[R&S] Amateur TeamLeague

Shimy

United States771 Posts

November 06 2015 04:47 GMT

Welcome to the Results and Standings thread of the Amateur StarLeague. Here is where you will find everything you need to compete in the league. All match ups will be posted in this thread every Sunday.

FORMAT

The format is Proleague style with a twist. Each week, two teams will face off in a Best of 6 tier based system. The tiers are as follows:

D+ cutoff <map A> D+ cutoff
D+ cutoff <map B> D+ cutoff
C- cutoff<map C> C- cutoff
C cutoff<map D> C cutoff
C cutoff <map E> C cutoff
C+ cutoff <map F> C+ cutoff

Each Saturday, before 03:59 GMT (+00:00), the TEAM CAPTAINS will submit a line up USING TL.net PRIVATE MESSAGE of players that correspond with each tier.

Players who represent a skill lower than a cutoff may be placed in that tier, but players who represent a skill higher than a cutoff may not be placed in that tier. Players have up until the next line up submission to play their games. This time is Saturday, 23:59 EST, Sunday, 05:59 CET, or Sunday, 17:59 NZDT

Teams will rotate Round Robin style each week. This means each team will play each other over the course of 5 weeks. Each win per player counts as 1 point. After 5 weeks, the Amateur TeamLeague's organization will evaluate the position of the league a determine how to move forward.

THE TEAMS

Bunny SlayerS

Captain:

(

) LMaster

+ Show Spoiler +

waterbender C+

sGs.Yaqoob C+

arb C

SiegesAddicted C

RedAxis C-

Stardom[eMg] C-

Eywa- C-

(

) LMaster D+

Shimy D+

feckless D+

DEsPA

Captain:

Art_Of_Turtle

+ Show Spoiler +

samsung865 C+

fischei C+

Art_Of_Turtle C

Artanis C

Ninazerg C

Qikz C-

(

) dazed. C-

Miso C-
:world:

iNs.DNH C-

Country: World

(

) JXN D+

BaD]Seed D+

(

) Rocko D+

Biolunar D

Sexy Gladiators

Captain:

iCCup.JiN

+ Show Spoiler +

Fols[raGe] C+

mmmbop[rage] C+

ElementalEvil C+

JaeDonG.- C

iCCup.JiN C

iwL-Hellscream C

Dark_A C-

romarior C-

msj[prokaznik] C-

PuBepoH D+

BaD]Fry D+

Dutch D+

Coaches:

Eptenax

mx[rage]

msj[clickmer]

Stealth Bunnies

Captain:

sB.Birdie

+ Show Spoiler +

Splax C+

SpongeBOZZ C+

sB.DefJam C+

sB.Birdie C

sB.TheMarine C

sB.RulZBoooM C

icedraco C-

sB.EMPaTHY C-

sB.Passafist D+

sB.mei D

sB.saggyBOOBS D

sB.smallBALLS D

(

) sB.Roy D

sB.i91 D

Coaches:

sB.totallynotdRaw

NWA

Captain:

sGs.Babo

+ Show Spoiler +

Puppyklr[eMg] C+

aB.WaRZoNe C+

(

) Fazers[Pain] C+

iNs.Rlentless

sGs.Babo C

[SD]RoLLeR C

f10eQQ C

eSpi.LoCcxitO C

tru]irish C-

nDie.XtinC

crimson0011 D

Melchsee D

WeMadeC

Captain:

EmptyCup

+ Show Spoiler +

Talent C+

Kororo C+

Taehee[KaL] C

Seriosity C

[SAM]Gohan C-

CoughingHydra C-

hafnium C-

evilEye C-

CrispyDrone C-

Master_soul D+

EmptyCup D

zs-Adun D

MAPS AND MATCHES

+ Show Spoiler +

Week 1 11/7 - 11/13

Bunny SlayerS vs Stealth Bunnies

(

) LMaster <Fighting Spirit> sB.Roy

Shimy <New Heartbreak Ridge> sB.Passafist

RedAxis <Shadowplay> sB.Empathy

Stardom[eMg] <Demian> sB.RulzBoooM

SiegesAddicted <Colosseum II> sB.Birdie

sGs.Yaqoob <Match Point> sB.Splax

Club Starcraft vs DeSPA

Melchsee <Fighting Spirit> Biolunar

crimson0011 <New Heartbreak Ridge> JXB

(

)

