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I was playing a lot of games and it always seemed to me that the UIs for each race seemed to be different. Today I finally took the time to figure it out and see just how different each races UI is. I did 2 Test set ups. The first one I am going to post but it doesn't show much because it has some human error in it. The 2nd test I did shows a somewhat shocking result (shocking to me at least). One of the Races UI's is unable to see something that the other two races can.
First I started off with a very poor quality side by side view of all 3 races screens.
+ Show Spoiler +
Then I placed a line on top of the Terran UI going through all 3 of the UI's completely.
+ Show Spoiler +
After all of this I felt like those were also my error or something. It didn't seem like that could be correct, but at the same time I always felt like it was true that Zerg could see less. I kept going from there. I did 2 full tests for the Races.
Test One:
+ Show Spoiler +For this test I used the same map for each of the tests. I would place my Hydralisks in the same (or at least I tried to) positions. I felt like this test doesn't really show anything because I probably made an error in the positioning somewhere. I used the infestation pit as Hotkey 3 so I could position the screen in the same location for the screenshots each time. Zerg: + Show Spoiler +Terran: + Show Spoiler +Protoss: + Show Spoiler +I felt like this test showed that Zerg could see less than the other races. But I also felt like the angle of the Hydras effects it a lot. I felt like this test was ruined due to human error so I did another similar test.
Test one did back my idea that Zerg could see less.... but It was too full of errors for me to accept that. I did another Test.
Test Two:+ Show Spoiler +For test 2 I used supply depots (No chance of error there!). They are positioned in the same location for all of the races. After looking I double checked the Zerg because I thought maybe I messed up or something (I didn't). I used the hotkey 3 for my factory to center the screenshot each time. (The tank is not in the same spot every time ignore that) Terran: + Show Spoiler +Protoss: + Show Spoiler +Zerg: + Show Spoiler +After looking at all three it becomes very obvious that the Zerg UI is blocking a lot. And if you look closely there is one depot that is showing its health bar in the bottom right for Protoss and Terran, but for Zerg it is blocked by the UI.
The Zerg UI is too bulky and it blocks a lot of things. And after looking at this I found it very shocking that it blocks entire health bars! I feel this is a wake up call for Blizzard to shrink the Zerg UI to better match that of Terran and Protoss.
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This really does not create any game breaking scenarios :/ Hardly imbalance...
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Even the Terran UI is OP! 
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Wow, nice find. Weird that Blizzard would make such a huge mistake.
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How did you even notice this? o.O;
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This is not the kind of imbalance that can be exploited but you'd think that to be fair each race should have the same viewing area... *sigh*
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Oh shayzus, the game is ruined. I know what the last patch before HotS will be: Terran Removed, game was overly imbalanced.
*sarcasm*
It hardly makes a difference.
However, I guess it was a decent observation.
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i cant believe that you actually managed to find something like this
although i dont really believe that the 2-4 pixel difference in the UI will actually make a difference in gameplay, but still something note worthy for Bliz to fix (hopefully ) in HotS
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Makes little difference to be fair. Cute find anyway.
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Can't wait to hear this one after zerg loses :"Fuck your imbalanced race. You only won caus you can see more of the screen then me you pos!. Has left the game!"
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Protoss and Zerg UI's both have less visible screen area than Terran UI.
The Terran UI is the cleanest.
I wouldn't say that it is particularly "imbalanced" but at the absolute highest level this game is at it could keep people from doing a couple things.
1.) Counting Units Properly
2.) Spotting a building under construction at the edge of vision range on either extreme bottom left or extreme bottom left.
In the end though I think either of these two scenarios are highly unlikely. Nice find anyway.
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The protoss UI is arguably only a few pixels off of the zerg one. Only the terran UI is really imbalanced, where they have a very noticeable area on the top left and top right areas of the UI where they can see more.
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Lol if you think you lost because of the small difference in UI height then you might want to watch the replay and figure out what ACTUALLY made you lose.
User was warned for this post
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Looks like zerg can see more in the middle of the screen, though.
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Isn't playing on a widescreen instead of 4:3 already considered imbalanced?
