EPTGotta love foreigners crying about Scan being too good and yet many of the same ones seem to loathe the idea of putting in new maps. IMO new maps should give them a better chance to win vs Scan, IF they're willing to prepare.
TeamLiquid Legacy Cup Series - Page 25
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Peeano
Netherlands5150 Posts
Gotta love foreigners crying about Scan being too good and yet many of the same ones seem to loathe the idea of putting in new maps. IMO new maps should give them a better chance to win vs Scan, IF they're willing to prepare. | ||
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dRaW
Canada5744 Posts
On July 26 2015 21:23 LRM)TechnicS wrote: Great tourney? Facepalm. I tuned in for 10 seconds to see trutaCz vs Scan's weakest race - P, on Match point, in sickest of all lag with 2 observers. As dRaW said - good viewer count but the players? This is the least amount of players involved in a TL BW event I've ever seen probably. Perhaps it's just inactivty issues or some other issues. Still expecting a reply to my post on top of Page 21. I think that the complaints in the thread will be ignored as they are firm in their decisions. Maybe we will have to wait and see if anything changes over the first 5 tours to return to these complaints. I have been talking with many people in defiler.ru and it seems like they will not participate until there is some change, but who knows. | ||
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fearthequeen
United States788 Posts
On July 28 2015 08:35 Peeano wrote: Seeing so much drama in the BW community good thing, right? It means people care. And since many people love drama it will give TLC/TLS and ultimately give BW extra attention which is the whole idea of the tournament! Gotta love foreigners crying about Scan being too good and yet many of the same ones seem to loathe the idea of putting in new maps. IMO new maps should give them a better chance to win vs Scan, IF they're willing to prepare. I'm curious how you think new maps will give someone a better chance to beat Scan. Are you assuming Scan won't even look at the map preview before he plays a tour game on it, and that his opponent will play 20 practice games vs Terran? Part of what makes good players good is their map preparation. | ||
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SuGo
United States681 Posts
On July 28 2015 12:44 fearthequeen wrote: I'm curious how you think new maps will give someone a better chance to beat Scan. Are you assuming Scan won't even look at the map preview before he plays a tour game on it, and that his opponent will play 20 practice games vs Terran? Part of what makes good players good is their map preparation. Good point here. And also not to mention the pure fact- if Scan even sees starting positions during map preview (assuming he actually never even played the map), he will still win lol. So what does it REALLY matter. Realistically his "pro gamer" macro is enough to win 80% of the games vs typical foreigners, so map or not, it's irrelevant. | ||
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iFU.spx
Russian Federation371 Posts
Considering rules: "TeamLiquid Legacy Cup series was organized to strengthen the activity and support of the foreign BW scene (read non-Korean/Chinese)." Otherwise foreign BW community loses motivation to play in TLC, which ruin the main purpose to strengtheh the activity of foreign bw community. | ||
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_Animus_
Bulgaria1064 Posts
On July 29 2015 04:46 iFU.spx wrote: The right decision is to allow Scan play in final event, but not allow to play TLC Series. Considering rules: "TeamLiquid Legacy Cup series was organized to strengthen the activity and support of the foreign BW scene (read non-Korean/Chinese)." Otherwise foreign BW community loses motivation to play in TLC, which ruin the main purpose to strengtheh the activity of foreign bw community. Having in mind last post of draw of how players keep refusing to play, because of admins decisions, just proves that TLC strenghtens Scan's pocket and the activity of the people who want to try against him, and probably will stop trying after a few defeats. Best case scenario will be the rise of some new players whowill be ok with losing and they will take the place of the old ones. Worst case scenario will be just to discourage everyone and kill foreign bw totally. Whatever the case, making notable players quit in order to keep one player(it really doesnt matter if its korean or not) is very very very BAD decision. Imagine kespa returns to bw but without flash, bisu, zero, jangbi, mind and so on. Having like 5-10% of the previous playerpool + new ones. its laughable... I was super excited to see players from tls 1,2,3 play again and how their thinking and playstyle changed/evloved, they are far from korean pro's, but we were getting used to see, know them and their play. | ||
