roman-style is not appropriate for most of US.
Haha, I had almost come to associate that style with the US government. They seem to use only that style a lot. But I think it's more of a dedication to one of the greatest democracies to ever exist. I'm sure that went through the building(s) designer(')s(') mind(s) when they decided on that.
On January 21 2012 21:01 white_horse wrote: the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
oh gosh nothing but trees? true. but they didnt apear from nowhere, those guy who build that culture... they came from Europe
I have nothing against USA, but really, dont say stupid things.
Yeah it was just way to characterize how there wasn't a european style "country". I'm sure there was more than just trees on the north american continent, thanks for pointing that out.
to say that america doesn't have a culture is silly to begin with because there isn't an existing "american race" that has a "culture" that europeans would consider what they think is "developed" culture. The american culture that you see today is made up from immigrants. what is wrong about that and what is so wrong that the descendents of these immigrants don't have a culture that what you think is "developed"?
I think the problem is that america doesn't have one culture, it has many cultures as a multicultural country. The Melting Pot didn't work, the salad bowl kinda did, and that's where you're at right now. Although many citizens of the USA have certain "american" things they share with each other you're still no fully american country, large parts of your people just belong to a country with many people from all over the world connected by certain "american" traditions and habits. Notice that I'm not saying that there are no "american" americans, but large parts of your citizens consider themselves americans and others would say they are americans too, while they still kept parts of the culture of the countries they or their driect ancestors came from, which they don't share with most of their fellow americans.
Thank you for understanding this. American culture is made up of a thousand other cultures practiced within arms length of one another. It's a very rare occasion that I am in a room full of people who are just like me, and in truth, I prefer the diversity.
I don't only undestand you, I understand the guy you argued with too and partially, I agree with him(sorry). One reason why there's a certain dislike of americans(not american individuals) in the world is that you see yourself as the #1, although america has many faults and that disproportional pride and nationalism is one of those faults(although a very human one). For example, somebody here said that america is "[...]economically[...] the #1", he mentioned other things aswell, which might be wrong too, but I especially remember this one because it made me laugh(once again sorry) because of the HUGE export/import deficit america has and several other reasons. Now that doesn't make you a bad people and especially not bad individuals, but you have to understand that this kind of attitude(which could be described as arrogance as one here did) doesn't really make you popular.
So talking about facts suddenly make me the stereotypical arrogant american? Might as well just tell me that you think all americans have some kind of high-horse attitude. America has the biggest economy in the world and the strongest military in the world. Those are facts. Does reading those lines make your stomach hurt? Then you have a complex.
Anyways, did I say that "USA is the strongest and we can do anything we want because everyone else sucks"? I was simply stating in my previous post that because america is a global hegemony, a lot of people find that as a reason to hate it. There are people in china, korea, japan, parts of middle east, parts of europe who bash america yet they want to send their kids there to study at american universities or they want to immigrate there. If that isn't jealousy or a complex I don't what is.
... There's a reason why I mentioned no names, I didn't mean you personally I ment that attitude in general and to be honest if you took offense in my post you might have to think about yourself a bit and if you don't have a lil complex yourself. "OH NO HE SAID SOMETHING AGAINST THE USA HE'S JUST JEALOUS." Calm down man, the world isn't tottally jealous of you, maybe in some third world countries, but that's about it. And as you said
There are people
not a majority, and just because they want to immigrate to america doesn't mean that they're jealous of you. Yes america has some good universities(some of the best), but america is also a huge country so it would be quite a shame if it wouldn't have good universities(Germany is smaller than some of your states alone). There are a shitton of people who study in Germany(yes Americans too) and want to immigrate here, does that mean that they are jealous? NO, it means they go where they have good possibilities to get a good education for what they are interested in. And America isn't a big economical player because you have such a great economy, you just import a lot from other countries(which is bad for you...) and you are pretty damn big, without the other countries which support you(e.g. China) you would've gone down long ago, but they don't want that because there's a big market in America for the stuff they produce(for the German economy too). And I can already see you writing: "Well Germany would be fucked without other countries too, because you guys need people to buy your shit!" Yeah, but that's because we are more succesful than you guys and can actually rely on people buying our products enough that it's not that bad that we rely on people buying stuff from us(although that means ofc that letting them go down (EUROPE ZONE!) would be bad for us).
On January 21 2012 22:02 white_horse wrote:
Since when did he suggest that, because america has the largest economy in the world, america is also the best as well?
I'm almost convinced that europeans have their brains hard-wired to accuse americans of being arrogant and uptight whenever theres some kind of discussion that involves the US.
That may be because the first thing that usually comes from americans is: THAT'S NOT TRUE, YOU ARE JUST JEALOUS!
On January 21 2012 20:55 Khenra wrote: When I visited New York the one thing that really struck me was the lack of old buildings. The few 'old' buildings in Manhattan are only like 200 years old. Compared to most cities in Europe, where you can find buildings over 400 years old everywhere in the city centres, that's quite a shocker.
In Europe our culture comes from very old traditions, going back hundreds of years. The civilized United States simply aren't that old. To the guy above saying that the United States are older than most countries in Europe: the names of the countries may have changed, but we had people living here for thousands of years. When the Europeans came to America they killed all the inhabitants, thus destroying any culture that was going on there.
That's a part of our culture -- modernization. Nothing but the best. There are still some pretty old buildings in New York, especially the Churches and most notably Federal Hall, built in 1842, complete with the statue of George Washington, first President of the United States.
You can be modern and still have aesthetically pleasing creations, but I am not really having a problem with New York, more with smaller cities and suburbs. Especially glaring is the copying of the styles of ancient Rome and Greece even in public buildings (White house I am looking at you ). Why not use a style that actually fits into the surrounding terrain/plant-life/climate/existing architecture. But that is unfortunately not purely American problem, it is just more visible in US.
But European architecture is damned beautiful. It would be folly to not go for that style. Should we have our own? Yeah, but not exclusively our own. It should be mixed in.
Yes, but pick the European style that suits the environment. Roman-style is not appropriate for most of US.
Haha, I had almost come to associate that style with the US government. They seem to use only that style a lot. But I think it's more of a dedication to one of the greatest democracies to ever exist. I'm sure that went through the building(s) designer(')s(') mind(s) when they decided on that.
That's actually more of an Ancient Greek style. Ancient being the key word.
A large economy and a large genitalia are very similar. Both are desired. Both can be used to rape and pillage. Both are best when large, independent of the aforementioned rape.
Should we stop raping China and Mexico? Hell yes. Does it make our economy "bad" because we do? No. Is our economy "bad"? Compared to what it was, sure, but we're still doing a hell of a lot better than Tijuana ever was.
I don't wanna say that your economy is at the level of a thrid world country, but it's just big, not good.
This is just a fact, i don't see why we need to dispute that. It might not be like that forever, but that doesn't change the current fact of life. The USA is the largest economy in the entire world.
To actually go on and ridicule a person for being accurate is just...
That person also said wealth, which is far from true, so
A large economy and a large genitalia are very similar. Both are desired. Both can be used to rape and pillage. Both are best when large, independent of the aforementioned rape.
Should we stop raping China and Mexico? Hell yes. Does it make our economy "bad" because we do? No. Is our economy "bad"? Compared to what it was, sure, but we're still doing a hell of a lot better than Tijuana ever was.
I don't wanna say that your economy is at the level of a thrid world country, but it's just big, not good.
This is just a fact, i don't see why we need to dispute that. It might not be like that forever, but that doesn't change the current fact of life. The USA is the largest economy in the entire world.
To actually go on and ridicule a person for being accurate is just...
That person also said wealth, which is far from true, so
Thank you
I'd love for you to prove that the US economy is similar to a majority of the third world countries, and by extension very different than the majority of first world countries. Good luck.
On January 21 2012 21:01 white_horse wrote: the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
oh gosh nothing but trees? true. but they didnt apear from nowhere, those guy who build that culture... they came from Europe
I have nothing against USA, but really, dont say stupid things.
Yeah it was just way to characterize how there wasn't a european style "country". I'm sure there was more than just trees on the north american continent, thanks for pointing that out.
to say that america doesn't have a culture is silly to begin with because there isn't an existing "american race" that has a "culture" that europeans would consider what they think is "developed" culture. The american culture that you see today is made up from immigrants. what is wrong about that and what is so wrong that the descendents of these immigrants don't have a culture that what you think is "developed"?
I think the problem is that america doesn't have one culture, it has many cultures as a multicultural country. The Melting Pot didn't work, the salad bowl kinda did, and that's where you're at right now. Although many citizens of the USA have certain "american" things they share with each other you're still no fully american country, large parts of your people just belong to a country with many people from all over the world connected by certain "american" traditions and habits. Notice that I'm not saying that there are no "american" americans, but large parts of your citizens consider themselves americans and others would say they are americans too, while they still kept parts of the culture of the countries they or their driect ancestors came from, which they don't share with most of their fellow americans.
Thank you for understanding this. American culture is made up of a thousand other cultures practiced within arms length of one another. It's a very rare occasion that I am in a room full of people who are just like me, and in truth, I prefer the diversity.
I don't only undestand you, I understand the guy you argued with too and partially, I agree with him(sorry). One reason why there's a certain dislike of americans(not american individuals) in the world is that you see yourself as the #1, although america has many faults and that disproportional pride and nationalism is one of those faults(although a very human one). For example, somebody here said that america is "[...]economically[...] the #1", he mentioned other things aswell, which might be wrong too, but I especially remember this one because it made me laugh(once again sorry) because of the HUGE export/import deficit america has and several other reasons. Now that doesn't make you a bad people and especially not bad individuals, but you have to understand that this kind of attitude(which could be described as arrogance as one here did) doesn't really make you popular.
America is the largest economy in the world.
This is just a fact, i don't see why we need to dispute that. It might not be like that forever, but that doesn't change the current fact of life. The USA is the largest economy in the entire world.
To actually go on and ridicule a person for being accurate is just...
large=/=best
I think that should be obvious
Since when did he suggest that, because america has the largest economy in the world, america is also the best as well?
I'm almost convinced that europeans have their brains hard-wired to accuse americans of being arrogant and uptight whenever theres some kind of discussion that involves the US.
He did when he jumped to the defence of someone claiming that "the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc. "
The statement #1 indeed suggests best, not largest... Geez I'm almost convinced that americans have their brains hard-wired to being automatically insulted if they can't claim USA #1 even when it just isn't true (look, I can make retarded generalizations as well).
I think the statement in the OP is meant to go on the civilians and not the society, meaning that american tourists are in Europe widely regarded to have a tendency to be pretty damn tactless - which obviously doesn't hold true for all americans and is probably unjust to the majority, but that is the way prejudice works.
On January 21 2012 21:01 white_horse wrote: the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
oh gosh nothing but trees? true. but they did apear from nowhere, those guy who build that culture... they came from Europe
No, they left Europe and then broke political connections through military action. There's a qualitative difference.
It's important to now separate the two factions that existed after settlement. The Europeans loyal to Europe, and the Europeans loyal to this new land.
Neither of those two factions existed... ever. They didn't even exist in a figurative sense. That is a completely romanticized and made up oversimplification of what actually happened and what made people leave Europe to America or side with that "military action" against European imperialism.
Do you really think that most of the Irish people that left to America felt no connection or loyalty towards their homeland and culture? That would be very ironic considering that loyalty is actually a huge part of why they had to leave in the first place. -__-
Study actual American history from pre-Revolutionary War to the ratification of the Constitution, and make sure you read all of the Federalist papers.
Obviously I am going to devote several months of my life to study a topic some random forum user recommended because he had no other means of defending the nonsensical claims he made. That seems perfectly reasonable.
I have. And while there is a lot of romanticizing going on in history classes in middle school, you get to learn about these men for real in university. The Sons of Liberty really did exist, and there were large factions of anti-British. Whether they came from Ireland or the Netherlands, even if they loved their home land greatly, they still fought for America against the British who sought only to annex the country for wealth.
Nobody disputes that they did, and why wouldn't they? It was a reasonable thing to oppose an overseas imperialistic government in their position.
That does not mean that they stopped being aware of their cultural origin and tradition and that it somehow stopped existing during the formative years of United States.
The only reason why I heared someone saying that America has no culture was because of their influence on the Esskultur ("eating culture"?, is there an english word for that meaning?) Fast food-restaurants and stuff like that are something I by myself consider to be "minor"/loss of culture (<- I am a food racist!) compared to my cultures usual food.
Notes: I would consider Basketball to be from Canada when the inventor was Canadian (by birth).
Someone claimed that the USA might be considered to have no culture because their language isn't that old... You guys speak English which comes from England...
When people say "Americans have no culture", they are referring to the aesthetic term "culture" or more generally to humanist sensitivity, not the anthropological term "culture". Of course any nation and any people have anthropological culture. Its impossible not to. Jazz and rock'n roll and coca-cola and baseball are examples of anthropological culture. Appreciation and understanding of the subtle but universal themes of the human condition, for example in the movie Brokeback Mountain can be classified as aesthetic culture as opposed to the easy to digest black and white themes of a movie like Predator. Understanding of the current condition of the global economy and how it affects changes in the lives of people from India to Indiana is an example of humanist sensitivity. That many Americans (I have no idea how prevalent) would rather watch reality TV than seek to understand reality and humanity on a deep level is what they mean when they say "Americans have no culture". I don't think it has anything to do with how old the buildings are or what sport or music was invented where.
Its a broad statement. On average, is it true or more true than for people of other countries? I'm going to have to go with a qualified "yes".
A large economy and a large genitalia are very similar. Both are desired. Both can be used to rape and pillage. Both are best when large, independent of the aforementioned rape.
Should we stop raping China and Mexico? Hell yes. Does it make our economy "bad" because we do? No. Is our economy "bad"? Compared to what it was, sure, but we're still doing a hell of a lot better than Tijuana ever was.
I don't wanna say that your economy is at the level of a thrid world country, but it's just big, not good.
On January 21 2012 22:06 mcc wrote:
America is the largest economy in the world.
This is just a fact, i don't see why we need to dispute that. It might not be like that forever, but that doesn't change the current fact of life. The USA is the largest economy in the entire world.
To actually go on and ridicule a person for being accurate is just...
That person also said wealth, which is far from true, so
Thank you
I'd love for you to prove that the US economy is similar to a majority of the third world countries, and by extension very different than the majority of first world countries. Good luck.
I didn't say similiar to, I just said on the level of(wealthwise).
On January 21 2012 21:01 white_horse wrote: the way people make fun of america just suggests that they have a complex against the #1 country in the world in terms of wealth, influence, military, economy, etc.
In any case, its so fucking stupid especially for europeans who bash america for its culture. We've been around for uh 250 years? and european cultures had thousands of years to develop. Thousands of years ago in america there was nothing but trees and native americans. so many haters around the world.
oh gosh nothing but trees? true. but they did apear from nowhere, those guy who build that culture... they came from Europe
No, they left Europe and then broke political connections through military action. There's a qualitative difference.
It's important to now separate the two factions that existed after settlement. The Europeans loyal to Europe, and the Europeans loyal to this new land.
Neither of those two factions existed... ever. They didn't even exist in a figurative sense. That is a completely romanticized and made up oversimplification of what actually happened and what made people leave Europe to America or side with that "military action" against European imperialism.
Do you really think that most of the Irish people that left to America felt no connection or loyalty towards their homeland and culture? That would be very ironic considering that loyalty is actually a huge part of why they had to leave in the first place. -__-
Study actual American history from pre-Revolutionary War to the ratification of the Constitution, and make sure you read all of the Federalist papers.
Obviously I am going to devote several months of my life to study a topic some random forum user recommended because he had no other means of defending the nonsensical claims he made. That seems perfectly reasonable.
I have. And while there is a lot of romanticizing going on in history classes in middle school, you get to learn about these men for real in university. The Sons of Liberty really did exist, and there were large factions of anti-British. Whether they came from Ireland or the Netherlands, even if they loved their home land greatly, they still fought for America against the British who sought only to annex the country for wealth.
Nobody disputes that they did, and why wouldn't they? It was a reasonable thing to oppose an overseas imperialistic government in their position.
That does not mean that they stopped being aware of their cultural origin and tradition and that it somehow stopped existing during the formative years of United States.
I never tried to say that. Maybe my message was unclear? I have a tendency to be a bit ambiguous at times. It seems that we agree more than we disagree, so I will leave it at that.
I'd still recommend reading the Federalist No. 51. It's a pretty good, but difficult, read. It describes a lot of the controls placed on government, why they are necessary, and other relevant information.
A large economy and a large genitalia are very similar. Both are desired. Both can be used to rape and pillage. Both are best when large, independent of the aforementioned rape.
Should we stop raping China and Mexico? Hell yes. Does it make our economy "bad" because we do? No. Is our economy "bad"? Compared to what it was, sure, but we're still doing a hell of a lot better than Tijuana ever was.
I don't wanna say that your economy is at the level of a thrid world country, but it's just big, not good.
On January 21 2012 22:06 mcc wrote:
America is the largest economy in the world.
This is just a fact, i don't see why we need to dispute that. It might not be like that forever, but that doesn't change the current fact of life. The USA is the largest economy in the entire world.
To actually go on and ridicule a person for being accurate is just...
That person also said wealth, which is far from true, so
Thank you
I'd love for you to prove that the US economy is similar to a majority of the third world countries, and by extension very different than the majority of first world countries. Good luck.
I didn't say similiar to, I just said on the level of(wealthwise).
"On the level of" doesn't mean "similar"? Uhh... you better practice your English.
A large economy and a large genitalia are very similar. Both are desired. Both can be used to rape and pillage. Both are best when large, independent of the aforementioned rape.
Should we stop raping China and Mexico? Hell yes. Does it make our economy "bad" because we do? No. Is our economy "bad"? Compared to what it was, sure, but we're still doing a hell of a lot better than Tijuana ever was.
I don't wanna say that your economy is at the level of a thrid world country, but it's just big, not good.
On January 21 2012 22:06 mcc wrote:
America is the largest economy in the world.
This is just a fact, i don't see why we need to dispute that. It might not be like that forever, but that doesn't change the current fact of life. The USA is the largest economy in the entire world.
To actually go on and ridicule a person for being accurate is just...
That person also said wealth, which is far from true, so
Thank you
I'd love for you to prove that the US economy is similar to a majority of the third world countries, and by extension very different than the majority of first world countries. Good luck.
I didn't say similiar to, I just said on the level of(wealthwise).
"On the level of" doesn't mean "similar"? Uhh... you better practice your English.
It doesn't. Let's say something stupid like: Roman armies in the year 0 were on the level of Japanese armies in the year 1600.(if that's true or not isn't important here) Now that they are on the same level in terms of fighting efficiency doesn't mean that they were similiar to each other. PS:
America has a culture just like Europe and every single european country has.
The difference is, that Europe has a larger varity of culture. 3000 years of history formed so many unique things, while America has 300 years of history, thats what America lacks a bit.
Some ppl are pretty harsh and would concider America - if it would disappear right now - just another nation like Rome, created by Europeans and finally failing to survive. Whoever thinks like that doesnt know that a) America is much more than that, because of multiculture influences. b) There where quite high developed cultures in the past thousands of years on the American continent as well. c) With saying that America has no culture, they basically say Rome had no culture as well - the biggest possible fail.
On January 21 2012 20:55 Khenra wrote: When I visited New York the one thing that really struck me was the lack of old buildings. The few 'old' buildings in Manhattan are only like 200 years old. Compared to most cities in Europe, where you can find buildings over 400 years old everywhere in the city centres, that's quite a shocker.
In Europe our culture comes from very old traditions, going back hundreds of years. The civilized United States simply aren't that old. To the guy above saying that the United States are older than most countries in Europe: the names of the countries may have changed, but we had people living here for thousands of years. When the Europeans came to America they killed all the inhabitants, thus destroying any culture that was going on there.
That's a part of our culture -- modernization. Nothing but the best. There are still some pretty old buildings in New York, especially the Churches and most notably Federal Hall, built in 1842, complete with the statue of George Washington, first President of the United States.
You can be modern and still have aesthetically pleasing creations, but I am not really having a problem with New York, more with smaller cities and suburbs. Especially glaring is the copying of the styles of ancient Rome and Greece even in public buildings (White house I am looking at you ). Why not use a style that actually fits into the surrounding terrain/plant-life/climate/existing architecture. But that is unfortunately not purely American problem, it is just more visible in US.
But European architecture is damned beautiful. It would be folly to not go for that style. Should we have our own? Yeah, but not exclusively our own. It should be mixed in.
Yes, but pick the European style that suits the environment. Roman-style is not appropriate for most of US.
Haha, I had almost come to associate that style with the US government. They seem to use only that style a lot. But I think it's more of a dedication to one of the greatest democracies to ever exist. I'm sure that went through the building(s) designer(')s(') mind(s) when they decided on that.
I don't know if by the greatest democracy to exist you mean Greece or Rome, but both were extremely poor democracies in modern standards. You could probably find better democracies than them in 1776. But as for the style I am sure it was meant exactly like that. I think it was a link to Rome more than to Greece, considering US is a republic and not a direct democracy. Also as far as I know creators of US system were more impressed with practical solutions of Romans as opposed to "purity" of Greek democracy. But still, it is a terrible style for non-Mediterranean climate.
A large economy and a large genitalia are very similar. Both are desired. Both can be used to rape and pillage. Both are best when large, independent of the aforementioned rape.
Should we stop raping China and Mexico? Hell yes. Does it make our economy "bad" because we do? No. Is our economy "bad"? Compared to what it was, sure, but we're still doing a hell of a lot better than Tijuana ever was.
I don't wanna say that your economy is at the level of a thrid world country, but it's just big, not good.
On January 21 2012 22:06 mcc wrote:
America is the largest economy in the world.
This is just a fact, i don't see why we need to dispute that. It might not be like that forever, but that doesn't change the current fact of life. The USA is the largest economy in the entire world.
To actually go on and ridicule a person for being accurate is just...
That person also said wealth, which is far from true, so
Thank you
I'd love for you to prove that the US economy is similar to a majority of the third world countries, and by extension very different than the majority of first world countries. Good luck.
I didn't say similiar to, I just said on the level of(wealthwise).
"On the level of" doesn't mean "similar"? Uhh... you better practice your English.
It doesn't. Let's say something stupid like: Roman armies in the year 0 were on the level of Japanese armies in the year 1600.(if that's true or not isn't important here) Now that they are on the same level in terms of fighting efficiency doesn't mean that they were similiar to each other. PS:
Using your example: Roman armies in the year 0 were similar to Japanese armies in the year 1600 in terms of fighting efficiency. Roman armies in the year 0 were on the same level of Japanese armies in the year 1600 in terms of fighting efficiency.
On January 21 2012 20:55 Khenra wrote: When I visited New York the one thing that really struck me was the lack of old buildings. The few 'old' buildings in Manhattan are only like 200 years old. Compared to most cities in Europe, where you can find buildings over 400 years old everywhere in the city centres, that's quite a shocker.
In Europe our culture comes from very old traditions, going back hundreds of years. The civilized United States simply aren't that old. To the guy above saying that the United States are older than most countries in Europe: the names of the countries may have changed, but we had people living here for thousands of years. When the Europeans came to America they killed all the inhabitants, thus destroying any culture that was going on there.
That's a part of our culture -- modernization. Nothing but the best. There are still some pretty old buildings in New York, especially the Churches and most notably Federal Hall, built in 1842, complete with the statue of George Washington, first President of the United States.
You can be modern and still have aesthetically pleasing creations, but I am not really having a problem with New York, more with smaller cities and suburbs. Especially glaring is the copying of the styles of ancient Rome and Greece even in public buildings (White house I am looking at you ). Why not use a style that actually fits into the surrounding terrain/plant-life/climate/existing architecture. But that is unfortunately not purely American problem, it is just more visible in US.
But European architecture is damned beautiful. It would be folly to not go for that style. Should we have our own? Yeah, but not exclusively our own. It should be mixed in.
Yes, but pick the European style that suits the environment. Roman-style is not appropriate for most of US.
Haha, I had almost come to associate that style with the US government. They seem to use only that style a lot. But I think it's more of a dedication to one of the greatest democracies to ever exist. I'm sure that went through the building(s) designer(')s(') mind(s) when they decided on that.
I don't know if by the greatest democracy to exist you mean Greece or Rome, but both were extremely poor democracies in modern standards. You could probably find better democracies than them in 1776. But as for the style I am sure it was meant exactly like that. I think it was a link to Rome more than to Greece, considering US is a republic and not a direct democracy. Also as far as I know creators of US system were more impressed with practical solutions of Romans as opposed to "purity" of Greek democracy. But still, it is a terrible style for non-Mediterranean climate.
I mean Great in terms of power, and we borrow a lot of Greek and Roman styles. Indeed, in the founding of the USA we sought to be nothing like Rome or Greece. The Federalist Papers outline why democracy is bad, and republicanism is best (not the political parties, the political systems). I wonder what would work in America though? I suppose because of the various climates we would need a variety of architecture.
A large economy and a large genitalia are very similar. Both are desired. Both can be used to rape and pillage. Both are best when large, independent of the aforementioned rape.
Should we stop raping China and Mexico? Hell yes. Does it make our economy "bad" because we do? No. Is our economy "bad"? Compared to what it was, sure, but we're still doing a hell of a lot better than Tijuana ever was.
I don't wanna say that your economy is at the level of a thrid world country, but it's just big, not good.
On January 21 2012 22:06 mcc wrote:
America is the largest economy in the world.
This is just a fact, i don't see why we need to dispute that. It might not be like that forever, but that doesn't change the current fact of life. The USA is the largest economy in the entire world.
To actually go on and ridicule a person for being accurate is just...
That person also said wealth, which is far from true, so
Thank you
I'd love for you to prove that the US economy is similar to a majority of the third world countries, and by extension very different than the majority of first world countries. Good luck.
I didn't say similiar to, I just said on the level of(wealthwise).
"On the level of" doesn't mean "similar"? Uhh... you better practice your English.
It doesn't. Let's say something stupid like: Roman armies in the year 0 were on the level of Japanese armies in the year 1600.(if that's true or not isn't important here) Now that they are on the same level in terms of fighting efficiency doesn't mean that they were similiar to each other. PS:
...you better practive your english
Using your example: Roman armies in the year 0 were similar to Japanese armies in the year 1600 in terms of fighting efficiency. Roman armies in the year 0 were on the same level of Japanese armies in the year 1600 in terms of fighting efficiency.
They mean the exact same thing...
... Think a second So they were on the same level in terms of fighting efficiency. BUT THEY WERE COMPLETELY DIFFERENT IN MOST OTHER CATEGORIES. Do you get it now? If I would've ment to say that they are similiar then I would've said that, not that they are not on the same niveau.
A large economy and a large genitalia are very similar. Both are desired. Both can be used to rape and pillage. Both are best when large, independent of the aforementioned rape.
Should we stop raping China and Mexico? Hell yes. Does it make our economy "bad" because we do? No. Is our economy "bad"? Compared to what it was, sure, but we're still doing a hell of a lot better than Tijuana ever was.
I don't wanna say that your economy is at the level of a thrid world country, but it's just big, not good.
On January 21 2012 22:06 mcc wrote:
America is the largest economy in the world.
This is just a fact, i don't see why we need to dispute that. It might not be like that forever, but that doesn't change the current fact of life. The USA is the largest economy in the entire world.
To actually go on and ridicule a person for being accurate is just...
That person also said wealth, which is far from true, so
Thank you
I'd love for you to prove that the US economy is similar to a majority of the third world countries, and by extension very different than the majority of first world countries. Good luck.
I didn't say similiar to, I just said on the level of(wealthwise).
"On the level of" doesn't mean "similar"? Uhh... you better practice your English.
It doesn't. Let's say something stupid like: Roman armies in the year 0 were on the level of Japanese armies in the year 1600.(if that's true or not isn't important here) Now that they are on the same level in terms of fighting efficiency doesn't mean that they were similiar to each other. PS:
...you better practive your english
Using your example: Roman armies in the year 0 were similar to Japanese armies in the year 1600 in terms of fighting efficiency. Roman armies in the year 0 were on the same level of Japanese armies in the year 1600 in terms of fighting efficiency.
They mean the exact same thing...
If Americans payed off their debts they'd be a third world country in terms of wealth. http://www.usdebtclock.org/ I don't think there's a similarity apart from that except for the religious fundamentalism and lack of education.
i just want to point out that baseball is not 'american'. romanians have been playing something similar since 1364. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oină.
also, when people say that US has no culture, they mean something like this: (random/bogus example) If CocaCola were to be invented by an irish living in US, it would not be considered something american.
Bah people just love to hate America like we are the root of all evil in the world. Until we cut off our foreign aid to them that is then we essential to there livelihood.
On January 21 2012 20:55 Khenra wrote: When I visited New York the one thing that really struck me was the lack of old buildings. The few 'old' buildings in Manhattan are only like 200 years old. Compared to most cities in Europe, where you can find buildings over 400 years old everywhere in the city centres, that's quite a shocker.
In Europe our culture comes from very old traditions, going back hundreds of years. The civilized United States simply aren't that old. To the guy above saying that the United States are older than most countries in Europe: the names of the countries may have changed, but we had people living here for thousands of years. When the Europeans came to America they killed all the inhabitants, thus destroying any culture that was going on there.
That's a part of our culture -- modernization. Nothing but the best. There are still some pretty old buildings in New York, especially the Churches and most notably Federal Hall, built in 1842, complete with the statue of George Washington, first President of the United States.
You can be modern and still have aesthetically pleasing creations, but I am not really having a problem with New York, more with smaller cities and suburbs. Especially glaring is the copying of the styles of ancient Rome and Greece even in public buildings (White house I am looking at you ). Why not use a style that actually fits into the surrounding terrain/plant-life/climate/existing architecture. But that is unfortunately not purely American problem, it is just more visible in US.
But European architecture is damned beautiful. It would be folly to not go for that style. Should we have our own? Yeah, but not exclusively our own. It should be mixed in.
Yes, but pick the European style that suits the environment. Roman-style is not appropriate for most of US.
Haha, I had almost come to associate that style with the US government. They seem to use only that style a lot. But I think it's more of a dedication to one of the greatest democracies to ever exist. I'm sure that went through the building(s) designer(')s(') mind(s) when they decided on that.
I don't know if by the greatest democracy to exist you mean Greece or Rome, but both were extremely poor democracies in modern standards. You could probably find better democracies than them in 1776. But as for the style I am sure it was meant exactly like that. I think it was a link to Rome more than to Greece, considering US is a republic and not a direct democracy. Also as far as I know creators of US system were more impressed with practical solutions of Romans as opposed to "purity" of Greek democracy. But still, it is a terrible style for non-Mediterranean climate.
