EPT[D] Why is protoss doing so bad in the GSL? - Page 64
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HuHEN
United Kingdom514 Posts
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K3Nyy
United States1961 Posts
How about you guys play Protoss and do everything you suggested? | ||
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Metalwing
Turkey1038 Posts
On November 09 2010 05:12 HuHEN wrote: Tester was considered the best player in the world for much of the beta, then suddenly became terrible, just coincidentally at the same time as every other toss player in the world suddenly became awful players which just SOMEHOW RANDOMLY coincided with toss nerfs and zerg buffs. Tester is not terrible. He's just not that good. Both Zerg and Terran always had and always have some good names. Terran has BoxeRs, Nada, Maka, ITR, IMMVP, all that good jazz. Zerg has Check, Zenio, Fruitdealer, NesTea. These are all consistent players. The only thing that the Protoss race can call consistent is InCa. Tester failed to qualify in GSL Season 2, Genius was eliminated by DAVIT in season 1, MC couldn't qualify to season 1 and got eliminated in season 2 after doing 1 base allins to NesTea in both games and getting roflstomped. Except these 4, the only reason why Anypro and HongUn eliminated TheWind and Zenio respectively in season 1 is because zerg tiers 1 and 2 were ridiculous compared to protoss' corresponding tiers in patch 1.03 and those guys could press A button from keyboard and left click with mouse after selecting all their army with hotkey 1. And this is the reason why these 2 ever won a televised game. And in season 2, HongUn, the better player between these 2, got eliminated in ro64 by KyrixZenith with a score of 2-0 (no wins in televised games), which is a better season 2 record than Anypro's. Anypro couldn't even qualify to GSL season 2. So yes, it has some things to do with recent protoss nerfs and zerg buffs. Roach +1 range is just too big for protoss players to take. And Zealot spawn time nerf as well as lolray nerf. It's just too much. Blizz is too unfair to Protoss. After all, Toss is the race that should be able to 1a its way to GSL championships. On November 09 2010 05:19 Woony wrote: Well if apparently all Protoss players suck, might that coincidence with the fact that the " real good" players don't play Protoss because it's bad? Nope, it's because you just can't march to victory with protoss 1 base allins in GSL and Zerg and Terran players in GSL are not from Bronze Divisions of the EU server. And there is an issue related to consistency. The thing that no toss players are aware of (except InCa). | ||
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HuHEN
United Kingdom514 Posts
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Nazarid
United States445 Posts
On November 09 2010 05:51 HuHEN wrote: Well you just relegated yourself from being taken seriously also "toss is the race which should be able to 1a its way to gls championships" Nope thats Terran, you were looking for Terran, I know its hard, they do both start with T after all. im just loling at your idiocy | ||
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HuHEN
United Kingdom514 Posts
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HuHEN
United Kingdom514 Posts
Im obviously joking, all the races take skill. | ||
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dragonblade369
Canada464 Posts
On November 09 2010 05:43 Metalwing wrote: Tester is not terrible. He's just not that good. Both Zerg and Terran always had and always have some good names. Terran has BoxeRs, Nada, Maka, ITR, IMMVP, all that good jazz. Zerg has Check, Zenio, Fruitdealer, NesTea. These are all consistent players. The only thing that the Protoss race can call consistent is InCa. Tester failed to qualify in GSL Season 2, Genius was eliminated by DAVIT in season 1, MC couldn't qualify to season 1 and got eliminated in season 2 after doing 1 base allins to NesTea in both games and getting roflstomped. Except these 4, the only reason why Anypro and HongUn eliminated TheWind and Zenio respectively in season 1 is because zerg tiers 1 and 2 were ridiculous compared to protoss' corresponding tiers in patch 1.03 and those guys could press A button from keyboard and left click with mouse after selecting all their army with hotkey 1. And this is the reason why these 2 ever won a televised game. And in season 2, HongUn, the better player between these 2, got eliminated in ro64 by KyrixZenith with a score of 2-0 (no wins in televised games), which is a better season 2 record than Anypro's. Anypro couldn't even qualify to GSL season 2. So yes, it has some things to do with recent protoss nerfs and zerg buffs. Roach +1 range is just too big for protoss players to take. And Zealot spawn time nerf as well as lolray nerf. It's just too much. Blizz is too unfair to Protoss. After all, Toss is the race that should be able to 1a its way to GSL championships. Nope, it's because you just can't march to victory with protoss 1 base allins in GSL and Zerg and Terran players in GSL are not from Bronze Divisions of the EU server. And there is an issue related to consistency. The thing that no toss players are aware of (except InCa). You know? It might help if you actually do some research... In the beta, Tester was considered to be the best player. For most tournaments, Tester and Fruitdealer were the top 2. Check, Zenio and gang cannot even compare with them in term of skill. Suddenly, everyone says that they need to l2p and they are "not good". Yeah, according to you, a player like Check suddenly became a better player than Tester after the patch hits. The patch taught Zergs how to play and Protoss suddenly don't know how to play anymore! | ||
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HuHEN
United Kingdom514 Posts
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RisingTide
Australia769 Posts
Makes me smile. | ||
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Cakemeister
2 Posts
Each player plays all three races against all three races of the other player. Would that take too much time? | ||
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Bosu
United States3247 Posts
On November 09 2010 06:22 Cakemeister wrote: Why not have matches be a best of 9? Each player plays all three races against all three races of the other player. Would that take too much time? Uh. Are you serious? | ||