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skzlime
Hungary462 Posts
On July 29 2015 04:46 iFU.spx wrote: The right decision is to allow Scan play in final event, but not allow to play TLC Series. Considering rules: "TeamLiquid Legacy Cup series was organized to strengthen the activity and support of the foreign BW scene (read non-Korean/Chinese)." Otherwise foreign BW community loses motivation to play in TLC, which ruin the main purpose to strengtheh the activity of foreign bw community. judging posts from both sides this would be the best compromise imo | ||
Falling
Canada11366 Posts
Worst case scenario will be just to discourage everyone and kill foreign bw totally. While the decision to include Scan or not is debatable, I don't see how a brand new tournament that exists because of a generous donor is suddenly going to kill foreign bw. How does something that did not exist less than a month ago have the power to destroy? I don't think it's undercutting any existing tournament. There is the bw foreign scene and then this comes along in addition to what people were already doing or not doing. It's bw foreign scene+ or if it does not encourage anyone to practice, then it is bw foreign scene neutral. We carry on as normal. | ||
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Rus_Brain
Russian Federation1893 Posts
On July 29 2015 10:15 Falling wrote: How aboutWhile the decision to include Scan or not is debatable, I don't see how a brand new tournament that exists because of a generous donor is suddenly going to kill foreign bw. How does something that did not exist less than a month ago have the power to destroy? I don't think it's undercutting any existing tournament. There is the bw foreign scene and then this comes along in addition to what people were already doing or not doing. It's bw foreign scene+ or if it does not encourage anyone to practice, then it is bw foreign scene neutral. We carry on as normal. + Show Spoiler + ![[image loading]](http://www.reactionface.info/sites/default/files/images/1287666826226.png) | ||
c3rberUs
Japan11286 Posts
On July 29 2015 04:46 iFU.spx wrote: The right decision is to allow Scan play in final event, but not allow to play TLC Series. Considering rules: "TeamLiquid Legacy Cup series was organized to strengthen the activity and support of the foreign BW scene (read non-Korean/Chinese)." Otherwise foreign BW community loses motivation to play in TLC, which ruin the main purpose to strengtheh the activity of foreign bw community. This looks like a really good compromise. Scan, Final Boss. | ||
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LRM)TechnicS
Bulgaria1565 Posts
On July 29 2015 10:15 Falling wrote: While the decision to include Scan or not is debatable, I don't see how a brand new tournament that exists because of a generous donor is suddenly going to kill foreign bw. How does something that did not exist less than a month ago have the power to destroy? I don't think it's undercutting any existing tournament. There is the bw foreign scene and then this comes along in addition to what people were already doing or not doing. It's bw foreign scene+ or if it does not encourage anyone to practice, then it is bw foreign scene neutral. We carry on as normal. Facepalm. The guy is throwing $2000+ at bw, yet TL considers 'bw foreign scene neutral' as an actual option? Before the tournament we had large amount of (maybe happily) inactive players that were planning to be inactive, now we have that same amount of inactive players but this time around frustrated and unwilling to be joining the bw event, still having the same plans of being inactive. This is 'bw foreign scene neutral' at best, not to say it's negative in reality to me. Also, Rus_Brain, I am not sure if you are right. Players like draw, trutacz, me, eonzerg, doty, nemu and even the inactive G5 had good chances to win against sziky, if we only weren't that stressed out against him and played somewhat noticeably below our usual level in practice games. I am not saying we are better than him or have better tournament results. I am saying it's significantly easier to win against him - the foreigner, than to win against Scan - the actual korean. But hey, the viewer count was 400 and there were not as many zvzs as TL organizers grew tired of them. Perhaps in the so called "long run" by 2pacalypse- (who is all a sudden silent about insulting basically all TLS1/2/3 actual foreigner players but replies to just about anything else), we will have a ton of foreigner D+ players attending the events, scan and several more actual koreans angling foreigner easy money to keep the "foreigner" scene going. | ||
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mca64Launcher_
Poland629 Posts
