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I don't even need to say "predicted" anymore
really hyvaa sangho up, estro just wins, that's all.
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On December 06 2008 16:11 Avidkeystamper wrote:Show nested quote +On December 06 2008 15:53 Dazed_Spy wrote:On December 06 2008 15:44 Avidkeystamper wrote:On December 06 2008 15:38 KnightOfNi wrote:
I have to say that Lecaf is probably the LEAST deep team in the league. They only have Jaedong and BackHo on Z and P, and after that they have nobody. I'd say that STX is the deepest.
Anyways, HYVAA FTW!!! Umm, they have fOrGG and Jaedong and a bunch of good supporting players. I would only put Khan and STX over them. CJ's player is still developing, OGN's players aren't as high caliber and some of them have a weak MU, and actually Stars is deeper, but are Zero and GGPlay better? Lecaf is "deep" because their supporting players can win games, unlike KTF who have no decent supporting cast after their two hitters. Lecaf is known for being a team that lacks depth. Why? They rely entirely on their aces. Be it anytime [thats over now...] forgg, Jaedong, Lomo, or Backho. The later two to only small extents. What I mean is, the players that are good on lecaf, are very good, but no other players are getting air time. The result? Lecaf has amazing results, but the 'future generation' is virtually unprepared. Other teams have made this mistake in the past, and they get raped for it. Next season Lecaf is going to HAVE to make the transiiton if they want to keep their spot as a top team. KTF is a good example I guess, of what could happen to lecaf. They didn't develop the next generation properly, so outside of their ace players, they as you said, have no good players. Admittedly that is an over exaggeration, firefist, 815, tempest etc are all very good- up and comers. They are getting their air time, and a few among them next season, or the next, may become top consistent pro gamers. KTF has been taking a beating lately because of the transition they are making. In the long term, they are running their team more logically than Lecaf. Thats all there is to it. On December 06 2008 15:51 thunk wrote:On December 06 2008 15:41 thunk wrote:On December 06 2008 15:40 KnightOfNi wrote:
Oh and Sangho and UpMagic are quietly going 14-4 this proleague season (SH is 8-2, UM is 6-2)... That's actually really interesting to know. Let me go look up Really's numbers. Really is 8-6, so not as impressive as SH and UM. I guess I knew that but didn't know it, if that makes sense. But them combined, they're 22-10, which is really quite fearsome (Like 63%). But Sangho and Upmagic by themselves are 78%, so even more impressive. Good for Estro. Well, the truth is, Really is Estr0s best player. Upmagic is inconsistent....Sangho definitely has the capabilities to be compared to really. Nonetheless, Really is just *such* a strong player all around, that hes being sent up against the best, is usually ace [iirc]. He's the better player. Though they are all doing fairly well lately, and thats a good sign. This would've been true last round, but this round contradicts what you're saying. And everything rely on their "Aces". "Aces" are just the best people of their team and every team plays the best all the time, not just Lecaf. I mean look at STX (last round). In what way does it contradict what I am saying? And yes every team relys on their aces, but most teams give air time to their less reliable up and comer type players. Hell a lot of teams find stable up and comers, yet still dont use them every week, giving air time to the less reliable up and comers, simply because they need to spend time developing the newbies. KTF is doing that now, because they totally failed to do it in the past. Lecaf still hasn't done it. Teams like lecaf and stx who don't give any air time to people who are not *the* best, will inevitably lack ace players in the future.
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Good job estro!
But Pure over Really. Oh well, that was destination which is definitely hard to play for terran against protoss.
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On December 07 2008 03:04 Dazed_Spy wrote:Show nested quote +On December 06 2008 16:11 Avidkeystamper wrote:On December 06 2008 15:53 Dazed_Spy wrote:On December 06 2008 15:44 Avidkeystamper wrote:On December 06 2008 15:38 KnightOfNi wrote:
I have to say that Lecaf is probably the LEAST deep team in the league. They only have Jaedong and BackHo on Z and P, and after that they have nobody. I'd say that STX is the deepest.
