The Ohio State coordinator hasn't been active/contacting us for months now. I would've probably made an effort to form a new OSU team but the registration fee is a sticking point. I am unwilling to pay upkeep fees (since this is what they are) out of my pocket, and it's way too late in the cycle to form a club and try to get money from the school (I'm a treasurer of a club here, and it'd be nearly impossible to do what has been suggested).

If Ancestral has been in contact with you and is saying something different, then believe him, but he hasn't been in contact with us. While Ohio State wasn't the best organized last year, we were still a participant in CSL and I think it's safe to say we won't be making the attempt to get a team as long registration fees are in effect.

OneOther

United States10774 Posts

September 01 2009 17:15 GMT

#62

On September 02 2009 02:12 Empyrean wrote:

Show nested quote +

Yeah and this was the first time I found out about the entry fee <_<

That being said, let's start getting our practicing in?

yeh

we are in pretty good shape if me/tyler/julian pull through, but you will have to bail us pretty frequently

edit: I don't really mind paying the fee as long as it's clear to others and me that it's being used correctly.

ziz

203 Posts

September 01 2009 17:18 GMT

#63

On September 02 2009 02:05 Xeris wrote:
First off, why would you trust Blizzard. You realize that Blizzard was one of the main things that killed WGT? We signed a contract with them and that essentially ended the ladder for good because they failed to come through on their part of the bargain and we were contractually obligated to basically sit and wait for them.

Really what this looks like is a bunch of people seeing an opportunity to make a quick buck. As Freaky said, I seriously FLEW to Montreal to host a tournament for Canadians because they didn't have WCG and I felt like their community deserved a tournament. I didn't make anything, I actually spent money from my own pocket, but it was a great tournament... everyone had a lot of fun, and 100% of entry fee went to the players, and I was able to get them hardware prizes.

There's almost 0 reason to charge an entry fee unless 100% of it is going to the players. At all, there's no justification for charging an entry fee.

i agree

Empyrean

17057 Posts

September 01 2009 17:19 GMT

#64

On September 02 2009 02:15 OneOther wrote:

Show nested quote +

yeh

I'm going to state it now and on the record, that on certain maps and match ups, I'm untouchable in a bo1

Ideas

United States8169 Posts

September 01 2009 17:19 GMT

#65

I'm not sure if my team will want to play now.

Empyrean

17057 Posts

September 01 2009 17:22 GMT

#66

On September 02 2009 02:19 Ideas wrote:
I'm not sure if my team will want to play now.

Not to suggest anything, but I think if enough teams don't want to play, then the organizers are either forced to scrap the entry fee or have to deal with mediocre participation, loss of interest, and hardly any community support or interest

Or maybe someone will organize a free version.

(that being said, I don't mind contributing to prize money and server costs, I just don't want to pay for CSL to get LLC status).

Xeris

Iran17695 Posts

September 01 2009 17:24 GMT

#67

Yep, I won't pay to have my team participate unless 100% entry fee money goes to the prize pool, and even then I'd still hesitate.

I was around for CSL playoff matches and it was a bunch of randomness and quite unorganized. If these guys are adamant about trying to extract money from the community for their own personal gains I'll just make UCPL into a nationwide college league, free of charge and for the love of the community and I can almost guarantee I'll run it just as well or better and all by myself to boot.

Muirhead

United States556 Posts

September 01 2009 17:27 GMT

#68

I think the CSL is a great idea and I really enjoyed it last year.

You guys should decide if you want to rage about a minimal fee on principle or if you want to try and support an idea which brings Starcraft players together at your universities.

I hope the organizers can propose clear suggestions about where the extra money will go in terms of prizes, and I hope they continue to do a good job of generating interest and awareness over the coming weeks. It would really be a tremendous thing if this grew to encompass dozens of universities.

AoN.DimSum

United States2983 Posts

September 01 2009 17:33 GMT

#69

Hey can anyone tell me what is going on with the rutgers team with clazzi banned? I still would like to play in it if others are willing.