tru]irish <Shadowplay> LTY

f10esQQ <Demian> Artanis

sGs.BaBo <Colosseum II> Art_Of_Turtle

(

) Fazers[PaiN] <Match Point> Fischei

WeMadeC vs Sexy Gladiators

zs-Adun <Fighting Spirit> PuBepoH

Master_soul <New Heartbreak Ridge> Dutch

CoughingHydra <Shadowplay> romarior

CrispyDrone <Demian> iCCup.JiN

Taehee[KaL] <Colosseum II> iwL-Hellscream

Kororo <Match Point> mmmbop[rage]

+ Show Spoiler +

Week 2 11/14 - 11/20

Club Starcraft vs WeMadeC

Crimson001<New Heartbreak Ridge> EmptyCup

Melchsee<Shadowplay> Master_Soul

Tru]Irish <Demian> evilEye

[SD]RoLLeR<Colosseum II> CoughingHydra

eSpi.LoCcxito <Match Point> CrispyDrone

Fazers[PaiN] <Blue Storm> Kororo

Bunny SlayerS vs DeSPA

Feckless <New Heartbreak Ridge> BaD]Seed

Shimy <Shadowplay> Rocko

Stardom [eMg] <Demian> dazed.

Eywa- <Colosseum II> iNs. Dnh

Sieges Addicted <Match Point> Miso

Yaqoob <Blue Storm> samsung865

Sexy Gladiators vs Stealth Bunnies

Dutch <New Heartbreak Ridge> sB.Roy

BaD]Fry <Shadowplay> sB.SmallBALLS

Dark_a<Demian> sB.EMPaTHY

Hellscream<Colosseum II> sB.RulZBoooM

JiN <Match Point> sB.TheMarine

Mmmbop[rage] <Blue Storm> sB.DefJam

+ Show Spoiler +

Week 3 11/21 - 11/27

Bunny SlayerS vs Sexy Gladiators

Feckless <Shadowplay> Pubepoh

Shimy <Demian> BaD]Fry

Eywa- <Colosseum II> dark_a

SiegesAddicted <Match Point> hellscream

RedAxis <Blue Storm> JiN

Arb <Heartbeat> mmmbop

Stealth Bunnies vs Club Starcraft

sB.smallBALLS <Shadowplay> crimson0011

sB.Passafist <Demian> nDie.XtinC

sB.EMPaTHY <Colosseum II> tru]irish

sB.Icedraco <Match Point> Rlentless

sB.Birdie <Blue Storm> f10eqq

sB.SpongeBOZZ <Heartbeat> Fazers

DeSPA vs WeMadeC

T: Biolunar <Shadowplay> EmptyCup

BaD]Seed<Demian> zs-Adun

Miso <Colosseum II> CrispyDrone

dazed. <Match Point> evilEye

Art_Of_Turtle <Blue Storm> Taehee[KaL]

fiscei <Heartbeat> Kororo

Week 4 11/28 - 12/4

Bunny SlayerS vs WeMadeC

Feckless <Demian> EmptyCup

LMaster <Colosseum II> Master_soul

RedAxis<Match Point> CoughingHydra

Stardom<Blue Storm> evilEye

Arb <Heartbeat> C Taehee[KaL]

SiegesAddicted <Latin Quarter> Seriosity

Stealth Bunnies vs DeSPA

sB.Passafist <Demian> BaD]Seed

sB.Roy <Colosseum II> Rocko

sB.Empathy <Match Point> dazed.

sB.RulzBoooM <Blue Storm> Miso

sB.TheMarine <Heartbeat> Artanis

sB.Splax <Latin Quarter> fischei

NWA vs Sexy Gladiators

nDie.XtinC <Demian> Pubepoh

crimson0011 <Colosseum II> BaD]Fry

tru]irish <Match Point> dark_a

sGs.BaBo <Blue Storm> Hellscream

[SD]RoLLeR <Heartbeat> JaeDong

Puppykiller <Latin Quarter> mmmbop[rage]

+ Show Spoiler [Week 5] +

Week 5 12/5 - 12/11

Bunny SlayerS vs Club Starcraft

D+ cutoff <Colosseum II> D+ cutoff
D+ cutoff <Match Point> D+ cutoff
C- cutoff<Blue Storm> C- cutoff
C cutoff<Heartbeat> C cutoff
C cutoff <Latin Quarter> C cutoff
C+ cutoff<Fighting Spirit> C+ cutoff

