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Laughably overpowered bits in SC2

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Kurdaj
Profile Joined May 2010
United States57 Posts
August 08 2010 05:51 GMT
#1
Medivacs, Banelings, Hydralisks, and Stim Pack on Marauders.

Medivacs are laughably overpowered. The concept behind the Medic in SC1 was, you had to choose to produce a support unit or a combat unit. They shared building queue in the Barracks with the Marine, Firebat, and Ghost. Furthermore, the Medic had a range. This means that in your ground army, positioning was important. You couldn't afford to A + Location because it would mean your Medics were out of place and they couldn't do their jobs.

The Medivac however, FLIES! Positioning doesn't matter anymore. As well you have the retarded synergy between Marines and Marauders, wherein the Marauder has 1 more range, and they can settle into ranks very nicely. The Medivac enables the Terran player to have lazy play.

- - - - Oh, and we're forgetting that the Medivac also provides the utility of a Dropship. So we have the SC1 Medic that doesn't take up Barracks build time, doesn't compete for positioning in the firing arc, and has way more survivability in that it can hang out behind the firing arc, waaay behind, and float overhead doing it's job. Also, it's heal is a little too efficient. They're too good at their job.

My suggestions: bring back the Medic with the Tech Lab. It was so weird having the Medic for so long during the single player campaign. Why did Blizzard think the Medivac was necessary? Shouldn't the Medic be the primary healer, and then the Medivac can also heal, but it isn't as good. Or it heals the units inside, that are being transported.

The Baneling is laughably overpowered. You take a 1/2 supply unit and morph it into a 2 supply unit killer. Besides this brain aneurysm, Zerglings can only be countered by Zealots. Sentries don't work, Stalkers don't work. Speedlings will get the surround and that's that. And in the early and mid game, the only spammable option Protoss will have... are Zealots.

So then the Zerg morphs some lings into Banelings... and then what? Try to FF them away and then retreat. My point is, Banelings are a game-changing unit and in a big way. They shouldn't explode when they're killed. That bit is has horrific consequences if they do a Baneling drop in your mineral line.

You shouldn't allow Banelings to be a problem! Kill the Overlord, use FF, get Collosus! Yea alright, I'll get right on that. Should I do that before or after my 3rd Gateway? Because it's that early in the game. I don't know they have Banelings, but I know they have Speedlings. So I suppose I should preemptively make a crap-ton of Stalkers - the only Gateway unit that doesn't take bonus damage from Banelings, in the off chance Speedlings weren't enough to beat me.

Banelings are a big-surprise unit that hard-counters everything out of the Gateway. The Zerg player will go out of his way to conceal that they're making them, because half of their effectiveness is the BOOM YOU GOT BANELING BUSTED!

The Hydralisk is laughably overpowered. This one needs clarification. This unit, by itself, is not op. The problem is the general utilitarian nature it has, that makes it desirable to mass without regret. The Hydralisk complements every other Zerg unit. You wouldn't want to mix Zerglings with Ultralisks because they'd get in each other's way, and the army is vulnerable to AoE and air.

Hydralisks don't have that problem. They survive a full-duration Psi Storm because they get the 1 point of regen in. They do awesome damage. A pure Hydra army will roflstomp a pure-Gateway army every time. So the Protoss player has to get Collosus or Templar. Well, Psi Storm isn't all it's cracked up to be - Psi Storm sucks. It really needs to get put back on par with how it was in SC1. Then we'd see more Templar.

So then, by process of elimination (only two viable tech trees here) we come to Collosus... which are massive units and massive units have a special relationship with Corruptors. I'm just saying. This is part of the Zerg's problem with having such distilled unit niches - we all know that Zerg has the lowest combat unit diversity. It really is just Speedlings, Roaches, Hydralisks, and Mutalisks. All the others come in in a "as needed" capacity.

So, just to sum up, once the Zerg gets it into his head to build only Hydralisks, basically the Protoss player is locked into making Collosus and Stalkers - not because Stalkers are any good, they're just a meat-shield and resource-dump. On a dime, mass Hydralisks will dictate the game, and because of how good Spine Crawlers are at repelling early harassment, the Toss player can't stop a determined Zerg from getting Hydras. So you try to meta, and choose to preserve your army and resources to fast-tech to Collosus with the range upgrade... and before you know it, they have 20+ Hydras to your 10 or so Gateway units. Don't let the Zerg macro next time! You should harass more!

Stim on Marauders are laughably overpowered. Real quick: Marauders serve every function of a Siege Tank but are better in every meaningful way. You get Marauders sooner, they do damage equivalent to their cost, and they build really quick. With the Slow upgrade, Marauders can be your entire ground army against Protoss.