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it probably doesnt effect the game much but i would like to see them all the same size anyway
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I think you might be taking this game a little too seriously =/
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On August 22 2011 10:31 ster wrote:
Looks like zerg can see more in the middle of the screen, though.
No. I had the tank and SCV in different spots every time. (not sure why i even put a tank in guess I was bored lol).
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eventho the zerg can see the least on the left and right sides, they obviously have the most sight in the middle if you compare the distance between the UI and the tank (in test 2). guess its balanced taht way ^^
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Why threads like this keeps popping up on TL? I don't read the official forums because people keep on creating those stupid 'balance' discussion threads that leads to nowhere and benefits no one. <_<
This is such a minor difference that shouldn't be noticed by anyone. 4:3 against 16:10 against 16:9 resolution difference is a much bigger issue 'UI wise'.
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The UI to screen space ratio changes big time based on your resolution anyway. One could say that playing in 16 : 9 gives you an unfair advantage or something, if viewing area really mattered that much. If you only had a tiny little bit of room to work with compared to other races, fine, but really that's hardly noticeable. If you were really worried about screen space, you should turn the menu and control group icon to hidden. That will give you way more screen space than the tiny bit that is hidden by the zerg UI.
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lol is this thread serious.
there will literally never be a game that this is going to affect.
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On August 22 2011 10:38 ScrubS wrote:
eventho the zerg can see the least on the left and right sides, they obviously have the most sight in the middle if you compare the distance between the UI and the tank (in test 2). guess its balanced taht way ^^
(The tank is not in the same spot every time ignore that).
@OP: Yeah, not exactly ab big deal; but every little thing like that is quite annoying.
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You should be watching the minimap anyway!
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While I don't think this is significant, it's still a stupid thing for Blizzard to implement. Not imbalanced, just stupid.
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On August 22 2011 10:49 Angra wrote:
lol is this thread serious.
there will literally never be a game that this is going to affect.
At what point, then, would it affect a game? When it's a 5 pixel difference? 10 pixels? At what point does it become a problem?
There's nothing wrong with pointing out that it SHOULD be exactly similar. Not being able to see or click on the banshee in the bottom left-hand corner of your screen just because your UI is a couple pixels bigger than it should be would be frustrating, I'm sure.
Obviously this little thing will not affect that much in the game at all. What DOES affect SC2 as an esport, however, are tons of little things like this that reflect Blizzard's attitude of not needing to be exact. The lack of perfect symmetry on their maps, the different-sized starting locations, etc. These are all small things, but we'd all feel better about Blizzard leading this esport if they DID go the extra mile to make sure all the UIs were exactly the same and all the starting locations and doodads were mirrored instead of slightly different.
It's more of a mindset issue than it is an actual gameplay issue.
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On August 22 2011 10:36 Subversion wrote:
I think you might be taking this game a little too seriously =/
yup. the difference is like a minuscule speck of dust
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No shit, Sherlock.
It's pretty obvious just by looking at the UIs, you didn't need to waste all that time...
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If you ever need to click something in that area, you've probably already dragged the mouse to move the screen. This is really insignificant in a game.
I like how each race UI is different. It would be pretty boring if everyone had the same UI but just different colors or something just so that you could see the same amount of screen..
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On August 22 2011 10:49 Angra wrote:
lol is this thread serious.
there will literally never be a game that this is going to affect.
I'm going to call it now. That after saying this, there will be a huge drama filled tournament loss from a Zerg who doesnt see something by the smallest amount.
And when that day comes, you're going to be left feeling really silly.
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Why is everyone being such a prick? I think this is a pretty good find. It may be a small difference, it may never affect the outcome of a single game in the universe (though there is no way to determine the truth behind that), but there's no reason Zerg players should see less of the screen than Terran and Protoss players. Just because you think it's insignificant doesn't mean that it should be that way... don't try and shoot down the OP because he took time out of his day to bring us information.
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if your loosing it's not because you see 2 pixels less then a terran.
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holy shit i thought i just had an affinity with T cause i notice more stuff with them than my main Z.
lol.
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LMAO @ all the people in this thread thinking he's whining hard about this or something. It's just quirky SC2 science. Of course it's not fucking gamebreaking. But should it be the same? Probably. Just an interesting oversight.
Christ.
