No love for mong? Effort hasn't played in any leagues yet so I'm not sure if he's at the level to win yet. Then again, Zero's zvz was terrible last time we saw it played
On March 31 2015 18:44 2Pacalypse- wrote: Mong is definitely getting out of this group...
I mean, I thought that about Mind in group A, and I'll never forget that one MSL Survivor Group with GGPlay and Flash where the two seemed like locks and then a noname Protoss who goes by Horang2 got out.
Mong seems to be pretty busy with his e-store these days and hasn't been playing very much -- will the two Zergs capitalize on this opportunity to advance?
On April 04 2015 23:14 2Pacalypse- wrote: awesome game!
sad for pusan though, he almost had it
Don't think he almost had it but nevertheless, good fight from him til the end.
If he didn't lose the 5o'clock base in such an unfortunate manner (moving his reavers away exactly before being dropped), I think he would be in a good position to take the late game.
But yeah, you're right as well, EffOrt was in a commanding position the whole game; very well played by him.
dam, was hoping for effort to win that. Only watched the last bit but why was Effort's eco suffering so badly? Like, he barely had drones mining at 6, not much at 12 etc... Was he that preoccupied or was he just getting tired seeing as they mined out most of the map lol
Effort was all over the place. Touches of genius a lot of very mediocre poorly controlled attacks. He's getting there. But he's not back to the standard a lot of us are hoping just yet.
Zerg needs to play too good against Terran. It's just becoming too difficult. Whenever the Terran has a distinctive advantage, the Zerg is dead. Not at all the other way around.
Interesting concept from effort. He basically tried and be as cost effective with the the zerg army as terran by using his queens very methodical. When you think about how zerg usually fight mech, that is pretty grounbreaking idea! I hope to see more of this style because it was really nerve biting!
On April 05 2015 00:07 Greg_J wrote: Effort was all over the place. Touches of genius a lot of very mediocre poorly controlled attacks. He's getting there. But he's not back to the standard a lot of us are hoping just yet.
hmm any reason why he didn't try dropping? Heck, even 2-3 OLs with just cracklings+1 defiler and a better engagement here and there would've helped big time. Mong's base barely had much turrets for defense and effort already took out Mong's base at ~2 oclock (mineral only base) so he had free safe access to drop. Seems like a wasted opportunity.
On April 05 2015 00:08 Rainalcar wrote: Zerg needs to play too good against Terran. It's just becoming too difficult. Whenever the Terran has a distinctive advantage, the Zerg is dead. Not at all the other way around.
from what I'm reading, seems like effort made some poor engagements. Also, looked like Mong's economy was not affected at all while effort was suffering big time which likely played a huge role in his lack of units later on.
haven't seen effort much recently but what was that?? he used to be imo one of the best players at playing with an advantage and he just threw it away. though mongs late game mech is as always very good
On April 05 2015 00:09 tanngard wrote: Interesting concept from effort. He basically tried and be as cost effective with the the zerg army as terran by using his queens very methodical. When you think about how zerg usually fight mech, that is pretty grounbreaking idea! I hope to see more of this style because it was really nerve biting!
Yes, he did very good the whole game until he decided to suicide 20 ultras at the tight choke for nothing. If he waited with those ultras and coordinated the attack together with his queens, he would've fared much better imo.
^That part made me facepalm lol. Should've just spread them out and waited imo.
Pusan with the double gate lol. Rematch with effort?
On April 05 2015 00:12 ii.blitzkrieg wrote: haven't seen effort much recently but what was that?? he used to be imo one of the best players at playing with an advantage and he just threw it away. though mongs late game mech is as always very good
ya, the bit I saw was disappointing. Maybe he was just tired after that game?
His Ultralisk use was so poor he built big groups of Ultras and most of them where wasted attacking on thier own or getting into big traffic jams trying to get through chokes and in one case the lings arrived before the Ultras and where all dead before the Ultras got there.
You need Ultras and lings to attack togther and as has been suggested if there are narrow chokes a bit of dropping can avoid the trffic jam problems to some extent.
On April 05 2015 00:19 reminisce12 wrote: that zvt was confusing as hell.. effort didnt do any harrassment or attack early
I think effort should have continued using lurkers under swarm, like he did when he defended the 6 o'clock. I have seen effort doing this against mech before This way he could get a massive economy, whithout sacrificing to much forces, and all the while saving up energy for his queens. The staple in his play would than to use his queens in a way the terran uses science vessels in tvz - massively cost effective in the long run.
Basically effort does seem to want to play a methodical and calculating game agaist mech and avoid doing the usually high frequent mass attacks. However these mass attacks he saves for the right time from the right angle, but in these games he failed somewhat in this aspect.