Stealth Bunnies vs WeMadeC

D+ cutoff <Colosseum II> D+ cutoff
D+ cutoff <Match Point> D+ cutoff
C- cutoff<Blue Storm> C- cutoff
C cutoff<Heartbeat> C cutoff
C cutoff <Latin Quarter> C cutoff
C+ cutoff<Fighting Spirit> C+ cutoff

Sexy Gladiators vs DeSPA

D+ cutoff <Colosseum II> D+ cutoff
D+ cutoff <Match Point> D+ cutoff
C- cutoff<Blue Storm> C- cutoff
C cutoff<Heartbeat> C cutoff
C cutoff <Latin Quarter> C cutoff
C+ cutoff<Fighting Spirit> C+ cutoff

MAP PACK!!

Players are responsible for contacting their opponent and organizing their match.
Replays and Results must be submitted to theamateurstarleague@gmail.com.
Random players are required to pick a race each week. It can change week to week.

RULES

All players are subject to administrative discretion.
This league is for D and C ranks players only using the iCCup ladder ranking system.
Anti-hack must be used in order to play in this league. I suggest mca64launcher.
Don't cheat.
Don't smurf, there's no point. + Show Spoiler +
We will all shame you if you are A+ player farming low ranks. You'd just be ruining the fun for everyone >,>

All replays must be sent to theamateurstarleague@gmail.com. Each player is responsible for sending his/her replay.
Team Captains must send line ups.
Captains do not have to be D/C ranks. Obviously they can't play in the league, but they can help organize/coach players.
Coaches are allowed and encouraged. Once again, they do not have to be D/C ranks.
Players that reach B- during any point of the League are allowed to remain in the league (It's about that improvement!)
Unplayable lag cases are handled on a case-to-case basis.
There are no substitutions in this league for any match. You have a week to play your match. If your opponent is consistently dodging you or you have trouble getting in touch with them, PM Shimy and the situation will be handled with his discretion. Failure to do so may result in a W.O.
Teams may add players during the course of the league, however, players must be added at least 2 days prior to line up submissions in order to play that week.

ORGANIZATION

Organizers: Shimy and ggrrg
Caster: Lmaster
Liquipedia: ggrrg
Map Committee: Freakling and CardinalAllin
iCCup Legit Checker: Cele

Shimy

United States771 Posts

November 06 2015 04:47 GMT

Poll: How come?

1 fish (1)

25%

2 fish (1)

25%

red fish (1)

25%

blue fish (1)

25%

4 total votes

Your vote: How come?

(Vote): 1 fish
(Vote): 2 fish
(Vote): red fish
(Vote): blue fish

Shimy

United States771 Posts

November 06 2015 04:53 GMT

Alright, I think I got everything correct in the OP, but I'm sure someone will tell me if I didn't. The format is updated and matchups are also there.

1) My team's name is a placeholder (And a pretty good one if you ask me) until LMaster gives me the official name.
2) Free Agents are about to get assigned to teams according the team's needs.
3) I'm giving Club Starcraft through tomorrow to find a D rank player in order to be able to submit a complete line up (basically just 1 extra day. I still need a line up tomorrow before 11:59 EDT. Please make it a priority to find a D rank who can play 1 game next week ;D)
4) There's a new rule about random players. I'm just requiring them to have a set race (race picking included if applicable) each week in order to keep the games more balanced and ultimately fair.

And yeah, good luck to everyone.

EDIT:

JaeDonG.- C Added to Sexy Gladiators

Seriosity C Added to WeMadeC

Talent C+ Added to WeMadeC

samsung865 C+ Added to DeSPA

waterbender C+ Added to Bunny SlayerS

Melchsee D Added to Club Starcraft

These players were added according to need, however, if both teams had the same need, and 1 or more players could fill that need, the players were selected at random. This was to prevent bias on behalf of the organization. Teams are allowed to trade players, but trades can only occur if both players being traded are not currently in the week's lineup. Trades are also only 1 for 1 and must take place at least 2 days prior to line up submissions.

chrisolo

Germany2610 Posts

November 06 2015 12:49 GMT

Hey I made a small banner for this thread, you can use it if you want to, but you don't need to

4) There's a new rule about random players. I'm just requiring them to have a set race (race picking included if applicable) each week in order to keep the games more balanced and ultimately fair.