On July 28 2015 00:32 Rus_Brain wrote: That does not work that way, bro <3 At the time being. NO. dont understand. you got money, i have nothing. You put money, i am happy. Paranoid Android, Hall of Valhalla, Lost Temple and Python. Deal?!! | ||
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Falling
Canada11366 Posts
I am speaking as myself; I am not TL, but a part of it (despite my 'occasional' bouts of delusions of grandeur and self-aggrandizement  ) I don't think it's bw scene neutral, but I am talking to individuals that seem to see the additional tournament as the Grim Reaper's visitation to the bw scene, so I allowed for neutral as an option as a worst case scenario. | ||
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TelecoM
United States10680 Posts
What logical explanation / rebuttal will be given then? | ||
BigFan
TLADT24920 Posts
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BisuDagger
Bisutopia19274 Posts
On July 30 2015 03:18 GGzerG wrote: What happens when Scan(A KOREAN) wins every Cup + The championship that was created for the "FOREIGN" BW scene? What logical explanation / rebuttal will be given then? GGZerg, we've been bro-ing it up lately. Thought we were on the same side of things.  | ||
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TelecoM
United States10680 Posts
On July 30 2015 03:39 BigFan wrote: I have to agree with falling. This tournament will either help increase the activity of the foreign scene or keep it the same and will in no way contribute to the scene's death. I think it is all but obvious that injecting cash into the BW "Foreign" scene is inevitably only going to help this scene, although injecting cash into the BW "Foreign" scene where a Korean wins everything is completely backwards, upside down, illogical, etc. It makes no sense. People can continue to beat around the bush all they want with long drawn out explanations, nonsensical rebuttals, and a myriad of inefficient reasonings, but in the end it will still yield the exact same result. We can change the map pool, and Scan play his off race, none of the results will change. TL ; DR : + Show Spoiler + " For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction. " Action: Korean wins every Cup + The final championship in an event that is supposed to be for the "BW Foreign Scene" Reaction: No growth in the BW Foreign scene. | ||
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GeckoXp
Germany2016 Posts
On July 30 2015 05:06 GGzerG wrote: I think it is all but obvious that injecting cash into the BW "Foreign" scene is inevitably only going to help this scene, although injecting cash into the BW "Foreign" scene where a Korean wins everything is completely backwards, upside down, illogical, etc. It makes no sense. People can continue to beat around the bush all they want with long drawn out explanations, nonsensical rebuttals, and a myriad of inefficient reasonings, but in the end it will still yield the exact same result. We can change the map pool, and Scan play his off race, none of the results will change. TL ; DR : + Show Spoiler + " For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction. " Action: Korean wins every Cup + The final championship in an event that is supposed to be for the "BW Foreign Scene" Reaction: No growth in the BW Foreign scene. To the second part of the question: You want a world congress organisation style? Go make your fund for example, fundraise to USD 1,000,000 at least and spend like USD 250k for the organisation part of the tournament and 750k USD - for a prizefund You cant? Go fuck off then. - the sponsor play and/or have fun. can't? get out. | ||
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BigFan
TLADT24920 Posts
On July 30 2015 05:06 GGzerG wrote: I think it is all but obvious that injecting cash into the BW "Foreign" scene is inevitably only going to help this scene, although injecting cash into the BW "Foreign" scene where a Korean wins everything is completely backwards, upside down, illogical, etc. It makes no sense. People can continue to beat around the bush all they want with long drawn out explanations, nonsensical rebuttals, and a myriad of inefficient reasonings, but in the end it will still yield the exact same result. We can change the map pool, and Scan play his off race, none of the results will change. TL ; DR : + Show Spoiler + " For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction. " Action: Korean wins every Cup + The final championship in an event that is supposed to be for the "BW Foreign Scene" Reaction: No growth in the BW Foreign scene. Sorry, but, I'm not interested in getting into an argument about Scan's inclusion. | ||
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Cele
Germany4016 Posts
On July 30 2015 05:01 BisuDagger wrote: GGZerg, we've been bro-ing it up lately. Thought we were on the same side of things. trusting Telecom is a bad idea  | ||
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