EPT[GOM] Ro16, Day 4 - Page 21
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boredcouch
United States110 Posts
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SuperArc
Austria7781 Posts
On June 28 2009 19:50 TwoToneTerran wrote: It's like you completely ignored my first three sentences. I know you're a CJ fan and you're happy that Effort won, but condescension is a pretty mean path to take in the face of a Violet fan. =( No, not at all. All I am asking is why should a midgame level player decide to cheese? Or play greedy and risky? | ||
ArvickHero
10387 Posts
On June 28 2009 19:41 Rostam wrote: Should I start linking games where Bisu gets owned by early speedlings? Mistakes happen, acting like those games suddenly prove all of Violet's other wins mean nothing is ridiculous. Hmm Bisu has been quite good at nullifying speedlings in his base lately with some superb probe micro.... I think there was one game where like 6-8 speedlings got in but they didn't really do any damage due to Bisu's excellent defense | ||
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5unrise
New Zealand646 Posts
On June 28 2009 19:51 SuperArc wrote: No, not at all. All I am asking is why should a midgame level player decide to cheese? Or play greedy and risky? yeah if he is confident he can take effort on and hold his own in a standard macro fashion why would he take these risks? | ||
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Magic84
Russian Federation1381 Posts
On June 28 2009 19:49 Bifur wrote: Golden Age of Zergs There are really like just 3 zergs that do great, you need more for golden age i think. | ||
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samachking
Bahrain4949 Posts
On June 28 2009 19:51 SuperArc wrote: No, not at all. All I am asking is why should a midgame level player decide to cheese? Or play greedy and risky? First of all, he cheesed on game 1 for change of pace, as he plays straight up most of the games he plays + Gods Garden is REALLY bad for P, if you take out Much's inflated wins vs shit tier Zergs the map ends up to be 23-7 which is not good. And game 2 is not THAT greedy, lots of protoss build 1 canon at nat, including Bisu himself,stork, and jangbi, and Violet made no mistakes with that as his probe saw a lair and only saw 6 lings< Effort started pumping lings after he killed the probe, so it was a sneaky all in. Violet was simply reacting to what he saw and what he saw was just standard play by effort untill that point. | ||
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SuperArc
Austria7781 Posts
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TwoToneTerran
United States8841 Posts
On June 28 2009 19:51 SuperArc wrote: No, not at all. All I am asking is why should a midgame level player decide to cheese? Or play greedy and risky? I just said he proxied because it Garden of God -- the map is a deathtrap for P considering how dominant Zerg mid/mid-late game is. HBR is supposed to be kind of hard to runby given the choke and decent sim city, and honestly he probably would've been fine losing his gas with that build. He wasn't even that greedy -- he just didn't know how many lings Effort had and got trounced by moving out of place. Oh well, it's kind of bittersweet anyhow. I'm also a Jaedong fan and it's vindicating that he's got a Bo3 against Jaedong next time. Flash is still gonna win the whole thing though. :3 Calling it now, GOM's gonna have a cycle. Flash wins invitational, Jaedong wins season 1, Bisu wins season 2, Flash wins season 3. Guess who's gonna win season four, Jaedong fans? 8) | ||
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SuperArc
Austria7781 Posts
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motbob
United States12546 Posts
On June 28 2009 19:58 TwoToneTerran wrote: Flash is still gonna win the whole thing though. :3 Calling it now, GOM's gonna have a cycle. Flash wins invitational, Jaedong wins season 1, Bisu wins season 2, Flash wins season 3. Guess who's gonna win season four, Jaedong fans? 8) Idra? + Show Spoiler + Sea.Really? | ||
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TwoToneTerran
United States8841 Posts
On June 28 2009 20:03 SuperArc wrote: I like how you are saying he isn't that greedy, skipping a 2nd scout and refusing to make more than one cannon isn't greedy? What is it then. A bit greedy? :p Skipping a 2nd scout? He wasn't at the time to get a second scout. You scout again when you can push your lots out past the initial zergling contain so your probe doesn't die like a bitch -- or you scout with a sair. Who scouts at that point with 8 speed lings light containing? The extra cannon wasn't necessary with the info he had. Telling him to make another cannon when all he's seen are initial lings is telling him to make cost efficiency mistakes. That's the same sim city you've seen everytime a protoss wins standard on HBR. Saying Violet was bad for that is saying Bisu was bad when he beat Jaedong on the map -- he isn't. Ling rushes happen sometime. | ||
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SuperArc
Austria7781 Posts
On June 28 2009 20:04 TwoToneTerran wrote: Skipping a 2nd scout? He wasn't at the time to get a second scout. You scout again when you can push your lots out past the initial zergling contain so your probe doesn't die like a bitch -- or you scout with a sair. Who scouts at that point with 8 speed lings light containing? Bisu :p The 2nd best protoss should be able to hide a probe. | ||
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samachking
Bahrain4949 Posts
On June 28 2009 20:03 SuperArc wrote: I like how you are saying he isn't that greedy, skipping a 2nd scout and refusing to make more than one cannon isn't greedy? What is it then. A bit greedy? :p You know his sair was almost done when the push came out yeah? Noone sends out a 2nd scout when your stargate is done -__-. | ||
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Husky
United States3362 Posts
Guess who's gonna win season four, Jaedong fans? 8) David Kim | ||
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TwoToneTerran
United States8841 Posts
On June 28 2009 20:06 SuperArc wrote: Bisu :p The 2nd best protoss should be able to hide a probe. Second best zerg should be able to find one? That's a dumb argument. | ||
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SuperArc
Austria7781 Posts
On June 28 2009 20:07 TwoToneTerran wrote: Second best zerg should be able to find one? That's a dumb argument. True, lol. Next time, just make more cannons | ||
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TheFoReveRwaR
United States10657 Posts
On June 28 2009 20:06 samachking wrote: You know his sair was almost done when the push came out yeah? Noone sends out a 2nd scout when your stargate is done -__-. Samachking...you're clueless ok? It's completely standard to send out a second probe after your first one dies. It's even better to have a second one hidden after your first one dies so you can see even more(read: Sent out BEFORE the first one dies in anticipation of the first one dying). Violet played greedy and had placement mistakes that effort perfectly exploited. The exploitation of mistakes is out playing someone pure and simple. Violet thought he was safe because he had his zealots in position and he WAS. Until effort saw the cannon placement and FORCED him to move his zealots out of position with a small number of lings. When the zealots were out of position effort showed the rest of lings and won... Effort completely outplayed him in both games. There's no denying this. Violet should've been good enough to reason that there was a huge window that could've been used to make speedlings(and there was). He should've been good enough to realize his cannon placement wouldn't cover his gas...he wasn't, so effort made him pay like a really good zerg should. | ||
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TheFoReveRwaR
United States10657 Posts
On June 28 2009 19:40 iLoveKT wrote: No it didnt. did you watch the games? Jaedong and Effort didnt beat him because they outplayed him. They beat him because of violets mistake. Watch jaedong vs much. That is an example of beating the crap out of him. violet vs effort/jd wasnt. Define the word "outplayed"? Go ahead... | ||
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Remure
United States6 Posts
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SuperArc
Austria7781 Posts
On June 28 2009 20:51 Remure wrote: I'm looking forward to Jaedong v Effort. Yeah, me too. Especially the "How will Jaedong rape this time" will be a fun part of the series. | ||
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