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On December 14 2011 11:15 HypernovA wrote:
Why have I stopped playing this game?
- I'm tired of having to work 2 or 3 times harder than most of my opponents (high diamond level).
- I'm tired of being flamed if I win because I play Terran.
- I'm tired of being called a bad player because I play Terran.
- I'm tired of people calling me a cheesy abuser if I use units like cloaked banshees, or hellions openings.
- I'm tired of people flaming Terran players who win tournaments in situations where clearly the Terran player was the superior player.
- I'm tired of receiving help answer like "LOL DUDE, MAKE MORE MARINES. Can't make more MMM against Protoss? Wow you suck."
There. I said it. The community is very negative toward Terran players in General and this has caused me to stop playing and only watch games.
I find it amazing and bewildering the difference between the SC2 community and the BW community. I played BW for 10 years and I can't recall a single time where someone berated me because of the race I play. I'm not sure what the deal is with these SC2 nerds, but it really starts to grate after a while.
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On December 14 2011 11:23 IMoperator wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 11:21 Silidons wrote:
if vanishing means about 30% in every league, then yea their vanishing <30% terrans in all leagues except at really low levels (silver/bronze) or grandmasters...
Yeah, and terran is one of the lesser played races overall past bronze league. Probably because it's a much different playstyle than both protoss and zerg.
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I think it's the broodwar effect again. What was that quote?
Terran is hard for noobs, ez for masters.
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It is weird. I'm strongest vs T, and Terrans there was a time that Terrans seemed to be 70% of my part of the ladder, so my MMR shot up even tho I would lose to every Z I played. Now, there's no Terrans left and my MMR misses those little guys.
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On December 14 2011 11:25 Devolved wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 11:15 HypernovA wrote:
Why have I stopped playing this game?
- I'm tired of having to work 2 or 3 times harder than most of my opponents (high diamond level).
- I'm tired of being flamed if I win because I play Terran.
- I'm tired of being called a bad player because I play Terran.
- I'm tired of people calling me a cheesy abuser if I use units like cloaked banshees, or hellions openings.
- I'm tired of people flaming Terran players who win tournaments in situations where clearly the Terran player was the superior player.
- I'm tired of receiving help answer like "LOL DUDE, MAKE MORE MARINES. Can't make more MMM against Protoss? Wow you suck."
There. I said it. The community is very negative toward Terran players in General and this has caused me to stop playing and only watch games. I find it amazing and bewildering the difference between the SC2 community and the BW community. I played BW for 10 years and I can't recall a single time where someone berated me because of the race I play. I'm not sure what the deal is with these SC2 nerds, but it really starts to grate after a while.
What race did you play? Because all my friends who played protoss were constantly barraged about how easy their race was. Maybe not in the same insulting way as you do on the SC2 ladder, but the opinion was definitely there.
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On December 14 2011 11:25 Devolved wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 11:15 HypernovA wrote:
Why have I stopped playing this game?
- I'm tired of having to work 2 or 3 times harder than most of my opponents (high diamond level).
- I'm tired of being flamed if I win because I play Terran.
- I'm tired of being called a bad player because I play Terran.
- I'm tired of people calling me a cheesy abuser if I use units like cloaked banshees, or hellions openings.
- I'm tired of people flaming Terran players who win tournaments in situations where clearly the Terran player was the superior player.
- I'm tired of receiving help answer like "LOL DUDE, MAKE MORE MARINES. Can't make more MMM against Protoss? Wow you suck."
There. I said it. The community is very negative toward Terran players in General and this has caused me to stop playing and only watch games. I find it amazing and bewildering the difference between the SC2 community and the BW community. I played BW for 10 years and I can't recall a single time where someone berated me because of the race I play. I'm not sure what the deal is with these SC2 nerds, but it really starts to grate after a while.
Because apparently being a jerk to people is what passes as cool this days. Shame but I wouldn´t blame the whole community. I do agree that its pretty grating, overinflated ego nerds ....
But Oh well it did happen in BW but it was not that common, dunno why you never got to experience but yeah its definitively worse in SC2
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On December 14 2011 11:09 docvoc wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 10:14 oniman999 wrote:
Part of it is the nerfs. Terran receives a nerf just about every patch. Many of these nerfs are necessary, but it is disheartening when every patch the other guys get better and your race gets worse. It's a psychological thing I think. protoss has had the same issue, though i want to switch to terran. the thing is that most terrans were there when times were easy, but now that times have gotten tougher and they don't have the rediculous win percentages, the skill level required has been highered and many of them have switched to zerg which at this point is enjoying a fairly high win percentage. Protoss is making a comeback though  .