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This reminds me of the symmetry and the shifted simetry posts in the map making section. Its one of the perks of the game that is very specific to a race or angle of play. I dont think it was intended and the abuse of something like that is not going to do anything. THe difference is so small.
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this is actually interesting haha, i always thought hte terrran UI looked slicker and more simple/clean o.o
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On August 22 2011 11:13 Shinrae wrote:Show nested quote +On August 22 2011 10:49 Angra wrote:
lol is this thread serious.
there will literally never be a game that this is going to affect. I'm going to call it now. That after saying this, there will be a huge drama filled tournament loss from a Zerg who doesnt see something by the smallest amount. And when that day comes, you're going to be left feeling really silly.
I sincerely doubt that.
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I don't think this really calls for the word 'imbalance'. You're right, all the races should be able to see the same amount of screen, but this isn't going to get 'balanced', or cause good discussion.
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Good catch, but as with most people here, I doubt it would have any really effect on gameplay
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Gosh guys, stop saying that "this isn't going to affect the game for zergs", there's an obvious difference in what a player can or cannot see.
That said, it's obvious that:
a) The effect that this could have has to happen in very specific situations, and
b) The effect that this could have will only show in expert play, where even 1 scroll or minimap click could be crucial for making a decision.
I'll try to develop my two points.
a. I think that this could affect the game in a moment where you need to cast a spell, estimate the opponent army count that is moving or simply just running around.
b. Have you ever seen Broodwar FPV-VODs? The army positioning occurs on even the minimum sight of the opponent army. Maybe at high level play this could be crucial when not seeing the minimap. Imagine a harass situation, after the attack, you hit spacebar, and the medivac/warpprism/ovie is retreating while you wanna hit a last attack on that drop with your aa.
Again, this would be in pretty specific situations, and yes, maybe guessing them would be too hypothetical and paranoic.
In my opinion, why wouldn't blizzard patch this? Seems a pretty easy thing to do, and everyone would be happy or at least indifferent.
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Who cares, this is like calling people that play on higher resolution screens op... There has never been and never will be any effect on gameplay as a result of this....
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lol n1 but are you really serious about this being an inbalance?
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Sweden353 Posts
Mb not game breaking but should nontheless be fixed.
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This wouldn't even make a bug report in the alpha.
Easily waived, sorry mang.
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so it isn't the 1/1/1 that is overpowered, it is the UI!
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All you folks are going way too hard on the OP for something very percilurar he found, that shouldn't be that way and you just rolling with the use of the word "imblanced".
Bottom line is that there most likely the world will explode for the gigles of it, before this has an actual effect in game, but there shouldn't be a difference in first place. And somebody pointed very well before me is more of question of Blizzard's mentality, than anything else.
Peace!
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Whilst it might be a little bit annoying, it's hardly going to change the outcome of a game.
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As has been stated several times, playing on widescreen gives you a SIGNIFICANTLY larger view, but this thread is talking about a few pixels. How about you start out by getting blizzard to patch out the real concern, widescreen.
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If you think that the Terran UI is imbalanced due to its cleaner design, you should also examine the negative effects of color choices that can be abused to hide on the minimap.
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Regardless of balance issues I still believe the UI should be smaller. Or at least there should be an option to make it as smaller as one pleases.
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You think THAT'S imbalanced, try listening to the Terran music! When I roll Terran with random I just know I play better because their music is more epic and motivational!
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Terran UI is also the UI that is used to view replays or as an observer 
I doubt this has much of an effect on gameplay though haha. People are very rarely dealing with things on the edge of their vision as they tend to like to center on the main focus.
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Way to go!
Another excuse for Idra when he loses!
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On August 22 2011 11:44 XnG_777 wrote:
lol n1 but are you really serious about this being an inbalance?
Imbalances don't *have* to be huge. It would be like if scvs and drones had a speed of 2.81 and probes had a speed of 2.8 (obviously that would be an easy fix but you get my point)
In an ideal world, this would be fixed, as there's really not much reason for this discrepancy, but I don't see blizzard using their manpower to fix something so small.. especially when they might have to like redesign the zerg UI art.
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A lot of effort went into this joke and the fact some people are taking it seriously makes it gold.