RaGe

Belgium9950 Posts

September 01 2009 17:37 GMT

#70

Oh and can you explain the VoE involvement in this? CSL is officially yours, right Hazel? So just because Cholera (member of VoE) is cocasting the event, you want your participants to pay their filing fees?

Xeris

Iran17695 Posts

September 01 2009 17:39 GMT

#71

It is a great idea, and many people enjoyed it. I thought for the most part it was good, wasn't run very well but it was in the spirit of fun so whatever. It's not the money that is a problem, $5 is chump change, but it's the principle.

NOBODY tells the community "I'm going to host a tournament but you have to pay for it" . Established people can't even get that shit to work, and a bunch of scrubs (pardon my english) think that after running one season of a league that they can come in here and start milking the community? If TL or WGT, or GG.net, or even me don't get anything out of what they do (ok GG.net earns some profit, but not much) other than the satisfaction of knowing they're making SC nerds happy then what makes these guys able to do that? It's a disgusting manipulation of the passion we all have for this game. This game survived for so long because of people's love for it, it's not about making money...

If you look at almost ANY business, they had to go through years of financial loss and hardship before they became established and started earning profit. These CSL people are trying to cut corners by exploiting the community to save some money and start their dumbass corporation. I paid for hosting of BWUSA.org and ran a league and other tournaments out of my own pocket for fun, etc... TL.net runs tournaments all the time and never makes a dime. It's complete and utter bullshit for these guys to even claim they're trying to cover expenses. Don't get involved in this shit if your goal is to make money / break even.

Even look at GG.net (a BW example). Raistlin and Mazor started it in 2002 or 2003 or whenever it was, they paid for hosting and they worked probably 10-15 hours a day coding, writing newses, etc. They did EVERYTHING for the community and worked their asses off to provide foreigner coverage. Now it's 2009 and GG.net has ads and can get sponsors and make a bit of money too, but it took them 3-4 years to get to a point where they could earn anything.

There's absolutely no justification for charging and entry fee AT ALL.

shaldengeki

United States104 Posts

September 01 2009 17:54 GMT

#72

While the $5 fee per player is small, and really amounts to very little when you look our individual SC club's budget, there are some very good points in this thread about what exactly that fee goes towards and why it's being charged.

Server costs clearly don't cover the whole sum of money you'll be receiving if CSL takes off, especially if you'll be streaming offsite. If LLC costs are high enough to be forcing you to charge fees already, when the previous season wasn't very well-run, then you may want to reconsider being an LLC in the first place. CSL has to first prove that it's capable of smoothly running a large-scale operation before people will even consider giving money to participate in an activity that normally costs absolutely nothing. Without that trust, you really can't expect people to be willing to invest in you.

@Xeris: You're clearly getting too emotionally involved with this. Step back, take a chill pill. There's no reason to resort to calling people "scrubs" or "dumbass"es when the people behind this are rational, decent people who are clearly trying their best to further legitimize SCBW in the US. Please don't immediately assume that they're trying to "milk the community".

Xeris

Iran17695 Posts

September 01 2009 17:57 GMT

#73

It's kind of insulting for people who have never even thought of profiting from community efforts and have been doing it for many years to see some people who have been involved in the community for what seems like a grand total of 6 months try to start to turn things corporate, and have the community pay for it, no less. I mean look at the op, there's not even any mention of prizes =P

shaldengeki

United States104 Posts

September 01 2009 18:02 GMT

#74

It is a bit disconcerting to hear CSL staff drop hints of prizes when it's been clearly stated before that there will be no prizes offered to the winning teams. Certainly CSL could use some better organization and communication. It's also understandable that SCBW community veterans who have contributed generously and altruistically to the community over the years would feel uneasy and offended at the prospect of others charging money to participate in leagues.

But I think that this step is a necessary eventuality if SCBW is ever going to be "legitimized" in the US; clearly this is debatable, and CSL is probably rushing too fast on this path, but it'll probably happen at some point or another, unfortunately. Such is reality.

Kennigit