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On December 14 2011 11:01 Sennap wrote:
What I feel, as a Terran player, is that Terran is missing idol players. What I mean by that is players that are doing really well and have huge fanbase (usually because they use unusual strategies). Just look at the crowd cheering for HerO, Leenock, WhiteRa, Stephano, Destiny, Naniwa, Huk, Kiwikaki and more. The only terran that gets the same attention is Boxer, but I don't see too much of him these days. Another terran I just love to watch is qxc, but I haven't seen many recent games of him either.
We really need a Terran who is willing to explore more strategies, and be successfully. I'd just love seeing someone going mech in a TvP without all-ining, ghosts in TvT, mass ghosts in any matchup, mass air in any matchup, (use raven), or any other nonstandard strategy and still take games off some of the best players in the world.
O_O... MVP? MMA? Bomber?
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On December 14 2011 11:15 HypernovA wrote:
Why have I stopped playing this game?
- I'm tired of having to work 2 or 3 times harder than most of my opponents (high diamond level).
- I'm tired of being flamed if I win because I play Terran.
- I'm tired of being called a bad player because I play Terran.
- I'm tired of people calling me a cheesy abuser if I use units like cloaked banshees, or hellions openings.
- I'm tired of people flaming Terran players who win tournaments in situations where clearly the Terran player was the superior player.
- I'm tired of receiving help answer like "LOL DUDE, MAKE MORE MARINES. Can't make more MMM against Protoss? Wow you suck."
There. I said it. The community is very negative toward Terran players in General and this has caused me to stop playing and only watch games.
AMEN. This is exactly how I feel. It's fucking depressing how some people act toward Terran.
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I find it pretty funny that all these people are wanting to switch to Z that have been T for so long. I have been a zerg player since beta (In diamond at the moment). The other day I have been so bored with Z that I just switched to random, I have never played T or P except for maybe 1-2 games each but now I am forced to learn that shit during ladder games! It is actually a lot of fun and while I have lost a few games, I am actually starting to win with T and P.
PvP is really fucking hard when you don't know how to play P at a diamond level, everyone keeps owning me with 4 gate, DT, immortal pushes, warp prism lol.. but it is fun non the less
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On December 14 2011 11:15 bubblegumbo wrote:
Going bio or some sort of bio variant gets very boring, and then hitting t and A move.I play terran and I wish mech was viable against Protoss, but not even Goody does mech vs Protoss anymore.
Look at the bright side---Blizzard will HAVE to make mech viable in TvP in HOTS, or terran will have no answer for colossus based deathballs with tempest support (bye bye vikings) ^-^
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On December 14 2011 11:15 HypernovA wrote:
Why have I stopped playing this game?
- I'm tired of having to work 2 or 3 times harder than most of my opponents (high diamond level).
- I'm tired of being flamed if I win because I play Terran.
- I'm tired of being called a bad player because I play Terran.
- I'm tired of people calling me a cheesy abuser if I use units like cloaked banshees, or hellions openings.
- I'm tired of people flaming Terran players who win tournaments in situations where clearly the Terran player was the superior player.
- I'm tired of receiving help answer like "LOL DUDE, MAKE MORE MARINES. Can't make more MMM against Protoss? Wow you suck."
There. I said it. The community is very negative toward Terran players in General and this has caused me to stop playing and only watch games.
Granted, I agree the community can be quite negative towards terran in LR threads and against pro players etc. (And here still you get flames and whines on all races.)
But on the ladder man, you will get flamed no matter what you are. (examples include "omg make more roach!", "broodlord so [insert insult]", "DEATHBALL LOL", "omg random always cheeser noob!" and "omg PvP such luck u still noob"). This is in no way unique to terrans and you are delusional if you think it is.
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let see zerg can abuse infestors and zerglings which r like one mineral heavy one gas heavy and they r excellent combo
protoss got sentry zealot early game one is dps and tank one can make sure zealots engage in favorable position and for late game chargelot archon which is again one mineral heavy and one gas heavy and super cost effective
terran has no combos like that (one is min heavy one is gas heavy) and have to micro a lot especially against templars/chargelots and infestor crackling
terran has to kite or split while the other race just a move and add in a few fungal or storm if they happened to have them
so yeah tbh i think its just easier to win with protoss and zerg than terran
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I switched from Z to T a while ago, mostly due to my undying hatred of zvz, and the main thing I noticed that was different with the ladder experience is that now 2/3rds of the games that I win end with the other player flaming me. I don't really mind getting bmed, it's perfectly natural to be angry at a loss, but thin-skinned people might have a problem with being screamed at every time they win a game.