I think that is unfair towards the random players to be honest. But if that is your decission, then I would like to change my race to Protoss...

Shimy

United States771 Posts

November 06 2015 13:02 GMT

On November 06 2015 21:49 chrisolo wrote:

Show nested quote +

I think that is unfair towards the random players to be honest. But if that is your decission, then I would like to change my race to Protoss...

Thanks for the banner!

AmatistA

Germany113 Posts

November 06 2015 13:41 GMT

go ahead!

AmatistA

Germany113 Posts

November 06 2015 13:43 GMT

is best of 1? or best of 3?

Shimy

United States771 Posts

November 06 2015 14:02 GMT

On November 06 2015 22:43 AmatistA wrote:
is best of 1? or best of 3?

Best of 1

AmatistA

Germany113 Posts

November 06 2015 14:52 GMT

On November 06 2015 23:02 Shimy wrote:

Show nested quote +

Best of 1

All or Nothing then... Gogogo

Eywa-

Canada4876 Posts

November 06 2015 14:56 GMT

#10

So, we have 2 players that play every week and 4 players who get to play once every 4 weeks? :-/

Also, please add LuMiX to my roster, he's D+ now. - Seriously though, Talent is AT LEAST as good as Lumix now...

Shimy

United States771 Posts

November 06 2015 15:06 GMT

#11

On November 06 2015 23:56 Eywa- wrote:
So, we have 2 players that play every week and 4 players who get to play once every 4 weeks? :-/

Also, please add LuMiX to my roster, he's D+ now. - Seriously though, Talent is AT LEAST as good as Lumix now...

Yeah but lumix has reached a skill higher than C+ on iCCup. I can't take all these borderline cases or I have to take them all and then it's incredibly hard to balance the league. That's why I made the ridiculous cutoff in the first place. It's hard to make sure everyone plays other people of equal skill.

And the reason we have 2 players that play every week is because I was the only one who was recruiting players lol Go ahead and add more! ^^

AmatistA

Germany113 Posts

November 06 2015 15:09 GMT

#12

I think C vs C- is possible or isnt?

Shimy

United States771 Posts

November 06 2015 15:18 GMT

#13

On November 07 2015 00:09 AmatistA wrote:
I think C vs C- is possible or isnt?

If a C- plays in a C cutoff, yes.

Shimy

United States771 Posts

November 06 2015 15:44 GMT

#14

On November 07 2015 00:18 Shimy wrote:

Show nested quote +

If a C- plays in a C cutoff, yes.

cutoffs are just that, a D rank can play in the C+ cutoff if need be, but the C+ can't play in the D+ cutoff because he's ranked higher than D+

ggrrg

Bulgaria2716 Posts

November 06 2015 17:05 GMT

#15

On November 06 2015 21:49 chrisolo wrote:
[...]

Show nested quote +

I think that is unfair towards the random players to be honest. But if that is your decission, then I would like to change my race to Protoss...

If anything playing random is hugely unfair towards your opponents in my opinion.

Considering the fundamentally different build orders each race has in some matchups not knowing what race you are against puts you at a huge disadvantage.
I cannot think of a single build order that is viable for Protoss in both PvZ and PvT. Basically, toss would need to guess correctly and blind counter or else he is absurdly far behind.
It is not much different for Z or T (think ZvZ vs ZvP, TvP vs TvZ). Even if you go for some really safe build against random you are very likely to have put yourself at such a disadvantage that you will probably be stomped by any mid-game timing even if executed in a poor fashion.
Additionally, random removes other key components from a weekly league such as strategy planning and the ability to practice for your match.

The league already barely has any restrictions on race selection as it is with the possibilty to only choose specific matchups to play or pick your race on a weekly basis.

Eywa-

Canada4876 Posts

November 06 2015 17:47 GMT

#16

On November 07 2015 00:06 Shimy wrote:

Show nested quote +

My point was that the LuMiX edge case is not very different (if at all) from the Talent edge case.

A good example of a similar case would be that you have me listed as C- despite the fact that I've never actually had a C- account. This is based on an arbitrary value you're attributing to my skill. You're doing the same thing for Talent but on the other side of the spectrum, you're estimating his skill to be C+, when I would probably estimate it at B-.

