EPT[PL] SKT vs KTF - Page 21
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knyttym
United States5797 Posts
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Freezard
Sweden1017 Posts
Anyway great game... just Flash has gotten so arrogant lately, getting completely devastated from just losing a game vs the Best Protoss around. Seriously... if it wasn't for the ace match he would definitely be emotionally destroyed and turned into a slump ball from this day on. | ||
disciple
9070 Posts
On May 28 2008 04:18 darktreb wrote: Flash lasted over 20 minutes in a game against probably the best P (and maybe best PvT) in the world when he didn't even SCOUT. If he even scans Best once and replaces half of his 92385 tanks with some Goliaths he still wins with ease probably. Face it - his TvP build is absolutely monstrous and this minor setback is only going to make it that much stronger ... scary thought. I also like the way Flash was furious after losing a game he had no business winning (I mean come on, he wasn't facing a B league scrub, he was facing Best and didn't even freaking scout) and then came back and just annihilated a shellshocked Hyuk. There's no question Hyuk should have put up a Sunken but if you look at his psychology (pulling 9 drones like 15 seconds too early) you could tell that he was thinking "OMG IT'S FLASH HE WILL COME NOW WITH 10 MARINE" Also, if I'm not mistaken, Hyuk's scouting of Flash was delayed by that Marine at choke which means he couldn't completely tell when the second Barracks was being put up (if that first Drone gets in he could tell it was later) so he gambled that Flash just went straight BBS and probably timed his counteroffensive off of that. As for not getting off gas ... uhh, don't know about that one. so you are saying Best got extremely lucky, that Flash didnt scouted him? I dont see what could be different , cant you see that flash's game is based on defending till the 3/3 ups and then rolling up. Flash doesnt care at all what is his opponent doing cause his build is very solid and safe, and if you ask me very boring to watch. IF he made more golis to counter the carriers there wouldnt be a big difference mainly because the carriers were extremely fast and flashs ups were like 1/1 when the carriers already had +1 attack and the most important Best used the carriers as a supporting unit, he never was low on goons, he pumped ground army all the time profiting from the fact that Flash just sits in his base and waiting for the ups to get done. Flash truly made mistakes in this game but I will give all the credits to Best for winning the game, his build may see risky and kinda all in with those early carriers but it was the best choice against flash's passive early game...as flash typed : GGG Best | ||
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ahole-surprise
United States813 Posts
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Athos
United States2484 Posts
I'm guessing he didn't build one since he lost an scv in the very beginning. I think Flash was cocky and felt he didn't need to scout but he learned that he is indeed human. I hope this isn't the end of his dominance. As good as Best is...I just don't like the guy. | ||
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Fwmeh
1286 Posts
On May 28 2008 05:26 disciple wrote: so you are saying Best got extremely lucky, that Flash didnt scouted him? I dont see what could be different , cant you see that flash's game is based on defending till the 3/3 ups and then rolling up. Flash doesnt care at all what is his opponent doing cause his build is very solid and safe, and if you ask me very boring to watch. IF he made more golis to counter the carriers there wouldnt be a big difference mainly because the carriers were extremely fast and flashs ups were like 1/1 when the carriers already had +1 attack and the most important Best used the carriers as a supporting unit, he never was low on goons, he pumped ground army all the time profiting from the fact that Flash just sits in his base and waiting for the ups to get done. Flash truly made mistakes in this game but I will give all the credits to Best for winning the game, his build may see risky and kinda all in with those early carriers but it was the best choice against flash's passive early game...as flash typed : GGG Best I think this is an important point. Flash's unite balance was not really bad, it was just that Best's was tailor made to counter it. The key was how fast he got the carriers, counting on the fact that flash was going to use the "flash build," which is not designed to punish his opponents for teching early. The other major difference from most carrier builds was how the carriers was used as support, just as disciple says. Most carrier builds go for carriers at the expense of a ground army, Best didn't do that, and abused the fact that Flash didn't really have any vultures. If flash had gotten a higher goliath count at the expense of tanks, I think Best might have killed him during his initial attack. If you watch that again, Best has like 7 goons there, but cannot move in because the tanks were very well-placed. Also, about Flash's lack of scouting. That build is really does require an unusually small amount of scouting compared to most builds. It never was a build that was heavily