No, no no. Just NO!
What did you s.. NO!
This is an argument that my stupid zerg friend who just watches starcraft comes up with. He said the same when protoss started struggling some time back. It is an absolutely terrible argument. Where does this come from? That all players playing races that are winning a lot is just sitting there all inning all day err day, and when they get nerfed and have to learn how to play they just switch races? THAT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE!
Terran probably were OP back in the day. I wouldn't know because I didn't play starcraft then, but after playing random for some time, then picking terran, I find it to be the hardest race of them all, without a doubt. Are they UP? Maybe, maybe not. I won't speculate on that, its too hard to say. But damn straight its a harder race to play. If you are going to take that angle in your argument, how about saying something along the lines of "well before, terran were OP, so players could snatch wins without perfect control etc. But now they have been nerfed to such a degree that they need to practice harder to stay on the same level". This would make sense to a certain degree.
terran tears and ranting + some views at how the races work on different levels of play:
+ Show Spoiler +
Between bronze - platinum, zerg is the hardest race to play. Some struggle with inject timings, but the main problem is when to drone/not to drone and surviving all ins or cheesy play. When they learn this, they get into the late game before they absolutely smash the defensive terran player with superb macro mechanics (in zerg, that is). They roflstomp their way through platinum, and then get to diamond. Here, they start meeting Terrans who understand the match up better, but at this level the terran does not have good enough control. The games are much more even, but if the terran makes a mistake, he is dead.
Terran is very simple to play at lower levels. You just make some stuff and then you a-move and win. You start struggling to some degree in Platinum, and when you reach Diamond you need to learn a LOT in a short amount of time.
I have played this game sporadically, but no more than 4 months combined. First I got placed in Bronze as Terran, used a couple of weeks to get platinum. I stopped playing for some time, then returned as Protoss. I was now Gold and stayed gold until I switched to Terran again and started playing more. I stayed gold and switched to zerg. I got a quick promotion to Platinum, and continued smashing my opponents and was pushing Diamond, then I quit again. Came back this october 2011 and played as Terran
After playing a LOT I have finally reached Diamond but it feels like I will get demoted because my improvement is going very very slow, and I blame it not on me, but at the fact that terran is the hardest race to play.
Call me a retarded noob or whatever, but I am sure that if I had stayed with zerg I would be masters by now. I am watching the replays and I am absolutely outplaying my opponents in almost all of them, but I give away huge advantages because of my sub par control, or understanding of how I must play in the lategame as terran. If I had met the same people with zerg, I would have absolutely wrecked them. I'm sitting there with double the apm (not spamming), correct responses to what they are doing, I have a much clearer picture of what they are up to than they have on me - but I just lose because I can't control my army well enough. I am sure other terrans feel the same. You play a great game by your levels standards, you are doing everything right - until the engagements. It all goes to hell and no matter how much you analyse your play, the simple fact is that you need to keep practicing control until you got it nailed and are doing it consistently. And in TvP, even then it can be hard to win. Z and P doesn't need to practice their control to such a degree, they have other things to worry about.
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I want to know aswell.All i get is ZvZ :_;
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On December 14 2011 11:22 windsupernova wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 11:15 HypernovA wrote:
Why have I stopped playing this game?
- I'm tired of having to work 2 or 3 times harder than most of my opponents (high diamond level).
- I'm tired of being flamed if I win because I play Terran.
- I'm tired of being called a bad player because I play Terran.
- I'm tired of people calling me a cheesy abuser if I use units like cloaked banshees, or hellions openings.
- I'm tired of people flaming Terran players who win tournaments in situations where clearly the Terran player was the superior player.
- I'm tired of receiving help answer like "LOL DUDE, MAKE MORE MARINES. Can't make more MMM against Protoss? Wow you suck."
There. I said it. The community is very negative toward Terran players in General and this has caused me to stop playing and only watch games. Although I agree in that the ¨T so OP lolz ez mode race¨ retardness really made it frustrating to play as T in ladder. I don´t really get your point here? You are tired of having to play better than your opponent to win? Personally I don´t care as long as I have the option to out play my opponent I just found that particular argument kinda petty
No. He is saying that as Terran it feels (and is to some extent true) that you have to play better/harder than your opponent just to keep up with them to give yourself a chance. At least thats how I understood it anyway, because that's how I feel when I watch replays of my bronze level games where I have 3x the APM of my opponent and still lose. ^^
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On December 14 2011 11:25 Silidons wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 11:23 IMoperator wrote:On December 14 2011 11:21 Silidons wrote:
if vanishing means about 30% in every league, then yea their vanishing <30% terrans in all leagues except at really low levels (silver/bronze) or grandmasters... Yeah, and terran is one of the lesser played races overall past bronze league. Probably because it's a much different playstyle than both protoss and zerg.