Anyways, HYVAA FTW!!! Umm, they have fOrGG and Jaedong and a bunch of good supporting players. I would only put Khan and STX over them. CJ's player is still developing, OGN's players aren't as high caliber and some of them have a weak MU, and actually Stars is deeper, but are Zero and GGPlay better? Lecaf is "deep" because their supporting players can win games, unlike KTF who have no decent supporting cast after their two hitters. Lecaf is known for being a team that lacks depth. Why? They rely entirely on their aces. Be it anytime [thats over now...] forgg, Jaedong, Lomo, or Backho. The later two to only small extents. What I mean is, the players that are good on lecaf, are very good, but no other players are getting air time. The result? Lecaf has amazing results, but the 'future generation' is virtually unprepared. Other teams have made this mistake in the past, and they get raped for it. Next season Lecaf is going to HAVE to make the transiiton if they want to keep their spot as a top team. KTF is a good example I guess, of what could happen to lecaf. They didn't develop the next generation properly, so outside of their ace players, they as you said, have no good players. Admittedly that is an over exaggeration, firefist, 815, tempest etc are all very good- up and comers. They are getting their air time, and a few among them next season, or the next, may become top consistent pro gamers. KTF has been taking a beating lately because of the transition they are making. In the long term, they are running their team more logically than Lecaf. Thats all there is to it. On December 06 2008 15:51 thunk wrote:On December 06 2008 15:41 thunk wrote:On December 06 2008 15:40 KnightOfNi wrote:
Oh and Sangho and UpMagic are quietly going 14-4 this proleague season (SH is 8-2, UM is 6-2)... That's actually really interesting to know. Let me go look up Really's numbers. Really is 8-6, so not as impressive as SH and UM. I guess I knew that but didn't know it, if that makes sense. But them combined, they're 22-10, which is really quite fearsome (Like 63%). But Sangho and Upmagic by themselves are 78%, so even more impressive. Good for Estro. Well, the truth is, Really is Estr0s best player. Upmagic is inconsistent....Sangho definitely has the capabilities to be compared to really. Nonetheless, Really is just *such* a strong player all around, that hes being sent up against the best, is usually ace [iirc]. He's the better player. Though they are all doing fairly well lately, and thats a good sign. This would've been true last round, but this round contradicts what you're saying. And everything rely on their "Aces". "Aces" are just the best people of their team and every team plays the best all the time, not just Lecaf. I mean look at STX (last round). In what way does it contradict what I am saying? And yes every team relys on their aces, but most teams give air time to their less reliable up and comer type players. Hell a lot of teams find stable up and comers, yet still dont use them every week, giving air time to the less reliable up and comers, simply because they need to spend time developing the newbies. KTF is doing that now, because they totally failed to do it in the past. Lecaf still hasn't done it. Teams like lecaf and stx who don't give any air time to people who are not *the* best, will inevitably lack ace players in the future.
Lecaf has started to use young, dongrae, and ggaemo this round, so this round contradicts what you're saying. Last round you're right. I think Lecaf is doing exactly what you warned them to do, play more young players.
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On December 07 2008 08:06 fusionsdf wrote:
dongrae is young? ^^
Were you making a pun or did you misread my post?
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WTF didnt expect 3-1
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nada 
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On December 07 2008 10:42 Wasabi wrote:Show nested quote +On December 07 2008 04:46 Lebesgue wrote:
Good job estro!
But Pure over Really. Oh well, that was destination which is definitely hard to play for terran against protoss. Some people don't know how decent Wemade could be just because they're losing a lot this season. Pure is definitely a better player than Really during his peak last season. I'm not just saying this because Wemade's my favorite, but because Pure is nowhere near in shape. His winning over Really wouldn't be considered an upset regardless of map. Edit - what's funny is you ignored the match right next to Pure vs Really - Mind vs Sangho. Anyone in their right mind (no pun intended) would put Mind as a favorite just by looking at his recent TvPs.
really is waywaywaywaywayway better than pure
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On December 07 2008 03:04 Dazed_Spy wrote:Show nested quote +On December 06 2008 16:11 Avidkeystamper wrote:On December 06 2008 15:53 Dazed_Spy wrote:On December 06 2008 15:44 Avidkeystamper wrote:On December 06 2008 15:38 KnightOfNi wrote:
I have to say that Lecaf is probably the LEAST deep team in the league. They only have Jaedong and BackHo on Z and P, and after that they have nobody. I'd say that STX is the deepest.