I just want LuMiX on the team for fun ;d not due to balance issues, we already have some C+, so he wouldn't even be able to play every week.

chrisolo

Germany2610 Posts

November 06 2015 19:10 GMT

#17

On November 07 2015 02:05 ggrrg wrote:

Show nested quote +

I already had this discussion too damn often here and anywhere else. No one can really understand how much harder it is to play random, when you did not commit to play random at one point (not just some fun random). You need to know 9 matchups, instead of 3. That is such a huge deficit, it really outweighs the randomness the opponent faces by a huge margin. Also scouting on 6 or 7 is not that much of a disadvantage in our skill levels. But I do not want to start this discussion over again, I already obeyed to Shimy's decission, so no need for an argument.

ggrrg

Bulgaria2716 Posts

November 06 2015 20:10 GMT

#18

On November 07 2015 04:10 chrisolo wrote:

Show nested quote +

I already had this discussion too damn often here and anywhere else.

Just because you had this discussion before does not make your opinion superior to that of others.

No one can really understand how much harder it is to play random, when you did not commit to play random at one point (not just some fun random). You need to know 9 matchups, instead of 3. That is such a huge deficit, it really outweighs the randomness the opponent faces by a huge margin.

Actually, you only need to know 6 matchups, 3 of them you should be able to play from both sides, but you should know the timings and strategies of both sides no matter which side you are on. 6 is still twice as much as 3, though, and additionally you need to be mechanically proficient with all three racesm which is hard as well.
However, the truth of the matter is that you do not really need to be very proficient in those matchups. Random allows you to effectively cut those matchups in half considering that you will often be far enough ahead up to the mid-game. The advantages you get by playing random are large enough to let you end the game by the early-mid game unless your opponent blind counters you. Your opponent is forced to play very safely no matter what race he is. This allows you to abuse mid-game timings in such a way that he can hardly hold... nevermind all the different early all-ins you can throw at him. It is true that the random player has it much harder if the game goes to the late-game, but the real problem is that the random player can decide to end it much earlier far too often without the opponent having much of a chance.

Also scouting on 6 or 7 is not that much of a disadvantage in our skill levels.

1. This is just blatantly saying that you expect your opponent to play with an economic disadvantage.
2. There is a huge range of skill levels in the league
3. On a 4 player map, you cannot possibly expect to scout the random player in time in any consistent manner in order to react properly. When you consider that you have matchups like PvZ vs PvT where literally the 2nd building is different in a standard build order, you basically always have toss at a disadvantage unless he blind counters.

But I do not want to start this discussion over again, I already obeyed to Shimy's decission, so no need for an argument.

The discussion was started as soon as you said that the decision was unfair.

Eywa-

Canada4876 Posts

November 06 2015 21:32 GMT

#19

The whole discussion about random is really dumb. Playing random at just about any rank is a significant disadvantage. It is pretty much guaranteed that at least 2 of your races will be weaker than they could otherwise be.

Also, one of the biggest problems with people who random is that all amateur players have 1 build per match up and one build only. Random upsets that... To which I say GOOD! The best example I can think of is.. Who isn't tired of seeing forge fe in PvZ?

Let's say you're a protoss player, if you 1 base, you will almost certainly scout your opponent before you commit to any build.

Eywa-

Canada4876 Posts

November 06 2015 21:39 GMT

#20

I still want the tier system to be explained if it please the organizer.

Old iccup system:

E D- D D+ C- C C+ B- B B+ A- A A+ O

New iccup system

E D C B A O

I never got C- on the old system, yet I am listed as C-... Talent (example I am taking because he seems like one of the better players/edge cases) C+ old system is considered C+...

The portion I want to have explained I guess is... Are we taking new system ranks when convenient and old system ranks when convenient? Because by the new iccup system, both Talent and I are considered to be the same rank (according to the ranks set for us in the OP) - by the old system ranks, I am not C-. Please explain.

Also, does anyone think it's unfair for LuMiX to play in this league? Is he better than all of the players in this league? We were discussing that on skype and we didn't really think so... Why is he being refused while other (just as good players) aren't? Is he just being used as an example to justify refusing edge cases?

Please clarify when you can.

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