Yeah it's kinda sad seeing this: http://sc2ranks.com/stats/league/am/1/all
That's for NA, there's a total of 23.9% terrans in Diamond and 24.5% in plat.
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On December 14 2011 11:15 HypernovA wrote:
Why have I stopped playing this game?
- I'm tired of having to work 2 or 3 times harder than most of my opponents (high diamond level).
Not true in the least but keep telling yourself that.
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On December 14 2011 11:16 Luppy1 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 11:10 poorcloud wrote:
I switched to zerg because its disgustingly difficult to have the micro required to beat a zerg using terran in diamond. Plus my apm is really low, so i'm not always looking at my army, which makes it frustrating when my army disappears in 3 seconds.
Not to mention how TvP is a joke. Its my best matchup but i always win with timings off 2 base. The moment it gets to the late game, i will never win due to the deathball.
Zerg is much easier to play and macro. You do not have to babysit your army all the time and can focus on hitting those injects + scouting/checking the map. Isn't it the other way round? If a terran army can disappear in 3 seconds, the zerg army can probably disappear in 2? All of the zerg units are so fragile and even a mismicro can mean that you lose half your army. How can it be easier to macro with zerg? With terran, you just hotkey the production facilities and remember to queue them and it's easy to do even during battles. For zerg, you have to base hop and inject to keep up with macro, forcing the zerg player to take his eyes off his fragile army.
Most of zerg units are fast. If you hear your army getting attacked, you just select it and run to your base and you lose very few units. Terran you can't. In TvZ you have to stay there in case of getting caught unsieged. And you have to siege and start splitting the moment YOU SEE THE ARMY. In TvP, if you just look away for a second, your army will get forcefielded + chased down.
So with zerg, you don't have to worry about your army so much and you can just focus on the macro. Maybe i shouldn't say the macro is easier. What i meant was that the macro was a lot more rewarding for the same amount of skill. Theres a low ceiling to the macroing for terran. But zerg, you can produce disgustingly huge amounts of army at 1 time. Heck, you can even miss production cycles since your larva stacks up. But as terran, once you miss that production cycle, your fucked and you have to waste lots of resources on other stuff since you never catch up.
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On December 14 2011 11:25 MrRicewife wrote:
I think it's the broodwar effect again. What was that quote?
Terran is hard for noobs, ez for masters.
100% true IMO
My main race is Protoss in masters league and I love micro.
Sometimes I play some terran for fun and yeh...
You need to be fast and you need to have good micro as Terran.
But when you can do that it really isn't all that difficult to win in any matchup since u can really outplay ur opponent as T.
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On December 14 2011 11:28 MasterKush wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 11:22 windsupernova wrote:On December 14 2011 11:15 HypernovA wrote:
Why have I stopped playing this game?
- I'm tired of having to work 2 or 3 times harder than most of my opponents (high diamond level).
- I'm tired of being flamed if I win because I play Terran.
- I'm tired of being called a bad player because I play Terran.
- I'm tired of people calling me a cheesy abuser if I use units like cloaked banshees, or hellions openings.
- I'm tired of people flaming Terran players who win tournaments in situations where clearly the Terran player was the superior player.
- I'm tired of receiving help answer like "LOL DUDE, MAKE MORE MARINES. Can't make more MMM against Protoss? Wow you suck."
There. I said it. The community is very negative toward Terran players in General and this has caused me to stop playing and only watch games. Although I agree in that the ¨T so OP lolz ez mode race¨ retardness really made it frustrating to play as T in ladder. I don´t really get your point here? You are tired of having to play better than your opponent to win? Personally I don´t care as long as I have the option to out play my opponent I just found that particular argument kinda petty No. He is saying that as Terran it feels (and is to some extent true) that you have to play better/harder than your opponent just to keep up with them to give yourself a chance. At least thats how I understood it anyway, because that's how I feel when I watch replays of my bronze level games where I have 3x the APM of my opponent and still lose. ^^
It felt that way in BW too. But as I said I don´t mind as long as I can outplay my opponent to win(and really I don´t think anyone will deny that you can win as a T)
I feel its stupid to complain about having to play better than your opponent, as long as the option is there I don´t mind
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On December 14 2011 10:15 Atlare wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 10:11 Grapefruit wrote:
According to sc2ranks.com Terran is the least featured race in all leagues except silver and bronze and that worldwide.