I mean Great in terms of power, and we borrow a lot of Greek and Roman styles. Indeed, in the founding of the USA we sought to be nothing like Rome or Greece. The Federalist Papers outline why democracy is bad, and republicanism is best (not the political parties, the political systems). I wonder what would work in America though? I suppose because of the various climates we would need a variety of architecture.
The D of I was also hugely based on the idea of the Enlightenment (according to some scholars anyway).
IMO the best system would be one which has more than two (massive) parties in the States. Not the fault of the infrastructure or the people, obviously.
A large economy and a large genitalia are very similar. Both are desired. Both can be used to rape and pillage. Both are best when large, independent of the aforementioned rape.
Should we stop raping China and Mexico? Hell yes. Does it make our economy "bad" because we do? No. Is our economy "bad"? Compared to what it was, sure, but we're still doing a hell of a lot better than Tijuana ever was.
I don't wanna say that your economy is at the level of a thrid world country, but it's just big, not good.
On January 21 2012 22:06 mcc wrote:
America is the largest economy in the world.
This is just a fact, i don't see why we need to dispute that. It might not be like that forever, but that doesn't change the current fact of life. The USA is the largest economy in the entire world.
To actually go on and ridicule a person for being accurate is just...
That person also said wealth, which is far from true, so
Thank you
I'd love for you to prove that the US economy is similar to a majority of the third world countries, and by extension very different than the majority of first world countries. Good luck.
I didn't say similiar to, I just said on the level of(wealthwise).
"On the level of" doesn't mean "similar"? Uhh... you better practice your English.
It doesn't. Let's say something stupid like: Roman armies in the year 0 were on the level of Japanese armies in the year 1600.(if that's true or not isn't important here) Now that they are on the same level in terms of fighting efficiency doesn't mean that they were similiar to each other. PS:
...you better practive your english
Using your example: Roman armies in the year 0 were similar to Japanese armies in the year 1600 in terms of fighting efficiency. Roman armies in the year 0 were on the same level of Japanese armies in the year 1600 in terms of fighting efficiency.
They mean the exact same thing...
... Think a second So they were on the same level in terms of fighting efficiency. BUT THEY WERE COMPLETELY DIFFERENT IN MOST OTHER CATEGORIES. Do you get it now? If I would've ment to say that they are similiar then I would've said that, not that they are not on the same niveau.
Here's what you posted: "I don't wanna say that your economy is at the level of a thrid world country, but it's just big, not good."
You didn't say "in terms of wealth" . You just said economy. Meaning you said "the US economy is on the same level of a third world country". You didn't specify specific attributes. You basically said "the US economy is surrounded by, or on the same level, of third world countries in their economy".
On January 21 2012 22:40 xM(Z wrote: i just want to point out that baseball is not 'american'. romanians have been playing something similar since 1364. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oină.
also, when people say that US has no culture, they mean something like this: (random/bogus example) If CocaCola were to be invented by an irish living in US, it would not be considered something american.
by that measure, soccer was invented in china around 300BC.
On January 21 2012 20:55 Khenra wrote: When I visited New York the one thing that really struck me was the lack of old buildings. The few 'old' buildings in Manhattan are only like 200 years old. Compared to most cities in Europe, where you can find buildings over 400 years old everywhere in the city centres, that's quite a shocker.
In Europe our culture comes from very old traditions, going back hundreds of years. The civilized United States simply aren't that old. To the guy above saying that the United States are older than most countries in Europe: the names of the countries may have changed, but we had people living here for thousands of years. When the Europeans came to America they killed all the inhabitants, thus destroying any culture that was going on there.
That's a part of our culture -- modernization. Nothing but the best. There are still some pretty old buildings in New York, especially the Churches and most notably Federal Hall, built in 1842, complete with the statue of George Washington, first President of the United States.
You can be modern and still have aesthetically pleasing creations, but I am not really having a problem with New York, more with smaller cities and suburbs. Especially glaring is the copying of the styles of ancient Rome and Greece even in public buildings (White house I am looking at you ). Why not use a style that actually fits into the surrounding terrain/plant-life/climate/existing architecture. But that is unfortunately not purely American problem, it is just more visible in US.
But European architecture is damned beautiful. It would be folly to not go for that style. Should we have our own? Yeah, but not exclusively our own. It should be mixed in.
Yes, but pick the European style that suits the environment. Roman-style is not appropriate for most of US.
Haha, I had almost come to associate that style with the US government. They seem to use only that style a lot. But I think it's more of a dedication to one of the greatest democracies to ever exist. I'm sure that went through the building(s) designer(')s(') mind(s) when they decided on that.
I don't know if by the greatest democracy to exist you mean Greece or Rome, but both were extremely poor democracies in modern standards. You could probably find better democracies than them in 1776. But as for the style I am sure it was meant exactly like that. I think it was a link to Rome more than to Greece, considering US is a republic and not a direct democracy. Also as far as I know creators of US system were more impressed with practical solutions of Romans as opposed to "purity" of Greek democracy. But still, it is a terrible style for non-Mediterranean climate.
I mean Great in terms of power, and we borrow a lot of Greek and Roman styles. Indeed, in the founding of the USA we sought to be nothing like Rome or Greece. The Federalist Papers outline why democracy is bad, and republicanism is best (not the political parties, the political systems). I wonder what would work in America though? I suppose because of the various climates we would need a variety of architecture.
The D of I was also hugely based on the idea of the Enlightenment (according to some scholars anyway).
IMO the best system would be one which has more than two (massive) parties in the States. Not the fault of the infrastructure or the people, obviously.
I think he spoke about architectural styles, which one would work in US. And of course the answer is variety as the landscape and climate is so varied. The only plus of having one style is that it is easy to recognize government buildings, but that is not really such a big plus.
The difference is, that Europe has a larger varity of culture. 3000 years of history formed so many unique things, while America has 300 years of history, thats what America lacks a bit.
I guess what makes me speechless when europeans bash america for its relative lack of culture is the way they phrase it, as if it's our fault for not developing a culture as good as the one they have. We just happened to not have been around as long as they have. Whats so wrong about that?
More importantly, how is it fair to even compare the culture of europe and the US? US is a giant amalgation of many different cultures. European countries like germany, france, belgium, etc are homogeonous groups of people who each share their own common set of values and characteristics (i.e culture). So how is it americans' and their ancestors' faults for not having the kind of "culture" that europeans are accustomed to?
People enjoy hating. That hating just happens to be directed at the US.
Gemany and Italy weren't exactly one homogeonous country for as far back as we can remember but I agree with that.
Out of curiosity, how big of an impact do Native Americans have on the, "culture," of the current USA?
On January 21 2012 20:55 Khenra wrote: When I visited New York the one thing that really struck me was the lack of old buildings. The few 'old' buildings in Manhattan are only like 200 years old. Compared to most cities in Europe, where you can find buildings over 400 years old everywhere in the city centres, that's quite a shocker.
In Europe our culture comes from very old traditions, going back hundreds of years. The civilized United States simply aren't that old. To the guy above saying that the United States are older than most countries in Europe: the names of the countries may have changed, but we had people living here for thousands of years. When the Europeans came to America they killed all the inhabitants, thus destroying any culture that was going on there.
That's a part of our culture -- modernization. Nothing but the best. There are still some pretty old buildings in New York, especially the Churches and most notably Federal Hall, built in 1842, complete with the statue of George Washington, first President of the United States.
You can be modern and still have aesthetically pleasing creations, but I am not really having a problem with New York, more with smaller cities and suburbs. Especially glaring is the copying of the styles of ancient Rome and Greece even in public buildings (White house I am looking at you ). Why not use a style that actually fits into the surrounding terrain/plant-life/climate/existing architecture. But that is unfortunately not purely American problem, it is just more visible in US.
But European architecture is damned beautiful. It would be folly to not go for that style. Should we have our own? Yeah, but not exclusively our own. It should be mixed in.
Yes, but pick the European style that suits the environment. Roman-style is not appropriate for most of US.
Haha, I had almost come to associate that style with the US government. They seem to use only that style a lot. But I think it's more of a dedication to one of the greatest democracies to ever exist. I'm sure that went through the building(s) designer(')s(') mind(s) when they decided on that.
I don't know if by the greatest democracy to exist you mean Greece or Rome, but both were extremely poor democracies in modern standards. You could probably find better democracies than them in 1776. But as for the style I am sure it was meant exactly like that. I think it was a link to Rome more than to Greece, considering US is a republic and not a direct democracy. Also as far as I know creators of US system were more impressed with practical solutions of Romans as opposed to "purity" of Greek democracy. But still, it is a terrible style for non-Mediterranean climate.
I mean Great in terms of power, and we borrow a lot of Greek and Roman styles. Indeed, in the founding of the USA we sought to be nothing like Rome or Greece. The Federalist Papers outline why democracy is bad, and republicanism is best (not the political parties, the political systems). I wonder what would work in America though? I suppose because of the various climates we would need a variety of architecture.
The D of I was also hugely based on the idea of the Enlightenment (according to some scholars anyway).
IMO the best system would be one which has more than two (massive) parties in the States. Not the fault of the infrastructure or the people, obviously.
I think he spoke about architectural styles, which one would work in US. And of course the answer is variety as the landscape and climate is so varied. The only plus of having one style is that it is easy to recognize government buildings, but that is not really such a big plus.
I suspect in these times US government buildings would rather go unrecognized.
The difference is, that Europe has a larger varity of culture. 3000 years of history formed so many unique things, while America has 300 years of history, thats what America lacks a bit.
I guess what makes me speechless when europeans bash america for its relative lack of culture is the way they phrase it, as if it's our fault for not developing a culture as good as the one they have. We just happened to not have been around as long as they have. Whats so wrong about that?
More importantly, how is it fair to even compare the culture of europe and the US? US is a giant amalgation of many different cultures. European countries like germany, france, belgium, etc are homogeonous groups of people who each share their own common set of values and characteristics (i.e culture). So how is it americans' and their ancestors' faults for not having the kind of "culture" that europeans are accustomed to?
People enjoy hating. That hating just happens to be directed at the US.
Gemany and Italy weren't exactly one homogeonous country for as far back as we can remember but I agree with that.
Out of curiosity, how big of an impact do Native Americans have on the, "culture," of the current USA?
Thanksgiving is one of the purely American holidays. We all know how full of bullshit the stories are, but we still celebrate it. It's something that unites all Americans. People of a hundred different cultures all stop and celebrate the fact that they're American.
Even if the natives didn't cause this directly, as the story tells us, they're still responsible for it indirectly.
The difference is, that Europe has a larger varity of culture. 3000 years of history formed so many unique things, while America has 300 years of history, thats what America lacks a bit.
I guess what makes me speechless when europeans bash america for its relative lack of culture is the way they phrase it, as if it's our fault for not developing a culture as good as the one they have. We just happened to not have been around as long as they have. Whats so wrong about that?
More importantly, how is it fair to even compare the culture of europe and the US? US is a giant amalgation of many different cultures. European countries like germany, france, belgium, etc are homogeonous groups of people who each share their own common set of values and characteristics (i.e culture). So how is it americans' and their ancestors' faults for not having the kind of "culture" that europeans are accustomed to?
People enjoy hating. That hating just happens to be directed at the US.
Gemany and Italy weren't exactly one homogeonous country for as far back as we can remember but I agree with that.
Out of curiosity, how big of an impact do Native Americans have on the, "culture," of the current USA?
They were still regions united by a common ancestry, cultural practices, language, etc.
As for Native American impact? I would say not that much, unfortunately.
The difference is, that Europe has a larger varity of culture. 3000 years of history formed so many unique things, while America has 300 years of history, thats what America lacks a bit.
I guess what makes me speechless when europeans bash america for its relative lack of culture is the way they phrase it, as if it's our fault for not developing a culture as good as the one they have. We just happened to not have been around as long as they have. Whats so wrong about that?
More importantly, how is it fair to even compare the culture of europe and the US? US is a giant amalgation of many different cultures. European countries like germany, france, belgium, etc are homogeonous groups of people who each share their own common set of values and characteristics (i.e culture). So how is it americans' and their ancestors' faults for not having the kind of "culture" that europeans are accustomed to?
People enjoy hating. That hating just happens to be directed at the US.
Gemany and Italy weren't exactly one homogeonous country for as far back as we can remember but I agree with that.
Out of curiosity, how big of an impact do Native Americans have on the, "culture," of the current USA?
Not very much. Maybe except as mascots for certain baseball teams lol.
Can we stay out of the subject of native americans? It's a source of another popular line of america-bashing.
I can basically prove that wrong in 5 seconds by turning on the tv.
Or I could go across the street from my apartment right into a MC Donalds and then continue to the cinema next to it where 60-80 % of the films they are airing right now are from America.
They probably have the most influential culture in the world right now...
Just because it's not some ancient culture doesn't mean it's not culture.
The difference is, that Europe has a larger varity of culture. 3000 years of history formed so many unique things, while America has 300 years of history, thats what America lacks a bit.
I guess what makes me speechless when europeans bash america for its relative lack of culture is the way they phrase it, as if it's our fault for not developing a culture as good as the one they have. We just happened to not have been around as long as they have. Whats so wrong about that?
More importantly, how is it fair to even compare the culture of europe and the US? US is a giant amalgation of many different cultures. European countries like germany, france, belgium, etc are homogeonous groups of people who each share their own common set of values and characteristics (i.e culture). So how is it americans' and their ancestors' faults for not having the kind of "culture" that europeans are accustomed to?
People enjoy hating. That hating just happens to be directed at the US.
Gemany and Italy weren't exactly one homogeonous country for as far back as we can remember but I agree with that.
Out of curiosity, how big of an impact do Native Americans have on the, "culture," of the current USA?
Not very much. Maybe except as mascots for certain baseball teams lol.
Can we stay out of the subject of native americans? It's a source of another popular line of america-bashing.
I prefer if we didn't stay out of Native Americans since the fact is that they still had a rich and vibrant culture for centuries, and should be a part of the fabric which makes America today, America.
Yes I know where you're coming from but the fact still stands that they were important historically, and are a part of the American lifestyle now (they are governed by the laws, etc).
Some people are seriously trying to argue that the US economy is around the level of a 3rd world country :')
I worry for the sanity of the people on my continent.
I understand the need to bash America. It's been hard having to deal with the fact that we aren't the center of the world anymore.
But atleast keep your bashing grounded in some sense of reality. You might want to atleast once in your life take a plane to the USA, step of it, and realize that in fact there is a small difference between Zimbabwe and the USA.
On January 21 2012 22:56 zalz wrote: Some people are seriously trying to argue that the US economy is around the level of a 3rd world country :')
I worry for the sanity of the people on my continent.
I understand the need to bash America. It's been hard having to deal with the fact that we aren't the center of the world anymore.
But atleast keep your bashing grounded in some sense of reality. You might want to atleast once in your life take a plane to the USA, step of it, and realize that in fact there is a small difference between Zimbabwe and the USA.
On January 21 2012 16:38 Nothingtosay wrote: My fellow Americans and team liquid goers of other nationalities.. if you have been alive for more than 5 seconds you've probably heard someone say "America has no culture".
A large economy and a large genitalia are very similar. Both are desired. Both can be used to rape and pillage. Both are best when large, independent of the aforementioned rape.
Should we stop raping China and Mexico? Hell yes. Does it make our economy "bad" because we do? No. Is our economy "bad"? Compared to what it was, sure, but we're still doing a hell of a lot better than Tijuana ever was.
I don't wanna say that your economy is at the level of a thrid world country, but it's just big, not good.
On January 21 2012 22:06 mcc wrote:
America is the largest economy in the world.
This is just a fact, i don't see why we need to dispute that. It might not be like that forever, but that doesn't change the current fact of life. The USA is the largest economy in the entire world.
To actually go on and ridicule a person for being accurate is just...
That person also said wealth, which is far from true, so
Thank you
I'd love for you to prove that the US economy is similar to a majority of the third world countries, and by extension very different than the majority of first world countries. Good luck.
I didn't say similiar to, I just said on the level of(wealthwise).
"On the level of" doesn't mean "similar"? Uhh... you better practice your English.
It doesn't. Let's say something stupid like: Roman armies in the year 0 were on the level of Japanese armies in the year 1600.(if that's true or not isn't important here) Now that they are on the same level in terms of fighting efficiency doesn't mean that they were similiar to each other. PS:
...you better practive your english
Using your example: Roman armies in the year 0 were similar to Japanese armies in the year 1600 in terms of fighting efficiency. Roman armies in the year 0 were on the same level of Japanese armies in the year 1600 in terms of fighting efficiency.
They mean the exact same thing...
... Think a second So they were on the same level in terms of fighting efficiency. BUT THEY WERE COMPLETELY DIFFERENT IN MOST OTHER CATEGORIES. Do you get it now? If I would've ment to say that they are similiar then I would've said that, not that they are not on the same niveau.
Here's what you posted: "I don't wanna say that your economy is at the level of a thrid world country, but it's just big, not good."
You didn't say "in terms of wealth" . You just said economy. Meaning you said "the US economy is on the same level of a third world country". You didn't specify specific attributes. You basically said "the US economy is surrounded by, or on the same level, of third world countries in their economy".
So, any proof?
What do you think a good economy is about? WEALTH, even if it's not fairly distributed between it's citizens, it's still about wealth.
On January 21 2012 22:56 zalz wrote: Some people are seriously trying to argue that the US economy is around the level of a 3rd world country :')
I worry for the sanity of the people on my continent.
I understand the need to bash America. It's been hard having to deal with the fact that we aren't the center of the world anymore.
But atleast keep your bashing grounded in some sense of reality. You might want to atleast once in your life take a plane to the USA, step of it, and realize that in fact there is a small difference between Zimbabwe and the USA.
pretty sure that everybody here said that it's not on the level of them (not is a very important word here)
The difference is, that Europe has a larger varity of culture. 3000 years of history formed so many unique things, while America has 300 years of history, thats what America lacks a bit.
I guess what makes me speechless when europeans bash america for its relative lack of culture is the way they phrase it, as if it's our fault for not developing a culture as good as the one they have. We just happened to not have been around as long as they have. Whats so wrong about that?
More importantly, how is it fair to even compare the culture of europe and the US? US is a giant amalgation of many different cultures. European countries like germany, france, belgium, etc are homogeonous groups of people who each share their own common set of values and characteristics (i.e culture). So how is it americans' and their ancestors' faults for not having the kind of "culture" that europeans are accustomed to?
People enjoy hating. That hating just happens to be directed at the US.
Gemany and Italy weren't exactly one homogeonous country for as far back as we can remember but I agree with that.
Out of curiosity, how big of an impact do Native Americans have on the, "culture," of the current USA?
Not very much. Maybe except as mascots for certain baseball teams lol.
Can we stay out of the subject of native americans? It's a source of another popular line of america-bashing.
Slowly you just seem paranoid, not everybody hates americans, in fact I'd say that most here don't.
On January 21 2012 22:56 zalz wrote: Some people are seriously trying to argue that the US economy is around the level of a 3rd world country :')
I worry for the sanity of the people on my continent.
I understand the need to bash America. It's been hard having to deal with the fact that we aren't the center of the world anymore.
But atleast keep your bashing grounded in some sense of reality. You might want to atleast once in your life take a plane to the USA, step of it, and realize that in fact there is a small difference between Zimbabwe and the USA.
pretty sure that everybody here said that it's not on the level of them (not is a very important word here)
The difference is, that Europe has a larger varity of culture. 3000 years of history formed so many unique things, while America has 300 years of history, thats what America lacks a bit.
I guess what makes me speechless when europeans bash america for its relative lack of culture is the way they phrase it, as if it's our fault for not developing a culture as good as the one they have. We just happened to not have been around as long as they have. Whats so wrong about that?
More importantly, how is it fair to even compare the culture of europe and the US? US is a giant amalgation of many different cultures. European countries like germany, france, belgium, etc are homogeonous groups of people who each share their own common set of values and characteristics (i.e culture). So how is it americans' and their ancestors' faults for not having the kind of "culture" that europeans are accustomed to?
People enjoy hating. That hating just happens to be directed at the US.
Gemany and Italy weren't exactly one homogeonous country for as far back as we can remember but I agree with that.
Out of curiosity, how big of an impact do Native Americans have on the, "culture," of the current USA?
Not very much. Maybe except as mascots for certain baseball teams lol.
Can we stay out of the subject of native americans? It's a source of another popular line of america-bashing.
Slowly you just seem paranoid, not everybody hates americans, in fact I'd say that most here don't.
Americans are on average richer then Germans.
I don't understand why this fact makes you so angry. They are richer then Dutch people aswell. I seem to still be sane.
On January 21 2012 22:56 zalz wrote: Some people are seriously trying to argue that the US economy is around the level of a 3rd world country :')
I worry for the sanity of the people on my continent.
I understand the need to bash America. It's been hard having to deal with the fact that we aren't the center of the world anymore.
But atleast keep your bashing grounded in some sense of reality. You might want to atleast once in your life take a plane to the USA, step of it, and realize that in fact there is a small difference between Zimbabwe and the USA.
On January 21 2012 22:56 zalz wrote: Some people are seriously trying to argue that the US economy is around the level of a 3rd world country :')
I worry for the sanity of the people on my continent.
I understand the need to bash America. It's been hard having to deal with the fact that we aren't the center of the world anymore.
But atleast keep your bashing grounded in some sense of reality. You might want to atleast once in your life take a plane to the USA, step of it, and realize that in fact there is a small difference between Zimbabwe and the USA.
pretty sure that everybody here said that it's not on the level of them (not is a very important word here)
On January 21 2012 22:52 white_horse wrote:
On January 21 2012 22:48 IntoTheheart wrote:
On January 21 2012 22:43 white_horse wrote:
On January 21 2012 22:31 KalWarkov wrote:
The difference is, that Europe has a larger varity of culture. 3000 years of history formed so many unique things, while America has 300 years of history, thats what America lacks a bit.
I guess what makes me speechless when europeans bash america for its relative lack of culture is the way they phrase it, as if it's our fault for not developing a culture as good as the one they have. We just happened to not have been around as long as they have. Whats so wrong about that?
More importantly, how is it fair to even compare the culture of europe and the US? US is a giant amalgation of many different cultures. European countries like germany, france, belgium, etc are homogeonous groups of people who each share their own common set of values and characteristics (i.e culture). So how is it americans' and their ancestors' faults for not having the kind of "culture" that europeans are accustomed to?
People enjoy hating. That hating just happens to be directed at the US.
Gemany and Italy weren't exactly one homogeonous country for as far back as we can remember but I agree with that.
Out of curiosity, how big of an impact do Native Americans have on the, "culture," of the current USA?
Not very much. Maybe except as mascots for certain baseball teams lol.
Can we stay out of the subject of native americans? It's a source of another popular line of america-bashing.
Slowly you just seem paranoid, not everybody hates americans, in fact I'd say that most here don't.
Americans are on average richer then Germans.
I don't understand why this fact makes you so angry. They are richer then Dutch people aswell. I seem to still be sane.
Pretty sure that the average income of a US American is lower than the one of a German, and they have way bigger debts with a lower probability to pay them back aswell. Atleast that would only make sense, since lower jobless number, a high export/import difference in germany, opposed to the export/import deficit in america, it's lower credit rating(triple A anyone?) and the higher debts.
On January 21 2012 22:40 xM(Z wrote: i just want to point out that baseball is not 'american'. romanians have been playing something similar since 1364. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oină.
also, when people say that US has no culture, they mean something like this: (random/bogus example) If CocaCola were to be invented by an irish living in US, it would not be considered something american.
And here is a post that just completely smells of rediculous nationalism and hatred towards the US. Some people have such a big complex against the US they must dig to the absolute bottom of the barrel to find some obscure fact that somehow and in someway proves we Americans are unoriginal and just copy/stole everything from other countries.
You my friend are just plain ignorant and stupid if you think that Romanians invented baseball. Just because a sport preceded baseball and used a similar ball etc, does not mean that is the same sport...
On January 21 2012 22:40 xM(Z wrote: i just want to point out that baseball is not 'american'. romanians have been playing something similar since 1364. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oină.
also, when people say that US has no culture, they mean something like this: (random/bogus example) If CocaCola were to be invented by an irish living in US, it would not be considered something american.
by that measure, soccer was invented in china around 300BC.
i do not consider re-runs, re-makes, re-adaptations as part of ones culture. if you do, thats your business.
It's mainly bashing modern American society and bashing the tacky 'fast food, gun obsession and spoiled teens who demand the new iPhone for christmas every year' image that I along with many other foriegners percieve. A warranted but nonetheless untrue view. And remember that these cultural icons become less relevant each year. It's not the lack of culture. It's the lack of people caring about it.
EDIT: I'd think baseball is based on cricket. But you wouldn't say soccer isn't part of Europe or South America's culture because it was invented in England.
On January 21 2012 22:40 xM(Z wrote: i just want to point out that baseball is not 'american'. romanians have been playing something similar since 1364. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oină.
also, when people say that US has no culture, they mean something like this: (random/bogus example) If CocaCola were to be invented by an irish living in US, it would not be considered something american.
And here is a post that just completely smells of rediculous nationalism and hatred towards the US. Some people have such a big complex against the US they must dig to the absolute bottom of the barrel to find some obscure fact that somehow and in someway proves we Americans are unoriginal and just copy/stole everything from other countries.
You my friend are just plain ignorant and stupid if you think that Romanians invented baseball. Just because a sport preceded baseball and used a similar ball etc, does not mean that is the same sport...
sheesh.. some people..
first read the phrase --> "SOMETHING SIMILAR" <-- then get it that i was just explaining a point of view (NOT MINE).
anyway, you just gave me a reason to hate US now. gratz, how do you feel?.
Oh and one more post. One thing that really irritates me is when people bash the US about its debt. Yes it is true that the USA has the largest debt in the world. However this is not really the best measure to consider. OF course since the USA has the largest economy it would seem natural that it would also have the largest debt.
So.... A better measure to consider is debt compared to % of GDP. If we look at this figure then the following nations are in much bigger shit than the US: Japan, Italy, Greece, Singapore, Belgium, Canada, Germany, France, Egypt, UK and the Netherlands.
On January 21 2012 23:16 False_Peace wrote: Oh and one more post. One thing that really irritates me is when people bash the US about its debt. Yes it is true that the USA has the largest debt in the world. However this is not really the best measure to consider. OF course since the USA has the largest economy it would seem natural that it would also have the largest debt.
So.... A better measure to consider is debt compared to % of GDP. If we look at this figure then the following nations are in much bigger shit than the US: Japan, Italy, Greece, Singapore, Belgium, Canada, Germany, France, Egypt, UK and the Netherlands.
On January 21 2012 22:40 xM(Z wrote: i just want to point out that baseball is not 'american'. romanians have been playing something similar since 1364. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oină.
also, when people say that US has no culture, they mean something like this: (random/bogus example) If CocaCola were to be invented by an irish living in US, it would not be considered something american.
And here is a post that just completely smells of rediculous nationalism and hatred towards the US. Some people have such a big complex against the US they must dig to the absolute bottom of the barrel to find some obscure fact that somehow and in someway proves we Americans are unoriginal and just copy/stole everything from other countries.
You my friend are just plain ignorant and stupid if you think that Romanians invented baseball. Just because a sport preceded baseball and used a similar ball etc, does not mean that is the same sport...
sheesh.. some people..
first read the phrase --> "SOMETHING SIMILAR" <-- then get it that i was just explaining a point of view (NOT MINE).
anyway, you just gave me a reason to hate US now. gratz, how do you feel?.
LOL read the phrase something similar?? How about the phrase you stated before it:
"baseball is not american"
You clearly said here that baseball is not american.
And I don't think I gave you a reason to hate America. It seems you already have your bias and are using my post to rationalize your feelings.
america is a young country and therefore lacks history, and for most history is culture. who is a famous american writer? hemmingway? poe ? twain?
not too bad but compared to the likes of schiller, goethe, shakespeare, tolstoy, dostoevsky ot the thousands of much more famous and impressive european writers it is just a insult to compare them.
same goes for musicans and artist in general, springstin vs beethoven? madonna vs bach? da vinci vs gates? van gogh vs warhole?
again not your fault your country is too young to have a rich and impressive cultural background like europe, but its just silly to say it aint there. reading here that stuff like baseball or coca cola is supossed to be your argument for having a strong culture, well lets just say it does not help to debunk the stereotypes.
On January 21 2012 23:16 False_Peace wrote: Oh and one more post. One thing that really irritates me is when people bash the US about its debt. Yes it is true that the USA has the largest debt in the world. However this is not really the best measure to consider. OF course since the USA has the largest economy it would seem natural that it would also have the largest debt.
So.... A better measure to consider is debt compared to % of GDP. If we look at this figure then the following nations are in much bigger shit than the US: Japan, Italy, Greece, Singapore, Belgium, Canada, Germany, France, Egypt, UK and the Netherlands.
The only negative things which I have to say about American culture are the following:
Too much obesity Too much whinging and whining (esp from the men? Man up???????) Too much greed and materialism Too much "God's gift to the world" complex.
Apart from the above, America actually has a very rich culture. The people there are for the most part genuine and warm.
On January 21 2012 22:56 zalz wrote: Some people are seriously trying to argue that the US economy is around the level of a 3rd world country :')
I worry for the sanity of the people on my continent.
I understand the need to bash America. It's been hard having to deal with the fact that we aren't the center of the world anymore.
But atleast keep your bashing grounded in some sense of reality. You might want to atleast once in your life take a plane to the USA, step of it, and realize that in fact there is a small difference between Zimbabwe and the USA.
pretty sure that everybody here said that it's not on the level of them (not is a very important word here)
On January 21 2012 22:52 white_horse wrote:
On January 21 2012 22:48 IntoTheheart wrote:
On January 21 2012 22:43 white_horse wrote:
On January 21 2012 22:31 KalWarkov wrote:
The difference is, that Europe has a larger varity of culture. 3000 years of history formed so many unique things, while America has 300 years of history, thats what America lacks a bit.
I guess what makes me speechless when europeans bash america for its relative lack of culture is the way they phrase it, as if it's our fault for not developing a culture as good as the one they have. We just happened to not have been around as long as they have. Whats so wrong about that?
More importantly, how is it fair to even compare the culture of europe and the US? US is a giant amalgation of many different cultures. European countries like germany, france, belgium, etc are homogeonous groups of people who each share their own common set of values and characteristics (i.e culture). So how is it americans' and their ancestors' faults for not having the kind of "culture" that europeans are accustomed to?
People enjoy hating. That hating just happens to be directed at the US.