As far as actual gameplay goes, I find TvZ incredibly frustrating, and even in diamond it feels like unless you get an unpunished 15 cc up you have to do some kind of 2 base timing push to keep the zerg from completely overrunning the map, and if that push fails, you just kind of die a slow death to mutas into eventual broodlords. This makes wins lategame vs zerg really fulfilling for me, so I'm more than happy to deal with the midgame nightmares, but I could definitely see a lot of players getting fed up with the difficulty of the matchup and switching.
I can't really share in the TvP woes that most people seem to have, as a well-practiced 2rax build seems to be the counter to the seemingly random nexus firsts or 4gates that I get from my protoss opponents lately. In all, I'm still really happy with my choice of race, but I can definitely see why people might be moving away from it.
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On December 14 2011 11:08 Devolved wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 10:57 Kharnage wrote:On December 14 2011 10:52 Zion9 wrote:On December 14 2011 10:46 Kharnage wrote:
Can someone list the big pile of nerfs that killed terran for me?
The ones i know of:
blue flame damage reduction (-5 damage to light)
rax build time (+5 secs)
emp radius nerf (-0.5 radius)
None of these seem too terrible... are there any others? Reaper nerf, Siege tank nerf, bunker build time shitting with Thor for patches These ones are pretty old though right? It's not like in the months following those 'nerfs' anyone switched race. They are a little like mentioning the supply depot first 'nerf'. Is the bunker build time 'nerfed' or returned to it's original value now? I've totally lost track of that one. I guess another question is does anyone think any of those nerfs were unfair or broke the race in some way? At a glance they all look kinda ok. EMP is probably the biggest one but ghosts are still argueably the best unit in the game... When taken 1 at a time these nerfs seem reasonable, but when you take the cumulative effect of the nerfs + buffs to other races it is really disheartening to play the Terran race. An example would be the siege Tank nerf + blue flame nerf + Thor energy re-enable + Immortal range buff + Zealot charge buff = impossible to go mech vs. Toss. And yes, whenever you win or take advantage of a units' traits as Terran everyone bitches about it whether it be on the ladder or in live report threads.
To quote Day9 "Huh". This is a really good point. All the protoss buffs effect their vs mech viability and a lot of the terran nerfs seem to hit their mech. It's totally valid to say 'Mech is less viable now in TvP than it was 8 months ago'.
None of them effect the protoss ability to deal with air units however, infact flux vanes, KA and blink research time argueably weaken protosses AA capability.
Hey, is it actually a nerf to get buffed and then de-buffed?
Bitching on ladder and LR threads will happen regardless. I had a terran blabber at me about me being a 1A race etc before protoss buff patch. *shrugs* BM players will say all sorts of shit regardless of the realities of the situation.
On December 14 2011 11:21 JL_GG wrote:
let see zerg can abuse infestors and zerglings which r like one mineral heavy one gas heavy and they r excellent combo
protoss got sentry zealot early game one is dps and tank one can make sure zealots engage in favorable position and for late game chargelot archon which is again one mineral heavy and one gas heavy and super cost effective
terran has no combos like that (one is min heavy one is gas heavy) and have to micro a lot especially against templars/chargelots and infestor crackling
terran has to kite or split while the other race just a move and add in a few fungal or storm if they happened to have them
so yeah tbh i think its just easier to win with protoss and zerg than terran
Why isn't marine raven viable?
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if vanishing means about 30% in every league, then yea their vanishing
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On December 14 2011 11:15 HypernovA wrote:
Why have I stopped playing this game?
- I'm tired of having to work 2 or 3 times harder than most of my opponents (high diamond level).
- I'm tired of being flamed if I win because I play Terran.
- I'm tired of being called a bad player because I play Terran.
- I'm tired of people calling me a cheesy abuser if I use units like cloaked banshees, or hellions openings.
- I'm tired of people flaming Terran players who win tournaments in situations where clearly the Terran player was the superior player.
- I'm tired of receiving help answer like "LOL DUDE, MAKE MORE MARINES. Can't make more MMM against Protoss? Wow you suck."
There. I said it. The community is very negative toward Terran players in General and this has caused me to stop playing and only watch games.
Although I agree in that the ¨T so OP lolz ez mode race¨ retardness really made it frustrating to play as T in ladder. I don´t really get your point here? You are tired of having to play better than your opponent to win?
Personally I don´t care as long as I have the option to out play my opponent I just found that particular argument kinda petty
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On December 14 2011 11:11 Luppy1 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 11:01 IMoperator wrote:On December 14 2011 10:53 Luppy1 wrote:
It's kinda awkward hearing people say zerg is an easier race. Can anyone give reasons for it?