The problem is that they deal bonus damage to armored, which itself is retarded. Since when does having armor make you more vulnerable? Besides that, Protoss really can't choose not to avoid this exploitation because that would leave Toss with Zealots and Sentries - not exactly the most optimal build.

But I'm getting off-track here. The Marauder isn't overpowered. It's good. The Marauder is a really good unit. The problem is how much better Marauders become with Stim Pack. Combine this with Medivacs and boom - you have a bio ball that mid-game, when the Protoss player is getting his expo saturated and trying to execute an end-game plan, that can't be handled.

I understand timing attacks - I get it that there are these windows of opportunity that if seized, can win you the game. And I get it that the Marauder has counters too - the Immortal. But the problem isn't that the Marauder is overpowered - it isn't. It's when Terrans pop open a can of Stim that even Immortals melt. That's the problem.

*** *** *** *** ***

So there, those are my arguments, that's what I think. You can look up my name in the game to see my rank. I'm sure all of you are pro-masters waiting for your turn in the gosu tournaments and pro leagues. Maybe you can take my experiences in game and tell me what I ought to be doing right.

User was temp banned for this post.
If there was no Devil, it would be necessary to invent him.
rollan
Profile Joined April 2009
Canada33 Posts
August 08 2010 05:54 GMT
#2
This is the "Strategy forum", not the Activision Blizzard unit balance forum.
Kurdaj
Profile Joined May 2010
United States57 Posts
August 08 2010 05:57 GMT
#3
What's the strategy for Protoss to handle these units? I'm applying the go-to strats and they aren't working. I'm not in Platinum anymore, the guys I'm up against have survived a timing push or two in their time.

What are the strategies for dealing with a bio ball that has 8 or so Medivacs with them?

What are the strategies for dealing with a Baneling bust against your Gateway/Cyb Core wall off with the Zealot holding the line?

What are the strategies for dealing with mass Hydralisk + Corruptors?

What are the strategies for dealing with a Marauder timing push with Stim Packs?



I am actively losing to these, and that's not acceptable. So what are the the choices I have?
If there was no Devil, it would be necessary to invent him.
Yaotzin
Profile Joined August 2010
South Africa4280 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-08-08 06:01:37
August 08 2010 05:59 GMT
#4
Wrong forum and a load of nonsense anyway.


What are the strategies for dealing with a bio ball that has 8 or so Medivacs with them?

AOE of course. Storm is the usual preference.

What are the strategies for dealing with a Baneling bust against your Gateway/Cyb Core wall off with the Zealot holding the line?

FF

What are the strategies for dealing with mass Hydralisk + Corruptors?

Good collosi micro or storm with a ground army.

What are the strategies for dealing with a Marauder timing push with Stim Packs?

FF

Sounds like you need to learn to love sentries more!
Railxp
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
Hong Kong1313 Posts
August 08 2010 05:59 GMT
#5
ah! another day, another sc2 balance whine thread on TL, good to know the universe is still in existence.
~\(。◕‿‿◕。)/~,,,,,,,,>
Williowa
Profile Joined April 2010
129 Posts
August 08 2010 06:00 GMT
#6
Show some replays, you know, let's see what you are doing wrong, not just your equally hopeless predicament as every other player out there.
It's A Zergling Lester
boredcouch
Profile Joined May 2008
United States110 Posts
August 08 2010 06:01 GMT
#7
Funny how you forget to mention that there is absolutely no counter to 200/200 voidrays.
starcraft is the greatest game ever
Jibba
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States22883 Posts
August 08 2010 06:01 GMT
#8
On August 08 2010 14:57 Kurdaj wrote:
I'm not in Platinum anymore, the guys I'm up against have survived a timing push or two in their time.

If you can't figure it out by learning to make a proper Strategy forum thread, I don't foresee this being a problem anymore.
ModeratorNow I'm distant, dark in this anthrobeat
IntoTheWow
Profile Blog Joined May 2004
is awesome32274 Posts
August 08 2010 06:01 GMT
#9
[image loading]
Moderator<:3-/-<
Heyoka
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Katowice25012 Posts
August 08 2010 06:02 GMT
#10
On August 08 2010 14:57 Kurdaj wrote:
What's the strategy for Protoss to handle these units? I'm applying the go-to strats and they aren't working. I'm not in Platinum anymore, the guys I'm up against have survived a timing push or two in their time.


Maybe you're just bad, have you considered that?
@RealHeyoka | ESL / DreamHack StarCraft Lead
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