Gemany and Italy weren't exactly one homogeonous country for as far back as we can remember but I agree with that.
Out of curiosity, how big of an impact do Native Americans have on the, "culture," of the current USA?
Not very much. Maybe except as mascots for certain baseball teams lol.
Can we stay out of the subject of native americans? It's a source of another popular line of america-bashing.
Slowly you just seem paranoid, not everybody hates americans, in fact I'd say that most here don't.
Americans are on average richer then Germans.
I don't understand why this fact makes you so angry. They are richer then Dutch people aswell. I seem to still be sane.
Pretty sure that the average income of a US American is lower than the one of a German, and they have way bigger debts with a lower probability to pay them back aswell. Atleast that would only make sense, since lower jobless number, a high export/import difference in germany, opposed to the export/import deficit in america, it's lower credit rating(triple A anyone?) and the higher debts.
#1 USA #2 Switzerland #3 Germany
The difference between your average Hans and your average Joe is about 5k a year.
On January 21 2012 23:21 eccokk wrote: america is a young country and therefore lacks history, and for most history is culture. who is a famous american writer? hemmingway? poe ? twain?
not too bad but compared to the likes of schiller, goethe, shakespeare, tolstoy, dostoevsky ot the thousands of much more famous and impressive european writers it is just a insult to compare them.
same goes for musicans and artist in general, springstin vs beethoven? madonna vs bach? da vinci vs gates? van gogh vs warhole?
again not your fault your country is too young to have a rich and impressive cultural background like europe, but its just silly to say it aint there. reading here that stuff like baseball or coca cola is supossed to be your argument for having a strong culture, well lets just say it does not help to debunk the stereotypes.
You're right that America has a smaller culture because of a lack of history, but it has one. So America has a culture. "America has no culture" is just wrong, it's just not as developed as European cultures yet.
In my opinion the expression amercans have no culture might result because either of two major points: - expression said by dumb people who are just arguing without a good reason. - or it is a wrong chosen expression. It could be more meant that, in comparison to other countrys, americans have got no (better a short) culture (better history) compared to other countrys that 'exist' since hundreds of years.
I would say americans have a short history and they definetely have culture no question. Would even say they have a really unique culture.
On January 21 2012 23:16 False_Peace wrote: Oh and one more post. One thing that really irritates me is when people bash the US about its debt. Yes it is true that the USA has the largest debt in the world. However this is not really the best measure to consider. OF course since the USA has the largest economy it would seem natural that it would also have the largest debt.
So.... A better measure to consider is debt compared to % of GDP. If we look at this figure then the following nations are in much bigger shit than the US: Japan, Italy, Greece, Singapore, Belgium, Canada, Germany, France, Egypt, UK and the Netherlands.
Most countries try to keep their debts internally held.
For a long time most of the U.S. debt was internally held. Treasury bonds, war bonds, etc.
Lately we've been borrowing internationally, and that's what worries people, myself included. It's the fact that we somehow now owe China a trillion dollars -- plus accruing interest. UK has a lot of debt, but they keep it internal. It's easier knowing you owe your citizens money, as opposed to owing money to your most direct competitor.
As for the topic, It's funny because culture and entertainment is actually our most consistent export.
The world has been watching our movies and copying our music for decades. Jazz and Blues are great, and while I hate Rap and all of its spinoffs, the world sure seems to feel otherwise.
On January 21 2012 23:22 JesusOurSaviour wrote: The only negative things which I have to say about American culture are the following:
Too much obesity Too much whinging and whining (esp from the men? Man up???????) Too much greed and materialism Too much "God's gift to the world" complex.
Apart from the above, America actually has a very rich culture. The people there are for the most part genuine and warm.
I heard everyone in Australia works for free, because they're not greedy and they don't value material things. And they never complain. Ever. You could throw a brick at an Australian and he would compliment how good you look, AND give you his house, while he explains how his bricks aren't as good as your bricks, because he is very modest.
Its a pretty common misconception that a lot of countries in the western world dont have any culture. There's also a lot of hate coming from people in the western world towards their own culture, aswell as the constant talk of that other cultures are "richer" etc. I don't really understad where its coming from or if its ever going to go away.
On January 21 2012 23:16 False_Peace wrote: Oh and one more post. One thing that really irritates me is when people bash the US about its debt. Yes it is true that the USA has the largest debt in the world. However this is not really the best measure to consider. OF course since the USA has the largest economy it would seem natural that it would also have the largest debt.
So.... A better measure to consider is debt compared to % of GDP. If we look at this figure then the following nations are in much bigger shit than the US: Japan, Italy, Greece, Singapore, Belgium, Canada, Germany, France, Egypt, UK and the Netherlands.
Similar articles are published on most news sites. I was wrong in the 2010 thing though. I must've read an article that it was getting close or something. Either way it's now over 100% of GPD.
Maybe... Maybe they mean to say that mainstream American culture seems soulless and brutal. I think America's pop scene is pretty soulless. Kind of uncreative. Filled with remakes and redundancies and the music seems to have only a few chord progressions going for it. I also think mainstream American culture is a sledge hammer. Obtuse and slow to swing in new directions. But that's mainstream. There are tons of non mainstream things that are wonderful in America. It's my hope that people in America look at pop and roll their eyes, but I have a feeling some people are actually engrossed in the lives of however many Jersey dwelling idiots, a woman who seems to steal songs and is making up for a massive lack of attention in high school, and whatever other pop thing is iconic at the time but otherwise absolutely forgettable. Ala Backstreet Boys, N*Sync, New Kids on the Block (and other stuff that, you know, ISN'T a boy band).
Perhaps that's the reason for the insult? We don't have any cultural icons that last for more than a few internet minutes before the next big thing/scandal/WTF moment/holy amazing thing hits the airwaves. American culture isn't so much iconic as it is several flashes in the pan, so to speak. And hipsters have made it too ironic to like old good things anymore. Hipsters -_-
On January 21 2012 23:16 False_Peace wrote: Oh and one more post. One thing that really irritates me is when people bash the US about its debt. Yes it is true that the USA has the largest debt in the world. However this is not really the best measure to consider. OF course since the USA has the largest economy it would seem natural that it would also have the largest debt.
So.... A better measure to consider is debt compared to % of GDP. If we look at this figure then the following nations are in much bigger shit than the US: Japan, Italy, Greece, Singapore, Belgium, Canada, Germany, France, Egypt, UK and the Netherlands.
Of course USA have culture, but it obviously originates to just a few hundred years back since its a new country. Most movies and series everyone here watch is American, they have the worlds greatest film industry. USA have their own sports like baseball and american football, very distinctive things. Alot of products we Europeans use are originally from USA because of their ability to invent things and their hard working citizens.
On January 21 2012 23:22 JesusOurSaviour wrote: The only negative things which I have to say about American culture are the following:
Too much obesity Too much whinging and whining (esp from the men? Man up???????) Too much greed and materialism Too much "God's gift to the world" complex.
Apart from the above, America actually has a very rich culture. The people there are for the most part genuine and warm.
I heard everyone in Australia works for free, because they're not greedy and they don't value material things. And they never complain. Ever. You could throw a brick at an Australian and he would compliment how good you look, AND give you his house, while he explains how his bricks aren't as good as your bricks, because he is very modest.
But hey, you got me on the obesity thing.
It's funny cuz most of the world would think that australians are pretty cool for being like that
On January 21 2012 22:56 zalz wrote: Some people are seriously trying to argue that the US economy is around the level of a 3rd world country :')
I worry for the sanity of the people on my continent.
I understand the need to bash America. It's been hard having to deal with the fact that we aren't the center of the world anymore.
But atleast keep your bashing grounded in some sense of reality. You might want to atleast once in your life take a plane to the USA, step of it, and realize that in fact there is a small difference between Zimbabwe and the USA.
pretty sure that everybody here said that it's not on the level of them (not is a very important word here)
On January 21 2012 22:52 white_horse wrote:
On January 21 2012 22:48 IntoTheheart wrote:
On January 21 2012 22:43 white_horse wrote:
On January 21 2012 22:31 KalWarkov wrote:
The difference is, that Europe has a larger varity of culture. 3000 years of history formed so many unique things, while America has 300 years of history, thats what America lacks a bit.
I guess what makes me speechless when europeans bash america for its relative lack of culture is the way they phrase it, as if it's our fault for not developing a culture as good as the one they have. We just happened to not have been around as long as they have. Whats so wrong about that?
More importantly, how is it fair to even compare the culture of europe and the US? US is a giant amalgation of many different cultures. European countries like germany, france, belgium, etc are homogeonous groups of people who each share their own common set of values and characteristics (i.e culture). So how is it americans' and their ancestors' faults for not having the kind of "culture" that europeans are accustomed to?
People enjoy hating. That hating just happens to be directed at the US.
Gemany and Italy weren't exactly one homogeonous country for as far back as we can remember but I agree with that.
Out of curiosity, how big of an impact do Native Americans have on the, "culture," of the current USA?
Not very much. Maybe except as mascots for certain baseball teams lol.
Can we stay out of the subject of native americans? It's a source of another popular line of america-bashing.
Slowly you just seem paranoid, not everybody hates americans, in fact I'd say that most here don't.
Americans are on average richer then Germans.
I don't understand why this fact makes you so angry. They are richer then Dutch people aswell. I seem to still be sane.
Pretty sure that the average income of a US American is lower than the one of a German, and they have way bigger debts with a lower probability to pay them back aswell. Atleast that would only make sense, since lower jobless number, a high export/import difference in germany, opposed to the export/import deficit in america, it's lower credit rating(triple A anyone?) and the higher debts.
#1 USA #2 Switzerland #3 Germany
The difference between your average Hans and your average Joe is about 5k a year.
That might be one of the reasons for the debt then, though I doubt that it stays like that in the future
The culture of a nation is reflected in the values, ideals and not just the arts (literature, philosophy, architecture, gastronomy etc.). If you overlook the fact that the history of America is relatively small and in no way comparable to that of many other countries (that covers the part about arts etc.), unfortunately the average American (and I refer mainly to the U.S. citizens btw) today remains uninterested in the spiritual nurture and pursues only his personal success, material possessions, fame and power in his life. Values such as friendship, family, kindness and compassion have lost their true meaning and nobody even notices. But hey, those are the values that the arts promote anyway, so maybe they are not that meaningless. Sadly that kind of lifestyle has influenced more or less every modern society, since economical power usually means influential ability as well. That's what most people refer to when they talk about lack of culture in my opinion.
On January 21 2012 23:21 eccokk wrote: america is a young country and therefore lacks history, and for most history is culture. who is a famous american writer? hemmingway? poe ? twain?
not too bad but compared to the likes of schiller, goethe, shakespeare, tolstoy, dostoevsky ot the thousands of much more famous and impressive european writers it is just a insult to compare them.
same goes for musicans and artist in general, springstin vs beethoven? madonna vs bach? da vinci vs gates? van gogh vs warhole?
again not your fault your country is too young to have a rich and impressive cultural background like europe, but its just silly to say it aint there. reading here that stuff like baseball or coca cola is supossed to be your argument for having a strong culture, well lets just say it does not help to debunk the stereotypes.
Oh now here's a good one. You base 'amount of culture' to 'longer history'. Not only that, but you then compare authors of writings, music plays and paintings with completely different styles. And the 'it's not your fault' sentence basically comes down to this: It's not your fault your culture isn't rich and impressive like mine totally is.
Your post does as much damage to the European stereotype of 'bitching about the US because we have a baseless complex' than it does to prove the stereotype that American culture is at its highest point with Coca cola and baseball.
The only thing that truly amazes me though is that you have the audacity to compare artists like that. Madonna vs Bach? Van Gogh versus Andy Warhol? The hell is up with this? Atleast compare them to artists within their own style. Just because classical music and figurative art has a higher esteem value and general elitist poshness surrounding it doesn't mean it is better than Pop music or Pop-Art. By that same token I can compare the aestetical value of Mondriaans work to the work of Jackson Pollock and come to the conclusion that American culture is more sophisticated because it uses a wider range of colour.
On January 21 2012 23:35 Astyanaxis wrote: Maybe... Maybe they mean to say that mainstream American culture seems soulless and brutal. I think America's pop scene is pretty soulless. Kind of uncreative. Filled with remakes and redundancies and the music seems to have only a few chord progressions going for it. I also think mainstream American culture is a sledge hammer. Obtuse and slow to swing in new directions. But that's mainstream. There are tons of non mainstream things that are wonderful in America. It's my hope that people in America look at pop and roll their eyes, but I have a feeling some people are actually engrossed in the lives of however many Jersey dwelling idiots, a woman who seems to steal songs and is making up for a massive lack of attention in high school, and whatever other pop thing is iconic at the time but otherwise absolutely forgettable. Ala Backstreet Boys, N*Sync, New Kids on the Block (and other stuff that, you know, ISN'T a boy band).
Perhaps that's the reason for the insult? We don't have any cultural icons that last for more than a few internet minutes before the next big thing/scandal/WTF moment/holy amazing thing hits the airwaves. American culture isn't so much iconic as it is several flashes in the pan, so to speak. And hipsters have made it too ironic to like old good things anymore. Hipsters -_-
On January 21 2012 16:42 Vindicare605 wrote: The thing is. American culture is so mainstrream everywhere in the western world that most people forget its actually american.
Well I think the main problem about that mainstream aspect is that we outside the US get the cheap, gimmicky and sellout influences of the culture rather than the main culture itself. And if you recognize how shitty/gimmicky the mainstream influences we're getting here are, you tend to confuse that for the real deal which it is not. For instance, there's a McD/Starbucks at every corner of the street but noone here does thanksgiving. Well, you know what I mean.
Defo have culture, it is in the history department you guys are lacking. Europe, Africa and Asia all have thousands of years of history and culture to draw upon, the United States has only 300 years or so. The history of America goes back just as far as Europe but its not relevant to 99% of Americans as the history is that of the indigenous population.
p.s when your country has a history the length of say the UK, you lose that "We are the best country in the world" sentiment and it is replaced with "Well it would be worse, at least we have toilets and stuff"
America is an English, French, Spanish colony and was once upon also colonized by danes, of course it has no culture and the culture that it does have is stolen from other countries. Also I don't accept Justin Bieber and Selina Gomez as gods or as real culture as you do in America.
On January 21 2012 23:21 eccokk wrote: america is a young country and therefore lacks history, and for most history is culture. who is a famous american writer? hemmingway? poe ? twain?
not too bad but compared to the likes of schiller, goethe, shakespeare, tolstoy, dostoevsky ot the thousands of much more famous and impressive european writers it is just a insult to compare them.
same goes for musicans and artist in general, springstin vs beethoven? madonna vs bach? da vinci vs gates? van gogh vs warhole?
again not your fault your country is too young to have a rich and impressive cultural background like europe, but its just silly to say it aint there. reading here that stuff like baseball or coca cola is supossed to be your argument for having a strong culture, well lets just say it does not help to debunk the stereotypes.
Oh now here's a good one. You base 'amount of culture' to 'longer history'. Not only that, but you then compare authors of writings, music plays and paintings with completely different styles. And the 'it's not your fault' sentence basically comes down to this: It's not your fault your culture isn't rich and impressive like mine totally is.
Your post does as much damage to the European stereotype of 'bitching about the US because we have a baseless complex' than it does to prove the stereotype that American culture is at its highest point with Coca cola and baseball.
The only thing that truly amazes me though is that you have the audacity to compare artists like that. Madonna vs Bach? Van Gogh versus Andy Warhol? The hell is up with this? Atleast compare them to artists within their own style. Just because classical music and figurative art has a higher esteem value and general elitist poshness surrounding it doesn't mean it is better than Pop music or Pop-Art. By that same token I can compare the aestetical value of Mondriaans work to the work of Jackson Pollock and come to the conclusion that American culture is more sophisticated because it uses a wider range of colour.
What he said^^
This guy pretty much sums it all up. You are a smart fellow :-)
Can't we all just embrace our differences? Come to America and im sure you will love it. And I have been to many of the countries that represent most posters here and I loved all of them as well. Each one of them distinctively different from the other...
On January 21 2012 23:21 eccokk wrote: america is a young country and therefore lacks history, and for most history is culture. who is a famous american writer? hemmingway? poe ? twain?
not too bad but compared to the likes of schiller, goethe, shakespeare, tolstoy, dostoevsky ot the thousands of much more famous and impressive european writers it is just a insult to compare them.
same goes for musicans and artist in general, springstin vs beethoven? madonna vs bach? da vinci vs gates? van gogh vs warhole?
again not your fault your country is too young to have a rich and impressive cultural background like europe, but its just silly to say it aint there. reading here that stuff like baseball or coca cola is supossed to be your argument for having a strong culture, well lets just say it does not help to debunk the stereotypes.
Oh now here's a good one. You base 'amount of culture' to 'longer history'. Not only that, but you then compare authors of writings, music plays and paintings with completely different styles. And the 'it's not your fault' sentence basically comes down to this: It's not your fault your culture isn't rich and impressive like mine totally is.
Your post does as much damage to the European stereotype of 'bitching about the US because we have a baseless complex' than it does to prove the stereotype that American culture is at its highest point with Coca cola and baseball.
The only thing that truly amazes me though is that you have the audacity to compare artists like that. Madonna vs Bach? Van Gogh versus Andy Warhol? The hell is up with this? Atleast compare them to artists within their own style. Just because classical music and figurative art has a higher esteem value and general elitist poshness surrounding it doesn't mean it is better than Pop music or Pop-Art. By that same token I can compare the aestetical value of Mondriaans work to the work of Jackson Pollock and come to the conclusion that American culture is more sophisticated because it uses a wider range of colour.
What he said^^
This guy pretty much sums it all up. You are a smart fellow :-)
Can't we all just embrace our differences? Come to America and im sure you will love it. And I have been to many of the countries that represent most posters here and I loved all of them as well. Each one of them distinctively different from the other...
Kinda sad that you've been to so many of them and still wrote that they're younger that the USA. + Show Spoiler +
On January 21 2012 22:40 xM(Z wrote: i just want to point out that baseball is not 'american'. romanians have been playing something similar since 1364. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oină.
also, when people say that US has no culture, they mean something like this: (random/bogus example) If CocaCola were to be invented by an irish living in US, it would not be considered something american.
And here is a post that just completely smells of rediculous nationalism and hatred towards the US. Some people have such a big complex against the US they must dig to the absolute bottom of the barrel to find some obscure fact that somehow and in someway proves we Americans are unoriginal and just copy/stole everything from other countries.
You my friend are just plain ignorant and stupid if you think that Romanians invented baseball. Just because a sport preceded baseball and used a similar ball etc, does not mean that is the same sport...
sheesh.. some people..
first read the phrase --> "SOMETHING SIMILAR" <-- then get it that i was just explaining a point of view (NOT MINE).
anyway, you just gave me a reason to hate US now. gratz, how do you feel?.
LOL read the phrase something similar?? How about the phrase you stated before it:
"baseball is not american"
You clearly said here that baseball is not american.
And I don't think I gave you a reason to hate America. It seems you already have your bias and are using my post to rationalize your feelings.
my bad that i didn't make a distinction between the brand and the game i guess.
On January 21 2012 23:53 Evil_Monkey_ wrote: America is an English, French, Spanish colony and was once upon also colonized by danes, of course it has no culture and the culture that it does have is stolen from other countries. Also I don't accept Justin Bieber and Selina Gomez as gods or as real culture as you do in America.
The English that we know started when a bunch of Germans (Saxons) invaded England. Furthermore, the English Monarchy was started by a Norman (a mixture of Norman, Anglo-Saxon, Scandinavian, and French cultures) invading and taking over/uniting the country. The French have been repeatedly influenced by Anglo-Saxon/Muslim immigration and were significantly influenced by Viking/Scandinavian immigration/invasion. The Spanish are a mixture of European and North African roots. It's ridiculous to say that because a country was influenced by another culture it therefore doesn't have a culture of its own. If we say that then pretty much every European region wouldn't have a culture.
Sports and singing sluts does not equal culture. Celebrating how the English and Spanish stole the land from the indigenous people (who guess what, actually had a culture) not as advanced in war and destruction as them does not equal culture. A mosaic of culture from other nations does not equal culture. A history of war and destruction and greed does not equal culture. A heaven for corporations to trive and have more rights than the federal government, not to mention average citizen surely does not equal culture. The US has many good things, none of them truly linked to the country itself but rather to the people in it, but culture is not one of them.
On January 21 2012 23:53 Evil_Monkey_ wrote: America is an English, French, Spanish colony and was once upon also colonized by danes, of course it has no culture and the culture that it does have is stolen from other countries. Also I don't accept Justin Bieber and Selina Gomez as gods or as real culture as you do in America.
The English that we know started when a bunch of Germans (Saxons) invaded England. Furthermore, the English Monarchy was started by a Norman (a mixture of Norman, Anglo-Saxon, Scandinavian, and French cultures) invading and taking over/uniting the country. The French have been repeatedly influenced by Anglo-Saxon/Muslim immigration and were significantly influenced by Viking/Scandinavian immigration/invasion. The Spanish are a mixture of European and North African roots. It's ridiculous to say that because a country was influenced by another culture it therefore doesn't have a culture of its own. If we say that then pretty much every European region wouldn't have a culture.
On January 21 2012 16:44 Wombatsavior wrote: Just gotta say, basketball came from Canada.
On this point -- no, No, and NO again -- please see James Naismith at the University of Kansas for the invention of the game of Basketball (in its current form) -- please see Latin American empires for previous version (Inca'n if memory serves). Sorry, had to get that out there. Rock Chalk!
On January 21 2012 23:53 Evil_Monkey_ wrote: America is an English, French, Spanish colony and was once upon also colonized by danes, of course it has no culture and the culture that it does have is stolen from other countries. Also I don't accept Justin Bieber and Selina Gomez as gods or as real culture as you do in America.
The English that we know started when a bunch of Germans (Saxons) invaded England. Furthermore, the English Monarchy was started by a Norman (a mixture of Norman, Anglo-Saxon, Scandinavian, and French cultures) invading and taking over/uniting the country. The French have been repeatedly influenced by Anglo-Saxon/Muslim immigration and were significantly influenced by Viking/Scandinavian immigration/invasion. The Spanish are a mixture of European and North African roots. It's ridiculous to say that because a country was influenced by another culture it therefore doesn't have a culture of its own. If we say that then pretty much every European region wouldn't have a culture.
EDIT: quoted the wrong post but corrected it now lol
This is absolutely true, but to say that the U.S. simply does not have a culture is straight up ignorant. With that said, most western countries have a similar experience to the U.S., although it isn't nearly as extensive as the U.S. experience. Here, we are such a large country that we have several different cultures and subcultures that makes it so that the U.S. can't have one defined cultural identity. Many other cultures (such as France and Germany with their Muslim populations) deal with multiculturalism as well, just not as much as the U.S.
On January 22 2012 00:15 DreamChaser wrote: So what i get from this is the reason America doesn't have culture is
1. No bad-ass castles from the middle ages and all the chivalry
2. Not enough artist/writers/our music sucks (Agreed for the most part)
3. We don't have some history with bad ass Roman mythology or Norse mythology (No dragon born )
Y'know what? For all the shitty pop music, we still invented jazz. Chalkin' that up as a major win.
Hate to say it here(actually no, I don't I'm having fun^^), but wasn't jazz and blues invented by the blacks and wasn't that only possible because you enslaved them and they still didn't have equal rights? Blues even comes from sadness afaik
I actually don't think this type of insult is specifically geared towards Americans.
Here in Toronto, it blows my mind how regularly the immigrant population here claims that Canadians too have no culture. From my experience, it seems like western culture is just tied up into a nice bow of "western life," and somehow that means both the US and Canada don't have any culture of their own.
This can also be attributed to the fact that many things 'American' have now made their way around the entire world (Starbucks, McDonalds, etc). So the "American" aspect of it got washed out in the minds of everyone else.
Hope to not incite a riot here, but for me these "America/Canada/X country has no culture" comments almost always seem to come from Europeans directed at North Americans. Food for thought, this type of shit pisses me off a lot.
On January 22 2012 00:15 DreamChaser wrote: So what i get from this is the reason America doesn't have culture is
1. No bad-ass castles from the middle ages and all the chivalry
2. Not enough artist/writers/our music sucks (Agreed for the most part)
3. We don't have some history with bad ass Roman mythology or Norse mythology (No dragon born )
Terrible writers those Americans.
That guy was actually a HUGE dick(in a good way), it's kinda sad that most people only know him for his books for children. The one he wrote about the German language isn't bad either(as long as you don't take it too serious, since he often doesn't go enough into detail or gives reasons for certain things(for example he redicules that mädchen is genderless in German, but doesn't explain that it's a diminutive form of another word(cutification, which you can do with every noun in german) and that the original word was female, every diminutive is genderless in german)
"We must take care of bacteria it's the only culture we have left" lol Well the US tries to stay independent from religion and we have a huge number of people that immigrated here at some point and brought their own cultures with them. So is something "American" because it was created by someone who is technically an American citizen? I really can't say anything that hasn't already been said.
I love how this thread has almost turn into an American pity party with Europeans patting them on the shoulder and reminding them of why their culture isn't shit. Buck up little America, you always have Twain!
I wanted to also make a quick point about the term "melting pot" and how it doesn't really accurately reflect how culture has developed here in my opinion. When I think melting pot, I think many ingredients being molded into a new, identical form. More preferably, I think of the US as a stew, in which you can tell what each individual ingredient is (Beef, corn, etc: Germans, Italians, etc) and they still retain each flavor. Now after the stew has settled for a while, maybe left in the refrigerator for a while, the ingredients no longer really retain their natural smells and flavors; it's just "stew." Of course you can tell the corn from the beans, but it all has the same distinct stew taste.
On January 22 2012 00:24 Maxd11 wrote: "We must take care of bacteria it's the only culture we have left" lol Well the US tries to stay independent from religion and we have a huge number of people that immigrated here at some point and brought their own cultures with them. So is something "American" because it was created by someone who is technically an American citizen? I really can't say anything that hasn't already been said.
The U.S. is less separated from religion than pretty much every western European nation, in terms of both culture and politics.
On January 22 2012 00:24 Maxd11 wrote: "We must take care of bacteria it's the only culture we have left" lol Well the US tries to stay independent from religion and we have a huge number of people that immigrated here at some point and brought their own cultures with them. So is something "American" because it was created by someone who is technically an American citizen? I really can't say anything that hasn't already been said.
The U.S. is less separated from religion than pretty much every western European nation, in terms of both culture and politics.
Simple example: In todays days a German chancellor would never say "God bless Germany" like Obama did in his victory speech after becoming the president of the USA
On January 22 2012 00:30 GatorGar wrote: We certainly have culture; we just don't have culture that is as ancient as other society's culture (excluding our Native Americans).
A large economy and a large genitalia are very similar. Both are desired. Both can be used to rape and pillage. Both are best when large, independent of the aforementioned rape.
Should we stop raping China and Mexico? Hell yes. Does it make our economy "bad" because we do? No. Is our economy "bad"? Compared to what it was, sure, but we're still doing a hell of a lot better than Tijuana ever was.
I don't wanna say that your economy is at the level of a thrid world country, but it's just big, not good.
On January 21 2012 22:06 mcc wrote:
America is the largest economy in the world.
This is just a fact, i don't see why we need to dispute that. It might not be like that forever, but that doesn't change the current fact of life. The USA is the largest economy in the entire world.
To actually go on and ridicule a person for being accurate is just...
That person also said wealth, which is far from true, so
Thank you
I'd love for you to prove that the US economy is similar to a majority of the third world countries, and by extension very different than the majority of first world countries. Good luck.
I didn't say similiar to, I just said on the level of(wealthwise).
"On the level of" doesn't mean "similar"? Uhh... you better practice your English.
It doesn't. Let's say something stupid like: Roman armies in the year 0 were on the level of Japanese armies in the year 1600.(if that's true or not isn't important here) Now that they are on the same level in terms of fighting efficiency doesn't mean that they were similiar to each other. PS:
...you better practive your english
Using your example: Roman armies in the year 0 were similar to Japanese armies in the year 1600 in terms of fighting efficiency. Roman armies in the year 0 were on the same level of Japanese armies in the year 1600 in terms of fighting efficiency.
They mean the exact same thing...
If Americans payed off their debts they'd be a third world country in terms of wealth. http://www.usdebtclock.org/ I don't think there's a similarity apart from that except for the religious fundamentalism and lack of education.
What an idiotic and wrong statement. You wanna know which country owns the bulk of the US debt? As in, a vast majority of it? + Show Spoiler +
The United States. Yeah, we'd be third world if we had to pay back ourselves.
On January 22 2012 00:30 GatorGar wrote: We certainly have culture; we just don't have culture that is as ancient as other society's culture (excluding our Native Americans).
Kinda true. We took some culture from the UK since that is where we came from, after all.
A large economy and a large genitalia are very similar. Both are desired. Both can be used to rape and pillage. Both are best when large, independent of the aforementioned rape.
Should we stop raping China and Mexico? Hell yes. Does it make our economy "bad" because we do? No. Is our economy "bad"? Compared to what it was, sure, but we're still doing a hell of a lot better than Tijuana ever was.
I don't wanna say that your economy is at the level of a thrid world country, but it's just big, not good.
On January 21 2012 22:06 mcc wrote:
America is the largest economy in the world.
This is just a fact, i don't see why we need to dispute that. It might not be like that forever, but that doesn't change the current fact of life. The USA is the largest economy in the entire world.
To actually go on and ridicule a person for being accurate is just...
That person also said wealth, which is far from true, so
Thank you
I'd love for you to prove that the US economy is similar to a majority of the third world countries, and by extension very different than the majority of first world countries. Good luck.
I didn't say similiar to, I just said on the level of(wealthwise).
"On the level of" doesn't mean "similar"? Uhh... you better practice your English.
It doesn't. Let's say something stupid like: Roman armies in the year 0 were on the level of Japanese armies in the year 1600.(if that's true or not isn't important here) Now that they are on the same level in terms of fighting efficiency doesn't mean that they were similiar to each other. PS:
...you better practive your english
Using your example: Roman armies in the year 0 were similar to Japanese armies in the year 1600 in terms of fighting efficiency. Roman armies in the year 0 were on the same level of Japanese armies in the year 1600 in terms of fighting efficiency.
They mean the exact same thing...
If Americans payed off their debts they'd be a third world country in terms of wealth. http://www.usdebtclock.org/ I don't think there's a similarity apart from that except for the religious fundamentalism and lack of education.
What an idiotic and wrong statement. You wanna know which country owns the bulk of the US debt? As in, a vast majority of it? + Show Spoiler +
The United States. Yeah, we'd be third world if we had to pay back ourselves.