A lot of diamonds-low masters are always claiming that games are extremely hard for them. I feel that's entirely because they didn't have to pick much skills when playing through the lower leagues. For example, those playing zerg would already face this difficulty through the lower leagues if they are lacking severely in their mechanics. But, terrans only face it at diamond, or even low masters. I think the difficulty of terran that everyone is talking about is probably only applicable at the highest level and it doesn't affect diamond- low master terrans at all. Once zerg knows how to scout and survive the stupid all ins low level terrans do, and they just mass lings and banes it's really hard for the terran to win without really good micro. With the reason that you gave, it still doesn't explain why it's easier. Even after knowing how to deal with a generic all-in, the execution of an all-in is still easier than having to react + exeute to defend an all in. Also, there are so many forms of early aggression terran players can do. Even pro gamers are still losing to all-ins even with the large rush distances on tournament maps.
It still happens sure, but not nearly as much as it used to. The ladder map pool got updated with bigger maps and that significantly weakened marine/scv all ins (remember when 2 rax scv all in bitbybit style was all terrans were using?) Like I said, after the zerg defends the early push/all in, it's their game to lose. If you're halfway decent at injects you should be able to pump a lot of units and since terrans have a much harder time microing tvz it's a lot easier for the zergs to just mass and attack over and over. The terran cannot do damage if he doesn't have the multitasking to do multipronged drops, or the micro to win in the big battles. It doesn't matter as much if the zerg loses his army if he trades pretty well. The terran HAS to keep the majority of his army after a battle and THEN do damage with it. And with constant streams of reinforcements it's hard to get any actual damage done.
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On December 14 2011 11:13 power-overwhelming wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 10:14 oniman999 wrote:
Part of it is the nerfs. Terran receives a nerf just about every patch. Many of these nerfs are necessary, but it is disheartening when every patch the other guys get better and your race gets worse. It's a psychological thing I think. What nerfs? Protoss lost KA, increased blink research time, warpgate time, ff and archon toilet (on ground units). Every patch you get a nerf because you started out the beta with the most ridiculous imbalanced things.
throwing a tantrum over how terran is imba doesn't refute the fact that they were continuously nerfed throughout the patches.
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because terran always gets nerf
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On December 14 2011 11:18 Razuik wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 11:15 HypernovA wrote:
Why have I stopped playing this game?
- I'm tired of having to work 2 or 3 times harder than most of my opponents (high diamond level).
- I'm tired of being flamed if I win because I play Terran.
- I'm tired of being called a bad player because I play Terran.
- I'm tired of people calling me a cheesy abuser if I use units like cloaked banshees, or hellions openings.
- I'm tired of people flaming Terran players who win tournaments in situations where clearly the Terran player was the superior player.
- I'm tired of receiving help answer like "LOL DUDE, MAKE MORE MARINES. Can't make more MMM against Protoss? Wow you suck."
There. I said it. The community is very negative toward Terran players in General and this has caused me to stop playing and only watch games. AMEN. This is exactly how I feel. It's fucking depressing how some people act toward Terran.
Well.. the reason isn't that hard.
Since release Terran has been the race with the most 'abusive' builds.
There's nothing wrong with that, but it is a fact.
When playing a game like SCII which requires 100% focus it's really frustrating to lose too such things, which in my opinion created the bad image of Terran.
You can't take such flaming all too serious and it happens for every race, when I'm rocking my Protoss deathball on the ladder I've had countless of Zergs and Terrans whine about it aswell. Just laugh at them.
If you care about whiners and haters you shouldn't play multiplayer games :p
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On December 14 2011 11:21 Silidons wrote:
if vanishing means about 30% in every league, then yea their vanishing
<30% terrans in all leagues except at really low levels (silver/bronze) or grandmasters...
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I play Z.
T is the hardest race to play.
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It got to the point where it was easier to just switch races than try to improve as Terran.
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Constantly losing my marines to banelings and baneling landmines is starting to make me think about switching back to random.
For me, even losing to a two base terran as a five base zerg because I didn't make enough army units doesn't feel as bad as dropping, harassing, and splitting your marines everywhere only to accidentally lose 30 of them to two cleverly placed banelings and instantly lose your entire army to the mutas that fly in right after.
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Come to think of it, my Terran friends were the first ones to quit SC2. Not sure why though.
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I think its fairly obvious, there are many many cases of terrans tired of running their heads into a wall to try to get the sleepwalking macro mode that MVP/MMA have so they switch races and are able to find more success easier after the initial suck period, P/Z players who thought T was OP decide to ride the bandwagon only to realize how fricken hard it actually is to play Terran to jump back to their own race/the third one. Thus you end up with a lot of outgoing players and very few incoming players.
It gets very tiresome when even at a high diamond level you have to micro perfectly meanwhile the zerg counterpart has very little micro to do and a macro system that is much more forgiving. Its the same thing with protoss, if you haven't set up they can just a-move into you and win easily and it can get very frustrating with the only comfort being once you can macro/micro at the same time perfectly you will be able to crush them like puny insects which is often a goal that seems quite lofty.
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EPT
