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There's a very interesting discussion going on about Z 5-6 base play vs. T mech strat @ around 16min mark...
Artosis says that its tough when you have 80 drones to build up a nice army....and I'd like to point out that perhaps at that point its a little excessive to be mining so ferociously? Why not send in 20 or so drones with your 1st push or something to free up supply and then come back with a much larger force? I really can't see how 60 drones don't still provide a healthy amount of income.
Tasteless stops making probes in the Day[9]vs.Tasteless showmatch precisely because that income and supply is to be used to fuel his strategy. Would the simple fix ZvTmech be to build less drones and use the free supply to provide a bigger army? A bigger army that successfully breaks mech would mean that you wouldn't need that insane income stream to keep on replenishing your army because your push would have put T at a severe disadvantage. Why not build more hatch in existing bases and build off of 4 base?
I'm not a Z player so I'd love some insight!
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I think it was a good episode. Well done JP and quests.
Oh and I really liked Enter the Dragon as well. Great map, would definitely play a SC2 remake.
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On June 24 2010 20:46 Sylvr wrote:
I find it absolutely hilarious how interviewers have such a hard time reacting to TLO's super short answers. Sometimes his answer is shorter than the question and the interviewer is never really prepared when he stops talking and you get those awkward silences. It seems like nobody is ever really sure that he's done talking either.
I realize that it's most likely because English isn't his first language and really going in depth with his answers may prove difficult, but I still can't help find it funny when his questions/interviews run really short and the interviewer is scrambling for ways to drag it out. I suppose I can't really blame them for that; if I had a chance to talk to TLO, I probably wouldn't want to waste it on 1 sentence answers either. I would want to draw out a real discussion with him.
I think part of the reason why it he was giving this extremely short answers (even shorter than usual), is that it was 5:30 AM over here when they did the interview 
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if idra and artosis really think terran is imba, why dont they play terran to really highlight why its imbalanced?
edit 1: they should play terran and dominate all the tournaments so that the guys at blizzard can go make a nerf
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On June 25 2010 00:12 metaphoR wrote:
if idra and artosis really think terran is imba, why dont they play terran to really highlight why its imbalanced?
edit 1: they should play terran and dominate all the tournaments so that the guys at blizzard can go make a nerf
That would totally work if it was imbalanced. . .but it's not. >.> People just don't know how to beat it. Just like Day9 was saying, early in SC1 the Terran timing push that is so standard was really hard to beat.
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On June 25 2010 00:12 metaphoR wrote:
if idra and artosis really think terran is imba, why dont they play terran to really highlight why its imbalanced?
edit 1: they should play terran and dominate all the tournaments so that the guys at blizzard can go make a nerf
Guys, seriously. It's ok if Terran is overpowered or tanks are overpowered or whatever. It doesn't reflect poorly on people that are Terran. If Blizz wants to change Terran, they will. Then Terran will adapt. If they don't want to change Terran, they won't. Then Zerg players can "whine" all they want, but they'll have to adapt. We play the hand that's dealt us.
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On June 24 2010 23:48 MrHavix wrote:Tasteless stops making probes in the Day[9]vs.Tasteless showmatch precisely because that income and supply is to be used to fuel his strategy.
Actually, Tasteless stops making probes at 16-21 because he thinks 2 Probes per mineral patch is optimal. Even IF that was the case, I don't know why he doesn't make more Probes for his eventual expansion.
And yeah, I somewhat agree with the previous posters. Artosis went too far to push his beliefs that Terran mech is overpowered. While I didn't think he did it on purpose (I still have heaps of respect for Artosis), it did seem as if he was unintentionally taking advantage of TLO's poor English to push his opinion. You could tell TLO was the bigger man in that 'debate' when he just backed off because Artosis wasn't listening to anything TLO was saying. Same with Day[9], he was with TLO in that there were little to no imbalances, yet Artosis wouldn't hear it.
That said, it was a very friendly interview and what could have potentially been a fierce argument was kept professional. Good work on the podcast and I'll be tuning in every week (or however often you choose to do it).
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On June 25 2010 00:35 youngminii wrote:Show nested quote +On June 24 2010 23:48 MrHavix wrote:Tasteless stops making probes in the Day[9]vs.Tasteless showmatch precisely because that income and supply is to be used to fuel his strategy. Actually, Tasteless stops making probes at 16-21 because he thinks 2 Probes per mineral patch is optimal. Even IF that was the case, I don't know why he doesn't make more Probes for his eventual expansion. And yeah, I somewhat agree with the previous posters. Tasteless went too far to push his beliefs that Terran mech is overpowered. While I didn't think he did it on purpose (I still have heaps of respect for Tasteless), it did seem as if he was unintentionally taking advantage of TLO's poor English to push his opinion. You could tell TLO was the bigger man in that 'debate' when he just backed off because Tasteless wasn't listening to anything TLO was saying. Same with Day[9], he was with TLO in that there were little to no imbalances, yet Tasteless wouldn't hear it. That said, it was a very friendly interview and what could have potentially been a fierce argument was kept professional. Good work on the podcast and I'll be tuning in every week (or however often you choose to do it).