A big part of it already belongs to China and that's pretty dangerous, especially since it doesn't seem like they'll stop buying up your debts or lending you money in the first place.
On January 21 2012 16:39 {CC}StealthBlue wrote: Never heard someone say America has no Culture, the fact that people wear Nike and Jordan jerseys seems to make the insult redundant.
I've heard it a lot. Maybe it's just because we have many different cultures.
A large economy and a large genitalia are very similar. Both are desired. Both can be used to rape and pillage. Both are best when large, independent of the aforementioned rape.
Should we stop raping China and Mexico? Hell yes. Does it make our economy "bad" because we do? No. Is our economy "bad"? Compared to what it was, sure, but we're still doing a hell of a lot better than Tijuana ever was.
I don't wanna say that your economy is at the level of a thrid world country, but it's just big, not good.
On January 21 2012 22:06 mcc wrote:
[quote] That person also said wealth, which is far from true, so
Thank you
I'd love for you to prove that the US economy is similar to a majority of the third world countries, and by extension very different than the majority of first world countries. Good luck.
I didn't say similiar to, I just said on the level of(wealthwise).
"On the level of" doesn't mean "similar"? Uhh... you better practice your English.
It doesn't. Let's say something stupid like: Roman armies in the year 0 were on the level of Japanese armies in the year 1600.(if that's true or not isn't important here) Now that they are on the same level in terms of fighting efficiency doesn't mean that they were similiar to each other. PS:
...you better practive your english
Using your example: Roman armies in the year 0 were similar to Japanese armies in the year 1600 in terms of fighting efficiency. Roman armies in the year 0 were on the same level of Japanese armies in the year 1600 in terms of fighting efficiency.
They mean the exact same thing...
If Americans payed off their debts they'd be a third world country in terms of wealth. http://www.usdebtclock.org/ I don't think there's a similarity apart from that except for the religious fundamentalism and lack of education.
What an idiotic and wrong statement. You wanna know which country owns the bulk of the US debt? As in, a vast majority of it? + Show Spoiler +
The United States. Yeah, we'd be third world if we had to pay back ourselves.
A big part of it already belongs to China and that's pretty dangerous, especially since it doesn't seem like they'll stop buying up your debts or lending you money in the first place.
China's economy is more reliant on ours that ours is on theirs. All of this talk is just fear mongering by Republicans about how we're too dependent on China and how they could take our economy down.
A large economy and a large genitalia are very similar. Both are desired. Both can be used to rape and pillage. Both are best when large, independent of the aforementioned rape.
Should we stop raping China and Mexico? Hell yes. Does it make our economy "bad" because we do? No. Is our economy "bad"? Compared to what it was, sure, but we're still doing a hell of a lot better than Tijuana ever was.
I don't wanna say that your economy is at the level of a thrid world country, but it's just big, not good.
On January 21 2012 22:06 mcc wrote:
[quote] That person also said wealth, which is far from true, so
Thank you
I'd love for you to prove that the US economy is similar to a majority of the third world countries, and by extension very different than the majority of first world countries. Good luck.
I didn't say similiar to, I just said on the level of(wealthwise).
"On the level of" doesn't mean "similar"? Uhh... you better practice your English.
It doesn't. Let's say something stupid like: Roman armies in the year 0 were on the level of Japanese armies in the year 1600.(if that's true or not isn't important here) Now that they are on the same level in terms of fighting efficiency doesn't mean that they were similiar to each other. PS:
...you better practive your english
Using your example: Roman armies in the year 0 were similar to Japanese armies in the year 1600 in terms of fighting efficiency. Roman armies in the year 0 were on the same level of Japanese armies in the year 1600 in terms of fighting efficiency.
They mean the exact same thing...
If Americans payed off their debts they'd be a third world country in terms of wealth. http://www.usdebtclock.org/ I don't think there's a similarity apart from that except for the religious fundamentalism and lack of education.
What an idiotic and wrong statement. You wanna know which country owns the bulk of the US debt? As in, a vast majority of it? + Show Spoiler +
The United States. Yeah, we'd be third world if we had to pay back ourselves.
A big part of it already belongs to China and that's pretty dangerous, especially since it doesn't seem like they'll stop buying up your debts or lending you money in the first place.
They own about a trillion. So about 1/15 of our debt. Yeah, that's really not that bad. We have about double the Chinese GPD anyways. China is more dependent on the US than we are on China at any rate. Don't think that we're at their mercy in any way.
A large economy and a large genitalia are very similar. Both are desired. Both can be used to rape and pillage. Both are best when large, independent of the aforementioned rape.
Should we stop raping China and Mexico? Hell yes. Does it make our economy "bad" because we do? No. Is our economy "bad"? Compared to what it was, sure, but we're still doing a hell of a lot better than Tijuana ever was.
I don't wanna say that your economy is at the level of a thrid world country, but it's just big, not good.
On January 21 2012 22:06 mcc wrote:
[quote] That person also said wealth, which is far from true, so
Thank you
I'd love for you to prove that the US economy is similar to a majority of the third world countries, and by extension very different than the majority of first world countries. Good luck.
I didn't say similiar to, I just said on the level of(wealthwise).
"On the level of" doesn't mean "similar"? Uhh... you better practice your English.
It doesn't. Let's say something stupid like: Roman armies in the year 0 were on the level of Japanese armies in the year 1600.(if that's true or not isn't important here) Now that they are on the same level in terms of fighting efficiency doesn't mean that they were similiar to each other. PS:
...you better practive your english
Using your example: Roman armies in the year 0 were similar to Japanese armies in the year 1600 in terms of fighting efficiency. Roman armies in the year 0 were on the same level of Japanese armies in the year 1600 in terms of fighting efficiency.
They mean the exact same thing...
If Americans payed off their debts they'd be a third world country in terms of wealth. http://www.usdebtclock.org/ I don't think there's a similarity apart from that except for the religious fundamentalism and lack of education.
What an idiotic and wrong statement. You wanna know which country owns the bulk of the US debt? As in, a vast majority of it? + Show Spoiler +
The United States. Yeah, we'd be third world if we had to pay back ourselves.
A big part of it already belongs to China and that's pretty dangerous, especially since it doesn't seem like they'll stop buying up your debts or lending you money in the first place.
Because China links it's currency to the dollar it has taken to buying US dollars for more yuan then any other country. As a result they are paying more money for a dollar then a dollar is worth, essentially generating debt for themselves.
As a result the US dollar remains high and China can maintain it's current growth.
Every dollar in the Chinese reserve is matched by larger ammount in yuan debt.
Basically i am trying to sell a dollar and the Chinese government is telling me that they are willing to pay 1.01 dollar for every dollar i have.
But ofcourse it's the US economy that is unhealthy.
On January 21 2012 23:42 Chaosvuistje wrote: Oh now here's a good one. You base 'amount of culture' to 'longer history'. Not only that, but you then compare authors of writings, music plays and paintings with completely different styles. And the 'it's not your fault' sentence basically comes down to this: It's not your fault your culture isn't rich and impressive like mine totally is.
Your post does as much damage to the European stereotype of 'bitching about the US because we have a baseless complex' than it does to prove the stereotype that American culture is at its highest point with Coca cola and baseball.
The only thing that truly amazes me though is that you have the audacity to compare artists like that. Madonna vs Bach? Van Gogh versus Andy Warhol? The hell is up with this? Atleast compare them to artists within their own style. Just because classical music and figurative art has a higher esteem value and general elitist poshness surrounding it doesn't mean it is better than Pop music or Pop-Art. By that same token I can compare the aestetical value of Mondriaans work to the work of Jackson Pollock and come to the conclusion that American culture is more sophisticated because it uses a wider range of colour.
here is the difference bro, i dont want to change the european stereotype about having a superior culture then the us becouse it is a fact. art is debetable and you are free to say " only elistist think classical music and literature are superior", but the elite is called elite for a reason. you can say a pile of shit from a cow is superior to a michelangelo statue in your point of view so what`? go collect piles of shit then.
americans only have "modern" artist so how can i compare goethe to a american writer, the whole point of my argument is that they lack the culture that is born thorough history and had no impact whatsoever in the most important times of mankind. thats the point of the example thanks for pointing out the obvious and making my point. now go write about how all cultures are equal and pop music / mickey mouse are the same as thousands of years of european culuture lol.
On January 21 2012 22:15 SilentchiLL wrote: [quote]
I don't wanna say that your economy is at the level of a thrid world country, but it's just big, not good.
[quote]
Thank you
I'd love for you to prove that the US economy is similar to a majority of the third world countries, and by extension very different than the majority of first world countries. Good luck.
I didn't say similiar to, I just said on the level of(wealthwise).
"On the level of" doesn't mean "similar"? Uhh... you better practice your English.
It doesn't. Let's say something stupid like: Roman armies in the year 0 were on the level of Japanese armies in the year 1600.(if that's true or not isn't important here) Now that they are on the same level in terms of fighting efficiency doesn't mean that they were similiar to each other. PS:
...you better practive your english
Using your example: Roman armies in the year 0 were similar to Japanese armies in the year 1600 in terms of fighting efficiency. Roman armies in the year 0 were on the same level of Japanese armies in the year 1600 in terms of fighting efficiency.
They mean the exact same thing...
If Americans payed off their debts they'd be a third world country in terms of wealth. http://www.usdebtclock.org/ I don't think there's a similarity apart from that except for the religious fundamentalism and lack of education.
What an idiotic and wrong statement. You wanna know which country owns the bulk of the US debt? As in, a vast majority of it? + Show Spoiler +
The United States. Yeah, we'd be third world if we had to pay back ourselves.
A big part of it already belongs to China and that's pretty dangerous, especially since it doesn't seem like they'll stop buying up your debts or lending you money in the first place.
They own about a trillion. So about 1/15 of our debt. Yeah, that's really not that bad. We have about double the Chinese GPD anyways. China is more dependent on the US than we are on China at any rate. Don't think that we're at their mercy in any way.
On January 21 2012 22:19 seiferoth10 wrote: [quote] I'd love for you to prove that the US economy is similar to a majority of the third world countries, and by extension very different than the majority of first world countries. Good luck.
I didn't say similiar to, I just said on the level of(wealthwise).
"On the level of" doesn't mean "similar"? Uhh... you better practice your English.
It doesn't. Let's say something stupid like: Roman armies in the year 0 were on the level of Japanese armies in the year 1600.(if that's true or not isn't important here) Now that they are on the same level in terms of fighting efficiency doesn't mean that they were similiar to each other. PS:
...you better practive your english
Using your example: Roman armies in the year 0 were similar to Japanese armies in the year 1600 in terms of fighting efficiency. Roman armies in the year 0 were on the same level of Japanese armies in the year 1600 in terms of fighting efficiency.
They mean the exact same thing...
If Americans payed off their debts they'd be a third world country in terms of wealth. http://www.usdebtclock.org/ I don't think there's a similarity apart from that except for the religious fundamentalism and lack of education.
What an idiotic and wrong statement. You wanna know which country owns the bulk of the US debt? As in, a vast majority of it? + Show Spoiler +
The United States. Yeah, we'd be third world if we had to pay back ourselves.
A big part of it already belongs to China and that's pretty dangerous, especially since it doesn't seem like they'll stop buying up your debts or lending you money in the first place.
They own about a trillion. So about 1/15 of our debt. Yeah, that's really not that bad. We have about double the Chinese GPD anyways. China is more dependent on the US than we are on China at any rate. Don't think that we're at their mercy in any way.
hahaha you're so wrong.
Hi. Would you care for some evidence to back up your trolling?
Well, whoever said that is wrong or you interpreted it wrong. Every country/land/people have a culture. Simply America has a younger culture. (and classic play/music are europeans)
If only people stopped arguing about such things, they could focus their attention elsewhere and do something useful. We're not animals - every single country in the world has a culture and all cultures originate from the same place - the advent of man.
On January 22 2012 00:30 GatorGar wrote: We certainly have culture; we just don't have culture that is as ancient as other society's culture (excluding our Native Americans).
Kinda true. We took some culture from the UK since that is where we came from, after all.
"you" came from all over the world. not just UK. youd be surprised how many have german,italian, dutch etc roots. and thats not even counting the black people from various parts of the world that came there for different reasons...
i when it comes to american culture there are 3problems:
1. the usa lacks the big long history we see as normal over here. and had zero part in the evolution of our civilization till quite recently. i mean im drinking beer from a brewery with a 972 years long history (and thats just the date from which the first document about brewing beer is). i know that doesnt matter much in the end but that might give you some clue of our perspective on history.
2. alot of stuff "americans" did were just immigrants or 1/2nd generation immigrants etc(for example many european scientists going to america during ww2). so for how much of that can you give the us credit for?
3. america in the last 20-30 years changed from the nice hard working country with great morals and where evrybody had a dream to the most decadent and spoiled country out there. from obesity to the propaganda media to a company run evrything. lets be honest, most of the world kinda looks down on whats going on atm over there for all kinds of reasons. and im not even talking about the wars or foreign politcs which is a different topic.
so over that decline of respect for americans nowadays people forget the good things the country did. basicly the "now" is overshadowing the past.
On January 22 2012 00:15 DreamChaser wrote: So what i get from this is the reason America doesn't have culture is
1. No bad-ass castles from the middle ages and all the chivalry
2. Not enough artist/writers/our music sucks (Agreed for the most part)
3. We don't have some history with bad ass Roman mythology or Norse mythology (No dragon born )
Y'know what? For all the shitty pop music, we still invented jazz. Chalkin' that up as a major win.
Hate to say it here(actually no, I don't I'm having fun^^), but wasn't jazz and blues invented by the blacks and wasn't that only possible because you enslaved them and they still didn't have equal rights? Blues even comes from sadness afaik
... so now we don't consider the black people living in the US during that time American? By that token, nobody is actually from America because they all came from Europe. Just to go in further on that, it would mean that we aren't European either because we migrated from Africa. Which would actually mean that Africa has all the culture.
Stop delegitimizing posters based on stupid facts that are solely meant to distract people away from the actual discussion. Blues originated from the south of the US. Whether it was made by a black person or a cowboy hat wearing Texan or an asian person that happened to be there at that time does not change the fact that it originates from that particular area, which means it comes from the US which means it is part of US culture. Period.
Thread like this actually has to define what is culture.
Culture can be from 2 gangs in same street to Asia vs West. The scales can be massivly different, and if you dont define what is culture in current context, discussion is made extremely more difficult.
srsly not this shit again :/ "America" is commonly and all over the world used for the United States of America....
no, somone got an F saying that here
America is the country.
North-America / South-America the 2 continents.
The Americas is the unified region of north and south America.
Hmm i read more about it, but it might be difference in langauge, in my language everything is EXACLY the same, and you HAVE to add United States of America, or people get confused. I still think it shows a bit of arrogance to say Americans, on the other hand Europeans sometimes call themselves Erupeans regardless of countrie.
And continents have different lvls too, Eurasia can be devided into Asia, Europe, Middle-East, as America can be divided into Middle, North South. Dont remember the term in english.
Hey Canadians. Don't bother. I know you all think you know what you're talking about because of those Heritage Minute propaganda pieces you were bombarded with, but consider that Canada didn't exist when the inventor of basketball was born. He was born in the "Province of Canada" which was a British colony that ceased to exist when the country of Canada was formed.
For the "Americans" I should mention this, though: the man was only in the US to do a job, and he was only in the US for a couple of years when he invented the game. No reasonable person would refer to him as an "American" at the time basketball was invented. At least not in this context.
By the way, Superman wasn't created by a Canadian. He was created by two Jewish men, one of whom was born in Canada to European immigrant parents. His family moved to the US when he was a kid.
On January 22 2012 00:15 DreamChaser wrote: So what i get from this is the reason America doesn't have culture is
1. No bad-ass castles from the middle ages and all the chivalry
2. Not enough artist/writers/our music sucks (Agreed for the most part)
3. We don't have some history with bad ass Roman mythology or Norse mythology (No dragon born )
Y'know what? For all the shitty pop music, we still invented jazz. Chalkin' that up as a major win.
Hate to say it here(actually no, I don't I'm having fun^^), but wasn't jazz and blues invented by the blacks and wasn't that only possible because you enslaved them and they still didn't have equal rights? Blues even comes from sadness afaik
... so now we don't consider the black people living in the US during that time American? By that token, nobody is actually from America because they all came from Europe. Just to go in further on that, it would mean that we aren't European either because we migrated from Africa. Which would actually mean that Africa has all the culture.
Stop delegitimizing posters based on stupid facts that are solely meant to distract people away from the actual discussion. Blues originated from the south of the US. Whether it was made by a black person or a cowboy hat wearing Texan or an asian person that happened to be there at that time does not change the fact that it originates from that particular area, which means it comes from the US which means it is part of US culture. Period.
If US citizens didn't consider those people "American" at the time then modern US citizens don't deserve the right to take ownership of their achievements. Period.
America is by far the most influential country in the world. Our movies, books, music, and television shows are available throughout the globe. Almost every movie on the Afi's or any major ranking list is American. Most of the world's largest websites are from the US. The US has the most millionares and billionares by a mile, as well as the most companies in the fortune 500.
On January 22 2012 01:58 xrapture wrote: America is by far the most influential country in the world. Our movies, books, music, and television shows are available throughout the globe. Almost every movie on the Afi's or any major ranking list is American. Most of the world's largest websites are from the US. The US has the most millionares and billionares by a mile, as well as the most companies in the fortune 500.
Haters gonna hate I guess.
Bragging about it constantly is going to make them hate you too :/ Nationality like this has always sounded silly to me and in of it self acheives nothing. I do get nationalistic concerning the places here, how pretty the Rocky mountains are because I see it every day and I am happy to live here, but if I brag about the achievements of others? I don't see the relation.
On January 21 2012 16:51 KimJongChill wrote: They probably mean to say that America lacks cultural refinement.
This isn't even true. People love to use the argument that the food we eat was invented in other countries. Who gives a shit? We have it all!!!!
General Tso's Chicken #1 food in the world, and invented in NYC.
The menu for my chinese restaurant says General Tso's Chicken was created for General Tso during the Ching Dynasty, are you calling it a liar?
Yes. All Chinese menus are lying. How on earth are chicken, beef and shrimp going to be a Happy Family? They don't even speak the same animal language. Complete nonsense.
On January 22 2012 01:58 xrapture wrote: The US has the most millionares and billionares by a mile, as well as the most companies in the fortune 500.
You consider that culture?
That's something to be ashamed of considering the absolute horrid wealth gap in your country. You know what U.S. also has? Nearly 50 million people living below the poverty line. Should we consider that culture, too?
Honestly, this entire arrogance of "we are the best ever everyone else jelly lets intervene in the rest of the world's business and tell them we know better" is why people hate you. It's why 9/11 happened. This attitude is the most adverse to America's success that you could possibly imagine and you're actually proud of it.
Even if America was the #1 nation in the world, you can proudly proclaim that people like yourself are the ones preventing it from reaching it's potential of becoming even better. You're officially a drag on your own country. Congratulations.
Dont know about american "culture" all that well, but something ive always thought is that U.S probably have many of the smartest people in the world, and many of the ABSOLUTE dumbest.
On January 22 2012 01:58 xrapture wrote: The US has the most millionares and billionares by a mile, as well as the most companies in the fortune 500.
You consider that culture?
That's something to be ashamed of considering the absolute horrid wealth gap in your country. You know what U.S. also has? Nearly 50 million people living below the poverty line. Should we consider that culture, too?
Honestly, this entire arrogance of "we are the best ever everyone else jelly lets intervene in the rest of the world's business and tell them we know better" is why people hate you. It's why 9/11 happened. This attitude is the most adverse to America's success that you could possibly imagine and you're actually proud of it.
Even if America was the #1 nation in the world, you can proudly proclaim that people like yourself are the ones preventing it from reaching it's potential of becoming even better. You're officially a drag on your own country. Congratulations.
Oh I see how it is. As soon as we start to defend ourselves by stating some achievement we have had we drag our country down?? So we should just sit there and let people like you bash us to no end...
Let me guess, you have never been to America and are speaking entirely based on things you have heard or read?
On January 21 2012 17:12 Notfragile wrote: They are not jelly. OP is insecure and should not have made this thread.
As a short response to the thread I have to say the following:
-USA does have culture. But it is not by the standards of the European or Asian culture who had millenia to develop. -An average resident of the US (of course there are exceptions, the coastal cities, both pacific and atlantic) has a lower standard of elegance and savoir vivre than the average european. To us (and to the more civilized citizens of the coastal regions) someone may seem almost like a caveman -Football is something played with the feet only. (aka soccer for you)
Except from the above, there are a few reasons why people outside the US exaggerate and say US has no culture. Warning: transfering rants about the US. If you don't want to know the truth, don't open the spoiler.
-The proud usage of the word AMERICAN, in every occasion. At least, try to remember what this name is derived from before using it like almost a spell. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Americo_Vespucci -The nationalism AND the low educational standards leading quite a few citizens having no bloody idea what, or where is the rest of the world -The really poor educational system. A huge chunk of US sientists are foreigners, and that is just a sad display of the low stantards of the rest of the population -The fact that there is a bible zone. And the fact that 40% of the US citizens believe the world was created by god in the past 10000 years. (We aren't mass atheists, but we can appreciate the evidence from carbon 14 isotope dating and can see why the bible should at least be taken as something not literal). -The fact that many of you believe that evolution is a theory. This saddens us really really much. -Constant war making and Imperialism, do not help with your image in the eyes of citizens around the world. -Fixation on capitalism. Around the world we discuss politics oppenly. What would happen to me if I said I am of communist ideology, somewhere in texas? -Fixation on terrorism. Get over it. -The cold war. Russia is not the evil empire. -The song "america fuck yeah" is ironic. Some people seem to have trouble understanding that. -Insane obesity rates. -Etc, etc etc
So, you see it's not that you have no culture. Everyone has developed a culture. It's that there are so many things bugging us about your country that we as non US citizens close our eyes to what good you have done and try to focus on the negative side of things.
For me, the bright side is Blues, Jazz, (a small part of) Hollywood and of course the scientific culture the US have developed, driving the whole world forward as a result.
PS: I don't want any answer to the post, I'm merely explaining why europeans refuse to see what good you have done as a country. They just blacklist you as a whole, which is unfair.
Opened the spoiler because I didn't expect to be offended, but I did click it to see what you could say to bash Americans.
I laughed, but I sorta shamed. As an American, I...
Just sorta am surprised that people from the outside looking in have the same opinions that I do. My mother, who was a veteran in the Gulf War, didn't know what the Cold War even was.
That might be one of the most ignorant statements ever. Everyone knows America's biggest export is Culture... Just because America's culture includes elements of other cultures doesn't disqualify it or degrade it in any way.
On January 22 2012 02:25 jj33 wrote: from a anthrological point of view american "culture" is the same as any modern country that gets their food in the supermarket.
We are classified the same as say Korea, Japan, France etc. WE all get our food the same way.
That's just 'food" culture, only a small segment of culture as a whole... shortminded much?
Also, i dare to point out that the percentage of agraric and artisanal food is a LOT bigger in Europe and most other countries..
Here is a list of the dates of the formation of every country that exists in the world.
The United States is the oldest country in the America's. Older than Brazil, Mexico, Argentina, etc. But most people would say these countries have more culture than the US. Why? Most of their modern day citizens are also descendants from other places, i.e Spain, Africa, etc..
The Unites States of America is also older than the following countries in Europe: Germany, Austria, Belgium, Finland, Hungary, Netherlands, Norway, Sweden, Switzerland to name a few. In fact, the US is actually older than most European countries.
So you see, if you want to base culture on when the country was formed, then the US actually has one of the most cultured countries in the world...
The only reason why people say countries in Europe have more culture is because those countries were formed from people that had customs and cultural identities from many years before.
Here is a link for the people who make fun of Americans who use the word "soccer." The term was in fact used in British society along with the word "football" to describe the game many many years ago. The word subsequently fell out of favor and "football" was later used predominantly.
The history of the Czech lands includes the following periods: Slavs: Bohemians and Moravians – arrival into Czech area during the 6th century (535?) Samo’s realm (623–658) Moravian principality (~800–833) in Moravia Great Moravia (833–907) • 888–894 also comprised Bohemia Bohemian Principality (870s–1198) • including Moravia, since 1197 the Margraviate of Moravia Kingdom of Bohemia (1198–1348/1918) • since 1291/1335 also with Silesia (duchies) and both Lusatias (margraviates) Crown of Bohemia (1348–1749/1918) – de facto cancelled in 1749 • since 1526 under Habsburg rule (personal union with Austria and Hungary) • 1620/27 lost independence, part of Habsburg Empire • since 1804 part of Austrian Empire • since 1867 part of Austria-Hungary Czechoslovakia (1918–1992) • since 1960 the Czechoslovak Socialist Republic (ČSSR) • since 1990 the Czechoslovak Federative Republic (ČSFR) Czech Republic (since 1993)
Charles University in Prague (also simply Charles University; Czech: Univerzita Karlova v Praze; Latin: Universitas Carolina Pragensis; German: Karls-Universität zu Prag) is the oldest and largest university in the Czech Republic. Founded in 1348, it was the first university in Central Europe and is also considered the earliest German university.[1] It is one of the oldest universities in Europe in continuous operation. It is a top university in the Central and Eastern Europe and it belongs among 1.5 percent of world’s best universities
On January 22 2012 01:58 xrapture wrote: America is by far the most influential country in the world. Our movies, books, music, and television shows are available throughout the globe. Almost every movie on the Afi's or any major ranking list is American. Most of the world's largest websites are from the US. The US has the most millionares and billionares by a mile, as well as the most companies in the fortune 500.
Haters gonna hate I guess.
Im not hating but the richest guy in the world is a Mexican. (Carlos Slim)
On January 22 2012 00:15 DreamChaser wrote: So what i get from this is the reason America doesn't have culture is
1. No bad-ass castles from the middle ages and all the chivalry
2. Not enough artist/writers/our music sucks (Agreed for the most part)
3. We don't have some history with bad ass Roman mythology or Norse mythology (No dragon born )
Y'know what? For all the shitty pop music, we still invented jazz. Chalkin' that up as a major win.
Hate to say it here(actually no, I don't I'm having fun^^), but wasn't jazz and blues invented by the blacks and wasn't that only possible because you enslaved them and they still didn't have equal rights? Blues even comes from sadness afaik
... so now we don't consider the black people living in the US during that time American? By that token, nobody is actually from America because they all came from Europe. Just to go in further on that, it would mean that we aren't European either because we migrated from Africa. Which would actually mean that Africa has all the culture.
Stop delegitimizing posters based on stupid facts that are solely meant to distract people away from the actual discussion. Blues originated from the south of the US. Whether it was made by a black person or a cowboy hat wearing Texan or an asian person that happened to be there at that time does not change the fact that it originates from that particular area, which means it comes from the US which means it is part of US culture. Period.
If US citizens didn't consider those people "American" at the time then modern US citizens don't deserve the right to take ownership of their achievements. Period.
You're getting on a whole new level here, but I'll go along.
What you are saying is that if those people were considered to be American at the time, then citizens of the US WOULD deserve the right to take ownership of their achievements. Which brings us to this question, is this actually the case?
The flaw with being proud of your nation, religious belief or family stems from one thing: That you can actually be proud of yourself because other people did something good. People in the US, or hell any country on the world, appearantly can take pride in what they are simply because of what their ancestors did. Great achievements like becoming sovereign or inventing something, that you probably weren't even involved in, you can be proud of that your nation achieved.
Not only is this a very selfish and ignorant notion ( It would be akin to "I am so proud to be a Teamliquid forum subscriber for having a civilized thread", an act that I cannot attribute solely for myself ) but if you can inherit someones achievements, you must inherit their failures as well. In other words, people that take pride in being a US citizen have to automatically assume guilt of slavery or other failing policies their deceased countrymen have taken part in. German citizens that take pride in being German have to assume guilt for what their countrymen did during the second worldwar. It is simply a flawed mindset. People CANNOT influence their countries' past, and therefore cannot take pride NOR guilt in the events that happened during that time. It is not logical and only serves an emotional purpose.
I cannot take ownership of my culture because it just happened. It happened before me and it will happen after me. Saying that US citizens don't deserve the right to take ownership of the achievements of their african american ancestors assumes that this right exists if you are directly part of the heritage of the people back then. Which simply isn't true because it happened out of your control. The only guy that can logically be proud of inventing Jazz is the guy that invented it.
On January 22 2012 02:25 jj33 wrote: from a anthrological point of view american "culture" is the same as any modern country that gets their food in the supermarket.
We are classified the same as say Korea, Japan, France etc. WE all get our food the same way.
That's just 'food" culture, only a small segment of culture as a whole... shortminded much?
Also, i dare to point out that the percentage of agraric and artisanal food is a LOT bigger in Europe and most other countries..
not shortminded at all.
ask any anthropologist.
the way any culture or group of people get their food is what forms that culture. nothing is more important that how you get your food.
everything else is superficial.
France and any modern day european country is classified the same as the USA from an anthropological view.
and when you said that's just "food culture" once again how you get your food is the most important and beefiest part of culture.
and maybe you should stop with the insults if you're wrong.
On January 22 2012 01:58 xrapture wrote: America is by far the most influential country in the world. Our movies, books, music, and television shows are available throughout the globe. Almost every movie on the Afi's or any major ranking list is American. Most of the world's largest websites are from the US. The US has the most millionares and billionares by a mile, as well as the most companies in the fortune 500.
Haters gonna hate I guess.
Im not hating but the richest guy in the world is a Mexican. (Carlos Slim)
I feel like that name is so fitting for like a super slick, media mogul CEO. Is that actually his real birth name? If so that's kinda awesome.
People who say the US lacks culture or even "refined culture" or try to imply the short history of the US somehow means it's culture is inferior are insecure nationalistic fucks, and their tribalistic attitude is the very reason why Europe was such a hellhole for such a long time following the sack of Rome.
Just because the US is a relatively young country does not mean US culture worked from a blank slate, how ignorant can some of you people get? Tomatoes are a very recent European import, as old as the US itself, yet it defines the culture of Italian cuisine.
Ask yourself this: do you hold the same view with regards to the other countries in the Americas? If so, get thee to a Cuban restaurant and enjoy some empanadas and a Cubano. If not, query whether your opinion of American culture has more to do with anti-American bias rather than objective analysis.
On January 21 2012 16:42 Vindicare605 wrote: The thing is. American culture is so mainstrream everywhere in the western world that most people forget its actually american.
