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On August 21 2010 18:53 rainei wrote:Show nested quote +On August 21 2010 18:44 SubtleArt wrote:
WOOOOOOOOOOT GG. I love Jaedong, although I'm a little bitter that out of all games, he didn't win a macro game. The only 2 late games were set 2 and 3, and light won both. Jaedong basically won from a ling all in, muta all in, and muta / ling all in respectively. Ah well, I feel Jaedong outplayed light in set 3, but lost due to how T>>>Z Odd Eye is.
GGs all around, but Jaedong is gonna have to up his game to take down Flash. He has better mid + late game TvZ than Light, and he sure as hell won't fall for early game shenanigans 3 times in a row.
This map pool though.....so bad.... Or will he......??
He won't.
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On August 22 2010 00:09 Amnesia wrote:Show nested quote +On August 21 2010 18:53 rainei wrote:On August 21 2010 18:44 SubtleArt wrote:
WOOOOOOOOOOT GG. I love Jaedong, although I'm a little bitter that out of all games, he didn't win a macro game. The only 2 late games were set 2 and 3, and light won both. Jaedong basically won from a ling all in, muta all in, and muta / ling all in respectively. Ah well, I feel Jaedong outplayed light in set 3, but lost due to how T>>>Z Odd Eye is.
GGs all around, but Jaedong is gonna have to up his game to take down Flash. He has better mid + late game TvZ than Light, and he sure as hell won't fall for early game shenanigans 3 times in a row.
This map pool though.....so bad.... Or will he......?? He won't.
Or will he......??
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Canada2480 Posts
On August 21 2010 16:26 kwkwookw wrote:
Wow, I cannot believe people are disappointed/angry at Jaedong winning by taking advantage of Light's lack of defense at the expo. Jaedong continuously harassed the entrance to intentionally shift Light's attention to defending the entrance, which made Light spend resources on firebats and also lose resource by being forced to pull scvs away from mining to defend/repair/block entrance. By shifting Light's attention and decreasing his resource mining, Jaedong knows he can delay Light's construction of engineering bay for turrets and hence, he has a higher chance of finishing Light off with mutalisks.
You guys don't think that's strategy? Sure it was all-in but it's not like a 4-pool all-in where its success almost solely depends on the opponents starting build. It was an all-in based on a carefully thought out strategy Jaedong planned out once he saw that Light's lackluster expo defense could be exploited.
You still disappointed and gonna take credit away from Jaedong for "cheesing"?
For crying out loud, starcraft isn't the 18th century european wars where two sides marched towards each other on the field, stopped, lined up in a single file, and just started shooting at equal footing.
Everyone (including commentators btw) knows late-game terran mechanic is the STRONGEST force in sheer power alone in Starcraft. I'm NOT saying terran is imbalanced; all i'm saying is that if you're zerg, you know that a head on fight (yes, including plague, dark swarm, irradiate, drops, etc.; i'm not saying a LITERAL head on fight) against mech terran, esp in this map, is going to be increasingly difficult as time passes. Why would Jaedong just let Light continue mining resources, teching, and building up forces when Jaedong can take advantage of the weak defence Light exposed?
You guys said this wouldn't have worked against flash b/c he would have built a bunker. that's most likely true, but once jaedong saw a bunker already being built, i highly doubt he would have produced and sent all those zerglings for an all-in strategy.
Although I'm a flash fan (yes, i think flash is going to win in the finals), it's kind of disappointing that Jaedong's plays are being understood as some low-skill-required lucky "cheese" play to overseas viewers (first time on tl btw!). As if only 30min+ games require "true skill", w/e that is. Yes, please tell that to someone who has multiple osls, msls, and a wcg.
Really nice first post
On August 21 2010 18:53 rainei wrote:Show nested quote +On August 21 2010 18:44 SubtleArt wrote:
WOOOOOOOOOOT GG. I love Jaedong, although I'm a little bitter that out of all games, he didn't win a macro game. The only 2 late games were set 2 and 3, and light won both. Jaedong basically won from a ling all in, muta all in, and muta / ling all in respectively. Ah well, I feel Jaedong outplayed light in set 3, but lost due to how T>>>Z Odd Eye is.
GGs all around, but Jaedong is gonna have to up his game to take down Flash. He has better mid + late game TvZ than Light, and he sure as hell won't fall for early game shenanigans 3 times in a row.
This map pool though.....so bad.... Or will he......??
HAHAHHAHAHAAHAHAHA
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Remind me to never read LR threads again. Some posters really are clueless..