Great screenshots btw! Im totally going to point to this thread the next time random gives me zerg and I lose XD
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Zerg v Terran that could make a huge difference
Good find
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It's not really a significant difference, and it's a nice aesthetic effect. It should be shrunk, but it's not completely imba, so I doubt Blizz will do anything about it.
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The difference between 4:3, 16 and 16:10 screens are so much more meaningful than this.
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Minor annoyance and every little thing does count in the end. I doubt it would be fixed, but I'm glad someone actually stumbled across this, nice observation.
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B-but Terran music IS imba!
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I enjoy this level of scrutiny, good observation.
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LOL i found saying this would be quite appropriate:
"I'm bronze and what is this?"
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10/10 thread will read again
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1st world problems... sigh
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I love troll-type posts like this veiled under the word 'tests'. Threads like these don't degrade TL at all..
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All zerg problems will be solved in HoTS!
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Minor difference, but definitely an interesting find. Wouldn't hurt to fix it up!
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Did you really make a thread about complaining about a tenth of an inch more zerg UI than the other races? Who care dude, the z UI looks nice, they wont change it for a small little thing like that.
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Terran UI OP, someone tell David Kim
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There is a way more pixel difference when you hide your control group.
If we assume that one control group box is 10 pixel (roughly estimated number), then it would be a 100 pixel differencen (10 possible buttons) to people who dont hide there control groups...
So i dont think it's a big deal with the UI.
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Nice observation, though it really doesn't matter all that much in my honest opinion.
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Interesting find, same as a small bug that blizzard needs to polish up imo.
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You're really grasping for straws, aren't you?
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Think of the countless GSL championships that have been determined due to this glaring imbalance.
+ Show Spoiler +
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I wouldn't go so far as to say something this trivial be considered imbalanced. I mean we DO have the mini-map to look at when we play, not just the main screen.
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you know what i hate, it's the menus not having some kind of toggle on/off at the top of the screen... a few times i've been microing and clicked up there and instead a drop down menu comes up..
or am i retarded and you can minimize those?
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On August 22 2011 15:30 FLiP491 wrote:
you know what i hate, it's the menus not having some kind of toggle on/off at the top of the screen... a few times i've been microing and clicked up there and instead a drop down menu comes up..
or am i retarded and you can minimize those?
Just go to Options>Gameplay and put "Menu Bar Mode" on "Hidden".
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Kinda lol at people calling this a "Huge misstake" tbh. There is such miniscule difference that i can hardly see the point of this thread. But then again, i can neither see why blizzard made it this way to begin with.
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Haha, that's kind of funny, and I guess it is technically an "imbalance", but honestly it doesn't matter at all.
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wow, you sure took the time to document this.
Good find but hardly game breaking. But Blizzard should still be thankful there are people like you taking the time to document stuff like that.
If there is a "bug report" forum on bnet you should post it there.
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lol GG blizz. Just wait for heart of the swarm, Zerg UI is gonna be soooo imba.
EDIT: + Show Spoiler +I play protoss and I just play by right clicking and a-moving on the mini map
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I like playing Protoss, the UI is so beautiful
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Gentlemen, we have reached peak imbalance.
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Why can't they just remove all the shitty ui and let us play with some standard or something.
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damn that must be the reason 1-1-1 is so strong!
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Ok that explains every single zerg loss ive ever had.
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hardly felt the difference tough im playing random.... to me not imbalanced
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I presume someone has already found the files in the MPQ and changed it so all 3 races have the terran Interface?
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wow people do actually want a game with only one race availabe before they can be happy. And yes no difference sorry. How about complaining about widescreen as well ? :3
you should play warcraft2 humans were so underpowered, that everyone played orc. So same UI same units everything perfectly balanced.
And its quiet normal for the organic ui to block more, but no reason to be worried, because organic looks way cooler. So you are more into the zerg style which makes you stronger, so actually the zerg ui is imba, because it buffs the players zergyness.
edit: oh toss is a debuff: yes i am high tech i am invincible !
and terran well, with the bgm and everything. Yay redneck terran fighting, lets do a party, dood!
oh more sidenotes: terran blue ui makes your mind calm down, and makes you slower. Zerg ui is reddish which makes you aggressiv and more activ.