On January 22 2012 02:25 jj33 wrote: from a anthrological point of view american "culture" is the same as any modern country that gets their food in the supermarket.
We are classified the same as say Korea, Japan, France etc. WE all get our food the same way.
That's just 'food" culture, only a small segment of culture as a whole... shortminded much?
Also, i dare to point out that the percentage of agraric and artisanal food is a LOT bigger in Europe and most other countries..
not shortminded at all.
ask any anthropologist.
the way any culture or group of people get their food is what forms that culture. nothing is more important that how you get your food.
everything else is superficial.
France and any modern day european country is classified the same as the USA from an anthropological view.
and when you said that's just "food culture" once again how you get your food is the most important and beefiest part of culture.
and maybe you should stop with the insults if you're wrong.
Anthropologist here Your severely simplifying "culture" and any anthropologist would *not* say "its about food production".
On January 22 2012 01:58 xrapture wrote: The US has the most millionares and billionares by a mile, as well as the most companies in the fortune 500.
You consider that culture?
That's something to be ashamed of considering the absolute horrid wealth gap in your country. You know what U.S. also has? Nearly 50 million people living below the poverty line. Should we consider that culture, too?
Honestly, this entire arrogance of "we are the best ever everyone else jelly lets intervene in the rest of the world's business and tell them we know better" is why people hate you. It's why 9/11 happened. This attitude is the most adverse to America's success that you could possibly imagine and you're actually proud of it.
Even if America was the #1 nation in the world, you can proudly proclaim that people like yourself are the ones preventing it from reaching it's potential of becoming even better. You're officially a drag on your own country. Congratulations.
Oh I see how it is. As soon as we start to defend ourselves by stating some achievement we have had we drag our country down?? So we should just sit there and let people like you bash us to no end...
Let me guess, you have never been to America and are speaking entirely based on things you have heard or read?
Not only is it not a prerequisite to have been to a country to understand it's affairs considering the internet puts us in touch with people around the globe on a daily basis, but I have been to the U.S. in fact. I've been to Washington D.C., Miami, New York City and Los Angeles.
Also, this isn't "defending yourself", it's scrambling to put down an argument and then just insulting your opponent. That's not self defense, that's portruding the exact stereotype that people claim they dislike about your attitude toward the rest of them. Why on earth would you prove them right? How about saying "Hey guys, I know America isn't really the best place in the world. It is for some and it isn't for others. In fact, lots of countries are great to live. I know I wouldn't mind living somewhere else, because I appreciate a great amount of cultures!"
Because you know what? You'll be hard pressed to find a EU inhabitant that wouldn't be willing to say this. We don't hate eachother's countries, and we aren't as disgustingly nationalistic in every aspect. All we're asking is "tone down the goddamn nationalism by about 20 levels because it's getting ridiculous", and your response is to tone it up some more. To prove us wrong, do the opposite of what we expect you to, and we will respect you for it.
On January 22 2012 02:38 domovoi wrote: People who say the US lacks culture or even "refined culture" or try to imply the short history of the US somehow means it's culture is inferior are insecure nationalistic fucks, and their tribalistic attitude is the very reason why Europe was such a hellhole for such a long time following the sack of Rome.
What a bizzare and ridiculous thing to say. America is run by European migrants. We are the same people as of the sacking of Rome. Not that the sacking of Rome as anything at all to do with American culture.
On January 22 2012 02:38 domovoi wrote: People who say the US lacks culture or even "refined culture" or try to imply the short history of the US somehow means it's culture is inferior are insecure nationalistic fucks, and their tribalistic attitude is the very reason why Europe was such a hellhole for such a long time following the sack of Rome.
What a bizzare and ridiculous thing to say. America is run by European migrants. We are the same people as of the sacking of Rome. Not that the sacking of Rome as anything at all to do with American culture.
I'm saying having the attitude that "My culture is superior to yours" is what led to a millennia of European in-fighting following the break up of Rome. It's unhealthy and, frankly, quite stupid, though to be sure Americans (or Chinese or Koreans or anyone else in the world) are no stranger to such a thing.
Never heard anyone say it but I don't really consider baseball a multinational sport. I mean who else plays much (not including small fan things) apart from usa and japan.
On January 22 2012 02:45 Hydrox911 wrote: Never heard anyone say it but I don't really consider baseball a multinational sport. I mean who else plays much (not including small fan things) apart from usa and japan.
About a third of MLB players were not born in the US. Baseball's influence is mostly limited to the rest of the American continent and some of the Asian countries (mostly Japan, but also Korea and Taiwan).
On January 22 2012 02:25 jj33 wrote: from a anthrological point of view american "culture" is the same as any modern country that gets their food in the supermarket.
We are classified the same as say Korea, Japan, France etc. WE all get our food the same way.
That's just 'food" culture, only a small segment of culture as a whole... shortminded much?
Also, i dare to point out that the percentage of agraric and artisanal food is a LOT bigger in Europe and most other countries..
not shortminded at all.
ask any anthropologist.
the way any culture or group of people get their food is what forms that culture. nothing is more important that how you get your food.
everything else is superficial.
France and any modern day european country is classified the same as the USA from an anthropological view.
and when you said that's just "food culture" once again how you get your food is the most important and beefiest part of culture.
and maybe you should stop with the insults if you're wrong.
Anthropologist here Your severely simplifying "culture" and any anthropologist would *not* say "its about food production".
How any culture or group gets their food, is the most important part is that not correct? Makes sense to me. Food is the most important as well you can't live without it.
On January 22 2012 01:58 xrapture wrote: The US has the most millionares and billionares by a mile, as well as the most companies in the fortune 500.
You consider that culture?
That's something to be ashamed of considering the absolute horrid wealth gap in your country. You know what U.S. also has? Nearly 50 million people living below the poverty line. Should we consider that culture, too?
Honestly, this entire arrogance of "we are the best ever everyone else jelly lets intervene in the rest of the world's business and tell them we know better" is why people hate you. It's why 9/11 happened. This attitude is the most adverse to America's success that you could possibly imagine and you're actually proud of it.
Even if America was the #1 nation in the world, you can proudly proclaim that people like yourself are the ones preventing it from reaching it's potential of becoming even better. You're officially a drag on your own country. Congratulations.
Oh I see how it is. As soon as we start to defend ourselves by stating some achievement we have had we drag our country down?? So we should just sit there and let people like you bash us to no end...
Let me guess, you have never been to America and are speaking entirely based on things you have heard or read?
Not only is it not a prerequisite to have been to a country to understand it's affairs considering the internet puts us in touch with people around the globe on a daily basis, but I have been to the U.S. in fact. I've been to Washington D.C., Miami, New York City and Los Angeles.
Also, this isn't "defending yourself", it's scrambling to put down an argument and then just insulting your opponent. That's not self defense, that's portruding the exact stereotype that people claim they dislike about your attitude toward the rest of them. Why on earth would you prove them right? How about saying "Hey guys, I know America isn't really the best place in the world. It is for some and it isn't for others. In fact, lots of countries are great to live. I know I wouldn't mind living somewhere else, because I appreciate a great amount of cultures!"
Because you know what? You'll be hard pressed to find a EU inhabitant that wouldn't be willing to say this. We don't hate eachother's countries, and we aren't as disgustingly nationalistic in every aspect. All we're asking is "tone down the goddamn nationalism by about 20 levels because it's getting ridiculous", and your response is to tone it up some more. To prove us wrong, do the opposite of what we expect you to, and we will respect you for it.
It's odd that you describe this as an American stereotype. If I started a thread that said "The French have no culture," you can be damn sure there will be plenty of people giving me examples of French culture, especially the aspects that most people find superior (food comes to mind). But if an American does it, now he's just being stereotypically nationalistic? And you claim Americans are too closed-minded? Ironic.
On January 22 2012 02:25 jj33 wrote: from a anthrological point of view american "culture" is the same as any modern country that gets their food in the supermarket.
We are classified the same as say Korea, Japan, France etc. WE all get our food the same way.
That's just 'food" culture, only a small segment of culture as a whole... shortminded much?
Also, i dare to point out that the percentage of agraric and artisanal food is a LOT bigger in Europe and most other countries..
not shortminded at all.
ask any anthropologist.
the way any culture or group of people get their food is what forms that culture. nothing is more important that how you get your food.
everything else is superficial.
France and any modern day european country is classified the same as the USA from an anthropological view.
and when you said that's just "food culture" once again how you get your food is the most important and beefiest part of culture.
and maybe you should stop with the insults if you're wrong.
America doesn't have food culture? Almost every insult I see from non Americans is "shove a big mac down your fat throat" or something of the sort. So because the food is processed and greasy it's not part of our culture? I guarantee you 200 years from now Mcdonalds will be discussed more than the culture of most of today's most 'cultured' countries.
On January 22 2012 01:58 xrapture wrote: The US has the most millionares and billionares by a mile, as well as the most companies in the fortune 500.
You consider that culture?
That's something to be ashamed of considering the absolute horrid wealth gap in your country. You know what U.S. also has? Nearly 50 million people living below the poverty line. Should we consider that culture, too?
Honestly, this entire arrogance of "we are the best ever everyone else jelly lets intervene in the rest of the world's business and tell them we know better" is why people hate you. It's why 9/11 happened. This attitude is the most adverse to America's success that you could possibly imagine and you're actually proud of it.
Even if America was the #1 nation in the world, you can proudly proclaim that people like yourself are the ones preventing it from reaching it's potential of becoming even better. You're officially a drag on your own country. Congratulations.
Oh I see how it is. As soon as we start to defend ourselves by stating some achievement we have had we drag our country down?? So we should just sit there and let people like you bash us to no end...
Let me guess, you have never been to America and are speaking entirely based on things you have heard or read?
Not only is it not a prerequisite to have been to a country to understand it's affairs considering the internet puts us in touch with people around the globe on a daily basis, but I have been to the U.S. in fact. I've been to Washington D.C., Miami, New York City and Los Angeles.
Also, this isn't "defending yourself", it's scrambling to put down an argument and then just insulting your opponent. That's not self defense, that's portruding the exact stereotype that people claim they dislike about your attitude toward the rest of them. Why on earth would you prove them right? How about saying "Hey guys, I know America isn't really the best place in the world. It is for some and it isn't for others. In fact, lots of countries are great to live. I know I wouldn't mind living somewhere else, because I appreciate a great amount of cultures!"
Because you know what? You'll be hard pressed to find a EU inhabitant that wouldn't be willing to say this. We don't hate eachother's countries, and we aren't as disgustingly nationalistic in every aspect. All we're asking is "tone down the goddamn nationalism by about 20 levels because it's getting ridiculous", and your response is to tone it up some more. To prove us wrong, do the opposite of what we expect you to, and we will respect you for it.
It's odd that you describe this as an American stereotype. If I started a thread that said "The French have no culture," you can be damn sure there will be plenty of people giving me examples of French culture, especially the aspects that most people find superior (food comes to mind). But if an American does it, now he's just being stereotypically nationalistic? And you claim Americans are too closed-minded? Ironic.
To maybe bridge the gap between cultures, it's important to understand how Dutch people tend to look at succes.
If you draw a nice picture and get a compliment you are almost obligated to talk it down or you are will already seem to be braging. If you are good at playing an instrument you can show it, but you can't talk about how good you are, even if you do you have to constantly be modest about it or you will appear arrogant.
Talking about your achievements and succes is almost in itself considered braging in the Netherlands. Even slightly hinting at having a lot of money means you are braging. If you let slip how succesful your parents are, you are braging.
I think such a low tolerance for even the smallest display of achievements can clash with American culture which is a lot more geared towards competition.
If you had to put it in a slide then Holland would be among the lower countries to care for competition whilst countries in asia like Japan would be on the end of the spectrum. America being somewhere in between.
On January 22 2012 02:38 domovoi wrote: People who say the US lacks culture or even "refined culture" or try to imply the short history of the US somehow means it's culture is inferior are insecure nationalistic fucks, and their tribalistic attitude is the very reason why Europe was such a hellhole for such a long time following the sack of Rome.
What a bizzare and ridiculous thing to say. America is run by European migrants. We are the same people as of the sacking of Rome. Not that the sacking of Rome as anything at all to do with American culture.
I'm saying having the attitude that "My culture is superior to yours" is what led to a millennia of European in-fighting following the break up of Rome. It's unhealthy and, frankly, quite stupid, though to be sure Americans (or Chinese or Koreans or anyone else in the world) are no stranger to such a thing.
It's easy to look at history and say that something is "stupid" (or illogical, irrational, inefficient, etc).
The same can be said for present day as well. Even though we have the technology to do it (and we've had it for a while now), we are still split into different countries, we do not share a common language, we bicker over obsolete concepts like religion and outdated social and economic ideologies, we fail to even acknowledge, let alone attempt to solve, a myriad of problems on a global level that are necessary for the advancement (or even long term survival) of humanity.
You could say that all of that is stupid, irrational and a direct consequence of "my culture is superior to yours" attitude as well. And in a way it is - and looking at it that way is extremely frustrating when you realize how much of our planet's resources are essentially being wasted on completely meaningless concepts that don't lead anywhere.
But that's simply how humans are, and all those faults are a consequence of us not being perfectly rational. The exact same thing is happening today, only on a larger scale and with more variables. In fact, it is causing a lot more damage now than it did during the millennia of in-fighthing in Europe.
On January 22 2012 02:25 jj33 wrote: from a anthrological point of view american "culture" is the same as any modern country that gets their food in the supermarket.
We are classified the same as say Korea, Japan, France etc. WE all get our food the same way.
That's just 'food" culture, only a small segment of culture as a whole... shortminded much?
Also, i dare to point out that the percentage of agraric and artisanal food is a LOT bigger in Europe and most other countries..
not shortminded at all.
ask any anthropologist.
the way any culture or group of people get their food is what forms that culture. nothing is more important that how you get your food.
everything else is superficial.
France and any modern day european country is classified the same as the USA from an anthropological view.
and when you said that's just "food culture" once again how you get your food is the most important and beefiest part of culture.
and maybe you should stop with the insults if you're wrong.
America doesn't have food culture? Almost every insult I see from non Americans is "shove a big mac down your fat throat" or something of the sort. So because the food is processed and greasy it's not part of our culture? I guarantee you 200 years from now Mcdonalds will be discussed more than the culture of most of today's most 'cultured' countries.
On January 22 2012 02:38 domovoi wrote: People who say the US lacks culture or even "refined culture" or try to imply the short history of the US somehow means it's culture is inferior are insecure nationalistic fucks, and their tribalistic attitude is the very reason why Europe was such a hellhole for such a long time following the sack of Rome.
What a bizzare and ridiculous thing to say. America is run by European migrants. We are the same people as of the sacking of Rome. Not that the sacking of Rome as anything at all to do with American culture.
I'm saying having the attitude that "My culture is superior to yours" is what led to a millennia of European in-fighting following the break up of Rome. It's unhealthy and, frankly, quite stupid, though to be sure Americans (or Chinese or Koreans or anyone else in the world) are no stranger to such a thing.
It's easy to look at history and say that something is "stupid" (or illogical, irrational, inefficient, etc).
The same can be said for present day as well. Even though we have the technology to do it (and we've had it for a while now), we are still split into different countries, we do not share a common language, we bicker over obsolete concepts like religion and outdated social and economic ideologies, we fail to even acknowledge, let alone attempt to solve, a myriad of problems on a global level that are necessary for the advancement (or even long term survival) of humanity.
You could say that all of that is stupid, irrational and a direct consequence of "my culture is superior to yours" attitude as well. And in a way it is - and looking at it that way is extremely frustrating when you realize how much of our planet's resources are essentially being wasted on completely meaningless concepts that don't lead anywhere.
But that's simply how humans are, and all those faults are a consequence of us not being perfectly rational. The exact same thing is happening today, only on a larger scale and with more variables. In fact, it is causing a lot more damage now than it did during the millennia of in-fighthing in Europe.
At a macro, human species level, I pretty much agree with your attitude that "it is what it is." At an individual level, though, feelings of cultural superiority should be discouraged.
Didnt read the whole thing, but i hope the OP and everyone else are well aware that basketball was invented by a canadian...not saying usa have no culture, just saying it was a canadian who invented basketball.
On January 22 2012 01:58 xrapture wrote: The US has the most millionares and billionares by a mile, as well as the most companies in the fortune 500.
You consider that culture?
That's something to be ashamed of considering the absolute horrid wealth gap in your country. You know what U.S. also has? Nearly 50 million people living below the poverty line. Should we consider that culture, too?
Honestly, this entire arrogance of "we are the best ever everyone else jelly lets intervene in the rest of the world's business and tell them we know better" is why people hate you. It's why 9/11 happened. This attitude is the most adverse to America's success that you could possibly imagine and you're actually proud of it.
Even if America was the #1 nation in the world, you can proudly proclaim that people like yourself are the ones preventing it from reaching it's potential of becoming even better. You're officially a drag on your own country. Congratulations.
Oh I see how it is. As soon as we start to defend ourselves by stating some achievement we have had we drag our country down?? So we should just sit there and let people like you bash us to no end...
Let me guess, you have never been to America and are speaking entirely based on things you have heard or read?
Not only is it not a prerequisite to have been to a country to understand it's affairs considering the internet puts us in touch with people around the globe on a daily basis, but I have been to the U.S. in fact. I've been to Washington D.C., Miami, New York City and Los Angeles.
Also, this isn't "defending yourself", it's scrambling to put down an argument and then just insulting your opponent. That's not self defense, that's portruding the exact stereotype that people claim they dislike about your attitude toward the rest of them. Why on earth would you prove them right? How about saying "Hey guys, I know America isn't really the best place in the world. It is for some and it isn't for others. In fact, lots of countries are great to live. I know I wouldn't mind living somewhere else, because I appreciate a great amount of cultures!"
Because you know what? You'll be hard pressed to find a EU inhabitant that wouldn't be willing to say this. We don't hate eachother's countries, and we aren't as disgustingly nationalistic in every aspect. All we're asking is "tone down the goddamn nationalism by about 20 levels because it's getting ridiculous", and your response is to tone it up some more. To prove us wrong, do the opposite of what we expect you to, and we will respect you for it.
It's odd that you describe this as an American stereotype. If I started a thread that said "The French have no culture," you can be damn sure there will be plenty of people giving me examples of French culture, especially the aspects that most people find superior (food comes to mind). But if an American does it, now he's just being stereotypically nationalistic? And you claim Americans are too closed-minded? Ironic.
To maybe bridge the gap between cultures, it's important to understand how Dutch people tend to look at succes.
If you draw a nice picture and get a compliment you are almost obligated to talk it down or you are will already seem to be braging. If you are good at playing an instrument you can show it, but you can't talk about how good you are, even if you do you have to constantly be modest about it or you will appear arrogant.
Talking about your achievements and succes is almost in itself considered braging in the Netherlands. Even slightly hinting at having a lot of money means you are braging. If you let slip how succesful your parents are, you are braging.
I think such a low tolerance for even the smallest display of achievements can clash with American culture which is a lot more geared towards competition.
If you had to put it in a slide then Holland would be among the lower countries to care for competition whilst countries in asia like Japan would be on the end of the spectrum. America being somewhere in between.
Well if you play an instrument greatly you won't have to tell somebody how awesome you are, they should know it when they hear you play. And when they know that you play an instrument but never hear you play they probably don't care so why should you tell em about it?
Separation of church of state - yet all 13 years of public school I attended all stundents were forced to stand and recite "The pledge of Alligience"...[quote]"One nation under God" Also, every note/coin has "In God we trust" written on them.
*FREEDOM*
Television - Jersey Shore and MTV, edited/censored media in general really But the best trolling comes from the news and that show Cops, both of which are used primarily to scare and keep white americans in their houses because America is O so scary with all the black americans commiting violent crimes.
On January 22 2012 03:05 Nders wrote: Didnt read the whole thing, but i hope the OP and everyone else are well aware that basketball was invented by a canadian...not saying usa have no culture, just saying it was a canadian who invented basketball.
It was a Canadian living in the US who invented it. It was popularized in the US and exported from there and is currently a much bigger part of US culture than it is a part of Canadian culture. Sort of like how soccer/football is a big part of a lot of cultures, but it was invented in Britain.
On January 22 2012 01:58 xrapture wrote: The US has the most millionares and billionares by a mile, as well as the most companies in the fortune 500.
You consider that culture?
That's something to be ashamed of considering the absolute horrid wealth gap in your country. You know what U.S. also has? Nearly 50 million people living below the poverty line. Should we consider that culture, too?
Honestly, this entire arrogance of "we are the best ever everyone else jelly lets intervene in the rest of the world's business and tell them we know better" is why people hate you. It's why 9/11 happened. This attitude is the most adverse to America's success that you could possibly imagine and you're actually proud of it.
Even if America was the #1 nation in the world, you can proudly proclaim that people like yourself are the ones preventing it from reaching it's potential of becoming even better. You're officially a drag on your own country. Congratulations.
Oh I see how it is. As soon as we start to defend ourselves by stating some achievement we have had we drag our country down?? So we should just sit there and let people like you bash us to no end...
Let me guess, you have never been to America and are speaking entirely based on things you have heard or read?
Not only is it not a prerequisite to have been to a country to understand it's affairs considering the internet puts us in touch with people around the globe on a daily basis, but I have been to the U.S. in fact. I've been to Washington D.C., Miami, New York City and Los Angeles.
Also, this isn't "defending yourself", it's scrambling to put down an argument and then just insulting your opponent. That's not self defense, that's portruding the exact stereotype that people claim they dislike about your attitude toward the rest of them. Why on earth would you prove them right? How about saying "Hey guys, I know America isn't really the best place in the world. It is for some and it isn't for others. In fact, lots of countries are great to live. I know I wouldn't mind living somewhere else, because I appreciate a great amount of cultures!"
Because you know what? You'll be hard pressed to find a EU inhabitant that wouldn't be willing to say this. We don't hate eachother's countries, and we aren't as disgustingly nationalistic in every aspect. All we're asking is "tone down the goddamn nationalism by about 20 levels because it's getting ridiculous", and your response is to tone it up some more. To prove us wrong, do the opposite of what we expect you to, and we will respect you for it.
It's odd that you describe this as an American stereotype. If I started a thread that said "The French have no culture," you can be damn sure there will be plenty of people giving me examples of French culture, especially the aspects that most people find superior (food comes to mind). But if an American does it, now he's just being stereotypically nationalistic? And you claim Americans are too closed-minded? Ironic.
To maybe bridge the gap between cultures, it's important to understand how Dutch people tend to look at succes.
If you draw a nice picture and get a compliment you are almost obligated to talk it down or you are will already seem to be braging. If you are good at playing an instrument you can show it, but you can't talk about how good you are, even if you do you have to constantly be modest about it or you will appear arrogant.
Talking about your achievements and succes is almost in itself considered braging in the Netherlands. Even slightly hinting at having a lot of money means you are braging. If you let slip how succesful your parents are, you are braging.
I think such a low tolerance for even the smallest display of achievements can clash with American culture which is a lot more geared towards competition.
If you had to put it in a slide then Holland would be among the lower countries to care for competition whilst countries in asia like Japan would be on the end of the spectrum. America being somewhere in between.
Well if you play an instrument greatly you won't have to tell somebody how awesome you are, they should know it when they hear you play. And when they know that you play an instrument but never hear you play they probably don't care so why should you tell em about it?
You don't seem to grasp that one isn't better then the other. They are simply different ways of looking at it.
The self flagellation can just as easily be incredibly annoying.
America has its own modern culture but it is still very young. I like some american music and movies. I have no problem with American people (I have problem with your stupid government thou O_O). But I would never want to be born in America (p.s. I love Canada)
The fact that almost everybody in the world learns English at some time in their life is a testament to American culture. That and America is the world's #1 exporter of music, movies, has some of the world's premier sports leagues, and a ton of monuments. To say America has no culture is just silly.
On January 22 2012 01:58 xrapture wrote: The US has the most millionares and billionares by a mile, as well as the most companies in the fortune 500.
You consider that culture?
That's something to be ashamed of considering the absolute horrid wealth gap in your country. You know what U.S. also has? Nearly 50 million people living below the poverty line. Should we consider that culture, too?
Honestly, this entire arrogance of "we are the best ever everyone else jelly lets intervene in the rest of the world's business and tell them we know better" is why people hate you. It's why 9/11 happened. This attitude is the most adverse to America's success that you could possibly imagine and you're actually proud of it.
Even if America was the #1 nation in the world, you can proudly proclaim that people like yourself are the ones preventing it from reaching it's potential of becoming even better. You're officially a drag on your own country. Congratulations.
Oh I see how it is. As soon as we start to defend ourselves by stating some achievement we have had we drag our country down?? So we should just sit there and let people like you bash us to no end...
Let me guess, you have never been to America and are speaking entirely based on things you have heard or read?
Not only is it not a prerequisite to have been to a country to understand it's affairs considering the internet puts us in touch with people around the globe on a daily basis, but I have been to the U.S. in fact. I've been to Washington D.C., Miami, New York City and Los Angeles.
Also, this isn't "defending yourself", it's scrambling to put down an argument and then just insulting your opponent. That's not self defense, that's portruding the exact stereotype that people claim they dislike about your attitude toward the rest of them. Why on earth would you prove them right? How about saying "Hey guys, I know America isn't really the best place in the world. It is for some and it isn't for others. In fact, lots of countries are great to live. I know I wouldn't mind living somewhere else, because I appreciate a great amount of cultures!"
Because you know what? You'll be hard pressed to find a EU inhabitant that wouldn't be willing to say this. We don't hate eachother's countries, and we aren't as disgustingly nationalistic in every aspect. All we're asking is "tone down the goddamn nationalism by about 20 levels because it's getting ridiculous", and your response is to tone it up some more. To prove us wrong, do the opposite of what we expect you to, and we will respect you for it.
It's odd that you describe this as an American stereotype. If I started a thread that said "The French have no culture," you can be damn sure there will be plenty of people giving me examples of French culture, especially the aspects that most people find superior (food comes to mind). But if an American does it, now he's just being stereotypically nationalistic? And you claim Americans are too closed-minded? Ironic.
The "defense" of saying "EVERYONE ELSE IS JUST JEALOUS OF OUR SUCCESS" is baseless nationalism. First you have to realize that we don't even view "success" in the same sense you do. We don't view success in individual successes (i.e. we have the most millionaires), we view a nation's success as the happiness, wellbeing and success of the entire nation as these parameters. With all of these, the U.S. scores far lower than many European nations. But I'm not going to say "GREATEST CONTINENT IN THE WORLD(?)", because I realize that to some people the opportunity and reward for individual success that America offers could be more valuable.
Our cultures differ. I recognize this. I will not recognize that this makes me better than you or vice versa, but the entire American attitude that suggests "anyone who disagrees with us being the best is JEALOUS" simply shows that you don't understand that culture is relative and a disgusting cultural trait inherent in a large majority of your nation that says "no matter what, being from the U.S. makes you better than others". It's about looking down on others as much as it's about bragging about your own approach being superior. This isn't supposed to be what culture is like. Different, but equal, yeah? What's more, if someone from another nation disagrees with that, you are unwilling to accept the idea that they can rationally justify their disagreeing. They MUST be jealous. Because no one could have a different culture than yours.
On January 22 2012 02:25 jj33 wrote: from a anthrological point of view american "culture" is the same as any modern country that gets their food in the supermarket.
We are classified the same as say Korea, Japan, France etc. WE all get our food the same way.
That's just 'food" culture, only a small segment of culture as a whole... shortminded much?
Also, i dare to point out that the percentage of agraric and artisanal food is a LOT bigger in Europe and most other countries..
not shortminded at all.
ask any anthropologist.
the way any culture or group of people get their food is what forms that culture. nothing is more important that how you get your food. everything else is superficial.
France and any modern day european country is classified the same as the USA from an anthropological view.
So what i digest in form of nutrients determines how i think and how great people in my culture come to their peaks on intelligence? Not values or social-economics or history, just to name a few?? And "ask ANY..." for god's sake man... don't even start with such things as a form of argument.
And even if your feeble statement held true, did you fail to read what i wrote about artisanal food in europa vs us?
and when you said that's just "food culture" once again how you get your food is the most important and beefiest part of culture.
and maybe you should stop with the insults if you're wrong.
Edit: wrong form, heh. the quote is only till "blablabla ... anthropological view"
On January 22 2012 03:12 Mondieu wrote: America has no history, now that is true.
Trying to think of something that Romania is known for...
..
...
....
....still trying
Your own ignorance is not a testimony to anything but your own ignorance. Why would you think telling people you don't know something about X proves a point about X? All it proves is how little you know and how proud you are of it.
On January 22 2012 03:12 HoldenR wrote: The "defense" of saying "EVERYONE ELSE IS JUST JEALOUS OF OUR SUCCESS" is baseless nationalism.
Agreed, but it's odd you consider this an American stereotype when pretty much everyone does this (look at the "French bashing" thread for example).
Our cultures differ. I recognize this. I will not recognize that this makes me better than you or vice versa, but the entire American attitude that suggests "anyone who disagrees with us being the best is JEALOUS" simply shows that you don't understand that culture is relative and a disgusting cultural trait inherent in a large majority of your nation that says "no matter what, being from the U.S. makes you better than others". It's about looking down on others as much as it's about bragging about your own approach being superior. This isn't supposed to be what culture is like. Different, but equal, yeah? What's more, if someone from another nation disagrees with that, you are unwilling to accept the idea that they can rationally justify their disagreeing. They MUST be jealous. Because no one could have a different culture than yours.
I mostly agree with you and have been saying similar things in this thread. But if someone (not you) is going to make the trollish and ignorant claim that X country lacks culture or even "refined" (whatever the fuck that means) culture, then the expected response would be people giving examples of where X country is "superior." Personally, I didn't get the sense that he was being all "America, FUCK YEAH," but I'm only going by what you quoted.
I think the reason people say that is that America has many different cultures. Take for example the Southeast and compare it to the Northeast. Although both share basic holidays like Christmas and Thanksgiving, the two have different cultures. However, I do feel that California lacks culture, especially in the area I live in. I think that California is so ethnically diverse there has been no single dominating culture that runs society. This also means that minorities have a hard time finding others of their race to celebrate.
We fight with everyone over what the word "football means".
In your football, there is no ball, and hardly any kicking. There is nothing to fight about.
Such ignorance, but I will start a separate thread on the etymology and origins of football.
I dont see how its ignorant to state facts. One game has a ball that you kick around with your feet. Another has an egg you toss around and run with. What am i missing here?
Calling americans cultureless is an extremely common thing here in Brasil, one usual thing we often hear is that americans are so inane that they can't spot the region they live in on their own country's map and that we most likely know more about their history than they do, again, that's what he hear around here, and then there are the jokes regarding fat people, e.g most americans eat so much that they get to places by rolling, etc.