And I'm really wondering why? They have some awesome race mechanics and great role models, why are there less and less Terran players?
A while ago when they were the least represented race in M and D some people have been saying that Terran has been balanced for Korean GM level play, and thus is too weak against "good" macro without outatanding control but now they are even dissapearing in the lower leagues.
What makes them stop playing or switch?
I'm really curious about this.
What's your opinion on this, especially if you're a Terran? This happens in stages all the time as a result due to perceived balance issues, interesting matchups etc. For a long term Zerg had this representation and more recently there was a period of time when Protoss was wildily underplayed, a significant portion of Starcrafts playerbase swaps races at whim which is influenced by current perceptions on the game (which can be misleading or false).
Actually I think terran has been the most featured race in silver bronze but lowest everywhere else except in Korea for quite a while. At least they where when protoss was considered widely underpowered.
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On December 14 2011 11:19 Lavi wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 11:15 bubblegumbo wrote:
Going bio or some sort of bio variant gets very boring, and then hitting t and A move.I play terran and I wish mech was viable against Protoss, but not even Goody does mech vs Protoss anymore. Look at the bright side---Blizzard will HAVE to make mech viable in TvP in HOTS, or terran will have no answer for colossus based deathballs with tempest support (bye bye vikings) ^-^
Eh.. it would just end up like Infestor/Brood Lord vs Terran.. You have to split up your Vikings to keep them alive, and snipe the Colossi as quickly as possible..
I really do think that people who struggle with Terran just don't quite have the multi-tasking abilities necessary in every match up. And it's not just splitting units, it's dropping (sometimes in more than one place at a time), landing critical EMP's, constantly scouting so you have time to prepare for an attack...
Higher tech Terran units just aren't viable in any match up really (other than thors in TvZ and very specific timing attacks in the other match ups). This leaves Terran with a group of relatively low-health ground units who quickly ball up. This means AoE (Infestor, Baneling, Colossus, High Templar) devastate the Terran army, unless you take out these key units before the main battle actually starts. Of course Terrans have tanks against Zerg, and ghosts are good against Zerg and Protoss.. But really, without EMP, Terran's couldn't deal with the caster units of the other two races, and without tanks they couldn't really even deal with mass Zergling/Baneling.
So I guess what I'm trying to say is, if Terran armies didn't die so quickly to AoE, people wouldn't be so frustrated with the race (ie. there were other viable builds where AoE didn't do so much damage due to the fact that there are so many units on top of each other). That's just my opinion anyway..
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On December 14 2011 11:28 krooked wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 11:09 docvoc wrote:On December 14 2011 10:14 oniman999 wrote:
Part of it is the nerfs. Terran receives a nerf just about every patch. Many of these nerfs are necessary, but it is disheartening when every patch the other guys get better and your race gets worse. It's a psychological thing I think. protoss has had the same issue, though i want to switch to terran. the thing is that most terrans were there when times were easy, but now that times have gotten tougher and they don't have the rediculous win percentages, the skill level required has been highered and many of them have switched to zerg which at this point is enjoying a fairly high win percentage. Protoss is making a comeback though . No, no no. Just NO! What did you s.. NO! This is an argument that my stupid zerg friend who just watches starcraft comes up with. He said the same when protoss started struggling some time back. It is an absolutely terrible argument. Where does this come from? That all players playing races that are winning a lot is just sitting there all inning all day err day, and when they get nerfed and have to learn how to play they just switch races? THAT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE! Terran probably were OP back in the day. I wouldn't know because I didn't play starcraft then, but after playing random for some time, then picking terran, I find it to be the hardest race of them all, without a doubt. Are they UP? Maybe, maybe not. I won't speculate on that, its too hard to say. But damn straight its a harder race to play. If you are going to take that angle in your argument, how about saying something along the lines of "well before, terran were OP, so players could snatch wins without perfect control etc. But now they have been nerfed to such a degree that they need to practice harder to stay on the same level". This would make sense to a certain degree. terran tears and ranting + some views at how the races work on different levels of play: + Show Spoiler +
Between bronze - platinum, zerg is the hardest race to play. Some struggle with inject timings, but the main problem is when to drone/not to drone and surviving all ins or cheesy play. When they learn this, they get into the late game before they absolutely smash the defensive terran player with superb macro mechanics (in zerg, that is). They roflstomp their way through platinum, and then get to diamond. Here, they start meeting Terrans who understand the match up better, but at this level the terran does not have good enough control. The games are much more even, but if the terran makes a mistake, he is dead.