Maybe the reason why terrans are the least bm of the 3 races hu ?
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If you think this is bad, you should have seen the music imbalance that was in Brood War. There's a reason the winningest players were all Terran...
*hums terran theme to self*
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With people being able to edit MPQ to change their backgrounds, would it not be possible to use Terran UI for all races. I have always thought Zerg UI to be a bit bulky and would much rather have the slimmer terran version.
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lol is this serious?
Well we better say Widescreen is imbalanced as well since some players can see more on the screen than others.
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On August 22 2011 23:51 Moochlol wrote:
With people being able to edit MPQ to change their backgrounds, would it not be possible to use Terran UI for all races. I have always thought Zerg UI to be a bit bulky and would much rather have the slimmer terran version.
It sure is.. I have Terran UI as Zerg at the moment, Nearly working for Protoss too (half of it for some reason keeps a protoss animation but Terran textures around the minimap, working on it).
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This needs fixed. Great find OP
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Can't believe this slipped by the testers. Expect a hotfix and a ladder reset in the coming days after this news circulates.
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never even noticed there was a UI when i played. totally zoned that part out. -_-
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For everyone who wants it, I have made a MOD that will give Zerg the Terran UI.
File name: Doomed_TerranUI_forZerg.zip File size: 3.2 MB
All you need to do is:
1. Download the zip file
2. Extract it
3. Copy the extracted "base.SC2Assets" to "StarCraft II\Mods\LibertyMulti.SC2Mod\"
And that's it!
If you want to remove it, just delete the "base.SC2Assets" from the folder above.
Make sure you don't mistake Liberty.SC2Mod with the LibertyMulti.
P.S. As always, using this is at your own risk (people reading this should be aware of the debates and potential risks (doubt there are many) by adding mods to SC2.
EDIT:
Here is a screenshot of above addon.
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/717/doomedterranuiforzerg.jpg/
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It should be fixed since it was noted, or at least give players the option of using the Terran UI for all three races.
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Fairly small mistake and the research owns up to being sloppily done...
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This thing has absolutely no effect in gameplay, i cant even believe this thread has gained this much pages.
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I doubt it makes a difference, but Blizz probably should add a graphics setting option to use the Terran UI for the other two races.
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I'm sorry but this is hilarious.,
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This thing has absolutely no effect in gameplay, i cant even believe this thread has gained this much pages.
Responses like this are so unnecessary. Where in the OP does it say that it actually affects competitive play?
Half of the responses are like "no one would ever lose because of this." Well no shit, no one is arguing that you would lose because your UI is slightly bigger than the other two races... But that doesn't mean it shouldn't be fixed.
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Screw Terran. Even the cursor looks nicer.
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lol, everything blizzard does gets nit-picked so hard. that would suck.
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lol what a joke... Do you smell that little blizzard child i mean terran? Who cares anyways let them have it all.
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god sc2 casuals reporting in.
In bw you would have been handled with respect. Nice find.
As said before this just falls back to Blizzard not making the overview equal. This is not a huge thing, but a bug that should be fixed in order to restore balance.
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Damn. No wonder idra can't win a PvZ.
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Huh, interesting find. I kinda noticed this, but never cared to test it out. I just figured that blizzard had them all set the same, and I was just seeing things lol.
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Interesting, even if completely pointless
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check the sc1 ui and see peoples reactions, on a post like this :3. calling that imba xD.
Maybe the reaction would be nicer if people don't write imba in the title to get attention :3
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I like this OP. It's a great observation, and it does make a difference whether people want to acknowledge it or not. Screen real estate is actually a huge design issue when designing a game, and that's why Blizzard allows the user to hide things like the control groups and the menu buttons at the top of the screen.
Now all that's left is to determine if Blizzard did it on purpose or not!
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I always knew Zerg was UP ... now we have scientific proof
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Same in WarCraft III, Armies of Exigo, and pretty much any UI-variable RTS with good art design:
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/FkZeN.gif)
Identical shapes to the pixel are not as soothing for the eye, as these small artistic differences.
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This has to be a troll thread. I eagerly await your next thread where you argue why it's imbalanced that assimilators have more health than extractors.
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