Somehow this thread developed in a completely predictable yet entirely unfortunate way. I wouldn't have bothered to make it if knew it would make people more angry when it's purpose was to exact opposite.
On January 22 2012 03:26 Nothingtosay wrote: Somehow this thread developed in a completely predictable yet entirely unfortunate way. I wouldn't have bothered to make it if knew it would make people more angry when it's purpose was to exact opposite.
Yep, unfortunately I can't tell the difference between this and the France bashing thread too much anymore...luckily you didn't mention Californian wine or there would be absolutely no difference by now...
We fight with everyone over what the word "football means".
In your football, there is no ball, and hardly any kicking. There is nothing to fight about.
Such ignorance, but I will start a separate thread on the etymology and origins of football.
You shouldn't waste your time, it's not even feasible to me that someone can come up with a reasonable argument to explain exactly what the guy above said and then there's the fact that americans say its football, but the entire world says otherwise and when it comes to disputes about designating names to things, numbers always win.
On January 22 2012 02:38 domovoi wrote: People who say the US lacks culture or even "refined culture" or try to imply the short history of the US somehow means it's culture is inferior are insecure nationalistic fucks, and their tribalistic attitude is the very reason why Europe was such a hellhole for such a long time following the sack of Rome.
What a bizzare and ridiculous thing to say. America is run by European migrants. We are the same people as of the sacking of Rome. Not that the sacking of Rome as anything at all to do with American culture.
I'm saying having the attitude that "My culture is superior to yours" is what led to a millennia of European in-fighting following the break up of Rome. It's unhealthy and, frankly, quite stupid, though to be sure Americans (or Chinese or Koreans or anyone else in the world) are no stranger to such a thing.
It's easy to look at history and say that something is "stupid" (or illogical, irrational, inefficient, etc).
The same can be said for present day as well. Even though we have the technology to do it (and we've had it for a while now), we are still split into different countries, we do not share a common language, we bicker over obsolete concepts like religion and outdated social and economic ideologies, we fail to even acknowledge, let alone attempt to solve, a myriad of problems on a global level that are necessary for the advancement (or even long term survival) of humanity.
You could say that all of that is stupid, irrational and a direct consequence of "my culture is superior to yours" attitude as well. And in a way it is - and looking at it that way is extremely frustrating when you realize how much of our planet's resources are essentially being wasted on completely meaningless concepts that don't lead anywhere.
But that's simply how humans are, and all those faults are a consequence of us not being perfectly rational. The exact same thing is happening today, only on a larger scale and with more variables. In fact, it is causing a lot more damage now than it did during the millennia of in-fighthing in Europe.
At a macro, human species level, I pretty much agree with your attitude that "it is what it is." At an individual level, though, feelings of cultural superiority should be discouraged.
But it is the same thing. Those individual flaws cause and reinforce social ones. For as long as there are different (even radically different) cultures, people will feel connected to them and, as a result, hostile towards opposing cultures.
The degree of hostility might differ from person to person and be more or less pronounced depending on the differences, but there is just NO WAY you can make a human being truly accept the elements of a different culture that strongly oppose his own.
The whole Europe vs America thing doesn't even scratch the surface of the problem. Europe and North America are culturally incredibly close and have the same origin, despite the mutual bickering (which is mostly over social and economic issues anyway, and the exact same problems exist on both sides of the Atlantic). What happens when you put western cultures side-by-side with modern-day Islamic culture, various Asian cultures, Indian?
History has shown that non-aggressive cultures are also the most easily suppressed and assimilated, even though they are in no way inferior (Tibetan, Native American, Gaelic).
Either you try to strip the people of the bond with their tradition and history (which may or may not be possible), or it simply is what it is. There's no middle ground there.
On January 22 2012 03:26 R!! wrote: Calling americans cultureless is an extremely common thing here in Brasil, one usual thing we often hear is that americans are so inane that they can't spot the region they live in on their own country's map and that we most likely know more about their history than they do, again, that's what he hear around here, and then there are the jokes regarding fat people, e.g most americans eat so much that they get to places by rolling, etc.
A miracle that Brazilian comedies aren't shown on every channel around the world.
On January 22 2012 01:58 xrapture wrote: The US has the most millionares and billionares by a mile, as well as the most companies in the fortune 500.
You consider that culture?
That's something to be ashamed of considering the absolute horrid wealth gap in your country. You know what U.S. also has? Nearly 50 million people living below the poverty line. Should we consider that culture, too?
Honestly, this entire arrogance of "we are the best ever everyone else jelly lets intervene in the rest of the world's business and tell them we know better" is why people hate you. It's why 9/11 happened. This attitude is the most adverse to America's success that you could possibly imagine and you're actually proud of it.
Even if America was the #1 nation in the world, you can proudly proclaim that people like yourself are the ones preventing it from reaching it's potential of becoming even better. You're officially a drag on your own country. Congratulations.
Oh I see how it is. As soon as we start to defend ourselves by stating some achievement we have had we drag our country down?? So we should just sit there and let people like you bash us to no end...
Let me guess, you have never been to America and are speaking entirely based on things you have heard or read?
Not only is it not a prerequisite to have been to a country to understand it's affairs considering the internet puts us in touch with people around the globe on a daily basis, but I have been to the U.S. in fact. I've been to Washington D.C., Miami, New York City and Los Angeles.
Also, this isn't "defending yourself", it's scrambling to put down an argument and then just insulting your opponent. That's not self defense, that's portruding the exact stereotype that people claim they dislike about your attitude toward the rest of them. Why on earth would you prove them right? How about saying "Hey guys, I know America isn't really the best place in the world. It is for some and it isn't for others. In fact, lots of countries are great to live. I know I wouldn't mind living somewhere else, because I appreciate a great amount of cultures!"
Because you know what? You'll be hard pressed to find a EU inhabitant that wouldn't be willing to say this. We don't hate eachother's countries, and we aren't as disgustingly nationalistic in every aspect. All we're asking is "tone down the goddamn nationalism by about 20 levels because it's getting ridiculous", and your response is to tone it up some more. To prove us wrong, do the opposite of what we expect you to, and we will respect you for it.
What American here said "America is the best"? Ive read almost every post and nowhere did anyone make a blanket statement saying we are better than everyone else/ Once again you love to add generalizations that you have heard or read to frame your arguement. Please stick to the topic.
Because you know what? You'll be hard pressed to find a EU inhabitant that wouldn't be willing to say this. We don't hate eachother's countries, and we aren't as disgustingly nationalistic in every aspect.
Oh this one was real good! This actually gave me such a good laugh!! No buddy, Europe isn't nationalistic at all...., Europeans were only responsible for the 2 largest wars in the previous century that were practically a direct result of nationalism!! Oh and don't even get me started on eastern Europe and the virtual merry-go-around of countries it has produced in the last 50 years! Oh noooo! you Europeans could careless about your own countries, you are all about the greater good of mankind!
On January 22 2012 02:25 jj33 wrote: from a anthrological point of view american "culture" is the same as any modern country that gets their food in the supermarket.
We are classified the same as say Korea, Japan, France etc. WE all get our food the same way.
That's just 'food" culture, only a small segment of culture as a whole... shortminded much?
Also, i dare to point out that the percentage of agraric and artisanal food is a LOT bigger in Europe and most other countries..
not shortminded at all.
ask any anthropologist.
the way any culture or group of people get their food is what forms that culture. nothing is more important that how you get your food. everything else is superficial.
France and any modern day european country is classified the same as the USA from an anthropological view.
So what i digest in form of nutrients determines how i think and how great people in my culture come to their peaks on intelligence? Not values or social-economics or history, just to name a few?? And "ask ANY..." for god's sake man... don't even start with such things as a form of argument.
And even if your feeble statement held true, did you fail to read what i wrote about artisanal food in europa vs us?
and when you said that's just "food culture" once again how you get your food is the most important and beefiest part of culture.
and maybe you should stop with the insults if you're wrong.
Edit: wrong form, heh. the quote is only till "blablabla ... anthropological view"
you digest something I did not say.
in anthropology, they classify by hunter-gatherer, farmers, horiculturalists etc etc.
belgium and USA i'm pretty sure would be classified the same way. we both get our food from the supermarket. that's all i said.
seems alot of people on TL have really bad reading comprehension
On January 22 2012 03:26 R!! wrote: Calling americans cultureless is an extremely common thing here in Brasil, one usual thing we often hear is that americans are so inane that they can't spot the region they live in on their own country's map and that we most likely know more about their history than they do, again, that's what he hear around here, and then there are the jokes regarding fat people, e.g most americans eat so much that they get to places by rolling, etc.
A miracle that Brazilian comedies aren't shown on every channel around the world.
Oh, we don't have such jokes in comedy shows, then again I hardly ever watch TV, but I doubt it, this is just commonplace talk we have regarding americans.
We fight with everyone over what the word "football means".
In your football, there is no ball, and hardly any kicking. There is nothing to fight about.
Such ignorance, but I will start a separate thread on the etymology and origins of football.
You shouldn't waste your time, it's not even feasible to me that someone can come up with a reasonable argument to explain exactly what the guy above said and then there's the fact that americans say its football, but the entire world says otherwise and when it comes to disputes about designating names to things, numbers always win.
I think he was probably arguing it's ignorant to not look at the history of American football and why it is called football--the sport changed ya know?
It's kind of like calling French fries, French. They were made in Belgium first, but who cares.
We fight with everyone over what the word "football means".
In your football, there is no ball, and hardly any kicking. There is nothing to fight about.
Such ignorance, but I will start a separate thread on the etymology and origins of football.
You shouldn't waste your time, it's not even feasible to me that someone can come up with a reasonable argument to explain exactly what the guy above said and then there's the fact that americans say its football, but the entire world says otherwise and when it comes to disputes about designating names to things, numbers always win.
I think he was probably arguing it's ignorant to not look at the history of American football and why it is called football--the sport changed ya know?
It's kind of like calling French fries, French. They were made in Belgium first, but who cares.
I have another thread already, but short version: both American football and association football are offshoots of an old British game. It's hard to say which version football is closer to that original game given centuries of rule changes, but suffice to say, it's incredibly ignorant to suggest American football has no claim to the word "football."
As for French fries (and thank god for Belgium for inventing them), I recall it has something to do with the fact they are "French cut." Not sure if the term "French cut fries" originates from Belgium or not.
On January 22 2012 03:12 Mondieu wrote: America has no history, now that is true.
Trying to think of something that Romania is known for...
..
...
....
....still trying
Gypsies, cheap whores(use a condom), bear dancers That's what I thought of in the first 3 seconds and except the beardancing thing I don't see anything negative about it
We fight with everyone over what the word "football means".
In your football, there is no ball, and hardly any kicking. There is nothing to fight about.
Such ignorance, but I will start a separate thread on the etymology and origins of football.
You shouldn't waste your time, it's not even feasible to me that someone can come up with a reasonable argument to explain exactly what the guy above said and then there's the fact that americans say its football, but the entire world says otherwise and when it comes to disputes about designating names to things, numbers always win.
I think he was probably arguing it's ignorant to not look at the history of American football and why it is called football--the sport changed ya know?
It's kind of like calling French fries, French. They were made in Belgium first, but who cares.
Oh i know the history of it, that it was called football (among other sports) because it was played on feet rather than horseback or somesuch rubbish. Doesnt change the fact that its absurd to call handegg the 'real' football in this day and age :D
We fight with everyone over what the word "football means".
In your football, there is no ball, and hardly any kicking. There is nothing to fight about.
Such ignorance, but I will start a separate thread on the etymology and origins of football.
You shouldn't waste your time, it's not even feasible to me that someone can come up with a reasonable argument to explain exactly what the guy above said and then there's the fact that americans say its football, but the entire world says otherwise and when it comes to disputes about designating names to things, numbers always win.
I think he was probably arguing it's ignorant to not look at the history of American football and why it is called football--the sport changed ya know?
It's kind of like calling French fries, French. They were made in Belgium first, but who cares.
Oh i know the history of it, that it was called football (among other sports) because it was played on feet rather than horseback or somesuch rubbish. Doesnt change the fact that its absurd to call handegg the 'real' football in this day and age :D
They're both separate versions of football. Dumb to think there is even such a thing as a "real" version; pretty sure they're both quite real.
We fight with everyone over what the word "football means".
In your football, there is no ball, and hardly any kicking. There is nothing to fight about.
Such ignorance, but I will start a separate thread on the etymology and origins of football.
You shouldn't waste your time, it's not even feasible to me that someone can come up with a reasonable argument to explain exactly what the guy above said and then there's the fact that americans say its football, but the entire world says otherwise and when it comes to disputes about designating names to things, numbers always win.
I think he was probably arguing it's ignorant to not look at the history of American football and why it is called football--the sport changed ya know?
It's kind of like calling French fries, French. They were made in Belgium first, but who cares.
I have another thread already, but short version: both American football and association football are offshoots of an old British game. It's hard to say which version football is closer to that original game given centuries of rule changes, but suffice to say, it's incredibly ignorant to suggest American football has no claim to the word "football."
As for French fries (and thank god for Belgium for inventing them), I recall it has something to do with the fact they are "French cut." Not sure if the term "French cut fries" originates from Belgium or not.
Exactly what I was trying to get at. I'll move the discussion over to the other thread.
We fight with everyone over what the word "football means".
In your football, there is no ball, and hardly any kicking. There is nothing to fight about.
Such ignorance, but I will start a separate thread on the etymology and origins of football.
You shouldn't waste your time, it's not even feasible to me that someone can come up with a reasonable argument to explain exactly what the guy above said and then there's the fact that americans say its football, but the entire world says otherwise and when it comes to disputes about designating names to things, numbers always win.
I think he was probably arguing it's ignorant to not look at the history of American football and why it is called football--the sport changed ya know?
It's kind of like calling French fries, French. They were made in Belgium first, but who cares.
Oh i know the history of it, that it was called football (among other sports) because it was played on feet rather than horseback or somesuch rubbish. Doesnt change the fact that its absurd to call handegg the 'real' football in this day and age :D
They're both separate versions of football. Dumb to think there is even such a thing as a "real" version; pretty sure they're both quite real.
Alright, you have your points. I still believe its absurd to call the sport football, and regardless of the origins of the word that wont change, but I respect you going out of your way to educate me on the history of it
Never heard of that, but the american culture is so infused into others that it just blends into it, which might give away that impression.
Just think about, we all watch american movies, series, we eat american food, we play american games, etc, etc... all of these have been globalized, so to speak.
On January 22 2012 01:58 xrapture wrote: The US has the most millionares and billionares by a mile, as well as the most companies in the fortune 500.
You consider that culture?
That's something to be ashamed of considering the absolute horrid wealth gap in your country. You know what U.S. also has? Nearly 50 million people living below the poverty line. Should we consider that culture, too?
Honestly, this entire arrogance of "we are the best ever everyone else jelly lets intervene in the rest of the world's business and tell them we know better" is why people hate you. It's why 9/11 happened. This attitude is the most adverse to America's success that you could possibly imagine and you're actually proud of it.
Even if America was the #1 nation in the world, you can proudly proclaim that people like yourself are the ones preventing it from reaching it's potential of becoming even better. You're officially a drag on your own country. Congratulations.
Oh I see how it is. As soon as we start to defend ourselves by stating some achievement we have had we drag our country down?? So we should just sit there and let people like you bash us to no end...
Let me guess, you have never been to America and are speaking entirely based on things you have heard or read?
Not only is it not a prerequisite to have been to a country to understand it's affairs considering the internet puts us in touch with people around the globe on a daily basis, but I have been to the U.S. in fact. I've been to Washington D.C., Miami, New York City and Los Angeles.
Also, this isn't "defending yourself", it's scrambling to put down an argument and then just insulting your opponent. That's not self defense, that's portruding the exact stereotype that people claim they dislike about your attitude toward the rest of them. Why on earth would you prove them right? How about saying "Hey guys, I know America isn't really the best place in the world. It is for some and it isn't for others. In fact, lots of countries are great to live. I know I wouldn't mind living somewhere else, because I appreciate a great amount of cultures!"
Because you know what? You'll be hard pressed to find a EU inhabitant that wouldn't be willing to say this. We don't hate eachother's countries, and we aren't as disgustingly nationalistic in every aspect. All we're asking is "tone down the goddamn nationalism by about 20 levels because it's getting ridiculous", and your response is to tone it up some more. To prove us wrong, do the opposite of what we expect you to, and we will respect you for it.
What American here said "America is the best"? Ive read almost every post and nowhere did anyone make a blanket statement saying we are better than everyone else/ Once again you love to add generalizations that you have heard or read to frame your arguement. Please stick to the topic.
Because you know what? You'll be hard pressed to find a EU inhabitant that wouldn't be willing to say this. We don't hate eachother's countries, and we aren't as disgustingly nationalistic in every aspect.
Oh this one was real good! This actually gave me such a good laugh!! No buddy, Europe isn't nationalistic at all...., Europeans were only responsible for the 2 largest wars in the previous century that were practically a direct result of nationalism!! Oh and don't even get me started on eastern Europe and the virtual merry-go-around of countries it has produced in the last 50 years! Oh noooo! you Europeans could careless about your own countries, you are all about the greater good of mankind!
Gimmie a break..
If you haven't seen the america is the #1 post then you clearly haven't read all of the posts here
We fight with everyone over what the word "football means".
In your football, there is no ball, and hardly any kicking. There is nothing to fight about.
Such ignorance, but I will start a separate thread on the etymology and origins of football.
You shouldn't waste your time, it's not even feasible to me that someone can come up with a reasonable argument to explain exactly what the guy above said and then there's the fact that americans say its football, but the entire world says otherwise and when it comes to disputes about designating names to things, numbers always win.
I think he was probably arguing it's ignorant to not look at the history of American football and why it is called football--the sport changed ya know?
It's kind of like calling French fries, French. They were made in Belgium first, but who cares.
I have another thread already, but short version: both American football and association football are offshoots of an old British game. It's hard to say which version football is closer to that original game given centuries of rule changes, but suffice to say, it's incredibly ignorant to suggest American football has no claim to the word "football."
As for French fries (and thank god for Belgium for inventing them), I recall it has something to do with the fact they are "French cut." Not sure if the term "French cut fries" originates from Belgium or not.
Exactly what I was trying to get at. I'll move the discussion over to the other thread.
Apparently my thread was so non-controversial, it was closed. Anyway, here's what I wrote.
For some reason, certain soccer fans find it necessary to criticize American football on the grounds that it doesn't involve much kicking or a spheroid. This is a thread to point out how ignorant they sound.
Football can be split it up into two categories: association football and gridiron football. Both of these games are derived from the British sport of football (to be sure, plenty of other cultures had games involving running, kicking and ball carrying). That British sport generally moved the ball around through carrying the ball, but scoring involved kicking the ball into some target. Centuries later, the two offshoots of that game became popularized. Association football got rid of the carrying aspect while gridiron football downplayed the kicking aspect. American football went one step further and allowed forward passes.
American football is not the only gridiron football that is played. There is Rugby and its various versions. Canada and Australia also have their own version of gridiron football. All of those countries also call the game "football." Even in Britain, it is common to refer to gridiron football rather than association football as "football." Needless to say, there is no "one true way" to referring to these types of games; American football has as much claim to the term "football" as association football does.
We fight with everyone over what the word "football means".
In your football, there is no ball, and hardly any kicking. There is nothing to fight about.
Such ignorance, but I will start a separate thread on the etymology and origins of football.
You shouldn't waste your time, it's not even feasible to me that someone can come up with a reasonable argument to explain exactly what the guy above said and then there's the fact that americans say its football, but the entire world says otherwise and when it comes to disputes about designating names to things, numbers always win.
I think he was probably arguing it's ignorant to not look at the history of American football and why it is called football--the sport changed ya know?
It's kind of like calling French fries, French. They were made in Belgium first, but who cares.
Oh i know the history of it, that it was called football (among other sports) because it was played on feet rather than horseback or somesuch rubbish. Doesnt change the fact that its absurd to call handegg the 'real' football in this day and age :D
They're both separate versions of football. Dumb to think there is even such a thing as a "real" version; pretty sure they're both quite real.
Alright, you have your points. I still believe its absurd to call the sport football, and regardless of the origins of the word that wont change, but I respect you going out of your way to educate me on the history of it
The etymology totally makes sense. I can think of way more absurd English words. For example, China. China hasn't been ruled by the Qin since 200 BC.
Baseball Before We Knew It: A Search for the Roots of the Game (2005), by David Block, suggests that the game originated in England; recently uncovered historical evidence supports this position. Block argues that rounders and early baseball were actually regional variants of each other, and that the game's most direct antecedents are the English games of stoolball and "tut-ball".
I saw this on Canadian Tv:
So yea, a Canadian invented it IN America.
My perspective is that of a Canadian. We are nigh American, but I feel like we don't quite have the extreme highs and lows of American culture that seems evident to me.
American culture has many factors. The biggest one being how many Americans there are. There is a lot of them. The thing that seperates Americans from other nationalities, from our perspective, is alot more greasy food, cheaper alcohol, more principle based, conservative reasoning & a religious insanity only rivalled by the middle east and certain parts of asia.
Hollywood and California are in America. They are a huge source of modern fashion and mainstream styles. This ripples out into the USA in the form of an image obsession. Ofc, this obsession is also present in other countries, but since it's origin is American, it's strongest in America.
American culture for me is the true fight for rights and freedom. Not necessarily outside itself.. but the events that have occurred within itself in it's own history.
On January 21 2012 16:51 KimJongChill wrote: They probably mean to say that America lacks cultural refinement.
This isn't even true. People love to use the argument that the food we eat was invented in other countries. Who gives a shit? We have it all!!!!
General Tso's Chicken #1 food in the world, and invented in NYC.
The menu for my chinese restaurant says General Tso's Chicken was created for General Tso during the Ching Dynasty, are you calling it a liar?
Yes. All Chinese menus are lying. How on earth are chicken, beef and shrimp going to be a Happy Family? They don't even speak the same animal language. Complete nonsense.
On January 21 2012 17:03 Terranist wrote: i've heard that we have no history, but culture? lol. the world revolves around america and everyone else is a jealous hater.
/thread
This is the main aspect of American culture to many Americans. And it's what infuriates and amuses people outside of America.
I know that not all Americans are like this, but I kinda feel bad for the normies down there. Come up to Canada, its better here.
America is the world's leading Military and economical power. A decade ago one could add Political power to that, two decades or three decades ago one could also add cultural power to that. No longer. It's economical lead is threatened by China (in pure GDP value) , only it's military aspect remains no 1 by orders of magnitude..
On January 22 2012 04:31 RetroAspect wrote: America is the world's leading Military and economical power. A decade ago one could add Political power to that, two decades or three decades ago one could also add cultural power to that. No longer.
Just curious who do you think the world leading Political power and cultural powers are?
On January 22 2012 04:25 StarStruck wrote: Correction. Americans think the world revolves around them.
It certainly doesn't anger me. I find it pretty funny
actually my public school education taught me we revolve around a sun. which revolves around in a spiral galaxy pretty much on the edge of it which is expanding at an accelerating rate outwards from a point of origin.
On January 22 2012 04:31 RetroAspect wrote: America is the world's leading Military and economical power. A decade ago one could add Political power to that, two decades or three decades ago one could also add cultural power to that. No longer.
Just curious who do you think the world leading Political power and cultural powers are?
No countries at all really stand out atm, that is clear as water no? Im just stating facts, don't try to make it sound like im drawing conclusions, that is up to people who read the facts.
On January 22 2012 04:31 RetroAspect wrote: America is the world's leading Military and economical power. A decade ago one could add Political power to that, two decades or three decades ago one could also add cultural power to that. No longer.
Just curious who do you think the world leading Political power and cultural powers are?
No countries at all really stand out atm, that is clear as water no? Im just stating facts, don't try to make it sound like im drawing conclusions, that is up to people who read the facts.
Claiming any one country is the world cultural "power" at any one time seems pretty much like an opinion to me, and not a fact.
On January 22 2012 04:31 RetroAspect wrote: America is the world's leading Military and economical power. A decade ago one could add Political power to that, two decades or three decades ago one could also add cultural power to that. No longer. It's economical lead is threatened by China (in pure GDP value) , only it's military aspect remains no 1 by orders of magnitude..
On January 22 2012 04:31 RetroAspect wrote: America is the world's leading Military and economical power. A decade ago one could add Political power to that, two decades or three decades ago one could also add cultural power to that. No longer. It's economical lead is threatened by China (in pure GDP value) , only it's military aspect remains no 1 by orders of magnitude..
Yea I mean you got some rich Wall Street dicks running your country, but I wouldnt be bragging about that. T_T
The US is in a tailspin, I just hope you don't bring the rest of the world with you.
I don't know where you've been, but pretty much the entire world is in an economic tailspin. I don't think it's just the US that's going to be bringing down the rest of the world.
On January 22 2012 04:31 RetroAspect wrote: America is the world's leading Military and economical power. A decade ago one could add Political power to that, two decades or three decades ago one could also add cultural power to that. No longer. It's economical lead is threatened by China (in pure GDP value) , only it's military aspect remains no 1 by orders of magnitude..
Yea I mean you got some rich Wall Street dicks running your country, but I wouldnt be bragging about that. T_T
The US is in a tailspin, I just hope you don't bring the rest of the world with you.
Uhhh let's not sling shit with how Europe is doing right now. This is why all the insults at each other are incredibly comical, many countries are in trouble. Culture is irrelevant right now, I'd rather survive and improve the economy.
On January 22 2012 04:31 RetroAspect wrote: America is the world's leading Military and economical power. A decade ago one could add Political power to that, two decades or three decades ago one could also add cultural power to that. No longer. It's economical lead is threatened by China (in pure GDP value) , only it's military aspect remains no 1 by orders of magnitude..
Perhaps "no culture" is just another way of saying "no rich history of church dominance and religious oppression." Apparently, if things have relative stability, they are bad.
On January 22 2012 03:12 Mondieu wrote: America has no history, now that is true.
Trying to think of something that Romania is known for...
..
...
....
....still trying
Your own ignorance is not a testimony to anything but your own ignorance. Why would you think telling people you don't know something about X proves a point about X? All it proves is how little you know and how proud you are of it.
Think he's trying to say that most people in the world couldn't mention a thing about Romania, but the United States is known everywhere.
On January 22 2012 04:31 RetroAspect wrote: America is the world's leading Military and economical power. A decade ago one could add Political power to that, two decades or three decades ago one could also add cultural power to that. No longer. It's economical lead is threatened by China (in pure GDP value) , only it's military aspect remains no 1 by orders of magnitude..
Yea I mean you got some rich Wall Street dicks running your country, but I wouldnt be bragging about that. T_T
The US is in a tailspin, I just hope you don't bring the rest of the world with you.
If Bill Gates walks into a bar of poor men, suddenly the GDP per capita of said bar raises to a few million. In quite a few of those countries, this is the case. Almost every single country with a higher GDP per capita than the US has a very small population.
The word culture is such a relative term. There is no such thing as more or less culture; no country in the world has more or less culture than any other country in the world.
Let me tell you the most basic thing of American Culture : It's an exageration of itself.
EG : It's very american to want BIG POWERFUL CARS (I worked for General Motors btw) so they exagerate to the point where they build the HUMMER, a car (truck) which is conceptwise stupid but very understandable from the exageration pov. The same goes for the concept "Freedom of choice". Big ice cream shops consider themselves big when they have "freedom of choice" so they exagerate to the point where they have 300+ flavours of ice cream. Again, having the flavour "red dirt" (I have seen it btw) can be seen as pointless but from the "exagerated freedom of choice pov" it's normal and desireable.
Now, from the foreign uneducated pov, a very American thing can be seen as pants on head retarded but if you really pay attention it's just an exageration of what a person raised in the US wants.
On January 22 2012 05:04 Lightwip wrote: Perhaps "no culture" is just another way of saying "no rich history of church dominance and religious oppression." Apparently, if things have relative stability, they are bad.
Let me introduce you to Texas.......... You have a part of your country called the Bible belt where it is seen as an outrage that Darwinism and Big Bang is being taught instead of creationism and yet you make a statement like that? Holy christ Lightwip, I knew you were a funny guy, but that one is on par with the dental puns by Vermin Supreme.....
And again, the "no culture" is usually used in conjunction with the complete lack of sensitivity of some tourists when visiting a foreign country.... Just like Germans are all known to eat wurst and sauerkraut 24/7, the brits are pompous pricks who do nothing but drink tea all day and the french can hoist a white flag quicker than an italian tank can retreat, a spanish worker can fall asleep or a russian can drain a bottle of vodka (I think I hit most of the major stereotypes, if not I'll gladly include a few more - they are just that, stereotypes and one should really just laugh and shrug at them).
On January 22 2012 05:04 Lightwip wrote: Perhaps "no culture" is just another way of saying "no rich history of church dominance and religious oppression." Apparently, if things have relative stability, they are bad.
Let me introduce you to Texas.......... You have a part of your country called the Bible belt where it is seen as an outrage that Darwinism and Big Bang is being taught instead of creationism and yet you make a statement like that? Holy christ Lightwip, I knew you were a funny guy, but that one is on par with the dental puns by Vermin Supreme.....
And again, the "no culture" is usually used in conjunction with the complete lack of sensitivity of some tourists when visiting a foreign country.... Just like Germans are all known to eat wurst and sauerkraut 24/7, the brits are pompous pricks who do nothing but drink tea all day and the french can hoist a white flag quicker than an italian tank can retreat, a spanish worker can fall asleep or a russian can drain a bottle of vodka (I think I hit most of the major stereotypes, if not I'll gladly include a few more - they are just that, stereotypes and one should really just laugh and shrug at them).
On January 22 2012 05:04 Lightwip wrote: Perhaps "no culture" is just another way of saying "no rich history of church dominance and religious oppression." Apparently, if things have relative stability, they are bad.
Let me introduce you to Texas.......... You have a part of your country called the Bible belt where it is seen as an outrage that Darwinism and Big Bang is being taught instead of creationism and yet you make a statement like that? Holy christ Lightwip, I knew you were a funny guy, but that one is on par with the dental puns by Vermin Supreme.....
And again, the "no culture" is usually used in conjunction with the complete lack of sensitivity of some tourists when visiting a foreign country.... Just like Germans are all known to eat wurst and sauerkraut 24/7, the brits are pompous pricks who do nothing but drink tea all day and the french can hoist a white flag quicker than an italian tank can retreat, a spanish worker can fall asleep or a russian can drain a bottle of vodka (I think I hit most of the major stereotypes, if not I'll gladly include a few more - they are just that, stereotypes and one should really just laugh and shrug at them).