Just FYI, that was Artosis on the podcast, not Tasteless. Maybe just a typo, but important to note.
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Thanks for bringing it in mp3. I bring it to my gym, awesome stuff to listen to..
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On June 24 2010 23:48 MrHavix wrote:
Artosis says that its tough when you have 80 drones to build up a nice army....and I'd like to point out that perhaps at that point its a little excessive to be mining so ferociously? Why not send in 20 or so drones with your 1st push or something to free up supply and then come back with a much larger force? I really can't see how 60 drones don't still provide a healthy amount of income.
Well Artosis and IdrA are in love with their Drones and would never sacrifice them. Terrans sometimes do, but since our Zerg wiseguys have "tried everything" they probably also tried taking 20 Drones on an attack when they are maxed, right?
1. If you have a smaller army than an opponent you are bound to lose.
2. Maybe the whole point is not to allow the Terran to get a high number of tanks. This can probably only be accomplished with early harrassment, but Zerg seem to harrass only rarely and only when they have maxed armies to act as decoys.
3. What is good against Hydras? Tanks! What is good against Tanks? 1 Brood Lord! What kills Brood Lords? Vikings! What is a Viking totally crappy against? Hydras! So if you face a sieged up tank Terran you just need one Brood Lord to either force him to make Vikings which you can kill with your Hydras OR he unsieges and tries to advance and the tanks become crappy against Hydras OR he does nothing and lets the Brood Lord nibble away at the sieged tanks and have the tanks shoot their splash damage at the Broodlings and kill their own units.
Artosis argues that the tank smart fire prevents overkill. Sure that is a change compared to BW, but the splash damage still does friendly fire and kills their own units. That is actually a huge drawback to sieged tanks which doesnt get abused enough. One Brood Lord which spawns fighting units for free (unlike the Carrier where you need to pay for Interceptors) is enough to abuse it. If you lose it it wont be a big deal, but you probably killed more than its worth with it as either the cause of the damage or as simple bait for enemy forces. You can even keep a Brood Lord alive pretty easily (unless the Terran has enough Vikings to kill him in one volley) with a Queen or two. If he has enough Vikings to do that he should have much fewer ground forces though. Comparing BW and SC2 the siege tank has had its cost increased (25 more gas and 1 more food) and its attack damage reduced (70 to 50 after the last patch) and it still is not enough? Deactivating smart shooting will not solve the problem, because you simply position your tanks deeper and solve it that way. Think again on the possibilities of ZERG before asking for a nerf for the other side.
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No one noticed the genre of the mp3s? :D
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On June 25 2010 01:01 JonChamp wrote:
No one noticed the genre of the mp3s? :D
On June 24 2010 22:54 MythicalMage wrote:![[image loading]](http://img248.imageshack.us/img248/4470/sotgjpop.png) This is without any modification. Yes, State of the Game is JPop. >.>
XD
EDIT: Now that I think about it, it might be a joke on JP's part. JPop
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Wired how evry thing u said in EP5 came trough in the week afther the podcast.
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On June 24 2010 16:29 Keitzer wrote:
now wait.... are you counting ZERGLINGS as .5 supply? Because that's the only other "unit" that costs 1 supply
I noticed that as well.
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I definitely think changing the AI only for tanks is the wrong option. Making things act more like they did in broodwar is definitely a way to make an interesting and balanced game, but it's not the only way.
But, I definitely agree with Day9 on mech TvZ. The issue isn't so much balance as it is that it makes the match up pretty "dry" and boring to watch for spectators. I guess that's just my opinion, though.
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I so completely agree with TLO. And also, I really like Artosis, he's a funny guy, does alot for the community; but the way that he explains he's basically just saying that the reason terrans aren't winning left and right and winning all TvZs ever is that they're bad players who don't know how to properly play their race, which I find somewhat disrespectful.
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On June 22 2010 04:14 Midj wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2010 01:31 MangoTango wrote:
Is there a way for you to release these podcasts on itunes? I'd like to put it on my ipod to listen to while working. Although, come to think of it, that might not be a good idea. Laughing while handling dangerous chemicals might not be the best idea. Ah well, sacrifices must be made for Starcraft. I believe you can add the RSS feed to your itunes.
You can indeed, however the RSS currently only has up through episode 5. Any word on when it will be added, JP?
Thanks for another show. <3 these.
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Holy shit, Zerg have no 1 supply unit...I never noticed :|
-Thanks for answering 3 of my questions!! ^_^;;
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they have 2 0.5 supply units now though, baneling being only 0.5 supply is really nice in late game.
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EPT
