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Seraphic
United States3849 Posts
could be wrong though. Adding in total percentage is a bit lopsided. Since BvZ is just imba, Flash can beat just about anything, JD is still winning despite not playing the best, and Stork. Well Stork is Stork. I think the best way to do percentage is just remove TBLS completely. Probably will look a LOT different with the 4 out of the picture. | ||
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TwoToneTerran
United States8841 Posts
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Lightwip
United States5497 Posts
Action and Hydra are the only ones. | ||
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ssregi-
Korea (South)146 Posts
On March 18 2011 13:13 Lightwip wrote: Zero didn't beat Bisu this season, Action did. Action and Hydra are the only ones. U must wait until Shine vs Bisu | ||
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darklordjac
Canada2231 Posts
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Lightwip
United States5497 Posts
It already happened a few times. | ||
]343[
United States10328 Posts
Slardar is just joking (and he even says so); calm down. DarkMatter_ is spewing nonsense, or has a very narrow definition of "skill" that is generally agreed to be false. infinity2k9 has a point---T is probably stronger in WL in general due to their safe, economically strong builds, due in part to Terran's ability to be very defensive (though this season the WL maps favor Protoss quite a bit, and are not very good for Zerg. Also Zerg has been having trouble vs P lately, which is really hurting their winrate.) Not to say things like Reavers and Storm can't be defensive (see JD vs Snow game 2 anyone??), or mass sunkens can't be defensive (see Soulkey vs Shuttle, MST last season?) | ||
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infinity2k9
United Kingdom2397 Posts
On March 18 2011 10:39 Djabanete wrote: Why don't you post some stats to support it? You listed some advantages T has over Z, but Z has advantages over T as well, which don't necessarily add up to an imbalance either way. The guy i was talking to said stats don't even matter though? I can't show you stats that say Terran openings are safest, cause like i said it doesn't necessarily win games. But one thing you will notice is, the only time Jaedong beat Flash in a BO5 was when most of the games were 3 hatch before pool against 1 rax CC, which as i understand, is equal or slightly better in economy. With players of this caliber small advantages roll into victory, comebacks are very difficult. Everyone used to complain that every Bisu vs Jaedong game was anti-climatic for this reason. On their games on Match Point or Benzene, Flash is free to scout and get a 14CC off safely, and the midgame army advantage he gets is too much with his mechanics controlling them. I'm not saying Jaedong played perfectly and lost anyway since sure he could have won any of them with different decisions but certainly the opening helps out. Its just most noticeable with Flash rather than any other Terran cause once he gets an advantage TvZ he doesn't let it slip. Edit: and yes, i do know someones probably going to point out he lost after 14CC against 12 hatch ZerO. But i'm trying to say T is invincible with an advantage, just that it is an advantage. | ||
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SimonB
United States1088 Posts
On March 18 2011 23:21 infinity2k9 wrote: The guy i was talking to said stats don't even matter though? Of course Stats matters!  T has generally has a ~53% advantage over Z, but it's a very tricky thing to measure because the game has changed so much and continues to change. A 100 game sample in the most recent WL season is not nearly large enough to conclude anything. It's absolutely ridiculous to bring up all this nonsense to try to bring down Flash when his weakest matchup has been vZ. I suppose TvT is IMBA too. He has almost 75% in that. | ||
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Woosung
65 Posts
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ibreakurface
United States664 Posts
On March 18 2011 23:21 infinity2k9 wrote: The guy i was talking to said stats don't even matter though? I can't show you stats that say Terran openings are safest, cause like i said it doesn't necessarily win games. But one thing you will notice is, the only time Jaedong beat Flash in a BO5 was when most of the games were 3 hatch before pool against 1 rax CC, which as i understand, is equal or slightly better in economy. With players of this caliber small advantages roll into victory, comebacks are very difficult. Everyone used to complain that every Bisu vs Jaedong game was anti-climatic for this reason. On their games on Match Point or Benzene, Flash is free to scout and get a 14CC off safely, and the midgame army advantage he gets is too much with his mechanics controlling them. I'm not saying Jaedong played perfectly and lost anyway since sure he could have won any of them with different decisions but certainly the opening helps out. Its just most noticeable with Flash rather than any other Terran cause once he gets an advantage TvZ he doesn't let it slip. Edit: and yes, i do know someones probably going to point out he lost after 14CC against 12 hatch ZerO. But i'm trying to say T is invincible with an advantage, just that it is an advantage. It all comes down to maps, you said it yourself. "On their games on Match Point or Benzene, Flash is free to scout and get a 14CC off safely" Terran openings are safe on SPECIFIC maps and situations. Anyway, the better terran will beat the inferior zerg a majority of the time, and the better zerg will beat the inferior terran a majority of the time. Wouldn't you agree? I'm not going to start theorycrafting, this isn't the sc2 forum. | ||
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kamikami
France1057 Posts
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infinity2k9
United Kingdom2397 Posts
@ibreakurface it doesn't just come down to maps though; 1 Rax CC is safer and better economically than 12hatch on any map. It can't just be thrown off by people like SimonB that its nonsense and doesn't matter when of course it actually does. I'm just pointing out facts, not opinions on balance. Z has its own advantages; But their openings are not one of them (in TvZ at least). | ||
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Yodo
Russian Federation327 Posts
T is probably stronger in WL in general due to their safe, economically strong builds Oh, really? Number of AK/RAK in WL: P = 8 T = 5 Z = 1 How come T is a strongest race in WL? This stats clearly indicate that tosses are the most round/around race with safe and stable play. Zergs are the hardest race to score 4 straight wins. 3-kill chance for all races are a kinda equal. | ||
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KTF_CloaK
Netherlands1338 Posts
On March 19 2011 05:16 Yodo wrote: Oh, really? Number of AK/RAK in WL: P = 8 T = 5 Z = 1 How come T is a strongest race in WL? This stats clearly indicate that tosses are the most round/around race with safe and stable play. Zergs are the hardest race to score 4 straight wins. 3-kill chance for all races are a kinda equal. you can't really say: t has less all-kills than protoss, therefore it is more weak in wl you can have more medicore skilled terrans and half of those p all-kils come from bisu vs an incompetent team where they dont have medicore terrans to take him out /rant ahh whatever, stats all killed skt1 so yeah lol xD | ||
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SuperJongMan
Jamaica11586 Posts
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bearbuddy
3442 Posts
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moopie
12605 Posts
On March 19 2011 05:25 KTF_CloaK wrote: you can't really say: t has less all-kills than protoss, therefore it is more weak in wl you can have more medicore skilled terrans and half of those p all-kils come from bisu vs an incompetent team where they dont have medicore terrans to take him out /rant ahh whatever, stats all killed skt1 so yeah lol xD The main reason for the WL AK list being protoss favored is the maps, not race imba. Maps this round (and last) are very good for protoss, and there are a few maps other races don't do well on. As such, depending on the map order for a specific set, it can be hard for a certain race to create a 4-win streak. | ||
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Kazzabiss
1006 Posts
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aimaimaim
Philippines2167 Posts
On March 19 2011 07:45 Kazzabiss wrote: wtf how is this LR still alive? Thats what you get for Protoss favored maps mixed with Tyson clearly won vs The Final Boss | ||
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