dependant on responding to the opponent, rather it was like NaDa's old style tornado play, you know his push was comming, but was usually powerless before it. I think it was tasteless who said it in a commentary, that you could probably map hack against NaDa and he would still own you. I think the "flash build" is somewhat similar. You know that flash will turtle, go for fast upgrades, get 3/3 and 3 bases if possible, and then push out and kill you. And up to this point, it has worked very well, even against early harass. He seems to be behind, but his macro is just so good, he will still get that killing push going. I kinda hope this will stake out a possible counter against the flash build, so that he has to evolve his own game to stay ahead. He is a bit too predictable with that build to get away with it every time. | ||
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PoP
France15446 Posts
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ScarFace
United States1175 Posts
On May 28 2008 05:44 Athos wrote: Lol? You are considering a decline because he dropped a single game? Come on man, even oov dropped games here and there. Flash was cocky, so now he will smarten up a bit. He looked pissed off too, so he will probably come back with a vengeance against all Protosses he meets in the next bit ;]I cant believe flash didn't scout..... I'm guessing he didn't build one since he lost an scv in the very beginning. I think Flash was cocky and felt he didn't need to scout but he learned that he is indeed human. I hope this isn't the end of his dominance. As good as Best is...I just don't like the guy. HOW DARE THE PROTOSS TRY TO RUIN HIS STREAK!  | ||
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Darkmole
United States900 Posts
On May 28 2008 05:44 Athos wrote: I cant believe flash didn't scout..... I'm guessing he didn't build one since he lost an scv in the very beginning. I think Flash was cocky and felt he didn't need to scout but he learned that he is indeed human. I hope this isn't the end of his dominance. As good as Best is...I just don't like the guy. Flash started being soooo cocky ever since he won the OSL game... just like Jaedong when he won the OSL he started being so cocky... | ||
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Wasabi
United States3085 Posts
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disciple
9070 Posts
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JWD
United States12607 Posts
I think Flash's lack of scouting hurt but it didn't cost him the game. No scouting probe and he didn't even have scan up until absurdly late in the game. I think his first scan was in time to see BeSt's first few carriers out, but by then I think it was too late for him to get enough goliaths to deal with the pressure. Other than that, you have to chalk this up to brilliant play by BeSt. The build was genius, the carrier micro was sick (utterly abusing the cliff over Flash's main), and the storms in the middle of the map completed the game. BeSt is the real deal guys - hands down the best Protoss playing hte game, and as we have seen he is even challenging Flash for the spot of best SC player in the world. | ||
Sigrun
United States1655 Posts
On May 28 2008 07:31 disciple wrote: no one is as cocky as jaedong, the "legend killer" even proxy hatched the emperor himself. You're stupid, Boxer went 14 CC while Jaedong went 9 pool. The proxy Hatchery is a strategy on Katrina by Zerg to pressure Terran that wall-in on that map and play greedy. Also, learn proper grammar please. | ||
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RifleCow
Canada637 Posts
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Tensai176
Canada2061 Posts
Flash is just a monster. I think thats why they didnt send BeSt on the Ace, cause i dont think he could've won again, or it could'e been the map, blue storm... but Hyuk? Hyuk? Are you kidding me? | ||
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Tinithor
United States1552 Posts
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StRyKeR
United States1739 Posts
On May 28 2008 11:43 Tensai176 wrote: Best would get his ass kicked. Even thoguh hes my favourite player, Flash is just a monster. I think thats why they didnt send BeSt on the Ace, cause i dont think he could've won again, or it could'e been the map, blue storm... but Hyuk? Hyuk? Are you kidding me? lol That's why they sent Hyuk? Cuz they thought Hyuk would win vs. Flash? Obviously they didn't know Flash was gonna come, given Hyuk's horrendous zvt rec. If they knew, I'm sure they' d have sent out someone else, maybe Best. | ||
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Seku
United States313 Posts
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Darkmole
United States900 Posts
Edit: 1. SKT1 8-4 66.7% 9 2. KTF 8-4 66.7% 8 3. Samsung Khan 8-4 66.7% 7 4. Lecaf Oz 8-4 66.7% 4 5. WeMade Fox 6-4 60.0% 6 6. OnGameNet SPARKYZ 6-4 60.0% -1 7. STX 7-5 58.3% 5 8. MBC Game 5-7 41.7% -2 9. Hanbit Star 4-6 40.0% -1 10. CJ Entus 3-7 30.0% -6 11. ACE Air Force 3-9 25.0% -16 12. eSTRO 2-10 16.7% -15 Wow took a while to do this 0_0 if its wrong tell me :D http://e-sports.or.kr/ results of the proleagues | ||
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bahhh
United States888 Posts
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