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On August 21 2010 17:11 jyLee wrote:Show nested quote +On August 21 2010 16:36 LuigiNMario wrote:On August 21 2010 16:34 shadesofkarma wrote:On August 21 2010 16:25 LuigiNMario wrote:On August 21 2010 16:24 Yxes2211 wrote:On August 21 2010 16:17 LuigiNMario wrote:On August 21 2010 16:16 OpticalShot wrote:
This thread's fanboy/girl arguments are too weak. I'm expecting better after the finals =P Can you really call me a fanboy for hating on cheesy zergling agression? Nah... Why would anyone be aggressive with the first military unit to come out? I mean, Zergs by their nature are not an aggressive race right? God bro, early aggression is how u punish greed, any competent player would do the same. I keep telling you 1 cheese win is fine by me, but 2 is too much for me to handle :l and I'll start hating like i did with effort. ;/ Why don't you go hate on Flash for 14 CCing his way to 3-0. 14cc is rather economical rather than cheesy LOL you dont think 14cc is cheese? Are you fucking serious? 14cc is on par with a 4 pool in terms of tvz cheese. Blindly going for maximum eco is the same kind of cheese as going for maximum aggression with 4 pool.
i love how some people scream about how 14cc is cheese and imba, and then turn around and say 3 hatch no pool or 12 nex is standard economical play. I guess it's just the anti-fans who can't stand watching Flash win all the time...
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Because nothing says 'zergs be too aggressive and imba' like good enough micro and decision-making to not let all your lings become a sad pile of ling blood due to stim.
Seriously, Sea v Jaedong set 3 proved that Jaedong can screw mech late game too (although I guess it was more full-on mech than Light's strat, but still, it was late-game mech). So he didn't want to spend 40 minutes playing the 'let's rebuild my freaking hatcheries' game. I like this style of play that keeps people on their toes. I liked how EffOrt/Jaedong constantly found holes in FlaSh/Light's defenses - that's how the game's supposed to be played, not a-moving and pressing w (or o, as may be the case) for half an hour. Nobody cried foul when Fantasy screwed Calm over with a simple sunken breaker lulz. So don't cry foul now.
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konadora
Singapore66071 Posts
Looks like no one has done the interview yet. I'll be doing it now.
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On August 22 2010 00:53 konadora wrote:
Looks like no one has done the interview yet. I'll be doing it now.
You're a hero! ^__^
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Canada2480 Posts
On August 22 2010 00:53 konadora wrote:
Looks like no one has done the interview yet. I'll be doing it now.
YESYESYESYESYYEYESYESYES
<3 kona
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On August 22 2010 00:46 Wings wrote:Show nested quote +On August 21 2010 17:11 jyLee wrote:On August 21 2010 16:36 LuigiNMario wrote:On August 21 2010 16:34 shadesofkarma wrote:On August 21 2010 16:25 LuigiNMario wrote:On August 21 2010 16:24 Yxes2211 wrote:On August 21 2010 16:17 LuigiNMario wrote:On August 21 2010 16:16 OpticalShot wrote:
This thread's fanboy/girl arguments are too weak. I'm expecting better after the finals =P Can you really call me a fanboy for hating on cheesy zergling agression? Nah... Why would anyone be aggressive with the first military unit to come out? I mean, Zergs by their nature are not an aggressive race right? God bro, early aggression is how u punish greed, any competent player would do the same. I keep telling you 1 cheese win is fine by me, but 2 is too much for me to handle :l and I'll start hating like i did with effort. ;/ Why don't you go hate on Flash for 14 CCing his way to 3-0. 14cc is rather economical rather than cheesy LOL you dont think 14cc is cheese? Are you fucking serious? 14cc is on par with a 4 pool in terms of tvz cheese. Blindly going for maximum eco is the same kind of cheese as going for maximum aggression with 4 pool. i love how some people scream about how 14cc is cheese and imba, and then turn around and say 3 hatch no pool or 12 nex is standard economical play. I guess it's just the anti-fans who can't stand watching Flash win all the time...
Let's call it econ cheese then?
What's so unfair about 14CC in ZvT is that when u 12 hatch ur automaticallly behind against it, and u scout it too late to change your build. Basically the only way to stop 14CC for Zerg is to play pool first, which leaves you automatically behind against any other terran opening.
3 Hatch before pool on the other hand is really easy to scout, autoloss vs any bunker rush, and if Terran scouts you first try he can still successfully bunker rush without proxying. Theres a much greater risk involved as opposed to 14cc when u consider Zergs have to 12h in ZvT 99% of the time.
as for the Flash anti-fans thing, I don't see how its in any way relevant. Tons of Terrans use 14CC, and flash has been over the "I 14CC and build no defense TvZ" phase for over a year now
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konadora
Singapore66071 Posts
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konadora
Singapore66071 Posts
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Wow, would it have killed them to make Fighting Spirit be the map that got doubled?
Thanks for the info and interview!
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For fucks sake. :/
Do you know which map Flash thumbed down?
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....this was determined by random drawing, right?
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konadora
Singapore66071 Posts
No idea which maps were thumbed down, not mentioned on Fomos.
And yes, random drawing lol :/
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Hey I'm new. So I missed the live stream. Is there anyway to watch a rebroadcast right now? Or do I have to wait until its uploaded to youtube :/
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So its 1 in 8 that Jaedong gets Polaris doubled 3 times in a row. Oh well, at least it will make this SL run even more memorable if he wins.
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Well, it's still not as bad of a map pool as the Jaedong vs ForGG finals. Now that was bad.
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EPT