Perhaps I've misinterpreted you, but are you suggesting it is okay to stereotype Americans because all Americans stereotype other nationalities.(this notion is a stereotype in itself). Although I agree that Lightwip didn't make the most enlightened comment, it's not like you've made yourself look good in your response. In my opinion the idea that America has no culture is because the people who currently inhabit America can't trace their lineage back to the "homeland" like many people in Europe can. When Europe was erecting enormous temples, the people who's ancestors would eventually inhabit America were likely helping build those very structures. American culture is a difficult idea to grasp because it is essentially a continuation of European cultures. Where does European culture end and American culture begin? America was settled long before America became a nation. Does American culture begin when the first Europeans stepped off the boat? Or maybe it begins when the first Europeans stepped off Europe onto the boat.. So does that make these first Europeans Americans? Maybe American culture begins when the declaration of independence is approved, but then again Americans, (or are they European settlers?) had already been separating from the British government before the declaration of independence was approved... and even after it was approved there were still a significant chunk of the population who didn't want to separate from the British. My point is American culture is a vague term because the current American population doesn't have any distinctly American roots. They can all be traced back to Europe (and Africa, Asia, South American, and Different countries in North America for that matter). "American culture" is hard to define, and its hard to say what American culture really is... So I guess it's just easier for some people to say America has no culture, because after all they're from Europe, and that means they're usually right about these things.
On January 22 2012 05:04 Lightwip wrote: Perhaps "no culture" is just another way of saying "no rich history of church dominance and religious oppression." Apparently, if things have relative stability, they are bad.
Let me introduce you to Texas.......... You have a part of your country called the Bible belt where it is seen as an outrage that Darwinism and Big Bang is being taught instead of creationism and yet you make a statement like that? Holy christ Lightwip, I knew you were a funny guy, but that one is on par with the dental puns by Vermin Supreme.....
And again, the "no culture" is usually used in conjunction with the complete lack of sensitivity of some tourists when visiting a foreign country.... Just like Germans are all known to eat wurst and sauerkraut 24/7, the brits are pompous pricks who do nothing but drink tea all day and the french can hoist a white flag quicker than an italian tank can retreat, a spanish worker can fall asleep or a russian can drain a bottle of vodka (I think I hit most of the major stereotypes, if not I'll gladly include a few more - they are just that, stereotypes and one should really just laugh and shrug at them).
Lol, I think that one's a little more than a stereotype. But, I see what you're saying. It just seems that American stereotypes are said with much more hostility than the ones you mentioned.
Also, isn't it strange that people say a country's become "Americanized." What's that mean?
Could it possibly mean, *gasps*, that the country acquired parts of American "culture."
American cultue is EVERYWHERE in our world now, in every little big or open country on this planet i'm sure you will find American culture, coca-cola, where can you not find this, the smallest town in the most northern nepal has cola, the most desert place of india has cola, mcdonalds is everywhere, fastfood, kfc, buger king, american music is reckon and if not the most popular in the world along with english music, rock 'n'roll for that matter.
American tv series is broadcasted in every country, video games, american and the knowledge along with language is so deep in danish culture even here that it's changing out language words are being popularized, people say we go out shopping, i love to shop, not "handle in"
as we did 40 years ago since americanism and globalization was introduced in my country, mcdonals entered here in the early 80's. we watch american movies in tv everyday, the simpsons, family guy with danish subtitbles, friends, scrubs we start watching this when we are 8 years old, i'm 22 now and i can speak fairly fluent in english because of this, i believe us who grow up with this don't even have to look at the subtitles anymore.
You're no longer popular in schoo herel if you don't know about the colbert show, or you've seen this funny SNL clip on youtube because it's foreign and american
We're being exposed to english like 60% of our day that our mind now automatically translate. the internet, computer games as said are in english. my favorite bands are from america, i love bobby darin, nat king cole. there's not a single day without this exposure and i fear it's gonna slowly erase our own integrity in the future. tho i think it wont but i fear of this massive influx.
The influence on the entire world america has had the last 60 years is even potrayed in rammsteins song
face it guys the worlds biggest firms and headquarters are mostly placed in america. Think what our world would look like without america. frightning right. entrepreneurship is one of the key strengths in america especially if you succeed, look at apple, microsoft. BILLIONS!
On January 22 2012 05:04 Lightwip wrote: Perhaps "no culture" is just another way of saying "no rich history of church dominance and religious oppression." Apparently, if things have relative stability, they are bad.
Let me introduce you to Texas.......... You have a part of your country called the Bible belt where it is seen as an outrage that Darwinism and Big Bang is being taught instead of creationism and yet you make a statement like that? Holy christ Lightwip, I knew you were a funny guy, but that one is on par with the dental puns by Vermin Supreme.....
Yes, let's all have a distorted view of other countries and pretend that it's fact! What a wonderful thing to do. If you didn't know it already, most Americans are just as fond of Fox, Texas, and the bible belt as Europeans are. + Show Spoiler +
But I hope you realize how much more smoothly things in general run in a smaller country. Denmark is far more homogenous than the United States, a large entity consisting of many, many immigrants from everywhere. China, Russia, and India have a similar situation.
On January 22 2012 03:12 Mondieu wrote: America has no history, now that is true.
Trying to think of something that Romania is known for...
..
...
....
....still trying
Your own ignorance is not a testimony to anything but your own ignorance. Why would you think telling people you don't know something about X proves a point about X? All it proves is how little you know and how proud you are of it.
BURN! There are hot girls in Romania. But he clearly answered the question, the OP misinterpreted 'Americans have no culture'. :D
On January 22 2012 05:32 Zoler wrote: Canada invented basketball.
England invented baseball.
lol
American walked on the moon.
Russians first in space.
Am i doing this right?
Sending a guy on a glorified rollercoaster.
Sending a man to walk on the face of another planet.
Not entirely the same thing.
Nobody sent a man on another planet. And I blame America for this. (You too Russia.) But I have faith in China! And Russia was more developped space-wise than USA at a point.
On January 22 2012 05:32 Zoler wrote: Canada invented basketball.
England invented baseball.
lol
American walked on the moon.
Russians first in space.
Am i doing this right?
Sending a guy on a glorified rollercoaster.
Sending a man to walk on the face of another planet.
Not entirely the same thing.
Nobody sent a man on another planet. And I blame America for this. (You too Russia.) But I have faith in China! And Russia was more developped space-wise than USA at a point.
America is the only country the executes children under the law. 1/100 adults in jail. 1% of their population have like 80% of the wealth. The only country to ever drop nuclear weapons. First country to make nukes.
On January 22 2012 05:32 Zoler wrote: Canada invented basketball.
England invented baseball.
lol
American walked on the moon.
Best way to end any bragging rights conversation.
I don't know. There's some excesses in American culture I don't like, but I really can't complain too loud. Most of my music and movies and books comes from the US. I might critique what I get to listen, watch, and read- but I still enjoy a fair amount of it.
On January 22 2012 05:32 Zoler wrote: Canada invented basketball.
England invented baseball.
lol
American walked on the moon.
Russians first in space.
Am i doing this right?
Sending a guy on a glorified rollercoaster.
Sending a man to walk on the face of another planet.
Not entirely the same thing.
Nobody sent a man on another planet. And I blame America for this. (You too Russia.) But I have faith in China! And Russia was more developped space-wise than USA at a point.
And the Mongolians once ruled one of the largest empires in the world. Ergo, they are the mightiest nation in the world?
Ooh wait, past achievements don't count for much when other people improve on them.
Watching people twist and bend to make good things rubber, bad things glue, is almost like watching Houdini escape his chains.
On January 22 2012 05:32 Zoler wrote: Canada invented basketball.
England invented baseball.
lol
American walked on the moon.
Russians first in space.
Am i doing this right?
Sending a guy on a glorified rollercoaster.
Sending a man to walk on the face of another planet.
Not entirely the same thing.
Nobody sent a man on another planet. And I blame America for this. (You too Russia.) But I have faith in China! And Russia was more developped space-wise than USA at a point.
And the Mongolians once ruled one of the largest empires in the world. Ergo, they are the mightiest nation in the world?
Ooh wait, past achievements don't count for much when other people improve on them.
Watching people twist and bend to make good things rubber, bad things glue, is almost like watching Houdini escape his chains.
As we're talking a certain period known as the Cold war, and that my point stands during the half of this period, I think my sarcasm detector is broken. If not, I'm truly sorry for you. :D
On January 22 2012 05:32 Zoler wrote: Canada invented basketball.
England invented baseball.
lol
American walked on the moon.
Russians first in space.
Am i doing this right?
Sending a guy on a glorified rollercoaster.
Sending a man to walk on the face of another planet.
Not entirely the same thing.
Nobody sent a man on another planet. And I blame America for this. (You too Russia.) But I have faith in China! And Russia was more developped space-wise than USA at a point.
And the Mongolians once ruled one of the largest empires in the world. Ergo, they are the mightiest nation in the world?
Ooh wait, past achievements don't count for much when other people improve on them.
Watching people twist and bend to make good things rubber, bad things glue, is almost like watching Houdini escape his chains.
As we're talking a certain period known as the Cold war, and that my point stands during the half of this period, I think my sarcasm detector is broken. If not, I'm truly sorry for you. :D
So your point is that the USSR won the space race when they launched the first man into space, rather then when America landed the first man on the moon?
I suppose you can have that point of view. Not a single historian would agree, but 1st amendment rights allow you to be wrong.
On January 22 2012 05:32 Zoler wrote: Canada invented basketball.
England invented baseball.
lol
American walked on the moon.
Russians first in space.
Am i doing this right?
Sending a guy on a glorified rollercoaster.
Sending a man to walk on the face of another planet.
Not entirely the same thing.
Nobody sent a man on another planet. And I blame America for this. (You too Russia.) But I have faith in China! And Russia was more developped space-wise than USA at a point.
And the Mongolians once ruled one of the largest empires in the world. Ergo, they are the mightiest nation in the world?
Ooh wait, past achievements don't count for much when other people improve on them.
Watching people twist and bend to make good things rubber, bad things glue, is almost like watching Houdini escape his chains.
As we're talking a certain period known as the Cold war, and that my point stands during the half of this period, I think my sarcasm detector is broken. If not, I'm truly sorry for you. :D
So your point is that the USSR won the space race when they launched the first man into space, rather then when America landed the first man on the moon?
I suppose you can have that point of view. Not a single historian would agree, but 1st amendment rights allow you to be wrong.
... I'll quote myself :
And Russia was more developped space-wise than USA at a point.
As one is not enough for you, I shall point another time :
and that my point stands during the half of this period
im like 99 percent sure we import culture lol. our culture is a melting pot of other culture or maybe our only culture is the jersey shore lol but i can say for sure that we dont lack culture but i suppose its a question of "what is culture exactly"
America has culture no doubt, but I'd say it's hard to narrow down an exact definition due to its size, multiculturalism, and age. My view of American culture is that consumerism has made it rather boring.
On January 22 2012 06:21 IveReturned wrote: Is walking on the moon cultural?
No it's just really exciting.
Lol If I found a game it it gets extremely multinationally popular, does it remain as my own culture?
I don't know - if it gets popular in Turkey first and then spreads to the rest of the world, then maybe it's your culture. Maybe not? Things travel too fast now.
On January 22 2012 06:21 IveReturned wrote: Is walking on the moon cultural?
No it's just really exciting.
Lol If I found a game it it gets extremely multinationally popular, does it remain as my own culture?
I don't know - if it gets popular in Turkey first and then spreads to the rest of the world, then maybe it's your culture. Maybe not? Things travel too fast now.
Thats the aspect people should be looking at, instead of trolling.
For me, it is not rational to find multintional stuff cultural.
Ex:
basketball and football lack cultural aspects. They dont tell you about their origins. But, you can say Cirit(javelin throwing on horses, to each other, like a boss) has many deepness inside of them and there are so many small stuff to do from the past, like 3,5k years.
Getting inside your shop for the first time ever ,and taking the first step with right foot has a past and cultural. People don't explain why. But they do it. It of course had a meaning, maybe it still has.
Just some Kebab types FYI. They have origins and cultural aspects, according to daily life, and unlike your "Hamburger" types they are all different from each other in many ways. Some look same but, anyway you have to taste all of them.
Kebab refers to a great variety of meat-based dishes in Turkish cuisine. Kebab in Turkey encompasses not only grilled or skewered meats, but also stews and casseroles.
Adana kebap or kıyma kebabı – kebab with hand-minced (zırh) meat mixed with chili on a flat wide metal skewer (shish); associated with Adana region although very popular all over Turkey.[11]
Ali Paşa kebabı, "Ali Pasha kebab" – cubed lamb with tomato, onion and parsley wrapped in phillo.[11]
Alinazik kebab – Ground meat kebab sautéed in a saucepan, with garlic, yogurt and eggplants added.
Bahçıvan kebabı, 'gardener's kebab' – Boneless lamb shoulder mixed with chopped onions and tomato paste.
Beykoz kebabı – Tomato and onion flavoured lamb, wrapped in aubergine slices and garnished with lamb brains.[11]
Beyti kebab – Ground lamb or beef, seasoned and grilled on a skewer, often served wrapped in lavash and topped with tomato sauce and yoghurt, traced back to the famous kebab house Beyti in İstanbul and particularly popular in Turkey's larger cities.
Bostan kebabı – Lamb and aubergine casserole.[11]
Buğu kebabı, "steamed kebap" – cooked in low heat until the meat releases its moisture and reabsorbs it.
Cağ kebab, 'spoke kebab' – Cubes of lamb roasted first on a cağ (a horizontal rotating spit) and then on a skewer, a specialty of Erzurum region with recently rising popularity.
Ciğerli kağıt kebabı, 'liver paper kebab' – Lamb liver kebab mixed with meat and marinated with thyme, parsley and dill.
Çardak kebabı, 'arbor kebab' – Stuffed lamb meat in a crêpe.
Çökertme kebabı – Sirloin veal kebap stuffed with yogurt and potatoes.
Çömlek kebabı, 'earthenware bowl kebab' – Meat and vegetable casserole (called a güveç in Turkish) with eggplant, carrots, shallots, beans, tomatoes and green pepper.
Çöp şiş, "small skewer kebab" – a specialty of Selçuk and Germencik near Ephesus, pounded boneless meat with tomatoes and garlic marinated with black pepper, thyme and oil on wooden skewers.[12]
Döner kebab Hünkâri kebabı, 'Sultan's kebab' – Sliced lamb meat mixed with patlıcan beğendi (aubergine purée), basil, thyme and bay leaf.[11]
İskender kebap – döner kebap served with yoghurt, tomato sauce and butter, originated in Bursa. The kebab was invented by İskender Efendi in 1867. He was inspired from Cağ kebab and turned it from horizontal to vertical.
İslim kebabı, 'steamed kebab' – Another version of the aubergine kebab without its skin, marinated in sunflower oil.[11][12]
Kağıt kebabı – Lamb cooked in a paper wrapping.[12]
Kuyu kebabı, 'pit kebab' – Prepared from the goat it is special for Aydın region, similar to tandır kebabı.
Kuzu incik kebabı, 'lamb shank kebab' – Lamb shanks mixed with peeled eggplants and chopped tomatoes, cream, salt and pepper.
Kuzu şiş – Shish prepared with marinated milk-fed lamb meat.
Köfte kebap or Shish köfte – minced lamb meatballs with herbs, often including parsley and mint, on a stick, grilled.
Kılıç şiş – Brochette of swordfish[11]
Manisa kebabı – This Manisa region version of the kebab is smaller and flat size shish meat on the sliced pide bread, flavored with butter, and stuffed with tomato, garlic and green pepper.
Orman kebabı, 'forest kebab' – Lamb meat on the bone and cut in large pieces mixed with carrots, potatoes and peas.[11]
Patates kebabı, 'potato kebab' – Beef or chicken mixed with potatoes, onions, tomato sauce and bay leaves.
Patlıcan kebabı, 'aubergine kebab' – Special kebap meat marinated in spices and served with eggplant (aubergine), hot pide bread and a yoghurt sauce.[12]
Ramazan kebabı, 'Ramadan kebab' – Meat mixed with yogurt, tomato and garlic stuffed with fresh mint or garnish on Pide bread.
Şiş kebabı – Prepared with fish, lamb or chicken meat on thin metal or reed rods, grilled.[11][12]
Sivas kebabı – Associated with the Sivas region, similar to Tokat kebab but especially lamb ribs are preferred and it also differs from Tokat kebabı on the point that there are no potatoes inside.
Susuz kebap, 'waterless kebab' – Cooked after draining excess fluid from the meat rubbed with salt and cinnamon in saucepan.
Şiş kebab
Şiş tavuk or Tavuk şiş or – Yogurt-marinated chicken grilled on a stick[12]
Talaş kebabı, 'sawdust kebab' – Diced lamb, mixed with grated onions, brown meat mixed with flour dough.
Tandır kebabı, 'tandoor kebab' – Lamb pieces (sometimes a whole lamb) baked in an oven called a tandır, which requires a special way of cooking for hours. Served with bread and raw onions.[11]
Tas kebabı, 'bowl kebab' – Stewed kebab in a bowl, beginning with the cooking of the vegetables in butter employing a method called yaga vurmak, ("butter infusion"), before the meat itself is cooked in the same grease.
Testi kebabı, 'earthenware-jug kebab' – Ingredients are similar to çömlek kebabı, prepared in a testi instead of a güveç, generally found in Central Anatolia and the Mid-Western Black Sea region.
Tokat kebabı – Associated with the Tokat region, it is made with veal marinated in olive oil, aubergine, tomatoes, potatoes, onion, garlic and special pita bread.
Urfa kebabı – from Urfa, similar to Adana kebab, but not spicy
There are more Ive seen or heard the name of, but that is enough I suppose
The First basketball type game may have been played by the early Olmec people of ancient Mexico as early as 500 years go. The Aztec, and Mayan cultures also had a game similar to basketball, only instead of a rubber ball they used the decapitated skulls of their conquered foes. The First true basketball game as we know it was on January 20th, 1892 in Springfield, Massachusetts. Canadian Doctor James Naismith invented the game for the YMCA to play during the winter months. Naismith wrote simple rules for the game, and nailed up two peach baskets for hoops, most of original Naismith rules are still in place today. Some of the rules have changed a bit, and new rules have been added since then, such as in the original game bouncing the ball was prohibited. Of the 13 rules, nine have been modified and kept in the modern game of basketball, the rest have been disregarded.
On January 21 2012 17:17 Falling wrote: I'v never heard that- I've heard Canada has no culture. Either we are too much like the Americans or else we define our Canadianism as being "we are NOT Americans."
Perhaps it could be argued that American culture is not very old- as America (that is ignoring the indigenous cultures). Old culture seems to carry greater importance. But I don't think it could be said that America has no culture- perhaps it's the commercialized culture that people react to. Because quite certainly American/ Western culture is very exportable so there must be a culture to export.
Oh and just like a lot of things, we'll fight you for Basketball. No matter how long you've lived in America, if you were born in Canada and if you do something we like, we will claim you. And if you do something we don't like, we will disown you to the Americans just as fast
On January 21 2012 18:13 Wafflelisk wrote: Of course the USA has culture. Just because several people might not like the US government or even the attitude of its people doesn't mean they can deny that several significant things have originated from there in its very short lifetime as a nation. I actually have heard a few people say "the USA has no culture" a few times, and I'm not even sure where it comes from. Maybe because not *every* American person likes/does the exact same thing? That'd be nonsense, because I'm pretty sure not every Frenchman likes wine.
PS: Wasn't baseball heavily influenced from a sport played in Britain? I know it became what it is today in the USA probably enough to be called an American invention, but if what I know about it's previous iteration is correct, I think it's unfair to say baseball is a purely American sport without at least explaining one's reasoning in parenthesis. I'll give you basketball, but it's not 100% clear itself.
On January 21 2012 22:19 Uncreative_Troll wrote: The only reason why I heared someone saying that America has no culture was because of their influence on the Esskultur ("eating culture"?, is there an english word for that meaning?) Fast food-restaurants and stuff like that are something I by myself consider to be "minor"/loss of culture (<- I am a food racist!) compared to my cultures usual food.
Notes: I would consider Basketball to be from Canada when the inventor was Canadian (by birth).
Someone claimed that the USA might be considered to have no culture because their language isn't that old... You guys speak English which comes from England...
Sorry for my bad English by the way.
On January 21 2012 22:31 Arkless wrote: Hate to burst your bubble. But basketball was created by us canadians =)
On January 21 2012 23:48 Gyro_SC2 wrote: Wtf , we canadien created basketball !
On January 22 2012 00:05 Epoch wrote: Umm.. Canadians invented basketball. You don't even know what cultural things were created by you.
On January 21 2012 16:44 Wombatsavior wrote: Just gotta say, basketball came from Canada.
On this point -- no, No, and NO again -- please see James Naismith at the University of Kansas for the invention of the game of Basketball (in its current form) -- please see Latin American empires for previous version (Inca'n if memory serves). Sorry, had to get that out there. Rock Chalk!
On January 22 2012 00:53 Feartheguru wrote: America did NOT invent basketball.
On January 22 2012 01:10 lolmlg wrote: Hey Canadians. Don't bother. I know you all think you know what you're talking about because of those Heritage Minute propaganda pieces you were bombarded with, but consider that Canada didn't exist when the inventor of basketball was born. He was born in the "Province of Canada" which was a British colony that ceased to exist when the country of Canada was formed.
For the "Americans" I should mention this, though: the man was only in the US to do a job, and he was only in the US for a couple of years when he invented the game. No reasonable person would refer to him as an "American" at the time basketball was invented. At least not in this context.
By the way, Superman wasn't created by a Canadian. He was created by two Jewish men, one of whom was born in Canada to European immigrant parents. His family moved to the US when he was a kid.
On January 22 2012 03:05 Nders wrote: Didnt read the whole thing, but i hope the OP and everyone else are well aware that basketball was invented by a canadian...not saying usa have no culture, just saying it was a canadian who invented basketball.
It was a Canadian living in the US who invented it. It was popularized in the US and exported from there and is currently a much bigger part of US culture than it is a part of Canadian culture. Sort of like how soccer/football is a big part of a lot of cultures, but it was invented in Britain.
On January 22 2012 05:21 Mykill wrote: Did canadian who went to US who then invented basketball have a citizenship in US? if he didnt then canada invented it
On January 22 2012 06:03 Templar. wrote: basketball wasn't created by Americans.. it was created by a Canadian who went to America
It was still invented in America though.
Apparently canadians don't understand that if you leave a country for so many years you're not exactly part of that country's culture still. Let alone live out the rest of your life die and be buried in America, you're American http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Naismith Place of death Lawrence, Kansas. It's interesting that candians take he being born in canada as him being canadian forever when the US is probably the only country that takes birth place into account for nationality, due to it's immigrant history.
On January 22 2012 00:49 whatusername wrote: I think America is the only place in the world where you have ridiculous lawsuits over a nipple shown on TV for half a second.
Ahahahahaha, let's start a discussion about the Chinese judicial, oh wait I forgot there isn't one and the goverment and corrupt officials have the final say in everything. A Chinese person laughing at the American judicial now I've seen everything. Ahahahahaha
A person from a country where individuals have virtually no rights at all and you still choose to condescend on America. Been listening too much to The Communist Party Manifest have we?
What the fuck is with all these threads about nationality stereotypes recently?
I get it, TL is an international site, but who CARES if anyone thinks the Americans are fat or the French are arrogant? Didn't we do all this in the 80's?
On January 22 2012 06:21 IveReturned wrote: Is walking on the moon cultural?
no, but in all fairness this thread has kind of turned into an "America sucks!" "no America is awesome!" back and forth.
No but it deeply influenced the culture at the time, look at car design of the 50's to 60's americans were obsessed with the idea of flight, the space race start deeply influenced america onwards.
On January 22 2012 06:50 The KY wrote: What the fuck is with all these threads about nationality stereotypes recently?
I get it, TL is an international site, but who CARES if anyone thinks the Americans are fat or the French are arrogant? Didn't we do all this in the 80's?
Didn't you hear racism is dead apparently so country and their people hating isn't racist anymore and people aren't ashamed to do so. =p
I don't think the major criticism is that Americans have no culture, only that their "culture" is new, and doesn't even go back much farther than 500 years. To put it into perspective, the Muslims had controlled much of Southern & Western Europe for over 500 years before the crusades drove them back to Jerusalem. The Roman Empire lasted for even longer, before its collapse. As far as being a deep, ancient culture, definitely not, but obviously there is some kind of culture present in any society. Look at China, India, Greece or Egypt. There's simply no comparison. There is a difference between no culture, and a lack of culture.
On January 22 2012 06:39 semantics wrote: *snip for space.
Apparently canadians don't understand that if you leave a country for so many years you're not exactly part of that country's culture still. Let alone live out the rest of your life die and be buried in America, you're American http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Naismith Place of death Lawrence, Kansas. It's interesting that candians take he being born in canada as him being canadian forever when the US is probably the only country that takes birth place into account for nationality, due to it's immigrant history.
Yep. That's pretty much what my post was about. If you were born in Canada and left immediately thereafter, we will claim you. We are very possesive that way- unless you muck up your career and then we will disown you- we will give you Pamela Anderson for instance.
a bit confused why the OP made the thread in the first place... i don't think it will actually convince anyone that wasn't convinced before. only start flamefests.
one problem is i don't think america has a single identifying culture. east coast is so much different than midwest, which is so different from west coast, which is so different from the south. even within one region you can't say florida has the same culture as arkansas. californians are noticeably different from nevadans. there are certain things we all appreciate, but i wouldn't say we have a single american culture beyond the basic american traditions.
I think it's odd the people that equate 'country' with 'culture'. Talking about countries as if they have a single culture or even a single set of cultures is weird.
For a pretty obvious example, here we are on team liquid.net, a website within the starcraft community with its own cultural norms/worldviews, etc that is completely anational.
It's almost like the argument against racism-- there is more diversity within an ethnic group than across ethnic groups, and it make sense to talk about broader similarities between two individuals across ethnic groups than two potential individuals within them, etc. We've all heard it before, don't need to rehash the whole argument here. Why race? or why the pairing of country with culture? The answer is political.
America is the world's culture now, they have influenced the entire world. America is (was?) a great country, but I can't help but feel like the good years of America are gone and they need a revolution to get back on track. Congress is fucked beyond repair, their entire political system seems so corrupt that it should simply be rebuilt from the ground up. They have companies which have way too much power and many, many uneducated people. America can be the best country in the world for years to come if they get their shit together, but to me, America seems fucked beyond repair, and it scares me.
The biggest issue facing America is how undecuted your people are by statistics. This probably doesnt apply to anyone reading Team Liquid, but you have some dumb ass motherfuckers living in your country. For how developed a country America is, it is highly uneducated.
Push come to shove, America is a fucking empire, and every empire in the history of the world has fallen. The world would be a better place if America wasn't fueling the worlds money into Aircraft Carriers and weapons of mass destruction.
Can you imagine Rick Perry or Mitt Romney having power over 8500 nuclear missles? What the fuck?
On the flipside, America has been a powerhouse of innovation in technology over the past century. So, I mean good on you guys, cause I like computers and video games.
On January 22 2012 06:39 semantics wrote: *snip for space.
Apparently canadians don't understand that if you leave a country for so many years you're not exactly part of that country's culture still. Let alone live out the rest of your life die and be buried in America, you're American http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Naismith Place of death Lawrence, Kansas. It's interesting that candians take he being born in canada as him being canadian forever when the US is probably the only country that takes birth place into account for nationality, due to it's immigrant history.
Yep. That's pretty much what my post was about. If you were born in Canada and left immediately thereafter, we will claim you. We are very possesive that way- unless you muck up your career and then we will disown you- we will give you Pamela Anderson for instance.
What!?! Damnt it. We don't want pam anderson. Fine, how about this: we will take pam, but we also get Huk, once and for all. I would also be willing to negotiate a trade involving Steve Nash for the state of Minnesotta.
I don't think people say America has no culture, I think they say Americans are "uncultured", which means they don't understand other cultures around the globe. This is mostly true; we are isolated from other countries. Mexico is kept locked out, Canada is full of soulless doppelgangers, and we don't learn much about Asia or Europe in school. Meanwhile, Europe is a diverse and rich tapestry of different cultures mingling together, so they have more exposure to different views. Japan and Korea are also very globally connected through technology and education. It makes some sense that foreigners would see us as uncouth.
On January 22 2012 07:07 Techno wrote: America is the world's culture now, they have influenced the entire world. America is (was?) a great country, but I can't help but feel like the good years of America are gone and they need a revolution to get back on track. Congress is fucked beyond repair, their entire political system seems so corrupt that it should simply be rebuilt from the ground up. They have companies which have way too much power and many, many uneducated people. America can be the best country in the world for years to come if they get their shit together, but to me, America seems fucked beyond repair, and it scares me.
The biggest issue facing America is how undecuted your people are by statistics. This probably doesnt apply to anyone reading Team Liquid, but you have some dumb ass motherfuckers living in your country. For how developed a country America is, it is highly uneducated.
Push come to shove, America is a fucking empire, and every empire in the history of the world has fallen. The world would be a better place if America wasn't fueling the worlds money into Aircraft Carriers and weapons of mass destruction.
Can you imagine Rick Perry or Mitt Romney having power over 8500 nuclear missles? What the fuck?
On the flipside, America has been a powerhouse of innovation in technology over the past century. So, I mean good on you guys, cause I like computers and video games.
To be fair, the U.S. rates higher than Germany and the U.K. on that index, yet I think most would agree that their schooling is on average probably better. My guess would be that it's because that index just takes enrollment figures, not quality of education, and the quality of education in the U.S. is pretty well known to be shit on average (at least through high school).
On January 22 2012 00:49 whatusername wrote: I think America is the only place in the world where you have ridiculous lawsuits over a nipple shown on TV for half a second.
Ahahahahaha, let's start a discussion about the Chinese judicial, oh wait I forgot there isn't one and the goverment and corrupt officials have the final say in everything. A Chinese person laughing at the American judicial now I've seen everything. Ahahahahaha
A person from a country where individuals have virtually no rights at all and you still choose to condescend on America. Been listening too much to The Communist Party Manifest have we?
你到底是不是中国人
Because obviously the American government isn't corrupt and most certainly isn't run by big business.