Terran is very simple to play at lower levels. You just make some stuff and then you a-move and win. You start struggling to some degree in Platinum, and when you reach Diamond you need to learn a LOT in a short amount of time.
I have played this game sporadically, but no more than 4 months combined. First I got placed in Bronze as Terran, used a couple of weeks to get platinum. I stopped playing for some time, then returned as Protoss. I was now Gold and stayed gold until I switched to Terran again and started playing more. I stayed gold and switched to zerg. I got a quick promotion to Platinum, and continued smashing my opponents and was pushing Diamond, then I quit again. Came back this october 2011 and played as Terran
After playing a LOT I have finally reached Diamond but it feels like I will get demoted because my improvement is going very very slow, and I blame it not on me, but at the fact that terran is the hardest race to play.
Call me a retarded noob or whatever, but I am sure that if I had stayed with zerg I would be masters by now. I am watching the replays and I am absolutely outplaying my opponents in almost all of them, but I give away huge advantages because of my sub par control, or understanding of how I must play in the lategame as terran. If I had met the same people with zerg, I would have absolutely wrecked them. I'm sitting there with double the apm (not spamming), correct responses to what they are doing, I have a much clearer picture of what they are up to than they have on me - but I just lose because I can't control my army well enough. I am sure other terrans feel the same. You play a great game by your levels standards, you are doing everything right - until the engagements. It all goes to hell and no matter how much you analyse your play, the simple fact is that you need to keep practicing control until you got it nailed and are doing it consistently. And in TvP, even then it can be hard to win. Z and P doesn't need to practice their control to such a degree, they have other things to worry about.
I absolutely agree. When i play terran, i always manage to get ahead of the zerg/protoss in food and macro. I get set up nice on 3 bases or more. But engagements are the bane of my play and i always lose. People can say, why not just get better? I assure you i have tried to practise so much times but it is not something you can achieve unless you have the time to play 6 - 8 hours everyday. I rather change to an easier race like zerg.
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The only reason I do not ladder much anymore is TvP; cannot stand the matchup. I expect that a lot of people looked at Blizzard nerfing Terran patch after patch and decided to play another race, as the most common reason
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I bought another account to play protoss recently. I play both races now. I never really liked playing zerg. I find both Protoss and Terran to be a lot of fun.
As many other people have said; Terran receive nerfs all the time. It is kind of frustrating to watch your race getting weaker all the time, even if it might be for the greater good.
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On December 14 2011 11:27 Andreas wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 11:25 Devolved wrote:On December 14 2011 11:15 HypernovA wrote:
Why have I stopped playing this game?
- I'm tired of having to work 2 or 3 times harder than most of my opponents (high diamond level).
- I'm tired of being flamed if I win because I play Terran.
- I'm tired of being called a bad player because I play Terran.
- I'm tired of people calling me a cheesy abuser if I use units like cloaked banshees, or hellions openings.
- I'm tired of people flaming Terran players who win tournaments in situations where clearly the Terran player was the superior player.
- I'm tired of receiving help answer like "LOL DUDE, MAKE MORE MARINES. Can't make more MMM against Protoss? Wow you suck."
There. I said it. The community is very negative toward Terran players in General and this has caused me to stop playing and only watch games. I find it amazing and bewildering the difference between the SC2 community and the BW community. I played BW for 10 years and I can't recall a single time where someone berated me because of the race I play. I'm not sure what the deal is with these SC2 nerds, but it really starts to grate after a while. What race did you play? Because all my friends who played protoss were constantly barraged about how easy their race was. Maybe not in the same insulting way as you do on the SC2 ladder, but the opinion was definitely there.
I played Toss and Terran. Thinking back, I can recall one instance in a clanwar where I went Carrier/Corsair vs. Terran and mass disruption web around important chokes where the battles took place. The Terran bitched about it because it was abusive, but my clan was very happy with the strat ...and mind you, that is NOT an easy strat to pull off! That is literally the only time (other than a cheese rush) where I can remember anyone bitching about my race.
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EPT