Sure he could have used more overlord dropping on the tanks during the mass engangements, or applying them in harrasment of worker lines, but effort was going for style here that require huge attention and i think you cannot ask him to to everything at once!
Terror mentioned on stream that Pusan is about enter the military for his mandatory service, and that if he advances to Ro8, there would be a wildcard tourney for the 8 players who dropped out in the Ro16. (I haven't seen the games as I write this, so I don't know the result.)
Haha, Terror asks Mong in his winner's interview: "How do you feel about advancing to the Ro8 as the first in your group?". Mong: "Well, first of all I would like to give praise to myself. I think I did really great today." Kkkk
At the end Mong shamelessly advertises for his cookies: "Please buy honeynchip snacks. They're really great, even Terror loves them and-" Terror: "I don't like them." Mong: "Excuse me?" Terror: "I said I don't like these snacks." Mong: "..." Then both break out into laughter.
On April 05 2015 10:27 GeLaar wrote: Terror mentioned on stream that Pusan is about enter the military for his mandatory service, and that if he advances to Ro8, there would be a wildcard tourney for the 8 players who dropped out in the Ro16. (I haven't seen the games as I write this, so I don't know the result.)
Thanks for sharing this -- sad to see the old-timer go, not to mention being separated from his newborn
On April 05 2015 10:27 GeLaar wrote: Terror mentioned on stream that Pusan is about enter the military for his mandatory service, and that if he advances to Ro8, there would be a wildcard tourney for the 8 players who dropped out in the Ro16. (I haven't seen the games as I write this, so I don't know the result.)
Thanks for sharing this -- sad to see the old-timer go, not to mention being separated from his newborn
Fortunately, Terror won't have to worry as Pusan did not advance
Indeed. At the end of the Loser's game they all show some respect for Pusan. Terror says that it's his final starleague, and that although he dropped out, he showed some decent games.
I agree with that. Effort's game vs. Mong showed that he was in good shape, and Pusan put up some good resistance against him. The game against Zero was also decent control-wise, but he made some poor tactical choices.
I'm guessing that nobody really expects Pusan to return to SC in two years, since it'll probably be just marriage and babies for him then. And who knows what the scene will look like then anyway...
Liquipedia vods have some mistake/First game its Zero-Mong but in liquipedia its Pusan-Effort.Its problem of vodplacement/Not only match placement/Fix it plz/
On April 05 2015 00:19 reminisce12 wrote: that zvt was confusing as hell.. effort didnt do any harrassment or attack early
This is pretty much how EffOrt has been playing. He plays extremely defensive with a very, very fast hive in probably 90% of his ZvTs on stream. It's actually kind of weird to watch, because it always feels like EffOrt is on the verge of dying. Even when he gets his hive and swarms up, it's like him still barely holding on for another 5-10 minutes.
On April 05 2015 00:19 reminisce12 wrote: that zvt was confusing as hell.. effort didnt do any harrassment or attack early
This is pretty much how EffOrt has been playing. He plays extremely defensive with a very, very fast hive in probably 90% of his ZvTs on stream. It's actually kind of weird to watch, because it always feels like EffOrt is on the verge of dying. Even when he gets his hive and swarms up, it's like him still barely holding on for another 5-10 minutes.
it doesn't mean effort only know how to play this defensive macro style, he still does some all-ins/pressure esque builds once in a while. just that doing defensive macro style is better for practicing general play/mechanics anyway. Also don't forget all the afreeca players play each other a lot, its best not to do all-ins one too many times lest you reveal your bag of tricks that make you less unpredictable in real competitions
apparently in the korean and chinese communities there are some speculation about the Mong v Effort game, with even a few calls of it being "fake" or fixed due to some of the really bad and/or questionable moves made by both players throughout the game...
On April 05 2015 00:19 reminisce12 wrote: that zvt was confusing as hell.. effort didnt do any harrassment or attack early
This is pretty much how EffOrt has been playing. He plays extremely defensive with a very, very fast hive in probably 90% of his ZvTs on stream. It's actually kind of weird to watch, because it always feels like EffOrt is on the verge of dying. Even when he gets his hive and swarms up, it's like him still barely holding on for another 5-10 minutes.
it doesn't mean effort only know how to play this defensive macro style, he still does some all-ins/pressure esque builds once in a while. just that doing defensive macro style is better for practicing general play/mechanics anyway. Also don't forget all the afreeca players play each other a lot, its best not to do all-ins one too many times lest you reveal your bag of tricks that make you less unpredictable in real competitions
apparently in the korean and chinese communities there are some speculation about the Mong v Effort game, with even a few calls of it being "fake" or fixed due to some of the really bad and/or questionable moves made by both players throughout the game...
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