On January 22 2012 07:11 Cel.erity wrote: I don't think people say America has no culture, I think they say Americans are "uncultured", which means they don't understand other cultures around the globe. This is mostly true; we are isolated from other countries. Mexico is kept locked out, Canada is full of soulless doppelgangers, and we don't learn much about Asia or Europe in school. Meanwhile, Europe is a diverse and rich tapestry of different cultures mingling together, so they have more exposure to different views. Japan and Korea are also very globally connected through technology and education. It makes some sense that foreigners would see us as uncouth.
On January 22 2012 06:39 semantics wrote: *snip for space.
Apparently canadians don't understand that if you leave a country for so many years you're not exactly part of that country's culture still. Let alone live out the rest of your life die and be buried in America, you're American http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Naismith Place of death Lawrence, Kansas. It's interesting that candians take he being born in canada as him being canadian forever when the US is probably the only country that takes birth place into account for nationality, due to it's immigrant history.
Yep. That's pretty much what my post was about. If you were born in Canada and left immediately thereafter, we will claim you. We are very possesive that way- unless you muck up your career and then we will disown you- we will give you Pamela Anderson for instance.
What!?! Damnt it. We don't want pam anderson. Fine, how about this: we will take pam, but we also get Huk, once and for all. I would also be willing to negotiate a trade involving Steve Nash for the state of Minnesotta.
Ooh, those are tough trades. Reminds me of a Dave Chappelle sketch where the different ethnic groups are doing team trades. I think a large part of our possessiveness comess from the fact that the US is just such an overwhelmingly big market. So if you want to get big in most things (music, movies, sports) you've got to the US because that's where the money is.
Anytime an American team wins the Stanely Cup, you can be sure we're counting how many of our Canadian boys were there to win it. And it's the same with brain drain as it is talent drain. Not only do we feed into the American stream, we also consume a fair amount of the same stuff. In rental stores, Hollywood films are not placed in the American films section nor the foreign films, though tecnically they are both. And so even if they're not living in Canada, we don't exactly 'lose' them as we see them more often and paid better.
Our possessiveness is probably kinda silly, but there it is.
I'll answer these. Generally, the economy takes care of the debt. As long as we don't rack up too much more, we're still fine, especially since we own more than half of it. Because we have more than a fair share of retarded fundamentalists. Most Americans aren't like that. Because we have immigrants and a bad economy. That happens. Because someone has to sell weapons. It's not Americans, it's capitalism. Not all buyers are terrorists. Many aren't.
On January 22 2012 03:52 metbull wrote: Have you forgotten........ and and The world truly loves American culture. It can't be denied. Or they can't keep out American 'culture'.
Is this really culture? It is weird to say that Americans dont have a culture, first thing that comes to mind is eating turkey on your holiday or saying the national anthum before you start school (not sure if this is dont everywhere in USA) I do not see however, how companys have anything to do with a culture.
This thread is silly and I'm surprised that it is still open. American culture is so indisputably prolific worldwide that I can't imagine how anyone can argue with a straight face that America has no culture.
On January 22 2012 03:52 metbull wrote: Have you forgotten........ and and The world truly loves American culture. It can't be denied. Or they can't keep out American 'culture'.
Is this really culture? It is weird to say that Americans dont have a culture, first thing that comes to mind is eating turkey on your holiday or saying the national anthum before you start school (not sure if this is dont everywhere in USA) I do not see however, how companys have anything to do with a culture.
I should think so. Part of culture is food and both McD and KFC were developed in America. It's going to look a lot different because a lot of American culture developed during the industrial revolution rather than pre-industrial, highly localized culture. So maybe industrial strength culture? But it's more varied than that- you'll get California culture, north-west, mid-west, Texan, the South variants on American culture.
American culture is both mass culture/ commericialized and also regional specific. But it won't be as localized as culture that developed starting as a little hamlet in England where people hardly traveled beyond there local cluster of villages because of transportation.
Basketball was created in Canada, not in U.S. as well as Baseball, which was first mentioned in 14th century French manuscripts. Get your facts straight. Also, American football came from British Rugby.
Jazz is not American music. It is a mix of African and European music so in reality it would be a cultural heritage of Europe and Africa. Why are you completely forgetting First Nation? They are true Americans, not immigrants who came there to start a new life. Their customs and traditions are true for America.
This thread seems to feature quite a bit of Canadians trying to differentiate themselves from Americans however possible, even though the two cultures are very similar. My experiences with Canadians have also reflected this. Would anyone else disagree about this? Serious question.
On January 22 2012 08:14 ThatGuyDoMo wrote: Although basketball was created IN America, it was created BY a CANADIAN.
Thought I might mention that.
hahaha, just something to add is all.
Well, if you're going to be like that, thanksgiving was created by English colonists long before USA was founded. Thanksgiving would ironically also be the best example of American culture imo, if you don't count fastfood restaurants.
We fight with everyone over what the word "football means".
In your football, there is no ball, and hardly any kicking. There is nothing to fight about.
Such ignorance, but I will start a separate thread on the etymology and origins of football.
Dont worry, ill explain what american football is here.
New English immigrants came to America and showed the second/third generation Americans what rugby was. First the Americans noticed that your not allowed to throw the ball forward, "this cant be right" they thought. That would make the game much harder, and a hard game isnt a fun game. So they changed the rule and made it so that you are allowed to throw the ball forward. After this they noticed that this new game was actually pretty rough. "This cant be right" they thought. This would give injury's, and we dont want that. So they made prime evil gundam suits to protect themselves. Now they didnt have to worry about pain that much. Lastly they forgot how the English named the game, remembering that there was another game in Europe, called football, they thought that should probably be the name of the game they learned. Somehow the Americans didnt consider that the name football could actually be a game played with the feet.
Now you know where American football comes from + Show Spoiler +
On January 22 2012 07:41 Falling wrote: Ooh, those are tough trades. Reminds me of a Dave Chappelle sketch where the different ethnic groups are doing team trades. I think a large part of our possessiveness comess from the fact that the US is just such an overwhelmingly big market. So if you want to get big in most things (music, movies, sports) you've got to the US because that's where the money is.
Anytime an American team wins the Stanely Cup, you can be sure we're counting how many of our Canadian boys were there to win it. And it's the same with brain drain as it is talent drain. Not only do we feed into the American stream, we also consume a fair amount of the same stuff. In rental stores, Hollywood films are not placed in the American films section nor the foreign films, though tecnically they are both. And so even if they're not living in Canada, we don't exactly 'lose' them as we see them more often and paid better.
Our possessiveness is probably kinda silly, but there it is.
I'll take that as a yes on the Huk trade and a maybe on the Nash deal.
On January 22 2012 08:14 LesPhoques wrote: Basketball was created in Canada, not in U.S. as well as Baseball, which was first mentioned in 14th century French manuscripts. Get your facts straight. Also, American football came from British Rugby.
Jazz is not American music. It is a mix of African and European music so in reality it would be a cultural heritage of Europe and Africa. Why are you completely forgetting First Nation? They are true Americans, not immigrants who came there to start a new life. Their customs and traditions are true for America.
yes and if we trace everything back to everywhere aren't we just noting but cosmic dust in an infinite every expand universe nothing but a small dot on the edge of a spiraling galaxy. =p
Funny how far people will reach to say america is bad/nothing. I like to think it's cuz ppl had penis envy of america post wwii
Actually I think the insult is that "Americans think they're the only ones with culture." Not the majority, of course, but historical evidence of American Culture being 'forced upon' other countries probably aggravates more than few souls. Also, there is the ignorance of a number of people who happen to be on American television quite often...
On January 22 2012 03:52 metbull wrote: Have you forgotten........ and and The world truly loves American culture. It can't be denied. Or they can't keep out American 'culture'.
Is this really culture? It is weird to say that Americans dont have a culture, first thing that comes to mind is eating turkey on your holiday or saying the national anthum before you start school (not sure if this is dont everywhere in USA) I do not see however, how companys have anything to do with a culture.
Yes in fact it is so much culture that you're blinded by it. Because you're blinded by it you cannot fully comprehend how rich our culture is and out of confusion believe we have no culture. Perfectly understandable though.
Music: Jazz + Rap + Hip Hop (though the latter two have been shit as of late) Comedy: We own it. Movies: You watch them because they're about us. Sarcasm: We invented it. Fast Food: We die for it. Debt: We do debt so well it affects other countires and their economies. World Police: Are you going to do it? Computers as you know them: Yup we did that Sports: World champions even though only US teams played
Melting pot of old and new cultures combined and reinvented over and over again. Spreading from Hawaii to NYC. All the fads and ideas the rest of the world wished they could come up with.
America, is not troubled with NO culture, we have so many together that it can be hard to know what is shared between Americans. I'm not an expert on this, but Music, food, movies, books, etc are a lot of what define our culture. Living in a place like New York is truly an experience you probably don't see many other places.
There are people from every nation, and it can be overwhelming at times, seeing the large differences of life style, or even the similarities. America's culture is... weird, but we've got one for sure. :D
On January 22 2012 03:52 metbull wrote: Have you forgotten........ and and The world truly loves American culture. It can't be denied. Or they can't keep out American 'culture'.
Is this really culture? It is weird to say that Americans dont have a culture, first thing that comes to mind is eating turkey on your holiday or saying the national anthum before you start school (not sure if this is dont everywhere in USA) I do not see however, how companys have anything to do with a culture.
Comedy: We own it. Sarcasm: We invented it. Fast Food: We die for it. Debt: We do debt so well it affects other countires and their economies. Computers as you know them: Yup we did that
"Nationalism does nothing but teach you to hate people that you never met. All of a sudden you begin to take pride in accomplishments you had no part in whatsoever" -Doug Stanhope
On January 22 2012 03:52 metbull wrote: Have you forgotten........ and and The world truly loves American culture. It can't be denied. Or they can't keep out American 'culture'.
Is this really culture? It is weird to say that Americans dont have a culture, first thing that comes to mind is eating turkey on your holiday or saying the national anthum before you start school (not sure if this is dont everywhere in USA) I do not see however, how companys have anything to do with a culture.
Yes in fact it is so much culture that you're blinded by it. Because you're blinded by it you cannot fully comprehend how rich our culture is and out of confusion believe we have no culture. Perfectly understandable though.
Music: Jazz + Rap + Hip Hop (though the latter two have been shit as of late) Comedy: We own it. Movies: You watch them because they're about us. Sarcasm: We invented it. Fast Food: We die for it. Debt: We do debt so well it affects other countires and their economies. World Police: Are you going to do it? Computers as you know them: Yup we did that Sports: World champions even though only US teams played
Melting pot of old and new cultures combined and reinvented over and over again. Spreading from Hawaii to NYC. All the fads and ideas the rest of the world wished they could come up with.
America Fuck Ya!
<3 all other countires though.
You are kidding, right? I am pretty sure you know why I am saying this, so I wont argue further.
What I ment with my post was, that I am aware that food is culture, but the idea that a company that produces food can be seen as culture is weird to me. Surely, bad hamburgers and nasty fries with a soda is american culture, but is McDonalds as well?
On January 22 2012 03:52 metbull wrote: Have you forgotten........ and and The world truly loves American culture. It can't be denied. Or they can't keep out American 'culture'.
Is this really culture? It is weird to say that Americans dont have a culture, first thing that comes to mind is eating turkey on your holiday or saying the national anthum before you start school (not sure if this is dont everywhere in USA) I do not see however, how companys have anything to do with a culture.
Comedy: We own it. Sarcasm: We invented it. Fast Food: We die for it. Debt: We do debt so well it affects other countires and their economies. Computers as you know them: Yup we did that
"Nationalism does nothing but teach you to hate people that you never met. All of a sudden you begin to take pride in accomplishments you had no part in whatsoever" -Doug Stanhope
On January 22 2012 03:52 metbull wrote: Have you forgotten........ and and The world truly loves American culture. It can't be denied. Or they can't keep out American 'culture'.
Is this really culture? It is weird to say that Americans dont have a culture, first thing that comes to mind is eating turkey on your holiday or saying the national anthum before you start school (not sure if this is dont everywhere in USA) I do not see however, how companys have anything to do with a culture.
Comedy: We own it. Sarcasm: We invented it. Fast Food: We die for it. Debt: We do debt so well it affects other countires and their economies. Computers as you know them: Yup we did that
"Nationalism does nothing but teach you to hate people that you never met. All of a sudden you begin to take pride in accomplishments you had no part in whatsoever" -Doug Stanhope
But instead of quoting the proper parts you took my lines (except movies) that I actually did take a part of. I consider myself rather funny though I don't know how to prove it. That post was sarcastic Love my fast food and I am a manager of an programming company. I didn't really contribute to the debt in the fact that I didn't make the decision to spend the money, but I did vote for the offical that did, so in the end I am actually a part of all of that.
"Nationalism does nothing but teach you to hate people that you never met. All of a sudden you begin to take pride in accomplishments you had no part in whatsoever" -Doug Stanhope
On January 22 2012 03:52 metbull wrote: Have you forgotten........ and and The world truly loves American culture. It can't be denied. Or they can't keep out American 'culture'.
Is this really culture? It is weird to say that Americans dont have a culture, first thing that comes to mind is eating turkey on your holiday or saying the national anthum before you start school (not sure if this is dont everywhere in USA) I do not see however, how companys have anything to do with a culture.
Comedy: We own it. Sarcasm: We invented it. Fast Food: We die for it. Debt: We do debt so well it affects other countires and their economies. Computers as you know them: Yup we did that
"Nationalism does nothing but teach you to hate people that you never met. All of a sudden you begin to take pride in accomplishments you had no part in whatsoever" -Doug Stanhope
Movies: You watch them because they're about us.
No, we watch them because Hollywood has budget =)
But instead of quoting the proper parts you took my lines (except movies) that I actually did take a part of. I consider myself rather funny though I don't know how to prove it. That post was sarcastic Love my fast food and I am a manager of an programming company. I didn't really contribute to the debt in the fact that I didn't make the decision to spend the money, but I did vote for the offical that did, so in the end I am actually a part of all of that.
I wasn't attacking you, I quoted a comedian and I think it was a good followup to your post . It applies to many people here.
On January 22 2012 03:52 metbull wrote: Have you forgotten........ and and The world truly loves American culture. It can't be denied. Or they can't keep out American 'culture'.
Is this really culture? It is weird to say that Americans dont have a culture, first thing that comes to mind is eating turkey on your holiday or saying the national anthum before you start school (not sure if this is dont everywhere in USA) I do not see however, how companys have anything to do with a culture.
Yes in fact it is so much culture that you're blinded by it. Because you're blinded by it you cannot fully comprehend how rich our culture is and out of confusion believe we have no culture. Perfectly understandable though.
Music: Jazz + Rap + Hip Hop (though the latter two have been shit as of late) Comedy: We own it. Movies: You watch them because they're about us. Sarcasm: We invented it. Fast Food: We die for it. Debt: We do debt so well it affects other countires and their economies. World Police: Are you going to do it? Computers as you know them: Yup we did that Sports: World champions even though only US teams played
Melting pot of old and new cultures combined and reinvented over and over again. Spreading from Hawaii to NYC. All the fads and ideas the rest of the world wished they could come up with.
America Fuck Ya!
<3 all other countires though.
You are kidding, right? I am pretty sure you know why I am saying this, so I wont argue further.
What I ment with my post was, that I am aware that food is culture, but the idea that a company that produces food can be seen as culture is weird to me. Surely, bad hamburgers and nasty fries with a soda is american culture, but is McDonalds as well?
The part about inventing sarcasm doesn't make it so old that it is a lost art or anything.... And I agree that a company perhaps does seem weird that it is part of a culture, but it is a part of your culture isn't it? I mean it is a part of a lot of peoples day. Working at X place or using X place. Like the GSL and to a futher extent all of esports is a part of Korean culture though. It is a company that we think of when we think of Korea.
sorry if this has been mentioned before, haven't read any post cept OP cus i kinda feel most posts will be pointless flames. I disagree with your statement, actually i have never heard it before. What i have heard before is America has no "own" culture, guess this is in regards to America being a melting pot of cultures. And of course America has no(read a relatively short) history. And i kinda agree with both of them. Don't get me wrong i do not mean this as a negative point. The melting pot could be seen as a lesson for most of the world with growing globalism. Not to mention the fact that most cultures in the world have been mixed through invasions and migration. The history aspect the same. Be it short; it is a colorful/diverse history. All i can say is don't worry bout "insults" like that.
On January 22 2012 03:52 metbull wrote: Have you forgotten........ and and The world truly loves American culture. It can't be denied. Or they can't keep out American 'culture'.
Is this really culture? It is weird to say that Americans dont have a culture, first thing that comes to mind is eating turkey on your holiday or saying the national anthum before you start school (not sure if this is dont everywhere in USA) I do not see however, how companys have anything to do with a culture.
Comedy: We own it. Sarcasm: We invented it. Fast Food: We die for it. Debt: We do debt so well it affects other countires and their economies. Computers as you know them: Yup we did that
"Nationalism does nothing but teach you to hate people that you never met. All of a sudden you begin to take pride in accomplishments you had no part in whatsoever" -Doug Stanhope
Movies: You watch them because they're about us.
No, we watch them because Hollywood has budget =)
But instead of quoting the proper parts you took my lines (except movies) that I actually did take a part of. I consider myself rather funny though I don't know how to prove it. That post was sarcastic Love my fast food and I am a manager of an programming company. I didn't really contribute to the debt in the fact that I didn't make the decision to spend the money, but I did vote for the offical that did, so in the end I am actually a part of all of that.
I wasn't attacking you, I quoted a comedian and I think it was a good followup to your post . It applies to many people here.
I know you weren't. Just wanted to counter your piece. I would never hate on Canada though when I was 16 and visiting family in upstate NY, Canada was the promise land of booze, cheap cigs, fireworks and a good time. I know there is much more to Canda than that, but when you're young mischeif is the first thing on your mind when given the oppertunity.
On January 22 2012 03:52 metbull wrote: Have you forgotten........ and and The world truly loves American culture. It can't be denied. Or they can't keep out American 'culture'.
Is this really culture? It is weird to say that Americans dont have a culture, first thing that comes to mind is eating turkey on your holiday or saying the national anthum before you start school (not sure if this is dont everywhere in USA) I do not see however, how companys have anything to do with a culture.
Yes in fact it is so much culture that you're blinded by it. Because you're blinded by it you cannot fully comprehend how rich our culture is and out of confusion believe we have no culture. Perfectly understandable though.
Music: Jazz + Rap + Hip Hop (though the latter two have been shit as of late) Comedy: We own it. Movies: You watch them because they're about us. Sarcasm: We invented it. Fast Food: We die for it. Debt: We do debt so well it affects other countires and their economies. World Police: Are you going to do it? Computers as you know them: Yup we did that Sports: World champions even though only US teams played
Melting pot of old and new cultures combined and reinvented over and over again. Spreading from Hawaii to NYC. All the fads and ideas the rest of the world wished they could come up with.
America Fuck Ya!
<3 all other countires though.
You are kidding, right? I am pretty sure you know why I am saying this, so I wont argue further.
What I ment with my post was, that I am aware that food is culture, but the idea that a company that produces food can be seen as culture is weird to me. Surely, bad hamburgers and nasty fries with a soda is american culture, but is McDonalds as well?
The part about inventing sarcasm doesn't make it so old that it is a lost art or anything.... And I agree that a company perhaps does seem weird that it is part of a culture, but it is a part of your culture isn't it? I mean it is a part of a lot of peoples day. Working at X place or using X place. Like the GSL and to a futher extent all of esports is a part of Korean culture though. It is a company that we think of when we think of Korea.
Maybe the following comparison isnt really correct, because food is food.
Philips is a Dutch company. Philips developed the CD. I use CD's in my everyday live. So in this logic, is the CD part of the Dutch culture?
Edit: more importantly is Philips part of the Dutch culture?
On January 22 2012 03:52 metbull wrote: Have you forgotten........ and and The world truly loves American culture. It can't be denied. Or they can't keep out American 'culture'.
Is this really culture? It is weird to say that Americans dont have a culture, first thing that comes to mind is eating turkey on your holiday or saying the national anthum before you start school (not sure if this is dont everywhere in USA) I do not see however, how companys have anything to do with a culture.
Yes in fact it is so much culture that you're blinded by it. Because you're blinded by it you cannot fully comprehend how rich our culture is and out of confusion believe we have no culture. Perfectly understandable though.
Music: Jazz + Rap + Hip Hop (though the latter two have been shit as of late) Comedy: We own it. Movies: You watch them because they're about us. Sarcasm: We invented it. Fast Food: We die for it. Debt: We do debt so well it affects other countires and their economies. World Police: Are you going to do it? Computers as you know them: Yup we did that Sports: World champions even though only US teams played
Melting pot of old and new cultures combined and reinvented over and over again. Spreading from Hawaii to NYC. All the fads and ideas the rest of the world wished they could come up with.
America Fuck Ya!
<3 all other countires though.
You are kidding, right? I am pretty sure you know why I am saying this, so I wont argue further.
What I ment with my post was, that I am aware that food is culture, but the idea that a company that produces food can be seen as culture is weird to me. Surely, bad hamburgers and nasty fries with a soda is american culture, but is McDonalds as well?
The part about inventing sarcasm doesn't make it so old that it is a lost art or anything.... And I agree that a company perhaps does seem weird that it is part of a culture, but it is a part of your culture isn't it? I mean it is a part of a lot of peoples day. Working at X place or using X place. Like the GSL and to a futher extent all of esports is a part of Korean culture though. It is a company that we think of when we think of Korea.
Maybe the following comparison isnt really correct, because food is food.
Philips is a Dutch company. Philips developed the CD. I use CD's in my everyday live. So in this logic, is the CD part of the Dutch culture?
Edit: more importantly is Philips part of the Dutch culture?
maybe not from the Dutch culture but defensibly from the Brabantse culture
On January 22 2012 03:52 metbull wrote: Have you forgotten........ and and The world truly loves American culture. It can't be denied. Or they can't keep out American 'culture'.
Is this really culture? It is weird to say that Americans dont have a culture, first thing that comes to mind is eating turkey on your holiday or saying the national anthum before you start school (not sure if this is dont everywhere in USA) I do not see however, how companys have anything to do with a culture.
Comedy: We own it. Sarcasm: We invented it. Fast Food: We die for it. Debt: We do debt so well it affects other countires and their economies. Computers as you know them: Yup we did that
"Nationalism does nothing but teach you to hate people that you never met. All of a sudden you begin to take pride in accomplishments you had no part in whatsoever" -Doug Stanhope
Movies: You watch them because they're about us.
No, we watch them because Hollywood has budget =)
But instead of quoting the proper parts you took my lines (except movies) that I actually did take a part of. I consider myself rather funny though I don't know how to prove it. That post was sarcastic Love my fast food and I am a manager of an programming company. I didn't really contribute to the debt in the fact that I didn't make the decision to spend the money, but I did vote for the offical that did, so in the end I am actually a part of all of that.
I wasn't attacking you, I quoted a comedian and I think it was a good followup to your post . It applies to many people here.
I know you weren't. Just wanted to counter your piece. I would never hate on Canada though when I was 16 and visiting family in upstate NY, Canada was the promise land of booze, cheap cigs, fireworks and a good time. I know there is much more to Canda than that, but when you're young mischeif is the first thing on your mind when given the oppertunity.
You won't get my love by praising Canada. I hate that country :D!
rofl somebody at first page talking about jordans and nikes and claiming that its same as any other cultural stuff or like it has any value.
well, Louis Vuitton is a french brand and it have been inspired a lot by french stuff back in the time but still it isnt a part of their culture. Your point makes no sense at all lol.
we are in 2012 and THERE IS still 2 centuries old american ultra-nationalism and the right-wing madness with "WE HAVE CULTURE! WE HAVE HOLYWOOD, MCDONALDS, NBA!!!" stupidty.
The native american civilization that your European ancestors have eradicated from the face of earth had the culture that other people around the world is talking about. Your lands that you are living on now was meant to be colonies, not a darn new europe.
Americans want to have some culture? let it pass 2-3 more centuries minimum coz it is a very young nation and people. Only notable thing that Americans have done for the world was their help in WW2 and that is just because of their debt to the Allies and losing the asian market to JAPAN. So far the American history tells to us regarding culture is that, it is the land of immigration, kudos to french revolution.
On January 22 2012 03:52 metbull wrote: Have you forgotten........ and and The world truly loves American culture. It can't be denied. Or they can't keep out American 'culture'.
Is this really culture? It is weird to say that Americans dont have a culture, first thing that comes to mind is eating turkey on your holiday or saying the national anthum before you start school (not sure if this is dont everywhere in USA) I do not see however, how companys have anything to do with a culture.
Yes in fact it is so much culture that you're blinded by it. Because you're blinded by it you cannot fully comprehend how rich our culture is and out of confusion believe we have no culture. Perfectly understandable though.
Music: Jazz + Rap + Hip Hop (though the latter two have been shit as of late) Comedy: We own it. Movies: You watch them because they're about us. Sarcasm: We invented it. Fast Food: We die for it. Debt: We do debt so well it affects other countires and their economies. World Police: Are you going to do it? Computers as you know them: Yup we did that Sports: World champions even though only US teams played
Melting pot of old and new cultures combined and reinvented over and over again. Spreading from Hawaii to NYC. All the fads and ideas the rest of the world wished they could come up with.
America Fuck Ya!
<3 all other countires though.
You are kidding, right? I am pretty sure you know why I am saying this, so I wont argue further.
What I ment with my post was, that I am aware that food is culture, but the idea that a company that produces food can be seen as culture is weird to me. Surely, bad hamburgers and nasty fries with a soda is american culture, but is McDonalds as well?
The part about inventing sarcasm doesn't make it so old that it is a lost art or anything.... And I agree that a company perhaps does seem weird that it is part of a culture, but it is a part of your culture isn't it? I mean it is a part of a lot of peoples day. Working at X place or using X place. Like the GSL and to a futher extent all of esports is a part of Korean culture though. It is a company that we think of when we think of Korea.
Maybe the following comparison isnt really correct, because food is food.
Philips is a Dutch company. Philips developed the CD. I use CD's in my everyday live. So in this logic, is the CD part of the Dutch culture?
Edit: more importantly is Philips part of the Dutch culture?
I was thinking about the different scenarios in which companies are a part of a culture and I think we could wind up going in circles about everything other than food. Food is something needed to live. And with the companies that provide that food and your food stylistic choice I think you can agree that they're ideas are part of each countires individual culture.
Going further than that and deciding which company fits which culture best for anything other than food does seem odd. It does make me wonder though if there are other companies that can be part of your culture. The big one that sticks out to me is Walmart for the US and perhaps Microsoft as well. I think to assume a certain company is part of one's culture it must be truly dominate and owned by that country, but even then other than food is it really part of what makes up your nation.
I don't really know though -_-
On January 22 2012 09:01 Reyis wrote: rofl somebody at first page talking about jordans and nikes and claiming that its same as any other cultural stuff or like it has any value.
well, Louis Vuitton is a french brand and it have been inspired a lot by french stuff back in the time but still it isnt a part of their culture. Your point makes no sense at all lol.
we are in 2012 and THERE IS still 2 centuries old american ultra-nationalism and the right-wing madness with "WE HAVE CULTURE! WE HAVE HOLYWOOD, MCDONALDS, NBA!!!" stupidty.
The native american civilization that your European ancestors have eradicated from the face of earth had the culture that other people around the world is talking about. Your lands that you are living on now was meant to be colonies, not a darn new europe.
Americans want to have some culture? let it pass 2-3 more centuries minimum coz it is a very young nation and people. Only notable thing that Americans have done for the world was their help in WW2 and that is just because of their debt to the Allies and losing the asian market to JAPAN. So far the American history tells to us regarding culture is that, it is the land of immigration, kudos to french revolution.
Update your history books because that wasn't why we went to war. Also your end-run arguement is that America has no culture because they're too young. The people who live here now are all part of a giant melting pot of other countries. We take all their cultures in and mix them together. With that in mind if we in the end have no culture then no country has a culture. Or perhaps everyone who moved here lost it on their way.
Here is a list of the dates of the formation of every country that exists in the world.
The United States is the oldest country in the America's. Older than Brazil, Mexico, Argentina, etc. But most people would say these countries have more culture than the US. Why? Most of their modern day citizens are also descendants from other places, i.e Spain, Africa, etc..
The Unites States of America is also older than the following countries in Europe: Germany, Austria, Belgium, Finland, Hungary, Netherlands, Norway, Sweden, Switzerland to name a few. In fact, the US is actually older than most European countries.
So you see, if you want to base culture on when the country was formed, then the US actually has one of the most cultured countries in the world...
The only reason why people say countries in Europe have more culture is because those countries were formed from people that had customs and cultural identities from many years before.
Excuse me, did you just claim USA is older than Sweden? Sweden became sweden when gustav vasa was crowned king, which was in 1523. Please explain to me how USA is even close?
Sorry, the Sweden reference was a mistake. Sweden was in fact created in 1523 as you say, so it is older. However I believe my point is still valid that The United States is an older country than the majority of most European countries and all of North and South America.
Not really. Countries in Europe that are clearly younger than US are : Latvia, Estonia, Finland, Belarus, Belgium, Malta, Slovenia and that is about it. You might add Romania, Italy, Slovakia, Moldova and Ukraine to the mix depending on your definitions.
I don't think this argument is relevant at all. A culture follows a nation, or a particular civilisation if you will, not the political idea of a sovereign state. Malta became a sovereign state in 1964, but it would be incredibly stupid to say that the Maltese identity, and thus Maltese culture, started out then, especially when you consider that we have free standing buildings (and thus, evidence of civilisation, culture, religion, etc.) that are over 5,000 years old.
On January 21 2012 16:42 Vindicare605 wrote: The thing is. American culture is so mainstrream everywhere in the western world that most people forget its actually american.
No I just wanted to understand where the remarks of America being cultureless come from. I myself am the least nationalistic that a person can probably be. (I don't like it when people claim things such as innovation or inventions as part of their culture I believe that those things belong to individuals I was merely trying to show that some of these great things have originated in America not saying that we as Americans have any right to collectively take pride in what some of our countrymen have done.)
On January 22 2012 08:14 LesPhoques wrote: Basketball was created in Canada, not in U.S. as well as Baseball, which was first mentioned in 14th century French manuscripts. Get your facts straight. Also, American football came from British Rugby.
Jazz is not American music. It is a mix of African and European music so in reality it would be a cultural heritage of Europe and Africa. Why are you completely forgetting First Nation? They are true Americans, not immigrants who came there to start a new life. Their customs and traditions are true for America.
Basketball was invented in Massachusetts which last time I checked isn't a part of Canada. And Jazz is "a musical style that originated at the beginning of the 20th century in African American communities in the Southern United States."
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