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Cakemeister
2 Posts
I don't know how these tournaments work. Enlighten me. | ||
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toadstool
Australia421 Posts
On November 09 2010 05:43 Metalwing wrote: Tester is not terrible. He's just not that good. Both Zerg and Terran always had and always have some good names. Terran has BoxeRs, Nada, Maka, ITR, IMMVP, all that good jazz. Zerg has Check, Zenio, Fruitdealer, NesTea. These are all consistent players. The only thing that the Protoss race can call consistent is InCa. Tester failed to qualify in GSL Season 2, Genius was eliminated by DAVIT in season 1, MC couldn't qualify to season 1 and got eliminated in season 2 after doing 1 base allins to NesTea in both games and getting roflstomped. Except these 4, the only reason why Anypro and HongUn eliminated TheWind and Zenio respectively in season 1 is because zerg tiers 1 and 2 were ridiculous compared to protoss' corresponding tiers in patch 1.03 and those guys could press A button from keyboard and left click with mouse after selecting all their army with hotkey 1. And this is the reason why these 2 ever won a televised game. And in season 2, HongUn, the better player between these 2, got eliminated in ro64 by KyrixZenith with a score of 2-0 (no wins in televised games), which is a better season 2 record than Anypro's. Anypro couldn't even qualify to GSL season 2. So yes, it has some things to do with recent protoss nerfs and zerg buffs. Roach +1 range is just too big for protoss players to take. And Zealot spawn time nerf as well as lolray nerf. It's just too much. Blizz is too unfair to Protoss. After all, Toss is the race that should be able to 1a its way to GSL championships. Nope, it's because you just can't march to victory with protoss 1 base allins in GSL and Zerg and Terran players in GSL are not from Bronze Divisions of the EU server. And there is an issue related to consistency. The thing that no toss players are aware of (except InCa). Are you kidding me. Tester was considered the best player in the world, feared by all Koreans at one point. There are still arguments and comparisons between Genius, MC and Sangho and TESTER. Testers decline and Protoss decline can be attributed to all the nerfs Protoss has been getting. Simply put, it's HARDER to play consistently now that Zerg and Terran have so many timing windows against nerfed Warpgates and zealots. | ||
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selboN
United States2523 Posts
On November 09 2010 06:26 Cakemeister wrote: I don't know how these tournaments work. Enlighten me. Best of 9 is A LOT of games. You can't hold a live audience for that long with multiple sets. Especially with the demand for more games to be played... | ||
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GoldenH
1115 Posts
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Toxigen
United States390 Posts
Tosses lose in the GSL because they fuck up. Either forcefields, being cute with no robo, etc. Gotta agree with this. Zerg can cut corners, Terran can cut corners, neither of which causes them to loose. Sure they may go "oh sh1t" but a toss goes "gg" Oops I made to many drones, ah crap, u bring drones to fight, u transfuse/fight with queens, you can usually live. Might sac a hatch. Yeah you will be far behind but not to the GG. I think you really underestimate how much this really sets you back as a Zerg. Especially saccing a hatch if it's your 3rd or your natural. Usually, you don't realize you were drone whoring too much UNLESS it's a gg -- if it's not gg, you were drone whoring the right amount (or could have gotten away with more). If a terran uses to much energy on his CC and has DTs wrecking havoc, they will prob loose alot, but when the scan comes, everythings set again. You are behind but again, you don't loose. This isn't the same either. The Terran can't MULE much after the DTs appear because he can't afford to get caught without detection again (and good 'tosses won't clump DTs up so you'll need multiple scans to stop it). Also, chances are he's going to lose map control until he gets turrets and/or a raven up, setting him back even more. If this isn't a situation that'll eventually lead to a gg I don't know what is... If toss skimps on robo, its game, period. This feels like it's the case currently because not preparing for early banshees/roaches is pretty risky, but players like NEXGenius often don't open robo and go stargate and still beat top Terrans. I do agree that an occasional "build-order loss" if you don't open robo every game is frustrating and should be fixed, but I'm waiting to see how the Toss community handles it before calling imba. Everybody else should be too, imo. | ||
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Nazarid
United States445 Posts
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dragonblade369
Canada464 Posts
after researching this for the last few days ive found very few reasons protoss players are unable to compete well in the GSL.I think they are just under performing IMO not saying the current players in the GSL are bad protoss players they are good they have the concepts needed, but are not performing them to the appropriate level needed for the win...that's my thought im pretty sure im correct i don't see any major unit imbalances that are not in the protoss favor i just see Mechanics in the game that many of the GSL protoss players have been attempting but were unable to pull it off...i think GSL season 3 and 4 we will start seeing Protoss players become much stronger and more able to handle bad situations... Please elaborate on the "research" that you've done. I am very curious to see that :D | ||
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Romple
United States57 Posts
On November 09 2010 05:51 HuHEN wrote: Well you just relegated yourself from being taken seriously also "toss is the race which should be able to 1a its way to gls championships" Nope thats Terran, you were looking for Terran, I know its hard, they do both start with T after all. I'd agree with you except that's not accounting for stim. It's more like 1, a, t, /afk. | ||
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