Anyways, HYVAA FTW!!! Umm, they have fOrGG and Jaedong and a bunch of good supporting players. I would only put Khan and STX over them. CJ's player is still developing, OGN's players aren't as high caliber and some of them have a weak MU, and actually Stars is deeper, but are Zero and GGPlay better? Lecaf is "deep" because their supporting players can win games, unlike KTF who have no decent supporting cast after their two hitters. Lecaf is known for being a team that lacks depth. Why? They rely entirely on their aces. Be it anytime [thats over now...] forgg, Jaedong, Lomo, or Backho. The later two to only small extents. What I mean is, the players that are good on lecaf, are very good, but no other players are getting air time. The result? Lecaf has amazing results, but the 'future generation' is virtually unprepared. Other teams have made this mistake in the past, and they get raped for it. Next season Lecaf is going to HAVE to make the transiiton if they want to keep their spot as a top team. KTF is a good example I guess, of what could happen to lecaf. They didn't develop the next generation properly, so outside of their ace players, they as you said, have no good players. Admittedly that is an over exaggeration, firefist, 815, tempest etc are all very good- up and comers. They are getting their air time, and a few among them next season, or the next, may become top consistent pro gamers. KTF has been taking a beating lately because of the transition they are making. In the long term, they are running their team more logically than Lecaf. Thats all there is to it. On December 06 2008 15:51 thunk wrote:On December 06 2008 15:41 thunk wrote:On December 06 2008 15:40 KnightOfNi wrote:
Oh and Sangho and UpMagic are quietly going 14-4 this proleague season (SH is 8-2, UM is 6-2)... That's actually really interesting to know. Let me go look up Really's numbers. Really is 8-6, so not as impressive as SH and UM. I guess I knew that but didn't know it, if that makes sense. But them combined, they're 22-10, which is really quite fearsome (Like 63%). But Sangho and Upmagic by themselves are 78%, so even more impressive. Good for Estro. Well, the truth is, Really is Estr0s best player. Upmagic is inconsistent....Sangho definitely has the capabilities to be compared to really. Nonetheless, Really is just *such* a strong player all around, that hes being sent up against the best, is usually ace [iirc]. He's the better player. Though they are all doing fairly well lately, and thats a good sign. This would've been true last round, but this round contradicts what you're saying. And everything rely on their "Aces". "Aces" are just the best people of their team and every team plays the best all the time, not just Lecaf. I mean look at STX (last round). In what way does it contradict what I am saying? And yes every team relys on their aces, but most teams give air time to their less reliable up and comer type players. Hell a lot of teams find stable up and comers, yet still dont use them every week, giving air time to the less reliable up and comers, simply because they need to spend time developing the newbies. KTF is doing that now, because they totally failed to do it in the past. Lecaf still hasn't done it. Teams like lecaf and stx who don't give any air time to people who are not *the* best, will inevitably lack ace players in the future.
STX does use different players... They've used 9 players over the course of his year, and although most of the time it is the big 4, they have thrown like modesty and by.hero and others like them in before. They haven't played Tossgirl though .
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On December 07 2008 11:35 Wasabi wrote:
You mostly likely have a better understanding of how good Really is - since you've been to Estro and all - but his results do not support it. He doesn't win left and right like Pure had.
i said he was a better player, i didnt say he wins more
sadly he didnt choose protoss
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Why do you say it is sad that he didn't choose protoss?
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Yay! Estro moving up the ranks! Nice~
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Game 1 was surprising that Really lose to Pure. It looked like Really was ahead after defending the DT drop with minimal lost. Really lost it when his tanks had no units or mines to defend it.
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EPT
